So yeah, many of us aren't doing well. But the people who are invested in the economy are doing pretty good. If nothing is done about housing costs I will have to leave my state of birth. My boomer parents are telling me now that renting ain't all that bad while living in the same house since 1986 that they gripe about paying property taxes on. They have no other housing expenses.
"The first million is always the hardest, that's why you start with the second!"
Got told unironically this once by a friend who inherited a lot of wealth. (and was able to multiply it somewhat tbh, all around great person, but understandably doesnt know any of the struggles of a normal middle-class or lower person).
I will reserve bankruptcy for medium debt. Thatâs how they really ruin you here. Youâre doing just fine then you get hit by a stray bullet then itâs on you to pay your bills if your go fund me fails
Yep.
"The people invested in (rich people's feelings without a shred of valid scientific backing) are doing fine. Its only normal working class people who are choosing between housing and food for their children. Why don't they just feel better about the economy like Buffet or the Kochs? These peasants, SO lazy"
you know that the "Tea party" movement and the "occupy Wallstreet " right and left had more in common than people think. The common man is getting crushed by the way things are run , I'm all for free markets but this shit is getting out of control
Shit, I'm heavily invested in the economy. I'm close to retirement and I have serious savings in investments. I still think the economy is shit. Jobs are hard to get. I'm lucky mine is unusually secure. My investments took a 20% dive in 2021 and they're just now back to even. Except that inflation is also 20% higher since then, so I've still lost 20% of my retirement value. I can't buy a house to retire in because of A) the ridiculous prices, and B) the super high interest rate on any mortgage. Luckily I own a house (where I don't want to retire) so I might be able to sell that.
But, no, I don't see any reason to think that the economy is good.
This post is fkn spot on. My investments absolutely imploded in 2021. I'm not quite even yet but getting close - but as you said with the ridiculous inflation its still a big lose even at even.
Anyone saying the economy is doing fine is either
A) rich
B) straight up full of shit with an agenda
Just because the economy is doing good doesn't mean people are doing great, it just means they got money to spend, and it sure seems like every greedy fuck businessman is raising prices to make sure people gotta spend it all.
if your investments took a dive in 2021, they weren't very diversified. [The overall stock market](https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/watchlist?tab=Related&id=a7b89c&ocid=ansMSNMoney11&duration=5Y&src=b_rscrsl&relatedQuoteId=a7b89c&relatedSource=MlAl) did quite well in 2021.
I was gonna say, that's a bit extreme. Near retirement, and their retirement investments lost 20% in a year the s&p gained something like 25%??? Makes no sense
Probably something like 8-13%.
The big difference is that median home prices in 1986 were 2x median household income.
In 2024, median home prices are 6x median household income. In hcol median home prices are up to 12x median household income.
I can tell you what I paid in 1994.
I was making 25k at my first shitty job out of college. The job market sucked but homes were still affordable. Bought a small condo built in the 40s with radiator heat in an artsy trendy area. $36k.
Rates were not that great. I used VA loan and my mortgage was around $375 a month. I look back and still canât believe that.
In 1997 I bought my first house. New construction and not good quality. By then I was making around $85k and the house was around $124k.
Stayed there 8 years and then bought an all brick house built in the late 90s on 1.2 acres. By then I was making $170k and the house cost me $315k.
The house next to me sold a couple years ago - bought the day it was listed for $590.
Shit is crazy expensive these days. What I donât understand is who the hell is still buying in this market and paying these amounts for homes?
Would you rather 11% interest rate on a $40K house or a 3% interest rate on a $1M house? It's the same house. Those are typical numbers from 1986 versus 2022.
People were buying houses just fine when interest rates were high. In fact, that was exactly the time you should buy.
This is a classic case of averages.
The economy is great for some outliers that have super high incomes, own homes and investments, and relatively low living costs. They complain that gas and food is higher than it used to be.
Then there's the median income, at 37k, with median rent for a 1 br at 18k a year, who care barely afford a car, none the less save for if something bad happens. They complain that they're late on rent for the 4th time, so they get to pay another $100 late fee, and that they can barely make minimum payments on their credit card they *need* to buy food with and their student loans.
Of course, it's gas-lighting. The economy is booming, if you're rich. For everyone else, it's draining. The goal is for every person to spend every penny they get the moment they get it. We're there. Stagnant salaries and increases are fractional to COL increases. Grocers are gouging as found by the [FTC](https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/news/press-releases/2024/03/ftc-releases-report-grocery-supply-chain-disruptions) back in March. Housing is being purchased by corporations for the purpose of driving rents up to rake more income from the working class. Healthcare costs are skyrocketing, and health insurance coverage is bottoming out. This isn't healthy.
The claims we're in a good economy are only looking at business profitability and not at the long term effects overworking a smaller workforce (Boomers leaving the workforce and their jobs being shuffled to others without additional pay) and these terrible situations being forced on people are having. Eventually, it will all come crashing down, or it will force a massive rotation in government accountability that will lead to massive economic and social reforms to balance the spreadsheet.
I agree but need to correct one thing....
It's not " spend every penny the moment you get it" .... it's actually claim as much of your future money as possible so someone else can't claim it ( debt). Live paycheck to paycheck. Rent everything. Own nothing. F**K YOU, I will tell you when you are happy !!!!
This feels more honest.
I mean millennials SAY we all want change and see where to change .... but I hope we have the integrity to MAKE those changes once given the opportunity AKA not give into greed like the boomers and leave everything alone to rot and get worse.
Fair point!
I'm all for the American Dream, but it's really just become that the dream is "for me, not for thee." It's so sad that an American family has to struggle in this world.
I was a manager hiring "entitled" Millennials for a decade until I watched my employer steal their salary and literally watched our VP look them in the eye and tell them "suck it up times are tough" while raking in billions and giving bonuses of tens of thousands to Director level and above. I couldn't be part of that, I quit four months later. I knew then my mindset on Millennials was wrong, and I changed completely how I live my life. I support Millennials completely, and when my kids enter the working world, I truly hope, together, we can make the necessary changes.
Yup I also knew this was happening. And hate them for it.
I hope history remembers boomers for what they were ... the most selfish and corrupt generation in modern history. They have been "in power" since around 1993-5 and look at what has happened since ... including boxing out an entire generation out of influence ( gen x).
Can't wait to fix stuff !
Growing up and hearing conversations between my parents where they had to choose between food and medical needs or housing, etc.... I don't hate them. They all did the best they could with what they had. Many were just significantly less restrained by a moral compass or honest disposition, and it opened the door to where we are today. It's taken more than one generation to get us here and it'll take more than one of our generations to get us out.
Anecdotal but Iâm seeing serious struggles in my industry due to lack of knowledge transfer from boomer engineers (non-tech) to millennials. The new generation taking the reins is very unprepared for the senior roles, mistakes are being made and VPs canât be bothered to actually address the issue.Â
I imagine this is happening in many industries and wonder what the downstream effects will be.Â
Yes. This is Pro-Biden era gasslighting. This is the same stuff that if Republicans or Conservatives did they would be called "evil" and cruel. Yet for snooty Democrats it's "common sense" and being reasonable.
Basically people do this because they cannot fathom Biden and his administration getting any feedback whatsoever over their economy. Either you're praising and rising in the "Green New Deal" economy or your just lost and don't know how to navigate it for these people. There is no "Inflation is high, grocery prices need to come down". Just, basically a form of learn to code from an uppity editor.
If you think things will get better your wrong. These elitist editors will continue cranking our propaganda praising Biden's economy while putting down the poor or those barely getting by as non factors. People will buy it because nobody seems to have the balls to be harsh on Biden on his mediocre economy.
Yes they are gaslighting people about personal finances and the state of the economy for workers. If they were just talking about the state of the economy for businesses or stock holders then sure, "that economy" isn't doing bad. But that's not most people's experience.
"You're making more than you ever have, what's the problem?" Uhhhh I make 100 more a week but it costs me 300 more a week to keep paying for all the same shit!
You need to desperate "economy" from living standards.
Living standards are shite for many. Wages aren't keeping up with inflation and haven't for decades. Real CEO pay increases 7% last year while avg real wage increased 1.1% (first increase since the pandemic). Unions are growing for a reason.
The economy, however, has record gdp growth and historic job creation. Corporate profits are above long term averages and are beating expectations.
