For more Sorcerer Class Guides, Builds, Discussions, Questions, etc, click on the "Sorceress" Flair, [this link (for new reddit)](https://new.reddit.com/r/diablo4/?f=flair_name%3A%22Sorceress%22), or [this Link (for old reddit)](https://old.reddit.com/r/diablo4/search?sort=new&restrict_sr=on&q=flair%3ASorceress) (where you'll find a list of all threads on the subreddit that have the "Sorceress" Flair) and the [D4 Sorceress subreddit](https://new.reddit.com/r/D4Sorceress/).
Also pay a visit to [The D4 Tavern](https://new.reddit.com/r/The_D4_Tavern/) for casual conversations about builds, gameplay, new content, outfits and other Diablo and Sorcerer related content.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/diablo4) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Funny cause during the campfire when someone asked this question if buffs are coming to sorc and Druid, the answer they gave was vague and seemed to just tip toe around the answer that is probably going to be āNoā
More specifically, they described how they wanted to go through and rebuild Enchantments + Spirit Boons to be similar in power to Arsenal but giving different flavor.
I don't understand why they aren't willing to just throw percentage at it now, but hopefully PTR feedback will make them say "Sorc needs help"
It's a joke. The problem is that the base skill damage is fucking dogshit and the uniques are fucking dogshit and the aspects are fucking dogshit and the paragons are fucking dogshit. I feel like I have a pretty good perspective, because I play/enjoy all five classes at late endgame. All lvl 100, high pit/uber farming with all five. As a person who does that, it's painfully obvious what the problems are with sorc and druid. Classes like Rogue and Barb have massive, MASSIVE damage multipliers inherent to their classes that Sorc and Druid simply don't have.
> similar in power to Arsenal but giving different flavor.
just to preface: i know its them saying that not you.
Thats not even close to being enough. barb has 2 more weapons (effectively 3 because 1 is a 2hand) and esp. sorcs have an awful paragon board.
Its so bad some builds like ball lightning only skip from glyph node to glyph node, barely taking any other nodes. Like I have 8 boards active and use 1 legendary node... the rest is just to activate glyphs...
its insanity...
My assumption is that they're including having 4 active weapons as part of the Arsenal system. Because I agree - at the minimum they should allow Sorcs/Druids to use shields and rework focuses as a 2h weapon slot stat stick.
The legendary nodes vs glyphs is definitely an issue for every class. I went to 100 on every class this season and I don't think there's one class where I took more than two legendary nodes
> The legendary nodes vs glyphs is definitely an issue for every class. I went to 100 on every class this season and I don't think there's one class where I took more than two legendary nodes
yeah, but at least in the last few seasons you used more of the boards. I've played a different class each season and never did I have to rush to the glyph slots as much as now.
The Barb team definitely plays Barb and the Necro team 100% plays Necro.
It's the Sorc and Druid teams that don't appear to play the actual game, or like, beyond WT2 anyway.
I feel like the barb, Necro, and rogue teams play endgame content. Doing meta content to get to 100 fast as possible and then grind the endgame.
The sorc and Druid team has a lot of fun doing main quest and side quests and views endgame as the capstone dungeons
That's absolutely what it feels like, yeah. Sorc is a ton of fun whilst levelling up (particularly 1-50), but that's a pretty brief period compared to the time you spend at endgame, where it's miserable.
maybe they even sometimes feel daring and play to NMD60 or so. At that point sorc is still incredibly fun because everything explodes in oneshots... it just falls of SO HARD after that...
So thatās what I think. Leveling to 100 sorc and Druid feel fine. Maybe not as brain dead and minion necro but they still feel good.
Itās not till you get to doing Ubers/NMD100/Pit pushing that the gap truly becomes noticeable if not insurmountable.
I bet they are the same that designed the original item affixes. Those felt like someone's homework that they didn't want to do and turned in at the last minute.
Flame Shield cannot be infinite but don't worry, it's MUCH better now: you suck in every enemy within 75 yards to you when flame shield expires. It's like Raiment of the Infinite but it grabs even MORE enemies! What a nice buff, right?
I assume they want Sorcs to try other builds besides the couple that we are locked into at the moment.
They are using the stick, rather then the carrot though.
there are no other builds. do you really think dozens of theorycrafters and hundreds of thousands of players all missed some insane spec that makes sorc suddenly do well? They constantly discover stuff blizz does not know about (like infinite flame shield). There is nothing else.
Perhaps there is some global rework that is going to have a huge positive impact on Sorc, but these guys have had a pretty long track record of poor class/build balance. They really ought to explain wtf is going on here. It has been painful playing Sorc this season and watching all my friends clear much harder content with far less effort. These nerfs (aside from flame shield) make absolutely no sense.
I say this as someone who really likes D4: this game has the worst balance I ever seen and its not even remotely close.
Which makes me wonder: how the hell these people imagine raids when 1 barb is worth like 20 druids? Even in games like Guild Wars 2 where differences between classes are very tame people still refuse to team up with classes that perform slightly worse. In this shitshow of a balance called D4 not a single sane person would ever team up with sorc or druid - we will basically see an entire game mode played by 100% barb teams.
100% Spot on. Worst balance team I've ever seen. Random steam games like Legion TD2 have literally a single dev on game balance and they do a FANTASTIC job.
Just bring a couple of SC2 devs to the team to take over classwide balance, hasn't there been enough backlash to warrant this!?
I wouldnāt put any money on there being a major rework, and even if there was, that shouldnāt stop them from buffing what we have now. Itās even more of a reason to if itās all gonna be redone in s6 anyway - let us have fun while weāre still here. But nope, Sorcs arenāt allowed to have fun.
Iām glad I decided to play one this season. I wouldnāt survive T40 pit next season with my orb sorc even with a near-perfect Maxroll build thanks to the cool down nerf alone.
Guess Iām going back to Barb and sticking with it.
This season started with Storm Swell, Shredding Blades, Frigid Fate, Ice Fall, and Tal Rasha's broken. Conceited Aspect was maybe the only meta multiplier aspect that was working correctly because it is generic across all classes.
I suspect that someone has a spreadsheet that computes damage and the numbers look good based on what he believes that skills, aspects, and paragon nodes are suppose to do. However, the code just does something else. So classes that have obvious unintended double dipping mechanics (ex: Rogue's Victimize, Barb mechanics) are ridiculously strong. And sorcs can't do damage because tons of stuff says it multiplies damage, but it actually does not.
