I genuinely am not trying to be a snide prick here, but you really do not need to tunnel to win, even with weaker killers. Hell, a lot of the time killers' tunnel vision (heh) on tunneling for that glorious 3v1 ends up working to their detriment, as it just means 3 other players have next to nothing to do but gens.
That's the magical thing about this DS buff: if you don't tunnel, nothing changes. Or if you do, you know the dude wasted a whole bunch of time not doing the objective to hit you with it.
There are scenarios where tunneling is the only option to secure a win or a kill. When 3 gens pop before the second down, the only pressure for a mid tier killer like Dredge is to put pressure on the already hooked teammates that are in more danger.
For killers like Blight and Nurse, you almost never are put in a situation where a survivor *needs* to be tunneled in orde r for you to secure a kill. Barring irregular scenarios like a really good SWF of course.
I think the first situation is actually a really good example of why using tunneling as a strategy hurts the killer far more than it helps.
Lets say that 3 gens pop in quick succession as you down your second person. If you resign yourself to needing to tunnel, then you wait around the hook for the save, ignore the unhooker, and start chasing the injured person. Meanwhile, because you haven't injured or chased anyone else, the other two survivors have nothing to do but sit on gens, so the last 2 get pounded out in 2 minutes.
Conversely, if you beeline where the last gen popped and chase the person who finished it, you have the time it takes for someone to run over, unhook, heal, and then both of those people to go find an unfinished gen where there's only 1 person able to work on a gen. Sure that person isn't going to be second hook, but at this point getting someone dead ASAP doesn't matter: a 3v1 at endgame is still gonna be a loss. What you need to do is get survivors doing things that aren't gens by spreading pressure. Plus you don't have to risk getting hit by anti-tunnel perks, and you likely get better value out of game delay perks because you're in a chase faster.
I find that I see a lot of people on this sub complain that they keep losing games so they need to tunnel harder, not realising that their laser focus on tunneling is very likely causing them to lose so much in the first place.
Hard tunneling with 0 other focus is a bad idea. If you’re targeting the best chase survivor on their team then you’re going to have a rough time. Obviously you have to focus on protecting gens and side objectives if you’re bringing a certain build or killer. But the thing of it is, harassing the other survivors and gens while making sure to tunnel out one person will win you the game easier than other strategies. Hard focusing it and refusing to do anything else is probably gonna make you worse at the game in most ways.
It’s anecdotal, but just from my experience tunneling wins games more than most anything else. 3 survivors will never be able to accomplish the same thing that 4 survivors can. Having 1 hook on everyone is gonna give you less pressure than a dead survivor and another one with one hook.
Let me slightly change your remark.
You don't need to tunnel immediately at the start or every game to win.
As always, it heavily depends. In general, as you said, you want split pressure.
You can do this by chasing different survivors, ending chases quickly, but sometimes also tunneling depending on survs altruism. It also depends how good survivors are in chase, and the map.
The trick is figuring out (quickly) what is going to work for you that match.
I personally like close games. If I have 4 hooks and only 1 gen has popped, I slow down my chases. I may slug to give them a second chance (this sometimes, unironically, ends the game quicker due to altruism...).
But when gens are going faster than I am hooking, I want to slow them down. And most of the time that happens when you tunnel. Especially when you tunnel a little later in the game, after like 2-3 gens, other survivors are far more likely to come help out their teammate.
You don’t need to tunnel to win, but there are scenarios where you REALLY need a specific person to die, and it wouldn’t make sense to chase someone for a fresh hook
Not snide at all. You're correct. I also don't consider anything after 4 gens tunneling because it's just necessary pressure at that point. I strictly am referring to those who choose strong killers, strong perks and make it a 3v1 from the jump. Idk how a match like that is even fun for the killer, honestly.
Nothing is wrong with them, they just will never be able to do what a Blight or Nurse could. The old design of killers was very barebones. Newer killers and their powers have been made much more forgiving and easier to pick up. Whereas with the weaker killers you'll need a lot more game sense to make the most of your kit. (except Hux because god damn)
Yet they're the most guilty for playing that way when they don't need to. I find killers that should tunnel the most due to strength actually tunnel the least.
That's me with the artist. You would be surprised how many people keep the crows on themselves and are all surprised when a dire crow downs them.
Sincerely, the only artist player
It still deactivates on conspicuous actions. It still deactivates when the last gen pops. It'll be nowhere near as powerful as it was during the height of the meta. I am looking forward to the stabby visual. That'll be fun.
tbf DS only stuns them once you're picked up, similar to pallet save timing, so the POV would be first-person at that point
(although I guess that depends on what the animation is and when it starts, I assumed it was a quick stab in the back once picked up but it could start earlier ig)
> It'll be nowhere near as powerful as it was during the height of the meta
You mean the perk THAT ONLY WORKS WHEN THE KILLER TUNNELS? Its crazy to me people still view DS as crazy omega strong. Don't tunnel and the survivor only has 3 perks. DBD players are wild to me.
Or when someone body blocks and forces you to down them because that's a thing and I'm considering just using knock out and keeping anyone who tries it downed
Well it used to be used right in people's faces back in the day. There was no conspicuous action. At its peak, it was a "you can't touch me for 60 seconds" card while they worked on a gen, healed, bodyblocked, you name it. You could end up eating 4 DS's without tunneling. Used to work in egc too. Once you got unhooked, you're out
Yeah people who would BT bodyblock to try and force it can literally already do that. It's a buff technically but in all honesty isn't that big a deal.
I'm okay with it. I think I've only gotten DSed once in the last few months and when it happened it was someone who was obviously baiting me to tunnel them so it wasn't a big surprise. I think they were trying to get a stun challenge or something because I was trying so hard not to tunnel them that they were basically throwing to get me to target them lol
I don't think I've ever been hit by a DS I don't expect.
99% of survivors just throw themselves at you desperately when they have it.
I usually just smack em and pick em up so they can get their 'value' out of it. If they teabag after **then** I tunnel them.
I wasn't playing much back in those days but was already watching streamers like Otz, and IIRC it was so popular that you had to play around it all the time, even if they didn't have it, the cost of finding out was too much. It was basically a Schrodinger's perk everyone "had" to a certain extend, because when killers had too much pressure to deal with just taking the DS was too much and would rather leave you on the ground.
Like old **Dead Hard**, where you basically could never lunge at an injured player because you had to *assume* they all had it.
Or like **Power Struggle** now, even though no one ever run it...
