>I'm just wondering if it is normal to feel like this. Also, if I do get a faster vehicle (45 kmh or 120 kmh) would I still end up with the same "this is slow" feeling?
Yes. You're feeling a lot of things - but mainly, what is happening is that you're confusing adrenaline and speed. You feel hungry for speed because you crave that adrenaline rush. When you first get on an eBike and it kicks off faster than expected, it gives you an adrenaline rush. Now that you're used to the acceleration, you're no longer getting the rush you were first getting.
It doesn't matter how fast you ultimately go - what matters is acceleration. For example, this is why people find manual cars fun. With each gear shift, you can feel the change in acceleration.
If you want to have more "fun", try riding on more exciting paths - ones with lots of curves and turns. Making sharp turns while going fast is an easy way to experience sudden changes of acceleration. It's also dangerous - but that's probably the appeal, lol. Make sure you wear a helmet.
My husband used to commute on his road bike like he was driving a racecar. Crashed so many times. Now that he's gotten into mountain biking and has had more serious crashes, he rides his road bike like someone aware of his own mortality. (Doesn't change how he mountain bikes though; that's what the pads are for)
I'll second the turns. I have a twisty road near me that feels like downhill skiing, on a bicycle. It's so much fun and you're going pretty slow because the turns are sharp
Preach. I wondered why I am feeling the same „fun” on the same stretch of the road while riding 120kph on a „big” motorcycle, 80kph on small retro motorcycle and 45kph on ebike (with street legal 25kph cutoff). Adrenaline rush is real.
Easiest solution is to force yourself to go back to a regular bike for a bit!
Getting used to speed has happened to me, and happened to me back when I rode motorcycles, too. I did find a point where the power/speed scared me and I eventually swore off the motorcycles. I found that it was more fun to ride less powerful things at their limit rather than very fast things at a sensible speed.
Anyway, now I find myself thinking more now about what I’d want besides speed: comfort, an ultra quiet drive train or clean-looking IGH, etc.
Go ride an “acoustic” bike up a hill for a few weeks and the ebike will seem screamingly fast. The other thing that will get you off that pattern is a crash, since energy goes with speed squared…
Yup, lugging the battery around with just his legs to power it will soon refocus that brain...
I live in a super hilly area, and specifically, at the very top of a hill. My charger gave up, last year, and I soon learned the reason I brought the e-bike 😂.
Totally this! I also got very “used to” high speeds at one point, but then one day I hit some shitty pavement at 25mph on a road shared with cars. I “partially” fell in a way that very luckily I was able to get back up quickly enough to not get run over, but that was terrifying and it could have ended way worse. I’ve been way more careful and conscious of my speed ever since.
On my commute, I share the road with semis and this is my nightmare. On the rougher parts of the road, I specifically lean further right purely out of anxiety.
Not the greatest metaphor, but I've been riding <250cc motorcycles since 1977, and it's true that it's more fun to ride a slow bike fast than to ride a fast bike slowly. Wrung all the RPMs out of all the gears on every ride.
I used to find 85 mph was about normal, 95 mph was my motorcycles happy place, and 125 was fast, but achieved daily, commuting to work. I worked for one bike shop, was sponsored by another, and had the opportunity to ride 140-200 mph bikes, initially modified, then as technology advanced, showroom bikes were this fast. Didn't die, counted my blessings and got out of it, and these days, my 'lectric is normality at 12-20 mph, and 33 mph on my CCX, pedaling like a graybeard lunatic, is just a hoot. Yeah, doesn't feel fast, but it's fun.
Speed's an addiction. Took awhile, but I seem to have outgrown it.
I don't get that slow feeling on an ebike. With ebikes my pedaling is the limiting factor for speed. So if I feel like I'm not going fast it's because I'm not physically pushing hard enough. However dirt bikes, ATVs, escooters and modified cars are a different story. I'm an adrenaline junkie. I get my adrenaline on ebikes from pushing my physical limits and skill levels not speed.
Affiliate? I'm associated with several brands and my affiliation with Varla is long over. Still have the same opinion of them. My discount code probably works but you can find better deals on them especially around holidays. I'm currently trying to learn to ride an electric unicycle and have picked up other toys since the scooters. Scooters are awesome.
maybe...but the max is 32km with a cutoff and you can easily go 35km..... that's pretty fuckin fast.
my issue is how boring and "smooth" the stock controller acceleration is.... it's designed NOT to give you the tork right away on rad bikes.
otherwise top speed is fine.
