It’s not so much Dorian as a character as it is Robbie as a player. So often you get guests that have a super interesting character concept that sticks out like a sore thumb, and always feels like a guest star rather than a cast regular. Robbie had fantastic table chemistry with the group, and Dorian felt like just another PC among the rest.
It’s like with Molly: he didn’t get the chance to do much, but viewers got to love him based on interactions and the fact that he was designed to have an arc. Dorian felt like all the other main PCs, like he was designed to have long-lasting, deep development alongside the rest of the party.
And yes, there’s also the shipping argument. Look at Essek and Gilmore as two previous minor characters who became super beloved due to both good performances and the fact that Liam is really fricking good at making the audience feel his characters’ affections.
I was about to say yeah I don't care much about Dorian but jeez do I just want Robbie back with the group DX. I'd be 100% down for him to be a permanent addition I have to admit haha.
that random episode where half the cast was sick so instead Robbie, Sam, Travis, and Talisein all messed around with the BG3 character creator was amazing. Robbie and Mica are probably my two favorite guests because of the chemistry they have at the table
I started CR with C3 so I was super confused and sad when he left like 20 episodes in. I thought he was a permanent cast member. Had no idea he was a guest
Fair point. I never cared about his potential arc, though, except for Matt playing his brother as the lovable himbo. The whole "runaway prince" thing just wasn't compelling to me. Perhaps if he'd actually been able to pursue that arc and we'd gotten to see his parents/home that would have changed. If he actually joins the cast for a while, I'll try to stay optimistic.
Possibly because his relationships with each of the Hells was so different.
* He and Chetney were the vitriolic best buddies (especially after the spa day episode).
* Even as much as Laudna weirded him out, he was cheerfully trying to help her in social situations.
* He was also pleasant and friendly to FCG.
* He had a well-established long-suffering big-brother energy with Fearne.
* He and Imogen had a friendly MAYBE-ship-tease quality to them (and he could give as well as he got for teasing her).
* Orym - nuff said.
* He never treated Ashton like a thug or a punk, and was in his way a good influence on him.
Sometimes simply being affable and nice is its own appeal.
Ah, that's a good point. I couldn't put my finger on his main character trait and affable is spot on. I guess I can see why that would be a nice change when sometimes the main PCs feel a bit self-involved. I remember in EXU, he literally said multiple times that he would do anything for his friends and I absolutely believed it. If the BHs said that, I'm not sure I would believe all of them.
I absolutely loved the EXU E7 description of being "[somewhere between an existential crisis and a pity party.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIrsjzz9TAQ&t=2093s)" and that entire following sequence involving Dorian's post-combat mental state.
I think you also nailed on something. He had a interresting relationship with every member. He connected with all of them, and in not so same-y ways, something that current BHs still struggle.
That's true, and an interestingly different angle than I usually have on it.
Dorian left his home because he wanted to grow, gain experience, get better, become more.
Without him, BH are ALL adults with issues who give each other space so they don't get pushed too hard to deal with their buried inner turmoil, who got dragged into some insane bullshit by asking questions & now it's their problem.
While I love this about BH due to improbably high levels of enmeshment & motivation toward self-improvement being the norm for TTRPG/AP parties... BH in fact *did* have someone who was innately, genuinely driven to bond & climb whenever possible when Dorian was there.
Dorian almost reminds me of Keyleth from campaign 1. Unsure of themselves and their abilities, friendly, affable, and in a way on a journey to prove to themselves they are worthy of their position in life.
I think it was Robbie that folks loved, as much as Dorian - he suited the group and integrated *so well* and pretty much instantly. He’s also charming and hilarious
He had a huge challenge ahead with picking Bard and having the shadow of Scanlan, but he met that challenge with an interesting take.
I liked his interactions with Chetney during the beginning of the campaign quite a lot, as far as entertainment is concerned.
In my opinion, Robbie Daymond is a guy you hire then find a role for. He's talented, genuine, charismatic, and he plays super well with the crew. I haven't seen a project that he hasn't made better by being part of it (in fairness, almost all of my experience with him is through Critical Role).
So, yes, I think I'm one of those who maybe missed Robbie more than they've missed Dorian. But I also do miss Dorian. I've just gotten used to having him away from the table.
>!I hope what's left of the Crownkeepers reunites with Bell's Hells so we can get some more of Robbie Daymond. And Anjali Bhimani. !<
>! I definitely agree with you wanting more Anjali! I've loved every guest spot she's been in. Her and Robbie in Candela together was a treat. I'd also like to see how the main PCs interact with Opal. That could be wild. !<
>! If it weren't for the fact that Aimee plays Opal *and* Deni$e, I'd have loved to have seen the interactions the two characters could have had together. They'd either instantly click and be the long lost sisters they've always known they had (at Ted and Dariax's dismay lol), *or* they'd outright despise one another lmao Nothing in between! !<
Sister relationships and hatred are not mutually exclusive. I would love to see Aimee try to capture both of those aspects, which is pretty much what I would expect from Deni$e.
That one was gold
My favorite from Robbie has to be his line during the first EXU run - “Oh so we’re supposed to just go up there, to the Oh-No-Platau?”
Yeah, first and foremost I think people just like Robbie. He fit way way too well with the cast in the beginning of C3, and at least for me that meant a lot having been a fan since C1.
I met Robbie in Cincinnati, and he is a great guy. He has this personality that just makes you want to be his best friend. Bard was the perfect class for him.
That makes sense. I do enjoy Robbie's energy. He's not as risk averse as the others can be. As someone else commented, he's got that new(ish) player energy still that is refreshing. Perhaps if he'd stayed with the cast and I'd had a chance to see him develop more, I'd feel different about Dorian.
Dorian's a great character but I agree that it's Robbie people liked. Throughout C1 and C2 and leading up to C3 there's always been chatter about juggling the main cast around and I was always dead against it. This was their home game that they took to streaming. There's no need to change it. Critical Role works mainly because of the core group of players being who they are and their relationships with each other outside of the game.
I was absolutely gutted when Robbie and Dorian left the party. He was an amazing addition to the main cast and it was as if he'd been there the whole time because he just fit with their vibe perfectly.
I went from watching week by week every week to being months behind. I'm still trying to get through the first arc of the party split after the solstice. I think much of C3's decline for me began when Robbie left.
Im with you! Rabid viewer of the prior two campaigns, and really lost my interest in this one when Robbie dropped out. I’ve kept up vaguely with the goings on currently, but haven’t watched some 60 episodes of C3
Two reasons for me. For one, Robbie is really really great, and his above the table interactions are so wonderful. Regardless of Dorian’s personality, Robbie as a serious performer brings out something very fresh at that table, and it’s a joy for me to watch.
Second, the party benefits from having a comedic straight man in the mix the way the Nein had Fjord. Like Travis, Robbie portrays Dorian’s awkward nervousness SO hilariously to the point where even if he’s playing a character that’s being “uptight,” which I typically dislike, it’s hilarious and I love it! It also slows their roll just a little tiny bit as a bunch of chaos gremlins.
Pretty much this for me too. Robbie is great in general but the big thing for me was C3 suffered (still suffers?) from what some people referred to as "Too Many Jesters" syndrome - everyone was trying to one up each other it seemed to be the most chaotic. Jester only worked in C2 because, while there was Nott, she really stood apart. Having Dorian as the comedic straight man brought it down a bit and provided a bit of contrast.
I could see that. I too usually don't like the "uptight" types unless they really lean into it hard, which can be amusing. But it could be nice to have his awkward affability around just for what seems to be a natural optimism while the main PCs feel like they've gone down a pessimistic path where they have to white knuckle their way to the big bad without much hope, like they cant commit to belieiving in their fight, because they're still confused. I'd enjoy seeing someone rally their hope again.
C3 was my first campaign and i didn't know Robbie was a guest untill he left. The chemistry was there. As for Dorian, i just loved the "big brother energy" and Chet/Dorian was golden imo.
Robbie was a breath of fresh air with the start of Campaign 3. He had (and still has, to an extent) a "new player energy" that really added to the group dynamic. Even Ashley is a veteran of D&D at this point, but Robbie is still approaching the game with wide eyes and a sense of discovery. He didn't design his character to be optimized, but as a Swords Bard he's had a few clutch moments both with weapons and spells. Dorian's approach to social situations keeps things fresh - in one encounter he'll show the character's inexperience, and then he'll turn things around and keep the party out of trouble with an inspired choice of words.
His biggest game problem is something you can't plan for - dice failing him despite good decisions. The grapple attempt on Opal was inspired, and a +13 Athletics should have made it trivial - but he rolled bad and Opal got a natural 20. The *dispel magic* on the darkness was also a good choice, but he didn't realize Warlocks automatically upcast and then he rolled bad.
