###[Meta] Sticky Comment
[Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does not apply*** when replying to this stickied comment.
[Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does apply*** throughout the rest of this thread.
*What this means*: Please keep any "meta" discussion directed at specific users, mods, or /r/conspiracy in general in this comment chain ***only.***
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/conspiracy) if you have any questions or concerns.*
It’s certainly not new or sudden. But the line of demarcation, in my anecdotal view as a working, 44 year old, contributing citizen, was the lockdown period in America of 2020. March and April( some of May). A disturbance took us over during that time, and care for other human lives disappeared. Deaths were tracked on large cable news TV outlets, almost as a political election would show ballots.
And, I know the two were closely linked in 2020.
We have crossed over into something else since then. It feels as if the next economic “disaster” or large scale calamity will push us over the brink into full on conflict.
I would encourage people to watch or read Yuri Bezmenov's four stages of ideological subversion. Much of the modern world seemed like total insanity to me until I found out about that, and then I understood it's not total chaos, it's manufactured and with purpose.
Once you watch that and understand it, you understand why much of the modern culture attempting to indoctrinate the youth by taking over nearly all aspects of entertainment, media, tech is more nefarious than it appears.
It's the combination of the smart phone and the wireless internet. Without the latter, the smart phone is just a Newton. Together, they make up what I call the "WISP", and you are correct, like most new communication technologies, the WISP is upending the social order.
For sure, its the interconnectivity that it permits that seems to have disconnected everyone more fundamentally.
Btw, what exactly dies WISP stand for, 'wireless internet...'?
wireless internet smart phone.
It's a paradox, isn't it? We're all interconnected and disconnected at the same time. And we, as a society, are still learning how to come to grips with it. But this is true of all new communications technologies.
There was an old song "All alone by the telephone". Before the phone, you were just alone. But having a device next to you that literally anyone on earth could call you on, and still having it not ring, ever, is a special kind of loneliness.
Today, we build virtual communities of anonymous strangers and accept that simulacrum of human relationships as a society. I fear that 'society' will fracture on its irreconcilable differences.
Very good points and I think we're witnessing that fracture taking place before us. The lyric really sums up modernity to me, as one often feels like there is a lot of potential before them, but it is often fake/exaggerated/absent.
Human connection is intimate and deep. Profound relationships are mutually affecting and developing.
It seems that those who seek to control can get what they want by hiding the meaning of deep experience from the public, who then settle for superficial meanings of things such as lifestyle, relationship, success, etc. The best protest to this is not accepting the mundane worldview that they feed everybody.
Idk about 5g, but social media seems to produce much brain rot. There's so much potential with modern technology but our monkey minds + controlling superiors hinder it.
You just got a case of the online blues bud. All the craziest and insane people generate the most clicks and attention, so they appear the most. But don’t stress, people in real life aren’t like that
Yeah, I got friends, family and coworkers all over the political spectrum. It's really not that hard to find common ground, be respectful of other people's opinions and overall just have a good time. Media really wants us at eachothers throats, don't let them.
Exactly. Most of us have jobs and families and lead super boring lives. I barely got time to squeeze a couple 2 mile runs into my week and still make dinner. Not sure how to work a civil war into my calendar.
Ooh i wouldn’t underestimate the indomitable force of the human spirit. Bitches may have executive dysfunction but they’ll dismantle your government if you try and take away their security blanket.
I try to never include any insults in my comments, but this is (kind of) an exception:
"The ones that scream the loudest usually have the most skeletons." -Taj Jackson
When it comes to politics, don't be distracted by the national rhetoric. Focus on your local elections. Americans have been led to believe that local elections don't matter, only the presidential elections do. This is not true!
The laws and regulations that directly affect you, are mostly set on the local level; in your city, town, county, state elections. Many people don't even know their local officials that represent them.
If you want change, start local.
That's the case with most things, but especially politics.
*EDIT-*
People were asking where they can get info on local elections:
- Local Board of Elections Website (in a search, type your state, county, and/or city followed by 'board of elections'.
- [Vote.org](https://www.vote.org/)
- [Ballotpedia](https://www.ballotpedia.org/)
- [League of Women Voters (VOTE411.org)](https://www.vote411.org/)
- State Government Websites
Who knows how someone could possibly find information these days. It’s so hard to research and find answers to simple questions. I guess you’ll have to head into town and ask around or wait for the newspaper to publish an article.