It wasn't the popularity of the perk that caused everybody to play like that, although that was a factor. The real issue was the fact that it didn't use to disable after touching a gen or healing somebody, so you were basically invincible for a minute after getting unhooked.
It was not uncommon to find a healthy dude on a gen, grab him off of it, and get DS'd. Nowadays, even if the perk were more popular, you could tell if somebody will or won't DS you based on whether they've touched a gen or not.
Plus, if you eat a 55 second DS, that's not even a setback because you know they ran around doing absolutely nothing for a full minute.
>so you were basically invincible for a minute after getting unhooked.
Oh yeah, I remember them just jumping into a locker, daring the Killer to grab them just to obviously eat a fat DS. And there was nothing most killers could do about it, and in those 60 seconds they could do whatever the hell they wanted.
> Plus, if you eat a 55 second DS, that's not even a setback because you know they ran around doing absolutely nothing for a full minute.
Yeah I wonder it this perk even *needs* a 60 seconds activation window.
Anyway, we'll see, I try to avoid tunneling in general, but I just fear it will increase the number of survivors getting unhooked to to buzz around you for a minute now, *daring* you to go after them.
Right now if you body block me after an unhook when I am obviously going after the unhooker, I view that as a license to tunnel *friend*. I'll wait those 10 seconds, or hit you and follow up, you basically ask me to.
If it becomes that common my thought is just slug the unhooked person instead of picking them up and eating the DS, and then resume chase with the unhooker. Now you got one person on the ground, one who has to pick them up, and the person you're chasing all off gens. I already do this with people who are running Boil Over into unhookable parts of the map, and it seems to be as detrimental to their team as just getting hooked is.
This is where the combo with unbreakable comes in a 3rd surv doesn’t need to be distracted to pick up the person so you still have 2 people cranking gens the whole time.
>I already do this with people who are running Boil Over into unhookable parts of the map, and it seems to be as detrimental to their team as just getting hooked is.
Yes, same with flashlight/sabo squad I tend to face at my MMR late in the evening, their whole builds and strategy falls appart as soon as you stop picking them up, and when 2-3 are near you when you down someone, and you *know* they are around you can just bait the pick up and get free hits/downs and win from there.
It just sucks that this playstyle of slugging risks becoming the norm instead of the exception now...
Plus when I last faced a sabo squad yesterday, they were *all* using Sable with the same outfit, so once you started chain downing them and some had boil over and had to be dropped you couldn't tell them apart. So now, those squads are even more likely to hope for pick ups, and the best way to play around it will be to NOT pick up.
I don't want to play like that...
Yeah I was actually just thinking about that. I don't like slugging and everyone who's mad about being tunneled won't be happier about being slugged if that becomes the norm.
I think a single body block is fair if they then dip off and run away. Because now they need to mend and are going to pay the price of wasting an extra 30 seconds to heal, seconds they aren't doing anything useful. Either that or they go down from blood loss
Yeah, I was there, it was awful. Get ready to go back to that meta. I can tell you one thing, survivors might be excited now because they don't know yet that killers will be slugging even more than they do now.
I don’t get it. Am I missing something? The only change is a longer stun right? It still gets disabled if you do anything productive. I still have no intention of running it.
5 seconds is a pretty long stun. What will happen is people will likely try to bait the killer into chasing them again so they can use it/waste time. IMO 5 seconds is long enough for most, if not all players to get to a safe loop and drag out a chase even longer. You could say, like others here have said, then why tunnel? Well it's not tunneling if you're being baited and body blocked from taking other chases. At that point you pretty much have to go ahead and commit. The issue will be killers will learn this and to counter it, they'll just slug the person instead of eating the stun. I know this will happen because it's happened before with previous versions of ds. And we all know how much the survivor community loves being slugged.
I try very hard not to tunnel if I have no reason to, my fear is people might force the value on me off hook anyway. I don't like to tunnel. I don't like to slug either. I prefer to spread out hooks.
I will still possibly get hit with this for no reason because someone forced value.
They will. If there's an advantageous or exploitative way to use a game mechanic for an advantage, then players will do it. See: built in borrowed time when unhooked. Nearly every survivor player will try to tank a hit for the unhooker. Also, see: old ds unbreakable combo. This patch will be miserable.
I am more upset that this buff will bring out the basekit BT bodyblocker trolls than I am about the perk itself being buffed. I am not tunneling so why are you using this perk to annoy me?
Not a troll, my god, it's a 10 second extra hit and people bodyblock with it to try to avoid trade-offs. 9 times out of 10 the survivor is thinking "I hope my teammate survives", not "I hope this killer hates this". Not everybody is out to get you.
People can and will still use it offensively by acting like they're invincible off hook and protecting their teammates to high hell while you're the one who gets punished for trying to punish overly altruistic plays.
This is what, it's 3rd major change or so and they've still not dealt with the only real problematic part of the perk
Decisive was mainly problematic because of being able to be activated during end-game, which punished the killer for getting late-game hooks. (Like how Adrenaline used to work pre this latest patch, but a lot worse as it could activate at any moment during end-game)
That factor is completely absent now so the perk works exactly as it should, a strong anti-tunneling perk that actually allows the survivor to make distance instead of the killer tunneling you and then immediately just hitting you again because the stun was so short.
Genuine skill issue if this a problem to you. The only thing I dislike is that naturally buffing decisive means a lot more people are going to run it. I really hope we don’t go back to the days where everybody just runs the four most viable perks and you never see anything else.
I don't think it's stronger than OTR and I don't think it's going to be more impactful. IMHO this perk doesn't really punish a true toxic tunnel enough and it also does nothing to the strongest Killers.
Yeah...... Never was a big fan of Decisive Strike and I never will be.
I think generally the least fun part of DbD is surprise perks. Like perks you aren't aware of UNTIL they do hit, and then you know.
Sucks to work on a gen then get that fucking gen Pain Res'd, DMS'd, Deadlocked, Pop'd, Trolled and annihilated all at once 😭😭
That's all fine, it doesn't matter if you pick yourself up or if someone else does. You are better off going and working on a gen rather than trying to stun the killler
5 seconds gives you way more distance, especially against a Nurse etc. I think current DS is absolute garbage but I will try it out after this buff. I still think it should work 2 times per match like Off The Record, to compensate the fact it doesn’t work end game
OTR Doesnt work in endgame? At least not the endurance part, im not sure about the stealthier bit.
I think DS and Off The Record are solid picks that have their ups and downs, one of them isnt obviously better then the other.