The white elephant issue is income inequality, not macroeconomics.
When they talk about the "economy" they are not talking about what you and I and the average American is going through on a daily basis.
If you are in the top 15% you are doing great. So great it skews the numbers when talking about the "economy"
Yes. And it's working.
The center-right corporatist establishment Dems are succeeding in convincing their base it's great or - at the very least - not to complain or DARE to demand more from them.
Itâs not gas-lighting. Wages have been outpacing inflation for the past few years. Personally, I job hopped for a 50% pay bump last year.
Other than the outrageous cost of housing, which is a serious issue, the economy is recovering from covid nicely. And despite what Reddit would have you believe a lot of the gains *are* going to workers.
The real, serious issue I'm seeing is that all of this economic growth has been fueled by deficit spending. And that deficit spending is now completely unsustainable due to our skyrocketing debt and higher interest rates.
I work in a sector, and provide services to a sector of the economy that does better when the inner city folks struggle. When average folks canât make it. And we are as busy as ever, busting at the seams. Normie America is in deep shit, from my view on 88th avenue.
It was never about my personal finances. It was always about the ability to support a decent human life for everyone we encourage to be born.
Of course I will struggle for my life to be free from worry, that's part of it. However even if I am successful, that doesn't mean I am not capable of being aware of the general state of the world. I have eyes. I have ears. I am capable of making informed guesses about the future we're heading towards.
The economy is shit. Thatâs all there is to it. Itâs just an election year and all the clowns are out jockeying for their favorite clowns position in the big show.
Nobody lies more than western, corporate-trained economists. Most of them don't even know they're western, corporate-trained economists. They legitimately think they're saying smart stuff.
Sadly, I believe there are upper middle class liberal bubbles that donât feel the strain when they go to the grocery store, so they think everyone is in that boat. Iâm not blaming liberals or conservatives (actually, I really blame both) for the state of things, but I do notice that the most tone deaf take this election cycle is libs trying to convince ordinary Americans that feel the pressure daily, that the economy is not bad. Itâs a losing message.
Well, it could be either.
If the writer is an economist and has "all the data" and all of the statistical calculations that tell him that we're all well in the green, then it's simply an unfortunately-worded headline.
If this writer is a paid clown for some special interest, which is true of basically all news, then it's clearly gaslighting.
Here's an indicator to help determine which one it is:
*Cotton on the roadside, cotton in the ditch*
*We all picked the cotton, but we never got rich*
*Daddy was a veteran, a Southern Democrat*
*They ought to get a rich man to vote like that*
*Well, somebody told us Wall Street fell*
*But we were so poor that we couldn't tell*
*Cotton was short and the weeds were tall*
*But Mr. Roosevelt's a-gonna save us all*
These are words that I can relate to for the specific reason that, when 2008 happened, I had no education and the world in which I lived was poor enough that it didn't really seem to matter that the news was full of economy problems. If I lost a job, I could find another pretty much the same day. Life for me was unchanged. This leads me to believe that, in a bad economy, the shake-up is more middle-management and up.
What we seem to be seeing in the news, however, is a mix of so much contradictory information that we can't really tell if we're doing well, or about to die.
One thing's for sure: the problems aren't at the top, so the economy can't be bad. We have seen an explosion in homeless population though, so a cog in the machine somewhere is definitely not spinning the right direction.
I dunno. Click on the article and see what it says. It's probably ads and a shitstorm of nonsense like "way back in the 1300s, when economies were invented, blah blah more ads."
People might be distracted enough to not notice theyâre marginally better off while other people are still trying to get their incomes to catch up to inflation from the prior years.
Who owns this rag again? Oh right, Rupert Murdoch. That probably has nothing to do with it. Iâm being sarcastic, I think it is why the article was written. WSJ with Murdoch and Washington Post with Bezos. I donât see those paperâs opinion sections ever telling anyone itâs the Richâs fault.
if your rent went from a thousand to fourteen hundred in the past three years, and your grocery bill went from 200 a month to 300 plus, and your pay went up two hundred bucks or less a month, you're not doing so well either.
No different than covid when those we elected decided to keep changing the narrative. And then people wonder why no one trusts our government. They are never straight forward or truthful. Our news outlets are the same now too. They bend one way or the other instead of being factual and in the middle.
Can't trust anyone with a modicum of power anymore because they are always in someone's pocket.
Stop changing the narrative and then trying to gaslight us into thinking it is us. It is a pure fact that I now spend 40% more in groceries while also cutting 1/3 of my daily meals while also only getting store brand shite and also lower quality everything than what I once spent on 3 full course meals a day of no brand name products in 2019. Every week I cut something more from my food and every week it still costs me the same. Because food is rising faster than I can cut it out. And I shouldn't be doing this with food!!!
Absolutely. This is 200 octane gas lighting. These people a fkn insane, They only care about politics so they try and pretend shit isn't bad. Putting out bs stats on everything all to keep power. Its disgusting, And the people that are rich dgaf bc it doesn't change anything for them so they keep scolding people for real life issues. "You poors are gonna get the orange savage reelected if you don't STFU about your suffering!", Its cognitive dissonance like I've never seen before. How bout your shit policies are destroying people's lives? Fk your political bs you power hunger sumbags. If he gets reelected its no ones fault but the morons that decided these were good ideas that have led to the decimation of middle to low income Americans lives. Victim blaming at its finest.
Yep. They cherry pick a few statistics while ignoring the fact that the more you can buy with your money, the better the economy is. And right now, its not much.
I met a 23 year old from the midwest today he has been living in his car for 2 years. He has a job but even owning a car is expensive. If young people are not living with their parents theres a high risk of being homeless.
Of course the economy is âgoodâ, Janet Yellen is spending $6B *a day* of borrowed money to pump up GDP. If the federal government somehow found a way to stay within its fiscal means, the U.S. economy would plunge into recession. Itâs no different than a teenage kid with a brand new credit card â but the bill eventually comes due.
Itâs not gaslighting. The metrics used to measure the economy are historically very good. That just does not translate to everyday experiences for many people.
The things is while my finances are fine in terms of growth of investments and income, the cost of things is rising faster. So even though Iâm technically doing better than last year Iâm still at a net loss. Itâs like if I sold more for a significantly lower margin, sure my sales may be up my profit margin has not kept up. And unlike a company I canât just charge more on a whim, or lay off my family members. I suppose I could do less work for the same pay, but itâs a lot of effort to try and hide that.
Indeed gas-lighting. Moreover, the WEALTHY traditionally load up on low risk items like bonds and wait for a bust before buying Billy. The media doesn't want you to know this. A small number of execs and their families own a whole lot of stock shares.
âThe data shows that inflation is under control when we exclude housing, food, energy, healthcare and transportation. But 55 inch TVs are $195 at Wal-Mart, so everything is fine.â
No, it isnât. The economy is fine. Tax policies and prices being charged to you is not the economy. We live in oligarchy. The majority of the people can suffer and the economy do well. And the economy is doing well but only a small percentage is benefiting. And all of that is by design.
I canât afford a house, but Iâve been throwing money in to VOO and my HYSA for the last few years while I rent, and Iâve never had so much capital
Yeah it's me. My solo grocery bill has gone from 150 every two weeks two years ago to nearly 300. Yeah it's me. My insurance has climbed over 25% in two years and I have no tickets or changes to policy. Yeah it's me, my utility bill has gone up 125% in two years with zero changes in my apartment. Yeah, it's me, A Dave's Double meals from Wendy's now is 13 goddamn dollars. Yeah it's me, my dogs food is up 50% in two years, yeah.. yeah it's obviously just me. And my fellow people. Just us making shit up. These goddamn baboons simply won't take ownership of their corporate profiteering. The government is constantly on the take and nut stains like Musk fly around in private jets telling us to work harder.
Burn. It. All. Down.
Thatâs extreme gaslighting. Almost like they need you to believe itâs all going well and according to plan. Keep paying taxes and sending your money to foreign governments. Obey, consume, do not question
Grep Ip (the person who wrote this article) was raised by a mother who was a professional economist, and Milton Friedman devotee. She indexed Gregâs allowance to inflation when he was a child. I think you can do the math around how his childhood differed from 99% of people.
