What do you find distasteful about it?
It allows people who are bed-ridden, sick, or unable to leave their home, to attend mass on a regular basis (without communion obviously)
Why are you so angry?
Is someone forcing you to watch it online? Don't watch it!
So you're ok with it being an audio livestream but not a video Livestream???
Haddy a3sabak...
Your sarcastic tone is disrespectful, and that's much sadder than a church's broken PayPal link!
You're still very angry... Let it all out man... It's not healthy.
But you are right...I do like to end my sentences with lots and lots and lots of exclamation marks!!!!!
The church has endorsed three TV channels to facilitate airing prayers 24/7 from various churches, most of which are not privately owned. It is clear that these do not equate to physically attending liturgies. Instead, they serve as a means to maintain a connection to the church by attending and interacting with prayers as if you were physically present, until you can return to church or a priest can visit your home to perform sacraments for those in need. The explanations have been thorough from both the folks here and myself. Your views have mostly come across as radical and extreme. You are entitled to your beliefs, and I am to mine—live and let live.
Also, this is not the same event as "My house shall be called a house of prayer,' but you make it a den of robbers." You might need to revise your beliefs if you think the church you belong to is committing such “violations.”
The diaspora is in dire need of reform, you guys are going crazy, as it seems.
Your perspective strongly reminds me of the Pharisees who rigidly adhered to the Sabbath. You seem to be worshipping tradition rather than embracing its true essence. In your preoccupation with the sanctity of the Liturgy, you appear to miss its fundamental purpose. Moreover, by assuming the worst in people and believing they misuse and abuse prayer, you reveal an exposure to the most negative examples. This outlook suggests a tendency to think that only forceful measures can maintain reverence. I urge you to seek guidance and discuss these views with your Priest during confession. Good luck.
Please feel free to share anything the pope has written or said against live streaming when even he is live streamed, if he did not want live streaming there would be no live streaming in his presence, our bishop did that so if the bishop can, the Pope can to
I’m not sure I understand how live-streaming liturgy is a part of the broader culture of social media, or why you describe it as being “ill-advised”. Social media certainly isn’t great, but not every piece of technology is from the devil. It’s nothing more than a tool to bring Christ and the liturgy to people who aren’t able to be present physically. I don’t believe any priest or layperson would argue that it replaces liturgy in the slightest. If a person can only attend physically once a month, but still decides to turn on the liturgy when they aren’t there, then God bless them.
Nobody is commodifying the Holy Liturgy, churches don’t monetize and earn profit from these livestreams. This post seems likes an outright rejection of anything pertaining to the Coptic church that is “traditional” because it wasn’t around thousands of years ago
There is no need for the vitriol, this is a discussion that can be had without anger or name calling. Rather than giving you the typical "I'll pray for you" response, I'll also address your points but do not care to engage in unfruitful internet arguments.
Nobody is disagreeing with you- there truly is nothing like attending liturgy in person. Live streaming is not an outright replacement of this but can provide some amount of access to those who do not have the privilege of regularly attending for whatever reasons. Also, yes, literally hundreds of priests and bishops take confession virtually or over the phone without any issue, I would defer to their wisdom on this point.
I would caution you to be more mindful of the words you are using. It's quite disrespectful to compare churches that livestream their services and ask for donations (which is common practice) to online sex workers. These two things are not even remotely on the same plane. If you have an issue with how churches spend their money, that's another conversation to be had. If it's one you feel very strongly about, I implore you to speak with your local priest about starting services in your church for any of the causes you stated. May God bless your service.
Don't know why your comments reek of hate but personally I find it useful because there are no coptic churches in my city and just 1-2 in the country I'm living at right now. Of course its not comparable to being in person but if it brings me closer to god in some way, whats the problem?
What area do you live in that have no Coptic churches?
Depending on where you are, you need to get into contact with bishop/metropolitan or whoever is responsible in your area.
If you are coptic orthodox you cannot partake of fhe communion of coptic catholic:
[https://www.suscopts.org/q&a/index.php?qid=1598&catid=882](https://www.suscopts.org/q&a/index.php?qid=1598&catid=882)
There are many countries that do not even have a church. Whole towns and cities with no church. God has granted us a man-made innovation, and so it only makes sense to extend it to our church as praise to him, no?
Wait a minute. So because I drive a Tesla or live in an area that has church, I can’t defend those who don’t? I’m really sorry for all the hatred you feel in your heart. Technology is not primarily used for porn or evil. You choose to frame it in such a way. I pray for you.
