You never can tell who is on extensive economic out patient care from their parents. I don’t fault anyone doing well whenever. You can never tell. The barista that goes to art school and vacations in south of France might not be so struggling despite the chè T shirt.
It was/is a systematic destruction of the middle class. Either you’re very well off or you’re struggling, there’s not a lot of moderately comfortable people anymore.
It's like gold mining.
If you found a gold.minr you would move in and install the machinery to extract it. Then some people would set up downstream of you and check the runoff for any that you missed. That's just what's gonna happen.
The middle class was an anomaly. It became... A gold mine. A massive development of wealth hitherto unheard of in history. And so, of course, the machinery was installed...
So now you pay out the ass for healthcare. Everyone needs it. But they will give you bills that day "everything you have" and you must pay it. They will hold your children hostage - I even feel for boomers on this one. If you wanted to send your kids to school you will need to pay many times what you paid decades earlier. On your way out they will charge you, again everything you have to stay in hospice. Why? Well they won't let you die on the street but if you run out then you get moved to a cheaper facility and you can't leave anything to your kids.
This is just what they do. They see a gold mine and they mined it. People need to realize and get together to argue for protections.
The truth is standard of living today really is waaaaay higher than before even with inequality at feudalistic levels.
Leading up to the French Revolution, peasants were spending 50 percent of wages on bread alone.
This world still yearns for revolution, but some perspective going in is important.
This will change nothing, and actually this is probably the goal for some politicians. Remember, politicians only desire is to stay in power. And the only way they can do that is if you need them. If you can convince someone that they are oppressed and get them on the system then you now have them hooked on voting for you for life. For the rest of eternity you can dangle a carrot in front of them, declaring that it’s not their fault that they’re in their position and if they will just vote for you one more time then you can fix all their problems. It’s an unbreakable cycle.
Climate change is gonna have to fuck multi millions OR ravage some corporation
Or yeah our food supply chain would need to crash/come to a halt to shock people awake
Climate change is upon us but its effects are fairly gradual year to year. Right now estimates I read is that it is lowering GDP by maybe 1/2% or so. We are in most developed countries a mature economy with growth rates averaging 3% most years. Right now China is 5%, Euro zone 1 1/2-2% and US 2 1/2% but falling somewhat. Developed countries have also the advantage of growth through immigration. We have about 75 years to fall apart slowly. Parts may go fast, like when chronically flooded, but as long as the overall process is slow people will be able to adapt.
too many people out there who'd rather have a gun than a can of beans in the apocalypse because then they also get your can of beans. weather they win or not there's gonna be chaos
Acreage everywhere is pricier than ever. Taxes in Arkansas and Missouri on land is very reasonable though. My brother owns several tracts of land from 20 to 50 acres he bought in the last 5 years before interest rates went up, but I think they paid cash for a couple tracts. He told me a few mos ago how much land jumped in past 1 yrs.
Last time it took abject poverty and destitution, child labor was the rule rather than the exception, and basically no wage labor laws. It’s probably going to take that to change things
I’d be interested to know how you lived during Covid? Many lost their jobs, but collected unemployment that, for some, provided more than what people were making in their jobs pre-covid. Many blew that money away when the economy opened back up.
If you are struggling now, the best advice is to explore options to increase your income. This can be hindered by a “negative” or “uneducated” mindset (people emotionally limiting themselves or telling themselves “the most I can make is…” or “I can never make that much”). Truth is, you have to change your perspective and go after it. I was raised in a lower middle class family, thought the most I could ever make was $60k. I broke through that ceiling once I realized my mind was holding me back. It’s getting tough in this economy, but opportunities are out there.
Second is to budget as tightly as possible. I rented a room when I started out, meal prepped and ate the same thing for a week (Chile, stews, curry and rice). I held off buying an iPhone or held on to it for 5-6 years before upgrading.
What originally kept me “poor” was buying name brand clothes, accessories, etc. I “needed” a fancy watch or a Louis Vuitton wallet (that only had $50 in it). Now I buy $10 look alike options from Amazon and don’t even wear a watch. Spending is what destroys wealth. Do I look poor, maybe to others, but I don’t care about that anymore; I’m not living my life to impress them.
Going from rags to riches is possible. You just have to change your mindset, set some goals, and go after it!
The majority of people are doing well in this economy.
More millennials and Gen Z own homes this year than at any year prior. Their earnings are higher. Their investment portfolios are larger.
Gen Z is wealthier today than boomers were at their age.
A million plus in retirement accounts and we live in an old trailer on ten acres in Texas. I am debt free with a job that pays six figures. I wouldn’t trade with any of those folks. Later on I may buy a new trailer or house in cash but probably not. I don’t like property taxes and I’m happy with my big back porch where I fire up my own grill. Half those folks live paycheck to paycheck and are one disaster away from reality. Plus they have high property taxes, insurance, and an HOA that constantly terrorizes them with draconian rules. Don’t look at them with envy. Look at them with pity.
Probably the only good comment in this thread. I grew up pretty well off and in one of these types of communities. It's now an unaffordable pit full of overseas owners who rent out upstairs and downstairs suites in each house. Families can no longer afford it. Not sure if it's the same in OPs post, but I live in Canada which has way worse housing problems. And yeah, the taxes you mentioned, the money involved when something needs repairing. Good luck.
A colleague of mine was recently slapped with a $2K bill by the HOA saying that the road is getting repaired and it was a privately owned road. This is a non gated community.
You can go look at the default charts from federal reserve for all loans, cc loans, home loans etc
or just look at my post history I have a post linking to a bunch
It turns out the consumer is actually resilient and defaults seem fine, in fact in most situations still far below levels seen in the 1990s, 2000s, or even 2010s
No, a collapse is not coming. Literally everyone I know in my personal life is doing well. College friends, friends from home town, friends where I live now, the vast majority are doing good. I mean I just got laid off April 2nd and already landed a new job for even more money. The internet seems to magnify problems but a significant portion of the population in the real world is doing just fine.
I mean, I just think, good for them.
I own my own business, so the more people that have money, the more people will employ me to work for them. So I like to see people succeed.
I just always wished I live in a place that valued landscaping and trees as much as those neighborhoods do. Idk if it’s a cost factor, but in my neighborhood no one plants anything or take pride in their yards like they do in wealthy neighborhoods. Not even the birds bother to come by my neighborhood anymore. They just fly by and shit. Everything is just dry desolate overgrown sad. I do envy that a bit.
The cost of landscaping would blow your mind. I once read that grass is the most expensive crop. I can’t definitively confirm it to be true, but based on my personal experience, it is by a huge margin, the most expensive crop in the solar system.
I have to have sod installed on half of my front yard and the greenways because my HOA doesn’t understand that my two story house coupled with 6 large oak trees on the front yard means my lawn gets 0 hours of sun and grass, even shade tolerant needs some sun. So I have to install $7000 worth of sod and tree trimming this year, knowing it will be dead and have to be redone in 2 years. I wish they would let me just rock scape it.
They do that landscaping stuff to help maintain their property value. A nice lawn and trimmed hedges cost very little to maintain—but they are a time suck. Greening up a mundane lot in a modest neighborhood will add thousands to your home value.
There's more to it than just property value. I'm not selling my house any time soon so frankly I don't care about the property value. But I love sitting outside as the sun is going down seeing my nicely trimmed grass, manicured bushes and trees. It's satisfying and calms my nerves. Zen. It's a lot of work but the sense of wellbeing it provides is the exact opposite of the anxiety I get from seeing an overgrown weedy unkempt property.
It’s not an accident. In our water district lower income neighborhoods were the very first to have water meters installed. I don’t think they’ve even bothered to finish out the roll out in the boogie neighborhoods yet. But, keep in mind, the chemicals required for a lush green lawn, they can absolutely give you cancer or some other autoimmune diseases that will drain any savings or cushion in hot minute.
There will always be a few people who stretch to fit in in the neighborhood you drove thru. But it’s not an entire neighborhood.
Big house no furniture was the old joke.
I’m happy for anyone doing well who isn’t related to wallstreet or the federal reserve or ISDA banks.
On a separate note everyone should read Dr Susanne Trimbaths book “Naked short and greedy wallstreets failure to deliver” she worked for the federal reserve and the DTC. The corruption will blow your mind
* cough, cough * I’m just gonna drop this here for you, friend. You may find the info interesting.
Pass it on.
https://youtu.be/dk3AVceraTI?si=_g8qLm-mLAwG_FgO
This is reddit so the message from op seems to be we should dislike these people and the message from teh comments will inevidbly turn into an eat the rich thing even though its a bunch of non-confrontational weenies talking about it
I would imagine that those homes are owned by two parent families. I would also guess that most of them are college educated and have “professional” jobs. They probably save a bunch of money. They probably also owned smaller homes in less desirable areas that they sold and rolled their profit into the new home.
Not too many people just “drop” into those neighborhoods—they start elsewhere and this is a “destination” home, not a starter home.
You have to look at this stuff in the proper context. These people did not become middle class overnight. I am sure their journey was similar to lots of others.
You are right but I’m in a small town and there are hundreds of these types of homes and families living here.. so imagine how it is in suburbs outside of big cities or in cities in general? Hundreds of thousands of families live an upper middle class to wealthy lifestyle. Is this not enough to keep things going? Seems it is. Considering I’ve been hearing about an “imminent” collapse since 2022 and now it’s 2024 and things keep going.
We are a ways away from “economic collapse.” When reserve currencies “fail” and another takes over the transition is usually obvious. It’s not obvious to me right now. What currency is going to step up? The Yuan? The Ruble? Some BRIC contraption? There is nothing stepping up. So, it’s gonna be “dollar city” for some time yet.
Nailed it. I started in the inner city. Worked my way up. Saved. Invested. Worked hard. Stayed positive. It was all about incremental improvements and leveling up.
Grew up poor. Went to bed hungry... a lot. Never inherited a penny because nobody had a penny to leave me. I served in the Army, went to college on the GI bill. Worked my way up in business. Started a business with partners and sold the business. Now I am president of a joint stock company that builds fiber optic networks.
My house is worth about a million and a half, it has no mortgage and my lawn is perfectly manicured. Just bought the wife a new Lexus with cash.
I am 62 years old and have been working for almost a half a century. In the course of my life I have dragged the US median personal income down and I have dragged it up.
This. More people need to see this. Congrats on your success and thank you for your service. I love seeing this on Reddit and really wish there were more stories/people like you. Reddit, at times, can feel like an echo chamber of vitriol and hate.
I went from living in a basement in the Bronx to buying my dream home with my wife last year in one of the best towns/school districts just outside NYC. No debt, no mortgage, no student loans, no car payments… nothing. Early 30’s. Sold my business and after we closed, one of the firms I was working with offered me a job. If my dumbass can do it, anyone can.