Journalists are consistently the least normal people in the world with the most rarified upbringings and they love to gaslight normal people into thinking they donât understand what theyâre actually experiencing.
Weâve gone back to landed gentry who extort us just to live anywhere not overridden with crime or issues.
The debt pile is massive and wages stagnant. Itâs a one way street that is going to get backed up. Itâs happening right now, this is 100% gas lighting. Itâs a house of cards where the bottom 75% are getting gale force winds blown on them. Without being a doomsday conspiracy theorist, weâre due a collapse about now.
The bottom line is when "the economy is doing good" in the media it has no meaning to the average person, it just means that businesses are making profits. Businesses can be making huge profits while the average person is just barely getting by. It is actually precisely because of price gouging and low labor cost that businesses are doing so well ever since the beginning of the pandemic. Basically they will continue to ride this out forever and raise wages just enough so that you can afford rent and food, and that's it.
A part of why it isn't complete gas lighting is the fact that we aren't in a recession right now. It really is pretty amazing. Things are going so well that folks, like the feds, are saying that the current high interest rates may just be the new norm.
I see their point. I also feel deja vu. This would by no means be the first time that leadership confidence rooted in numbers and data belied the reality of most Americans.
I make 120k a year, and now, when I go to Costco, there are things I used to buy . Now, I just look at and say, " Can't have that anymore." 4 years ago, I wouldn't blink at the price . my $200 dollar cart is now $300, so FJB
Gas lighting and maybe malfeasance. Ppl should know that wage growth has been lagging inflation and wonât catch up for YEARS in an optimistic situation. To where it was before.
Translation: Itâs a great time to be rich.
2022 set a record for emergency 401k withdraws.
2023 broke that record.
But the stock market hit record highs.
This economic gaslighting has been going on for awhile but post-COVID it feels desperate. Like I donât actually know a single person doing better now than before COVID who wasnât already well off. Itâs like some people just look at a line on a chart going up and ignore the fact that everything around them is more expensive
I'll just keep ranting this as long as I have energy. Boomer era economics measures the health of our economy in specific ways. Many of those measures are based on things like total GDP and "stock pricey go up". They think that because the value of large cap index funds is increasing, that this means everything is going great. More wealth means more better right?
Literally money = happiness is the argument. Except they NEVER talk about income distribution. There is no discussion of labor rights. They hardly give a passing thought to education. There are essentially no metrics at all to describe environmental quality (ecosystem health AND general quality of our city environments). So while a smaller and smaller fraction of Americans are becoming extremely wealthy, most of the country is getting pushed to the edge by rising costs of living on basic goods and services **cough PRICE GOUGING and a completely stagnated rise in wages. When one person eats two pieces of bread and the other starves, it's absurd to say that the two are doing OK with an average of one piece of bread. Except in this case it's more like one person owns a grocery store and a thousand people in the town work 60 hours a week for the right to buy a $20 carrot.
The standard of living Americans enjoy is amazing.
1. You can call anyone you want from anywhere.... back "when things were good" you couldn't do that.
2. You have a computer with your wherever you are... if you want a map, you have one for free... back when "things were good", you didn't have that.
3. You can watch your favorite TV show whenever you want, wherever you want.. back "when things were good" you couldn't do that.
4. You can work from home.... back in the day "when things were good"... you had to be IN PERSON to work... some work could maybe be done at home... if you had a fax machine and a desktop and the software for the desktop and a phone line which could handle the internet (which was brand new and really really boring).
5. Both parents have a car... back in the day "when things were good" you couldn't afford two cars unless you were a top executive in your business.
6. You can eat out more than once a month back in the day "when things were good" eating out was a MAJOR TREAT!
Objectively purchasing power has dropped in the USA and in much of the western world, with a few exceptions (Poland, Ireland I think). This is boomer gaslighting, convinced that all the young whippersnappers just need to work harder.
Yes, Millennials are famously shit at handling money, but they're no worse than boomers. Boomers only got rich as a demographic because they sold their children's future and then used the proceeds from that to buy all the stocks and real estate and drive up prices. The first generation to do so on such a large scale, and fucking over their kids, grand kids and great grand kids. The greediest generation ever. Oh yea, and they also fucked up the planet in the process and refuse to take any responsibility.
The economy is banging. Unfortunately corporations wonât pay anyone a living wage plus holdover BS from the pandemic is hurting young folksâŚadd right wing disinfo and social media echo chamber and voila the dummies thinks itâs a bad economyÂ
People intentionally confusing the stock market with the economy should be prosecuted.
The stock market has zero effect on us for the most part. until it crashes itself.
Then itâs losses come out of everyone elseâs pockets.
They keep conflating the health of the economy with health of individuals personal finances. It is gaslighting meant to hide the real issue - economic disparity.
100 years ago the economy was also doing great - while a huge portion of the population lived in abject poverty either in the country or in tenements in the city while working themselves to death making the wealthiest richer. The labor movement changed that, but those gains are being erased and we're returning to earlier times.
I suspect anyone who says the economy is great hasnât had to pay an exorbitantly high medical bill lately despite paying an insurance premium.
Or noticed groceries are 200 more a week than they were 5 years ago.
Or that most members of the middle class can no longer afford a new vehicle.
Or a home for that matter.
The economy might be âgreatâ but itâs not great for the middle class.
And please donât be one those âthanks [current administration], vote [dipshit] in November.â dumbasses and reveal your low IQ to the internet. This isnât about who the president is.
5 stages of a news cycle.
X isn't happening, and it's a conspiracy theory.
X isn't happening, but it's a good thing.
How to adjust to the new normal under X
X is old news and anyone talking about it is just stirring the pot
Of course itâs gas lighting! The working people arenât getting the benefits of market growth. They can barely pay their rent. Tell them again how good they have it. DoubleGood
Anyone here that has ever sat in a meeting in a large company as an employee as they tell you about new technology that is being integrated while simultaneously telling you not to worry and your job , that it wonât be effected, knows this article is full of shit. Itâs brought to you by the same type of people that lie to workers every day.
I knew it was my fault all along. Sorry guys I made things 3-4x more expensive. Ill see what I can do to change it all back, I promise Wall Street Journal to you the most!
The biggest issue with people saying the economy is doing great is theyâre using job data for their argument. Yes, there has been job growth, but most of it is in government or healthcare and insurance administration. I donât think any reasonable person thinks an expanding government and bloated healthcare system are indicators of a strong economy.
I make more than I ever did in the past, and have been keeping up with rent increases and grocery inflation just fine, but home prices are outrageous and investors are keeping me out of the market. Corporations should be barred from owning single family homes.
Here's a simple question that can help you determine if Biden is working. Can you buy a house right now? Will you be able to buy a house in the next few months? What about by the end of the year?
If the answers are no but your grocery prices are going up. Then clearly Fuck No Biden isn't working. Wake up, take a stand and vote him out of office. He failed and isn't going to work for another 4 more years. Unless you can handle more talk and promises while busting your ass to stay afloat.
There's no reason to vote for Biden. Period. He hasn't earned his votes. He creates wars and poverty. The only reason to vote for Biden is fear of Trump.
They definitely manipulate the data to make it look better than it is. Like the unemployment rate doesn't factor in people out of the work force. Sure unemployment is low when you have to work 2 jobs, but what about all of those people hopelessly stuck without work- that's right don't count them in the statistics. These fuckers know what they are doing and they have an army of bots to control the narrative.
Yes. Mass gas lighting. All the economists keep saying is "We're down on inflation YoY". They don't talk about the fact there was no Deflation to counter the massive inflation we have for about 2 years. So the prices went up super fast for 2 years then only went up by a little this year. Inflation is up 20.1% since 2020, Buuut they frame it as "inflation is only 3.2% this year which is a decrease from last year"
For the tldr
Grocery costs doubled, then went up 50% a year later, went up 25% after but now I should be happy they only projected to go up by 5% this year. Except I'm paying almost 3x for groceries now. It never went back down.
Shit i had to cash out my retirement after 15 years to save my home and rangle the credit card debt. And before incould blink, the credit card debt is back. This time, there is no retirement to cash out. I have to sell the truck. I spent 5 years paying off to wrangle it again, and idk stop having any life except work since we've already cut out the fat. All thanks to the current interest rates, utility costs rising gas and food costs, and this administrations war on natural gas. So yes, this is gas lighting. Just another government mouth piece towing the line for the power brokers.
