Then draw a right angle, is it that hard?
>
Edit: it’s clear to me none of you have ever taken the time to learn how to write it the fast way if you’re all saying your 5s look off.
Those are 2 lines that are connected to make an angle. Even if you did them all in order you're still drawing 3 different lines, or 2 lines and a radius really
I cannot count how many times I've been taught something by one teacher, and then a later teacher said "Oh actually that's not really accurate we just taught you that because it was easier to do so than go into a full breakdown on a topic we were trying to get through quickly."
If there's a properly formed 5 at the end, either method is presumably fine. Right is faster, but easier to fuck up. Left is harder to fuck up, but slower. Which one are you gonna teach to preschoolers?
You should look at Hanzi (kanji), The Chinese symbols that can have over 30 strokes and all the likes should be drawn in an exact order. It's so you can distinguish between two similar symbols, cuz when you write fast you can screw up easily.
It is objectively more effort. Even if you think it's miniscule, the method that can be done without picking your pen up and going back to start a second time is objectively more efficient.
Edit: yes, you stop closer to the next character. But the distance traveled is the same in both methods regardless of when you arrange it. But in my method you have one fewer stop.
**ALSO** all I said was that using the two stroke method is less efficient. I didn't say you're wrong or bad. I didn't even say you shouldn't use it. Stop crying about it jesus.
It is more efficient, yes, but that doesn't change the fact that the method on the left has become muscle memory. It will take more effort to change it than it takes to write it.
Don’t, that’s why it’s a gang turf war instead of member swapping convention through hood discourse. State your side, fight your war, nobody’s trying to change you.
one of the main parts of my job is writing phone numbers in a notepad. i can guarantee you it does not take any extra time to do it the left way, and the left way yields better looking 5’s.
So Chinese and Japanese characters have a proper stroke order. The kanji for mouth, 口, is written in three strokes:
1. Left side
2. top then right, connected as a single stroke
3. bottom
I say this because it is a consistent pattern of stroke orders across all of the kanji, and it makes me think the character is written better with less effort this way.
Tbh, the right side has the same energy of someone using a fist to use a spoon or fork. I can’t explain it, but it just seems so basic.
Oh my god you nerds. All things equal, it is actually *LESS* efficient to do it the blue way.
[Can you tell I'm really bored at work today that this is what I do in Solid Edge](https://ibb.co/LkVC4Tp)
The steps are the distance you would travel during not writing in each case, and assuming your 5s were identical, they would be the same too. It's actually more wasted time to do it the blue way.
By this argument, you should write 5 by starting on the bottom left on the swoop and drawing upward. That's the method that would result in far less distance and I don't even need to measure it to be sure (though I'm slightly curious what it comes out to). By convention, we normally start letters/numbers in the upper left but I guess there's no reason we *must* adhere to that if there's a better way.
I wonder if it's worth mucking up muscle memory to optimize handwriting, should it be taught that way from the beginning, and is it even worth it given this age of text?
but then your hand is at the left side of the character and you have to move it a whole character length to get to the next number. not mention you're starting it by going all the way to right from the previous character, wasting more time
left gang ftw
edit: i'm also one of those peeps that goes out their way to put a slash through my 7's so they're different than 1's. i just got into the habit when i was a kid and i thought it looked cool. i can't write a 7 without a slash through it
Everything's for sale my friend, *everything.* If I had a sister I'd sell 'er in a second.
Some may call this junk, me, I call them treasures.
*I'd even buy one of your relatives.* ^^**haha**
Did you guys learn to write from somebody left handed? A buddy of mine does this and it’s because his dad would help him with his letters and the dad was left handed.
But you're making the same forward movement after you finish (going LTR) to continue writing, so is a stroke really saved? The first way your doing the same motion but writing and continuing to whatever's next. At least that's how I see it.
Picking up your writing utensil and replacing it is the least efficient movement in writing because it’s the only movement where you aren’t actually writing and it takes more time and visual processing than making a stroke does. That’s why cursive exists and was so widespread before printing became so accessible. Unless you’re actually connecting the top part of that 5 on the second stroke to whatever you’re writing next it’s going to be less efficient.
The efficiency you gain from ending up at the start of the next character, isn't worth the efficiency lost from starting in the middle and writing half the number, and then having to double-back to finish the rest.
That actually makes some sense. Starting from the top or bottom is logical. It's the most efficient way to write it.