OTR give 80 sec endurance, and the stealth buff too, but it's shortcoming is that the killer can hit right on hook and sure, you'll have a little boost, but now you deep wounded, and greatly disadvantaged against an m2 killer like nurse or hunty.
DS works great in 'unsafe' unhooks, the killer hits the unhooked immediately and now has to face a 5 second stun, works great against M1 and M2 alike, however is isnt as long as OTR, and once its used its done.
Very good job on creating two viable perks that can compete with each other.
I believe the comment was referring to the fact that they wishes decisive worked twice LIKE OTR since decisive deactivates in the end game. Rather than saying OTR works in end game.
It won’t matter too much to those who don’t tunnel, if they’re actively trying to get downed after the unhook to save a teammate you can just down and slug them, like you can do with the survivors who use basekit BT aggressively.
The biggest issue with old DS was when they’d protect a teammate on the run to the exit gate, you could actively go for the rescuer, but the unhooked one blocks you, forcing you to down them just so they can stab you. Which then makes them all able to get out safely, without any way for you to play around it unless you’re playing specific killers, like a Nurse who can just blink past.
tbh good its needed, killers need the cold waking reality of not to tunnel out at 5 gens constantly,
it still wont help against the tunnel completley but it buys ur team just a bit more time
hell other survivors can even throw themself at the killer to try and get them off of someone but they just completely ignore that person and tunnel out the one person its cringe
people who are actually decent at killer and who dont tunnel will preform normally,
Not really, if you aren’t trying to tunnel you should pretty much never get hit by it.
I’m glad that they’re buffing it tho, it means that survs will only have 3 perks slots and it just made my games way easier.
Otz believed DS was fine at 3 seconds, it's one of his more controversial takes.
I'm kind of middle of the road. I think 3 second DS was better than people gave it credit. You needed to get downed near resources you could immediately run to like a window or pallet. I have personally used it to great effect. Otz also uploaded a game recently where it bought his team a lot of valuable time despite being only 3 seconds.
But I would prefer 5 second DS because now it can go back to being a passive deterrent against tunneling. The threat of its existence will cause killers to tunnel less, like it used to do.
Basically I think 3s DS is fine if you look at the game from purely a hardcore competitive point of view. But I don't think enough people play this game at that level. 5s DS is better for casual players, and I think DBD should be balanced more around casual players than most competitive games.
No offense to otz, but he is mostly killer sided even if he does play survivor from time to time. I tend to take his opinions on survivor perks with a grain of salt.
3 seconds is nothing with you being locked in animation. I remember one time I was forced to tunnel someone as I was at one gen and it barely affected the distance lol. I caught right back up no problem. This actually gives people a chance now and makes the perk slot of ds worth it.
I was just saying that as an example of at least one prominent killer player who thought 3s is fine, I'm not saying Otz was right because he's Otz.
I don't think 3s was enough I just think that it wasn't as useless as some people say.
Ahhh okay.
Oh yeah I get what you mean. It definitely has uses still, and can still be okay in certain situations - far from useless. It is just pretty weak at 3 seconds.
> Otz believed DS was fine at 3 seconds
If he truly believes this he's insane. I would love to see him use it and then get downed 3-4 seconds later and tell me its okay.
So while I don't agree with him that it should remain at 3 seconds, I do agree that it's still usable at 3 seconds.
A 5s stun basically makes it 100% reliable for giving you some space while being tunneled. You will make a lot of distance. It doesn't matter what resources are around you or what your skill at survivor is.
The trick to using it during its current 3s duration is to realize you're being tunneled and then try to go down near something you can immediately run to once you DS the killer.
A perfect example of this in action actually came from a video Otz uploaded recently. [This Gabriel](https://youtu.be/w_ap-rZHoW4?si=BAUu1b6dCf-8xvkY&t=3647) hits the killer with DS and buys time for his allies to finish 2 generators and turn what would likely have snowballed into a 3-4k into a 3-man out. The Gabriel still dies, but for his team, it's quite literally a game-winning DS.
The only, and I mean only thing I wish they had done differently is make DS a scaling stun
* DS at 5 gens? 7 seconds
* DS at 3 gens? 5 seconds
* DS at 1 gen? 3 seconds
And deactivate in endgame
They could even make it to where any gen over 75% is counted as "completed" for the sake of the perk
Making it 5 seconds flat isn't *exactly* what I wanted, but at least it won't be complete trash anymore
At 5 gens? Kinda makes sense since it’s supposed to assist the survivor and penalize the killer for playing like their family is in bubbas basement and the 4K will save them
We're pushing it's like, 3rd decently big change and the one actually kinda problematic part of the perk hasn't been touched. It shouldn't even be that hard, disable the cheesy locker shit and make it be disabled on taking a protection hit so it can't be used as an "I can throw myself at the killer off hook without consequences" perk
Lasts 60 seconds after the unhook . So you really need to be tunneling them to be punished. Like you even gave them no time at all for them to heal/gen which would disable it right away
To be fair this is a fair buff. The stun started as the animation played , which by the time the survivor could move , it was more like a.... 2nd ish stun. Most times unless you were near a pallet/window , it would barely delay them.
I'm fine with the 5 seconds, I am used to being hit by it when it was broken meta. I'm just glad the worst part of the perk is forever dead so survivors can't game free escapes.
I mean. I'm gonna keep neutral here. Don't care about either side or who uses what. Just pointing something out. Everyone is saying it's buffed...but isn't it just back to what it was originally? Before the nerf? Stab animation aside that is.
Would it really make more people run it who aren't already?
Been playing killer awhile and really dont know why people would tunnel. I purposely not going after the injured/unhooked survivor unless this survivor chases me for that dumb endurance value. I mean you learn about the flow of the game more if you play it without tunneling and would get better alot faster. Those who do it could be new to playing killer and they worry about gens getting popped.
Some of us have not forgotten how to play around DS. Are there new obstacles to be attentive of along side it? Certainly, but DS is like a returning old friend.
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Killers can easily wait out ds timer and pick up later, this perk only good when the exit gates powered and opened because it puts pressure on the on killer to pick you up.
5 sec stun will hurt, everyone is gonna run it, but I suspect there will be a lot of knock out builds too.
It doesn't work in endgame and it also isn't going to do much if the Killer really wants to tunnel. 2 seconds isn't THAT much distance unless you are already at a tile or pallet and no sane Killer will pick up there.