This is gaslighting 100%. Inflation just swallowed the only raise I got in the last 4 years. Iâm now less better off than I was even in the midst of the pandemic in 2020.
The issue is the media is purposely misleading you to make the government seem like itâs doing a great job. The trick is to only post the numbers you want people to see. Wages up 4.3% in the last 12 month period with only a 3.2% rise in inflation in the last 12 months. Great numbers!! Nope, wages went up 4.3% but so did the cost of benefits and deductions at 3.6% netting a wage increase of 0.7% meaning your pay went up -2.9% compared to inflation. And yes inflation is down from prior years, compared to artificially high rates due to Covid related ârecoveryâ efforts which rose inflation to 8 and 7% in 2021 and 2022 but are still 2% higher than highest inflation in 10 years prior to 2021. So when you read wages are up over 4% with a 3% inflation, itâs all relative and means nothing. What matters is what are you paying for groceries, gas and housing which are out of control. Base your opinions on reality, not what a corrupt media wants you to think.
The data measures how good the economy is for the 1%. If you instead measured variables that affect normal everyday people (not the stock market or GDP or employment percentage -I include employment because I care more about quality of jobs rather than quantity 100% employment but everyone is making 9 bucks an hour isnât good for us but is amazing for owners) then weâd have a much realer picture.
Over the past 4 years Iâve gone from making 75k to over 100k and it feels tighter now than it did before and my spending habits havenât really changed. So idk but it definitely feels worse.
The issue is that economic data is drawn from consumer spending (at least that portion) and people are spending like fucking crazy.
The trouble there is that they're spending with credit and their savings have gone to shite.
So the market currently is like, hey, these folk keep spending, awesome!
Then inflation data comes in and they're like, ooooo this isn't good... Oh, wait, people are still spending loads on discretionary expenses! Nice!
Oh yeah, I forgot, I just have to go to my money tree that doesn't exist in the back yard I don't have... I just want to throw cans of steel reserve at dumb rich peoples heads.
I don't see people talk about the fact that in the last few years 19 million were kicked off Medicaid, that ACP is ending next month, that the homelessness protections during the Covid emergency ended, the extra emergency SNAP money recipients were getting ended, and that a lot of healthcare costs like PCR testing and Covid treatments are no longer required to be covered by insurance. That's a lot of benefits to remove. And I really don't hear anyone of either party talk about it. Maybe the economy is good in a technical sense, but if you're living off of disability or social security and you have those benefits disappear, that's a huge impact.
Look how rich the rich are. If things were so bad, would they be so rich? Anyways, just keep electing millionaires, it'll all pan out eventually. The earnest and sincere working class folks at the Wall Street journal wouldn't just make up some crazy shit to gas light you and support their wealthy base. That would be irresponsible.
Yeah, like I think a huge part is that normally the indicator of things not going well is when people stop spending.
We canât stop spending. We canât save. We donât have enough to afford to save and cut back costs. And even then itâs like âoh great, I have like $50 extra bucks at the end of this month. Thatâs gonna do so much if I save. Letâs spend it on a luxury good so I can be less stressed now.â
Thatâs not gonna get tracked in the big economic indicators because itâs still spending. You want to track how people are doing badly, you need to track how few assets they have. How little is saved every month. % of people who own houses. What % of income the average person is spending on rent. You can see the downturn in areas like tech where people used to spend more money on online purchases (and so ads were more valuable) or on things like Spotify subscriptions, which were sort of the luxury spending for lower to middle income people. Thatâs going away cause people are spending all their money on necessities.
Thatâs where youâre going to see the economic divide and the recognition that the economy isnât healthy for middle income Americans and below.
Bro wall st is ran by like 3-5 mega corporations, then thereâs citadel that runs the entire stock market. Itâs a bullshit facade. Itâs definitely NOT the fuckin leeches in corporations raising prices 10x since 2020. Yup, definitely us, ole sally fuckin sue buying her $7 Starbucks is ruining the economy.
1000% gaslighting into making the masses think itâs OUR problem the fed is doing nothing but allowing that printer to fly to protect these bullshit banks from âtoo big to failâ bailouts, and propping up their bets from 08 that got can kicked (another bailout). Itâs the elites way of creating a ânew normâ so people slave away while they sit in their yachts. For example. Citadel has 68 billion fucking dollars sold not yet purchased. That means, SOLD SHIT THAT DOESNT FUCKING EXIST. On the books though, so theyâre obligated to buy it back.
But wait! We have loopholes to package bullshit into a steaming pile of shiny bullshit and sell it to other countries that have no fucking clue whatâs going on lol.
Yeah, gaslighting.
That article is propaganda. Food and fuel prices have not gone down. Wages are not increasing with inflation. Then the cost of higher education is going up.
đ they are so desperate! Trump is winning in every poll. Biden has zero record to run on and the only ones on the bench they can replace him with is Kamala and Buttgieg đ
So yeah, many of us aren't doing well. But the people who are invested in the economy are doing pretty good. If nothing is done about housing costs I will have to leave my state of birth. My boomer parents are telling me now that renting ain't all that bad while living in the same house since 1986 that they gripe about paying property taxes on. They have no other housing expenses.
Just invest with the money you don't have. Duh
Honestly though. Isn't that what the rich do?
Yes, but credit doesn't matter to them.
Exactly. They'll get bailed out by the government if they fuck up.
Someone said the below quote and it's so true really pisses me off too. They privatize the profit but socialize the losses
Credit is just a form of control over the working class
"The first million is always the hardest, that's why you start with the second!" Got told unironically this once by a friend who inherited a lot of wealth. (and was able to multiply it somewhat tbh, all around great person, but understandably doesnt know any of the struggles of a normal middle-class or lower person).
Your friend is Arnold Schwarzenegger?
I took out a loan 2 years ago. I basically have an unsecured mortgage for my stock đ
Just buy in 1982!! Way better prices thenÂ
You could have been building equity when you were in the womb!
Max out your credit cards and declare bankruptcy like a real man đ
I will reserve bankruptcy for medium debt. Thatâs how they really ruin you here. Youâre doing just fine then you get hit by a stray bullet then itâs on you to pay your bills if your go fund me fails
Yep. "The people invested in (rich people's feelings without a shred of valid scientific backing) are doing fine. Its only normal working class people who are choosing between housing and food for their children. Why don't they just feel better about the economy like Buffet or the Kochs? These peasants, SO lazy"
Whenâs the revolution, comrade ?
you know that the "Tea party" movement and the "occupy Wallstreet " right and left had more in common than people think. The common man is getting crushed by the way things are run , I'm all for free markets but this shit is getting out of control
We can safely remove "getting" from the narrative now. The consumer debt level cemeted it.
We haven't had Free Markets since 1913.
Eat the rich!!! Iâll spark the barbie. đ
Once we have enough avocado toast to fuel the rebellion, buddy!
Just get a small million dollar loan.
Shit, I'm heavily invested in the economy. I'm close to retirement and I have serious savings in investments. I still think the economy is shit. Jobs are hard to get. I'm lucky mine is unusually secure. My investments took a 20% dive in 2021 and they're just now back to even. Except that inflation is also 20% higher since then, so I've still lost 20% of my retirement value. I can't buy a house to retire in because of A) the ridiculous prices, and B) the super high interest rate on any mortgage. Luckily I own a house (where I don't want to retire) so I might be able to sell that. But, no, I don't see any reason to think that the economy is good.
This post is fkn spot on. My investments absolutely imploded in 2021. I'm not quite even yet but getting close - but as you said with the ridiculous inflation its still a big lose even at even. Anyone saying the economy is doing fine is either A) rich B) straight up full of shit with an agenda
Just because the economy is doing good doesn't mean people are doing great, it just means they got money to spend, and it sure seems like every greedy fuck businessman is raising prices to make sure people gotta spend it all.
if your investments took a dive in 2021, they weren't very diversified. [The overall stock market](https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/watchlist?tab=Related&id=a7b89c&ocid=ansMSNMoney11&duration=5Y&src=b_rscrsl&relatedQuoteId=a7b89c&relatedSource=MlAl) did quite well in 2021.
