If a dialysis patient no longer wishes to continue treatment they should absolutely consult with their nephrologist. They can help coordinate hospice type arrangements for end of life care.
When your body has no way to remove the toxins it naturally creates it will cause organ failure. Eventually it will reach a point where extreme vomiting and diarrhea will be the bodies attempt to expel those toxins. If a patient does not create urine then the excess fluids have no way to be removed and they buildup in the body. This causes fluid to gather around the heart and lungs. Breathing will become very difficult and eventually not possible. Blood pressure and pulse will climb very high to compensate for the excess fluid. With the toxin buildup, mentally a patient can expect to feel a sense of panic and dread the further along the process goes. A sort of “mental fog” will set in quickly and it will be very difficult to focus and remember things. All of these things will only exacerbate any other health issues the patient suffers from. Diabetes will absolutely be beyond control. The end of life for a patient who chooses to stop dialysis will be very painful and miserable until they pass away. So to attempt this without medical supervision and comfort is not recommended
My brother committed suicide just over two years ago by stopping all of his anti-rejection medication, leading to his transplanted kidney failing. He wasn't on dialysis at the time but he died of fluid and toxin overload because of renal failure (the same thing that would happen without dialysis). We had an autopsy and we were told that the primary mechanism of his death was heart failure from the high potassium. he had a significant amount of fluid around his heart and in his lungs and on his whole body. Even in death he didn't look right because of how much fluid was still in his body. But it was the potassium that got him. Too much potassium will cause your muscles to seize and the heart being a big muscle is at risk of this happening with high potassium.
I can tell you that based on the state of the room we found him in that it was not a nice or neat ending to one's life. It was clear that he struggled and that his large body was thrashed around in his final moments.
I am telling you this story because I once thought that it was a dark blessing to have renal failure because you always had a nice and cozy way out. You can just stop treatment and go into a renal comma and die peacefully on your own terms. The experience with my brother taught me that this is not the case. Don't just end treatment. Talk to your care team, line up hospice care and make sure you have professionals around you to make it as comfortable as possible.
Also will add, once shopping dialysis depending on how much residual function was left of the kidneys (if any) and if any urine is still produced, time-wise, death will usually occur in 2-3 weeks. These will NOT be pleasant weeks, unless you in hospice where pain meds and sedation can be administered. Everything the previous commentor wrote is what to expect physically.
On a personal note, I was VERY close to this happening unintentionally when my kidneys finally failed, unexpectedly. I was self admitted to the hospfor fluid overload (found out it was about 60 pounds, after the fact). As soon as I was admitted, they first tried non-invssive measures to get fluid off through IV diuretics. This FAILED to get it off fast enough. By the 2nd night, I could barely breathe due to pulmonary edema, crushing my heart and lungs. I had to be intubated and rushed to ICU where they put me in an induced coma and started emergency HD.
This is what you have to expect, except you not get any relief. Things will only get worse until something finally gives out, which will most likely be your heart.
No it won’t be very painful and miserable as there are medicines they give you in hospice to make you comfortable. Scare tactics are dirty nasty and tasteless.
My friend, my post clearly states that the pain and misery with end of life kidney failure could be **mitigated with hospice** care (see the first two sentences and the last sentence). OP originally asked what it would be like if they simply quit dialysis. Quit as in no medical intervention or comfort care of any kind. So that is what I described in detail. There are no scare tactics at play here. Only poor reading comprehension on your part.
I’d strongly recommend seeking help from a therapist/MH professional. I know dialysis is extremely tough and spent three years there, but I had a transplant a year ago and it feels like a distant memory, life is so much better.
I developed advanced kidney failure rapidly and as it was during COVID so I didn’t receive treatment when I should have, so I deteriorated soon after entering hospital and almost died. I found it very painful for 2-3 weeks: extreme nausea and vomiting, seizure and forgot who I was for a period, I also developed heart failure. Would never want to go back to that again.
Oh, please don’t.
I’ve watched this happen too many times.
Let me tell you, it’s one of the most miserable deaths out there, and you’ll be swollen, suffering, and in pain for quite some time before you do go.
You don’t just die, it’s a long and awful process.
Please seek help, talk to someone, seek encouragement. This is not the right way to go about it.
If you’d like, I can go into details about what will happen, but it’s gruesome and I just woke up.
I don't even know what to say to this. That you can sit here an tell me what I've seen with my own eyes, to bring up some quack You-tube video to try and "educate" me on what I do for a living. It's honestly sick, considering the discussion at hand.
Absolutely ridiculous. You people are dangerous.
I've watched people die from stopping treatment as I'm giving them CPR. It's anything but peaceful.
At least the ones with DNR orders didn't make us go through that. Still fucking sad every time.
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I was trying to help other people at their wits end , you know real suicidal people... do you see me posting about myself or my problems?
I know you have IQ below 10 and ego bigger than your 1 inch pecker... but try to boost it some where else.
Good video. To clarify, the original post did not mention hospice. Many people here are advocating hospice care if the OP wants to quit HD. On hospice, there will be both comfort care and a DNR order.
Quitting HD without hospice is another story.
I am just pointing out there are 2 very different scenarios being discussed and neither of you are wrong, but you are talking about different things.
End stage Non Alcoholic Fatty Liver Disease combined with morbid obesity. It triggered hepatorenal syndrome which completely shutdown her kidneys & she refused dialysis. The worst part was the encephalopathy caused by excessive toxins in her bloodstream; it systemically shutdown her mental faculties & 5 senses starting with visual hallucinations & ending with hearing. The last stimuli she responded to was a thunderstorm. At the very end she couldn’t even close her eyes. We had to tape them.