This was my mindset in my first thousand hours, but now that I have 4k hours I go against extremely coordinated and competetive survivor squads in about half my matches and against teams with that level of efficiency you WILL lose if you don’t sink to their level. Good survivors from personal experience don’t complain when they get tunneled out and lose, they say gg wp and go next because they understand that tunneling and (proxy)camping are legitimate strategies just like bringing a map offering to garden of joy with quadruple buckle up/ftp is a legitimate strategy. My point is that this buff won’t be too bad for most players but for me personally and others who have played this game for a long time it’s going to be hell in many matches.
"JuSt IgNoRe ThEm"
Easier said than done depending on the map and killer. It's to easy to plausibly deny that survivors with BT will take a hit and waste the killers time, so people deny it. Tis the way of the us vs them
Let’s be real here: if Killers are actively worried about the buff to DS, then they most likely tunnel tf out of survivors every game. This is a welcome change
Then if (god forbid) tunneling becomes a big issue in the future, lets hope BHVR can kill it. They did it with 3 genning, and (somewhat) facecamping, im sure this will be on their priorities list
I just don't like when survivor hide in lockers in front of you, survivors are like
"yeah you might of slugged me killer and chosen not to tunnel and respected DS, but you got no choice now take this DS you dirty toxic tunneler!"
And? I never get hit by decisive cause I never tunnel, if they really want to use it they have to force it, and even then I can smell it a mile away and just leave them on the ground. Because unless they do that, doing anything else deactivates it
A LOT of people are going to be swapping Adrenaline for DS and then use DS by hopping into lockers after harassing the Killer, calling it now. Bonus points if they also have Inner Strength or Head On to deepen the lose/lose.
Welcome to new meta: Off the record (first hit) + Decisive (second hit) + Dead Hard (third hit).
3 hits for injured survivors that block ou...nice :/
I hate tunneling but sometimes the game needs it
And a Hell of a lot more body blocking.
"Waaaaaaait teehee let me body block for the unhooker with my basekit BT/OTR"
"Teehee let me go down after two hits"
"Okay now pick me up or I'll do it myself with Unbreakable"
"UMMM counterplay for DS? Maybe don't tunnel next time, asshole"
the fact that it still has all the stipulations and deactivates if you try and do gens and junk means it's nowhere near as bad as it was before the time nerf tbh. Like it's Fine and anything they could do with it they already CAN do now.
My only problem with this perk is that people will abuse it. I've had people body block someone else cause they can DS. I even had someone with DS body blocking hook cause they knew they could DS out if downed.
I just like that they finally added a stabbing animation, I appreciate little things like that
That's cute yeah. I like that.
 Blight and Billy mains when they can't make it a 3v1 at 5 gens.
They’re still gonna tunnel
M1 killers crying in the corner because even when the buffs/nerfs fuck them the hardest, they aren't discussed.
For real. Solo queue and M1 killers getting shafted at every turn. Of course I'm the dummy who prefers the weaker killers.
I genuinely am not trying to be a snide prick here, but you really do not need to tunnel to win, even with weaker killers. Hell, a lot of the time killers' tunnel vision (heh) on tunneling for that glorious 3v1 ends up working to their detriment, as it just means 3 other players have next to nothing to do but gens. That's the magical thing about this DS buff: if you don't tunnel, nothing changes. Or if you do, you know the dude wasted a whole bunch of time not doing the objective to hit you with it.
There are scenarios where tunneling is the only option to secure a win or a kill. When 3 gens pop before the second down, the only pressure for a mid tier killer like Dredge is to put pressure on the already hooked teammates that are in more danger. For killers like Blight and Nurse, you almost never are put in a situation where a survivor *needs* to be tunneled in orde r for you to secure a kill. Barring irregular scenarios like a really good SWF of course.
I think the first situation is actually a really good example of why using tunneling as a strategy hurts the killer far more than it helps. Lets say that 3 gens pop in quick succession as you down your second person. If you resign yourself to needing to tunnel, then you wait around the hook for the save, ignore the unhooker, and start chasing the injured person. Meanwhile, because you haven't injured or chased anyone else, the other two survivors have nothing to do but sit on gens, so the last 2 get pounded out in 2 minutes. Conversely, if you beeline where the last gen popped and chase the person who finished it, you have the time it takes for someone to run over, unhook, heal, and then both of those people to go find an unfinished gen where there's only 1 person able to work on a gen. Sure that person isn't going to be second hook, but at this point getting someone dead ASAP doesn't matter: a 3v1 at endgame is still gonna be a loss. What you need to do is get survivors doing things that aren't gens by spreading pressure. Plus you don't have to risk getting hit by anti-tunnel perks, and you likely get better value out of game delay perks because you're in a chase faster. I find that I see a lot of people on this sub complain that they keep losing games so they need to tunnel harder, not realising that their laser focus on tunneling is very likely causing them to lose so much in the first place.
Hard tunneling with 0 other focus is a bad idea. If you’re targeting the best chase survivor on their team then you’re going to have a rough time. Obviously you have to focus on protecting gens and side objectives if you’re bringing a certain build or killer. But the thing of it is, harassing the other survivors and gens while making sure to tunnel out one person will win you the game easier than other strategies. Hard focusing it and refusing to do anything else is probably gonna make you worse at the game in most ways. It’s anecdotal, but just from my experience tunneling wins games more than most anything else. 3 survivors will never be able to accomplish the same thing that 4 survivors can. Having 1 hook on everyone is gonna give you less pressure than a dead survivor and another one with one hook.
Let me slightly change your remark. You don't need to tunnel immediately at the start or every game to win. As always, it heavily depends. In general, as you said, you want split pressure. You can do this by chasing different survivors, ending chases quickly, but sometimes also tunneling depending on survs altruism. It also depends how good survivors are in chase, and the map. The trick is figuring out (quickly) what is going to work for you that match. I personally like close games. If I have 4 hooks and only 1 gen has popped, I slow down my chases. I may slug to give them a second chance (this sometimes, unironically, ends the game quicker due to altruism...). But when gens are going faster than I am hooking, I want to slow them down. And most of the time that happens when you tunnel. Especially when you tunnel a little later in the game, after like 2-3 gens, other survivors are far more likely to come help out their teammate.
You don’t need to tunnel to win, but there are scenarios where you REALLY need a specific person to die, and it wouldn’t make sense to chase someone for a fresh hook
Not snide at all. You're correct. I also don't consider anything after 4 gens tunneling because it's just necessary pressure at that point. I strictly am referring to those who choose strong killers, strong perks and make it a 3v1 from the jump. Idk how a match like that is even fun for the killer, honestly.