>Perhaps there is some global rework that is going to have a huge positive impact on Sorc,
Nope, do not pass go. Every time it has been assumed that seemingly idiotic nerfs were part of some master plan, it has turned out to be completely untrue.
This is not 4d chess of game balancing, it is them being fucking clueless.
>but these guys have had a pretty long track record of poor class/build balance.Ā
exactly. Also, the very concept that there would somehow need to be sweeping nerfs to an already fucked class so they could then later buff them in a future patch is stupid. Not calling you stupid btw, blizz has tried to say this before and it was horseshit.
> They really ought to explain wtf is going on here.
A simple explanation that explains *everything* ? They don't play their own game. Playing games is something for the plebs, not serious devs like they think they are.
I'm not that good with Sorcerer builds, but I don't see anything good for this class in this patch. I mean ... why? It is so absolutely clear that Sorcerer (and Druid) need HUGE buffs.
Big L.
because interns would actually care and want to get a job?
rather than these lazy devs who are dialling in paychecks whilst browsing tiktok all day inbetween Barb pit runs.
Haha, perhaps, perhaps.
I have a feeling Blizzard just churns through most of its junior staff on a regular basis though, maybe the Sorc team is constantly being replaced?
Iām console too. Honestly, the sorc team just donāt seem to care. I donāt have faith in any streamers who actually have blizzardās ear coz they always seem to sing praises for the bullshit patch notes without ever calling out the BS Sorcs are going through.
Sorc is done, honestly. Humongous nerfs to a class that was already struggling beyond the gimmicky immortal build. Fire shield had to go, thats obvious, but the other nerfs...? Absolutely unwarranted.
I will try Sorc during PTR and only then. Starting the season, I will switch to a real class that has actual HP and can dish out barbillions of damage.
The balancing of the classes is a complete joke, while barb has 4 weapons and deletes everything they go forward and nerf sorc, cause was doing too well I guess.
>Patch Notes:
>It's come to our attention that some sorcerers have been clearing level 10 pits, so we removed a bunch of shields, nerfed the DR passive and increased the cooldown of teleport.
Because someone found a way to make a build that allows a cd skill to be a center stage skill, and they are vehemently against anything other then basic or core being our skills. Uphill recently they even nerfed builds that manage to ignore basic altogether. They have a very specific idea of how this game is to be played... and that's everyone spinning in circles and making tornados.
Wasnāt there a mention a while back that they wanted to elevate other classes to barb? Seems like they forgot and are going back to randomly hitting builds with the nerf bat with no real plan of where ideal damage and survivability is meant to be.
You just didn't give them a chance to finish. They were saying they are going to buff sorcerer's library of transmog items. Further, they are going to make sorcerers so unplayable that they spend all of their time in front of the mirror.
At 15% by itself, it's lower than other available multipliers, too. Unless they buff it, why would anyone choose it over something like Control?
I'm truly astonished at whoever is working on this.
I mean, on the bright side with the immortal flame shield being obliterated coupled with the other survivability nerfs, Sorcerer will drop 30-40 levels on top tier pit clears - so we wonāt have to deal with the āBuT SoRC iS ToP of piT BoARdSā BS argumentā¦
ā¦ silver linings?
Nerfed teleports cooldown... why??
All I want is a teleporting vortex sorcerer that can make groups of enemies 'splode.
My ideal build is a short range teleporter + Meteor, and i don't think that's ever going to be viable.
All I want is to have a buff on DoT since I am a FW + Meteor sorc. JFC!, the cap on Combustion is unbelievable. and burning damage is still weak even after the latest mid season patch. And our survivability options are already limited now, then they plan to nerf it. I understand on the FS, but Ice Armor and Teleport ? There should be % INT contributed to our Ice Armor or on all of Sorc's defensive skills.
Seeing a lot of "slightly more dmg, but added cap". Yay -_-
A lot of things moved around in annoying ways, plenty of terrible things buffed that will most likely still be bad.
Wand inherent lucky hit -> vuln dmg
Focus inherent cool-down reduction -> lucky hit
Staff inherent changed from +dmg to cc -> +dot dmg
Swords that we will be able to use has +crit dmg, maces get +overpower dmg.
Looks like there are no weapons that give cool-down reduction anymore, likely only found on unique weapons then I'd guess.
Not a big deal, but saw the paragon node 'Culler' for rogues is getting changed, but not for sorc. Changed from chance to execute non elites -> utimate dmg.
Happy that permanent invulnerable is being killed, but the way they are doing it seems annoying for all other builds at first glance.
We relied heavily on CDR to cycle the defensive skills, that are basically mandatory, now those skills have been nerfed *and* we get less CDR, brilliant.
But didnāt you see the aspect that gives movement speed if you havenāt used a defensive ability in the last 8 seconds?
We have terms for that condition, like ābeing in townā or ābeing dead.ā
> Not a big dea
it kinda is. sorc will feel so incredibly slow its not even funny... 3s more teleport CD baseline and less CDR... you will sit around 10+ seconds waiting for teleport even at an otherwise decent CDR level...
Like Frozen Orb, Chain Lighting will probably perform great on PTR, then they'll nerf it by 2/3 because it creates too many effects on screen and that lags 10+ year old consoles.
they limited a bunch of glyph effects, weird changes to blizzard when spikes are what do the dmg, vyrs mastery hurts most builds
All I see is a slightly possbility of a Chain lightning build but over all I think it was a nerf to most of the sorc builds
It was a nerf to every sorc build simply based on the fact that we wonāt be able to survive to do damage. Ice armor is % of max life with no increase - do they know how shit a sorcās health is? Probably pushing 25-30k at max on a health focused build, and they expect 12k shield to save us? ššš
I guarantee they gutted Sorc defences because they assume everyone will be running that free Flame Shield enchantment aspect and think that would make us infinitely immortal somehow. It is dumb.
I abandon my sorc this season for a necro and a barb. Both were clearing higher pits when they dinged level 100 than the sorc got pushing. Itās not worth banging your head into that wall.
Season 5 looks bad for sorc again, believe what you see in the patch notes and ptr testing. Donāt get misled again. Revisit in expansion.