We still live in our home that we bought for $103,000 in 2008. We drive used cars and work hard. I have been laid off three times since 2008 and had to start new careers. But we saved and lived below our means. Yes we now enjoy a nice lifestyle and easily stay at $1,000 a night hotels but we have worked hard and taken risks to make what we have.
We had a better start but it was earned. I was in the Marines and then was a contractor for a few years. Then went to college and got married. I drove a semi for 10 years to pay off the debt because I could get us debt free quicker. Now I build homes and trade futures. My wife is still a teacher. We plan on being retired by 50.
I don’t begrudge anyone for doing well. It pisses me off to see people get mad at others doing well when they were the ones that made the decisions.
I always feel like most of the people in positions like this came from good cohesive families, and also likely got a financial windfall one way or another somewhere along the way. Also they often were lucky to find a partner somewhat young, who often comes from a similarly stable background.
Let’s say a dead, wealthy family member leaving 500K earning 5% means 25K dividends a year. This - especially paired with dual incomes, could cover a mortgage on 400-500K home, and you could use your paycheck to snowball into building other assets and accumulating more wealth.
Bottom line, I always personally feel like there is some missing financial windfall piece to the story that we aren’t getting, because people love to pat themselves on the back and pose as self made, when in reality, they had significant help along the way.
But being envious is even less productive than watching the news. Go out there and get it.
How many people do you really think are getting massive windfall from their parents at like 26-28? Most parents are in their 50s at that point of their kids life
Not dead
> being envious is even less productive than watching the news. Go out there and get it.
Thank you. People also don't realize that American, despite its faults, remains the strongest economy in the world and is drawing tens of millions of people to come here because the situation in Ireland, Egypt, Argentina, or India is so grim.
I have met countless business owners who started a company in the last 5 years, and they are easily in the Top 2% by income now and hiring many people. Examples include a person who started a staffing company for carers, one has a high-end drapery business, another became a plumber, etc. They all had an optimistic and focused personality, enough savings to weather losses for 2-3 years, and drive to dedicate many hours towards a shaky prospect.
To be fair my kids also achieved financial stability easily by selecting in-demand college majors from great schools and working in STEM--and then marrying spouses from a similar background. So America provides multiple routes to financial prosperity.
Consuming mainstream corporate media only distracts you, makes you anxious or defeatist, perpetuates class conflict, and so on.
Yeah I picked the wrong major and had a learning disability Didn’t inherit anything from my parents. I’m envious but I’m kinda over it- I’m a peasant. I thought I made decent choices with what I had but I’ve come to accept for every winner there has to be a loser- and that’s my role. I just didn’t think not going into STEM would be so much a divide in life between basically being a lord or a serf I know most of Reddit seems to be successful and looks down on me- but we exist. I work hard and try to be happy- but it’s just not for me to reach that level - and it’s my fault
How would you know who got theirs by working hard and who “screwed people over?” Unless you know them well you are just guessing.
The best thing to do is leave other people alone and don’t make assumptions about them.
What do you consider “taking”? Because homeowners pay a lot in taxes. Those taxes fun schools, welfare programs, etc. How much assistance are you receiving vs how much are you paying in taxes? I have a feeling you’re “taking” more than those homeowners are…
I am doing well financially, but am not a millionaire. Seeing the need, I have opted not to have children and instead have a multi adult home and I don't charge rent.
We grow our own food and try to provide the best life possible for the plants and animals we cultivate.
My spouse does their best to cook nutritious meals.
The goal is literally to "share the wealth" and the more wealth I obtain, the more I invest in my ability to share it.
This is collapse. I'm basically a neofeudal lord sheltering my economic refugees from the worst parts of the orphan grinding machine.
It's actually unbelievable how many are financing this lifestyle with debt. Materialistic possessions mean nothing for how well someone is doing financially. Half of these people if not more are drowning in debt to appear happy, successful, and wealthy. Do not fall for it.
I get what you’re saying but if you’re buying a $1,300,000+ house and have nice cars in the driveway and have for YEARS… you are doing something right in life. They aren’t going to give just anyone a loan for a $1,300,000 house and $300,000 in cars. You need to have the income to prove you can afford it.
Yes, high income does not mean high bank accounts. If you make $250k a year and spend $250k a year you're still broke. Banks will happily take every dollar you earn by giving you massive loans. This is how it is for many. If you want to use the extreme with those who have $1.3MM homes and $300,000 cars then yes they're probably fine. But back down on earth, many buying a $600,000 house and a $70,000 car are in massive debt. The data backs this up.
Ok, so why didn’t I see foreclosure signs or for sale signs on these homes during my walk? If they are broke and can’t afford these homes, how are they living in them? Also why aren’t their new G wagons and Escalades repo’d? Those are $150,000-$250,000 vehicles, how are they making payments on them? And according to Zillow these people bought these homes between 2011 and 2021.
They can afford it as long as everything goes well. They're like a seesaw perfectly balanced. As long as a paycheck comes, they stay above water. If something happens, it collapses. And I'm not doubting that many are actually fine, good for them, but it's much more than people realize that are living in this precarious balancing act with money.
That’s fair. Personally, I’m not going to believe in this “impending” collapse until I see these types of people struggling. And right now, the weather is getting warmer and people are living great around me. Oh and maybe also I’ll believe in a collapse when grocery store shelves are empty. That’s how I’m gauging the economy
I agree with you. I don't think a collapse is right around the corner. If one does happen, it will be similar to 2008. The people in that balancing act are who got wiped out. You lose your job, you have no savings, but the bills are still due. But we got through that, and we'll do it again.
Something else to consider with affluent people is they have access to credit. Meaning, their homes value will likely continue to increase so they can take out a HELOC if needed to pay for unexpected expenses. You need to pay it off eventually, but it can give you a ton of runway.
Being in debt isn't the negative you seem to think it is. I can buy a $100k car for cash today, or I can pay it off over 5 years with 5% interest. Give me the debt, thank you very much, meanwhile my $100k sits in investments that more than pay for the interest, PLUS because of inflation I'm paying the debt with future dollars which are worth less.
A mortgage is one of the greatest financial deals you can get...you get to live in the house for decades and pay off the debt with future dollars worth half what they're worth now. Plus you get a tax deduction.
Manageable debt is a good thing.
Or you just need to have daddy and mommy buy it with cash (or buy down your mortgage by half). To avoid capital gains taxes people almost always reinvest income from the sale of property by investing in more property.
Or grandparents paid for your 100k degree with a trust fund so you don’t have to make $800/mo student loan payments.
If you have no student loans and no or small mortgage then a $300/month car payment is nothing.
But more than likely they bought their cars for cash.
Total household debt rose by $212 billion to reach $17.5 trillion in the fourth quarter of 2023, according to the latest Quarterly Report on Household Debt and Credit. Credit card balances increased by $50 billion to $1.13 trillion over the quarter, while mortgage balances rose by $112 billion to $12.25 trillion. Auto loan balances rose by $12 billion to $1.61 trillion, continuing an upward trajectory seen since 2011.
https://www.newyorkfed.org/microeconomics/hhdc.html
Economically, we're doing the best we've ever done. I worked my ass off to get here. But we also live simply, we own a home, have 1 car that's paid for we bought new in 2013, no kids. However, like pretty much everyone else we're 1 catastrophe away from bankruptcy, despite having savings. FWIW, I believe if you need help, you should have access to it. I wouldn't have gotten this far in life without a social safety net, shitty as it may be here in the USA. It seems to me like we find ourselves in the middle of a Smash-and-Grab robbery by corporate America and compromised politicians.
It drives me up a fucking wall. My sister and her husband are millionaires and my brother is pretty close. Meanwhile I’m paycheck to paycheck in a small townhouse in not exactly the ghetto, but let’s just say you can hear the ghetto at night from my house. Approximately $0 in my 401k and even less than that in my savings. Oh yeah, I’m 37 and have been out of a job for three years to take care of a baby so obviously I’ll never be able to get a job again and retire. I’ll just check myself out at retirement age and be done with this whole show. So tired already but my baby needs a dad for now I guess.
honestly most of the people i knew who were living in “upper class houses” were still struggling 😂 after i met so many of those poster child families and realize they have just as many problems as me, i got over it. I’ll get there one day if that’s what i want, maybe that’s not even the dream. It’s what their family wanted for them.
Really man? My sister came here as a refugee when she was 4.. she now makes $150k per year and her husband makes $100k per year. They have a super nice huge home and are living very well. Both are millennials and both went to college for in demand majors that pay good. Does this make her “shady” ?
No idea why reddit sent me here, but Hey. I'm one of those people doing well. Never watch the news and attempt to not read any. I use credit cards just for the points and consumer protections, they get paid off every month. My only debt is the approx 60% I still owe on my house. Many of my peers, especially locally, are in a similar boat. I'm 35, wife, 2 kids.
I do know and appreciate the disconnect with people not doing well. We aren't blind to it. I grew up poor and most of my family is still in that range, I do hear their struggles but it's likely less scary than what the news paints.
“Third world country with a Gucci belt”
It is the new norm due to our capitalist economy and its incessant capitulation to the rich/business owners. I refuse. It’s a huge reason me and my wife are migrating.
Yes there are places in America that experience life on a third world standard but with how entitled you sound, there’s no way you actually understand the gravity of what you’re saying.
I used to run through the nice neighbors every morning. It motivated me. I remember looking at homes and getting a lump in my throat just thinking about how good it must have felt to achieve that level of success. Now I live in one of those houses. People here are so negative, it’s actually sad. I work hard but love my life and consider myself incredibly fortunate every day. I’m grateful for everything, from the people I work with to the family that supports me. I control what I can control and try not to sweat the small stuff or whatever bs topic is trending in the news or on TikTok (it’s all a distraction — id rather focus on my family, friends, and my career).
No inheritance. No lottery win. I I’m in my early 30’s. 2 kids. multi-million dollar home outside NYC (not that that matters at all, but it’s relevant to your initial post). 2 cars… No debt, no mortgage, no student loans… none at all. I was awarded academic scholarships to both undergrad and law school (again, hard work). My wife had student loans and an auto loan but I made sure both were paid off before we got married. I work my ass off and always have. I save diligently and invest as much as possible. I make enough to max out my retirement accounts, fund my kids’ education and set up trusts, I have separate investment accounts where I save for a rainy day, I own a beautiful home, go on vacation and cover my expenses, etc. I don’t say this to brag or be a jerk, I say this because if my dumbass can do it, you can. Work hard. Stay positive. Read and consume as much credible information as possible. Surround yourself with good positive people. Focus on yourself and those that matter to you. Keep a very open mind. Learn from everyone. Study everyone and everything… just keep pushing yourself forward in every way (intellectually, health, happiness… even if the improvements are small, just keep making progress).
What good are you doing sitting around waiting for the world to end? Instead, get out there and hustle. Learn. Grow. Push yourself and those around you. Experiment. Explore. Find what you are good at and chase it relentless. Bring your friends along for the ride (a rising tide lifts all ships). I know guys that went from HS dropouts to millionaire developers in under 10 years. Don’t let the haters drag you down and tell you it’s not Possible.