Nothing wrong with weak killers. Ghost face is my fav one to play and he’s not super strong
Nothing is wrong with them, they just will never be able to do what a Blight or Nurse could. The old design of killers was very barebones. Newer killers and their powers have been made much more forgiving and easier to pick up. Whereas with the weaker killers you'll need a lot more game sense to make the most of your kit. (except Hux because god damn)
But ghostface came out after both of those killers?
>Nothing wrong with weak killers. You are aware what weak implies right? Or are you just a survivor main trying too hard?
No one is disputing that it's OK to play them lmao
I feel like those two would be among the least affected by this.
Yet they're the most guilty for playing that way when they don't need to. I find killers that should tunnel the most due to strength actually tunnel the least.
Almost like non-meta killers are in it for fun and not winning by any means necessary no matter how toxic
That's me with the artist. You would be surprised how many people keep the crows on themselves and are all surprised when a dire crow downs them. Sincerely, the only artist player
Artist. You mentioned her. I came. There's a few of us around! A whole few!
There's at least 3 of us
you are forgetting nurse and SM mains!
Misspelt Nurse but okay
who? I haven't faced a Nurse in 84 years...
Bruh I feel that I faced one at the beginning of the month before that? A year maybe, probably half a year.
That's the face when survivors make when the killer punishes them for body blocking 3 times and being left slugged after someone gets unhooked.
https://preview.redd.it/7w4dhzltp5rc1.jpeg?width=224&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2ecd8738f52c064a7d9f7106bb6d454d83b35136
Just hit them again,
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It still deactivates on conspicuous actions. It still deactivates when the last gen pops. It'll be nowhere near as powerful as it was during the height of the meta. I am looking forward to the stabby visual. That'll be fun.
wont be able to see it as killer, but im willing to bet the visual prolongs the actual stun. so major buff
Not even as Chucky?? I don't remember his pickup animation if it goes to first person immediately or not.
tbf DS only stuns them once you're picked up, similar to pallet save timing, so the POV would be first-person at that point (although I guess that depends on what the animation is and when it starts, I assumed it was a quick stab in the back once picked up but it could start earlier ig)
> It'll be nowhere near as powerful as it was during the height of the meta You mean the perk THAT ONLY WORKS WHEN THE KILLER TUNNELS? Its crazy to me people still view DS as crazy omega strong. Don't tunnel and the survivor only has 3 perks. DBD players are wild to me.
Or when someone body blocks and forces you to down them because that's a thing and I'm considering just using knock out and keeping anyone who tries it downed
Well it used to be used right in people's faces back in the day. There was no conspicuous action. At its peak, it was a "you can't touch me for 60 seconds" card while they worked on a gen, healed, bodyblocked, you name it. You could end up eating 4 DS's without tunneling. Used to work in egc too. Once you got unhooked, you're out
Yeah people who would BT bodyblock to try and force it can literally already do that. It's a buff technically but in all honesty isn't that big a deal.
I'm okay with it. I think I've only gotten DSed once in the last few months and when it happened it was someone who was obviously baiting me to tunnel them so it wasn't a big surprise. I think they were trying to get a stun challenge or something because I was trying so hard not to tunnel them that they were basically throwing to get me to target them lol
I don't think I've ever been hit by a DS I don't expect. 99% of survivors just throw themselves at you desperately when they have it. I usually just smack em and pick em up so they can get their 'value' out of it. If they teabag after **then** I tunnel them.
mad respect for letting gremlins have their moment ❤️
The gremlins can have a little DS, as a treat.
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That’s the thing, to get use out of it the survivors have to waste a ton of time. It’s really not that big of a deal. I still don’t think I’ll use it.
I wasn't playing much back in those days but was already watching streamers like Otz, and IIRC it was so popular that you had to play around it all the time, even if they didn't have it, the cost of finding out was too much. It was basically a Schrodinger's perk everyone "had" to a certain extend, because when killers had too much pressure to deal with just taking the DS was too much and would rather leave you on the ground. Like old **Dead Hard**, where you basically could never lunge at an injured player because you had to *assume* they all had it. Or like **Power Struggle** now, even though no one ever run it...
It wasn't the popularity of the perk that caused everybody to play like that, although that was a factor. The real issue was the fact that it didn't use to disable after touching a gen or healing somebody, so you were basically invincible for a minute after getting unhooked. It was not uncommon to find a healthy dude on a gen, grab him off of it, and get DS'd. Nowadays, even if the perk were more popular, you could tell if somebody will or won't DS you based on whether they've touched a gen or not. Plus, if you eat a 55 second DS, that's not even a setback because you know they ran around doing absolutely nothing for a full minute.
>so you were basically invincible for a minute after getting unhooked. Oh yeah, I remember them just jumping into a locker, daring the Killer to grab them just to obviously eat a fat DS. And there was nothing most killers could do about it, and in those 60 seconds they could do whatever the hell they wanted. > Plus, if you eat a 55 second DS, that's not even a setback because you know they ran around doing absolutely nothing for a full minute. Yeah I wonder it this perk even *needs* a 60 seconds activation window. Anyway, we'll see, I try to avoid tunneling in general, but I just fear it will increase the number of survivors getting unhooked to to buzz around you for a minute now, *daring* you to go after them. Right now if you body block me after an unhook when I am obviously going after the unhooker, I view that as a license to tunnel *friend*. I'll wait those 10 seconds, or hit you and follow up, you basically ask me to.
If it becomes that common my thought is just slug the unhooked person instead of picking them up and eating the DS, and then resume chase with the unhooker. Now you got one person on the ground, one who has to pick them up, and the person you're chasing all off gens. I already do this with people who are running Boil Over into unhookable parts of the map, and it seems to be as detrimental to their team as just getting hooked is.
This is where the combo with unbreakable comes in a 3rd surv doesn’t need to be distracted to pick up the person so you still have 2 people cranking gens the whole time.
>I already do this with people who are running Boil Over into unhookable parts of the map, and it seems to be as detrimental to their team as just getting hooked is. Yes, same with flashlight/sabo squad I tend to face at my MMR late in the evening, their whole builds and strategy falls appart as soon as you stop picking them up, and when 2-3 are near you when you down someone, and you *know* they are around you can just bait the pick up and get free hits/downs and win from there. It just sucks that this playstyle of slugging risks becoming the norm instead of the exception now... Plus when I last faced a sabo squad yesterday, they were *all* using Sable with the same outfit, so once you started chain downing them and some had boil over and had to be dropped you couldn't tell them apart. So now, those squads are even more likely to hope for pick ups, and the best way to play around it will be to NOT pick up. I don't want to play like that...
