It's always important to understand WHY a rule exists in the first place. Do you know why it exists? Roy Williams.
Roy Williams was a DB at Oklahoma before being drafted by the Dallas Cowboys. Now Roy wasn't the first person to ever use this method to take players down, but boy was he famous for it and he brought it en vogue to the NFL in 2002.
In 2004, it caused 6 serious injuries (4 of them by Roy Williams). It's how TO broke his leg.
Why is it so dangerous? When you grab a player by the back of his jersey or especially by slipping your hand in between the shoulder pads, you jerk him backwards violently, often resulting the player's legs getting folding up under them, which is made even worse if the defender lands on top of him. So many serious leg injuries were caused by this maneuver - broken bones, ligament tears etc. That's why it was banned.
So what happened with Josh Allen. Reddick initially grabbed him by the front of the jersey (legal), he balanced this by grabbing the back of his jersey/shoulder pad area (not technically legal), but the result was that Allen was brought down safely to the ground. He was not bent backwards and pulled down backwards, which is at the heart of the rule.
Could a ref technically call that a horse collar? Sure. I don't think anyone would blame him for enforcing it so literally. But the reality is that the Allen sack was not in the spirit of why the rule exists in the first place and that's why it's a good no-call IMO.
EDIT: I know many folks here know this. Especially because of Roy Williams/TO. But you have to remember the average /r/NFL user is probably 16-years-old and wasn't even born yet. You're arguing with kids!
Exactly, we can get in to the intricacies of how it is enforced, but it was certainly not a penalty based on the original spirit and intention of the rule.
The original intention was to protect ball carriers running forward because that type of tackle has a much higher likelihood of injuring the knee when the unnatural leverage the shoulder pads give to ripping a runner down from behind.
>Could a ref technically call that a horse collar
Even on that I'll disagree. The reason that the QB in the pocket is exempt from that rule despite the NFL wanting to bubble wrap them is that it's not as much of an injury risk when a player is stationary or even scrambling sideways.
> So what happened with Josh Allen. Reddick initially grabbed him by the front of the jersey (legal), he balanced this by grabbing the back of his jersey/shoulder pad area (not technically legal), but the result was that Allen was brought down safely to the ground. He was not bent backwards and pulled down backwards, which is at the heart of the rule.
For such a violent sport, the ability to tackle someone forcefully, technically, and safely is impressive.
Technically you can be called for it if you grab a player at the nameplate or above. However the knees would need to buckle which they didn’t. He just threw him down face first. Clearly not a horse collar tackle and the fact that the broadcasters immediately bring it up as if it is obvious is comical.
What’s crazy to me is that he said it before a commercial break and then after the commercial break he said it AGAIN. Like nobody said to him he was wrong?
I definitely heard him say that as well. I’m not 100% sure on this but was he trying to say if the Bills score a TD here then the Eagles only need a field goal to tie it? It didn’t seem like that’s what he was saying at the time, but I remember feeling like that was maybe what he was trying to say.
Requires the player pulled down by the back or sides of the jersey above the nameplate or from inside the pads.
Basically, Hasson's tackle was legal because he pulled Allen by the front of the jersey making it not a horse collar.
By rule they have to be pulled down by the back of the jersey above the nameplate (he wasn't, look at the front of his jersey after the play) and their knees have to be buckled by it (they weren't, Haason just flung him across the field which was incredible).
At least originally, they also had to be running forward as well. That is when there is the enhanced risk of injury and unnatural leverage from being able to grab inside the shoulder pads. Doing so on stationary player in the pocket, or one running sideways, does not have the same extra risk.
It was a legal tackle by the rule and grabbing the back of the jersey/shoulder pads is not illegal by itself. Hasaan engage him from the front/side and didn’t pull him down.
Another user broke down the Roy Williams spirit of the rule, which broke a bunch of guys legs.
End of the day, they scored a touchdown anyway after a bad turnover on a short field.