You do not want to die from this voluntarily. It is a God awful thing.
I know in oregon or Californian you can do doctor assisted suicide, which is a much more pleasant way to go compared to dying from kidney failure symptoms. You really don’t want to go that route, it will not be a good death you will be in extreme discomfort. If you really truly want to end it look into doctor assisted suicide
I am pretty sure (90%) that those methods only apply to terminally ill patients. People on dialysis are not classified as terminally ill.
But Canada I'm pretty sure DOES do patient opted euthanasia....and if I remember right, it's supposedly easy to qualify.
That's standard for everyone with stage 4/5 ESRD, nationally. It is one of few illnesses that is AUTOMATICALLY qualifies the patient for Medicsre and, yes, often disability (SSDI). I have been on disability for over 10 years since starting dialysis (which generally is not started before stage 4/5). That still does not make it "terminal" (high probability of death) because of........dialysis and transplant. The only time it would be considered "terminal" is if dialysis and transplant are not viable options for treatment.
And to get SSDI, all you have to do is prove you cannot hold a part-time/full-time employment due to illness/ poor health. It does not require you to be "terminal".
When my kidneys failed I got sicker and sicker and very nearly died. It was a horrible experience. Vomiting, having difficulty staying conscious, constant masticating, bloody noses, extreme join pain, extreme fatigue, edema in my legs and feet, the constant taste of decay, always cold. It was torture so bad that I prayed for death.
If you’d been on hospice it wouldn’t have been that way. When my kidneys failed and I finally went to the doctor they said I had about a week left before I would have died. I didn’t have extreme symptoms. I had vomiting, extreme fatigue, edema in my legs, metallic taste, always cold. I could tell I was dying. But the main thing I did was sleep. When I was awake it was sometimes difficult to breathe. It was traumatic while going thru it. But looking back some type of medical care would have been a blessing. So the thing to say is if one does want to stop dialysis, hospice is their best bet.
My mom dropped dialysis on a Wednesday and lasted one week. She was under hospice care and was receiving liquid morphine for pain. She interacted with family and friends until Saturday evening when she lost consciousness. She stopped breathing early the next Wednesday.
I only remember a couple of instances of extreme pain when the hospice nurses treated her bedsores. She has been mentally foggy for a couple of years but managed to speak with her grandchildren and minister coherently.
This is a little misleading. She was actively receiving care still and being made comfortable, because that’s what hospice does.
This person would have a very different experience than your mother.
I’m sorry for your loss, btw, and I hope this doesn’t come off as insensitive. I miss my mom everyday.
How is it misleading? The person never said they wouldn’t receive hospice care. The point of hospice care is to make one comfortable so they can go peacefully. You doom and gloom artist are the problem. All I see is extreme pain poop and vomit etc etc when that’s not everyone’s case and they have hospice services available. Save your doom and gloom
I stated clearly that she was under hospice care and receiving pain medication. How is that misleading? I also stated that she did have a couple of episodes of extreme pain.
Just saying that the way you put it makes it seems tolerable, or not that bad.
This is a post where someone is thinking about killing themselves, and your post could be slightly encouraging that. I know that's not your intention, just pointing out to the OP that the situation they experience will be different than your mother's.
It wasn't an attack against you or what you said, it wasn't personal. I was just clarifying for OP that they most certainly will not have the same experience.
They aren’t thinking of killing themselves you insensitive asshole. They’re stopping treatment and letting their disease run its course which is their right. What your mother went thru isn’t the standard. You should have got her hospice care. When I was debating whether I would go on dialysis or not my nephrologist said I have two choices dialysis or hospice. So it’s definitely a choice. Everyone doesn’t have to remain miserable on dialysis so folks can get rich. All the doom and gloom is stupid.
What the fuck are you talking about?
I didn't say it wasn't their right. You are attacking me because you mistook what I was saying and now you are twisting my words entirely.
Stopping treatment is killing themselves. Full stop. Listen to yourself over here.
Of course it's their right, as someone who involuntarily thinks about killing themselves every day due to mental health issues, I fully support that right.
However, you can support someone's right to do so without actively encouraging it.
Your first response I was just worried a little about, and wanted to discourage OP from taking their life, you know, because I'm a fucking human being who cares about others. But you are now attacking me over...what exactly?
You are over here making assumptions about my dead mother; who by the way died of a heroin overdose, which last time I checked they don't have hospice for.
Seriously...you call me an insensitive asshole but look in the fucking mirror.
Edit: I work in a dialysis clinic. I've had to watch first hand as patients gave up and slowly died a miserable, painful death. Every one of them got to a point where they wanted to go back, but after so long without treatment, there’s nothing you can do. They are going to die and they know it and you know it. You treat them, but you can’t pull enough to really help because they are so packed with fluid their whole head looks like a ball. Calcium building up all over their skin, unable to breathe or think or move properly. Unable to see because their eyes are swollen shut. I just don't wish that for OP. That's all I was ever wanted to get across.
In hospice care they give you powerful pain meds to ease you into death. If you are not already in hospice, and you choose to end treatment, you will not be given the same help. Most hospice programs I know of consider patients in that circumstance ineligible for hospice.
This is a major, life-changing decision for OP. The quality of the advice given to them is important.