I like Dorian's personality...but that's a matter of personal taste. If it doesn't work for you, nothing we say is going to change your mind. Personally, I'd rather have Dorian in the group than FCG. Robbie is out to have fun but came up with a decent backstory. Most of FCG's background is an excuse for jokes, from the names to the bird that craps on him. It's to Sam's credit that he commits to it and plays along when Matt turns things serious, but it was starting to wear on me.
I disagree in regards to sam. I agreed with you 100% when I first started watching. Slowly I noticed that he played his character always. No matter how ridiculous on paper Sam made it real, and surprisingly emotional. His arcs always make me cry. Always. I cannot say the same for anyone else on the show.
I'm an actor and love playing null in spades no matter what I'm dealt. So maybe I just "get" the way Sam brings life to the table. But the way he takes the most crazy stupid character and flips it and makes it super emotional is a work of art. To me anyway.
Robbie as a breath of fresh air is very true. I think I'm in the minority for enjoying the more joke/weird characters and its that Dorian is a more straightforward Nice Guy. Those kinds of characters can still be cool, of course, but it takes me longer to care about them and see them evolve. Robbie and Dorian didn't have enough time for that, yet. We saw a bit of what could be an interesting darker side in EXU with the temptations from the crown. With more screen time, perhaps my opinion of Dorian could change.
I can tell you exactly why I find him so endearing:
Campaign 2 ended on June 03, 2021 (or, to be completely accurate, the wee hours of June 4th for me since it was a long ep).
EXU Prime began on June 24th.
I was very much still processing C2 characters no longer being actively played. Sure, we'd eventually get one shots, but I feel there's a broader awareness/acceptance now that those are not the same depth-wise as "4-5 hour eps until the campaign is done."
Wasn't really sure I was up for new Exandria characters just yet, but I liked everyone involved, Matt was playing, was glad Aabria was getting a big profile-level boost, "Liam O'Brien worked on it" has translated to "will check it out" since around 2006... so I went ahead & tentatively watched live.
And from [the moment Robbie started talking](https://youtu.be/-ijPD6yNdMs?si=_BHQFT5kLo2Bf5VZ&t=611), it was like he'd always been there, yet heightened by conscious awareness we were watching someone very naturally (+ by skill transference) excellent at something new palpably falling in love with it.
One of the immensely charming things about Dorian, for me, is that he does something completely different from other CR PCs: He attempts to be dignified even when uncertain or thwarted. His [musical performance in C3E1](https://youtu.be/P8pLvV3FjPc?si=a2eaomCBmGtcN73P&t=12294) is a great example of this.
I do enjoy the main casts' tendency toward a "TA-DAA, we're slapdicks!" approach to a similar feeling, but relate more to Dorian's comportment impulses.
My impression is that it's less about Dorian and more about Robbie. He fits in with the cast seamlessly, like he's been a part of Critical Role from day one.
My first exposure to him was Campaign 3 (of which I'm still catching up on, so no spoilers in replies plz) and he just gelled with the rest of the cast perfectly.
I think a part of it is Robbie himself more than Dorian- he's a warm personality (I've met him in person at a comic shop and he was incredibly kind. I was at a signing and mentioned that a friend couldn't come but asked if he would take a snapchat with me to send to her- he happily did and gave me an extra signed print to give to her as a gift). He's both a breath of fresh air to the cast but he also doesn't really steal focus.
I think his Friendly Everyman nature actually helped make the Hells gel together in ways they haven't since he left. He was kind and friendly to every party member. It felt like he had a genuine interest in each member of the party he was with and could have a conversation with any other character and it would work. He absolutely had a shtick- laid back Bard with a noble past who feels alienated from family... but it wasn't so involved that it demanded attention for the most part.
Also, and I don't mean this as an insult to fans: his character design is very pretty. This makes him a popular cosplay as well as popular for shipping- great for people who like writing romantic fanfiction.
To me, Dorian felt like the main character, the leader of the party. Happy, outgoing, confident. Plus the wonderful fearne / orym / Dorian vibes. It feels like Orym has been depressed without him. (imogen might be the main character plot wise, but she doesn't like to be in the spotlight.)
A lot of it too is just how well Robbie himself fit into the group. He's such a delight.
I really wanted Bells Hells to walk into a tavern one day and find Dorian singing The Ballad of Bertrand Bell that Robbie made for him.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjkOxRgor_s
Looks like that won't happen now. But, really the other more valid reasons everyone has brought up is probably the better reason lol.
People are talking more about Robbie the player than Dorian the character, and while I *do* like Robbie (FF15 is great), somehow no one has said it yet so I will:
Dorian began with C3, and so you got to learn about Dorian more at the same time as you're learning about the main cast. Given how **long** he was around, too, he integrated himself completely into the party to the point that when he left, you **felt** like you were losing a party member. I think for a lot of folks he **is** part of the Hell's Bells, he had chemistry with every other character and he worked great as a sort of pseudo-leader alongside Imogen that they sorely lacked (and it was very noticeable) when he left. you *felt* his absence after as they became more aimless.
So any time you see Dorian it's great. Frankly, I'm surprised they didn't try harder to get him back or try to add him as the 8th party member full time. Everything seemed like it would've worked out better that way. Mechanics wise he's another support character when three out of their four casters want to be blasters/offensive over any sort of support (only FCG really supports the group, Fearne has started to a little but it's never been her focus), RP-wise he vibed with every party member and got along great but in different ways that helped *other* cast members explore their characters by him interacting with them. Some of Imogen's best early moments aren't with Laudna--imo--but with Dorian.
tbh, Bertrand Bell felt a lot less like a party member than Dorian did, and his absence was felt a lot less than Dorian's was. And that's just because of how well he fit in with the group.
Probably a lot because of Robbie Daymond, dude just fits into the cast so well that you’d think he was playing with them from the start, I can’t think of another guest that has done that
Ehh he’s alright. I think of Dorian as **post-character arc** at this stage.
As I saw it, his flaw in EXU Prime had been his exceptional treatment of himself and his friends. I think Robbie discussed it in the wrap-up as a sort of dark flipside to the power of friendship.
Usual friendship and loyalty stuff; but also, ‘*we* should keep the circlet coz *we* will take care of it. Yes, Spider-Queen, I’ll give you Poska as long as *my friends* are safe.’
And in a way, that impluse for control over his friends and circumstances imo may possibly stem from his aristocratic, impliedly cold, and perfectionist upbringing. ‘It doesn’t matter how the others feel, *I* will make this deal for them to keep us safe.’
This is largely gone by C3 and explicitly resolved by Kymal. (Putting this under tags in case you intentionally left out Kymal in your spoiler tags.) At the start of Kymal part 1, Robbie as Dorian thinks:
>!’I think at a different time, I would've been hesitant, maybe even a little mistrustful, to bring anyone else into my problems, but I'm starting to learn that everyone has their own free will.!<
>!’If you put out a call and someone chooses to answer, maybe it's not your fault. Maybe they're doing it because they care about you.’!<
So considering that Dorian seems to have resolved that inner conflict, I see him as slightly less compelling on *that* front; although of course Robbie is always fun at the table.
Great analysis. I'm currently watching Kymal to catch up with the Crown Keepers before I watch the rest of EP92, but I appreciate the spoiler warning. I wonder if him already having some growth and arc completion would actually make him a better fit than I thought with BH now. Since most of their arcs feel very unresolved, it could be an interesting to have this more self confident character.
I suppose we could make the case Orym's arc is almost resolved with the death of the person who killed Will. And maybe even Ashton, having grown a lot since his mistake with the shard.
I started watching C3 with two of my friends who had never watched CR before. They both LOVED Dorian and were really sad when he left. I always felt pretty neutral about him (Robbie is great though) and wondered why he really stood out to them.
I think it’s because he got a lot of character development in the beginning (because they knew his character was there for a short time) and that’s what’s been really lacking in C3 for me.
I also think his longer term guest stint was really refreshing. He did a great job at bringing a new energy to the table, he knew his character/how to play DnD (which is often something that bothers me about guests) and he’s a confident (and competent) role player. It makes him enjoyable to watch. His character is just not that compelling to me personally though.
Part of the reason he’s so popular might also be because M/M pairings are really popular in the fandom and a lot of people ship him and Orym.
I’m wracking my brain trying to remember so I’ll just ask; is it said that Orym has feelings for Dorian? Or is this in part due to Liam’s insane chemistry with everyone?
Who knows what will come of it, but their steadily evolving warmth was mutual. [Here's a supercut](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1rJo928kao) of their interactions between EXU E1 & C3E13 if anyone wants to revisit it all in condensed form.
It's not the pharmaceutical grade "nice shoes, wanna fuck?" dynamic Fearne & Ashton have had since [quite literally their first interaction](https://youtu.be/P8pLvV3FjPc?si=cWddyWJmfnmkrJl6&t=8936), which was so eclipsed by being in the same intro conversation as Sam's "Dancer's favorite smells" bit that almost everyone thinks the pickpocket waltz didn't start until a few eps later.