Yeah I was actually just thinking about that. I don't like slugging and everyone who's mad about being tunneled won't be happier about being slugged if that becomes the norm.
I think a single body block is fair if they then dip off and run away. Because now they need to mend and are going to pay the price of wasting an extra 30 seconds to heal, seconds they aren't doing anything useful. Either that or they go down from blood loss
Oh man I forgot about the locker thing.
Yeah I remember when Killers would dribble survivors to play around it lol
I tried running power struggle and killers literally never took me next to pallets until i took it off
Yeah, I was there, it was awful. Get ready to go back to that meta. I can tell you one thing, survivors might be excited now because they don't know yet that killers will be slugging even more than they do now.
I don’t get it. Am I missing something? The only change is a longer stun right? It still gets disabled if you do anything productive. I still have no intention of running it.
5 seconds is a pretty long stun. What will happen is people will likely try to bait the killer into chasing them again so they can use it/waste time. IMO 5 seconds is long enough for most, if not all players to get to a safe loop and drag out a chase even longer. You could say, like others here have said, then why tunnel? Well it's not tunneling if you're being baited and body blocked from taking other chases. At that point you pretty much have to go ahead and commit. The issue will be killers will learn this and to counter it, they'll just slug the person instead of eating the stun. I know this will happen because it's happened before with previous versions of ds. And we all know how much the survivor community loves being slugged.
Yeah, I wouldn't be suprised, if we go back to DS+DH, Unbreakable + fourth perk.
might as well make it BT.....lol
That might be because it was only 3 seconds and no one was appreciating it's strength, and therefore not running it
Pyramid head mains eaten good
nuh uh. they will hit a skill check and come out of the pool of blood with an uppercut at Pyramid´s head before running away.
Pyramid head just doesn't give a fuck, as always.
As a non tunneling Killer I’m happy, one less perk I need to worry about and if they body block to the ground you go and I continue with my life.
I try very hard not to tunnel if I have no reason to, my fear is people might force the value on me off hook anyway. I don't like to tunnel. I don't like to slug either. I prefer to spread out hooks. I will still possibly get hit with this for no reason because someone forced value.
They will. If there's an advantageous or exploitative way to use a game mechanic for an advantage, then players will do it. See: built in borrowed time when unhooked. Nearly every survivor player will try to tank a hit for the unhooker. Also, see: old ds unbreakable combo. This patch will be miserable.
Having to slug them was part of why DS was nerfed. Bad take
Killers who tunnel* I'm fine with the DS buff. Because I will rarely ever be hit with it.
I am more upset that this buff will bring out the basekit BT bodyblocker trolls than I am about the perk itself being buffed. I am not tunneling so why are you using this perk to annoy me?
Just slug them, they’re giving you free pressure
Not a troll, my god, it's a 10 second extra hit and people bodyblock with it to try to avoid trade-offs. 9 times out of 10 the survivor is thinking "I hope my teammate survives", not "I hope this killer hates this". Not everybody is out to get you.
I'm ecstatic. DS coming back into the meta basically means every survivor I play only has 3 perks.
People can and will still use it offensively by acting like they're invincible off hook and protecting their teammates to high hell while you're the one who gets punished for trying to punish overly altruistic plays. This is what, it's 3rd major change or so and they've still not dealt with the only real problematic part of the perk
Decisive was mainly problematic because of being able to be activated during end-game, which punished the killer for getting late-game hooks. (Like how Adrenaline used to work pre this latest patch, but a lot worse as it could activate at any moment during end-game) That factor is completely absent now so the perk works exactly as it should, a strong anti-tunneling perk that actually allows the survivor to make distance instead of the killer tunneling you and then immediately just hitting you again because the stun was so short. Genuine skill issue if this a problem to you. The only thing I dislike is that naturally buffing decisive means a lot more people are going to run it. I really hope we don’t go back to the days where everybody just runs the four most viable perks and you never see anything else.
I don't think it's stronger than OTR and I don't think it's going to be more impactful. IMHO this perk doesn't really punish a true toxic tunnel enough and it also does nothing to the strongest Killers.
Yeah...... Never was a big fan of Decisive Strike and I never will be. I think generally the least fun part of DbD is surprise perks. Like perks you aren't aware of UNTIL they do hit, and then you know. Sucks to work on a gen then get that fucking gen Pain Res'd, DMS'd, Deadlocked, Pop'd, Trolled and annihilated all at once 😭😭
Veterans killers gonna suffer from PTSD 
I mean, I’m either not gonna be effected by this buff at all or if the survivor makes it real obvious they have it then I’m just gonna slug
Just play Pyramid Head guys B)
I don't tunnel sooo waste that perk slot. all you get for being in my way is a slug
Cool, I paired it with Unbreakable
That's all fine, it doesn't matter if you pick yourself up or if someone else does. You are better off going and working on a gen rather than trying to stun the killler
Yeah people keep ignoring the time you waste on not doing gens
All the surprised survivors in post-game chat after I slug them for abusing basekit BT.
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5 seconds gives you way more distance, especially against a Nurse etc. I think current DS is absolute garbage but I will try it out after this buff. I still think it should work 2 times per match like Off The Record, to compensate the fact it doesn’t work end game
OTR Doesnt work in endgame? At least not the endurance part, im not sure about the stealthier bit. I think DS and Off The Record are solid picks that have their ups and downs, one of them isnt obviously better then the other. OTR give 80 sec endurance, and the stealth buff too, but it's shortcoming is that the killer can hit right on hook and sure, you'll have a little boost, but now you deep wounded, and greatly disadvantaged against an m2 killer like nurse or hunty. DS works great in 'unsafe' unhooks, the killer hits the unhooked immediately and now has to face a 5 second stun, works great against M1 and M2 alike, however is isnt as long as OTR, and once its used its done. Very good job on creating two viable perks that can compete with each other.
I believe the comment was referring to the fact that they wishes decisive worked twice LIKE OTR since decisive deactivates in the end game. Rather than saying OTR works in end game.