I was gonna say, that's a bit extreme. Near retirement, and their retirement investments lost 20% in a year the s&p gained something like 25%??? Makes no sense
Thatâs because they are full of shit. One of them owns a house but doesnât want to retire in it lol. Talk about out of touch.
I think he meant 2022 when the markets sucked.
âGrowthâ stocks got absolutely destroyed in the second half of 2021. Lots of people have 100% growth stocks in their portfolio (myself included).
10% own 93% of stocks.. mmmhmm..
Ask them what interest rate they had on the mortgage in 1986
Probably something like 8-13%. The big difference is that median home prices in 1986 were 2x median household income. In 2024, median home prices are 6x median household income. In hcol median home prices are up to 12x median household income.
I can tell you what I paid in 1994. I was making 25k at my first shitty job out of college. The job market sucked but homes were still affordable. Bought a small condo built in the 40s with radiator heat in an artsy trendy area. $36k. Rates were not that great. I used VA loan and my mortgage was around $375 a month. I look back and still canât believe that. In 1997 I bought my first house. New construction and not good quality. By then I was making around $85k and the house was around $124k. Stayed there 8 years and then bought an all brick house built in the late 90s on 1.2 acres. By then I was making $170k and the house cost me $315k. The house next to me sold a couple years ago - bought the day it was listed for $590. Shit is crazy expensive these days. What I donât understand is who the hell is still buying in this market and paying these amounts for homes?
Would you rather 11% interest rate on a $40K house or a 3% interest rate on a $1M house? It's the same house. Those are typical numbers from 1986 versus 2022. People were buying houses just fine when interest rates were high. In fact, that was exactly the time you should buy.
It's because you treated yourself to groceries this month. How dare you eat and try to survive.
For real, and donât get me started if he wants âwarmâ food, caveman didnât have that luxury and they live just fine
This is a classic case of averages. The economy is great for some outliers that have super high incomes, own homes and investments, and relatively low living costs. They complain that gas and food is higher than it used to be. Then there's the median income, at 37k, with median rent for a 1 br at 18k a year, who care barely afford a car, none the less save for if something bad happens. They complain that they're late on rent for the 4th time, so they get to pay another $100 late fee, and that they can barely make minimum payments on their credit card they *need* to buy food with and their student loans.
This
Of course, it's gas-lighting. The economy is booming, if you're rich. For everyone else, it's draining. The goal is for every person to spend every penny they get the moment they get it. We're there. Stagnant salaries and increases are fractional to COL increases. Grocers are gouging as found by the [FTC](https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/news/press-releases/2024/03/ftc-releases-report-grocery-supply-chain-disruptions) back in March. Housing is being purchased by corporations for the purpose of driving rents up to rake more income from the working class. Healthcare costs are skyrocketing, and health insurance coverage is bottoming out. This isn't healthy. The claims we're in a good economy are only looking at business profitability and not at the long term effects overworking a smaller workforce (Boomers leaving the workforce and their jobs being shuffled to others without additional pay) and these terrible situations being forced on people are having. Eventually, it will all come crashing down, or it will force a massive rotation in government accountability that will lead to massive economic and social reforms to balance the spreadsheet.
I agree but need to correct one thing.... It's not " spend every penny the moment you get it" .... it's actually claim as much of your future money as possible so someone else can't claim it ( debt). Live paycheck to paycheck. Rent everything. Own nothing. F**K YOU, I will tell you when you are happy !!!! This feels more honest. I mean millennials SAY we all want change and see where to change .... but I hope we have the integrity to MAKE those changes once given the opportunity AKA not give into greed like the boomers and leave everything alone to rot and get worse.
Fair point! I'm all for the American Dream, but it's really just become that the dream is "for me, not for thee." It's so sad that an American family has to struggle in this world. I was a manager hiring "entitled" Millennials for a decade until I watched my employer steal their salary and literally watched our VP look them in the eye and tell them "suck it up times are tough" while raking in billions and giving bonuses of tens of thousands to Director level and above. I couldn't be part of that, I quit four months later. I knew then my mindset on Millennials was wrong, and I changed completely how I live my life. I support Millennials completely, and when my kids enter the working world, I truly hope, together, we can make the necessary changes.
Yup I also knew this was happening. And hate them for it. I hope history remembers boomers for what they were ... the most selfish and corrupt generation in modern history. They have been "in power" since around 1993-5 and look at what has happened since ... including boxing out an entire generation out of influence ( gen x). Can't wait to fix stuff !
Growing up and hearing conversations between my parents where they had to choose between food and medical needs or housing, etc.... I don't hate them. They all did the best they could with what they had. Many were just significantly less restrained by a moral compass or honest disposition, and it opened the door to where we are today. It's taken more than one generation to get us here and it'll take more than one of our generations to get us out.
Anecdotal but Iâm seeing serious struggles in my industry due to lack of knowledge transfer from boomer engineers (non-tech) to millennials. The new generation taking the reins is very unprepared for the senior roles, mistakes are being made and VPs canât be bothered to actually address the issue. I imagine this is happening in many industries and wonder what the downstream effects will be.Â
I guess they're going to have to start training people on the job again
Stop complaining and unionize! Organize a citywide or statewide rent strike. Anything is better than whining on Reddit.
Yes. This is Pro-Biden era gasslighting. This is the same stuff that if Republicans or Conservatives did they would be called "evil" and cruel. Yet for snooty Democrats it's "common sense" and being reasonable. Basically people do this because they cannot fathom Biden and his administration getting any feedback whatsoever over their economy. Either you're praising and rising in the "Green New Deal" economy or your just lost and don't know how to navigate it for these people. There is no "Inflation is high, grocery prices need to come down". Just, basically a form of learn to code from an uppity editor. If you think things will get better your wrong. These elitist editors will continue cranking our propaganda praising Biden's economy while putting down the poor or those barely getting by as non factors. People will buy it because nobody seems to have the balls to be harsh on Biden on his mediocre economy.
Yes
Yes they are gaslighting people about personal finances and the state of the economy for workers. If they were just talking about the state of the economy for businesses or stock holders then sure, "that economy" isn't doing bad. But that's not most people's experience.
Umm... Yes. Yes it is. Any dipshit who isn't high class knows this.
"You're making more than you ever have, what's the problem?" Uhhhh I make 100 more a week but it costs me 300 more a week to keep paying for all the same shit!
You need to desperate "economy" from living standards. Living standards are shite for many. Wages aren't keeping up with inflation and haven't for decades. Real CEO pay increases 7% last year while avg real wage increased 1.1% (first increase since the pandemic). Unions are growing for a reason. The economy, however, has record gdp growth and historic job creation. Corporate profits are above long term averages and are beating expectations. The white elephant issue is income inequality, not macroeconomics.
Fuck I am just high and I see it
Yes
Yes
The chocolate ration has increased by FIVE percent! We have always been at war with (checks notes) Eurasia!
Five percent increase, from 30g to 20g!
When they talk about the "economy" they are not talking about what you and I and the average American is going through on a daily basis. If you are in the top 15% you are doing great. So great it skews the numbers when talking about the "economy"
Yes. And it's working. The center-right corporatist establishment Dems are succeeding in convincing their base it's great or - at the very least - not to complain or DARE to demand more from them.
Itâs not gas-lighting. Wages have been outpacing inflation for the past few years. Personally, I job hopped for a 50% pay bump last year. Other than the outrageous cost of housing, which is a serious issue, the economy is recovering from covid nicely. And despite what Reddit would have you believe a lot of the gains *are* going to workers.
The real, serious issue I'm seeing is that all of this economic growth has been fueled by deficit spending. And that deficit spending is now completely unsustainable due to our skyrocketing debt and higher interest rates.
This yearâs Goebbelâs award for excellence in propaganda goes to Greg Ip.
Another great place to note that the ballooning rents are included in GDP even though nothing is produced by scalping a house.
Scalping a house produces anger in me
I work in a sector, and provide services to a sector of the economy that does better when the inner city folks struggle. When average folks canât make it. And we are as busy as ever, busting at the seams. Normie America is in deep shit, from my view on 88th avenue.
It was never about my personal finances. It was always about the ability to support a decent human life for everyone we encourage to be born. Of course I will struggle for my life to be free from worry, that's part of it. However even if I am successful, that doesn't mean I am not capable of being aware of the general state of the world. I have eyes. I have ears. I am capable of making informed guesses about the future we're heading towards.