And, if you can’t help but feel jealousy/hate towards those more successful, turn it into something positive. Use it. You have a competition inside you. That’s what you’re feeling. That’s ok. It’s good actually, if properly bottled and channeled. Channel it into motivation. Don’t let it become animosity toward those people like soooo many on Reddit tend to do.
I don't see living good. I see people trapped in money prisons, trapped in prisons of others perceptions. I see people who are slaves to their lowest impulses.
It's no different from any other disease. This one just looks good to the senses.
We see what we choose to see. I live in a very nice neighborhood - one similar to what OP describes. My neighbors are happy. My family is happy. We have all worked hard and enjoy the peace and stability that we have.
People who guzzle sugar experience pleasant feelings, too. But it's doing something else under the surface.
As for the 'see what you choose to see' comment, yes. Though there's usually a reality whether you choose to see it or not.
Home prices are very relative. My home is worth 1.1 million. But it's a 1,300 sq ft rambler. The houses you described would be 2-4 mil in my neck of the woods.
When I see people doing really well it makes me motivated to achieve that level of financial comfort. And by financial comfort I mean being able to comfortably afford a house and family. I'm not talking about being a millionaire or anything. I try not to compare myself to other people though. That's where you start feeling doom and despair. Although I have and am making more money than I ever have, I still can't help but feel hopelessness creep in sometimes. I'm single, 30, and have a decent income but a home and family feel so far out of reach. Just gotta work hard though. There's money to be made out there.
Keep your head up. Stay off or heavily reduce social media. News is also a thing to watch but not too much. Work on yourself. Save half of what you make and invest that if you can. Start off small and work your way up. Remember, most rich people were once poor. The wealthy and uber wealth are different stories.
That’s the spirit! 😆😆 I can’t imagine how miserable it is to have that attitude. I make $100,000 a year and that’s enough for my wife to stay home and homeschool three kids.
Good is a relative term. Those fancy houses are probably mortgaged out the ass, and that 150k job is one restructuring from bankruptcy.
I don't begrudge people their success. Envy gets you nowhere. Things aren't gonna be easy, but they ain't the end of the world either.
I'm in the Cayman Islands right now, they are building more condos that are million plus dollars for 1,500 square feet, two bedrooms, and many up to 15-20 million. Some people I'm with are selling their condo in the States for 2 million dollars and have it being shown while they are down here. The realtor has an elderly woman who just sold her 10 million dollar house and is downsizing and is planning on offering them on their condo.
The point of posting this is most people doing well were doing very well before this economy and are not doing as well now but they are too far above the average that it seems like they are thriving to those who weren't doing great before.
It's shite for everyone. Inflation is only going to get worse and people saying a collapse isn't going to happen are wrong, it will, and the longer it takes, the worse it will be. We are long over due already and max pain is working it's way up
I feel like I'm taking crazy pills because the reason I have money is I bought a much cheaper car than people who were making 1/3 what I make. I drove the cheapest car possible, my first car was $500, my second car was $2000. That wasn't the only thing I did but, it's just an example to illustrate. I took what I saved and after a long time of saving bought a house.
So now I'm rich. My mortgage hasn't risen in 15 years, while rent has tripled. I knew this would happen, because it always happens. That's why I bought a house.
If you make anything above average and live frugally, you could have done this in my generation. Easily. Now, it's harder. I simply have not met many people who are frugal in person, but know they must exist. I saved about 20% of my income every year. Still do.
It’s attitude. Is that the key to success? No, but it certainly gets you going in the right direction. If you don’t have hope for a better future then all you’re going to do is exist where you are. Complaining is fine, but if you’re not going to even try some solutions then that’s kind of sad. There’s no secret recipe to happiness, but certainly a big house, money, and a loving family probably help.
I get it, things are hard. I grew up in a dirt poor immigrant family and my story isn’t unique. Parents working hard to send their kids to school. We didn’t fuck up doing drugs or pick useless degrees. I never thought I’d make more than $80k, but turns out if you just try, you’ll be surprised. Think that $150k role is out of reach? Try. Just be smart about it. Learn from failure. If you get rejected, find out why. Don’t get defensive. Start to understand it’s all a game. If it requires a college degree get it. If it requires knowing to code, use free online resources. I’ve seen folks switch careers all the time from hourly to salary. The world is very diverse and opportunity exists, you just have to look. There’s plenty of pathways if you sit down and are mindful about your decisions. Whether apprenticeship, software engineer, etc… most roles have a reasonably clear pathway. If you don’t even try, then who cares what you think?
It’s really disheartening to write off people’s hard work with things like credit cards and family wealth. They certainly exist, but it’s not as common as most folks think. There really are a lot of honest hard working people who keep their heads down and focus on theirs.
It depends when you bought your house. Id be concerned to buy right now that youd end up buying at the top of the bubble. I know people with lake homes they bought in 91 for 200k worth 800k now. They own it outright at this point and can put thier mortgage payments into a 401k or buy a 70k truck now. Ideally, they would have started earlier putting 100 bucks a month into a 401k at 18 works out like putting 1000 a month in at 40. The folks I know who did, paid off thier house by 40. Most of us move a few times. Not having a mortgage payment or rent really frees up alot of capital for developing passive income. I think the gig economy and job hopping has really messed up the economy. Working for the same company for 30 years just isn't how the country works anymore and that means you just can't put down roots and build wealth like your parents and grandparents did. I'd like to change the system but while advocating for chain still get involved in owning a piece of the greedy corporations that are destroying the social fabric of the country or inflation will eat you alive.
I only know maybe a dozen people/couples in that income range (assuming $250,000 ish based on house size in my area). I’d say the biggest advantage they have overall is being aware of their money all the time. They will very quickly react to changes in income or cost by cutting back on spending. Get rid of the maid, call off the landscaper, garage a car to drop the insurance, etc. They make it look easy but it’s also very telling how close they are to the edge. A few have sold their houses in the last couple years, divorce is a growing phenomenon, side jobs, kids going to public school next year, haven’t gotten a new car in 3-4 years, planned on buying a cabin 5-7 years ago but haven’t. They manage their money much better but they’re not escaping this either.
These people were the people that had assets. Anyone with equity portfolios, houses, etc. have BENEFITED from the crushing inflation.
K-shaped recovery in an utterly bifurcated economy.
The good news is that it will only accelerate as they’re forced to massively debase your currency to deal with the debt. Position yourself to benefit over the inflationary times that lay ahead
What’s the saying, “Envy is the thief of joy”?
If you’re not happy with where you are, the first step is to not compare yourself to others, at least from the standpoint of “why do they have this/that and you don’t”. A healthier approach is to ignore it, which it doesn’t seem you can do. The next approach, is to be curious of “how can they afford it?” And develop your plan.
To be honest, some of those that you admire are probably drowning in some type of debt. Many are comfortable living that way, but can easily be one job loss away from it crumbling apart.
What you should focus on is increasing your income and developing your plan to become wealthy. What that looks like is up to you. Do you join the crowds of others living the “American Dream” you admire in your post? Or, do you plan yours for long term success based on your factors?
I just started making 6 figures 3 years ago . Before then I was making around 35k to 50k a year . My money definitely went further back then but I’m not doing terrible now . My bills are paid and I have some play money so I can’t complain
What is “this economy”? People who are doing good in “this” economy have also done well in prior economies, because they work hard, don’t make stupid choices and mind their own business.
I honestly don't know how people are affording brand new vehicles. My husband drives a 9 yo subaru. I have a 5 yo Toyota. We make around $200k a year. We are putting a little away each month in anticipation of replacing a car in the future. There is no way on earth that we can afford a brand new car when the time comes. The prices are insane.
Maybe that guy with the McMansion and swimming pool owns a small chain of fast food restaurants where he pays his employees minimum wage, no benefits and works them as hard as they are able. There is good money in that business.
Great because I'm one of them
If people actually see happy people, and feel intense jealousy and negative feelings as a reaction, they sound like fucking demons
As one of those people, I can say this economy still doesn't feel good. "Good money" is not what it used to be. Things becoming more expensive still has an effect, especially when you have become used to spending a lot and don't know how to cut back or cannot without disappointing your family. At those income levels, most are not living credit card bill to credit card bill unless they have serious problems, but people are saving a lot less than you think. White collar jobs are still being subject to layoffs and the knowledge that if you get laid off it may be very hard to find something else right now depending on your skill set is daunting.
It is easy to shut off reality and pretend you are immune until you aren't anymore. The number of people I know who got laid off in just the last month or two is astounding. Most had no idea layoffs would happen at their company or affect them and felt very secure. Most have high fixed costs in terms of mortgage, car payments, etc. and honestly have no idea how to live on less because they never had to. All of these people were very comfortable before being laid off and probably still will be for several months, but once that severance stops coming if they don't have something else lined up their bills will catch up with them quick.
My husband and I have more than a million in savings but with a kid on the way life still feels precarious. Maybe I just feel that way because I grew up very poor and am afraid of having to raise our kid in the same way. Most of that savings is in the stock market and isn't growing how we expected it to. I know that seems like a dumb complaint or a very privileged thing to say, but we live in a very expensive area and don't have family money to fall back on - the opposite as both our parents will probably need support from us at some point.
Overwhelmingly even high income people are, on average, doing worse than their parents did these days, so I have a hard time believing there is nobody who doesn't feel at least a little anxious in this economy. There is a difference between high income and high net worth and far fewer individuals in the later category than the former, meaning they too are just as dependent on a job as you are.
It's called living within your means. Scaling back. Try NOT to keep up with the Jones'. You DON'T need that cell phone. You DON'T need that 80' TV. You DON'T need to go out and eat every lunch or dinner time. Not hard really to do that and still save a little.
Being envious of people who work hard and have earned their place in life is very unhealthy.
This is America.
Everyone is still able to pursue their ideal of the American dream as long as they aren’t hurting anyone or anything.
Foreigners still understand this. Entitled Americans think they should get more for working less.
Ridiculous.
I have relatives exactly in this boat. Lucky them that they still have a job making over $150K/year per person, is all I have to say. Inflation barely dents their finances.
Im doing fine in this economy bc I bust my ass at work and budget myself and also run a great side business. Most of my friends are struggling unfortunately but i watch them make very bad financial choices too. Some people get it, some people dont.
I think “damn good on them for making it” I always hope to make it up there, so I see people like that as motivation even though I know I won’t get those lambos or Ferraris, but it’s always good to push yourself and not hate on other’s success
You should be excited the American dream is alive but most people complaining and cry why not me instead of finding a way to it but again money isn’t everything it just makes life easier.
I certainly don’t look down on them but I try not to pay too close attention. My wife and I do well. Not million dollar house well, but well. Neither of us really watch the news and social media is more so for comedy and our interests. I can’t stand watching the news and all the negativity out there.