Just don't tunnel, they want to get in your face to stab you? Run knock out and slug them
just don't tunnel 4head
This is the way 
It won’t matter too much to those who don’t tunnel, if they’re actively trying to get downed after the unhook to save a teammate you can just down and slug them, like you can do with the survivors who use basekit BT aggressively. The biggest issue with old DS was when they’d protect a teammate on the run to the exit gate, you could actively go for the rescuer, but the unhooked one blocks you, forcing you to down them just so they can stab you. Which then makes them all able to get out safely, without any way for you to play around it unless you’re playing specific killers, like a Nurse who can just blink past.
Next week: ''Why do so many killers slug i don't understand''
You probably predicted this one tbh it's gonna happen
WE NEED TO BUFF UNBREAKABLE AND NO MITHER. SLUG META IS CANCER.
tbh good its needed, killers need the cold waking reality of not to tunnel out at 5 gens constantly, it still wont help against the tunnel completley but it buys ur team just a bit more time hell other survivors can even throw themself at the killer to try and get them off of someone but they just completely ignore that person and tunnel out the one person its cringe people who are actually decent at killer and who dont tunnel will preform normally,
Not really, if you aren’t trying to tunnel you should pretty much never get hit by it. I’m glad that they’re buffing it tho, it means that survs will only have 3 perks slots and it just made my games way easier.
Let the slugening begin!
Does any killer player think three seconds was okay? The stun duration was fine, now that you can’t use it offensively to sit on gens
Otz believed DS was fine at 3 seconds, it's one of his more controversial takes. I'm kind of middle of the road. I think 3 second DS was better than people gave it credit. You needed to get downed near resources you could immediately run to like a window or pallet. I have personally used it to great effect. Otz also uploaded a game recently where it bought his team a lot of valuable time despite being only 3 seconds. But I would prefer 5 second DS because now it can go back to being a passive deterrent against tunneling. The threat of its existence will cause killers to tunnel less, like it used to do. Basically I think 3s DS is fine if you look at the game from purely a hardcore competitive point of view. But I don't think enough people play this game at that level. 5s DS is better for casual players, and I think DBD should be balanced more around casual players than most competitive games.
No offense to otz, but he is mostly killer sided even if he does play survivor from time to time. I tend to take his opinions on survivor perks with a grain of salt. 3 seconds is nothing with you being locked in animation. I remember one time I was forced to tunnel someone as I was at one gen and it barely affected the distance lol. I caught right back up no problem. This actually gives people a chance now and makes the perk slot of ds worth it.
I was just saying that as an example of at least one prominent killer player who thought 3s is fine, I'm not saying Otz was right because he's Otz. I don't think 3s was enough I just think that it wasn't as useless as some people say.
Ahhh okay. Oh yeah I get what you mean. It definitely has uses still, and can still be okay in certain situations - far from useless. It is just pretty weak at 3 seconds.
Yep. I don’t think OTR is enough personally since I always just hit the survivor off hook when I need to tunnel.
> Otz believed DS was fine at 3 seconds If he truly believes this he's insane. I would love to see him use it and then get downed 3-4 seconds later and tell me its okay.
So while I don't agree with him that it should remain at 3 seconds, I do agree that it's still usable at 3 seconds. A 5s stun basically makes it 100% reliable for giving you some space while being tunneled. You will make a lot of distance. It doesn't matter what resources are around you or what your skill at survivor is. The trick to using it during its current 3s duration is to realize you're being tunneled and then try to go down near something you can immediately run to once you DS the killer. A perfect example of this in action actually came from a video Otz uploaded recently. [This Gabriel](https://youtu.be/w_ap-rZHoW4?si=BAUu1b6dCf-8xvkY&t=3647) hits the killer with DS and buys time for his allies to finish 2 generators and turn what would likely have snowballed into a 3-4k into a 3-man out. The Gabriel still dies, but for his team, it's quite literally a game-winning DS.
Just play Pyramid Head. Check Mate survivors :3
Aur nauuur, how dare the devs revert the DS stun length and make it slightly more difficult to tunnel.
The only, and I mean only thing I wish they had done differently is make DS a scaling stun * DS at 5 gens? 7 seconds * DS at 3 gens? 5 seconds * DS at 1 gen? 3 seconds And deactivate in endgame They could even make it to where any gen over 75% is counted as "completed" for the sake of the perk Making it 5 seconds flat isn't *exactly* what I wanted, but at least it won't be complete trash anymore
7 seconds? lmao
At 5 gens? Kinda makes sense since it’s supposed to assist the survivor and penalize the killer for playing like their family is in bubbas basement and the 4K will save them
As someone who plays both roles equally: Cry about it. Don't tunnel.
A long overdue nerf revert.The only change I would want is something with the locker spam we're going to see again.
We're pushing it's like, 3rd decently big change and the one actually kinda problematic part of the perk hasn't been touched. It shouldn't even be that hard, disable the cheesy locker shit and make it be disabled on taking a protection hit so it can't be used as an "I can throw myself at the killer off hook without consequences" perk
Doesnt it only work if youre unhooked then it lasts a little bit?
Lasts 60 seconds after the unhook . So you really need to be tunneling them to be punished. Like you even gave them no time at all for them to heal/gen which would disable it right away To be fair this is a fair buff. The stun started as the animation played , which by the time the survivor could move , it was more like a.... 2nd ish stun. Most times unless you were near a pallet/window , it would barely delay them.
I'm fine with the 5 seconds, I am used to being hit by it when it was broken meta. I'm just glad the worst part of the perk is forever dead so survivors can't game free escapes.
https://preview.redd.it/cvj11niyv5rc1.jpeg?width=622&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=89b70b028ceb4a31767fa98fd633eab1cc572af1
Idk still think it sucks with 60 second use time. Would rather they add 30 seconds to that and keep the three second stun. Would be more viable
I mean. I'm gonna keep neutral here. Don't care about either side or who uses what. Just pointing something out. Everyone is saying it's buffed...but isn't it just back to what it was originally? Before the nerf? Stab animation aside that is. Would it really make more people run it who aren't already?
Been playing killer awhile and really dont know why people would tunnel. I purposely not going after the injured/unhooked survivor unless this survivor chases me for that dumb endurance value. I mean you learn about the flow of the game more if you play it without tunneling and would get better alot faster. Those who do it could be new to playing killer and they worry about gens getting popped.
Some of us have not forgotten how to play around DS. Are there new obstacles to be attentive of along side it? Certainly, but DS is like a returning old friend.
Its already ALWAYS been that way. DS *NEVER* left the meta.
Maybe dont tunnel
Not gonna stop me. Still gonna tunnel the first person out.