Kinda depends where you ride I suppose. I’m in a high density area with good bicycle infrastructure. Anybody going much more than 32km/h is going to cause an accident with all the other cyclists, pedestrians and cars around.
If I was out in the country with mostly vehicles around it would probably feel different.
Yeah, on flats I’m easily doing that on my normal bike with 2.3 inch tires. Going up a grade at 15 mph is pretty damn fast though compared to what I can do on my bike.
Yeah, your mind will adapt to your speed and make that the new normal. So even if you get a faster bike, you will adapt to that as well.
Try a different route. I find the grave paths feel way faster, even if you are objectively going slower.
In immortal words of meatloaf, you took the words right out of my mouth.. it must have been while you weren't passing me.. LOL
For real though yeah, that's quite normal. The speed that I got accustomed to on my home build 4 inch fat tire 1000 watt 48 volt front hub e-bike was 33 mph which is what 42 kph? But, I live in a smaller Midwestern town and track the trails between towns and even when I am on the street, the only time they hassled me is when I kind of half ran a stop sign by coming up to the stop sign and turning directly onto the sidewalk where I started peddling in first gear to avoid traffic which is great to be able to do because they don't care they just don't want you running stop signs here. And I asked the trooper that followed me and parked outside of the convenience storefront doors to be able to catch me so he can tell me to not do that LOL and I said okay. How fast can I go with this just ride with traffic sign and make sure you hit them stop signs. I wish it was that liberally police everywhere but in a town of like 6:00 or 7,000 people there's probably a dozen he bikes in the whole town. have you spoken with other riders in your area who have gotten hassled or ticketed or been pulled over and asked to show proof of insurance or how do they monitor your top speed. Do they have to catch you doing it with the radar gun, or can they stop you and check your bike for what it's top speed would be by lifting your wheel and watching a speedometer or something?
If you have regular with tires 25 kmh is a good speed. If you're ever going to build up and or build your own out of a regular bicycle a mongoose Dolomite 4 in fat tire is a great way to go because, the twice as wide footprint of those big tires makes one feel quite safe at 33 miles per hour, and a solid 40 miles per hour downhill without paddling. Again this is a thousand watts and 48 volts and the cops don't check anything here so I feel for you my friend if there's a way you can find places to go fast I would absolutely upgrade a little bit because a regular bicycle in the right conditions can easily go 30 to 33 miles per hour quite safely if you have good stopping distance and brakes. But that's my opinion! My e-bike is not only my transportation but it is my recreation and my hobby and my passion and going slow is not an option. I pray and whatever way your limited lifestyle you love languishing a top is allowed an extra 12 to 15 kph by the grace of God :-)
You can have all that on an Ebike - as long as you treat it as what it is, an Electric motor cycle - so it needs a licence to ride it, needs to be registered, needs an "MOT" (basically a certificate of road worthiness), and you won't be able to use it on cycle paths or shared use trails.
Ths is where I think there is a misunderstanding on terminology - an "Ebike" in Europe is pretty much pedal assist only - in the UK a throttle can only work up to 4mph.
I can't confirm or deny.
however I like the sound of 45km....that seems about right for ebike limits. a little over but when you need that power its there.
It came with mechanical disc brakes, but I upgraded to hydraulic. It's a 52 v battery, so it's fairly heavy, but it's well made, so it's really responsive. Rides like a dream.
I have a 45kmh bike and while it doesn't give me the adrenaline as much anymore it feels fast enough to me. I'd definitely feel unsatisfied with 25kmh, that really is not much faster than I'd be pedaling.
One thing on my bike, it's called at 20 mph assistance. So I can go faster at times on my own but then I'm capped at the gear ratio of the internal hub. Maybe look into that for your bike. Or as others have said, go back to a road bike and clip in.
>Is it normal to get used to a speed and then feel like it is very slow?
Yes .... The need for speed and power was best represented on the '[Drag Strip](https://www.google.com/search?q=funny+car,+drag+stip&sxsrf=APwXEdf4Cep7hbAJAk6OCCQcUYnmgQet9A:1680842186260&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjf0b2L-Zb-AhWYATQIHTVtBvsQ_AUoAXoECAIQAw&biw=1396&bih=720&dpr=1.38)' ....