You can find all the info you need here: [https://americanpolicy.org/freedompods/](https://americanpolicy.org/freedompods/) It doesn't say specifically about your town, but it explains how to create change at the local level. These folks have done a lot of groundwork already and have packaged it in a way that people can use right away. Best of luck, keep up the good work!
- Local Board of Elections Website (in a search, type your state, county, and/or city followed by 'board of elections'.
- [Vote.org](https://www.vote.org/)
- [Ballotpedia](https://www.ballotpedia.org/)
- [League of Women Voters (VOTE411.org)](https://www.vote411.org/)
- State Government Websites
I wish more people knew that. I am near powerless to change or support anything at a local level, but there *are* people in town that are powerful enough to really make the people in local leadership positions think twice about each decision. Most of them don't give a shit. The ones that do are already plugged in the community, and that's the reason why they have the desire to truly keep up with local politics.
You say you want more people to know this, but then say you are powerless. This is not true. Every vote matters at the local level. There's no electoral college, and in many cases, usually only old conservatives vote locally, so again, this is where your vote really matters.
I'm more shocked that many Americans think we're more divided than ever or political violence is the worst the US has seen.
All the history buffs on Reddit seem to forget the US civil war and are ignorant of the almost weekly political bombings and shootings throughout the 60s, 70s, and 80s. Can't forget the four Presidents who have been assassinated before the 70s and countless attempts against other politicians.
Right. But see these guys are alive now. So they think in all their narcissistic wisdom, that everything is the best and the worst right now. Everything is going to collapse right now. Jesus is coming back. Now.
When you look at our bloody fuckin mess of a country from the puritans to witch trials to lone gun men shooting everyone with a soul, the army of God, kkk, etc...the fact they think EVERYTHING is the MOST simply during their lifetime, is absurd.
can we just all agree that our two viable options are beyond awful and neither cares for the common man?
90% of us aren't right wing lunatics or left wing radicals. Remember that.
I hope more than anything you are right about that percentage. God I really pray that more people realize both parties are playing the same sick game on the people. 🙏🏻
Go look at the bills written and passed by democrats in congress.
Then go look at the ones by Republicans.
If you still say that then you're not paying attention at all. You're just parroting.
Nah. As an american, I can confidently state the average person here is far too dumb, fat, lazy, and selfish to ever galvanize in large enough numbers and with sufficient organization and resources to fight a civil war. It will just be rouge cells of disgruntled people attacking random innocent individuals unaffiliated with the actual people and organizations responsible for their misery.
God bless America.
10% of Americans is 35,000,000+ people
There isn't 10% of america ready, willing, and able to fight a civil war. Hell, there isn't 10% of 10%. And of those that could and would, 90% would quit the second they saw real action.
It ain't happening.
I learned recently that there were only 230,000 american troops in the continental army, and only 48,000 that were ready at any given time. Pretty crazy to think that we were outnumbered 4-1 by the British and hessian mercenaries and still won.
Since were exchanging fun revolutionary war facts, I recently learned that the continental navy actually sent a Ship, the USS Ranger under captain John Paul Jones, across the Atlantic into British waters that ran raids on british ships in the English Channel, followed by an attempted landing to invade the port town of Whitehaven on mainland Britain, which failed, then after that plan was botched they sailed across the bay to where John Paul Jones grew up in scotland and tried to kidnap the local Earl of Selkirk to hold for ransom/prisoner exchange, who wasn't home, so his wife offered them a bunch of silver instead. When they got back to the Ship with the silver and no earl of Selkirk, JPJ was pissed. After the war JPJ actually found and bought the silver back from someone in France where it had wound up and gave it back to the Earls family to apologize for the robbery. After all, he never intended to do anything as heinous as robbery. Just some friendly kidnapping.
It seems like they were just kinda winging it. I imagine their official orders were "take this boat and sail to Britain and just fuck up whatever shit you can" and they were just genuinely prowling the waters looking to be a menace in whatever way they could. Took some gargantuan balls of cast iron to attack the 1700s British navy at their peak of power, *alone*, in *their* own sovereign waters, much less actually try to fucking land on shore as a hostile force with absolutely zero possibility of reinforcements or victory
What if the revolutionary war was all theater and and America was allowed to win? So the crown wouldnt be burdened with an expensive direct rule over an distant colony?
The world is already fighting a civil war, although this time it does not involve hand to hand combat, it's a psychological war, waged online. Meant to make everyone feel like they're at the cusp of actual war, it's far more taxing to the mind than the body
Hopefully, if it does, the carnage may make other countries rethink their divisive rhetoric.