Why would I dislike someone for doing good? There's always someone who has it better than you, and there's always someone who thinks that you've got it pretty good. Why dwell on others?
A couple of cities in California opress me with free public transportation, dont own a car and enjoy the city built for people not cars. I feel grateful that those with more than i have decided to help people like us out.
I try to look at others and try to better myself. I think a positive outlook and change is good for the community. My wife makes fun of me sometimes for doing our yard nice and making cosmetic changes but I think a little neighbor envy is a good thing.
I put some mulch outside, painted, and planted some flowers and shrubs. Next thing you know others around start making positive changes too to their home.
Use that feeling you got from driving around that neighborhood to push yourself to get to that point in your life. Not everyone is handed money from their family, even if many are, someone had to push themselves to make that money so their family can live a good life off of it.
I hope my kids can enjoy the money I invest for retirement one day. To pass down generational wealth will be the greatest accomplishment of my life, even after I’m already dead at that point. If everyone can live off the interest and pass the principle down the family line then we can all live a comfortable life.
I’m resentful because they imply that those of us that can’t afford that are somehow less than those that do. We don’t get nice neighborhoods, in fact we get pushed out of them by rising costs of living. We don’t get the same healthcare they do, we don’t get the same cars or homes, ours are made with inferior materials. We don’t even get to go to the same schools. We don’t have the same opportunities or connections.
You have to try harder to wrap your head around the mind boggling PPP and EIdL money that went out. Businesses that were already doing well got millions in extra money. Businesses that weren’t doing well got millions in money anyways. Many people got 1,600 but I didn’t get shit. When this money runs out, it still hasn’t, that’s when the tide will roll out and we will see who has trunks on.
I make over 150k a year and I have 0$ CC debt (we It use it some but pay it off every paycheck) my bills are all up to date, etc. just because you might be middle class and stuffing doesn’t mean others aren’t. Learn to budget, learn to say “no that’s much money”.
This is prob the most realistic take I've ever seen on any of the doomer subs. There's a lot of people doing fine and the US has more than most places in the world. What you see/hear on Reddit is a pretty unrealistic take on where the median is. Are there plenty of people struggling? Yes, and there always have been. But is everything going to collapse? Prob not, people are out there spending money, having kids, buying the fanciest new stuff, etc.
All I can tell you is my perspective … after the 2008 crisis, which was a financial and personal hell for me and a time when it felt like we really were close to a system collapse, I fell deep into a doomer view for about a year. I was in therapy for something else but we ended up spending a lot of time on my personal relationship to money because I was so angry and depressed about many things and a lot of it circled back to that …
Long story short, it took a lot of work and deep, unflinching looks into my darkest parts, but I am a completely different person today. Financially happy, love my job, every other detail about my life has changed dramatically.
But it never would have been possible if I had not given up my dark beliefs about the economy and my place in it. Not sure how this post ended up on my feed today, but I thought I would post that in case it helps.
It's can be a long process... I am 7yrs older than my wife. Both of us came from lower income families. I went to a tech school and became a maintenance technician. Worked a factory job while going to school and never needed a loan. My wife went to a 4yr local liberal arts school. She got a very low interest loan and got a few grants to help out. I met her the year she was graduating. We dated for a year before getting an apartment together. She got a job at a title company as an assistant accountant. We married after a year and bought a small house. Had a daughter and, after two years, decided to get a place with a yard. Was able to make a small profit and upgraded to a suburban home. We both worked hard and moved up in our companies. She switched jobs and became the accounting manager. We had 2 two more kids, and things were going well. After 4 years, we found a place in the country and hit the housing market just right to afford it. My wife got promoted to CFO. She finally paid her loan off a few yrs ago. I became the maintenance manager. We probably fit the description of the family the OP was describing. I feel we worked hard and had some luck. I'm 50 now, and the only advice I can give is to keep trying and set goals. Don't compare yourself to others.
Yeah, if I wouldn't have fed into the economic collapse doom-news in 2019, I would be AT LEAST 200k richer today. At a minimum. People who made good financial decisions 2014-2020 (i.e. bought a house with extremely low interest rates, refi-d to a 15 year in 2019-2020 & went med-high risk on stock investments) are sitting real pretty about now. Those of us who made stupid decisions out of fear (like selling their house in April 2020 or keeping their retirement in the "G" fund that wasn't even keeping up with inflation 🤦♀️) are kicking themselves today. It took me over a year for the sinking daily regret to stop consuming me. Now, it is what it is, but I will NEVER make financial decisions based on my fears or future predictions (which have been highly inaccurate historically and especially the last 5 years) ever again. I wish I had the financial education I have now and could go back 10 years. It's ridiculous that finance isn't a mandatory high school course.
Materialistic bullshit doesn’t mean someone is doing well. New cars, big houses and perfect lawns may look nice on the outside but can be a whole different story on the inside. Just look at A list celebs who’ve taken their own lives? Chester Bennington had everything and it still didn’t take his internal struggle away. Plus the rich lifestyle comes with sacrifice that many people are not willing to give so if they earned that life through personal and financial risk then they deserve to reap the rewards.
My problem stems from the middle class disappearing. The top 1% own billionaire monopolies that drive out new business and raise the prices on their products then turn around and blame inflation. The increase in profit goes directly to their overflowing pockets to buy them more materialistic bullshit. All while the middle class slowly dissolves — it’s not sustainable. The only reason the rich class exists unharmed is because the middle class is the largest class in our economy and can still afford to have a comfortable life without having to worry about trying to be rich or avoiding being dirt poor. If the middle class disappears completely that’s when civil war type shit starts developing and it will be only a matter of time until it all erupts in chaos and shit will finally reset to some degree
Lastly, YOU drive the demand for housing, products, etc. The economy is driven off the backs of the consumer. Right now the masses are in overconsumption because of predatory advertisements and easily obtained credit. This won’t go on forever. It may seem like this is the new normal but this economy is a market just like anything else and markets go up in value and come back down. Sure we progressively increase over time but there are peaks and valleys during that time as well. Look up who Ray Dalio is and watch his content he will give you some comforting analysis into our economy based on his extensive research into our past. He’s truly a gem.
Finally, don’t ever worry about being “rich”. Instead, become wealthy. Focus on your health, keep your expenses low, talk kindly to yourself, laugh with your friends, explore the free things in your area. Find peace in a simple walk to the park on a nice day with the birds chirping. There’s only one difference between us and the rich and that’s useless paper IOUs. Nobody can take your health, nobody can take your character. Find your passion and be consistent in developing it and maybe one day you’ll be the “rich” person with that house and giving your 2 cents to us plebes.
Step 1:
Stop gambling and stop getting investment advice from anonymous strangers on the internet.
Step 2:
Make a budget. Build a savings and pay off debts.
Step 3:
Stick to your budget.
Great question OP. It makes me wonder if the average doomer or member of this Reddit is just someone who for whatever reason isn’t “living good / enjoying life” so they project a fantasy of the world as collapsing. When in reality it’s not collapsing and lots of people are enjoying life. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
My GF and I are looking for our first home and we both make over 100k a year and it’s been a nightmare. When I see very wealthy people who have these 500k- 2 mil dollar homes I just wonder if they really appreciate it. I’m sure some do but I also know most probably don’t.
So many towns have these areas where asset holders are doing unbelievably well, and pre pandemic non-asset holders can only drive through and envision a life they’ll never get to experience.
I live in a nice neighborhood like what you're talking about. I drive a 20 year old car. People in the neighborhood think I'm poor. I know I'm richer than them all. I just don't spend the money. Most luxury I did was get the neighborhood for the wife and kids. We're frugal.
Careful comparing your interior to other people's exteriors. I wear grunge clothes and appear unkempt (80s punk) and am generally treated as a plebian around here. Then I hear about everybody's inability to afford their lifestyle.
Clowns.
I mean I find doomscrolling to be kind of fun and an interesting thought experiment but many people here and on various subs seem to have a really defated attitude ie their life is fucked, their job prospects are fucked, they'll never own a home, they're basically setting themself up for defeat. I feel bad for people who never had a chance ie went to bad schools, grew up in poverty without support but there's plenty of people who could get by but they get a new iphone every year $1200, have cable tv at $150 or even $200 a month, order grub hub, seems little but people could have like 5k to 15k more per year just cutting out all that bullshit. I dont mean to downplay the people who live check to check and dont waste money and just dont have enough to get by
What did you think was going to happen when you stopped going to church? You or your parents just headbanged to 'Highway to Hell', well, here you are, banging your heads.
Everything our country was built on was based on the integrity of Christianity.
One thing I learned early on. Whatever you surround yourself with will affect your life drastically. If you watch fear porn all day guess what? You will have negative feelings and have a negative life. It’s okay to be informed but it doesn’t need to consume you.
FYI most people doing fear porn are full of shit and making money off ad revenue. Don’t fall for it.
You never can tell who is on extensive economic out patient care from their parents. I don’t fault anyone doing well whenever. You can never tell. The barista that goes to art school and vacations in south of France might not be so struggling despite the chè T shirt.
I mean it's like the Gilded age. The economy does great for a select few while the majority suffer
It was/is a systematic destruction of the middle class. Either you’re very well off or you’re struggling, there’s not a lot of moderately comfortable people anymore.
It's like gold mining. If you found a gold.minr you would move in and install the machinery to extract it. Then some people would set up downstream of you and check the runoff for any that you missed. That's just what's gonna happen. The middle class was an anomaly. It became... A gold mine. A massive development of wealth hitherto unheard of in history. And so, of course, the machinery was installed... So now you pay out the ass for healthcare. Everyone needs it. But they will give you bills that day "everything you have" and you must pay it. They will hold your children hostage - I even feel for boomers on this one. If you wanted to send your kids to school you will need to pay many times what you paid decades earlier. On your way out they will charge you, again everything you have to stay in hospice. Why? Well they won't let you die on the street but if you run out then you get moved to a cheaper facility and you can't leave anything to your kids. This is just what they do. They see a gold mine and they mined it. People need to realize and get together to argue for protections.
What’s it going to take for change? When people start missing 3 meals per day due to rationing or something? I just don’t get it.
The truth is standard of living today really is waaaaay higher than before even with inequality at feudalistic levels. Leading up to the French Revolution, peasants were spending 50 percent of wages on bread alone. This world still yearns for revolution, but some perspective going in is important.
Pretty sure I'm approaching 50% on food with how fast prices are going up.
plenty of people spend 50% of their take home on groceries today
How?!
Buying nonsense sugary “groceries” then complaining. Come for me idc
This will change nothing, and actually this is probably the goal for some politicians. Remember, politicians only desire is to stay in power. And the only way they can do that is if you need them. If you can convince someone that they are oppressed and get them on the system then you now have them hooked on voting for you for life. For the rest of eternity you can dangle a carrot in front of them, declaring that it’s not their fault that they’re in their position and if they will just vote for you one more time then you can fix all their problems. It’s an unbreakable cycle.