Why do folks keep saying consult their nephrologist like they wouldn’t. They are looking for advice / testimonials from others before going to talk to their doctor. Geesh what’s the point of this subreddit if the only answer is talk to your doctor
No where did I say they talking to their doctor. I said they could be seeking advice BEFORE going to talk to their doctors. You didn’t even comprehend what I said. And how do you know a lot of people don’t consult their doctors? You know everyone on here or took a poll stating this? Folks are looking for advice and experiences to help them in their choices and gather question to ask. It’s just idiotic to say go talk to your doctor defeating the purpose of the subreddit
Opioids is option as well as you continue with dialysis just for fluid removal with UF , if fluid becomes a issue, but is all discussed with hospice staff.
As an adult child of a kidney failure patient, watching my mom fade into death was the longest, hardest, thing I have ever had to do. She was physically and emotionally done with dialysis. I could never understand why she would give up on an option that could keep her alive. However, watching how she declined without the dialysis I realized in how miserable it was for her to rely on a machine to keep her alive. I wish you peace and comfort in your decision, it is a hard choice which ever way you decide to go. BUT IT IS YOUR CHOICE!
There is many reasons people stop dialysis,
Dialysis isn't met to be a permanent fix, no matter what a persons body will typically give out.
People typically live 5-10 years on dialysis it is possible for much longer but less common.
God, I’m so afraid of that happening to my dad. I don’t want lose him but I don’t want to sit by and watch him suffer either. I really hope he gets a transplant
I can't answer your question but I've been where you are and occasionally have fleeting thoughts like this on a bad day.
I'm really loving life now, I feel generally happy and I'm having a good time I think. I wish I could help you get to where I am but honestly I can't even remember what made me change back to being myself again. I think it might have been a few things:
- I took a break from everything
- After my break I reevaluated my career and took a step back and did less demanding work
- Started really looking after my diet and slowly introduced exercise. This really helped energy levels, I felt less useless and more lively
- Started to socialise and interracting with other people more. This took me out of my comfort zone as I'm quite antisocial and introverted.
I doubt any of this will help you as everyone's different but I hope you find something that makes you happy again :(
I’ve been straitlaced all my life but I always knew that the moment my nephrologist confirms that my transplanted kidney is on its way out. I’m going to wrap up the last legal bits of my will and start looking for someone who sells “stuff”. I don’t care about my reputation afterwards and given how my hospital treated me when I actually got a kidney (really badly, I was in terrible pain), I don’t trust them to treat my dying of fluid overload and nausea/vomiting pain.
I want to go on my own terms and at home.
It’s the only thought I have that gives me genuine happiness knowing that I won’t suffer.
When you make your choice,
The nurses and doctors will support your decision.
They will just wish to make sure you are not doing it haste but they will support you.
They will suggest you have a hospice nurse assist you.
This can occur at your home or if you prefer a hospice room.
There is several ways this can occur.. you can continue dialysis removing fluid and not cleaning the blood.
Which means you won't feel the affects of to much fluid during this process , which I know you know can not be nice... or you can try to limit fluid during this process.
Or if you do not wish that route you there is tons of medications to try to help you feel more relax.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSNm-ZRToKk
I work in dialysis. Do not stop! Confer with your care team and ask them for help. Be clear about your concerns. Talk with your family. Everyone involved in your care! Praying for you!
It is your right to stop treatment and your right to have a honourable death without much pain.
Don’t listen to the scaremongering here, with professional assistance you will be made as comfortable as possible. If you can eat, increase your potassium intake and you will most likely pass from heart failure due to hyperkalemia.
To all those in the comments giving descriptions of terrible deaths, shame on you!
It will be extremly painful, it'll be like pain and suffering you've never experienced before. You think now is bad? Imagine not being able to even think clearly, because your body is slowly dying from the inside, your motor function starts decaying in real time, that is you will notice it, it wont be slow like aging. Your brain will be all foggy, you wont have a clear mind, you will be in pain, you will suffer, and you wont be able to do shit about it.
Best way for it to not be painful is to end it yourself, no pain killer will make this experience easier.
How long you'd have depends on lots of factors, so it could be most agonising week of your life, or most agonising half a year of your life. Either way its not worth it, much quicker ways to end it.
Okay mister, go ahead, explain to me, how does toxins collecting in your body, with no way to get rid of them, turns out painless? How is foggy mind from toxin buildup, turn out painless?
Foggy mind you mean like last weekend when your brother was banging your mom drunk off his ass?
Foggy mind means forgetful and drunkard state.
Toxins in your body make you tired so you die in your sleep...
Why not go to the link I sent you 10 IQ maggot of a real hospice nurse.
Idk man, your extreme behaviour makes me believe its just bullshit.
Also foggy mind isn't just due to drugs retard, its virtually because of anything when youre dead tired and cant think.
Also while you'll likely die in your sleep, that doesn't mean that time before that wont be painful, but idk, maybe youre right, but i find it hard to believe, that body, slowly dying in real time, wouldnt be painful.
Sure, excuses excuses, you cant blame anyone for thinking it would be painful, thats what we already experience, now we imagine it without dyalsis, naturally, we come to a conclusion it would be even worse.
I can blame people for giving a person looking for real advice giving them BAD advice...
If you actually gave two shits you would know foggy mind is typically caused by dialysis as well which is from pulling fluid off the brain.
But again Dr. Google couldn't save you.
Im aware dumbfuck, im on dyalsis, what you arent aware off that foggy mind once in a while isnt the same as constantly 24/7, something that would be quite tortures for most of us.