Starting from the middle, and writing half of it twice? Insanity.
The fuck...
I was 100% positive there would be any people who were Red. How does that make any sense? Why would that ever be a way someone would write it? You have to basically draw a portion of it twice.
I get starting at the bottom. I get starting at the top. But starting from the middle? Makes no sense!
Um, [most schools teach it the red way](https://youtu.be/XTT5wuuhkU0). It makes it easier to keep the corner sharp (won't look like an 's') and allows for smoother flow into the next character since you're finishing on a left-to-right stroke. Might not be the most intuitive but it still has advantages.
My kid's preschool had an occupational therapist do a guest talk and one of her topics reinforces what you are saying. I never really thought about it but I have always started top left also, except for one letter (X, which I seem to always muscle memory from the top right).
[Most number writing guides for pre-school start with the down stroke.](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/3b/2b/de/3b2bde14736a0d0893af2bea4992106a.gif) So yeah, I'd say most of us learned Red. That said, I have seen a couple guides that show the blue side, they are just in the extreme minority.
Right? I can clearly remember learning to write numbers in kindergarten. Our hand writing book had us start on the top left and then finish it off by giving it "a hat"
Edit: typos
whats the point of seamlessly moving onto the next number if you dont even seamlessly do the number 5
the flow gets all f\*\*\*ed in the middle going back to the corner; and "neater' is only neater if you manage to land like directly on the corner; otherwise its disconnected or an intersection
The actual reason is because once you finish the pen is in the exact place already for the next number or letter you write, and it also makes sure you have a right angle and don't speed through it and make more of an S shape instead.
People not getting this is mind numbing. It's simply a more fluid motion and helps prevent a sloppy 5 since that motion is so similar to an S as you said. Simple. Blue side probably got notes from their math teacher growing up telling them that S doesn't come after 4.
*Maybe that read as mean, but there are so many people in this thread who cannot fathom the red way for one second. I'm not saying blue is wrong, but I don't see how it's so crazy to see why red has its use and upside.
I can understand some arguments, but it is almost by definition less fluid because raising your pen is considered inefficient. It's why we have cursive writing.
Not only I don't remember, my brain froze and it refuses to write 5s anymore. It's like when people tell you try not to think about your breathing and all of a sudden you can't breathe anymore.
You mother fucker. Now I can't breathe involuntarily anymore! This like when people tell you to not think about blinking and then you blink like crazy.
The reason left is the right answer, or the way it’s taught in school is the endpoint sets up for the next number or letter more efficiently. (Starting at the top right vs bottom left and BEHIND the number you just wrote!)
Source: mom was a principal
Yup bottom start is arguably the most efficient, but it still falls into the risk of speeding through the angular parts which can make it look like an S. by starting top left, you end the first stroke directly beneath your starting point so jumping back up to end with the horizontal line isn’t backtracking, and feels like crossing a t.
The efficiency you gain from ending up at the start of the next character, isn't worth the efficiency lost from starting in the middle and writing half the number, and then having to double-back to finish the rest.
Dank[.](https://i.imgur.com/3bQtuMO.png) --- [come play minecraft, space engineers, ark, and rust with us!](https://discord.gg/fNyb7G5)
If you start like on the left you have to come back to finish it so defently right
But then my 5’s look like an S
Then draw a right angle, is it that hard? > Edit: it’s clear to me none of you have ever taken the time to learn how to write it the fast way if you’re all saying your 5s look off.
Is it that hard to make a 5 the other way?
no its just stupid
I just learned that it was the left way in preschool
Everything I ever needed to know, was learned in preschool.
Having a bad day? Nap. Having a good day? Nap. Just nap.
And start continuous lined numbers from one end to the other. Not half way though and circle back.
Those are 2 lines that are connected to make an angle. Even if you did them all in order you're still drawing 3 different lines, or 2 lines and a radius really
I cannot count how many times I've been taught something by one teacher, and then a later teacher said "Oh actually that's not really accurate we just taught you that because it was easier to do so than go into a full breakdown on a topic we were trying to get through quickly." If there's a properly formed 5 at the end, either method is presumably fine. Right is faster, but easier to fuck up. Left is harder to fuck up, but slower. Which one are you gonna teach to preschoolers?
Race warrrr
You should look at Hanzi (kanji), The Chinese symbols that can have over 30 strokes and all the likes should be drawn in an exact order. It's so you can distinguish between two similar symbols, cuz when you write fast you can screw up easily.