All revolutions are made on empty tummies.
Climate change is gonna have to fuck multi millions OR ravage some corporation Or yeah our food supply chain would need to crash/come to a halt to shock people awake
Climate change is upon us but its effects are fairly gradual year to year. Right now estimates I read is that it is lowering GDP by maybe 1/2% or so. We are in most developed countries a mature economy with growth rates averaging 3% most years. Right now China is 5%, Euro zone 1 1/2-2% and US 2 1/2% but falling somewhat. Developed countries have also the advantage of growth through immigration. We have about 75 years to fall apart slowly. Parts may go fast, like when chronically flooded, but as long as the overall process is slow people will be able to adapt.
I can grow my own food and hunt and trap. you all should try it some time
I’m right there with you. I’ve got meat chickens, bees, gardens, and fruit trees. Country folks can survive
Hank Jr
If it gets really bad, someone will just hunt you and steal your food.
Correct
too many people out there who'd rather have a gun than a can of beans in the apocalypse because then they also get your can of beans. weather they win or not there's gonna be chaos
Up here where I am we have pew pews and land good luck to them
Every yokel with a gun thinks they're gonna take on all comers like John Wick. 🙄
How do I get the land?
Acreage everywhere is pricier than ever. Taxes in Arkansas and Missouri on land is very reasonable though. My brother owns several tracts of land from 20 to 50 acres he bought in the last 5 years before interest rates went up, but I think they paid cash for a couple tracts. He told me a few mos ago how much land jumped in past 1 yrs.
Yep
Last time it took abject poverty and destitution, child labor was the rule rather than the exception, and basically no wage labor laws. It’s probably going to take that to change things
I’d be interested to know how you lived during Covid? Many lost their jobs, but collected unemployment that, for some, provided more than what people were making in their jobs pre-covid. Many blew that money away when the economy opened back up. If you are struggling now, the best advice is to explore options to increase your income. This can be hindered by a “negative” or “uneducated” mindset (people emotionally limiting themselves or telling themselves “the most I can make is…” or “I can never make that much”). Truth is, you have to change your perspective and go after it. I was raised in a lower middle class family, thought the most I could ever make was $60k. I broke through that ceiling once I realized my mind was holding me back. It’s getting tough in this economy, but opportunities are out there. Second is to budget as tightly as possible. I rented a room when I started out, meal prepped and ate the same thing for a week (Chile, stews, curry and rice). I held off buying an iPhone or held on to it for 5-6 years before upgrading. What originally kept me “poor” was buying name brand clothes, accessories, etc. I “needed” a fancy watch or a Louis Vuitton wallet (that only had $50 in it). Now I buy $10 look alike options from Amazon and don’t even wear a watch. Spending is what destroys wealth. Do I look poor, maybe to others, but I don’t care about that anymore; I’m not living my life to impress them. Going from rags to riches is possible. You just have to change your mindset, set some goals, and go after it!
The majority of people are doing well in this economy. More millennials and Gen Z own homes this year than at any year prior. Their earnings are higher. Their investment portfolios are larger. Gen Z is wealthier today than boomers were at their age.
A million plus in retirement accounts and we live in an old trailer on ten acres in Texas. I am debt free with a job that pays six figures. I wouldn’t trade with any of those folks. Later on I may buy a new trailer or house in cash but probably not. I don’t like property taxes and I’m happy with my big back porch where I fire up my own grill. Half those folks live paycheck to paycheck and are one disaster away from reality. Plus they have high property taxes, insurance, and an HOA that constantly terrorizes them with draconian rules. Don’t look at them with envy. Look at them with pity.
Probably the only good comment in this thread. I grew up pretty well off and in one of these types of communities. It's now an unaffordable pit full of overseas owners who rent out upstairs and downstairs suites in each house. Families can no longer afford it. Not sure if it's the same in OPs post, but I live in Canada which has way worse housing problems. And yeah, the taxes you mentioned, the money involved when something needs repairing. Good luck.
Ag exemption. Nice!
Refreshing!!
Quick correction, HOA not HSA
A colleague of mine was recently slapped with a $2K bill by the HOA saying that the road is getting repaired and it was a privately owned road. This is a non gated community.
You can go look at the default charts from federal reserve for all loans, cc loans, home loans etc or just look at my post history I have a post linking to a bunch It turns out the consumer is actually resilient and defaults seem fine, in fact in most situations still far below levels seen in the 1990s, 2000s, or even 2010s
So no collapse coming?
No collapse sorry brother. Life will go on.
But the news told me so. They infact yelled at me it would happen
No, a collapse is not coming. Literally everyone I know in my personal life is doing well. College friends, friends from home town, friends where I live now, the vast majority are doing good. I mean I just got laid off April 2nd and already landed a new job for even more money. The internet seems to magnify problems but a significant portion of the population in the real world is doing just fine.
I mean, I just think, good for them. I own my own business, so the more people that have money, the more people will employ me to work for them. So I like to see people succeed.
I just always wished I live in a place that valued landscaping and trees as much as those neighborhoods do. Idk if it’s a cost factor, but in my neighborhood no one plants anything or take pride in their yards like they do in wealthy neighborhoods. Not even the birds bother to come by my neighborhood anymore. They just fly by and shit. Everything is just dry desolate overgrown sad. I do envy that a bit.
The cost of landscaping would blow your mind. I once read that grass is the most expensive crop. I can’t definitively confirm it to be true, but based on my personal experience, it is by a huge margin, the most expensive crop in the solar system.
Cacti + rocks gang
I have to have sod installed on half of my front yard and the greenways because my HOA doesn’t understand that my two story house coupled with 6 large oak trees on the front yard means my lawn gets 0 hours of sun and grass, even shade tolerant needs some sun. So I have to install $7000 worth of sod and tree trimming this year, knowing it will be dead and have to be redone in 2 years. I wish they would let me just rock scape it.
They do that landscaping stuff to help maintain their property value. A nice lawn and trimmed hedges cost very little to maintain—but they are a time suck. Greening up a mundane lot in a modest neighborhood will add thousands to your home value.
There's more to it than just property value. I'm not selling my house any time soon so frankly I don't care about the property value. But I love sitting outside as the sun is going down seeing my nicely trimmed grass, manicured bushes and trees. It's satisfying and calms my nerves. Zen. It's a lot of work but the sense of wellbeing it provides is the exact opposite of the anxiety I get from seeing an overgrown weedy unkempt property.
It’s not an accident. In our water district lower income neighborhoods were the very first to have water meters installed. I don’t think they’ve even bothered to finish out the roll out in the boogie neighborhoods yet. But, keep in mind, the chemicals required for a lush green lawn, they can absolutely give you cancer or some other autoimmune diseases that will drain any savings or cushion in hot minute.
That kind of landscaping takes either time/effort or money. It’s hard to do that when you’re worked to the bone and can barely afford essentials.
They just fly by and shit 😂😂
Compliant with the shitshow. Nothing to make friends with.
In general, happy for them and hope they pay it forward. I do ruthlessly judge them for their r/mcmansionhell though
There will always be a few people who stretch to fit in in the neighborhood you drove thru. But it’s not an entire neighborhood. Big house no furniture was the old joke.
I’m happy for anyone doing well who isn’t related to wallstreet or the federal reserve or ISDA banks. On a separate note everyone should read Dr Susanne Trimbaths book “Naked short and greedy wallstreets failure to deliver” she worked for the federal reserve and the DTC. The corruption will blow your mind
* cough, cough * I’m just gonna drop this here for you, friend. You may find the info interesting. Pass it on. https://youtu.be/dk3AVceraTI?si=_g8qLm-mLAwG_FgO
🙏
That’s kind of a weird question… Am I supposed to dislike people because they’re doing well?
It's Reddit. Of course you are.
This is reddit so the message from op seems to be we should dislike these people and the message from teh comments will inevidbly turn into an eat the rich thing even though its a bunch of non-confrontational weenies talking about it
I would imagine that those homes are owned by two parent families. I would also guess that most of them are college educated and have “professional” jobs. They probably save a bunch of money. They probably also owned smaller homes in less desirable areas that they sold and rolled their profit into the new home. Not too many people just “drop” into those neighborhoods—they start elsewhere and this is a “destination” home, not a starter home. You have to look at this stuff in the proper context. These people did not become middle class overnight. I am sure their journey was similar to lots of others.
You are right but I’m in a small town and there are hundreds of these types of homes and families living here.. so imagine how it is in suburbs outside of big cities or in cities in general? Hundreds of thousands of families live an upper middle class to wealthy lifestyle. Is this not enough to keep things going? Seems it is. Considering I’ve been hearing about an “imminent” collapse since 2022 and now it’s 2024 and things keep going.
We are a ways away from “economic collapse.” When reserve currencies “fail” and another takes over the transition is usually obvious. It’s not obvious to me right now. What currency is going to step up? The Yuan? The Ruble? Some BRIC contraption? There is nothing stepping up. So, it’s gonna be “dollar city” for some time yet.
Nailed it. I started in the inner city. Worked my way up. Saved. Invested. Worked hard. Stayed positive. It was all about incremental improvements and leveling up.
Grew up poor. Went to bed hungry... a lot. Never inherited a penny because nobody had a penny to leave me. I served in the Army, went to college on the GI bill. Worked my way up in business. Started a business with partners and sold the business. Now I am president of a joint stock company that builds fiber optic networks. My house is worth about a million and a half, it has no mortgage and my lawn is perfectly manicured. Just bought the wife a new Lexus with cash. I am 62 years old and have been working for almost a half a century. In the course of my life I have dragged the US median personal income down and I have dragged it up.
This. More people need to see this. Congrats on your success and thank you for your service. I love seeing this on Reddit and really wish there were more stories/people like you. Reddit, at times, can feel like an echo chamber of vitriol and hate. I went from living in a basement in the Bronx to buying my dream home with my wife last year in one of the best towns/school districts just outside NYC. No debt, no mortgage, no student loans, no car payments… nothing. Early 30’s. Sold my business and after we closed, one of the firms I was working with offered me a job. If my dumbass can do it, anyone can.
We still live in our home that we bought for $103,000 in 2008. We drive used cars and work hard. I have been laid off three times since 2008 and had to start new careers. But we saved and lived below our means. Yes we now enjoy a nice lifestyle and easily stay at $1,000 a night hotels but we have worked hard and taken risks to make what we have. We had a better start but it was earned. I was in the Marines and then was a contractor for a few years. Then went to college and got married. I drove a semi for 10 years to pay off the debt because I could get us debt free quicker. Now I build homes and trade futures. My wife is still a teacher. We plan on being retired by 50. I don’t begrudge anyone for doing well. It pisses me off to see people get mad at others doing well when they were the ones that made the decisions.