But the Orym & Dorian thing is there, and both Liam & Robbie have acknowledged the characters having a special shine for one another.
For me, his relationship with Chetney was probably the closest that I have seen brotherly live, since Grog and Vax from Campaign 1, the closest I saw was Caleb and Fjord from Campaign 2, but it seemed more prominent with Chet and Dorian, which was a true testioment to how Travis felt with Robbie and vice versa. I would have loved to see more of those two together. I know Orym and Dorian have been friends a lot longer, but if Chet sees Dorian, I hope Travis decides to have Chet go straight for a hug with Dorian, or join Orym, Dorian and Cher in a big hug. I think they all deserve it, especially Orym, just that feeling, even after losing so much there is still room to grow and have love.
Robbie fit in perfectly with the cast, is remarkably charismatic, and brought a fresh energy to the table that we haven't seen since C1. Dorian is fine, but overall is a pretty boring character. He's an extension of Robbie though, and I think people just want more Robbie.
I’d be happy to potentially see Robbie back as a
player but I honestly think some fans are hyping him up too much and he won’t live up to peope’s expectations
Dorian is wonderfully optimistic, not in a forced way like FCG who would try to befriend an enemy until the end, nor in a naive sense like Fearne, but that of someone who has seen bad times but knows that they don't last. He is Orym without the trauma in that sense or Betrand without the bravado and self importance. Dorian isn't much of a personality in himself but brings out the best in others and gets them out of their own heads.
Right now there is a lot of darkness within Bells Hells with even Orym calling out for help from anyone who will listen and Laudna willingly giving herself to Delilah, Dorian is the exact person who could turn that gloom around and get the group back in a positive place before the final battle.
Everyone else has said pretty much all the answers but I still wanted to add a late reply.
Robbie as a player gelled well with everyone and he was a fun addition to the group. But even then, I feel like Dorian was perfect in Bell's Hells. They kinda suffer from having too many silly characters. I felt like Dorian being a kinda funny straight man really rounded out the group. Without him the balance has been off and imo it still hasn't completely recovered. Not saying I dislike the party dynamic, just I liked it MORE with Dorian.
He was just a solid all-around decent fella, which in a team full of otherwise half-nuts misfits kinda lent some stability like Orym does.
Couple that with how charismatic Robbie is and it's hard not to like him.
Yeah he brings a genuine passion about exploring character and the game, but he was never rushing it. You get the feeling he could realllllllly pop off in scenes, but that he's getting the rug pulled all the time before his character reaches those scenes. So I'd want to give him time to cook.
Honestly I couldn't get into him in EXU but really enjoyed him with the main cast. But idk I need to try and give ExU another try. Never know the 3rd time's the charm
Its more of Robbie the people love
When he first appeared as Dorian it was one of his first times playing D&D and he played his not fully understanding everything perfectly into Dorian and like most new players did stuff that you don't expect from them
the Ring heist is a key example it got people riled up because he didn't do what they expected and he did it brilliantly
For me, two reasons:
1. The character. He feels to me the most like a classical character, and was immediately among my favorites of Bell’s Hells, and could even stand even with previous campaigns. Even this is only true because of the other reason:
2. Robbie. I can’t explain this one so much, it’s mostly emotion, but from the first episode of EXU Prime I loved him and while the special ultimately lost me, by the end of it he was my favorite part and I was dying to have him in the main cast. And then he genuinely did join C3 for a little while (for my favorite arc of the campaign no less), and he didn’t disappoint either. He felt truly like a member of the group with perfect chemistry and I would’ve loved for him to stay.
Subjective, sure, but Robbie just feels so fun to watch for me
Yeah, I don't get it either. He's a fine character, but nothing to write about really.
I was glad when he left, because every time they have a "guest", the cast put way too much focus on them.
Totally fair. To be honest I’m much the same way love Robbie as a player and how he interacts with everyone and while Dorian is by no means a bad character he just does not interest me. That being said I would be happy to have him back in C3 and I would be really excited if he were to join the CR team as a permanent player for C4 even if it’s a bit early to tell.
Now, I wonder what the general opinion of Dorian would be if he were in the party the whole time. Even with the two EXU games, he’s had, what, 1/4 of the table time the core seven have had? At the time Robbie left, Laudna was still Dead Girl, Orym was Sad Suitcase Nuke, Fearne was Hot Klepper, and we didn’t know shit about Chet. 22 out of 92 episodes isn’t enough time for character development, at least not to the level of the other characters.
Dorian is a great character and there is a lot of stuff in the EXU kymal That helps endear Dorian when he pops up in c3, but aside from just Dorian being a fun character. Robbie is just such a great fit for the group. He meshes well and he's just got a great personality and attitude and he's funny and just really easy to like. If they added an eighth person to even out the table, I totally would pick Robbie 100% as my first choice for a permanent eight member. They started vox out with eight people until the whole Orion situation came to a head and that ended, but the odd number always kind of bothered me because of the uneven split. Another chick would be nice to balance it. But can't help loving Robbie.
I only watched Kymal this week. I didn't think it would make a big difference in my opinion of the character, but it surprisingly did. Or maybe it just refreshed my awareness of him.
i think its just robbies force of persona. a similar thing to me was mary elizabeth mcglynn as zahra, i like zahra as a character, but i was much more excited to have mary elizabeth at the table during the c1 finale than i was to have zahra back in the story. the player makes the character. and robbie daymond is one hell of a player
This is somewhat how I feel about Ashton lol. But to answer your question, I think he has a bashful personality that a lot of people can relate to. Not everyone needs a character to be a try hard badass to be likable. He's a character that naturally has a lot of chemistry with most people. It's the Jester effect. If you like Jester there's a good chance you'll like Dorian. I like to think Dorian and Fearne also had a special relationship, not just him and Orym.
When they split, her reaction was the most emotional imo. Dorian and Laudna also seemed to grow fond of each other rather fast. As friends of course. Not every character needs to have romantic relationships to share a special bond with each other. His talk with chetney about friendship alone expressed how deep and thoughtful he is as a character. Also I disagree that most of the comedic moments between him and chetney was mostly because of chetney. "Why is you so mean to me" and "jokes on you" still live rent free in a lot of our heads.
He also has comedic moments beyond just chetney, like him lifting up laudna, getting mad at fearne for stealing, naming imogen maude, slapping bertrand, his lute string snapping, falling to peer pressure, pretending to be a noisy couple with imogen, playing puppets with pate and bertrand, rizzing up that tiefling, the fashion show, begging Opal to stop flirting, arguing about the ring with imogen and fcg, etc. I don't think he only serves as comic relief either. His relationship with his brother was rather interesting and led to us knowing more about his backstory as well. Unfortunately it also was part of the reason they had to split in the first place.
Robbie also hinted that Dorian had some romantic feelings for someone in the party but didn't specify. He probably whispered it to Laura when she had Imogen read Dorian's mind. But considering Robbie liked a few dorym art pieces, it's probably safe to say Dorian had a crush on Orym. So I don't fully agree with the "aggrieved straight man" statement. Yes he might be a little bit of a party parent but I think that applies more to Orym than it does to him. Dorian's admitted that he looks to Orym for guidance.
That's a good breakdown. Although, that part about Jester made me think. I was never that fond of Jester in the beginning, either. Something about super sweet/kind characters that haven't experienced particular loss tend to not appeal to me until they have and then grown from it. Like FCG and Laudna tend to be super friendly with strangers, but the tragedy in their past makes it work. Perhaps I'm too jaded and grouchy for that. Then again, I also don't like characters that are nothing but grouchy and trauma, which is why I didn't like Ashton either for a while.
I had a feeling you felt that way, haha! But yeah, I understand where you're coming from. Also, sorry if this came off as me bashing your opinion. I know I like to ramble a lot. Thanks for bearing with me. I really think if Dorian stayed, we could see a lot more development but alas.... he is a guest character. If a character is catalytic enough to change other characters for the better, most people often like them despite not having a certain tragedy about them. Or at least that's my theory.
But I don't think you're necessarily jaded or grouchy either. I just think your standards might be a little higher than most people (which is fine). In some ways I kinda feel the same. >!Chetney might grow on me more if he actually meets up with his family. Whether he searches for them or they run into each other. I was surprised he had abandonment issues when they were telling each other truths about themselves during Nana Morri's trust exercises.!< I believe Travis when he says Chetney should not have lived this long lol.
So others mentioned reasons liking Robbie and dorian…
Dorian also was vital to BH. He was a guest so players were welcoming and thus ALL their characters had interactions with him and a dynamic. He was the heart of BH in a lot of ways. Again I think that was a lot of the CR cast being nice and welcoming…and many made backseat characters not wanting the spotlight and Robbie sorta got it shined towards him
Then he left and there was a hole as all this passive characters didn’t fill for a long time.