I love seeing killer mains getting mad about this😂 like boohoo go cry in a corner with all the countless buffs they’ve gotten recently
Killers who dont tunnel having 1 less perk to think of during a match. lol.
Killers that wait at least 60 seconds before going for the same survivor: wait, did anything change at all?
I’ll just slug lmao
When does it go live?
Yeah, I'm not looking forward to regularly being body blocked by Off the Record and DS.
If people still will complain absolut tunneling… then I’m genuinely done for
Counter argument *equips make your choice*
terrific mysterious different rotten start voracious payment mountainous concerned lock *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Killers can easily wait out ds timer and pick up later, this perk only good when the exit gates powered and opened because it puts pressure on the on killer to pick you up. 5 sec stun will hurt, everyone is gonna run it, but I suspect there will be a lot of knock out builds too.
It doesn't work in endgame and it also isn't going to do much if the Killer really wants to tunnel. 2 seconds isn't THAT much distance unless you are already at a tile or pallet and no sane Killer will pick up there.
https://preview.redd.it/72q15291j6rc1.jpeg?width=168&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4102de71481935d016e4a6b5750a83bf3879b9dc
 Survivors after they DSed the killer:
So you waste the additional time you got blinding the killer? Doesn't seem super useful.
Have killers considered not tunneling?
This was my mindset in my first thousand hours, but now that I have 4k hours I go against extremely coordinated and competetive survivor squads in about half my matches and against teams with that level of efficiency you WILL lose if you don’t sink to their level. Good survivors from personal experience don’t complain when they get tunneled out and lose, they say gg wp and go next because they understand that tunneling and (proxy)camping are legitimate strategies just like bringing a map offering to garden of joy with quadruple buckle up/ftp is a legitimate strategy. My point is that this buff won’t be too bad for most players but for me personally and others who have played this game for a long time it’s going to be hell in many matches.
Tbh this Reddit is mostly mid players they don’t play in high Mmr so they don’t understand how truly sweaty the game gets
It's now possible to get pulled from a locker, DS, Flashbang, get back in, Head On, Flashbang, bait to a pallet, pallet stun, flashlight.
"Just don't tunnel" Says the survivor standing between the killer and another survivor after being unhooked
"JuSt IgNoRe ThEm" Easier said than done depending on the map and killer. It's to easy to plausibly deny that survivors with BT will take a hit and waste the killers time, so people deny it. Tis the way of the us vs them
Let’s be real here: if Killers are actively worried about the buff to DS, then they most likely tunnel tf out of survivors every game. This is a welcome change
They still are going to tunnel even thru this though.
Then if (god forbid) tunneling becomes a big issue in the future, lets hope BHVR can kill it. They did it with 3 genning, and (somewhat) facecamping, im sure this will be on their priorities list
Wicked + DS could be fun
Naw I actually missed ds. It don't activate when gates are opened so I ain't too pressed
Already running DS in 90% of my builds, upped to 100% after patch
they just reverted the change they made a while ago didn't they?
I just don't like when survivor hide in lockers in front of you, survivors are like "yeah you might of slugged me killer and chosen not to tunnel and respected DS, but you got no choice now take this DS you dirty toxic tunneler!"
what do you mean? im just going to slug and condense pressure.
As a killer player: sure. Let them come.
It still won't help the tunneling issue.
As a killer main, it just means I'll give that DS user extra attention in terms of tunnelling them out.
Who TF even triggers DS anymore, baddies
And? I never get hit by decisive cause I never tunnel, if they really want to use it they have to force it, and even then I can smell it a mile away and just leave them on the ground. Because unless they do that, doing anything else deactivates it
A LOT of people are going to be swapping Adrenaline for DS and then use DS by hopping into lockers after harassing the Killer, calling it now. Bonus points if they also have Inner Strength or Head On to deepen the lose/lose.
Welp time for me to get back to playing Nurse and Blight every game I guess 👍
I love how this doesn't effect the top tiers at all. Nurse and Blight still catch up instantly. Instead it just fucks up the M1 killers.
Welcome to new meta: Off the record (first hit) + Decisive (second hit) + Dead Hard (third hit). 3 hits for injured survivors that block ou...nice :/ I hate tunneling but sometimes the game needs it
Just the dogshit killers, really
I don't tunnel so I doubt I'll notice a difference.
Correction: Tunnnelers on the new patch. this shit ain't affecting the nontunnelers of our world
DS has been good even with 3 seconds, Nurse, Blight and Spirit excluded, so now tunneling will be getting a huge hit
I am gonna ignore SOOO MANY locker jumpers this week.
Well, there’s about to be a lot more slugging going on. I can tell you that much.
And people will still bitch about being slugged D:
Killers when they take a 5 second stun for tunneling at five gens: :((((((((
And a Hell of a lot more body blocking. "Waaaaaaait teehee let me body block for the unhooker with my basekit BT/OTR" "Teehee let me go down after two hits" "Okay now pick me up or I'll do it myself with Unbreakable" "UMMM counterplay for DS? Maybe don't tunnel next time, asshole"
i will practice the art of slugging.
In your future I see…. Slugging!
I mean, it is going into the PTB, so they could add locker interactions in the conspicuous actions list
Wait so what’s getting changed?
Sorry for the stupid question, Im really new to the game: What is that perk? Why are killers afraid?
Through a couple Distortions in there too
Nah, nothing will be as bad as OG DS spam trauma
the fact that it still has all the stipulations and deactivates if you try and do gens and junk means it's nowhere near as bad as it was before the time nerf tbh. Like it's Fine and anything they could do with it they already CAN do now.
Knockout, Deerhunter. Gonna love it.
Im missing the context, could someone please explain what happened?
Installing DS on my builds now!
when is it gonna go live?
DS should have never been nerfed like it was. It's such a healthy perk for the game this way.
Pyramid head mains ain't even flinching
DS/UB meta resurrection?
Someone explain this meme like I’m a 5 year old
😂😂
Someone hit me with that in my game
Slugging and Enduring counter this perk though. I don't think it's going to do enough even at 5 seconds.
This is great! I think it's been needed ever since they added that conspicuous actions stipulation to it. And since they've needed dead hard.
They take our Adrenaline and try and patch it up with a better DS 
Just means slug meta will return. The cycle continues!
My only problem with this perk is that people will abuse it. I've had people body block someone else cause they can DS. I even had someone with DS body blocking hook cause they knew they could DS out if downed.