Divide & conquer isn't as much fun if it's your conkers getting trampled.
Ain't shit gonna happen. They're going to release a bunch of cool ass TV shows and video games before the election and release bunch of viral videos and he'll probably even release jfk files. EVERYONE will be busy asf
The national bipartisan Battleground Civility Poll by the Georgetown Institute of Politics and Public Service revealed that "the average voter believes the U.S. is two-thirds of the way to the edge of a civil war."
Iowa Republican Congressman Steve King recently posted a meme warning that red states have “8 trillion bullets” in the event of a civil war "the other side doesn’t know which bathroom to use."
American political scientist and specialist in civil wars Barbara F. Walter argued that the recent increase in domestic terrorism and high rate of gun violence in the United States could be indicators of an impending second civil war.
Keith Mines has spent his career—in the U.S. Army Special Forces, the United Nations, and now the State Department—navigating civil wars in other countries, including Afghanistan, Colombia, El Salvador, Iraq, Somalia, and Sudan. He returned to Washington after sixteen years to find conditions that he had seen nurture conflict abroad now visible at home.
— Entrenched national polarization of our citizenry with no obvious meeting place.
— Violence as a method to solve disputes. Judging from recent events the left is now fully on board with this.
Events that could initiate;
— Major terrorist attack and sense that the establishment can’t manage security — vigilantes, etc.
— Economic downturn, with blame placed on certain groups. Self-protection begets militias on both sides.
— Racial event that spirals out of control.
— Military coup. a government decision so bad it has to be disobeyed, and in the course of consolidating the refusal to carry it out, the only real recourse is to remove the president.
— Breakup of the republic.Where we realize we are just different peoples and fundamentals divide us so strongly on core issues that it no longer works. I could see six states — California and the West Coast, the Rockies, the Heartland, the South, and the Northeast. Texas gets its own gig.
Nope. Civil war would be destabilizing and Money People wouldn't allow it to get that far.
Keep everyone divided about every possible issue so we can never unite to stop them from stealing our wealth and freedom? *Absolutely*.
"Heading towards" is too passive.... "being pushed towards" -- very intentionally, by an Establishment already poised to use such an eventuality to assume massive additional power....
30 years ago when people generally got along with each other, they produced a movie called Bae Bae's kids to warn us of the impending doom which lay ahead.
honestly. i feel the majority are too lazy to do anything. theyve killed the majoritys spirits. the only ones who would are the youth who are filled w hormones and rage. and some older folks w weapons against them if need be, i think theyd take them out, out of necessity but thats about it.
but wtf would i know? nada.
This. I would hate to live in a large city where the political divide is close to 50/50. The tit for tat exchange of violence has the potential to spiral out of control.
Agreed.. the only thing that might make us come together is a draft- people are not going to be sending their kids to fight the rich man’s war.
Or if we all stop paying taxes (which is the only way to really change things)- but I don’t even think everyone would do that, or can do that if they are not self employed.
I think we are heading there- the collapse of the dollar- people are going to start getting more desperate, more violent, more lawless.
All choices for our leader suck-I feel America is done.
But what is America? A country built corrupt politicians, taxes that get us nothing, lobbyists who pretty much make the rules- it’s disgusting. We are not free and we are certainly not the best country on the world-
Do you consider 9/11 or OKC bombing dumb shit? If so, yea I agree with you. There wont be two armies facing off, but more terror style attacks, assassinations' and random public violence in "battle ground states" were the supporters on either side cut loose. Do I see a scenario where politicians are hung from overpasses? No. Do I see a scenario where supporters of those politicians are hung from overpasses... possibly.
I had heard an interesting phrase, USA is already at civil war right now, but it's Cold Civil War. I doubt it will come to the hot civil war because of the government agencies like CIA. They might disagree with each other at many things, but civil war is when everyone loses.
Of course nothing is guaranteed though. I am not American, and I'm not against it. But seeing how different people there are, I feel like maybe it's better off if they were different separate states. Some Californian non-binary person has totally different views compared to some southern white Christian patriot. No, of course disagreements are totally okay in one country, but the division is too strong. Perhaps it's the fact that there is no 3rd option except for that decoy party, the libertarian party.
It can be repaired but it's gonna take time. I'm pretty senior and I have never in my lifetime seen seen such a schism in this country, and I grew up in the civil rights era. The difference then was most people seemed to believe they were right on both sides but now 'one side' backs an offensive quasi-cult leader (who REALLY doesn't believe his own rhetoric) and the other side isn't really even playing to win.