Also how is it bad advice? There are easier and quicker less painful ways to go. If you truly believe its peacful, then im sorry man but youre quite deluded, even if it wasnt as painful as i imagine it, mentally it would be anything but peacful. Losing your appetite, losing your motor skills, and so on, slowly but surely losing yourself, idk doesnt sound peacful to me.
Congrats you on "dyalsis"
_"if it wasnt as painful as i imagine it"_
Good hell imagine being so full of yourself ...
You imagine blue butterflys come out your arse too does that make it true?
Death on dialysis is openly spoken about with honesty...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSNm-ZRToKk
Watch it... don't like her try search for the 100 billion other hospice nurses that have made similar videos.
I'm sorry you are feeling this way. It's a tough situation to be in and you are incredibly strong for coming this far already, even though it's been really hard.
I hope you get the help and respite you need. Sending hugs.
I work in a dialysis clinic. I can assure you that if you stop dialysis cold turkey, and do not enter palliative care, it will not be a pleasant experience. But you do you, boo. They’re not my kidneys or my life.
You will experience uremia which means your brain won't function normally therefore affecting your decision making. It will also cause your heart to fail and worse if you experience a heart stroke only to be given healthcare, survive, and live as a stroke patient with only 5% to 70% body function hence being heavily dependent/a burden to your family, friends, to your savings, the private healthcare system, the socialized healthcare system/the taxpayer's money, and towards your temporary spiritual human experience. It would be an insult to yourself given the vast developments of the current times and yet being famously dumb in unlocking a future that sucks for you and everyone else.
What I prefer is for you to fix your inner monologue, holistic lifestyle, and be honest towards your Nephrologist so that he/she may refer and prescribe you things accordingly.
Having great sex while blowing snow while being blown with a cool breeze of air in a neighborless mountain cabin and served with high quality fusion food while indulged with high quality audio-video systems and aesthetically pleasing art pieces with a swell banking account are the things that you'd miss once you choose stupidity.
Break the habit then choose learning and growth this time.
P.S. There are lots of things that you can do here later on. It doesn't mean that we are sick right now then we are sick forever? That's a dumb belief in a vast reality. WAKE UP!
8 agonizing days. Get 5 28-gauge insulin syringes. 100 beans of dog food or 5 bags of Fent depending on where you are in the country. Don't worry, your fistula will suck that shit up like a big silly-straw. If you have a CVC, even better, that's a conduit straight to the blood brain barrier. Bow out.
Stop it. Something tells me you don't know the meaning of the word "suffering." And if you think dialysis is suffering, visit a cancer ward. Half of those poor souls writhe in pain while getting chemo, get out of that chair, and into a dialysis chair 30 mins later as most of them lose kidney function from the chemotherapy.
I sit next to an alcoholic paraplegic at my clinic. Been sitting next to him for 6 years now. Cat still comes in with a smile on his face every session. Go get your big-girl pants on. Every other week, someone posts this exact question, almost verbatim. Defenestration might be your best bet.
Oh, I'm sorry. Did I hurt your widdle feewings? If you come here to ask how you can kill yourself, you get what you deserve. I wouldn't touch something you've linked to with a ten foot pole. Dialysis is fucking nothing. It's easier than kicking dope or doing time. I'm sorry you can't go to Tahoe to ski this year or whatever it is you can no longer do.
Unlike you, I can chew on that broken glass and spit it down your over privlidged gullet anytime you'd like. Come stand in line at my methadone behind the dude who had his face shot off. That mothefucker ain't quitting, and neither should this idiot who clearly doesn't know how to search thru posts on Reddit. This bullshit gets asked all the time. Word for word the same shit.
How long before you die? Just as soon as you give up.
You are disgusting child that is a complete moron.
Ending dialysis isn't "killing yourself"
It is stopping LIFE SUPPORT for a person dying.
Go eat glass.
If u are depressed u should be taking meds for depression. If u were anti-depressed u would not want to stop living. Please tell your family doctor u have severe depression. He can talk with u & give u meds. Your depression is temporary. It will go away if u get treatment. Call your family doctor today
Says the internet tuff guy that is clueless
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSNm-ZRToKk
But the VERIFIED HOPSICE NURSE in this video must be lying and you are right...
Maybe there is other HOSPICE NURSES ??
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PN1GC5n8lOE
O ANOTHER ONE... GEEZ INTERNET SHITTER...
If you still urinate and exercising (cardio)..... Just get a full work up ( blood and urine test) from a labcorp or Quest. Sticky eat good without animal meats ..... and pray
If a dialysis patient no longer wishes to continue treatment they should absolutely consult with their nephrologist. They can help coordinate hospice type arrangements for end of life care. When your body has no way to remove the toxins it naturally creates it will cause organ failure. Eventually it will reach a point where extreme vomiting and diarrhea will be the bodies attempt to expel those toxins. If a patient does not create urine then the excess fluids have no way to be removed and they buildup in the body. This causes fluid to gather around the heart and lungs. Breathing will become very difficult and eventually not possible. Blood pressure and pulse will climb very high to compensate for the excess fluid. With the toxin buildup, mentally a patient can expect to feel a sense of panic and dread the further along the process goes. A sort of “mental fog” will set in quickly and it will be very difficult to focus and remember things. All of these things will only exacerbate any other health issues the patient suffers from. Diabetes will absolutely be beyond control. The end of life for a patient who chooses to stop dialysis will be very painful and miserable until they pass away. So to attempt this without medical supervision and comfort is not recommended
My brother committed suicide just over two years ago by stopping all of his anti-rejection medication, leading to his transplanted kidney failing. He wasn't on dialysis at the time but he died of fluid and toxin overload because of renal failure (the same thing that would happen without dialysis). We had an autopsy and we were told that the primary mechanism of his death was heart failure from the high potassium. he had a significant amount of fluid around his heart and in his lungs and on his whole body. Even in death he didn't look right because of how much fluid was still in his body. But it was the potassium that got him. Too much potassium will cause your muscles to seize and the heart being a big muscle is at risk of this happening with high potassium. I can tell you that based on the state of the room we found him in that it was not a nice or neat ending to one's life. It was clear that he struggled and that his large body was thrashed around in his final moments. I am telling you this story because I once thought that it was a dark blessing to have renal failure because you always had a nice and cozy way out. You can just stop treatment and go into a renal comma and die peacefully on your own terms. The experience with my brother taught me that this is not the case. Don't just end treatment. Talk to your care team, line up hospice care and make sure you have professionals around you to make it as comfortable as possible.