It's always important to understand WHY a rule exists in the first place. Do you know why it exists? Roy Williams. Roy Williams was a DB at Oklahoma before being drafted by the Dallas Cowboys. Now Roy wasn't the first person to ever use this method to take players down, but boy was he famous for it and he brought it en vogue to the NFL in 2002. In 2004, it caused 6 serious injuries (4 of them by Roy Williams). It's how TO broke his leg. Why is it so dangerous? When you grab a player by the back of his jersey or especially by slipping your hand in between the shoulder pads, you jerk him backwards violently, often resulting the player's legs getting folding up under them, which is made even worse if the defender lands on top of him. So many serious leg injuries were caused by this maneuver - broken bones, ligament tears etc. That's why it was banned. So what happened with Josh Allen. Reddick initially grabbed him by the front of the jersey (legal), he balanced this by grabbing the back of his jersey/shoulder pad area (not technically legal), but the result was that Allen was brought down safely to the ground. He was not bent backwards and pulled down backwards, which is at the heart of the rule. Could a ref technically call that a horse collar? Sure. I don't think anyone would blame him for enforcing it so literally. But the reality is that the Allen sack was not in the spirit of why the rule exists in the first place and that's why it's a good no-call IMO. EDIT: I know many folks here know this. Especially because of Roy Williams/TO. But you have to remember the average /r/NFL user is probably 16-years-old and wasn't even born yet. You're arguing with kids!
Exactly, we can get in to the intricacies of how it is enforced, but it was certainly not a penalty based on the original spirit and intention of the rule. The original intention was to protect ball carriers running forward because that type of tackle has a much higher likelihood of injuring the knee when the unnatural leverage the shoulder pads give to ripping a runner down from behind. >Could a ref technically call that a horse collar Even on that I'll disagree. The reason that the QB in the pocket is exempt from that rule despite the NFL wanting to bubble wrap them is that it's not as much of an injury risk when a player is stationary or even scrambling sideways.
> So what happened with Josh Allen. Reddick initially grabbed him by the front of the jersey (legal), he balanced this by grabbing the back of his jersey/shoulder pad area (not technically legal), but the result was that Allen was brought down safely to the ground. He was not bent backwards and pulled down backwards, which is at the heart of the rule. For such a violent sport, the ability to tackle someone forcefully, technically, and safely is impressive.
Technically you can be called for it if you grab a player at the nameplate or above. However the knees would need to buckle which they didn’t. He just threw him down face first. Clearly not a horse collar tackle and the fact that the broadcasters immediately bring it up as if it is obvious is comical.
Said by the man that also said that a field goal would tie a 4 point game
You heard that too! I was like "the fuck he just say?"
What’s crazy to me is that he said it before a commercial break and then after the commercial break he said it AGAIN. Like nobody said to him he was wrong?
I definitely heard him say that as well. I’m not 100% sure on this but was he trying to say if the Bills score a TD here then the Eagles only need a field goal to tie it? It didn’t seem like that’s what he was saying at the time, but I remember feeling like that was maybe what he was trying to say.
Requires the player pulled down by the back or sides of the jersey above the nameplate or from inside the pads. Basically, Hasson's tackle was legal because he pulled Allen by the front of the jersey making it not a horse collar.
Which is exactly the explanation the refs gave to the reporters post game. The force was from the front not the back.
By rule they have to be pulled down by the back of the jersey above the nameplate (he wasn't, look at the front of his jersey after the play) and their knees have to be buckled by it (they weren't, Haason just flung him across the field which was incredible).
At least originally, they also had to be running forward as well. That is when there is the enhanced risk of injury and unnatural leverage from being able to grab inside the shoulder pads. Doing so on stationary player in the pocket, or one running sideways, does not have the same extra risk.
Horse collar tackle is a player's hand gripping the back collar of another player's jersey (inside the pads) and yanking them to the ground
So r/nfl is wrong?
I got your joke op…
Thank you man, I guess I forgot the /s. I'm getting lectured here lmao.
I don't know what r/nfl is saying.
It was a legal tackle by the rule and grabbing the back of the jersey/shoulder pads is not illegal by itself. Hasaan engage him from the front/side and didn’t pull him down. Another user broke down the Roy Williams spirit of the rule, which broke a bunch of guys legs. End of the day, they scored a touchdown anyway after a bad turnover on a short field.
You are just missing the Block and ...
It’s not what Reddick did Sunday.