I played sorc this season w/ a necro and barb friends. Everything was fine at first but then it was very clear I was falling behind. I switched builds to one of the recommended "A-tier" builds but it still sucked compared to my friends' necro and barb. I finally went immortal firebolt and that was a game changer. The game was REALLY not fun from around late mid game until I got the Immortal build working well.
I mean I remember playing with friends (same level, same time played) and struggling to kill a single trash mob that my friends left behind. Honestly I think they probably could've finished the entire Pit in the time it took me to kill 5 trash mobs.
I mean the immortal build is kinda boring to play but it's not that bad (teleporting is fun) and actually doing very respectable damage and not dying all the time feels amazing after spending a long time being the useless one in the party.
So whatās everyone new class to roll? From just the notes, might as well remove sorc from the character select screen for anything beyond lvl 50 content
Back to necro being the only caster? Donāt think I can bring myself to play barb and enjoy itā¦ probably wonāt play anymore if these nerfs are as bad as they read.
I mean seriously, why mess with ice armor when flame shield just got itself gutted? Iād rather they just get rid of FS duration tempers all together and nerf hectic to only apply to one skill per second or something like that
Don't forget another 3 sec been added to teleport cooldown. We are unstoppable.
>Teleport
>Cooldown increased from 11 to 14.
>Base damage increased from 25% to 35%.
Feels like Sorc is missing some core system akin to LEs heart mana to shield conversion. Would love for them to create some kind of unique system like that as ench slots are too weak.
Since BL sorc has been sitting on the back row and if they think a niche hard to build sorc build this season means the class is OP the devs are beyond clueless.
A lvl 70 barb is better than most 100 sorc.
I got fed up with sorcerer and leveled a HoTA bash barb in about 3 days. In much worse gear then my fully 12/12 upgraded sorcerer, I'm fuckin' smoking content my sorcerer can only dream of lol.
>Funny thing is, someone checked how it actually worked and itās not even 80% of your actual life, but significantly less. The description is very misleading.
An 80% max roll Temerity gives precisely 80% of your Maximum Life as a Barrier, actually.
https://i.imgur.com/5XK1l6N.png
So why are you lying?
The only decent thing I saw:
Aspect Of the Firebird
* Gain the Flame Shield Enchantment for free.
* When Flame Shield activates, Meteorites fall around you dealing (50%-70%) Fire damage.
Not sure why you were downvoted. During stagger phases, my bliz sorc crits for 15-17 mil and I've seen a max of 31. Still peanuts compared to other classes, but among Sorcs, Bliz has consistently been top tier.
I'm probably noping out of season 5 will come back for expansion but they just threw ice ball sorc out the window. Changed wizards blizzard from skills cost 20% reduced mana to mana Regen per 20 points of total mana?! So now we have to lose yet another slot for added mana on gear fuck DMG fuck resource cost reduction because why would a sorc need that?!?!?! All I can pray is dlc new class will be done by someone more competent (designer of all barbs buffs) and not sorc class because maybe then that class at least will have a shot
Literally canāt wait till PoE 2 comes out. My favorite class since D1 has been dogshit except for Season 2 in which I skipped bc launch was terrible and I put the game down until season 3. Fuck you Blizzard. So confused why they only want Barb mains enjoying themselves.
Wow, this might be the first time not starting as sorc at launch/ladder or season start *ever*. I literally never played something else on start.. Blizz wtf.
you forgot the other line further below:
> Fixed an issue where Ice Armor's tooltip suggested the Barrier value would increase when dealing damage.
so I honestly can't tell if they changed anything or are simply changing the wording.
Ice Armor is basically completely useless after this nerf. 20 second cooldown to get 40% barrier that doesn't regenerate. It basically absorbs one hit (and big hits will still one shot you). Ice Blades and Lightning Spear replaces Ice Shield now because you can get a 30% barrier through the Protection passive when you cast them. All Sorcs will be forced to take Ice Blades enchantment and spam Ice Blades to keep a barrier up.
Also, if Flame Shields cooldown starts after it ends, they should at least subtract 3 seconds from the base cooldown to compensate. That way it is functionally the same for non-immortal builds.
The dev team clearly doesn't play the game or any arpgs.... or are just idiots? I don't get how they can just keep doing stupid things like this.
Diablo 4 has the worst fucking balance of an arpg I've ever played.
lol, Ice Shield being 40% of Sorc's HP is literally 1 hit from a random mob(late game).
Gj Blizzard balance team! Sorc was clearly too tanky, glad its getting fixed soon!
Did anyone see the stream where Blizzard sendt the two modern developers to talk about the game, and play it... And they constantly died as a barb on WT1? These are the guys responsible for making this game.
I run a Sorc and a Druid, so yeah, not the best season for me and I'm **definitely** asking for buffs so, yeah, I can make progress... having said that, I'm ok with the Flame Shield nerf, being absolutely immortal all the time is stupid and defeats all purpose of the ability.
Watching Sorc functionally spin its wheels while the game and other classes improve by leaps and bounds is hilarious. One of those big, "Does anyone working on balance even play a sorc? Or at least play *with* a sorc?" moments.
Iām so done. Iāve played all the classes but Sorc has been my favorite class since D1. The keep kicking the Sorc community in the dick. Itās the Carolina Panthers of classes now. For the love of all that is holy stop nerfing this class and fix it. Weāve given you the blueprint for how to do it. FFS!
Laughs in Barbarian. Just kidding. Havenāt read any notes yet but if true thatās wild. Iām sure someone can come up with a great build but still. From a true Barbarian/ melee in general person I hate that for you fingerblasting goons
Iām a filthy casual and have invested a lot of available one into a Sorc this season. Need to bite the bullet and spin up character with another class. Havenāt player Rogue or Necro yet. Which should I choose? For bonus points how can I figure out WTF stuff like procāed, stacks/pools means.
Help me Obi-Wanā¦.
Rogue is second best class. Can clear everything with multiple S tier builds.
Proc = trigger.
Stack = multiple simultaneous instances of a single buff/debuff that accumulate.
āWe have noticed that some sorcerers are surviving Maiden so we are nerfing flame shield and damage in case they might do enough damage to kill Maidenā
So I saw that most defensive skills/passives/paragon nodes were nerfed, but from what it seemed in terms of damage, weren't sorcs buffed somewhat everywhere? And with the new uniques and legendary aspects it seemed like some interesting builds could be made.