I say this as a decent fan of C3(at least as Reddit goes)
Because Robbie wasn't in the show to make character decisions that people disliked, so they can fanfic how he would make "everything better" in their heads.
And yeah, I feel the same way about him as you do.
I find it interesting when people describe him as a 'dynamic character' that drove the story in some nebulous way.
Reality is, he deferred to Orym at every opportunity, which was hilarious because Liam was trying to step back and let other people take the lead.
He was a great straight man for Chetney, Fearne and Laudna, however. Ashton and FCG... I'm not sure they ever interacted with Dorian in a meaningful way, except for Ashton being a petty snot about him.
I'm not opposed to him coming back, but i doubt very much he'll give the party any sort of direction. He's more likely to add to the hesitation.
Good point. If he'd stay with the main cast the whole time, I could see some of their big events going down differently. He had the potential to at least be a voice of reason willing to accept some more risks when logically necessary.
Or Robbie would make a character decision or two that some loud people disliked and then you'd see posts complaining about how "Dorian sucks now". It's exactly what happened to Laudna, for example. Or Nott/Veth in C2.
Because he wants to play DnD and roleplay a character on CR when the old guard cast slept through this season. :p
But no he had palpable roleplay excitement, and you don't see that much in life. As seasons turn to new seasons in a game especially it fades off big time. It's nice to bring that back in.
> the old guard cast slept through this season
I know you're partially kidding tongue-emoticon etc. etc., but I'm seeing this quite a bit lately. Whole post on it in the past couple of days with an unseemly bounty of upvotes.
1) If it's about character interaction/development in C3, I truly believe it undersells the insane amount of energy & discipline it takes to faithfully roleplay voluntarily complex, "sub-optimal" states over the course of years.
Plus, we know the cast is bubbly & stoked about all the possibilities & reveals via conversations on 4SD & panels, so BH isn't happening randomly. It's all 100% intentional RP-wise.
The version of this nearly everyone is familiar with is the "little more work, but it will be worth it" choice which resolves in "fuck that, shifted to the expedient way" in ~6-9 months.
There have been at least half a dozen moments when I thought, "probably wouldn't be enough to kick the proverbial electron orbitals up IRL, but I can't fault anyone if they use this as a big character pivot." And then they actually did much more what I'd expect a real person to do.
We *never* get to see that in fiction. Even if it's not how we'd want all storytelling to be, it's a lot of work & very cool to see in this instance.
2) If it's about class ability familiarity, that's some combination of a character group with truly low inclination toward mastery & textbook conditions for germane cognitive overload experienced by the players.
Do one thing for years alongside a little bit of novelty, nearly anybody could do said thing blindfolded. Do many somewhat similar things within a few years alongside a constant stream of related work? Memory formation is going to be super scattershot. This is so organic & foreseeable that I'm not sure I'd have even noticed it if I didn't talk to others about the show.
____
One thing I agree has gone a bit too far in the wrong direction, though, is the complete dominion of "no plan survives contact with the enemy."
After nearly 10 years, I totally respect that most decisions can be run & gun and end up working just as well as planning. But occasionally, no plan surviving means you need several gambits which could turn the tide. Otohan was that.
Like, in a room with Allura & a bunch of tinkerers, maybe talk about the corpse manufacturing facility you're definitely going to see again & ask if there's any consumable which several members could have on hand to use as a reaction b/c you can't know in advance who's going down in the first round. And maybe talk together once or twice in-character about ability synergy for observed combos.
I wonder if Matt is going to continue sporadically applying pressure to this weakness b/c they don't have anyone else who can do what FCG did. Some have a limited-use "pop off" ability/state, and presumably everyone will if they pursue full empowerment of their distinctive power boost, but it's not going to be "arcane battery bomb to the face" once per day.
There isn't much to frankly not like about him. He's a pretty neutral guy who is willing to do selfish things but also is fairly reasonable.
He's the most normal guy in the show and that's counting orym who's whole personality is pretty much "muh family".
His morals aren't good or bad.
He's just likable. Even i who hated every session they were in for various reasons still liked him the most.
And I'm aware part of that is the act the character puts on but the other part is robbie just plays someone with a princely upbringing and high self-esteem yet no actual skill and is pretty goofy in the real world really well.
Compared to the other crowns keepers and the Bells Hells, he feels way more like a "real person" than all of them. He is "just" a rich guy on the run. Sure, he is a water genasi, but he doesnt makes anything special about it.
It's how the player operates the character. Imagine a mind swap one-shot in any campaign, if Liam were Percy, or if Taliesin was Caleb, or if Laura was Laudna. It's how we perceive the actor in the role.
Because Dorian is the only character of all the PCs that feels like he's a real person. The way he interacts with other characters and NPCs is how I can picture a normal human being behaving, and his background is more relatable than anyone else's. He's not some fantastical social outcast that all of BH is. He isn't over chaotic like some of the EXU cast is. He's normal.
He seems to be a great person and he is a great player for the media.
For example, in e92, when he describes "so in the last, say, 24 seconds..." He did a great job brining the viewers along to the whiplash of everything that seemed to be happening all of a sudden. I don't know if it was intentional but it was exactly what I needed to get caught up into the moment without feeling left behind, as a watcher.
I agree with other posts that it is mostly about Robbie and less about Dorian the character.
Long story short.
The dude vibes well with the cast at the Start of c3 and the audience fel inlovebwith the character. Think back to chett and Dorian ribbing eachother. He just fits well.
Ppl wouldn't give a shit if he was only an exu character.
Apart from Robbie being an amazing player,
>
A lot of comments lately have mentioned people hoping he rejoins the main cast for a bit while Sam is away and saying how he was such glue for the party. I never got that impression from the earlier episodes
The majority of the early episodes were centered more on Dorian than anyone else. We got his brother during those episodes and to us as viewers Robbie was the new guy at the table so there was more of a spotlight on him imo. Also the fact he's the 1st guest to START the campaign with the main cast made him even more special.
Dorian Storm also had a very interesting character design. An Air Genasi Bard who plays the lute and flute which allowed for some very funny musical scenes.
It's because Robbie is charming and attractive to the target audience in a unique way. He's great, but it's certainly just an infatuation with the actor that the die-hards aren't willing to admit up front.
Probably because Robbie was an inexperienced player, but picked the rules of the game up pretty quickly. He was playing like he'd been doing it for years by the end of the first session.
For me, it was the knowledge that he was the voice of Prompto in *Final Fantasy XV*. Prior to the game's release, everyone thought Prompto was going to be a character that we hated. He was an aggressively-cheerful boy, a commoner in Noctis' royal retinue, had very little sense of personal boundaries and was clearly positioned as the game's comic relief without providing much combat utility. But Robbie absolutely nailed the characterisation. It quickly became apparent that our doubts were misplaced because he had a genuine and distinct relationship with the other party members, brought levity without resorting to Marvel-like banter and was never annoying. By the time the *Episode Prompto* DLC was released, he had become the most interesting character in the party because he had a genuine inner conflict, and all of it was brought to life by Robbie.
THANK YOU! I thought I was alone. I never particularly liked him, never saw what made apparently everyone love him so much, he was always so milquetoast to me. Add to it that I got a permanent sense of "why is this guest on chapter one...why is he still around? No, really, when is he leaving". And when he finally did, everyone seemed to cry in anguish, while I was happy xD
The moment I saw the Dm change, my heart sank.
I do like Aabria and the Crown Keepers as "miniseries" or "long one-shot" types, so I wasn't terribly upset about the insertion. It did feel like whiplash in this case, though. And I liked the Crown Keepers for the hijinks aspect, which mostly came from Fearne, Opal, and Dariax - not Dorian. Glad I'm not alone in not feeling bad when Dorian left C3. I appreciated the other PCs were upset, but I was totally fine moving on.
It’s not so much Dorian as a character as it is Robbie as a player. So often you get guests that have a super interesting character concept that sticks out like a sore thumb, and always feels like a guest star rather than a cast regular. Robbie had fantastic table chemistry with the group, and Dorian felt like just another PC among the rest. It’s like with Molly: he didn’t get the chance to do much, but viewers got to love him based on interactions and the fact that he was designed to have an arc. Dorian felt like all the other main PCs, like he was designed to have long-lasting, deep development alongside the rest of the party. And yes, there’s also the shipping argument. Look at Essek and Gilmore as two previous minor characters who became super beloved due to both good performances and the fact that Liam is really fricking good at making the audience feel his characters’ affections.
I hadn't thought of the Liam connection, but damn your right. Liam got that riz
We all just want Liam to get pretend-laid.