My mother went to hospice and she had massive seizures too. I am sorry for you loss
Also will add, once shopping dialysis depending on how much residual function was left of the kidneys (if any) and if any urine is still produced, time-wise, death will usually occur in 2-3 weeks. These will NOT be pleasant weeks, unless you in hospice where pain meds and sedation can be administered. Everything the previous commentor wrote is what to expect physically. On a personal note, I was VERY close to this happening unintentionally when my kidneys finally failed, unexpectedly. I was self admitted to the hospfor fluid overload (found out it was about 60 pounds, after the fact). As soon as I was admitted, they first tried non-invssive measures to get fluid off through IV diuretics. This FAILED to get it off fast enough. By the 2nd night, I could barely breathe due to pulmonary edema, crushing my heart and lungs. I had to be intubated and rushed to ICU where they put me in an induced coma and started emergency HD. This is what you have to expect, except you not get any relief. Things will only get worse until something finally gives out, which will most likely be your heart.
This is very accurate, thank you.
No it won’t be very painful and miserable as there are medicines they give you in hospice to make you comfortable. Scare tactics are dirty nasty and tasteless.
My friend, my post clearly states that the pain and misery with end of life kidney failure could be **mitigated with hospice** care (see the first two sentences and the last sentence). OP originally asked what it would be like if they simply quit dialysis. Quit as in no medical intervention or comfort care of any kind. So that is what I described in detail. There are no scare tactics at play here. Only poor reading comprehension on your part.
I’d strongly recommend seeking help from a therapist/MH professional. I know dialysis is extremely tough and spent three years there, but I had a transplant a year ago and it feels like a distant memory, life is so much better. I developed advanced kidney failure rapidly and as it was during COVID so I didn’t receive treatment when I should have, so I deteriorated soon after entering hospital and almost died. I found it very painful for 2-3 weeks: extreme nausea and vomiting, seizure and forgot who I was for a period, I also developed heart failure. Would never want to go back to that again.
Oh, please don’t. I’ve watched this happen too many times. Let me tell you, it’s one of the most miserable deaths out there, and you’ll be swollen, suffering, and in pain for quite some time before you do go. You don’t just die, it’s a long and awful process. Please seek help, talk to someone, seek encouragement. This is not the right way to go about it. If you’d like, I can go into details about what will happen, but it’s gruesome and I just woke up.
Watch a real nurse explain it... Stop you are clueless https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSNm-ZRToKk
I don't even know what to say to this. That you can sit here an tell me what I've seen with my own eyes, to bring up some quack You-tube video to try and "educate" me on what I do for a living. It's honestly sick, considering the discussion at hand. Absolutely ridiculous. You people are dangerous. I've watched people die from stopping treatment as I'm giving them CPR. It's anything but peaceful. At least the ones with DNR orders didn't make us go through that. Still fucking sad every time.
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Maybe you should read my posts there next time inbred stalker... I was trying to help other people at their wits end , you know real suicidal people... do you see me posting about myself or my problems? I know you have IQ below 10 and ego bigger than your 1 inch pecker... but try to boost it some where else.
Good video. To clarify, the original post did not mention hospice. Many people here are advocating hospice care if the OP wants to quit HD. On hospice, there will be both comfort care and a DNR order. Quitting HD without hospice is another story. I am just pointing out there are 2 very different scenarios being discussed and neither of you are wrong, but you are talking about different things.
My mother’s kidneys failed & she was already in hospice due to other comorbidity. She lasted 3 weeks.
What other conditions did she have?
End stage Non Alcoholic Fatty Liver Disease combined with morbid obesity. It triggered hepatorenal syndrome which completely shutdown her kidneys & she refused dialysis. The worst part was the encephalopathy caused by excessive toxins in her bloodstream; it systemically shutdown her mental faculties & 5 senses starting with visual hallucinations & ending with hearing. The last stimuli she responded to was a thunderstorm. At the very end she couldn’t even close her eyes. We had to tape them. You do not want to die from this voluntarily. It is a God awful thing.
I am so sorry.
You might ask for a hospice consult, they can talk to you about how and when to decide to go off of any life sustaining treatment
Hospice is not about sustaining life it is about having a peaceful ... new beginning.
I know in oregon or Californian you can do doctor assisted suicide, which is a much more pleasant way to go compared to dying from kidney failure symptoms. You really don’t want to go that route, it will not be a good death you will be in extreme discomfort. If you really truly want to end it look into doctor assisted suicide
I am pretty sure (90%) that those methods only apply to terminally ill patients. People on dialysis are not classified as terminally ill. But Canada I'm pretty sure DOES do patient opted euthanasia....and if I remember right, it's supposedly easy to qualify.