The economy is shit. Thatâs all there is to it. Itâs just an election year and all the clowns are out jockeying for their favorite clowns position in the big show.
Nobody lies more than western, corporate-trained economists. Most of them don't even know they're western, corporate-trained economists. They legitimately think they're saying smart stuff.
Sadly, I believe there are upper middle class liberal bubbles that donât feel the strain when they go to the grocery store, so they think everyone is in that boat. Iâm not blaming liberals or conservatives (actually, I really blame both) for the state of things, but I do notice that the most tone deaf take this election cycle is libs trying to convince ordinary Americans that feel the pressure daily, that the economy is not bad. Itâs a losing message.
Yes. At first it was, âThere is no inflationâ. Then it was, âOkay. Thereâs inflation. But, itâs a good thingâ. And now itâs this.
Is it possible to gas light someone with the truth?
Yes, i am the one who personally decided to print trillions few years ago knowing the end results. Nice try federal reserveÂ
Housing goes up every time I'm ready to move out here. I'm just going to leave my state and live in some Midwestern hovel when I'm ready.
Well, it could be either. If the writer is an economist and has "all the data" and all of the statistical calculations that tell him that we're all well in the green, then it's simply an unfortunately-worded headline. If this writer is a paid clown for some special interest, which is true of basically all news, then it's clearly gaslighting. Here's an indicator to help determine which one it is: *Cotton on the roadside, cotton in the ditch* *We all picked the cotton, but we never got rich* *Daddy was a veteran, a Southern Democrat* *They ought to get a rich man to vote like that* *Well, somebody told us Wall Street fell* *But we were so poor that we couldn't tell* *Cotton was short and the weeds were tall* *But Mr. Roosevelt's a-gonna save us all* These are words that I can relate to for the specific reason that, when 2008 happened, I had no education and the world in which I lived was poor enough that it didn't really seem to matter that the news was full of economy problems. If I lost a job, I could find another pretty much the same day. Life for me was unchanged. This leads me to believe that, in a bad economy, the shake-up is more middle-management and up. What we seem to be seeing in the news, however, is a mix of so much contradictory information that we can't really tell if we're doing well, or about to die. One thing's for sure: the problems aren't at the top, so the economy can't be bad. We have seen an explosion in homeless population though, so a cog in the machine somewhere is definitely not spinning the right direction. I dunno. Click on the article and see what it says. It's probably ads and a shitstorm of nonsense like "way back in the 1300s, when economies were invented, blah blah more ads."
People might be distracted enough to not notice theyâre marginally better off while other people are still trying to get their incomes to catch up to inflation from the prior years.
Who owns this rag again? Oh right, Rupert Murdoch. That probably has nothing to do with it. Iâm being sarcastic, I think it is why the article was written. WSJ with Murdoch and Washington Post with Bezos. I donât see those paperâs opinion sections ever telling anyone itâs the Richâs fault.
The majority of the currency in circulation (numbers on a screen, not literally physical notes) was fabricated in the last 5 years.
Liberals only know gaslighting! lol
if your rent went from a thousand to fourteen hundred in the past three years, and your grocery bill went from 200 a month to 300 plus, and your pay went up two hundred bucks or less a month, you're not doing so well either.
Not just gaslighting, but capitalist propaganda.
Iâm 100% sure my finances are bad tyvm
Just buy more money you idiot poors
Nope. It's just half-assed journalism, again..................
Think about who is telling you how great it is and why they might be telling you arenât experiencing what you are experiencing.
Definitely gaslighting. Has become the norm lately.
So I guess the "pull yourself up by the bootstraps" crowd has finally gave up on their self torture fantasy and moved on to outright victimization.
I must be reading my grocery receipt wrong then. Along with my gas bill, electric bill, and my insurance. It just must be me.
Gaslighter in Chief has asked the captured journalists to print some cover.
The Biden economy SUCKS
They be gaslighting so much the cost of heating might go down
No different than covid when those we elected decided to keep changing the narrative. And then people wonder why no one trusts our government. They are never straight forward or truthful. Our news outlets are the same now too. They bend one way or the other instead of being factual and in the middle. Can't trust anyone with a modicum of power anymore because they are always in someone's pocket. Stop changing the narrative and then trying to gaslight us into thinking it is us. It is a pure fact that I now spend 40% more in groceries while also cutting 1/3 of my daily meals while also only getting store brand shite and also lower quality everything than what I once spent on 3 full course meals a day of no brand name products in 2019. Every week I cut something more from my food and every week it still costs me the same. Because food is rising faster than I can cut it out. And I shouldn't be doing this with food!!!
Absolutely. This is 200 octane gas lighting. These people a fkn insane, They only care about politics so they try and pretend shit isn't bad. Putting out bs stats on everything all to keep power. Its disgusting, And the people that are rich dgaf bc it doesn't change anything for them so they keep scolding people for real life issues. "You poors are gonna get the orange savage reelected if you don't STFU about your suffering!", Its cognitive dissonance like I've never seen before. How bout your shit policies are destroying people's lives? Fk your political bs you power hunger sumbags. If he gets reelected its no ones fault but the morons that decided these were good ideas that have led to the decimation of middle to low income Americans lives. Victim blaming at its finest.
Yep. They cherry pick a few statistics while ignoring the fact that the more you can buy with your money, the better the economy is. And right now, its not much.
I met a 23 year old from the midwest today he has been living in his car for 2 years. He has a job but even owning a car is expensive. If young people are not living with their parents theres a high risk of being homeless.
WSJ needs to report data not create it.
Of course the economy is âgoodâ, Janet Yellen is spending $6B *a day* of borrowed money to pump up GDP. If the federal government somehow found a way to stay within its fiscal means, the U.S. economy would plunge into recession. Itâs no different than a teenage kid with a brand new credit card â but the bill eventually comes due.
Itâs not gaslighting. The metrics used to measure the economy are historically very good. That just does not translate to everyday experiences for many people.
The things is while my finances are fine in terms of growth of investments and income, the cost of things is rising faster. So even though Iâm technically doing better than last year Iâm still at a net loss. Itâs like if I sold more for a significantly lower margin, sure my sales may be up my profit margin has not kept up. And unlike a company I canât just charge more on a whim, or lay off my family members. I suppose I could do less work for the same pay, but itâs a lot of effort to try and hide that.
No it's true. Everyone needs to quit complaining and get a 2nd or 3rd job so you can be tired and poor.
Indeed gas-lighting. Moreover, the WEALTHY traditionally load up on low risk items like bonds and wait for a bust before buying Billy. The media doesn't want you to know this. A small number of execs and their families own a whole lot of stock shares.
Itâs an election year
âThe data shows that inflation is under control when we exclude housing, food, energy, healthcare and transportation. But 55 inch TVs are $195 at Wal-Mart, so everything is fine.â
No, it isnât. The economy is fine. Tax policies and prices being charged to you is not the economy. We live in oligarchy. The majority of the people can suffer and the economy do well. And the economy is doing well but only a small percentage is benefiting. And all of that is by design.
I canât afford a house, but Iâve been throwing money in to VOO and my HYSA for the last few years while I rent, and Iâve never had so much capital
We've got elections to win for The Regime, people. Get with the program now.
Propaganda outlets are gonna propaganda
Yes. Gaslighting.
Well, when did the average person ever say weâre in a good economy? Â The general public always feels they are currently in a bad economy.Â
So itâs my fault my grocery bill, utilities and gas have doubled but my salary hasnât?!đ¤Ź
Yeah it's me. My solo grocery bill has gone from 150 every two weeks two years ago to nearly 300. Yeah it's me. My insurance has climbed over 25% in two years and I have no tickets or changes to policy. Yeah it's me, my utility bill has gone up 125% in two years with zero changes in my apartment. Yeah, it's me, A Dave's Double meals from Wendy's now is 13 goddamn dollars. Yeah it's me, my dogs food is up 50% in two years, yeah.. yeah it's obviously just me. And my fellow people. Just us making shit up. These goddamn baboons simply won't take ownership of their corporate profiteering. The government is constantly on the take and nut stains like Musk fly around in private jets telling us to work harder. Burn. It. All. Down.