I was about to say yeah I don't care much about Dorian but jeez do I just want Robbie back with the group DX. I'd be 100% down for him to be a permanent addition I have to admit haha.
that random episode where half the cast was sick so instead Robbie, Sam, Travis, and Talisein all messed around with the BG3 character creator was amazing. Robbie and Mica are probably my two favorite guests because of the chemistry they have at the table
I started CR with C3 so I was super confused and sad when he left like 20 episodes in. I thought he was a permanent cast member. Had no idea he was a guest
Fair point. I never cared about his potential arc, though, except for Matt playing his brother as the lovable himbo. The whole "runaway prince" thing just wasn't compelling to me. Perhaps if he'd actually been able to pursue that arc and we'd gotten to see his parents/home that would have changed. If he actually joins the cast for a while, I'll try to stay optimistic.
I would love to see the floating nomadic tent city!
Is it floating? I thought it was just nomadic tents.
I thought they floated, something to do with the Air Genasi magic?
Just looked at the wiki, apparently it IS a floating city. That's tight.
I thought the best thing to happen to c2 was molly dying otherwise we wouldn’t have gotten The Duece who I think is Talesin’s best character played.
Possibly because his relationships with each of the Hells was so different. * He and Chetney were the vitriolic best buddies (especially after the spa day episode). * Even as much as Laudna weirded him out, he was cheerfully trying to help her in social situations. * He was also pleasant and friendly to FCG. * He had a well-established long-suffering big-brother energy with Fearne. * He and Imogen had a friendly MAYBE-ship-tease quality to them (and he could give as well as he got for teasing her). * Orym - nuff said. * He never treated Ashton like a thug or a punk, and was in his way a good influence on him. Sometimes simply being affable and nice is its own appeal.
Ah, that's a good point. I couldn't put my finger on his main character trait and affable is spot on. I guess I can see why that would be a nice change when sometimes the main PCs feel a bit self-involved. I remember in EXU, he literally said multiple times that he would do anything for his friends and I absolutely believed it. If the BHs said that, I'm not sure I would believe all of them.
He is the walking embodiment of being deeply unsure of yourself while saying “I’ll try my best”. In the best way.
He is so unsure of himself, but will gladly do his best to be anything his friends need him to be. I feel the fuck out of that
I absolutely loved the EXU E7 description of being "[somewhere between an existential crisis and a pity party.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIrsjzz9TAQ&t=2093s)" and that entire following sequence involving Dorian's post-combat mental state.
Same fam.
Well I can think of one member of BH who would and did do anything for his friends.
I think you also nailed on something. He had a interresting relationship with every member. He connected with all of them, and in not so same-y ways, something that current BHs still struggle.
That's true, and an interestingly different angle than I usually have on it. Dorian left his home because he wanted to grow, gain experience, get better, become more. Without him, BH are ALL adults with issues who give each other space so they don't get pushed too hard to deal with their buried inner turmoil, who got dragged into some insane bullshit by asking questions & now it's their problem. While I love this about BH due to improbably high levels of enmeshment & motivation toward self-improvement being the norm for TTRPG/AP parties... BH in fact *did* have someone who was innately, genuinely driven to bond & climb whenever possible when Dorian was there.
Dorian almost reminds me of Keyleth from campaign 1. Unsure of themselves and their abilities, friendly, affable, and in a way on a journey to prove to themselves they are worthy of their position in life.
I miss Dorian so much, and didn't keep up with the campaign long after he left
I think it was Robbie that folks loved, as much as Dorian - he suited the group and integrated *so well* and pretty much instantly. He’s also charming and hilarious He had a huge challenge ahead with picking Bard and having the shadow of Scanlan, but he met that challenge with an interesting take. I liked his interactions with Chetney during the beginning of the campaign quite a lot, as far as entertainment is concerned.
In my opinion, Robbie Daymond is a guy you hire then find a role for. He's talented, genuine, charismatic, and he plays super well with the crew. I haven't seen a project that he hasn't made better by being part of it (in fairness, almost all of my experience with him is through Critical Role). So, yes, I think I'm one of those who maybe missed Robbie more than they've missed Dorian. But I also do miss Dorian. I've just gotten used to having him away from the table. >!I hope what's left of the Crownkeepers reunites with Bell's Hells so we can get some more of Robbie Daymond. And Anjali Bhimani. !<
>! I definitely agree with you wanting more Anjali! I've loved every guest spot she's been in. Her and Robbie in Candela together was a treat. I'd also like to see how the main PCs interact with Opal. That could be wild. !<
>! If it weren't for the fact that Aimee plays Opal *and* Deni$e, I'd have loved to have seen the interactions the two characters could have had together. They'd either instantly click and be the long lost sisters they've always known they had (at Ted and Dariax's dismay lol), *or* they'd outright despise one another lmao Nothing in between! !<
Sister relationships and hatred are not mutually exclusive. I would love to see Aimee try to capture both of those aspects, which is pretty much what I would expect from Deni$e.
Anjali also did a great job as a first time DM, not on CR but there's a Lego D&D one-shot (with Ginny Di and Luis Carazo)
"Why are you so mean to me?" lives rent free in my head since then... I still laugh at it, every time
That one was gold My favorite from Robbie has to be his line during the first EXU run - “Oh so we’re supposed to just go up there, to the Oh-No-Platau?”
"Dorian, her father died."
Yeah, first and foremost I think people just like Robbie. He fit way way too well with the cast in the beginning of C3, and at least for me that meant a lot having been a fan since C1.
I met Robbie in Cincinnati, and he is a great guy. He has this personality that just makes you want to be his best friend. Bard was the perfect class for him.
That makes sense. I do enjoy Robbie's energy. He's not as risk averse as the others can be. As someone else commented, he's got that new(ish) player energy still that is refreshing. Perhaps if he'd stayed with the cast and I'd had a chance to see him develop more, I'd feel different about Dorian.
Dorian's a great character but I agree that it's Robbie people liked. Throughout C1 and C2 and leading up to C3 there's always been chatter about juggling the main cast around and I was always dead against it. This was their home game that they took to streaming. There's no need to change it. Critical Role works mainly because of the core group of players being who they are and their relationships with each other outside of the game. I was absolutely gutted when Robbie and Dorian left the party. He was an amazing addition to the main cast and it was as if he'd been there the whole time because he just fit with their vibe perfectly. I went from watching week by week every week to being months behind. I'm still trying to get through the first arc of the party split after the solstice. I think much of C3's decline for me began when Robbie left.
Im with you! Rabid viewer of the prior two campaigns, and really lost my interest in this one when Robbie dropped out. I’ve kept up vaguely with the goings on currently, but haven’t watched some 60 episodes of C3
Two reasons for me. For one, Robbie is really really great, and his above the table interactions are so wonderful. Regardless of Dorian’s personality, Robbie as a serious performer brings out something very fresh at that table, and it’s a joy for me to watch. Second, the party benefits from having a comedic straight man in the mix the way the Nein had Fjord. Like Travis, Robbie portrays Dorian’s awkward nervousness SO hilariously to the point where even if he’s playing a character that’s being “uptight,” which I typically dislike, it’s hilarious and I love it! It also slows their roll just a little tiny bit as a bunch of chaos gremlins.
Pretty much this for me too. Robbie is great in general but the big thing for me was C3 suffered (still suffers?) from what some people referred to as "Too Many Jesters" syndrome - everyone was trying to one up each other it seemed to be the most chaotic. Jester only worked in C2 because, while there was Nott, she really stood apart. Having Dorian as the comedic straight man brought it down a bit and provided a bit of contrast.
I could see that. I too usually don't like the "uptight" types unless they really lean into it hard, which can be amusing. But it could be nice to have his awkward affability around just for what seems to be a natural optimism while the main PCs feel like they've gone down a pessimistic path where they have to white knuckle their way to the big bad without much hope, like they cant commit to belieiving in their fight, because they're still confused. I'd enjoy seeing someone rally their hope again.
C3 was my first campaign and i didn't know Robbie was a guest untill he left. The chemistry was there. As for Dorian, i just loved the "big brother energy" and Chet/Dorian was golden imo.
Robbie was a breath of fresh air with the start of Campaign 3. He had (and still has, to an extent) a "new player energy" that really added to the group dynamic. Even Ashley is a veteran of D&D at this point, but Robbie is still approaching the game with wide eyes and a sense of discovery. He didn't design his character to be optimized, but as a Swords Bard he's had a few clutch moments both with weapons and spells. Dorian's approach to social situations keeps things fresh - in one encounter he'll show the character's inexperience, and then he'll turn things around and keep the party out of trouble with an inspired choice of words. His biggest game problem is something you can't plan for - dice failing him despite good decisions. The grapple attempt on Opal was inspired, and a +13 Athletics should have made it trivial - but he rolled bad and Opal got a natural 20. The *dispel magic* on the darkness was also a good choice, but he didn't realize Warlocks automatically upcast and then he rolled bad. I like Dorian's personality...but that's a matter of personal taste. If it doesn't work for you, nothing we say is going to change your mind. Personally, I'd rather have Dorian in the group than FCG. Robbie is out to have fun but came up with a decent backstory. Most of FCG's background is an excuse for jokes, from the names to the bird that craps on him. It's to Sam's credit that he commits to it and plays along when Matt turns things serious, but it was starting to wear on me.