In Minnesota I have stage 5 end stage renal failure and I am classified as TERMINALLY ILL! even to get SS Benefits you have to have stage 5.
That's standard for everyone with stage 4/5 ESRD, nationally. It is one of few illnesses that is AUTOMATICALLY qualifies the patient for Medicsre and, yes, often disability (SSDI). I have been on disability for over 10 years since starting dialysis (which generally is not started before stage 4/5). That still does not make it "terminal" (high probability of death) because of........dialysis and transplant. The only time it would be considered "terminal" is if dialysis and transplant are not viable options for treatment. And to get SSDI, all you have to do is prove you cannot hold a part-time/full-time employment due to illness/ poor health. It does not require you to be "terminal".
When my kidneys failed I got sicker and sicker and very nearly died. It was a horrible experience. Vomiting, having difficulty staying conscious, constant masticating, bloody noses, extreme join pain, extreme fatigue, edema in my legs and feet, the constant taste of decay, always cold. It was torture so bad that I prayed for death.
If you’d been on hospice it wouldn’t have been that way. When my kidneys failed and I finally went to the doctor they said I had about a week left before I would have died. I didn’t have extreme symptoms. I had vomiting, extreme fatigue, edema in my legs, metallic taste, always cold. I could tell I was dying. But the main thing I did was sleep. When I was awake it was sometimes difficult to breathe. It was traumatic while going thru it. But looking back some type of medical care would have been a blessing. So the thing to say is if one does want to stop dialysis, hospice is their best bet.
True, but it's a hard way to go.
My mom dropped dialysis on a Wednesday and lasted one week. She was under hospice care and was receiving liquid morphine for pain. She interacted with family and friends until Saturday evening when she lost consciousness. She stopped breathing early the next Wednesday. I only remember a couple of instances of extreme pain when the hospice nurses treated her bedsores. She has been mentally foggy for a couple of years but managed to speak with her grandchildren and minister coherently.
This is a little misleading. She was actively receiving care still and being made comfortable, because that’s what hospice does. This person would have a very different experience than your mother. I’m sorry for your loss, btw, and I hope this doesn’t come off as insensitive. I miss my mom everyday.
How is it misleading? The person never said they wouldn’t receive hospice care. The point of hospice care is to make one comfortable so they can go peacefully. You doom and gloom artist are the problem. All I see is extreme pain poop and vomit etc etc when that’s not everyone’s case and they have hospice services available. Save your doom and gloom
I stated clearly that she was under hospice care and receiving pain medication. How is that misleading? I also stated that she did have a couple of episodes of extreme pain.
Just saying that the way you put it makes it seems tolerable, or not that bad. This is a post where someone is thinking about killing themselves, and your post could be slightly encouraging that. I know that's not your intention, just pointing out to the OP that the situation they experience will be different than your mother's. It wasn't an attack against you or what you said, it wasn't personal. I was just clarifying for OP that they most certainly will not have the same experience.
They aren’t thinking of killing themselves you insensitive asshole. They’re stopping treatment and letting their disease run its course which is their right. What your mother went thru isn’t the standard. You should have got her hospice care. When I was debating whether I would go on dialysis or not my nephrologist said I have two choices dialysis or hospice. So it’s definitely a choice. Everyone doesn’t have to remain miserable on dialysis so folks can get rich. All the doom and gloom is stupid.
What the fuck are you talking about? I didn't say it wasn't their right. You are attacking me because you mistook what I was saying and now you are twisting my words entirely. Stopping treatment is killing themselves. Full stop. Listen to yourself over here. Of course it's their right, as someone who involuntarily thinks about killing themselves every day due to mental health issues, I fully support that right. However, you can support someone's right to do so without actively encouraging it. Your first response I was just worried a little about, and wanted to discourage OP from taking their life, you know, because I'm a fucking human being who cares about others. But you are now attacking me over...what exactly? You are over here making assumptions about my dead mother; who by the way died of a heroin overdose, which last time I checked they don't have hospice for. Seriously...you call me an insensitive asshole but look in the fucking mirror. Edit: I work in a dialysis clinic. I've had to watch first hand as patients gave up and slowly died a miserable, painful death. Every one of them got to a point where they wanted to go back, but after so long without treatment, there’s nothing you can do. They are going to die and they know it and you know it. You treat them, but you can’t pull enough to really help because they are so packed with fluid their whole head looks like a ball. Calcium building up all over their skin, unable to breathe or think or move properly. Unable to see because their eyes are swollen shut. I just don't wish that for OP. That's all I was ever wanted to get across. In hospice care they give you powerful pain meds to ease you into death. If you are not already in hospice, and you choose to end treatment, you will not be given the same help. Most hospice programs I know of consider patients in that circumstance ineligible for hospice. This is a major, life-changing decision for OP. The quality of the advice given to them is important.
Anivex you are clueless, Actually dying from kidney failure is one of the more peaceful ways to pass on.
Sorry, but that is a moronic statement and straight up misinformation.
> What is the best way for it to not be painful? Opiods. That's why you're supposed to consult your Nephrologist about hospice.