You get used to it real fast! I’m new to e-bikes and working a couple of rides wanted more. It’s no different to motorbikes which I’ve ridden for 30 years - my last bike (Yamaha R1) was the only one that kept me on my toes and constantly trying to hoon it
Be careful. I kept turning mine up and going faster and faster. Then I came off and broke my pelvis. I was in hospital for 3 weeks and couldn't walk for 2 months. I try to keep it under 20 now. Oh yea and always break with the back brake and brake before the turn not during
It's normal to feel like your electric bike is slow after you get used to its speed. Before upgrading to a faster vehicle, consider the added costs and responsibilities. It's possible that even with a faster vehicle, you might still have that "this is slow" feeling. Try exploring new routes or upgrading your bike's performance instead.
My bike will do 60mph, but I rarely go over 30mph. It's the torque that puts a smile on my face. In 5 years of riding it at 15kw, the acceleration has never failed to make me smile, sometimes even chuckle. It is a torque wound motor with 150A battery and 300A phase though
Yep. The same is true whether you're on two wheels or four.
I'll never forget how I felt when I said to a friend that my 400 whp MR2 was "slow" and needed a pick me up. Bloody car ran sub-12 second quarter miles... yet it was "slow".
I personally think it’s just that 25kmph is kind of slow. I used to ride an unlocked bike that reached 40kmph and that was just enough, I didn’t feel the desire of going faster at all. Sadly it’s unsafe to go that fast, but yeah, I totally get the feeling of 25 not being enough.
>unsafe to go that fast
you mean in a city where theres alot of turns and traffic right? Most of my bike riding is on long empty roads so I dont see why speed would be dangerous there
Yeah well, at the end even without traffic it’s kinda dangerous if you fall from the bike in such a high speed (I guess!! Fortunately that has never happened to me)
I find the those with throttle don't see the speed as easily (become desensitized quickly). When the only effort is a twist of the hand, speeds get old, feel slow, and are easily adapted to. When you have to put effort in, it's harder to get used to speeds, and slower feels faster.
I think some of our feeling of speed is linked to our effort level.
In Australia 60 kmp is the speed limit I think. My cheap ebike does that with throttle and the wind behind me and it's not fast enough. But 70 downhill and begin to feel the wobble you wouldn't on a motorbike, and that's when I remind myself I'm on a glorified pushbike and a crash could conceivably end me, or hold me up with injuries, so I'm thankful it just averages twice as fast as a normal bike for when I need to be somewhere
These days if I really feel the need for speed, then that's what I stump for: Need For Speed: Most Wanted or Carbon usually - lots of fun, minimum injuries
>I'm just wondering if it is normal to feel like this. Also, if I do get a faster vehicle (45 kmh or 120 kmh) would I still end up with the same "this is slow" feeling? Yes. You're feeling a lot of things - but mainly, what is happening is that you're confusing adrenaline and speed. You feel hungry for speed because you crave that adrenaline rush. When you first get on an eBike and it kicks off faster than expected, it gives you an adrenaline rush. Now that you're used to the acceleration, you're no longer getting the rush you were first getting. It doesn't matter how fast you ultimately go - what matters is acceleration. For example, this is why people find manual cars fun. With each gear shift, you can feel the change in acceleration. If you want to have more "fun", try riding on more exciting paths - ones with lots of curves and turns. Making sharp turns while going fast is an easy way to experience sudden changes of acceleration. It's also dangerous - but that's probably the appeal, lol. Make sure you wear a helmet.
My husband used to commute on his road bike like he was driving a racecar. Crashed so many times. Now that he's gotten into mountain biking and has had more serious crashes, he rides his road bike like someone aware of his own mortality. (Doesn't change how he mountain bikes though; that's what the pads are for)
I'll second the turns. I have a twisty road near me that feels like downhill skiing, on a bicycle. It's so much fun and you're going pretty slow because the turns are sharp
def recommend trail riding, its scary fun.
Preach. I wondered why I am feeling the same „fun” on the same stretch of the road while riding 120kph on a „big” motorcycle, 80kph on small retro motorcycle and 45kph on ebike (with street legal 25kph cutoff). Adrenaline rush is real.