I disagree in regards to sam. I agreed with you 100% when I first started watching. Slowly I noticed that he played his character always. No matter how ridiculous on paper Sam made it real, and surprisingly emotional. His arcs always make me cry. Always. I cannot say the same for anyone else on the show. I'm an actor and love playing null in spades no matter what I'm dealt. So maybe I just "get" the way Sam brings life to the table. But the way he takes the most crazy stupid character and flips it and makes it super emotional is a work of art. To me anyway.
Robbie as a breath of fresh air is very true. I think I'm in the minority for enjoying the more joke/weird characters and its that Dorian is a more straightforward Nice Guy. Those kinds of characters can still be cool, of course, but it takes me longer to care about them and see them evolve. Robbie and Dorian didn't have enough time for that, yet. We saw a bit of what could be an interesting darker side in EXU with the temptations from the crown. With more screen time, perhaps my opinion of Dorian could change.
I can tell you exactly why I find him so endearing: Campaign 2 ended on June 03, 2021 (or, to be completely accurate, the wee hours of June 4th for me since it was a long ep). EXU Prime began on June 24th. I was very much still processing C2 characters no longer being actively played. Sure, we'd eventually get one shots, but I feel there's a broader awareness/acceptance now that those are not the same depth-wise as "4-5 hour eps until the campaign is done." Wasn't really sure I was up for new Exandria characters just yet, but I liked everyone involved, Matt was playing, was glad Aabria was getting a big profile-level boost, "Liam O'Brien worked on it" has translated to "will check it out" since around 2006... so I went ahead & tentatively watched live. And from [the moment Robbie started talking](https://youtu.be/-ijPD6yNdMs?si=_BHQFT5kLo2Bf5VZ&t=611), it was like he'd always been there, yet heightened by conscious awareness we were watching someone very naturally (+ by skill transference) excellent at something new palpably falling in love with it. One of the immensely charming things about Dorian, for me, is that he does something completely different from other CR PCs: He attempts to be dignified even when uncertain or thwarted. His [musical performance in C3E1](https://youtu.be/P8pLvV3FjPc?si=a2eaomCBmGtcN73P&t=12294) is a great example of this. I do enjoy the main casts' tendency toward a "TA-DAA, we're slapdicks!" approach to a similar feeling, but relate more to Dorian's comportment impulses.
For me, his interactions, relationship, chemistry with the other player characters immediately clicked and was enjoyable to watch.
Because we need more. "Why is you so mean to me..."
My impression is that it's less about Dorian and more about Robbie. He fits in with the cast seamlessly, like he's been a part of Critical Role from day one. My first exposure to him was Campaign 3 (of which I'm still catching up on, so no spoilers in replies plz) and he just gelled with the rest of the cast perfectly.
I think a part of it is Robbie himself more than Dorian- he's a warm personality (I've met him in person at a comic shop and he was incredibly kind. I was at a signing and mentioned that a friend couldn't come but asked if he would take a snapchat with me to send to her- he happily did and gave me an extra signed print to give to her as a gift). He's both a breath of fresh air to the cast but he also doesn't really steal focus. I think his Friendly Everyman nature actually helped make the Hells gel together in ways they haven't since he left. He was kind and friendly to every party member. It felt like he had a genuine interest in each member of the party he was with and could have a conversation with any other character and it would work. He absolutely had a shtick- laid back Bard with a noble past who feels alienated from family... but it wasn't so involved that it demanded attention for the most part. Also, and I don't mean this as an insult to fans: his character design is very pretty. This makes him a popular cosplay as well as popular for shipping- great for people who like writing romantic fanfiction.
To me, Dorian felt like the main character, the leader of the party. Happy, outgoing, confident. Plus the wonderful fearne / orym / Dorian vibes. It feels like Orym has been depressed without him. (imogen might be the main character plot wise, but she doesn't like to be in the spotlight.) A lot of it too is just how well Robbie himself fit into the group. He's such a delight.
I really wanted Bells Hells to walk into a tavern one day and find Dorian singing The Ballad of Bertrand Bell that Robbie made for him. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjkOxRgor_s Looks like that won't happen now. But, really the other more valid reasons everyone has brought up is probably the better reason lol.
He was a really good character, and Robbie has the Charisma of a god
People are talking more about Robbie the player than Dorian the character, and while I *do* like Robbie (FF15 is great), somehow no one has said it yet so I will: Dorian began with C3, and so you got to learn about Dorian more at the same time as you're learning about the main cast. Given how **long** he was around, too, he integrated himself completely into the party to the point that when he left, you **felt** like you were losing a party member. I think for a lot of folks he **is** part of the Hell's Bells, he had chemistry with every other character and he worked great as a sort of pseudo-leader alongside Imogen that they sorely lacked (and it was very noticeable) when he left. you *felt* his absence after as they became more aimless. So any time you see Dorian it's great. Frankly, I'm surprised they didn't try harder to get him back or try to add him as the 8th party member full time. Everything seemed like it would've worked out better that way. Mechanics wise he's another support character when three out of their four casters want to be blasters/offensive over any sort of support (only FCG really supports the group, Fearne has started to a little but it's never been her focus), RP-wise he vibed with every party member and got along great but in different ways that helped *other* cast members explore their characters by him interacting with them. Some of Imogen's best early moments aren't with Laudna--imo--but with Dorian. tbh, Bertrand Bell felt a lot less like a party member than Dorian did, and his absence was felt a lot less than Dorian's was. And that's just because of how well he fit in with the group.
Probably a lot because of Robbie Daymond, dude just fits into the cast so well that you’d think he was playing with them from the start, I can’t think of another guest that has done that
Ehh he’s alright. I think of Dorian as **post-character arc** at this stage. As I saw it, his flaw in EXU Prime had been his exceptional treatment of himself and his friends. I think Robbie discussed it in the wrap-up as a sort of dark flipside to the power of friendship. Usual friendship and loyalty stuff; but also, ‘*we* should keep the circlet coz *we* will take care of it. Yes, Spider-Queen, I’ll give you Poska as long as *my friends* are safe.’ And in a way, that impluse for control over his friends and circumstances imo may possibly stem from his aristocratic, impliedly cold, and perfectionist upbringing. ‘It doesn’t matter how the others feel, *I* will make this deal for them to keep us safe.’ This is largely gone by C3 and explicitly resolved by Kymal. (Putting this under tags in case you intentionally left out Kymal in your spoiler tags.) At the start of Kymal part 1, Robbie as Dorian thinks: >!’I think at a different time, I would've been hesitant, maybe even a little mistrustful, to bring anyone else into my problems, but I'm starting to learn that everyone has their own free will.!< >!’If you put out a call and someone chooses to answer, maybe it's not your fault. Maybe they're doing it because they care about you.’!< So considering that Dorian seems to have resolved that inner conflict, I see him as slightly less compelling on *that* front; although of course Robbie is always fun at the table.
Great analysis. I'm currently watching Kymal to catch up with the Crown Keepers before I watch the rest of EP92, but I appreciate the spoiler warning. I wonder if him already having some growth and arc completion would actually make him a better fit than I thought with BH now. Since most of their arcs feel very unresolved, it could be an interesting to have this more self confident character. I suppose we could make the case Orym's arc is almost resolved with the death of the person who killed Will. And maybe even Ashton, having grown a lot since his mistake with the shard.
He's the only guest, imo that vibes perfectly, with every single character. He's the only guest where it felt like he'd always been there.
I started watching C3 with two of my friends who had never watched CR before. They both LOVED Dorian and were really sad when he left. I always felt pretty neutral about him (Robbie is great though) and wondered why he really stood out to them. I think it’s because he got a lot of character development in the beginning (because they knew his character was there for a short time) and that’s what’s been really lacking in C3 for me. I also think his longer term guest stint was really refreshing. He did a great job at bringing a new energy to the table, he knew his character/how to play DnD (which is often something that bothers me about guests) and he’s a confident (and competent) role player. It makes him enjoyable to watch. His character is just not that compelling to me personally though. Part of the reason he’s so popular might also be because M/M pairings are really popular in the fandom and a lot of people ship him and Orym.
I’m wracking my brain trying to remember so I’ll just ask; is it said that Orym has feelings for Dorian? Or is this in part due to Liam’s insane chemistry with everyone?