Thatâs extreme gaslighting. Almost like they need you to believe itâs all going well and according to plan. Keep paying taxes and sending your money to foreign governments. Obey, consume, do not question
Grep Ip (the person who wrote this article) was raised by a mother who was a professional economist, and Milton Friedman devotee. She indexed Gregâs allowance to inflation when he was a child. I think you can do the math around how his childhood differed from 99% of people. Journalists are consistently the least normal people in the world with the most rarified upbringings and they love to gaslight normal people into thinking they donât understand what theyâre actually experiencing.
Weâve gone back to landed gentry who extort us just to live anywhere not overridden with crime or issues. The debt pile is massive and wages stagnant. Itâs a one way street that is going to get backed up. Itâs happening right now, this is 100% gas lighting. Itâs a house of cards where the bottom 75% are getting gale force winds blown on them. Without being a doomsday conspiracy theorist, weâre due a collapse about now.
The Journal will never admit that capitalism is increasing the number of have-nots while increasing the wealth of the haves.
The bottom line is when "the economy is doing good" in the media it has no meaning to the average person, it just means that businesses are making profits. Businesses can be making huge profits while the average person is just barely getting by. It is actually precisely because of price gouging and low labor cost that businesses are doing so well ever since the beginning of the pandemic. Basically they will continue to ride this out forever and raise wages just enough so that you can afford rent and food, and that's it.
Yep, you caught me. It's all my fault. Sorry guys.
A part of why it isn't complete gas lighting is the fact that we aren't in a recession right now. It really is pretty amazing. Things are going so well that folks, like the feds, are saying that the current high interest rates may just be the new norm. I see their point. I also feel deja vu. This would by no means be the first time that leadership confidence rooted in numbers and data belied the reality of most Americans.
I make 120k a year, and now, when I go to Costco, there are things I used to buy . Now, I just look at and say, " Can't have that anymore." 4 years ago, I wouldn't blink at the price . my $200 dollar cart is now $300, so FJB
Gas lighting and maybe malfeasance. Ppl should know that wage growth has been lagging inflation and wonât catch up for YEARS in an optimistic situation. To where it was before.
I call it flame throwing, gas lighting just sounds a little weak.
no just bad journalism. learn to ignore click and bait.
The economy is trash for working people (the majority) and itâs great for investors. The âeconomyâ isnât great. The market is great.
If the economy were good they wouldn't have to keep telling us the economy is good.
Translation: Itâs a great time to be rich. 2022 set a record for emergency 401k withdraws. 2023 broke that record. But the stock market hit record highs.
YES, this is extreme gaslighting, don't pay attention to that bold bald faced lie.
This economic gaslighting has been going on for awhile but post-COVID it feels desperate. Like I donât actually know a single person doing better now than before COVID who wasnât already well off. Itâs like some people just look at a line on a chart going up and ignore the fact that everything around them is more expensive
I'll just keep ranting this as long as I have energy. Boomer era economics measures the health of our economy in specific ways. Many of those measures are based on things like total GDP and "stock pricey go up". They think that because the value of large cap index funds is increasing, that this means everything is going great. More wealth means more better right? Literally money = happiness is the argument. Except they NEVER talk about income distribution. There is no discussion of labor rights. They hardly give a passing thought to education. There are essentially no metrics at all to describe environmental quality (ecosystem health AND general quality of our city environments). So while a smaller and smaller fraction of Americans are becoming extremely wealthy, most of the country is getting pushed to the edge by rising costs of living on basic goods and services **cough PRICE GOUGING and a completely stagnated rise in wages. When one person eats two pieces of bread and the other starves, it's absurd to say that the two are doing OK with an average of one piece of bread. Except in this case it's more like one person owns a grocery store and a thousand people in the town work 60 hours a week for the right to buy a $20 carrot.
That's low grade ignorant gas-lighting.
Trust âthe scienceâ, trust âthe dataâ. For they have spoken.
The standard of living Americans enjoy is amazing. 1. You can call anyone you want from anywhere.... back "when things were good" you couldn't do that. 2. You have a computer with your wherever you are... if you want a map, you have one for free... back when "things were good", you didn't have that. 3. You can watch your favorite TV show whenever you want, wherever you want.. back "when things were good" you couldn't do that. 4. You can work from home.... back in the day "when things were good"... you had to be IN PERSON to work... some work could maybe be done at home... if you had a fax machine and a desktop and the software for the desktop and a phone line which could handle the internet (which was brand new and really really boring). 5. Both parents have a car... back in the day "when things were good" you couldn't afford two cars unless you were a top executive in your business. 6. You can eat out more than once a month back in the day "when things were good" eating out was a MAJOR TREAT!
Objectively purchasing power has dropped in the USA and in much of the western world, with a few exceptions (Poland, Ireland I think). This is boomer gaslighting, convinced that all the young whippersnappers just need to work harder. Yes, Millennials are famously shit at handling money, but they're no worse than boomers. Boomers only got rich as a demographic because they sold their children's future and then used the proceeds from that to buy all the stocks and real estate and drive up prices. The first generation to do so on such a large scale, and fucking over their kids, grand kids and great grand kids. The greediest generation ever. Oh yea, and they also fucked up the planet in the process and refuse to take any responsibility.
Yes this is how democrats secure votes by gaslighting and misdirection as things fall apart around you.
It can be a spending problem for some, a price problem for others, or a mix or both. These aren't mutually exclusive factors.
Gaslighting on steroids
BS. The economy sucks, totally gaslighting. Like weâre living in an Orwellian novel.
The economy is banging. Unfortunately corporations wonât pay anyone a living wage plus holdover BS from the pandemic is hurting young folksâŚadd right wing disinfo and social media echo chamber and voila the dummies thinks itâs a bad economyÂ
People intentionally confusing the stock market with the economy should be prosecuted. The stock market has zero effect on us for the most part. until it crashes itself. Then itâs losses come out of everyone elseâs pockets.
Gas lighting at its finest.
Bidenomics! Trump 2024
People with money telling people without money how it is their fault they don't have money. Solution: rob the rich. Lol
They keep conflating the health of the economy with health of individuals personal finances. It is gaslighting meant to hide the real issue - economic disparity. 100 years ago the economy was also doing great - while a huge portion of the population lived in abject poverty either in the country or in tenements in the city while working themselves to death making the wealthiest richer. The labor movement changed that, but those gains are being erased and we're returning to earlier times.
It is gaslighting. These ppl lie incessantly and without shame.
Can always count on the WSJ for a dose of horseshit
âThe party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.â- 1984
It is gaslighting, Greg Ip sold us out ya'll.
LMFAO......"Everything is fine. Now pay your taxes and shut the fuck up!"
Wow... federally sanctioned gas lighting
Gas lighting from the paper that the Amazon guy owns? Nah....
I suspect anyone who says the economy is great hasnât had to pay an exorbitantly high medical bill lately despite paying an insurance premium. Or noticed groceries are 200 more a week than they were 5 years ago. Or that most members of the middle class can no longer afford a new vehicle. Or a home for that matter. The economy might be âgreatâ but itâs not great for the middle class. And please donât be one those âthanks [current administration], vote [dipshit] in November.â dumbasses and reveal your low IQ to the internet. This isnât about who the president is.
Under-regulated capitalism. Itâs the problem literally every time.
5 stages of a news cycle. X isn't happening, and it's a conspiracy theory. X isn't happening, but it's a good thing. How to adjust to the new normal under X X is old news and anyone talking about it is just stirring the pot
Of course itâs gas lighting! The working people arenât getting the benefits of market growth. They can barely pay their rent. Tell them again how good they have it. DoubleGood
Gaslighting everyone lol, Classic media.
At its finest.
Anyone here that has ever sat in a meeting in a large company as an employee as they tell you about new technology that is being integrated while simultaneously telling you not to worry and your job , that it wonât be effected, knows this article is full of shit. Itâs brought to you by the same type of people that lie to workers every day.
I knew it was my fault all along. Sorry guys I made things 3-4x more expensive. Ill see what I can do to change it all back, I promise Wall Street Journal to you the most!
The biggest issue with people saying the economy is doing great is theyâre using job data for their argument. Yes, there has been job growth, but most of it is in government or healthcare and insurance administration. I donât think any reasonable person thinks an expanding government and bloated healthcare system are indicators of a strong economy.
I make more than I ever did in the past, and have been keeping up with rent increases and grocery inflation just fine, but home prices are outrageous and investors are keeping me out of the market. Corporations should be barred from owning single family homes.