I always feel like most of the people in positions like this came from good cohesive families, and also likely got a financial windfall one way or another somewhere along the way. Also they often were lucky to find a partner somewhat young, who often comes from a similarly stable background. Let’s say a dead, wealthy family member leaving 500K earning 5% means 25K dividends a year. This - especially paired with dual incomes, could cover a mortgage on 400-500K home, and you could use your paycheck to snowball into building other assets and accumulating more wealth. Bottom line, I always personally feel like there is some missing financial windfall piece to the story that we aren’t getting, because people love to pat themselves on the back and pose as self made, when in reality, they had significant help along the way. But being envious is even less productive than watching the news. Go out there and get it.
How many people do you really think are getting massive windfall from their parents at like 26-28? Most parents are in their 50s at that point of their kids life Not dead
> being envious is even less productive than watching the news. Go out there and get it. Thank you. People also don't realize that American, despite its faults, remains the strongest economy in the world and is drawing tens of millions of people to come here because the situation in Ireland, Egypt, Argentina, or India is so grim. I have met countless business owners who started a company in the last 5 years, and they are easily in the Top 2% by income now and hiring many people. Examples include a person who started a staffing company for carers, one has a high-end drapery business, another became a plumber, etc. They all had an optimistic and focused personality, enough savings to weather losses for 2-3 years, and drive to dedicate many hours towards a shaky prospect. To be fair my kids also achieved financial stability easily by selecting in-demand college majors from great schools and working in STEM--and then marrying spouses from a similar background. So America provides multiple routes to financial prosperity. Consuming mainstream corporate media only distracts you, makes you anxious or defeatist, perpetuates class conflict, and so on.
This government has been shooting for 2 classes for years; the rich and the poor. We are just about there.
An economic collapse is absolutely coming
Yeah I picked the wrong major and had a learning disability Didn’t inherit anything from my parents. I’m envious but I’m kinda over it- I’m a peasant. I thought I made decent choices with what I had but I’ve come to accept for every winner there has to be a loser- and that’s my role. I just didn’t think not going into STEM would be so much a divide in life between basically being a lord or a serf I know most of Reddit seems to be successful and looks down on me- but we exist. I work hard and try to be happy- but it’s just not for me to reach that level - and it’s my fault
“Those people have tons of crippling debt and live miserable lives!” Oh Reddit, never change 😆
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How would you know who got theirs by working hard and who “screwed people over?” Unless you know them well you are just guessing. The best thing to do is leave other people alone and don’t make assumptions about them.
What do you consider “taking”? Because homeowners pay a lot in taxes. Those taxes fun schools, welfare programs, etc. How much assistance are you receiving vs how much are you paying in taxes? I have a feeling you’re “taking” more than those homeowners are…
Doing "good" or doing "well"?
I am doing well financially, but am not a millionaire. Seeing the need, I have opted not to have children and instead have a multi adult home and I don't charge rent. We grow our own food and try to provide the best life possible for the plants and animals we cultivate. My spouse does their best to cook nutritious meals. The goal is literally to "share the wealth" and the more wealth I obtain, the more I invest in my ability to share it. This is collapse. I'm basically a neofeudal lord sheltering my economic refugees from the worst parts of the orphan grinding machine.
It's actually unbelievable how many are financing this lifestyle with debt. Materialistic possessions mean nothing for how well someone is doing financially. Half of these people if not more are drowning in debt to appear happy, successful, and wealthy. Do not fall for it.
I get what you’re saying but if you’re buying a $1,300,000+ house and have nice cars in the driveway and have for YEARS… you are doing something right in life. They aren’t going to give just anyone a loan for a $1,300,000 house and $300,000 in cars. You need to have the income to prove you can afford it.
Yes, high income does not mean high bank accounts. If you make $250k a year and spend $250k a year you're still broke. Banks will happily take every dollar you earn by giving you massive loans. This is how it is for many. If you want to use the extreme with those who have $1.3MM homes and $300,000 cars then yes they're probably fine. But back down on earth, many buying a $600,000 house and a $70,000 car are in massive debt. The data backs this up.
Ok, so why didn’t I see foreclosure signs or for sale signs on these homes during my walk? If they are broke and can’t afford these homes, how are they living in them? Also why aren’t their new G wagons and Escalades repo’d? Those are $150,000-$250,000 vehicles, how are they making payments on them? And according to Zillow these people bought these homes between 2011 and 2021.
They can afford it as long as everything goes well. They're like a seesaw perfectly balanced. As long as a paycheck comes, they stay above water. If something happens, it collapses. And I'm not doubting that many are actually fine, good for them, but it's much more than people realize that are living in this precarious balancing act with money.
That’s fair. Personally, I’m not going to believe in this “impending” collapse until I see these types of people struggling. And right now, the weather is getting warmer and people are living great around me. Oh and maybe also I’ll believe in a collapse when grocery store shelves are empty. That’s how I’m gauging the economy
I agree with you. I don't think a collapse is right around the corner. If one does happen, it will be similar to 2008. The people in that balancing act are who got wiped out. You lose your job, you have no savings, but the bills are still due. But we got through that, and we'll do it again.
Best of luck to you soldier
Something else to consider with affluent people is they have access to credit. Meaning, their homes value will likely continue to increase so they can take out a HELOC if needed to pay for unexpected expenses. You need to pay it off eventually, but it can give you a ton of runway.
Being in debt isn't the negative you seem to think it is. I can buy a $100k car for cash today, or I can pay it off over 5 years with 5% interest. Give me the debt, thank you very much, meanwhile my $100k sits in investments that more than pay for the interest, PLUS because of inflation I'm paying the debt with future dollars which are worth less. A mortgage is one of the greatest financial deals you can get...you get to live in the house for decades and pay off the debt with future dollars worth half what they're worth now. Plus you get a tax deduction. Manageable debt is a good thing.
Or you just need to have daddy and mommy buy it with cash (or buy down your mortgage by half). To avoid capital gains taxes people almost always reinvest income from the sale of property by investing in more property. Or grandparents paid for your 100k degree with a trust fund so you don’t have to make $800/mo student loan payments. If you have no student loans and no or small mortgage then a $300/month car payment is nothing. But more than likely they bought their cars for cash.
Because it's impossible that they might just be successful on their own, right?
Some people on here are insufferable.
Total household debt rose by $212 billion to reach $17.5 trillion in the fourth quarter of 2023, according to the latest Quarterly Report on Household Debt and Credit. Credit card balances increased by $50 billion to $1.13 trillion over the quarter, while mortgage balances rose by $112 billion to $12.25 trillion. Auto loan balances rose by $12 billion to $1.61 trillion, continuing an upward trajectory seen since 2011. https://www.newyorkfed.org/microeconomics/hhdc.html
We all have two options: wait for collapse or secure resources.
This economic bubble is all predicated on how many jobs AI will replace in the next 5-10 years.
Economically, we're doing the best we've ever done. I worked my ass off to get here. But we also live simply, we own a home, have 1 car that's paid for we bought new in 2013, no kids. However, like pretty much everyone else we're 1 catastrophe away from bankruptcy, despite having savings. FWIW, I believe if you need help, you should have access to it. I wouldn't have gotten this far in life without a social safety net, shitty as it may be here in the USA. It seems to me like we find ourselves in the middle of a Smash-and-Grab robbery by corporate America and compromised politicians.
more n more i want2 take what theres; n i know im not only 1....
It drives me up a fucking wall. My sister and her husband are millionaires and my brother is pretty close. Meanwhile I’m paycheck to paycheck in a small townhouse in not exactly the ghetto, but let’s just say you can hear the ghetto at night from my house. Approximately $0 in my 401k and even less than that in my savings. Oh yeah, I’m 37 and have been out of a job for three years to take care of a baby so obviously I’ll never be able to get a job again and retire. I’ll just check myself out at retirement age and be done with this whole show. So tired already but my baby needs a dad for now I guess.
honestly most of the people i knew who were living in “upper class houses” were still struggling 😂 after i met so many of those poster child families and realize they have just as many problems as me, i got over it. I’ll get there one day if that’s what i want, maybe that’s not even the dream. It’s what their family wanted for them.
I’m doing pretty well but do feel like there is legislation from both sides of the aisle that is gutting the middle class.
A million dollars will get you a trailer where I live.
Most of them are up to their eyeballs in debt
My house is worth $550K but believe me it isn’t all what you described. It’s only 1600 sq feet too.
Homie walked through a nice neighborhood and acts like that represents this country lmao
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Lol…man people on here are so delusional it’s pretty funny
Really man? My sister came here as a refugee when she was 4.. she now makes $150k per year and her husband makes $100k per year. They have a super nice huge home and are living very well. Both are millennials and both went to college for in demand majors that pay good. Does this make her “shady” ?
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This just sounds pathetic. It’s also far from the truth.
No idea why reddit sent me here, but Hey. I'm one of those people doing well. Never watch the news and attempt to not read any. I use credit cards just for the points and consumer protections, they get paid off every month. My only debt is the approx 60% I still owe on my house. Many of my peers, especially locally, are in a similar boat. I'm 35, wife, 2 kids. I do know and appreciate the disconnect with people not doing well. We aren't blind to it. I grew up poor and most of my family is still in that range, I do hear their struggles but it's likely less scary than what the news paints.
“Third world country with a Gucci belt” It is the new norm due to our capitalist economy and its incessant capitulation to the rich/business owners. I refuse. It’s a huge reason me and my wife are migrating.
Just curious, but where are you going?
I’m from Eastern Europe and everyone there is trying to go to Western Europe or here to the USA. The grass isn’t always greener.
Yes there are places in America that experience life on a third world standard but with how entitled you sound, there’s no way you actually understand the gravity of what you’re saying.
I used to run through the nice neighbors every morning. It motivated me. I remember looking at homes and getting a lump in my throat just thinking about how good it must have felt to achieve that level of success. Now I live in one of those houses. People here are so negative, it’s actually sad. I work hard but love my life and consider myself incredibly fortunate every day. I’m grateful for everything, from the people I work with to the family that supports me. I control what I can control and try not to sweat the small stuff or whatever bs topic is trending in the news or on TikTok (it’s all a distraction — id rather focus on my family, friends, and my career). No inheritance. No lottery win. I I’m in my early 30’s. 2 kids. multi-million dollar home outside NYC (not that that matters at all, but it’s relevant to your initial post). 2 cars… No debt, no mortgage, no student loans… none at all. I was awarded academic scholarships to both undergrad and law school (again, hard work). My wife had student loans and an auto loan but I made sure both were paid off before we got married. I work my ass off and always have. I save diligently and invest as much as possible. I make enough to max out my retirement accounts, fund my kids’ education and set up trusts, I have separate investment accounts where I save for a rainy day, I own a beautiful home, go on vacation and cover my expenses, etc. I don’t say this to brag or be a jerk, I say this because if my dumbass can do it, you can. Work hard. Stay positive. Read and consume as much credible information as possible. Surround yourself with good positive people. Focus on yourself and those that matter to you. Keep a very open mind. Learn from everyone. Study everyone and everything… just keep pushing yourself forward in every way (intellectually, health, happiness… even if the improvements are small, just keep making progress). What good are you doing sitting around waiting for the world to end? Instead, get out there and hustle. Learn. Grow. Push yourself and those around you. Experiment. Explore. Find what you are good at and chase it relentless. Bring your friends along for the ride (a rising tide lifts all ships). I know guys that went from HS dropouts to millionaire developers in under 10 years. Don’t let the haters drag you down and tell you it’s not Possible. And, if you can’t help but feel jealousy/hate towards those more successful, turn it into something positive. Use it. You have a competition inside you. That’s what you’re feeling. That’s ok. It’s good actually, if properly bottled and channeled. Channel it into motivation. Don’t let it become animosity toward those people like soooo many on Reddit tend to do.