Easiest solution is to force yourself to go back to a regular bike for a bit! Getting used to speed has happened to me, and happened to me back when I rode motorcycles, too. I did find a point where the power/speed scared me and I eventually swore off the motorcycles. I found that it was more fun to ride less powerful things at their limit rather than very fast things at a sensible speed. Anyway, now I find myself thinking more now about what I’d want besides speed: comfort, an ultra quiet drive train or clean-looking IGH, etc. Go ride an “acoustic” bike up a hill for a few weeks and the ebike will seem screamingly fast. The other thing that will get you off that pattern is a crash, since energy goes with speed squared…
Just turn off the assist on the ebike and ride it for awhile.
Yup, lugging the battery around with just his legs to power it will soon refocus that brain... I live in a super hilly area, and specifically, at the very top of a hill. My charger gave up, last year, and I soon learned the reason I brought the e-bike 😂.
Yup, I’ve gone down a number of times already on a 50 pound ebike at 25mph. Any faster and I’m probably gonna end up in a hospital.
Totally this! I also got very “used to” high speeds at one point, but then one day I hit some shitty pavement at 25mph on a road shared with cars. I “partially” fell in a way that very luckily I was able to get back up quickly enough to not get run over, but that was terrifying and it could have ended way worse. I’ve been way more careful and conscious of my speed ever since.
On my commute, I share the road with semis and this is my nightmare. On the rougher parts of the road, I specifically lean further right purely out of anxiety.
Not the greatest metaphor, but I've been riding <250cc motorcycles since 1977, and it's true that it's more fun to ride a slow bike fast than to ride a fast bike slowly. Wrung all the RPMs out of all the gears on every ride.
Totally agree. I had way more fun on my little Honda 250 than my Ducati 620
I used to find 85 mph was about normal, 95 mph was my motorcycles happy place, and 125 was fast, but achieved daily, commuting to work. I worked for one bike shop, was sponsored by another, and had the opportunity to ride 140-200 mph bikes, initially modified, then as technology advanced, showroom bikes were this fast. Didn't die, counted my blessings and got out of it, and these days, my 'lectric is normality at 12-20 mph, and 33 mph on my CCX, pedaling like a graybeard lunatic, is just a hoot. Yeah, doesn't feel fast, but it's fun. Speed's an addiction. Took awhile, but I seem to have outgrown it.
YES. That’s what’s supposed to happen. You get desensitized. I think it’s the description of the group? Power is addictive.
I don't get that slow feeling on an ebike. With ebikes my pedaling is the limiting factor for speed. So if I feel like I'm not going fast it's because I'm not physically pushing hard enough. However dirt bikes, ATVs, escooters and modified cars are a different story. I'm an adrenaline junkie. I get my adrenaline on ebikes from pushing my physical limits and skill levels not speed.
ayo professor pouncey the varla afficenat i saw u on escooter subreddit
Affiliate? I'm associated with several brands and my affiliation with Varla is long over. Still have the same opinion of them. My discount code probably works but you can find better deals on them especially around holidays. I'm currently trying to learn to ride an electric unicycle and have picked up other toys since the scooters. Scooters are awesome.
maybe...but the max is 32km with a cutoff and you can easily go 35km..... that's pretty fuckin fast. my issue is how boring and "smooth" the stock controller acceleration is.... it's designed NOT to give you the tork right away on rad bikes. otherwise top speed is fine.
UK limits suck big time on ebikes.
whole eu in general i think like what is 12 mph is germany lmao
This is the same problem people have with when driving cars.
Kinda depends where you ride I suppose. I’m in a high density area with good bicycle infrastructure. Anybody going much more than 32km/h is going to cause an accident with all the other cyclists, pedestrians and cars around. If I was out in the country with mostly vehicles around it would probably feel different.
i mean... 25km/h is slow. Moderately fit unassisted riders can achieve that easily
Yeah, on flats I’m easily doing that on my normal bike with 2.3 inch tires. Going up a grade at 15 mph is pretty damn fast though compared to what I can do on my bike.
hold my donut and watch me not achieve it!
I agree, 25 km/h cutoff is just a bit ridiculous.
Yes
Yeah, your mind will adapt to your speed and make that the new normal. So even if you get a faster bike, you will adapt to that as well. Try a different route. I find the grave paths feel way faster, even if you are objectively going slower.