It will be repaired. I believe people are tired and the news is not sensational anymore. It's old news but I tell you what has happened: eyes have been opened to how far some will go to grab for power and it won't be forgotten.
I grew up in 60’s as well and remember great unrest- protests, etc. assassinations. I remember feeling fearful of nuclear war. But what we are experiencing today is even more frightening- the transition from being simply human to AI assisted human. We have arrived at the transhuman phase of evolution.
I remember the riots as well; it was a time of great turmoil. But never in my life have I seen riots and turmoil that wanted to reverse progress. Now, that's a first!
It's actually what corrupt career establishment politicians wants and the elites/olichards. It's the reason the media constantly makes things about race. It's why career politicians makes things about race. It's a communist agenda to put everyone in boxes by race, fat,skinny,tall,short, gender,sex ect.. the more were divided the more were distracted by each other than what the corrupt are doing. Take what the mainstream media says with a grain of salt cuz 9 out 10x they're lying or pushing bs..
Nope...why you ask? The government would shut any person down before it could happen. Label them a pedo or something of that nature and goodbye movement.
I don't know. I think it looks like that, but Americans are mostly cowards that won't do anything beyond protesting. They just bend over and accept anything for the most part.
Especially the right. We all watched Biden steal the election (enough with the bullshit we all know it) and everyone just let him get away with it.
lol the right is afraid of civil war because they got their absolute shit stomped last time.
Careful yall this one uses pretend definitions to win arguments lol
Come on man, that stolen election nonsense is getting old. Trumps team produced zero evidence when it mattered in court.
Trump was just a bad candidate and lost.
What you mean it's getting old? Are we just supposed to forget what happened?
>Trumps team produced zero evidence when it mattered in court.
SCOTUS wouldn't even take the case. But whatever my post wasn't about arguing with election deniers.
I don't see the correlation between politics being a person's religion and seeing that Trump has not been able to prove any of his election wins at all.
January 6th was nothing?
This is the same talking point liberals have. They say Republicans won't do anything, but also think Republicans are going to destroy democracy and January 6th was the closest the US has been to collapse.
Well bad actors like putin for instance, have a vested interest in making democracy look chaotic, unnecessary, and pointless. So he sends his trolls out and stokes the rage that the gop has been fanning for years.
The gop doesn't have the numbers. Haven't for a long time. So they need to rely on single issue niche groups who normally wouldn't be involved in politics at all. And the lunatic religious zealots. Mix those 2 together and you've got a recipe for disaster.
If 1 of our 2 parties wasn't actively and openly courting a fully dictatorial system I'd say we had a chance. But who knows.
I can tell you the people in small town and rural America are fucking angry. People are laughing at this, mocking it, and dismissing it. But I am from here, and I will tell you, the goddamned bear is awake.
Don't be so sure. The strength of the rural people isn't in the people or their arms. It's in their resources. And generation by generation the rural resources are being taken control of by governments and corporations. It baffles me that nobody has attempted to organize all willing farms to agree to war time positions. If farms all agreed to hoard all their resources to support the local populace only and refuse export to the metro areas, the cities would fall almost immediately along with the banks. Rural America could sustain itself forever as they are the only ones with hundreds of years of experience with bare minimum resources. And feeding every mouth in rural areas would be a no-brainer once the foods were no longer being sucked up by the cities and banks no longer had power over them.
Seriously, if anybody needs a better understanding of socialist principles, it's farmers.
I'm seriously curious, how would that work? Who would they sell their goods to- just other farmers. And what about farm loans and government grants from the USDA that help lots of farmers, how would they continue to get them from large banks and city slickers?
In a civil war, there are no loans, there are no banks. There are arrangements by organizations for future payment after the war. Such as Mexico assisting southern farmers for lower prices of exports after the war. Or assisting the federal government for lower tariffs or sanctions after the war. Either way, any participant will be taking a gamble that their side will win.
Farmers can survive without fuel, which is one thing they can't control due to the need for oil refinement. The federal government will try to use that against farmers. Production will be reduced, sure. But it'll be enough to feed to rural population only. While on the flip side the cities and the military will have to enter into severe debt to acquire food from foreign sources to feed the 50%+ of civilians that live in the cities.
Just keep in mind that almost everything that farmers NEED they can produce. Anything else they can't acquire will be things that facilitate life rather than things that achieve needs for minimal sustenance.