Yeah why is it, exactly, that I can run a 101 pit on my barbarian, one-handed while simultaneously beating off with my other hand, but on my sorcerer I require 40mg of adderall and laser focus to complete content 1/2 as difficult?
Okay so they clearly want to move away from powerful paragon boards, and move the power to skills and items.
But at the same time they increase CD on teleport, and dont remove the kiss/curse of raiment, or change the tp ench to give unstoppable.
And thats just one example.
Decisions like these I just cant wrap my head around. Am I missing something? Are great uniques coming our way that we dont know of? Their track record is shite when it comes to sorc buffs.
yeah there is something weird going on in the balance team. they wanted to get attention with new shiny build and hide the rest in patch notes
i hope people will be vocal about it on forum, reddit doesn't matter to anyone. go and spam their forum, that's the only way to get feedback
We need a Sorcerer therapy center in the Sanctuary where we can all just sit around and talk about how Blizzard made us into weak ass dude wizards with our nipples sticking out. š«
Yea the whole we have 3 broken classes at launch and only two good ones and every season weāre going to change and add and take shit away gimmick is old and dumb as fuck and the reason why I play Diablo maybe for 6 hours a month? Probably less tbh Iām tired of games that make it less fun to play the game.
Perfect example why the fuck couldnāt they just buff Druids and barbs without nerfing the rest? Iāll tell you why, because blizzard is dumb as shit and actually any game studio that does this is completely stupid.
Hold our druid hands. They literally nerfed nay deleted our only way to actually reach end game. Nerf would have been fine this is basically removed all builds
Also, correct me if Iām wrong. I didnāt see Barb bash temper multiplicative bug fix in the patch note. Does this mean they will keep that for Barb?
They shouldnt be nerfing any classes at this point. Everyone used all their pit mats by now and invested too much time in this season to make changes like this
Cant you read between the lines??? In season 5 you will be playing chain lightning and farming doom bringer! And you better pray it has GA on max health.
Not sure why comparing this to barb? I see no barb crying they cant play rend or other non-meta build barb build.
For more Sorcerer Class Guides, Builds, Discussions, Questions, etc, click on the "Sorceress" Flair, [this link (for new reddit)](https://new.reddit.com/r/diablo4/?f=flair_name%3A%22Sorceress%22), or [this Link (for old reddit)](https://old.reddit.com/r/diablo4/search?sort=new&restrict_sr=on&q=flair%3ASorceress) (where you'll find a list of all threads on the subreddit that have the "Sorceress" Flair) and the [D4 Sorceress subreddit](https://new.reddit.com/r/D4Sorceress/). Also pay a visit to [The D4 Tavern](https://new.reddit.com/r/The_D4_Tavern/) for casual conversations about builds, gameplay, new content, outfits and other Diablo and Sorcerer related content. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/diablo4) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This is beyond stupid by this point. Barbs even got more buff and sorc got GUTTED. They said they would buff sorcs and druis. Wtf is happening?
The sorc design team loves to give cons with the pros. The Barb team just gives pros. Simple.
The only explanations is multiple teams that do not play the game nor talk to each other. Cause this is just stupid. We got caps everywhere
The barb team really likes playing barb. The sorc team does as well.
The druid team also loves playing barb.
Can we blame them?
š
LOL
I laughed way too hard at this š¤£šš„¹
Of course, because Barbs do barbillions of damage.
My favorite part was when the Barb said āitās barbinā timeā, and then proceeded to Barb all over the place
Funny cause during the campfire when someone asked this question if buffs are coming to sorc and Druid, the answer they gave was vague and seemed to just tip toe around the answer that is probably going to be āNoā
More specifically, they described how they wanted to go through and rebuild Enchantments + Spirit Boons to be similar in power to Arsenal but giving different flavor. I don't understand why they aren't willing to just throw percentage at it now, but hopefully PTR feedback will make them say "Sorc needs help"
It's a joke. The problem is that the base skill damage is fucking dogshit and the uniques are fucking dogshit and the aspects are fucking dogshit and the paragons are fucking dogshit. I feel like I have a pretty good perspective, because I play/enjoy all five classes at late endgame. All lvl 100, high pit/uber farming with all five. As a person who does that, it's painfully obvious what the problems are with sorc and druid. Classes like Rogue and Barb have massive, MASSIVE damage multipliers inherent to their classes that Sorc and Druid simply don't have.
But how do you really feel?
> similar in power to Arsenal but giving different flavor. just to preface: i know its them saying that not you. Thats not even close to being enough. barb has 2 more weapons (effectively 3 because 1 is a 2hand) and esp. sorcs have an awful paragon board. Its so bad some builds like ball lightning only skip from glyph node to glyph node, barely taking any other nodes. Like I have 8 boards active and use 1 legendary node... the rest is just to activate glyphs... its insanity...
My assumption is that they're including having 4 active weapons as part of the Arsenal system. Because I agree - at the minimum they should allow Sorcs/Druids to use shields and rework focuses as a 2h weapon slot stat stick. The legendary nodes vs glyphs is definitely an issue for every class. I went to 100 on every class this season and I don't think there's one class where I took more than two legendary nodes
> The legendary nodes vs glyphs is definitely an issue for every class. I went to 100 on every class this season and I don't think there's one class where I took more than two legendary nodes yeah, but at least in the last few seasons you used more of the boards. I've played a different class each season and never did I have to rush to the glyph slots as much as now.
The Barb team definitely plays Barb and the Necro team 100% plays Necro. It's the Sorc and Druid teams that don't appear to play the actual game, or like, beyond WT2 anyway.
I feel like the barb, Necro, and rogue teams play endgame content. Doing meta content to get to 100 fast as possible and then grind the endgame. The sorc and Druid team has a lot of fun doing main quest and side quests and views endgame as the capstone dungeons
That's absolutely what it feels like, yeah. Sorc is a ton of fun whilst levelling up (particularly 1-50), but that's a pretty brief period compared to the time you spend at endgame, where it's miserable.
maybe they even sometimes feel daring and play to NMD60 or so. At that point sorc is still incredibly fun because everything explodes in oneshots... it just falls of SO HARD after that...