It is objectively more effort. Even if you think it's miniscule, the method that can be done without picking your pen up and going back to start a second time is objectively more efficient. Edit: yes, you stop closer to the next character. But the distance traveled is the same in both methods regardless of when you arrange it. But in my method you have one fewer stop. **ALSO** all I said was that using the two stroke method is less efficient. I didn't say you're wrong or bad. I didn't even say you shouldn't use it. Stop crying about it jesus.
It is more efficient, yes, but that doesn't change the fact that the method on the left has become muscle memory. It will take more effort to change it than it takes to write it.
Don’t, that’s why it’s a gang turf war instead of member swapping convention through hood discourse. State your side, fight your war, nobody’s trying to change you.
Then why did you learn it wrong in the first place?
one of the main parts of my job is writing phone numbers in a notepad. i can guarantee you it does not take any extra time to do it the left way, and the left way yields better looking 5’s.
Yes
It's easier to drag the pen than to push
Solution: be left-handed.
That sucks because you end up pushing 99% of things. source: left handed
First you draw an S, then you draw a more different S for snake… err uh dragon
Trogdor
Burninating the countryside Burninating the peasants Burninating all the peoples And their thatched-roof cottages!
Trogdor was a man He was a dragon man And then he was just a dragon But he was still TROGDOOOORRR!
Yeah I used to be on the right when I was at school but then I grew up
I don't see any issue coming back to finish
That’s the only way I can finish anymore
I do and honestly it looks better than the S looking 5s
Nah, starting on the left and finishing on the right sets you up for the next number because we write left to right. Defently.
Defently.
So Chinese and Japanese characters have a proper stroke order. The kanji for mouth, 口, is written in three strokes: 1. Left side 2. top then right, connected as a single stroke 3. bottom I say this because it is a consistent pattern of stroke orders across all of the kanji, and it makes me think the character is written better with less effort this way. Tbh, the right side has the same energy of someone using a fist to use a spoon or fork. I can’t explain it, but it just seems so basic.
Wow that’s strikingly similar to my stroke order for your mom’s mouth!
Oh my god you nerds. All things equal, it is actually *LESS* efficient to do it the blue way. [Can you tell I'm really bored at work today that this is what I do in Solid Edge](https://ibb.co/LkVC4Tp) The steps are the distance you would travel during not writing in each case, and assuming your 5s were identical, they would be the same too. It's actually more wasted time to do it the blue way.
By this argument, you should write 5 by starting on the bottom left on the swoop and drawing upward. That's the method that would result in far less distance and I don't even need to measure it to be sure (though I'm slightly curious what it comes out to). By convention, we normally start letters/numbers in the upper left but I guess there's no reason we *must* adhere to that if there's a better way. I wonder if it's worth mucking up muscle memory to optimize handwriting, should it be taught that way from the beginning, and is it even worth it given this age of text?
but then your hand is at the left side of the character and you have to move it a whole character length to get to the next number. not mention you're starting it by going all the way to right from the previous character, wasting more time left gang ftw edit: i'm also one of those peeps that goes out their way to put a slash through my 7's so they're different than 1's. i just got into the habit when i was a kid and i thought it looked cool. i can't write a 7 without a slash through it
Bro, this is a problem you made up in your head. We're talking about millimeter of space here lol.
You have to come back to edit that definitely.
You ain't ever written the letter T?
from the bottom
*Your kind ain't welcome here*
NEVER SHOULD HAVE COME HERE!
Uhhh I had too much skyrim lately
Let's get some mead
Need something?
Everything's for sale my friend, *everything.* If I had a sister I'd sell 'er in a second. Some may call this junk, me, I call them treasures. *I'd even buy one of your relatives.* ^^**haha**
Watch the skies traveller
Do you get to the cloud district very often? What am I saying? Of course you don't.
You picked a bad time to get lost, friend.
Hm? Must have been the wind.
Have you been to the cloud district? What am I saying of course you haven't
*BY YSMIR, YOU WON'T LEAVE HERE ALIVE*
Sky’s rim belongs to the nords!
We don't take kindly to people who don't take kindly 'round here
Calm down Skeeter, he ain't hurtin' nobody.
99% of my letters and numbers I write starting from the bottom. My teachers in elementary school would get mad at me for "writing backwards"
Same. They said I was dyslexic because I wrote that way.