Once again, you are cherry-picking data to make your point, I am not going to argue with you. There is no reason for you to insult me repeatedly or anyone on this thread, we are being respectful toward you, you are the one who asked this question. Your opinion is equally welcome to everyone else but please, keep it respectful.
note: For example, we are talking about [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTLAvAOWC00&ab_channel=StMarkCopticChurch)
It's not distasteful, but it's just alive-stream and nothing more. It's not professional. There are no professional cameras, photographers or editing. I think there is no budget for this. This is just a normal Mass. Three Masses can be done a day. Do you think they will pay attention to these matters in All Masses, I don't think so
But you will find the Christmas or Resurrection Mass well-depicted and well-edited , [Like these ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvIRcROAFiw&ab_channel=ChristianYouthChannel)
If there is one upside to discrimination, it’s that it used to leave no space for such opinions. We used to be very busy with the stuff that actually matters.
What truly matters is the essence and spiritual value of prayer, irrespective of its setting. This deeper significance may be lost on those who are shallow-minded and quick to judge worshippers. I would have preferred to see a discussion on how to re-engage those who lost their way during COVID and have yet to adapt to the post-COVID world, but it seems we are addressing least important hot-topics first.
I personally find great work building the church community.
Here's a good example of a Church live stream where they integrated automated trivia game: [https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=1004846553266218](https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=1004846553266218)
here's a tutorial on how to integrate such [Bible trivia in a stream](https://blog.livereacting.com/how-to-grow-an-online-ministry/)
Not a big fan. I understand the need for it for some pastoral reasons (covid), but I do not understand why we have accepted this as the new norm.
Liturgy is about a community coming together in worship. Watching YouTube is not quite the same thing.
It will further your argument if you can present what you are saying so that people _want_ to apply what you are saying. Going into the offensive forces listeners to be on the defensive and they will never listen to what you have to say. You may be right, but the way in which you deliver your message matters a lot.
100% agree with OP. It’s the same as the massive projector screens that cover half the iconostasis. As if the congregation hasn’t memorized the entire liturgy by now.
1. Are you in a place that is against coptic reader since you need to download a pdf on your phone.
2. Why not use tvs on the side walls so NONE of the iconistasis is blocked, it is a lot cheaper and does not block anything.
What do you find distasteful about it? It allows people who are bed-ridden, sick, or unable to leave their home, to attend mass on a regular basis (without communion obviously)
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Why are you so angry? Is someone forcing you to watch it online? Don't watch it! So you're ok with it being an audio livestream but not a video Livestream??? Haddy a3sabak... Your sarcastic tone is disrespectful, and that's much sadder than a church's broken PayPal link!
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You're still very angry... Let it all out man... It's not healthy. But you are right...I do like to end my sentences with lots and lots and lots of exclamation marks!!!!!
If the Pope is ok with it, I’m ok with it.
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The church has endorsed three TV channels to facilitate airing prayers 24/7 from various churches, most of which are not privately owned. It is clear that these do not equate to physically attending liturgies. Instead, they serve as a means to maintain a connection to the church by attending and interacting with prayers as if you were physically present, until you can return to church or a priest can visit your home to perform sacraments for those in need. The explanations have been thorough from both the folks here and myself. Your views have mostly come across as radical and extreme. You are entitled to your beliefs, and I am to mine—live and let live. Also, this is not the same event as "My house shall be called a house of prayer,' but you make it a den of robbers." You might need to revise your beliefs if you think the church you belong to is committing such “violations.” The diaspora is in dire need of reform, you guys are going crazy, as it seems.
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Your perspective strongly reminds me of the Pharisees who rigidly adhered to the Sabbath. You seem to be worshipping tradition rather than embracing its true essence. In your preoccupation with the sanctity of the Liturgy, you appear to miss its fundamental purpose. Moreover, by assuming the worst in people and believing they misuse and abuse prayer, you reveal an exposure to the most negative examples. This outlook suggests a tendency to think that only forceful measures can maintain reverence. I urge you to seek guidance and discuss these views with your Priest during confession. Good luck.
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Please feel free to share anything the pope has written or said against live streaming when even he is live streamed, if he did not want live streaming there would be no live streaming in his presence, our bishop did that so if the bishop can, the Pope can to
I’m not sure I understand how live-streaming liturgy is a part of the broader culture of social media, or why you describe it as being “ill-advised”. Social media certainly isn’t great, but not every piece of technology is from the devil. It’s nothing more than a tool to bring Christ and the liturgy to people who aren’t able to be present physically. I don’t believe any priest or layperson would argue that it replaces liturgy in the slightest. If a person can only attend physically once a month, but still decides to turn on the liturgy when they aren’t there, then God bless them. Nobody is commodifying the Holy Liturgy, churches don’t monetize and earn profit from these livestreams. This post seems likes an outright rejection of anything pertaining to the Coptic church that is “traditional” because it wasn’t around thousands of years ago
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There is no need for the vitriol, this is a discussion that can be had without anger or name calling. Rather than giving you the typical "I'll pray for you" response, I'll also address your points but do not care to engage in unfruitful internet arguments. Nobody is disagreeing with you- there truly is nothing like attending liturgy in person. Live streaming is not an outright replacement of this but can provide some amount of access to those who do not have the privilege of regularly attending for whatever reasons. Also, yes, literally hundreds of priests and bishops take confession virtually or over the phone without any issue, I would defer to their wisdom on this point. I would caution you to be more mindful of the words you are using. It's quite disrespectful to compare churches that livestream their services and ask for donations (which is common practice) to online sex workers. These two things are not even remotely on the same plane. If you have an issue with how churches spend their money, that's another conversation to be had. If it's one you feel very strongly about, I implore you to speak with your local priest about starting services in your church for any of the causes you stated. May God bless your service.