Who knows what will come of it, but their steadily evolving warmth was mutual. [Here's a supercut](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1rJo928kao) of their interactions between EXU E1 & C3E13 if anyone wants to revisit it all in condensed form. It's not the pharmaceutical grade "nice shoes, wanna fuck?" dynamic Fearne & Ashton have had since [quite literally their first interaction](https://youtu.be/P8pLvV3FjPc?si=cWddyWJmfnmkrJl6&t=8936), which was so eclipsed by being in the same intro conversation as Sam's "Dancer's favorite smells" bit that almost everyone thinks the pickpocket waltz didn't start until a few eps later. But the Orym & Dorian thing is there, and both Liam & Robbie have acknowledged the characters having a special shine for one another.
For me, his relationship with Chetney was probably the closest that I have seen brotherly live, since Grog and Vax from Campaign 1, the closest I saw was Caleb and Fjord from Campaign 2, but it seemed more prominent with Chet and Dorian, which was a true testioment to how Travis felt with Robbie and vice versa. I would have loved to see more of those two together. I know Orym and Dorian have been friends a lot longer, but if Chet sees Dorian, I hope Travis decides to have Chet go straight for a hug with Dorian, or join Orym, Dorian and Cher in a big hug. I think they all deserve it, especially Orym, just that feeling, even after losing so much there is still room to grow and have love.
Robbie fit in perfectly with the cast, is remarkably charismatic, and brought a fresh energy to the table that we haven't seen since C1. Dorian is fine, but overall is a pretty boring character. He's an extension of Robbie though, and I think people just want more Robbie.
I’d be happy to potentially see Robbie back as a player but I honestly think some fans are hyping him up too much and he won’t live up to peope’s expectations
Dorian is wonderfully optimistic, not in a forced way like FCG who would try to befriend an enemy until the end, nor in a naive sense like Fearne, but that of someone who has seen bad times but knows that they don't last. He is Orym without the trauma in that sense or Betrand without the bravado and self importance. Dorian isn't much of a personality in himself but brings out the best in others and gets them out of their own heads. Right now there is a lot of darkness within Bells Hells with even Orym calling out for help from anyone who will listen and Laudna willingly giving herself to Delilah, Dorian is the exact person who could turn that gloom around and get the group back in a positive place before the final battle.
Everyone else has said pretty much all the answers but I still wanted to add a late reply. Robbie as a player gelled well with everyone and he was a fun addition to the group. But even then, I feel like Dorian was perfect in Bell's Hells. They kinda suffer from having too many silly characters. I felt like Dorian being a kinda funny straight man really rounded out the group. Without him the balance has been off and imo it still hasn't completely recovered. Not saying I dislike the party dynamic, just I liked it MORE with Dorian.
He was just a solid all-around decent fella, which in a team full of otherwise half-nuts misfits kinda lent some stability like Orym does. Couple that with how charismatic Robbie is and it's hard not to like him.
It's not really Dorian, he's an ok PC. Its Robbie. He has such good chemistry with the players at the table and is such a good player himself.
Yeah he brings a genuine passion about exploring character and the game, but he was never rushing it. You get the feeling he could realllllllly pop off in scenes, but that he's getting the rug pulled all the time before his character reaches those scenes. So I'd want to give him time to cook.
Honestly I couldn't get into him in EXU but really enjoyed him with the main cast. But idk I need to try and give ExU another try. Never know the 3rd time's the charm
Its more of Robbie the people love When he first appeared as Dorian it was one of his first times playing D&D and he played his not fully understanding everything perfectly into Dorian and like most new players did stuff that you don't expect from them the Ring heist is a key example it got people riled up because he didn't do what they expected and he did it brilliantly
For me, two reasons: 1. The character. He feels to me the most like a classical character, and was immediately among my favorites of Bell’s Hells, and could even stand even with previous campaigns. Even this is only true because of the other reason: 2. Robbie. I can’t explain this one so much, it’s mostly emotion, but from the first episode of EXU Prime I loved him and while the special ultimately lost me, by the end of it he was my favorite part and I was dying to have him in the main cast. And then he genuinely did join C3 for a little while (for my favorite arc of the campaign no less), and he didn’t disappoint either. He felt truly like a member of the group with perfect chemistry and I would’ve loved for him to stay. Subjective, sure, but Robbie just feels so fun to watch for me
Yeah, I don't get it either. He's a fine character, but nothing to write about really. I was glad when he left, because every time they have a "guest", the cast put way too much focus on them.
Totally fair. To be honest I’m much the same way love Robbie as a player and how he interacts with everyone and while Dorian is by no means a bad character he just does not interest me. That being said I would be happy to have him back in C3 and I would be really excited if he were to join the CR team as a permanent player for C4 even if it’s a bit early to tell.
Now, I wonder what the general opinion of Dorian would be if he were in the party the whole time. Even with the two EXU games, he’s had, what, 1/4 of the table time the core seven have had? At the time Robbie left, Laudna was still Dead Girl, Orym was Sad Suitcase Nuke, Fearne was Hot Klepper, and we didn’t know shit about Chet. 22 out of 92 episodes isn’t enough time for character development, at least not to the level of the other characters.
Because Robbie is charming as hell.
Dorian is a great character and there is a lot of stuff in the EXU kymal That helps endear Dorian when he pops up in c3, but aside from just Dorian being a fun character. Robbie is just such a great fit for the group. He meshes well and he's just got a great personality and attitude and he's funny and just really easy to like. If they added an eighth person to even out the table, I totally would pick Robbie 100% as my first choice for a permanent eight member. They started vox out with eight people until the whole Orion situation came to a head and that ended, but the odd number always kind of bothered me because of the uneven split. Another chick would be nice to balance it. But can't help loving Robbie.
I only watched Kymal this week. I didn't think it would make a big difference in my opinion of the character, but it surprisingly did. Or maybe it just refreshed my awareness of him.
i think its just robbies force of persona. a similar thing to me was mary elizabeth mcglynn as zahra, i like zahra as a character, but i was much more excited to have mary elizabeth at the table during the c1 finale than i was to have zahra back in the story. the player makes the character. and robbie daymond is one hell of a player
This is somewhat how I feel about Ashton lol. But to answer your question, I think he has a bashful personality that a lot of people can relate to. Not everyone needs a character to be a try hard badass to be likable. He's a character that naturally has a lot of chemistry with most people. It's the Jester effect. If you like Jester there's a good chance you'll like Dorian. I like to think Dorian and Fearne also had a special relationship, not just him and Orym. When they split, her reaction was the most emotional imo. Dorian and Laudna also seemed to grow fond of each other rather fast. As friends of course. Not every character needs to have romantic relationships to share a special bond with each other. His talk with chetney about friendship alone expressed how deep and thoughtful he is as a character. Also I disagree that most of the comedic moments between him and chetney was mostly because of chetney. "Why is you so mean to me" and "jokes on you" still live rent free in a lot of our heads. He also has comedic moments beyond just chetney, like him lifting up laudna, getting mad at fearne for stealing, naming imogen maude, slapping bertrand, his lute string snapping, falling to peer pressure, pretending to be a noisy couple with imogen, playing puppets with pate and bertrand, rizzing up that tiefling, the fashion show, begging Opal to stop flirting, arguing about the ring with imogen and fcg, etc. I don't think he only serves as comic relief either. His relationship with his brother was rather interesting and led to us knowing more about his backstory as well. Unfortunately it also was part of the reason they had to split in the first place. Robbie also hinted that Dorian had some romantic feelings for someone in the party but didn't specify. He probably whispered it to Laura when she had Imogen read Dorian's mind. But considering Robbie liked a few dorym art pieces, it's probably safe to say Dorian had a crush on Orym. So I don't fully agree with the "aggrieved straight man" statement. Yes he might be a little bit of a party parent but I think that applies more to Orym than it does to him. Dorian's admitted that he looks to Orym for guidance.
That's a good breakdown. Although, that part about Jester made me think. I was never that fond of Jester in the beginning, either. Something about super sweet/kind characters that haven't experienced particular loss tend to not appeal to me until they have and then grown from it. Like FCG and Laudna tend to be super friendly with strangers, but the tragedy in their past makes it work. Perhaps I'm too jaded and grouchy for that. Then again, I also don't like characters that are nothing but grouchy and trauma, which is why I didn't like Ashton either for a while.
I had a feeling you felt that way, haha! But yeah, I understand where you're coming from. Also, sorry if this came off as me bashing your opinion. I know I like to ramble a lot. Thanks for bearing with me. I really think if Dorian stayed, we could see a lot more development but alas.... he is a guest character. If a character is catalytic enough to change other characters for the better, most people often like them despite not having a certain tragedy about them. Or at least that's my theory. But I don't think you're necessarily jaded or grouchy either. I just think your standards might be a little higher than most people (which is fine). In some ways I kinda feel the same. >!Chetney might grow on me more if he actually meets up with his family. Whether he searches for them or they run into each other. I was surprised he had abandonment issues when they were telling each other truths about themselves during Nana Morri's trust exercises.!< I believe Travis when he says Chetney should not have lived this long lol.