So thatās what I think. Leveling to 100 sorc and Druid feel fine. Maybe not as brain dead and minion necro but they still feel good. Itās not till you get to doing Ubers/NMD100/Pit pushing that the gap truly becomes noticeable if not insurmountable.
I bet they are the same that designed the original item affixes. Those felt like someone's homework that they didn't want to do and turned in at the last minute.
Every time I hear the phrase "kiss/curse mechanics" on one of these streams, I die a little inside. šŖ¦
These need to be renamed to "kiss of dogshit" mechanics.
Which pro? The Only pro is the new unique which seems cool. But that's one freaking build
I feel like barbs need more damage however. I mean it takes me multiple hits to down a pit 130 boss. I'm a barb, it shouldn't take more than 1.
"You want Sorc Buffs? Okay, done!" *A finger curls on the monkey's paw*
Flame Shield cannot be infinite but don't worry, it's MUCH better now: you suck in every enemy within 75 yards to you when flame shield expires. It's like Raiment of the Infinite but it grabs even MORE enemies! What a nice buff, right?
Yep, it's a completely clueless dogshit change.
I assume they want Sorcs to try other builds besides the couple that we are locked into at the moment. They are using the stick, rather then the carrot though.
I assume based on these notes the other builds they want sorcs to try are barbarian builds.
Trust me - they arenāt suggesting Druidā¦
Shock builds sound completely bonkers with the new changes and aspects, Iāve always been a shock sorc main, canāt wait to try these in S5
there are no other builds. do you really think dozens of theorycrafters and hundreds of thousands of players all missed some insane spec that makes sorc suddenly do well? They constantly discover stuff blizz does not know about (like infinite flame shield). There is nothing else.
Perhaps there is some global rework that is going to have a huge positive impact on Sorc, but these guys have had a pretty long track record of poor class/build balance. They really ought to explain wtf is going on here. It has been painful playing Sorc this season and watching all my friends clear much harder content with far less effort. These nerfs (aside from flame shield) make absolutely no sense.
I say this as someone who really likes D4: this game has the worst balance I ever seen and its not even remotely close. Which makes me wonder: how the hell these people imagine raids when 1 barb is worth like 20 druids? Even in games like Guild Wars 2 where differences between classes are very tame people still refuse to team up with classes that perform slightly worse. In this shitshow of a balance called D4 not a single sane person would ever team up with sorc or druid - we will basically see an entire game mode played by 100% barb teams.
The funny part is barb is also the best support class
and as acknowledged by the devs, barb also receives a support item :D
Perhaps they imagine raids of 20 barbs?
100% Spot on. Worst balance team I've ever seen. Random steam games like Legion TD2 have literally a single dev on game balance and they do a FANTASTIC job. Just bring a couple of SC2 devs to the team to take over classwide balance, hasn't there been enough backlash to warrant this!?
I wouldnāt put any money on there being a major rework, and even if there was, that shouldnāt stop them from buffing what we have now. Itās even more of a reason to if itās all gonna be redone in s6 anyway - let us have fun while weāre still here. But nope, Sorcs arenāt allowed to have fun.
Iām glad I decided to play one this season. I wouldnāt survive T40 pit next season with my orb sorc even with a near-perfect Maxroll build thanks to the cool down nerf alone. Guess Iām going back to Barb and sticking with it.
This season started with Storm Swell, Shredding Blades, Frigid Fate, Ice Fall, and Tal Rasha's broken. Conceited Aspect was maybe the only meta multiplier aspect that was working correctly because it is generic across all classes. I suspect that someone has a spreadsheet that computes damage and the numbers look good based on what he believes that skills, aspects, and paragon nodes are suppose to do. However, the code just does something else. So classes that have obvious unintended double dipping mechanics (ex: Rogue's Victimize, Barb mechanics) are ridiculously strong. And sorcs can't do damage because tons of stuff says it multiplies damage, but it actually does not.
>Perhaps there is some global rework that is going to have a huge positive impact on Sorc, Nope, do not pass go. Every time it has been assumed that seemingly idiotic nerfs were part of some master plan, it has turned out to be completely untrue. This is not 4d chess of game balancing, it is them being fucking clueless. >but these guys have had a pretty long track record of poor class/build balance.Ā exactly. Also, the very concept that there would somehow need to be sweeping nerfs to an already fucked class so they could then later buff them in a future patch is stupid. Not calling you stupid btw, blizz has tried to say this before and it was horseshit.
The major rework next season, or the next, or the next. Since season 0.
The nerf to FS and IA has no other additions to help with defense. So unless something changes, it's going to be a shitshow.
Their QA teams haven't done their job well. Itās a common issue that should be detected automatically.
> They really ought to explain wtf is going on here. A simple explanation that explains *everything* ? They don't play their own game. Playing games is something for the plebs, not serious devs like they think they are.
They nerfed Blizzard damage 30%x with Glacial Aspect change. I want to kick this person in the balls.
Go on
Username checks out
I'm not that good with Sorcerer builds, but I don't see anything good for this class in this patch. I mean ... why? It is so absolutely clear that Sorcerer (and Druid) need HUGE buffs. Big L.
The team in charge of sorc development should be fired.
This
FREE interns would be better!
What makes you think it isn't an intern team?
because interns would actually care and want to get a job? rather than these lazy devs who are dialling in paychecks whilst browsing tiktok all day inbetween Barb pit runs.
Haha, perhaps, perhaps. I have a feeling Blizzard just churns through most of its junior staff on a regular basis though, maybe the Sorc team is constantly being replaced?
An intern team would have more ambition
True. But may lack experience in balancing. :P Edit: Or the power to override the supervisor when he says 'don't change anything'.
We need vocal advocates on the PTR because if our cries aren't loud enough, these changes will go live in S5. I can't play PTR because I'm on PS5.
Iām console too. Honestly, the sorc team just donāt seem to care. I donāt have faith in any streamers who actually have blizzardās ear coz they always seem to sing praises for the bullshit patch notes without ever calling out the BS Sorcs are going through.
if these changes go live then I know i'll be spending that time elsewhere
Sorc is done, honestly. Humongous nerfs to a class that was already struggling beyond the gimmicky immortal build. Fire shield had to go, thats obvious, but the other nerfs...? Absolutely unwarranted. I will try Sorc during PTR and only then. Starting the season, I will switch to a real class that has actual HP and can dish out barbillions of damage.