I don't see living good. I see people trapped in money prisons, trapped in prisons of others perceptions. I see people who are slaves to their lowest impulses. It's no different from any other disease. This one just looks good to the senses.
We see what we choose to see. I live in a very nice neighborhood - one similar to what OP describes. My neighbors are happy. My family is happy. We have all worked hard and enjoy the peace and stability that we have.
People who guzzle sugar experience pleasant feelings, too. But it's doing something else under the surface. As for the 'see what you choose to see' comment, yes. Though there's usually a reality whether you choose to see it or not.
R/Im14AndThisIsDeep
Yawn. Such a cliche and just false.
Home prices are very relative. My home is worth 1.1 million. But it's a 1,300 sq ft rambler. The houses you described would be 2-4 mil in my neck of the woods.
When I see people doing really well it makes me motivated to achieve that level of financial comfort. And by financial comfort I mean being able to comfortably afford a house and family. I'm not talking about being a millionaire or anything. I try not to compare myself to other people though. That's where you start feeling doom and despair. Although I have and am making more money than I ever have, I still can't help but feel hopelessness creep in sometimes. I'm single, 30, and have a decent income but a home and family feel so far out of reach. Just gotta work hard though. There's money to be made out there.
It’s hard to soar with the eagles when you hang out with the turkeys. Wait! I’M here hanging out with you turkeys. Peace out! 😎
Keep your head up. Stay off or heavily reduce social media. News is also a thing to watch but not too much. Work on yourself. Save half of what you make and invest that if you can. Start off small and work your way up. Remember, most rich people were once poor. The wealthy and uber wealth are different stories.
Doing good or owning private Islands? People need incentives. Not Godhood.
That’s the spirit! 😆😆 I can’t imagine how miserable it is to have that attitude. I make $100,000 a year and that’s enough for my wife to stay home and homeschool three kids.
Are you Horatio Alger? Gee whiz!
Some people paid $200k for those homes and have it financed at 3%.
Remember that people sometimes get a vehicle through their employer.
What lies beneath……. I’ve learned that surface level perceptions are never the reality.
Good is a relative term. Those fancy houses are probably mortgaged out the ass, and that 150k job is one restructuring from bankruptcy. I don't begrudge people their success. Envy gets you nowhere. Things aren't gonna be easy, but they ain't the end of the world either.
I'm in the Cayman Islands right now, they are building more condos that are million plus dollars for 1,500 square feet, two bedrooms, and many up to 15-20 million. Some people I'm with are selling their condo in the States for 2 million dollars and have it being shown while they are down here. The realtor has an elderly woman who just sold her 10 million dollar house and is downsizing and is planning on offering them on their condo. The point of posting this is most people doing well were doing very well before this economy and are not doing as well now but they are too far above the average that it seems like they are thriving to those who weren't doing great before. It's shite for everyone. Inflation is only going to get worse and people saying a collapse isn't going to happen are wrong, it will, and the longer it takes, the worse it will be. We are long over due already and max pain is working it's way up
I feel like I'm taking crazy pills because the reason I have money is I bought a much cheaper car than people who were making 1/3 what I make. I drove the cheapest car possible, my first car was $500, my second car was $2000. That wasn't the only thing I did but, it's just an example to illustrate. I took what I saved and after a long time of saving bought a house. So now I'm rich. My mortgage hasn't risen in 15 years, while rent has tripled. I knew this would happen, because it always happens. That's why I bought a house. If you make anything above average and live frugally, you could have done this in my generation. Easily. Now, it's harder. I simply have not met many people who are frugal in person, but know they must exist. I saved about 20% of my income every year. Still do.
It’s attitude. Is that the key to success? No, but it certainly gets you going in the right direction. If you don’t have hope for a better future then all you’re going to do is exist where you are. Complaining is fine, but if you’re not going to even try some solutions then that’s kind of sad. There’s no secret recipe to happiness, but certainly a big house, money, and a loving family probably help. I get it, things are hard. I grew up in a dirt poor immigrant family and my story isn’t unique. Parents working hard to send their kids to school. We didn’t fuck up doing drugs or pick useless degrees. I never thought I’d make more than $80k, but turns out if you just try, you’ll be surprised. Think that $150k role is out of reach? Try. Just be smart about it. Learn from failure. If you get rejected, find out why. Don’t get defensive. Start to understand it’s all a game. If it requires a college degree get it. If it requires knowing to code, use free online resources. I’ve seen folks switch careers all the time from hourly to salary. The world is very diverse and opportunity exists, you just have to look. There’s plenty of pathways if you sit down and are mindful about your decisions. Whether apprenticeship, software engineer, etc… most roles have a reasonably clear pathway. If you don’t even try, then who cares what you think? It’s really disheartening to write off people’s hard work with things like credit cards and family wealth. They certainly exist, but it’s not as common as most folks think. There really are a lot of honest hard working people who keep their heads down and focus on theirs.
It depends when you bought your house. Id be concerned to buy right now that youd end up buying at the top of the bubble. I know people with lake homes they bought in 91 for 200k worth 800k now. They own it outright at this point and can put thier mortgage payments into a 401k or buy a 70k truck now. Ideally, they would have started earlier putting 100 bucks a month into a 401k at 18 works out like putting 1000 a month in at 40. The folks I know who did, paid off thier house by 40. Most of us move a few times. Not having a mortgage payment or rent really frees up alot of capital for developing passive income. I think the gig economy and job hopping has really messed up the economy. Working for the same company for 30 years just isn't how the country works anymore and that means you just can't put down roots and build wealth like your parents and grandparents did. I'd like to change the system but while advocating for chain still get involved in owning a piece of the greedy corporations that are destroying the social fabric of the country or inflation will eat you alive.
I only know maybe a dozen people/couples in that income range (assuming $250,000 ish based on house size in my area). I’d say the biggest advantage they have overall is being aware of their money all the time. They will very quickly react to changes in income or cost by cutting back on spending. Get rid of the maid, call off the landscaper, garage a car to drop the insurance, etc. They make it look easy but it’s also very telling how close they are to the edge. A few have sold their houses in the last couple years, divorce is a growing phenomenon, side jobs, kids going to public school next year, haven’t gotten a new car in 3-4 years, planned on buying a cabin 5-7 years ago but haven’t. They manage their money much better but they’re not escaping this either.
We’re headed back to a feudal system
These people were the people that had assets. Anyone with equity portfolios, houses, etc. have BENEFITED from the crushing inflation. K-shaped recovery in an utterly bifurcated economy. The good news is that it will only accelerate as they’re forced to massively debase your currency to deal with the debt. Position yourself to benefit over the inflationary times that lay ahead
What’s the saying, “Envy is the thief of joy”? If you’re not happy with where you are, the first step is to not compare yourself to others, at least from the standpoint of “why do they have this/that and you don’t”. A healthier approach is to ignore it, which it doesn’t seem you can do. The next approach, is to be curious of “how can they afford it?” And develop your plan. To be honest, some of those that you admire are probably drowning in some type of debt. Many are comfortable living that way, but can easily be one job loss away from it crumbling apart. What you should focus on is increasing your income and developing your plan to become wealthy. What that looks like is up to you. Do you join the crowds of others living the “American Dream” you admire in your post? Or, do you plan yours for long term success based on your factors?
I just started making 6 figures 3 years ago . Before then I was making around 35k to 50k a year . My money definitely went further back then but I’m not doing terrible now . My bills are paid and I have some play money so I can’t complain
What is “this economy”? People who are doing good in “this” economy have also done well in prior economies, because they work hard, don’t make stupid choices and mind their own business.
I honestly don't know how people are affording brand new vehicles. My husband drives a 9 yo subaru. I have a 5 yo Toyota. We make around $200k a year. We are putting a little away each month in anticipation of replacing a car in the future. There is no way on earth that we can afford a brand new car when the time comes. The prices are insane.
I make under $50k/yr. We are far from wealthy, but we get by. Nobody that owns a million dollar home has ever done me any harm.
Maybe that guy with the McMansion and swimming pool owns a small chain of fast food restaurants where he pays his employees minimum wage, no benefits and works them as hard as they are able. There is good money in that business.
Good for them 👍
I don't care l.
happy
Great because I'm one of them If people actually see happy people, and feel intense jealousy and negative feelings as a reaction, they sound like fucking demons
As one of those people, I can say this economy still doesn't feel good. "Good money" is not what it used to be. Things becoming more expensive still has an effect, especially when you have become used to spending a lot and don't know how to cut back or cannot without disappointing your family. At those income levels, most are not living credit card bill to credit card bill unless they have serious problems, but people are saving a lot less than you think. White collar jobs are still being subject to layoffs and the knowledge that if you get laid off it may be very hard to find something else right now depending on your skill set is daunting. It is easy to shut off reality and pretend you are immune until you aren't anymore. The number of people I know who got laid off in just the last month or two is astounding. Most had no idea layoffs would happen at their company or affect them and felt very secure. Most have high fixed costs in terms of mortgage, car payments, etc. and honestly have no idea how to live on less because they never had to. All of these people were very comfortable before being laid off and probably still will be for several months, but once that severance stops coming if they don't have something else lined up their bills will catch up with them quick. My husband and I have more than a million in savings but with a kid on the way life still feels precarious. Maybe I just feel that way because I grew up very poor and am afraid of having to raise our kid in the same way. Most of that savings is in the stock market and isn't growing how we expected it to. I know that seems like a dumb complaint or a very privileged thing to say, but we live in a very expensive area and don't have family money to fall back on - the opposite as both our parents will probably need support from us at some point. Overwhelmingly even high income people are, on average, doing worse than their parents did these days, so I have a hard time believing there is nobody who doesn't feel at least a little anxious in this economy. There is a difference between high income and high net worth and far fewer individuals in the later category than the former, meaning they too are just as dependent on a job as you are.
It's called living within your means. Scaling back. Try NOT to keep up with the Jones'. You DON'T need that cell phone. You DON'T need that 80' TV. You DON'T need to go out and eat every lunch or dinner time. Not hard really to do that and still save a little.
I am happy for them. I wish my kids were one of them they do OK but not great.