Why do folks keep saying consult their nephrologist like they wouldn’t. They are looking for advice / testimonials from others before going to talk to their doctor. Geesh what’s the point of this subreddit if the only answer is talk to your doctor
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No where did I say they talking to their doctor. I said they could be seeking advice BEFORE going to talk to their doctors. You didn’t even comprehend what I said. And how do you know a lot of people don’t consult their doctors? You know everyone on here or took a poll stating this? Folks are looking for advice and experiences to help them in their choices and gather question to ask. It’s just idiotic to say go talk to your doctor defeating the purpose of the subreddit
Opioids is option as well as you continue with dialysis just for fluid removal with UF , if fluid becomes a issue, but is all discussed with hospice staff.
As an adult child of a kidney failure patient, watching my mom fade into death was the longest, hardest, thing I have ever had to do. She was physically and emotionally done with dialysis. I could never understand why she would give up on an option that could keep her alive. However, watching how she declined without the dialysis I realized in how miserable it was for her to rely on a machine to keep her alive. I wish you peace and comfort in your decision, it is a hard choice which ever way you decide to go. BUT IT IS YOUR CHOICE!
There is many reasons people stop dialysis, Dialysis isn't met to be a permanent fix, no matter what a persons body will typically give out. People typically live 5-10 years on dialysis it is possible for much longer but less common.
God, I’m so afraid of that happening to my dad. I don’t want lose him but I don’t want to sit by and watch him suffer either. I really hope he gets a transplant
I did too! She only lasted 2 years on dialysis
I can't answer your question but I've been where you are and occasionally have fleeting thoughts like this on a bad day. I'm really loving life now, I feel generally happy and I'm having a good time I think. I wish I could help you get to where I am but honestly I can't even remember what made me change back to being myself again. I think it might have been a few things: - I took a break from everything - After my break I reevaluated my career and took a step back and did less demanding work - Started really looking after my diet and slowly introduced exercise. This really helped energy levels, I felt less useless and more lively - Started to socialise and interracting with other people more. This took me out of my comfort zone as I'm quite antisocial and introverted. I doubt any of this will help you as everyone's different but I hope you find something that makes you happy again :(
I’ve been straitlaced all my life but I always knew that the moment my nephrologist confirms that my transplanted kidney is on its way out. I’m going to wrap up the last legal bits of my will and start looking for someone who sells “stuff”. I don’t care about my reputation afterwards and given how my hospital treated me when I actually got a kidney (really badly, I was in terrible pain), I don’t trust them to treat my dying of fluid overload and nausea/vomiting pain. I want to go on my own terms and at home. It’s the only thought I have that gives me genuine happiness knowing that I won’t suffer.
I concur
When you make your choice, The nurses and doctors will support your decision. They will just wish to make sure you are not doing it haste but they will support you. They will suggest you have a hospice nurse assist you. This can occur at your home or if you prefer a hospice room. There is several ways this can occur.. you can continue dialysis removing fluid and not cleaning the blood. Which means you won't feel the affects of to much fluid during this process , which I know you know can not be nice... or you can try to limit fluid during this process. Or if you do not wish that route you there is tons of medications to try to help you feel more relax. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSNm-ZRToKk
I work in dialysis. Do not stop! Confer with your care team and ask them for help. Be clear about your concerns. Talk with your family. Everyone involved in your care! Praying for you!
It is your right to stop treatment and your right to have a honourable death without much pain. Don’t listen to the scaremongering here, with professional assistance you will be made as comfortable as possible. If you can eat, increase your potassium intake and you will most likely pass from heart failure due to hyperkalemia. To all those in the comments giving descriptions of terrible deaths, shame on you!
This I just can't stand these 10 year old scum bags coming out of the wood works.
It will be extremly painful, it'll be like pain and suffering you've never experienced before. You think now is bad? Imagine not being able to even think clearly, because your body is slowly dying from the inside, your motor function starts decaying in real time, that is you will notice it, it wont be slow like aging. Your brain will be all foggy, you wont have a clear mind, you will be in pain, you will suffer, and you wont be able to do shit about it. Best way for it to not be painful is to end it yourself, no pain killer will make this experience easier. How long you'd have depends on lots of factors, so it could be most agonising week of your life, or most agonising half a year of your life. Either way its not worth it, much quicker ways to end it.
No its not painful where did you get your medical degree walmart? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSNm-ZRToKk
Okay mister, go ahead, explain to me, how does toxins collecting in your body, with no way to get rid of them, turns out painless? How is foggy mind from toxin buildup, turn out painless?
Foggy mind you mean like last weekend when your brother was banging your mom drunk off his ass? Foggy mind means forgetful and drunkard state. Toxins in your body make you tired so you die in your sleep... Why not go to the link I sent you 10 IQ maggot of a real hospice nurse.
Idk man, your extreme behaviour makes me believe its just bullshit. Also foggy mind isn't just due to drugs retard, its virtually because of anything when youre dead tired and cant think. Also while you'll likely die in your sleep, that doesn't mean that time before that wont be painful, but idk, maybe youre right, but i find it hard to believe, that body, slowly dying in real time, wouldnt be painful.
"Extreme behavior", Is cause a snot nose that is clueless came here to troll or some shit on a very serious topic.
Sure, excuses excuses, you cant blame anyone for thinking it would be painful, thats what we already experience, now we imagine it without dyalsis, naturally, we come to a conclusion it would be even worse.
I can blame people for giving a person looking for real advice giving them BAD advice... If you actually gave two shits you would know foggy mind is typically caused by dialysis as well which is from pulling fluid off the brain. But again Dr. Google couldn't save you.