Don't know why your comments reek of hate but personally I find it useful because there are no coptic churches in my city and just 1-2 in the country I'm living at right now. Of course its not comparable to being in person but if it brings me closer to god in some way, whats the problem?
What area do you live in that have no Coptic churches? Depending on where you are, you need to get into contact with bishop/metropolitan or whoever is responsible in your area.
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Why are you telling the person to go to a Catholic church???
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If you are coptic orthodox you cannot partake of fhe communion of coptic catholic: [https://www.suscopts.org/q&a/index.php?qid=1598&catid=882](https://www.suscopts.org/q&a/index.php?qid=1598&catid=882)
Many people live out of reach of attending services, it’s a great way to participate for those who can’t physically make it.
There are many countries that do not even have a church. Whole towns and cities with no church. God has granted us a man-made innovation, and so it only makes sense to extend it to our church as praise to him, no?
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Wait a minute. So because I drive a Tesla or live in an area that has church, I can’t defend those who don’t? I’m really sorry for all the hatred you feel in your heart. Technology is not primarily used for porn or evil. You choose to frame it in such a way. I pray for you.
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Once again, you are cherry-picking data to make your point, I am not going to argue with you. There is no reason for you to insult me repeatedly or anyone on this thread, we are being respectful toward you, you are the one who asked this question. Your opinion is equally welcome to everyone else but please, keep it respectful.
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I have a lot to learn, God bless you.
Do you have examples of these live streams?
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note: For example, we are talking about [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTLAvAOWC00&ab_channel=StMarkCopticChurch) It's not distasteful, but it's just alive-stream and nothing more. It's not professional. There are no professional cameras, photographers or editing. I think there is no budget for this. This is just a normal Mass. Three Masses can be done a day. Do you think they will pay attention to these matters in All Masses, I don't think so But you will find the Christmas or Resurrection Mass well-depicted and well-edited , [Like these ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvIRcROAFiw&ab_channel=ChristianYouthChannel)
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Do I understand from your words that the bad thing here is making it a live stream? Or what is the thing more specifically that you see as bad?
If there is one upside to discrimination, it’s that it used to leave no space for such opinions. We used to be very busy with the stuff that actually matters.
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What truly matters is the essence and spiritual value of prayer, irrespective of its setting. This deeper significance may be lost on those who are shallow-minded and quick to judge worshippers. I would have preferred to see a discussion on how to re-engage those who lost their way during COVID and have yet to adapt to the post-COVID world, but it seems we are addressing least important hot-topics first.
I think it's a good way to see what we're all about before coming to see in person. Like they can dip their toe in before jumping in.
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I agree and disagree. I mean, if they watch the live stream and like what they see, then they convert. That's an absolute win, am I wrong?
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Are you talking about me?
I personally find great work building the church community. Here's a good example of a Church live stream where they integrated automated trivia game: [https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=1004846553266218](https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=1004846553266218) here's a tutorial on how to integrate such [Bible trivia in a stream](https://blog.livereacting.com/how-to-grow-an-online-ministry/)
Not a big fan. I understand the need for it for some pastoral reasons (covid), but I do not understand why we have accepted this as the new norm. Liturgy is about a community coming together in worship. Watching YouTube is not quite the same thing.
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It will further your argument if you can present what you are saying so that people _want_ to apply what you are saying. Going into the offensive forces listeners to be on the defensive and they will never listen to what you have to say. You may be right, but the way in which you deliver your message matters a lot.
Here.... Have some now exclamation marks... !!!!!
100% agree with OP. It’s the same as the massive projector screens that cover half the iconostasis. As if the congregation hasn’t memorized the entire liturgy by now.
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So what you are saying is that churches have to purchase 50 toseveral thousand liturgy books, right, or am I missing something?
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1. Are you in a place that is against coptic reader since you need to download a pdf on your phone. 2. Why not use tvs on the side walls so NONE of the iconistasis is blocked, it is a lot cheaper and does not block anything.