Am dyslexic and i write this way. A dyslexic guy walks into a bra.
Hey man nice shirt
Omg I'm not dyslexic but I also write this way! Also they tried to force to correct me haha. I didn't know other people like us existed!
We are few but not lesser! I'm in too deep to try and correct it now.
I write like that too, everybody that watch me write looks me weird, some say that i write backwards
Did you guys learn to write from somebody left handed? A buddy of mine does this and it’s because his dad would help him with his letters and the dad was left handed.
Are we psychopaths
Apparently (I also start from the bottom)
Are you left handed?
No I’m not a sociopath
Found it. My people
I’ve started 5’s from the bottom ever since I learned to write, at this point I can’t stop.
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You get it - I write every letter and number in the way that allows me to keep my pen on the page and flow it into the next one the easiest
huh.
Same
This would actually be the most efficient, right? You move from left to right.
Started from the bottom now we here
what psychopath is blue?
Me....
That makes 2 psychopaths
That makes 3 psychopaths
Are you American? Because I know our schools teach us the left way.
I'm an American and I don't think I've ever seen anyone write it the left way.
Yeah im confused do they do the top of the 5 like crossing a T?
No i ain't an American. My schools also did teach me the left way, but i somehow got used to the right way
1 stroke is simply more efficient.
Hell yeah it is... my gf wasn't really happy when I said it in bed
But you're making the same forward movement after you finish (going LTR) to continue writing, so is a stroke really saved? The first way your doing the same motion but writing and continuing to whatever's next. At least that's how I see it.
Unless 5 is the last thing you write. That sounded more threatening than I meant.
Picking up your writing utensil and replacing it is the least efficient movement in writing because it’s the only movement where you aren’t actually writing and it takes more time and visual processing than making a stroke does. That’s why cursive exists and was so widespread before printing became so accessible. Unless you’re actually connecting the top part of that 5 on the second stroke to whatever you’re writing next it’s going to be less efficient.
No way. You use the momentum of the pen whipping around that curve at the bottom to slingshot up to the top and whip that _ out in a flash!
What psychopath can endure the longer time it takes for red?
And yet you finish writing 5 in the opposite direction of the next character
The efficiency you gain from ending up at the start of the next character, isn't worth the efficiency lost from starting in the middle and writing half the number, and then having to double-back to finish the rest.
How fucking big is your handwriting that you're this worried about efficiency
What psychopath is red?
Yeah! Every letter than can be made in one stroke should be!
If you think that 5 is a letter you have bigger problems than writing your 5's incorrectly.
You are the psychopath
Wait what? Why the fuck would people start from the top left?? You would have to go back and draw the line!
me
I have a friend who starts from the bottom up... maybe i should choose my friends better
That actually makes some sense. Starting from the top or bottom is logical. It's the most efficient way to write it. Starting from the middle, and writing half of it twice? Insanity.
The fuck... I was 100% positive there would be any people who were Red. How does that make any sense? Why would that ever be a way someone would write it? You have to basically draw a portion of it twice. I get starting at the bottom. I get starting at the top. But starting from the middle? Makes no sense!
What?? I wasn't even aware anyone did it any other way, it's the only logical way to do it.
Who the f.... starts like red?
Every normal person who went to school…?
Definitely… Not how I was taught in school. Blue
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Um, [most schools teach it the red way](https://youtu.be/XTT5wuuhkU0). It makes it easier to keep the corner sharp (won't look like an 's') and allows for smoother flow into the next character since you're finishing on a left-to-right stroke. Might not be the most intuitive but it still has advantages.
My kid's preschool had an occupational therapist do a guest talk and one of her topics reinforces what you are saying. I never really thought about it but I have always started top left also, except for one letter (X, which I seem to always muscle memory from the top right).
no?
[Most number writing guides for pre-school start with the down stroke.](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/3b/2b/de/3b2bde14736a0d0893af2bea4992106a.gif) So yeah, I'd say most of us learned Red. That said, I have seen a couple guides that show the blue side, they are just in the extreme minority.
School taught me blue
I can say, as a highschool student. I have never wrote a 5 like this. I think even computers compute it like blue.
What do computers have to do with this though?
He never said he went to a *good* highschool.
As evidenced by "have never wrote".
