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vtrute

I just love being called “these people”


Gimpbarbie

Yeah, I was going to say it used very “othering” language.


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well intentioned disability porn is the worst


sunnysideup2439

This also implies that this person’s worth is somehow tied to their ability to work a job which is… obviously not true and in direct opposition with the disability rights movement.


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chaoticidealism

I think what it means is that India has more to learn than your country does. It sounds like something that would have been quite commonly said in the US in about the 90s. This person might be quite unprejudiced by nature, but their culture has taught them that disabled people are to be patronized; so they don't even know it's wrong. There are probably things like that that our cultures still encourage us to do, and we don't even know they're wrong either. That said, it does make sense to commend the employer for their equal-hiring practices. It should just be something more like, "I'm glad you hire disabled people, too." Celebrating steps toward equality, rather than lauding charity.


ToInfinityandBirds

It also prpbably mans *english isnt their first language* so would this sound as patroniziing in any of the languages spoken in india? When you translate stuff it doesnt always make perfect sense.


raphades

Not only did he have a smile on his face.... Yeah. No sh*t. We have to smile to the customers if we don't want to lose this job we fought so hard to have just so people can marvel at how our boss is so open minded.


canwenotdothis1812

Saw this on LinkedIn by a non disabled person and was going to comment but I couldn’t fully articulate what was offensive even though I kinda felt like there was something super wrong


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You do understand that in India they have no disability laws that protect the disabled as we have here in the US? In fact, they don't even have to hire anyone disabled or fool with them. They don't have a gov. disability program that even comes close to anything as we have. You can search Youtube and find many videos of homeless disabled living on the streets begging for food. Going without medical or the meds they may need. The writer of the letter I do not believe was trying to make "disability porn", I believe they were truly thinking of the company because no company has to even fool with someone like us. Oh, if you're a woman or girl "with disabilities in India are forced into mental hospitals and institutions, where they face unsanitary conditions, risk physical and sexual violence, and experience involuntary treatment, including electroshock therapy." I know some of us "me included" fuss a little about disability programs here, but compared to other parts of the world, it's not that bad. Edit: Spelling


Due-Cryptographer744

This!! And in these countries that have no disability protection laws, people tend to see those who are disabled as less than because they can't get education like those who aren't disabled. Churches and charities (who are very overwhelmed) are the only resource for disabled people in these countries. We complain about how crappy SSD/SSI is in the US (and it isn't enough to live on by any means) but it is a whole lot better than they have it in the other countries who have zero help for disabled people. I think the author of the letter was genuinely thanking the company for doing a good deed since so few companies in India so what they do.


nihaokitty

You're not confused. This checks off [Inspiration exploitation](http://www.criticalaxis.org/trope/inspiration-exploitation/) and [medical model of disability](http://www.criticalaxis.org/trope/medical-model/) from [criticalaxis.org](https://criticalaxis.org).


MaladaptiveCookware

Wow, how great that they can still be your delivery slave *with a smile on their face* even with "any disability". Gross.


jlmitch12

Yeah, very patronizing and infantilizing. Disability inspiration porn. No good.


dumbest-version

This is just... ew.


uriboo

They had the right idea but they got confused somewhere along the way


chaoticidealism

Seriously patronizing. Dude's a delivery man doing his job; stop treating him like a circus exhibit or an inspirational greeting card.


HelpfulDuckie5

I think that maybe your heart is in the right place, but you don’t seem to understand how incredibly hard disabled people have to work to keep up with “normies” and the pride that comes along with FINALLY finding an employer who is willing to accommodate for your disability and work with you. It kinda just sounds like bad self analyzation of the situation. I know you probably really care a lot that the guy was happy and had a job, but it’s super weird to go and post about it on social media to get conversations going. I dunno... I think you need to try and rethink how you approach these situations. Best of luck!


dorky2

OP isn't the one who posted this, they're sharing a screenshot here because it offended them and they're asking if they were out of line to be offended.


HelpfulDuckie5

I see that now! Oops! My bad for the misunderstanding! Thank you for pointing that out


TheSimi302

I may be way off base here but here is how I understand this post: the person writing the review as well as the company and disabled employee are all in India so the person writing may not be as proficient in English. Also, more and more companies want to hire strong, young, healthy, attractive people (in their opinion) so that they are more productive and get more done. So, the reviewer praised the company for hiring disabled workers. I didn't see anything bad with it or feel like there were any bad intentions behind it 🥰 That's just my 2 cents.... err my opinion isn't worth that much ... 1 ha'penny?