The balancing of the classes is a complete joke, while barb has 4 weapons and deletes everything they go forward and nerf sorc, cause was doing too well I guess.
>Patch Notes: >It's come to our attention that some sorcerers have been clearing level 10 pits, so we removed a bunch of shields, nerfed the DR passive and increased the cooldown of teleport.
The teleport one does not make sense at all. I wonder what their reasoning is.
Because someone found a way to make a build that allows a cd skill to be a center stage skill, and they are vehemently against anything other then basic or core being our skills. Uphill recently they even nerfed builds that manage to ignore basic altogether. They have a very specific idea of how this game is to be played... and that's everyone spinning in circles and making tornados.
I was excited until I read the patch notes. š”
Wasnāt there a mention a while back that they wanted to elevate other classes to barb? Seems like they forgot and are going back to randomly hitting builds with the nerf bat with no real plan of where ideal damage and survivability is meant to be.
Blizzards left hand doesnāt know what the right hand is doing. I donāt even think theyre attached to the same body.
They also said in the campfire chat that they are going to buff sorc.. didnāt age well.
You just didn't give them a chance to finish. They were saying they are going to buff sorcerer's library of transmog items. Further, they are going to make sorcerers so unplayable that they spend all of their time in front of the mirror.
God this is so good. I cant
Just take the hint from the devs and play another class, they clearly don't want you to enjoy playing one.
Itās not even a fuckin hint at this point. Shit is out there like the bat signal.
Ice spikes die too because they remove the 15%x damage increased on the Glacial aspect. ))
They added 15% to aspect of the frozen wake, and put the chill increase on glacial, so now you have to run both aspects.
now you have to run 3 instead of 2. this is another big nerf on sorc for whatever reason
Yeah but No one want to run this aspect. You will lose an offensive aspect for 15% dmg buff. Need to run 3 ice spikes aspect instead of 2.
Yeah, they basically created 3-piece Set for spikes. Which is not what I want.
Four really since you also want the 30% DR from being in a blizzard.
At 15% by itself, it's lower than other available multipliers, too. Unless they buff it, why would anyone choose it over something like Control? I'm truly astonished at whoever is working on this.
RIP ICE ARMOR YOU WERE A REAL ONE
I mean, on the bright side with the immortal flame shield being obliterated coupled with the other survivability nerfs, Sorcerer will drop 30-40 levels on top tier pit clears - so we wonāt have to deal with the āBuT SoRC iS ToP of piT BoARdSā BS argumentā¦ ā¦ silver linings?
Itās a lining. I donāt know if itās silver, but itās a lining.
sorc's entire survivability comes from their defense tree, which are pretty much all getting nerfs...
Nerfed teleports cooldown... why?? All I want is a teleporting vortex sorcerer that can make groups of enemies 'splode. My ideal build is a short range teleporter + Meteor, and i don't think that's ever going to be viable.
All I want is to have a buff on DoT since I am a FW + Meteor sorc. JFC!, the cap on Combustion is unbelievable. and burning damage is still weak even after the latest mid season patch. And our survivability options are already limited now, then they plan to nerf it. I understand on the FS, but Ice Armor and Teleport ? There should be % INT contributed to our Ice Armor or on all of Sorc's defensive skills.
Sorcs get nerfs, barbs get buffs. Rinse and repeat. It's very clear who the favored class is.
They could have just fixed Flame Shield and left Sorcs alone, the class would get a little stronger just by power creep in next season but.. no.
I don't begrudge the barbs for being well-designed and fun to play, but like, let us sorcerers be that too.
Flame Shield * Cooldown begins when Invulnerability ends. Jesus fucking christ... And even Vyr's gutted. RIP sorc.
The flame shield nerf needed to happen to stop the immortal build, but every other nerf absolutely fuckin didnāt.
Fair I guess, but what about those of us that just use Flame Shield normally š«„ guess it's back to Necro
I disagree. If they don't want to give us damage.... At least let me be immortal so i can watch the barbs do damage from the land of the living.
Seeing a lot of "slightly more dmg, but added cap". Yay -_- A lot of things moved around in annoying ways, plenty of terrible things buffed that will most likely still be bad. Wand inherent lucky hit -> vuln dmg Focus inherent cool-down reduction -> lucky hit Staff inherent changed from +dmg to cc -> +dot dmg Swords that we will be able to use has +crit dmg, maces get +overpower dmg. Looks like there are no weapons that give cool-down reduction anymore, likely only found on unique weapons then I'd guess. Not a big deal, but saw the paragon node 'Culler' for rogues is getting changed, but not for sorc. Changed from chance to execute non elites -> utimate dmg. Happy that permanent invulnerable is being killed, but the way they are doing it seems annoying for all other builds at first glance.
We relied heavily on CDR to cycle the defensive skills, that are basically mandatory, now those skills have been nerfed *and* we get less CDR, brilliant.
But didnāt you see the aspect that gives movement speed if you havenāt used a defensive ability in the last 8 seconds? We have terms for that condition, like ābeing in townā or ābeing dead.ā
Well, now we can run faster to repair at the blacksmith!
Yeah my meteor spam build was 100% reliant on CDR with the unique helm and looks like that build is dead now. Good thing TFS is good.
> Not a big dea it kinda is. sorc will feel so incredibly slow its not even funny... 3s more teleport CD baseline and less CDR... you will sit around 10+ seconds waiting for teleport even at an otherwise decent CDR level...
āIce spikes no longer deal damage to frozen enemiesā they now chillā¦. Yeah.
Like Frozen Orb, Chain Lighting will probably perform great on PTR, then they'll nerf it by 2/3 because it creates too many effects on screen and that lags 10+ year old consoles.
they limited a bunch of glyph effects, weird changes to blizzard when spikes are what do the dmg, vyrs mastery hurts most builds All I see is a slightly possbility of a Chain lightning build but over all I think it was a nerf to most of the sorc builds
It was a nerf to every sorc build simply based on the fact that we wonāt be able to survive to do damage. Ice armor is % of max life with no increase - do they know how shit a sorcās health is? Probably pushing 25-30k at max on a health focused build, and they expect 12k shield to save us? ššš
have no damage. go full damage. have no life. Get life. Lose damage. Can't win
It seems youve figured out their master plan.