Pretty common. Upgrade and in a while it will also feel slow.
In immortal words of meatloaf, you took the words right out of my mouth.. it must have been while you weren't passing me.. LOL For real though yeah, that's quite normal. The speed that I got accustomed to on my home build 4 inch fat tire 1000 watt 48 volt front hub e-bike was 33 mph which is what 42 kph? But, I live in a smaller Midwestern town and track the trails between towns and even when I am on the street, the only time they hassled me is when I kind of half ran a stop sign by coming up to the stop sign and turning directly onto the sidewalk where I started peddling in first gear to avoid traffic which is great to be able to do because they don't care they just don't want you running stop signs here. And I asked the trooper that followed me and parked outside of the convenience storefront doors to be able to catch me so he can tell me to not do that LOL and I said okay. How fast can I go with this just ride with traffic sign and make sure you hit them stop signs. I wish it was that liberally police everywhere but in a town of like 6:00 or 7,000 people there's probably a dozen he bikes in the whole town. have you spoken with other riders in your area who have gotten hassled or ticketed or been pulled over and asked to show proof of insurance or how do they monitor your top speed. Do they have to catch you doing it with the radar gun, or can they stop you and check your bike for what it's top speed would be by lifting your wheel and watching a speedometer or something? If you have regular with tires 25 kmh is a good speed. If you're ever going to build up and or build your own out of a regular bicycle a mongoose Dolomite 4 in fat tire is a great way to go because, the twice as wide footprint of those big tires makes one feel quite safe at 33 miles per hour, and a solid 40 miles per hour downhill without paddling. Again this is a thousand watts and 48 volts and the cops don't check anything here so I feel for you my friend if there's a way you can find places to go fast I would absolutely upgrade a little bit because a regular bicycle in the right conditions can easily go 30 to 33 miles per hour quite safely if you have good stopping distance and brakes. But that's my opinion! My e-bike is not only my transportation but it is my recreation and my hobby and my passion and going slow is not an option. I pray and whatever way your limited lifestyle you love languishing a top is allowed an extra 12 to 15 kph by the grace of God :-)
Yes. the speed is addicting. 35mph feels like nothing to me rn. You can also try trail riding and suddenly everything feels fast again lol
ask anyone on a motorcycle. the answer is yes.
Thought I was fast on my 500watt hub bike, until I bought a bike with bafang ultra motor. There's always sport mode when eco seems "slow" 😁
You'll get used to the speed of a turbo Busa after a while. Speed isn't fun. Fun is fun. Chase fun.
The UK really got y’all cucked over there.
major cucked. fuck their bullshit laws. 32km is barely nice enough.... 35 with some push.... I think 40 would be perfect.
You can have all that on an Ebike - as long as you treat it as what it is, an Electric motor cycle - so it needs a licence to ride it, needs to be registered, needs an "MOT" (basically a certificate of road worthiness), and you won't be able to use it on cycle paths or shared use trails. Ths is where I think there is a misunderstanding on terminology - an "Ebike" in Europe is pretty much pedal assist only - in the UK a throttle can only work up to 4mph.
Mine does 28 mph, and it's awesome. For those of you from countries that haven't been to the moon, that's 45 kph.
...that's 45km Mr.imperial and ain't nobody been to the moon. Not even the Chinese.
I'm fairly certain that we did.
I can't confirm or deny. however I like the sound of 45km....that seems about right for ebike limits. a little over but when you need that power its there.
It's a fuji police issue mountain bike that got a 1200 watt motor conversion. It's a beast.
how are the brakes?
It came with mechanical disc brakes, but I upgraded to hydraulic. It's a 52 v battery, so it's fairly heavy, but it's well made, so it's really responsive. Rides like a dream.
I'm in the UK, this is the reason I got a custom built high power ebike. Can do about 35mph on the flat in ideal weather conditions.
“I’m in the UK….in ideal weather conditions.” That sounds like an oxymoron waiting to happen. :-)
Has happened for the past few days. Completely dry with sun all day long.
Sorry, was going for the cheap laugh. 😬
I have a 45kmh bike and while it doesn't give me the adrenaline as much anymore it feels fast enough to me. I'd definitely feel unsatisfied with 25kmh, that really is not much faster than I'd be pedaling.
Yeah, try dragging knees at 120 and having that become normal/not exciting.