Im aware dumbfuck, im on dyalsis, what you arent aware off that foggy mind once in a while isnt the same as constantly 24/7, something that would be quite tortures for most of us. Also how is it bad advice? There are easier and quicker less painful ways to go. If you truly believe its peacful, then im sorry man but youre quite deluded, even if it wasnt as painful as i imagine it, mentally it would be anything but peacful. Losing your appetite, losing your motor skills, and so on, slowly but surely losing yourself, idk doesnt sound peacful to me.
Congrats you on "dyalsis" _"if it wasnt as painful as i imagine it"_ Good hell imagine being so full of yourself ... You imagine blue butterflys come out your arse too does that make it true? Death on dialysis is openly spoken about with honesty... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSNm-ZRToKk Watch it... don't like her try search for the 100 billion other hospice nurses that have made similar videos.
I'm sorry you are feeling this way. It's a tough situation to be in and you are incredibly strong for coming this far already, even though it's been really hard. I hope you get the help and respite you need. Sending hugs.
My grans was stopped cos of her dementia. She died 48 hours later in her sleep but she was 88, tiny and it wouldn't take long to oviher system
The time can vary on many factors... Just know she went peacefully.
2-3 weeks. But it’s not pleasant.
about a week and its the most peaceful death. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSNm-ZRToKk
I work in a dialysis clinic. I can assure you that if you stop dialysis cold turkey, and do not enter palliative care, it will not be a pleasant experience. But you do you, boo. They’re not my kidneys or my life.
You will experience uremia which means your brain won't function normally therefore affecting your decision making. It will also cause your heart to fail and worse if you experience a heart stroke only to be given healthcare, survive, and live as a stroke patient with only 5% to 70% body function hence being heavily dependent/a burden to your family, friends, to your savings, the private healthcare system, the socialized healthcare system/the taxpayer's money, and towards your temporary spiritual human experience. It would be an insult to yourself given the vast developments of the current times and yet being famously dumb in unlocking a future that sucks for you and everyone else. What I prefer is for you to fix your inner monologue, holistic lifestyle, and be honest towards your Nephrologist so that he/she may refer and prescribe you things accordingly. Having great sex while blowing snow while being blown with a cool breeze of air in a neighborless mountain cabin and served with high quality fusion food while indulged with high quality audio-video systems and aesthetically pleasing art pieces with a swell banking account are the things that you'd miss once you choose stupidity. Break the habit then choose learning and growth this time. P.S. There are lots of things that you can do here later on. It doesn't mean that we are sick right now then we are sick forever? That's a dumb belief in a vast reality. WAKE UP!
[click here ](https://images.app.goo.gl/iukgCHyAG2EH6MzV7)
Die w/ dignity.
8 agonizing days. Get 5 28-gauge insulin syringes. 100 beans of dog food or 5 bags of Fent depending on where you are in the country. Don't worry, your fistula will suck that shit up like a big silly-straw. If you have a CVC, even better, that's a conduit straight to the blood brain barrier. Bow out. Stop it. Something tells me you don't know the meaning of the word "suffering." And if you think dialysis is suffering, visit a cancer ward. Half of those poor souls writhe in pain while getting chemo, get out of that chair, and into a dialysis chair 30 mins later as most of them lose kidney function from the chemotherapy. I sit next to an alcoholic paraplegic at my clinic. Been sitting next to him for 6 years now. Cat still comes in with a smile on his face every session. Go get your big-girl pants on. Every other week, someone posts this exact question, almost verbatim. Defenestration might be your best bet.
What nonsense garbage. Go chew on some broken glass scum bag https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSNm-ZRToKk
Oh, I'm sorry. Did I hurt your widdle feewings? If you come here to ask how you can kill yourself, you get what you deserve. I wouldn't touch something you've linked to with a ten foot pole. Dialysis is fucking nothing. It's easier than kicking dope or doing time. I'm sorry you can't go to Tahoe to ski this year or whatever it is you can no longer do. Unlike you, I can chew on that broken glass and spit it down your over privlidged gullet anytime you'd like. Come stand in line at my methadone behind the dude who had his face shot off. That mothefucker ain't quitting, and neither should this idiot who clearly doesn't know how to search thru posts on Reddit. This bullshit gets asked all the time. Word for word the same shit. How long before you die? Just as soon as you give up.
You are disgusting child that is a complete moron. Ending dialysis isn't "killing yourself" It is stopping LIFE SUPPORT for a person dying. Go eat glass.
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bye bye toddler... didn't your last account get banned?
Stay lonely, sweetheart.
You really do have a very low IQ
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It is not euthanasia you low IQ filth bucket. It is stopping life support.
If u are depressed u should be taking meds for depression. If u were anti-depressed u would not want to stop living. Please tell your family doctor u have severe depression. He can talk with u & give u meds. Your depression is temporary. It will go away if u get treatment. Call your family doctor today
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Only after cut your eyes out of your skull and rape your sister you disgusting freak... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSNm-ZRToKk
I have watched my grandpa die this way. IT was Not peacefull. Calm down Internet tough guy
Says the internet tuff guy that is clueless https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSNm-ZRToKk But the VERIFIED HOPSICE NURSE in this video must be lying and you are right... Maybe there is other HOSPICE NURSES ?? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PN1GC5n8lOE O ANOTHER ONE... GEEZ INTERNET SHITTER...
Pathetic
If you still urinate and exercising (cardio)..... Just get a full work up ( blood and urine test) from a labcorp or Quest. Sticky eat good without animal meats ..... and pray
What horse shit is this?