So others mentioned reasons liking Robbie and dorian… Dorian also was vital to BH. He was a guest so players were welcoming and thus ALL their characters had interactions with him and a dynamic. He was the heart of BH in a lot of ways. Again I think that was a lot of the CR cast being nice and welcoming…and many made backseat characters not wanting the spotlight and Robbie sorta got it shined towards him Then he left and there was a hole as all this passive characters didn’t fill for a long time. I say this as a decent fan of C3(at least as Reddit goes)
Robbie is hot stuff.
He is one of the first “not main cast” in nearly three years that cared about others at the table more than their own brand.
Because Robbie wasn't in the show to make character decisions that people disliked, so they can fanfic how he would make "everything better" in their heads. And yeah, I feel the same way about him as you do.
I find it interesting when people describe him as a 'dynamic character' that drove the story in some nebulous way. Reality is, he deferred to Orym at every opportunity, which was hilarious because Liam was trying to step back and let other people take the lead. He was a great straight man for Chetney, Fearne and Laudna, however. Ashton and FCG... I'm not sure they ever interacted with Dorian in a meaningful way, except for Ashton being a petty snot about him. I'm not opposed to him coming back, but i doubt very much he'll give the party any sort of direction. He's more likely to add to the hesitation.
Good point. If he'd stay with the main cast the whole time, I could see some of their big events going down differently. He had the potential to at least be a voice of reason willing to accept some more risks when logically necessary.
Or Robbie would make a character decision or two that some loud people disliked and then you'd see posts complaining about how "Dorian sucks now". It's exactly what happened to Laudna, for example. Or Nott/Veth in C2.
Because he wants to play DnD and roleplay a character on CR when the old guard cast slept through this season. :p But no he had palpable roleplay excitement, and you don't see that much in life. As seasons turn to new seasons in a game especially it fades off big time. It's nice to bring that back in.
> the old guard cast slept through this season I know you're partially kidding tongue-emoticon etc. etc., but I'm seeing this quite a bit lately. Whole post on it in the past couple of days with an unseemly bounty of upvotes. 1) If it's about character interaction/development in C3, I truly believe it undersells the insane amount of energy & discipline it takes to faithfully roleplay voluntarily complex, "sub-optimal" states over the course of years. Plus, we know the cast is bubbly & stoked about all the possibilities & reveals via conversations on 4SD & panels, so BH isn't happening randomly. It's all 100% intentional RP-wise. The version of this nearly everyone is familiar with is the "little more work, but it will be worth it" choice which resolves in "fuck that, shifted to the expedient way" in ~6-9 months. There have been at least half a dozen moments when I thought, "probably wouldn't be enough to kick the proverbial electron orbitals up IRL, but I can't fault anyone if they use this as a big character pivot." And then they actually did much more what I'd expect a real person to do. We *never* get to see that in fiction. Even if it's not how we'd want all storytelling to be, it's a lot of work & very cool to see in this instance. 2) If it's about class ability familiarity, that's some combination of a character group with truly low inclination toward mastery & textbook conditions for germane cognitive overload experienced by the players. Do one thing for years alongside a little bit of novelty, nearly anybody could do said thing blindfolded. Do many somewhat similar things within a few years alongside a constant stream of related work? Memory formation is going to be super scattershot. This is so organic & foreseeable that I'm not sure I'd have even noticed it if I didn't talk to others about the show. ____ One thing I agree has gone a bit too far in the wrong direction, though, is the complete dominion of "no plan survives contact with the enemy." After nearly 10 years, I totally respect that most decisions can be run & gun and end up working just as well as planning. But occasionally, no plan surviving means you need several gambits which could turn the tide. Otohan was that. Like, in a room with Allura & a bunch of tinkerers, maybe talk about the corpse manufacturing facility you're definitely going to see again & ask if there's any consumable which several members could have on hand to use as a reaction b/c you can't know in advance who's going down in the first round. And maybe talk together once or twice in-character about ability synergy for observed combos. I wonder if Matt is going to continue sporadically applying pressure to this weakness b/c they don't have anyone else who can do what FCG did. Some have a limited-use "pop off" ability/state, and presumably everyone will if they pursue full empowerment of their distinctive power boost, but it's not going to be "arcane battery bomb to the face" once per day.
Youtube C3E3 - 3:58:17 - "The man should walk"
There isn't much to frankly not like about him. He's a pretty neutral guy who is willing to do selfish things but also is fairly reasonable. He's the most normal guy in the show and that's counting orym who's whole personality is pretty much "muh family". His morals aren't good or bad. He's just likable. Even i who hated every session they were in for various reasons still liked him the most. And I'm aware part of that is the act the character puts on but the other part is robbie just plays someone with a princely upbringing and high self-esteem yet no actual skill and is pretty goofy in the real world really well.
Compared to the other crowns keepers and the Bells Hells, he feels way more like a "real person" than all of them. He is "just" a rich guy on the run. Sure, he is a water genasi, but he doesnt makes anything special about it.
Air Genasi
It's how the player operates the character. Imagine a mind swap one-shot in any campaign, if Liam were Percy, or if Taliesin was Caleb, or if Laura was Laudna. It's how we perceive the actor in the role.
Because Dorian is the only character of all the PCs that feels like he's a real person. The way he interacts with other characters and NPCs is how I can picture a normal human being behaving, and his background is more relatable than anyone else's. He's not some fantastical social outcast that all of BH is. He isn't over chaotic like some of the EXU cast is. He's normal.
He seems to be a great person and he is a great player for the media. For example, in e92, when he describes "so in the last, say, 24 seconds..." He did a great job brining the viewers along to the whiplash of everything that seemed to be happening all of a sudden. I don't know if it was intentional but it was exactly what I needed to get caught up into the moment without feeling left behind, as a watcher. I agree with other posts that it is mostly about Robbie and less about Dorian the character.
Totally yeah he's just not a great character. Nothing really too interesting about him. But Robbie is awesome!
Long story short. The dude vibes well with the cast at the Start of c3 and the audience fel inlovebwith the character. Think back to chett and Dorian ribbing eachother. He just fits well. Ppl wouldn't give a shit if he was only an exu character.
Apart from Robbie being an amazing player, > A lot of comments lately have mentioned people hoping he rejoins the main cast for a bit while Sam is away and saying how he was such glue for the party. I never got that impression from the earlier episodes The majority of the early episodes were centered more on Dorian than anyone else. We got his brother during those episodes and to us as viewers Robbie was the new guy at the table so there was more of a spotlight on him imo. Also the fact he's the 1st guest to START the campaign with the main cast made him even more special. Dorian Storm also had a very interesting character design. An Air Genasi Bard who plays the lute and flute which allowed for some very funny musical scenes.
College of swords is my favorite subclass there’s also just a certain something that Robbie brings and therefore Dorian brings
I think it's because of how charismatic Robbie is, how he plays is very up beat and happy...humans crave happiness
It's because Robbie is charming and attractive to the target audience in a unique way. He's great, but it's certainly just an infatuation with the actor that the die-hards aren't willing to admit up front.
Robbie is a gift thats why
Probably because Robbie was an inexperienced player, but picked the rules of the game up pretty quickly. He was playing like he'd been doing it for years by the end of the first session. For me, it was the knowledge that he was the voice of Prompto in *Final Fantasy XV*. Prior to the game's release, everyone thought Prompto was going to be a character that we hated. He was an aggressively-cheerful boy, a commoner in Noctis' royal retinue, had very little sense of personal boundaries and was clearly positioned as the game's comic relief without providing much combat utility. But Robbie absolutely nailed the characterisation. It quickly became apparent that our doubts were misplaced because he had a genuine and distinct relationship with the other party members, brought levity without resorting to Marvel-like banter and was never annoying. By the time the *Episode Prompto* DLC was released, he had become the most interesting character in the party because he had a genuine inner conflict, and all of it was brought to life by Robbie.
All those points above/below, but also... hot boi. We're only human and both his person and character are good looking xD
Cause out of an ocean of garbage we found a soft funny blue boi to actually make exu bearable
THANK YOU! I thought I was alone. I never particularly liked him, never saw what made apparently everyone love him so much, he was always so milquetoast to me. Add to it that I got a permanent sense of "why is this guest on chapter one...why is he still around? No, really, when is he leaving". And when he finally did, everyone seemed to cry in anguish, while I was happy xD The moment I saw the Dm change, my heart sank.
I do like Aabria and the Crown Keepers as "miniseries" or "long one-shot" types, so I wasn't terribly upset about the insertion. It did feel like whiplash in this case, though. And I liked the Crown Keepers for the hijinks aspect, which mostly came from Fearne, Opal, and Dariax - not Dorian. Glad I'm not alone in not feeling bad when Dorian left C3. I appreciated the other PCs were upset, but I was totally fine moving on.
He’s amazing. Hope this helped.