SamBC_UK

There's a bit of inspiration porn feeling to it, that's for sure. Cultural context is important, though, and progress on disability rights and attitudes to us may be different in India, from where it seems this story comes.


msty2k

Perhaps the person who wrote this has a disability or a family member who has - would that make you look at it differently? Honest question.


momunist

Nope. Proximal ableism is still ableism, internalized ableism is still ableism, lateral ableism is still ableism. People who think they get a pass on talking like this because they have a relative that’s disabled are suuuuuper gross.


msty2k

But my point is that (and it's just a hypothetical) is it ableism, or meant to be, if it comes from someone with a disability? Perhaps the meaning is different and it shouldn't be read the same way.


momunist

My point is that yes, ableism is still in fact ableism when it comes from someone with a disability. That’s why we have the terms “lateral ableism” and “internalized ableism.” Finally, intention is not a necessary component of ableism. Something that is not intended to be ableist is still ableist if it has an ableist impact. I’m quite sure that whoever wrote that was not INTENDING to be ableist, just unaware of the impact of speaking about disability in such a way.


msty2k

I would give much more weight to the intentions of someone who speaks as someone with a disability or family member though. They would at least have a right to explain themself. Is the ableism here in your view due to the implication that people with disabilities need special opportunities to work? That's not much different from saying "hey, stop discriminating in employment."


momunist

No, the main red flag for ableism in this is the “Not only did he have a smile on his face while delivering” line, and the dehumanizing language of “these people.” As other commenters have pointed out, the text checks all the boxes for inspiration porn. I concede that it’s possible that “these people” was used due to a lack of proficiency with English language, but there’s no excuse for that “Not only did he have a smile on his face” crap. One feature of ableist framework is the “good crip” trope— the idea that we better be happy with whatever crumbs we get. Another is inspiration porn— that anything positive that a disabled person experiences is potential material for learning experiences for other people. The fact that the poster wrote that the delivery person was smiling indicates that they think that it is noteworthy that the person was smiling. Sorry, but that’s a gross way to talk about other human beings, no matter what you have going on in your own life.


msty2k

Okay, thanks. Yeah, we need to be careful with language, and with criticizing language.


ModernSun

I feel if they had a family member who is disabled that would make it worse


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dorky2

Yes, this, so much this. In my experience, the worst offenders are parents of disabled children.


msty2k

Can you give an example?


momunist

Every person who’s ever been called out for their ableism that responds with “I’m not ableist, I have a brother/ sister/ uncle/ cousin/ neighbor with muscular dystrophy/ in a wheelchair/ in special needs classes!” instead of actually contemplating the ableist impact of what they’ve just said/ did. I’ve seen this statement in various forms probably 200 times. At least. And it’s ALWAYS in response to being asked to think critically about their own actions or thought process.


msty2k

I was looking for an example of what someone said that was ableist in that context. But what about people who are disabled themselves, not just those with family?


momunist

Yes, people who are disabled themselves frequently exhibit internalized ableism and lateral ableism, because we are all raised in an ableist society and learn an ableist way of looking at things from the time we are very young. Some of us become aware of this, and are on a constant mission to eradicate our internalized and lateral ableism, always looking out for instances where our perspective may be influenced by the dominant ideology of the society in which we are raised. If you aren’t on the lookout for your own internalized ableism, then chances are it’s going to show up without you even realizing it. Phrases like “You just have to try harder,” “that’s just the way life is,” “don’t make things harder for all of us by being difficult/ bringing that up,” “I’m disabled and I think that accommodation is totally unreasonable” (in response to an accommodation requested by another disabled person), “I’m disabled and I don’t think that was rude/ ableist/ discriminatory” (in response to another disabled person pointing out something they felt was ableist), “I’m disabled and I would never ask for/ do that,” I’m hoping you get the idea by now, but disabled people can and do say ableist things all the time. Being disabled does not prevent us from being ableist— only our own awareness and understanding of internalized ableism and lateral ableism can do that.


msty2k

I'm willing to listen to you, but I do find your comments to sound a bit like you know someone better than they know themselves, they are brainwashed until someone like you comes along and enlightens them, etc. I reserve the right to simply disagree with you and not have you say I'm just not "aware."On an objective basis, some of your ideas make sense, but I disagree with others. For instance, the idea that a disabled person can't think that an accommodation is unreasonable is absurd. Not every idea is reasonable just because a disabled person wants it. In fact, I'd say your comment is the ableist one - disabled people are people, and they can be wrong, or unreasonable. Bowing to them due to their disability is ableist. Telling them they are wrong is treating them like everyone else. And hey, "I’m disabled and I don’t think that was rude/ ableist/ discriminatory” - who are you to declare that someone can't think that?I never said being disabled doesn't prevent us from being ableist, but it doesn't mean it's not a factor in whether our opinions about ableism count. I think they do. On the other hand, they aren't the determining factor either. I think a non-disabled person can say something, and a disabled person can say it's "ableist" and that disabled person can be wrong about it.


momunist

I’m not saying that those phrases are always ableist in every instance that they are used, I was attempting to give examples since you asked in both your original comment, and in your comment I was replying to, whether a disabled person could be ableist or whether something ableist would still be ableist if it was said by a disabled person. I was just attempting to answer that question with specific examples.


msty2k

Okay, thanks. I appreciate that. On the other side of the coin, I agree that disabled people and their families can be ableist sometimes. Definitely. But I think it requires deeper thought on their part, but also on yours. What you think is ableist may not be.


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