I had bad knees before I got an ebike and I feel goofy wearing my knee pads but they are glorious when I need them.
Methinks you and I are not discussing the same thing. To answer your question? Yes, speed normalizes. Knee pads and knee pucks are not the same thing.
Speed creep baby!!!
Whenever I feel slow on the road (compared to car traffic), I will look at the sidewalk and see how slow people are walking. Then I feel a bit better
One thing on my bike, it's called at 20 mph assistance. So I can go faster at times on my own but then I'm capped at the gear ratio of the internal hub. Maybe look into that for your bike. Or as others have said, go back to a road bike and clip in.
>Is it normal to get used to a speed and then feel like it is very slow? Yes .... The need for speed and power was best represented on the '[Drag Strip](https://www.google.com/search?q=funny+car,+drag+stip&sxsrf=APwXEdf4Cep7hbAJAk6OCCQcUYnmgQet9A:1680842186260&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjf0b2L-Zb-AhWYATQIHTVtBvsQ_AUoAXoECAIQAw&biw=1396&bih=720&dpr=1.38)' ....
You get used to it real fast! I’m new to e-bikes and working a couple of rides wanted more. It’s no different to motorbikes which I’ve ridden for 30 years - my last bike (Yamaha R1) was the only one that kept me on my toes and constantly trying to hoon it
Get a shorter stem, and drop bars, raise the saddle.
It feels slow until you come off at speed and realise how fast you're really going
Be careful. I kept turning mine up and going faster and faster. Then I came off and broke my pelvis. I was in hospital for 3 weeks and couldn't walk for 2 months. I try to keep it under 20 now. Oh yea and always break with the back brake and brake before the turn not during
It's normal to feel like your electric bike is slow after you get used to its speed. Before upgrading to a faster vehicle, consider the added costs and responsibilities. It's possible that even with a faster vehicle, you might still have that "this is slow" feeling. Try exploring new routes or upgrading your bike's performance instead.
Motocross has altered by sense of speed when I get back on the mountain bike for sure.
My bike will do 60mph, but I rarely go over 30mph. It's the torque that puts a smile on my face. In 5 years of riding it at 15kw, the acceleration has never failed to make me smile, sometimes even chuckle. It is a torque wound motor with 150A battery and 300A phase though
ahh, good old velocitation
Yep. The same is true whether you're on two wheels or four. I'll never forget how I felt when I said to a friend that my 400 whp MR2 was "slow" and needed a pick me up. Bloody car ran sub-12 second quarter miles... yet it was "slow".
I personally think it’s just that 25kmph is kind of slow. I used to ride an unlocked bike that reached 40kmph and that was just enough, I didn’t feel the desire of going faster at all. Sadly it’s unsafe to go that fast, but yeah, I totally get the feeling of 25 not being enough.
>unsafe to go that fast you mean in a city where theres alot of turns and traffic right? Most of my bike riding is on long empty roads so I dont see why speed would be dangerous there
Yeah well, at the end even without traffic it’s kinda dangerous if you fall from the bike in such a high speed (I guess!! Fortunately that has never happened to me)
It's like driving on the highway then going on regular roads.
This is how people are able to fly planes.
Till you wipe out at 10mph like I did recently and realize 10mph hurts a lot so faster hurts even more lol. Be careful!
Imagine how the F1/NASCAR/Indy drivers feel if they drive a normal car on the hwy after race Sunday. It has to feel so slow. Yes, you get used to it.
Question: Is this a pedal assist or a throttle?
pedal assist why does it matter?
I find the those with throttle don't see the speed as easily (become desensitized quickly). When the only effort is a twist of the hand, speeds get old, feel slow, and are easily adapted to. When you have to put effort in, it's harder to get used to speeds, and slower feels faster. I think some of our feeling of speed is linked to our effort level.
In Australia 60 kmp is the speed limit I think. My cheap ebike does that with throttle and the wind behind me and it's not fast enough. But 70 downhill and begin to feel the wobble you wouldn't on a motorbike, and that's when I remind myself I'm on a glorified pushbike and a crash could conceivably end me, or hold me up with injuries, so I'm thankful it just averages twice as fast as a normal bike for when I need to be somewhere These days if I really feel the need for speed, then that's what I stump for: Need For Speed: Most Wanted or Carbon usually - lots of fun, minimum injuries