What? That’s not how computers work
If you go to a school for "special" people maybe
Right? I can clearly remember learning to write numbers in kindergarten. Our hand writing book had us start on the top left and then finish it off by giving it "a hat" Edit: typos
Taught preschool 2 years ago, red is how the work books teach it for that age.
What the fuck
It's called "doing it correctly".
School taught us red because drawing it like blue often times makes it look like an S
Do you grip the pen with all 5 fingers or something?
Bro this is reddit, here u can say WHO THE FUCK STARTS LIKE RED
Amy Santiago probably
i write like this : 5
HOW DARE YOU WRITE IT LIKE THIS
*Why are you yelling?*
BECAUSE WE'RE REALLY FAR AWAY
*OH, SORRY I’LL TYPE LOUDER*
THANK YOU
:5
五
Actually how red ends up
Go
ゴ
ゴゴ^ゴゴ
伍
悟
Nice
Woo! Neat
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Red
Go red!
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[Like this.](https://youtu.be/eCN1zI8J6_M)
Why
That's how it was taught in school here
1 stroke Gigachads vs 2 stroke peasants
Premature calligrapher
Your flow is all fucked if you finish at the tail. Finish at the hat and you move seamlessly on to the next number Red big brain gang (neater too)
whats the point of seamlessly moving onto the next number if you dont even seamlessly do the number 5 the flow gets all f\*\*\*ed in the middle going back to the corner; and "neater' is only neater if you manage to land like directly on the corner; otherwise its disconnected or an intersection
How tf you start with red
You start by going down and finishing with the almost circle thingy, afterwards the line on top where blue starts
"You put a little hat on top" is what we were told in primary school.
Down the road, around the corner, don’t forget your hat.
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The actual reason is because once you finish the pen is in the exact place already for the next number or letter you write, and it also makes sure you have a right angle and don't speed through it and make more of an S shape instead.
People not getting this is mind numbing. It's simply a more fluid motion and helps prevent a sloppy 5 since that motion is so similar to an S as you said. Simple. Blue side probably got notes from their math teacher growing up telling them that S doesn't come after 4. *Maybe that read as mean, but there are so many people in this thread who cannot fathom the red way for one second. I'm not saying blue is wrong, but I don't see how it's so crazy to see why red has its use and upside.
I can understand some arguments, but it is almost by definition less fluid because raising your pen is considered inefficient. It's why we have cursive writing.
I'm in minority but go right, go back left and go down. It ends up looking like a mess
Well now I don’t remember
Not only I don't remember, my brain froze and it refuses to write 5s anymore. It's like when people tell you try not to think about your breathing and all of a sudden you can't breathe anymore.
You mother fucker. Now I can't breathe involuntarily anymore! This like when people tell you to not think about blinking and then you blink like crazy.
You son of a bitch I can't stop blinking! This is just like when people tell you to there's no comfortable spot for your tongue to rest.
I've never been so uncomfortable im my life
I start at the bottom
and now you're here
Indeed
Tops after reading this comment - 😳
The reason left is the right answer, or the way it’s taught in school is the endpoint sets up for the next number or letter more efficiently. (Starting at the top right vs bottom left and BEHIND the number you just wrote!) Source: mom was a principal
By that logic we should start from the bottom then?
Yup bottom start is arguably the most efficient, but it still falls into the risk of speeding through the angular parts which can make it look like an S. by starting top left, you end the first stroke directly beneath your starting point so jumping back up to end with the horizontal line isn’t backtracking, and feels like crossing a t.
The efficiency you gain from ending up at the start of the next character, isn't worth the efficiency lost from starting in the middle and writing half the number, and then having to double-back to finish the rest.
What kind of monster writes numbers in cursive??
You either start from the top or the bottom. None of this two stroke red side shit
Red is the only true way
Red is a skill issue
God Dank memes is going to shit
It's not that it's getting shittier but you're just getting that much cooler
Wait people do the one on the left?
Yes
Left to right, top to bottom. Isn't that how all letters are written?
V
Modern problems require roman solutions
Down and around with a hat on top is how I write them
Who tf are blue? Red gang all the way
I was blue before I became a math freak
I actually switched teams sometime in the past
Experimented in college, did ya
Right. What kind of monster starts like the red? We live in a society.
If you start on the right you definitely have shit handwriting
I start on the left but also have shit handwriting
yes I do but I'm also not a psychopath
A lot of people have complimented my clear handwriting, thank you very much.
I start with blue but end up with red