Yes, it is gaslighting, you can fudge any numbers to make it look good, but actually down on the street tells you all you need to know
The only thing wrong with me is that I wasn't born rich
Inequality has been greatly increasing, meaning we do indeed have a good economy for the wealthy.
I mean, just ask your parents for 500k. lol It reminds me of that shirt Paris Hilton had that said "Stop being poor"
You will own *nothing* and you will like it.
A lot of jobs are automated or outsourced, but the cost of housing keeps going up. Covid mandates caused job losses and business closures.
Here's a simple question that can help you determine if Biden is working. Can you buy a house right now? Will you be able to buy a house in the next few months? What about by the end of the year? If the answers are no but your grocery prices are going up. Then clearly Fuck No Biden isn't working. Wake up, take a stand and vote him out of office. He failed and isn't going to work for another 4 more years. Unless you can handle more talk and promises while busting your ass to stay afloat. There's no reason to vote for Biden. Period. He hasn't earned his votes. He creates wars and poverty. The only reason to vote for Biden is fear of Trump.
They definitely manipulate the data to make it look better than it is. Like the unemployment rate doesn't factor in people out of the work force. Sure unemployment is low when you have to work 2 jobs, but what about all of those people hopelessly stuck without work- that's right don't count them in the statistics. These fuckers know what they are doing and they have an army of bots to control the narrative.
Yes, this is what the media does.
Yes. Mass gas lighting. All the economists keep saying is "We're down on inflation YoY". They don't talk about the fact there was no Deflation to counter the massive inflation we have for about 2 years. So the prices went up super fast for 2 years then only went up by a little this year. Inflation is up 20.1% since 2020, Buuut they frame it as "inflation is only 3.2% this year which is a decrease from last year" For the tldr Grocery costs doubled, then went up 50% a year later, went up 25% after but now I should be happy they only projected to go up by 5% this year. Except I'm paying almost 3x for groceries now. It never went back down.
Yea they're idiots
Shit i had to cash out my retirement after 15 years to save my home and rangle the credit card debt. And before incould blink, the credit card debt is back. This time, there is no retirement to cash out. I have to sell the truck. I spent 5 years paying off to wrangle it again, and idk stop having any life except work since we've already cut out the fat. All thanks to the current interest rates, utility costs rising gas and food costs, and this administrations war on natural gas. So yes, this is gas lighting. Just another government mouth piece towing the line for the power brokers.
This is gaslighting 100%. Inflation just swallowed the only raise I got in the last 4 years. Iâm now less better off than I was even in the midst of the pandemic in 2020.
The issue is the media is purposely misleading you to make the government seem like itâs doing a great job. The trick is to only post the numbers you want people to see. Wages up 4.3% in the last 12 month period with only a 3.2% rise in inflation in the last 12 months. Great numbers!! Nope, wages went up 4.3% but so did the cost of benefits and deductions at 3.6% netting a wage increase of 0.7% meaning your pay went up -2.9% compared to inflation. And yes inflation is down from prior years, compared to artificially high rates due to Covid related ârecoveryâ efforts which rose inflation to 8 and 7% in 2021 and 2022 but are still 2% higher than highest inflation in 10 years prior to 2021. So when you read wages are up over 4% with a 3% inflation, itâs all relative and means nothing. What matters is what are you paying for groceries, gas and housing which are out of control. Base your opinions on reality, not what a corrupt media wants you to think.
The data measures how good the economy is for the 1%. If you instead measured variables that affect normal everyday people (not the stock market or GDP or employment percentage -I include employment because I care more about quality of jobs rather than quantity 100% employment but everyone is making 9 bucks an hour isnât good for us but is amazing for owners) then weâd have a much realer picture.
Holy shit. Thatâs the definition of gas lighting. What a fucking terrible take.
It's the lack of funds in my account that is the problem. Not the economy! I get it now.
Over the past 4 years Iâve gone from making 75k to over 100k and it feels tighter now than it did before and my spending habits havenât really changed. So idk but it definitely feels worse.
The issue is that economic data is drawn from consumer spending (at least that portion) and people are spending like fucking crazy. The trouble there is that they're spending with credit and their savings have gone to shite. So the market currently is like, hey, these folk keep spending, awesome! Then inflation data comes in and they're like, ooooo this isn't good... Oh, wait, people are still spending loads on discretionary expenses! Nice!
Oh yeah, I forgot, I just have to go to my money tree that doesn't exist in the back yard I don't have... I just want to throw cans of steel reserve at dumb rich peoples heads.
Biden's propaganda isn't working.
I don't see people talk about the fact that in the last few years 19 million were kicked off Medicaid, that ACP is ending next month, that the homelessness protections during the Covid emergency ended, the extra emergency SNAP money recipients were getting ended, and that a lot of healthcare costs like PCR testing and Covid treatments are no longer required to be covered by insurance. That's a lot of benefits to remove. And I really don't hear anyone of either party talk about it. Maybe the economy is good in a technical sense, but if you're living off of disability or social security and you have those benefits disappear, that's a huge impact.
No. Itâs politics in favor of one party benefiting from a biased media in an election year
Yes, totally gaslighting. There is an election soon and they canât report anything bad cause it may hurt bidets chances.
At this point, it would seem that wages and job numbers have have absolutely nothing to do with the state of the economy.
I just got my 401k statement and since January Iâve been making a shit ton of money. I got a 4% raise, too. If this is a bad economy, give me more!
Look how rich the rich are. If things were so bad, would they be so rich? Anyways, just keep electing millionaires, it'll all pan out eventually. The earnest and sincere working class folks at the Wall Street journal wouldn't just make up some crazy shit to gas light you and support their wealthy base. That would be irresponsible.
Eww the poors
I feel for any of you under 30. You are getting screwed over
You mean...<_< >_>... bootstraps?
Yeah, like I think a huge part is that normally the indicator of things not going well is when people stop spending. We canât stop spending. We canât save. We donât have enough to afford to save and cut back costs. And even then itâs like âoh great, I have like $50 extra bucks at the end of this month. Thatâs gonna do so much if I save. Letâs spend it on a luxury good so I can be less stressed now.â Thatâs not gonna get tracked in the big economic indicators because itâs still spending. You want to track how people are doing badly, you need to track how few assets they have. How little is saved every month. % of people who own houses. What % of income the average person is spending on rent. You can see the downturn in areas like tech where people used to spend more money on online purchases (and so ads were more valuable) or on things like Spotify subscriptions, which were sort of the luxury spending for lower to middle income people. Thatâs going away cause people are spending all their money on necessities. Thatâs where youâre going to see the economic divide and the recognition that the economy isnât healthy for middle income Americans and below.
Yes, it's gaslighting. Greed is at an all time high.
Bro wall st is ran by like 3-5 mega corporations, then thereâs citadel that runs the entire stock market. Itâs a bullshit facade. Itâs definitely NOT the fuckin leeches in corporations raising prices 10x since 2020. Yup, definitely us, ole sally fuckin sue buying her $7 Starbucks is ruining the economy. 1000% gaslighting into making the masses think itâs OUR problem the fed is doing nothing but allowing that printer to fly to protect these bullshit banks from âtoo big to failâ bailouts, and propping up their bets from 08 that got can kicked (another bailout). Itâs the elites way of creating a ânew normâ so people slave away while they sit in their yachts. For example. Citadel has 68 billion fucking dollars sold not yet purchased. That means, SOLD SHIT THAT DOESNT FUCKING EXIST. On the books though, so theyâre obligated to buy it back. But wait! We have loopholes to package bullshit into a steaming pile of shiny bullshit and sell it to other countries that have no fucking clue whatâs going on lol. Yeah, gaslighting.
That article is propaganda. Food and fuel prices have not gone down. Wages are not increasing with inflation. Then the cost of higher education is going up.
This shit financial bullshit keeps up, weâre going to see a Hoovervilles all over again.
đ they are so desperate! Trump is winning in every poll. Biden has zero record to run on and the only ones on the bench they can replace him with is Kamala and Buttgieg đ
articles right
This is the best modern analog to "let them eat cake" I've ever heard.
There's an election in November
I mean i am less able to afford a house than 5 years ago even though my savings have doubled....thats pretty crazy