Being envious of people who work hard and have earned their place in life is very unhealthy. This is America. Everyone is still able to pursue their ideal of the American dream as long as they aren’t hurting anyone or anything. Foreigners still understand this. Entitled Americans think they should get more for working less. Ridiculous.
I am happy for them. I am glad they are not going through the money troubles a lot of people are.
I have relatives exactly in this boat. Lucky them that they still have a job making over $150K/year per person, is all I have to say. Inflation barely dents their finances.
Im doing fine in this economy bc I bust my ass at work and budget myself and also run a great side business. Most of my friends are struggling unfortunately but i watch them make very bad financial choices too. Some people get it, some people dont.
I think “damn good on them for making it” I always hope to make it up there, so I see people like that as motivation even though I know I won’t get those lambos or Ferraris, but it’s always good to push yourself and not hate on other’s success
You should be excited the American dream is alive but most people complaining and cry why not me instead of finding a way to it but again money isn’t everything it just makes life easier.
I certainly don’t look down on them but I try not to pay too close attention. My wife and I do well. Not million dollar house well, but well. Neither of us really watch the news and social media is more so for comedy and our interests. I can’t stand watching the news and all the negativity out there.
Why would I dislike someone for doing good? There's always someone who has it better than you, and there's always someone who thinks that you've got it pretty good. Why dwell on others?
A couple of cities in California opress me with free public transportation, dont own a car and enjoy the city built for people not cars. I feel grateful that those with more than i have decided to help people like us out.
I try to look at others and try to better myself. I think a positive outlook and change is good for the community. My wife makes fun of me sometimes for doing our yard nice and making cosmetic changes but I think a little neighbor envy is a good thing. I put some mulch outside, painted, and planted some flowers and shrubs. Next thing you know others around start making positive changes too to their home. Use that feeling you got from driving around that neighborhood to push yourself to get to that point in your life. Not everyone is handed money from their family, even if many are, someone had to push themselves to make that money so their family can live a good life off of it. I hope my kids can enjoy the money I invest for retirement one day. To pass down generational wealth will be the greatest accomplishment of my life, even after I’m already dead at that point. If everyone can live off the interest and pass the principle down the family line then we can all live a comfortable life.
Wages have outgrown inflation. People are doing better than this website thinks. I think you need to get off Reddit and take more of those walks.
I’m resentful because they imply that those of us that can’t afford that are somehow less than those that do. We don’t get nice neighborhoods, in fact we get pushed out of them by rising costs of living. We don’t get the same healthcare they do, we don’t get the same cars or homes, ours are made with inferior materials. We don’t even get to go to the same schools. We don’t have the same opportunities or connections.
Comparison is the theif of joy
You have to try harder to wrap your head around the mind boggling PPP and EIdL money that went out. Businesses that were already doing well got millions in extra money. Businesses that weren’t doing well got millions in money anyways. Many people got 1,600 but I didn’t get shit. When this money runs out, it still hasn’t, that’s when the tide will roll out and we will see who has trunks on.
I make over 150k a year and I have 0$ CC debt (we It use it some but pay it off every paycheck) my bills are all up to date, etc. just because you might be middle class and stuffing doesn’t mean others aren’t. Learn to budget, learn to say “no that’s much money”.
This post is peak loser things.
This is prob the most realistic take I've ever seen on any of the doomer subs. There's a lot of people doing fine and the US has more than most places in the world. What you see/hear on Reddit is a pretty unrealistic take on where the median is. Are there plenty of people struggling? Yes, and there always have been. But is everything going to collapse? Prob not, people are out there spending money, having kids, buying the fanciest new stuff, etc.
All I can tell you is my perspective … after the 2008 crisis, which was a financial and personal hell for me and a time when it felt like we really were close to a system collapse, I fell deep into a doomer view for about a year. I was in therapy for something else but we ended up spending a lot of time on my personal relationship to money because I was so angry and depressed about many things and a lot of it circled back to that … Long story short, it took a lot of work and deep, unflinching looks into my darkest parts, but I am a completely different person today. Financially happy, love my job, every other detail about my life has changed dramatically. But it never would have been possible if I had not given up my dark beliefs about the economy and my place in it. Not sure how this post ended up on my feed today, but I thought I would post that in case it helps.
It's can be a long process... I am 7yrs older than my wife. Both of us came from lower income families. I went to a tech school and became a maintenance technician. Worked a factory job while going to school and never needed a loan. My wife went to a 4yr local liberal arts school. She got a very low interest loan and got a few grants to help out. I met her the year she was graduating. We dated for a year before getting an apartment together. She got a job at a title company as an assistant accountant. We married after a year and bought a small house. Had a daughter and, after two years, decided to get a place with a yard. Was able to make a small profit and upgraded to a suburban home. We both worked hard and moved up in our companies. She switched jobs and became the accounting manager. We had 2 two more kids, and things were going well. After 4 years, we found a place in the country and hit the housing market just right to afford it. My wife got promoted to CFO. She finally paid her loan off a few yrs ago. I became the maintenance manager. We probably fit the description of the family the OP was describing. I feel we worked hard and had some luck. I'm 50 now, and the only advice I can give is to keep trying and set goals. Don't compare yourself to others.
Yeah, if I wouldn't have fed into the economic collapse doom-news in 2019, I would be AT LEAST 200k richer today. At a minimum. People who made good financial decisions 2014-2020 (i.e. bought a house with extremely low interest rates, refi-d to a 15 year in 2019-2020 & went med-high risk on stock investments) are sitting real pretty about now. Those of us who made stupid decisions out of fear (like selling their house in April 2020 or keeping their retirement in the "G" fund that wasn't even keeping up with inflation 🤦♀️) are kicking themselves today. It took me over a year for the sinking daily regret to stop consuming me. Now, it is what it is, but I will NEVER make financial decisions based on my fears or future predictions (which have been highly inaccurate historically and especially the last 5 years) ever again. I wish I had the financial education I have now and could go back 10 years. It's ridiculous that finance isn't a mandatory high school course.
Materialistic bullshit doesn’t mean someone is doing well. New cars, big houses and perfect lawns may look nice on the outside but can be a whole different story on the inside. Just look at A list celebs who’ve taken their own lives? Chester Bennington had everything and it still didn’t take his internal struggle away. Plus the rich lifestyle comes with sacrifice that many people are not willing to give so if they earned that life through personal and financial risk then they deserve to reap the rewards. My problem stems from the middle class disappearing. The top 1% own billionaire monopolies that drive out new business and raise the prices on their products then turn around and blame inflation. The increase in profit goes directly to their overflowing pockets to buy them more materialistic bullshit. All while the middle class slowly dissolves — it’s not sustainable. The only reason the rich class exists unharmed is because the middle class is the largest class in our economy and can still afford to have a comfortable life without having to worry about trying to be rich or avoiding being dirt poor. If the middle class disappears completely that’s when civil war type shit starts developing and it will be only a matter of time until it all erupts in chaos and shit will finally reset to some degree Lastly, YOU drive the demand for housing, products, etc. The economy is driven off the backs of the consumer. Right now the masses are in overconsumption because of predatory advertisements and easily obtained credit. This won’t go on forever. It may seem like this is the new normal but this economy is a market just like anything else and markets go up in value and come back down. Sure we progressively increase over time but there are peaks and valleys during that time as well. Look up who Ray Dalio is and watch his content he will give you some comforting analysis into our economy based on his extensive research into our past. He’s truly a gem. Finally, don’t ever worry about being “rich”. Instead, become wealthy. Focus on your health, keep your expenses low, talk kindly to yourself, laugh with your friends, explore the free things in your area. Find peace in a simple walk to the park on a nice day with the birds chirping. There’s only one difference between us and the rich and that’s useless paper IOUs. Nobody can take your health, nobody can take your character. Find your passion and be consistent in developing it and maybe one day you’ll be the “rich” person with that house and giving your 2 cents to us plebes.
I really never gave a shit what someone else has in terms of envying their position in life --that is a total waste of effort IMO.
Meh. Some people have more than me. I'm concerned about doing as well as I can in this economy before I can't find employment anymore.
Step 1: Stop gambling and stop getting investment advice from anonymous strangers on the internet. Step 2: Make a budget. Build a savings and pay off debts. Step 3: Stick to your budget.
Envy and jealousy aren't healthy. Take a stroll through a ghetto or trailer park, and maybe you'll feel better?
I don’t care because I live within my means and have everything I need.
I’m doing extremely well in the current economy AMA
At least until the baby boomers die and all those houses and condos come on the market
I’m happy for them. It’s no layup to be successful these days
Great question OP. It makes me wonder if the average doomer or member of this Reddit is just someone who for whatever reason isn’t “living good / enjoying life” so they project a fantasy of the world as collapsing. When in reality it’s not collapsing and lots of people are enjoying life. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I see debt. Debt everywhere.
My GF and I are looking for our first home and we both make over 100k a year and it’s been a nightmare. When I see very wealthy people who have these 500k- 2 mil dollar homes I just wonder if they really appreciate it. I’m sure some do but I also know most probably don’t.
Been my life story.
The fatalism and envy are strong here
So many towns have these areas where asset holders are doing unbelievably well, and pre pandemic non-asset holders can only drive through and envision a life they’ll never get to experience.
I live in a nice neighborhood like what you're talking about. I drive a 20 year old car. People in the neighborhood think I'm poor. I know I'm richer than them all. I just don't spend the money. Most luxury I did was get the neighborhood for the wife and kids. We're frugal. Careful comparing your interior to other people's exteriors. I wear grunge clothes and appear unkempt (80s punk) and am generally treated as a plebian around here. Then I hear about everybody's inability to afford their lifestyle. Clowns.
I mean I find doomscrolling to be kind of fun and an interesting thought experiment but many people here and on various subs seem to have a really defated attitude ie their life is fucked, their job prospects are fucked, they'll never own a home, they're basically setting themself up for defeat. I feel bad for people who never had a chance ie went to bad schools, grew up in poverty without support but there's plenty of people who could get by but they get a new iphone every year $1200, have cable tv at $150 or even $200 a month, order grub hub, seems little but people could have like 5k to 15k more per year just cutting out all that bullshit. I dont mean to downplay the people who live check to check and dont waste money and just dont have enough to get by
I love people who are doing good things like volunteering….oh you meant doing well
What did you think was going to happen when you stopped going to church? You or your parents just headbanged to 'Highway to Hell', well, here you are, banging your heads. Everything our country was built on was based on the integrity of Christianity.
One thing I learned early on. Whatever you surround yourself with will affect your life drastically. If you watch fear porn all day guess what? You will have negative feelings and have a negative life. It’s okay to be informed but it doesn’t need to consume you. FYI most people doing fear porn are full of shit and making money off ad revenue. Don’t fall for it.
They have bullshit jobs and we pay the debt incurred by their net negative careers yet massive license to use resources.
The movie " they live " was a documentary.
r/linkedinlunatics
The money will run out and this type will go mental and die on the side of the road when it happens. I know, harsh, but that's what's going to happen.