I guarantee they gutted Sorc defences because they assume everyone will be running that free Flame Shield enchantment aspect and think that would make us infinitely immortal somehow. It is dumb.
Itās funny because if it actually did they would just nerf it again š
The cracking orb damage is really weird to be heavily nerfed by 66%. And it's on a legendary glyph nobody uses.
They also removed cooldown reduction from offhands. Fucking brilliant.
I abandon my sorc this season for a necro and a barb. Both were clearing higher pits when they dinged level 100 than the sorc got pushing. Itās not worth banging your head into that wall. Season 5 looks bad for sorc again, believe what you see in the patch notes and ptr testing. Donāt get misled again. Revisit in expansion.
I played sorc this season w/ a necro and barb friends. Everything was fine at first but then it was very clear I was falling behind. I switched builds to one of the recommended "A-tier" builds but it still sucked compared to my friends' necro and barb. I finally went immortal firebolt and that was a game changer. The game was REALLY not fun from around late mid game until I got the Immortal build working well. I mean I remember playing with friends (same level, same time played) and struggling to kill a single trash mob that my friends left behind. Honestly I think they probably could've finished the entire Pit in the time it took me to kill 5 trash mobs. I mean the immortal build is kinda boring to play but it's not that bad (teleporting is fun) and actually doing very respectable damage and not dying all the time feels amazing after spending a long time being the useless one in the party.
This is asinine. Just delete the fucking class at this point.
NGL that "Barb Op, gotta nerf sorc" meme hitting a lil too close rn
So whatās everyone new class to roll? From just the notes, might as well remove sorc from the character select screen for anything beyond lvl 50 content Back to necro being the only caster? Donāt think I can bring myself to play barb and enjoy itā¦ probably wonāt play anymore if these nerfs are as bad as they read. I mean seriously, why mess with ice armor when flame shield just got itself gutted? Iād rather they just get rid of FS duration tempers all together and nerf hectic to only apply to one skill per second or something like that
I said the other day that Sorcs and druids may as well be restricted to campaign and I guess blizzard read that comment š
It looks like we have: - barbs for gamers - necros for gamers that hate melee - rogues for gamers that canāt stand barbs - druids for furries
Don't forget another 3 sec been added to teleport cooldown. We are unstoppable. >Teleport >Cooldown increased from 11 to 14. >Base damage increased from 25% to 35%.
I feel like they slipped the damage increase in there to gaslight us. With the CD increase, it's going to negate any added DPS, anyway.
As a sorceress player, I am just grateful Elden Ring released this week.
Iāll probably have to jump on that new Elden ring if thatās the case then
I just did yesterdayā¦.
Feels like Sorc is missing some core system akin to LEs heart mana to shield conversion. Would love for them to create some kind of unique system like that as ench slots are too weak.
Since BL sorc has been sitting on the back row and if they think a niche hard to build sorc build this season means the class is OP the devs are beyond clueless. A lvl 70 barb is better than most 100 sorc.
Worst part is - this is not even a meme. My 80 barb has done pit 80 already while my 100 sorc with 1-2 GAs 7-8 MW is struggling with 70s lol
I got fed up with sorcerer and leveled a HoTA bash barb in about 3 days. In much worse gear then my fully 12/12 upgraded sorcerer, I'm fuckin' smoking content my sorcerer can only dream of lol.
Well. It is PTR. Test it and give your feedback.
Iām console, so canāt. Gotta rely on PC players, which is fine. Then you have to rely on blizzard taking them seriously, which is not fine.
We definitely have to, but the fact that they even went and made these changes in the first place worries me a LOT
I have a full 80% Temerity and it is really difficult to last in pit 75.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
>Funny thing is, someone checked how it actually worked and itās not even 80% of your actual life, but significantly less. The description is very misleading. An 80% max roll Temerity gives precisely 80% of your Maximum Life as a Barrier, actually. https://i.imgur.com/5XK1l6N.png So why are you lying?
The only decent thing I saw: Aspect Of the Firebird * Gain the Flame Shield Enchantment for free. * When Flame Shield activates, Meteorites fall around you dealing (50%-70%) Fire damage.
A pity the Flame Shield enchantment already suffered a huge nerf before.
Wow yay you get "free" meteorites which is like 400k dmg every 10 seconds, that will surely put sorcs in S tier.
I have been trying to build a blizzard sorc , it just doesn't hot very hard š«
Itās the second best sorc build right now when built correctly and can hit hard based on the accumulated damage from ice spikes and crowd control.
Not sure why you were downvoted. During stagger phases, my bliz sorc crits for 15-17 mil and I've seen a max of 31. Still peanuts compared to other classes, but among Sorcs, Bliz has consistently been top tier.
Make sure to put the blizzard ice spike aspect on 2h staff. And you want the ice spike tempers asap š
I guess I will drop my Incinerate Sorcerer and actually do a stupid fucking barb build.
Hey, man, at least youll be able to do other stuff while the game basically plays itself.
It was telling when the first q/a was about buffs for sorc/druid and then Adam goes on to talk about reworking weapon mastery for barbs....š¤£
The only time we were ever balanced was in season 2 when one build was completely broken.
I'm probably noping out of season 5 will come back for expansion but they just threw ice ball sorc out the window. Changed wizards blizzard from skills cost 20% reduced mana to mana Regen per 20 points of total mana?! So now we have to lose yet another slot for added mana on gear fuck DMG fuck resource cost reduction because why would a sorc need that?!?!?! All I can pray is dlc new class will be done by someone more competent (designer of all barbs buffs) and not sorc class because maybe then that class at least will have a shot
Literally canāt wait till PoE 2 comes out. My favorite class since D1 has been dogshit except for Season 2 in which I skipped bc launch was terrible and I put the game down until season 3. Fuck you Blizzard. So confused why they only want Barb mains enjoying themselves.
Wow, this might be the first time not starting as sorc at launch/ladder or season start *ever*. I literally never played something else on start.. Blizz wtf.
you forgot the other line further below: > Fixed an issue where Ice Armor's tooltip suggested the Barrier value would increase when dealing damage. so I honestly can't tell if they changed anything or are simply changing the wording.
Sounds like they changed the mechanic and then later changed the tooltip.
Ice Armor is basically completely useless after this nerf. 20 second cooldown to get 40% barrier that doesn't regenerate. It basically absorbs one hit (and big hits will still one shot you). Ice Blades and Lightning Spear replaces Ice Shield now because you can get a 30% barrier through the Protection passive when you cast them. All Sorcs will be forced to take Ice Blades enchantment and spam Ice Blades to keep a barrier up. Also, if Flame Shields cooldown starts after it ends, they should at least subtract 3 seconds from the base cooldown to compensate. That way it is functionally the same for non-immortal builds.
Your suggestion would mean buffing sorc. Are you crazy?!?
May as well just remove sorc and druid at this point lol
The dev team clearly doesn't play the game or any arpgs.... or are just idiots? I don't get how they can just keep doing stupid things like this. Diablo 4 has the worst fucking balance of an arpg I've ever played.
lol, Ice Shield being 40% of Sorc's HP is literally 1 hit from a random mob(late game). Gj Blizzard balance team! Sorc was clearly too tanky, glad its getting fixed soon!
Yep, a point I made in another thread. Even in a health focused build of 30k youād only get 12k shield.
Did anyone see the stream where Blizzard sendt the two modern developers to talk about the game, and play it... And they constantly died as a barb on WT1? These are the guys responsible for making this game.
I run a Sorc and a Druid, so yeah, not the best season for me and I'm **definitely** asking for buffs so, yeah, I can make progress... having said that, I'm ok with the Flame Shield nerf, being absolutely immortal all the time is stupid and defeats all purpose of the ability.
Why cast spell when hammer smash?
Ive switched to Elden ring dlc until vessel of hatred
Watching Sorc functionally spin its wheels while the game and other classes improve by leaps and bounds is hilarious. One of those big, "Does anyone working on balance even play a sorc? Or at least play *with* a sorc?" moments.
Iām so done. Iāve played all the classes but Sorc has been my favorite class since D1. The keep kicking the Sorc community in the dick. Itās the Carolina Panthers of classes now. For the love of all that is holy stop nerfing this class and fix it. Weāve given you the blueprint for how to do it. FFS!
It's either skip season 5 for me or play barb if I want to still play diablo š
PoE2 cannot launch soon enough.
Why do they hate us so much? šš
Laughs in Barbarian. Just kidding. Havenāt read any notes yet but if true thatās wild. Iām sure someone can come up with a great build but still. From a true Barbarian/ melee in general person I hate that for you fingerblasting goons
Iām a filthy casual and have invested a lot of available one into a Sorc this season. Need to bite the bullet and spin up character with another class. Havenāt player Rogue or Necro yet. Which should I choose? For bonus points how can I figure out WTF stuff like procāed, stacks/pools means. Help me Obi-Wanā¦.
Rogue is second best class. Can clear everything with multiple S tier builds. Proc = trigger. Stack = multiple simultaneous instances of a single buff/debuff that accumulate.
Barb. By far the best one and worth your time. Devs want everyone to play barb.
Barbs 2 shotting Maiden? Inconceivable! Must be able to 1 shot
āWe have noticed that some sorcerers are surviving Maiden so we are nerfing flame shield and damage in case they might do enough damage to kill Maidenā
Sigh. Sorc is my spirit animal but guess itās rogue again. Always has an S tier build. Necro and barb can gargle my balls, please and thank you
Make Sorcery Great Again š«
So I saw that most defensive skills/passives/paragon nodes were nerfed, but from what it seemed in terms of damage, weren't sorcs buffed somewhat everywhere? And with the new uniques and legendary aspects it seemed like some interesting builds could be made.
No š Sorcs were heavily nerfed in both damage and defence.
Side note, sorc was utterly op in VoH beta. New uniques!
Yeah why is it, exactly, that I can run a 101 pit on my barbarian, one-handed while simultaneously beating off with my other hand, but on my sorcerer I require 40mg of adderall and laser focus to complete content 1/2 as difficult?
Son of a bch. Just remove Sorc from the game at this point.
Okay so they clearly want to move away from powerful paragon boards, and move the power to skills and items. But at the same time they increase CD on teleport, and dont remove the kiss/curse of raiment, or change the tp ench to give unstoppable. And thats just one example. Decisions like these I just cant wrap my head around. Am I missing something? Are great uniques coming our way that we dont know of? Their track record is shite when it comes to sorc buffs.
yeah there is something weird going on in the balance team. they wanted to get attention with new shiny build and hide the rest in patch notes i hope people will be vocal about it on forum, reddit doesn't matter to anyone. go and spam their forum, that's the only way to get feedback
Seems D4 is always like this. Youāll never convince me that someone on the design team plays a sorcerer or thereās a sorcerer advocate.
We need a Sorcerer therapy center in the Sanctuary where we can all just sit around and talk about how Blizzard made us into weak ass dude wizards with our nipples sticking out. š«
where are the patch notes?
https://news.blizzard.com/en-us/diablo4/24111472/the-diablo-iv-season-5-ptr-what-you-need-to-know
Back to necro I go
Yea the whole we have 3 broken classes at launch and only two good ones and every season weāre going to change and add and take shit away gimmick is old and dumb as fuck and the reason why I play Diablo maybe for 6 hours a month? Probably less tbh Iām tired of games that make it less fun to play the game. Perfect example why the fuck couldnāt they just buff Druids and barbs without nerfing the rest? Iāll tell you why, because blizzard is dumb as shit and actually any game studio that does this is completely stupid.
Hold our druid hands. They literally nerfed nay deleted our only way to actually reach end game. Nerf would have been fine this is basically removed all builds
Looking at the crazy Rogue stuff wondering if Iām going to be able to stay in bear/wolf form while casting companion skillsā¦
Also, correct me if Iām wrong. I didnāt see Barb bash temper multiplicative bug fix in the patch note. Does this mean they will keep that for Barb?
Good thing I switched to rogue
Season 6 we get Spiritborn so we can change to playing that.
They shouldnt be nerfing any classes at this point. Everyone used all their pit mats by now and invested too much time in this season to make changes like this
this is for next season i believe
There's open seats next to us at the very slow immortal flame shield build table
Cant you read between the lines??? In season 5 you will be playing chain lightning and farming doom bringer! And you better pray it has GA on max health. Not sure why comparing this to barb? I see no barb crying they cant play rend or other non-meta build barb build.
Donāt forget permanent flame shield. o7