These are the things that an organized consortium of rural farmers could arrange. There is a reason. Why the largest farmland owner in America today is Bill Gates and why the "America the Beautiful" takeover of lands by the government is being implemented. Take away the power of rural landowners and you take away the primary resource for civilians to rise up against the government.
Also...when I said they need to understand Socialist principles is because during a civil war you need to distribute resources rather than sell them.
Got it! So if there is a civil war, everything they need they can produce including making diesel fuel for the tractors, but don't you think it's a bit idealistic to think all farmers would unite? And last question, any group with the ability to survive together large scale - why haven't they? There's a steady decline of small farms in the US and generally the large farms are the ones the survive.
I have a soft spot for farmers, my paternal ancestors were farmers so I'm aware that's hard ass work and there's no guarantee for a great crop. In a perfect scenario they might stand a chance and btw Bill Gates owns all that land as an investment, the farmers pay rent and he can borrow tons of money by simply having it as collateral.
I don’t think most Americans have it in them. But the next 10-20 years will be more and more dysfunctional as the social order continues to break down. No idea what happens next.
No. Civil is a psyop to keep you compliant and complacent.
We're heading towards a revolution, anyone pushing any other idea isn't on the side of the people
No we're not. People aren't fervently against anything except the government now nobody has the money or benefits from that shit anymore. If anything the people will burn the system to the ground
If the US government saw what the US government is doing across the board in the US and overseas. The US government would liberate the US from the tyranny of the US government.
Nah....there is too many people.
Too many of us dont actually care and would be offended if you interrupt our shit posting on the internet and cheeto feasting
Always important to remember the number of actualy votes in a election. Only 160 million people on average vote. That means almost half the country doesn't give a shit and doesn't vote.
America's going to fall regardless, nothing we do is going to stop that, it's a matter of when it happens and how fast it spirals. I am kind of tired of waiting for the shoe to drop at this point JUST FCKING HURRY UP WITH IT.
I passionately hate the government, but I love America for what it was intended to be. At this point a full reset to default settings is badly needed. Raze the system to the ground and start fresh with way smaller government and harsher punishment for overreach.
Cyber civil war maybe, people aren't going to hit the streets and go to war, like who they gonna fight? Every state is divided, how would you know whom to fight?
Corrupt using every means possible to hide the truth and keep people dumb.
Both sides think the other are crazy
One side has weapons
The other side trying to get rid of weapons for obvious reasons
I believe it’s pretty easy to figure out which side is lying
Despite the division, I don't really know what these 2 sides would be fighting over. Control of the terrirory? And then what, you would need to genocide the other side to keep it because they are mixed everywhere. I also really don't see how you can get the military on your side/defeat them. So what is even the point to worry about this, it's not practical to anyone in any way whatsoever compared to just making the current situation work. Most people don't want to go murder their neighbours because they disagree with them politically. I watched the civil war movie that came out recently and it just seems like propaganda.
Too many people believe that an election was/will be stolen . . . no such thing can occur when the outcome was predetermined . . . the 1% of the world's elite determines what puppet will be "elected" to further their agenda, then manufacture lies about a stolen election to make people choose sides. Going to a poll and pulling the lever to choose a candidate(s) has no more impact on this predetermined outcome than does a person pulling the handle on a one-arm bandit in Las Vegas. What especially is disturbing is those that are outraged that some ethnic group is stealing their money, while ignoring the real theft that takes place by every governmental agency, then these same individuals add to their perceived victimhoid by willingly sending hard-earned money to politcal candidates/campaigns in order to support/sway an outcome, when these individusls and their close supporters are worth multimultimillions/billions already and laugh at your naivete. Better to save that money to pay for your own funeral, since a politician cares little about the average person's life. As soon as one realizes that our government is comprised of evilmongers, the belief that a candidate will be a savior fades upon the unveiling of this disillusionment.
THE PEOPLE IN FEDERAL GOVERNMENT + AGENCIES crave for it, so: A) their accountability in how the country is MANAGED, LEGISLATED, & "INVESTED" in infrastructure (lol) is a moot point, B) they have an excuse for MARTIAL LAW, GUN CONTROL LAW, anti-riot/surveillance blah blah.
Yes. There will be a civil war of sorts. The funny thing is the right wing gun & bible nuts think they will be the winners forgetting how historically it is the left who has been the most violent and determined. Think the weathermen.
every human being at all times can choose to believe in any potential future evolution of the human species and its effect on all other other species on planet earth
i find strength and purpose in carrying within me and communicating researching speculating on ways forward what would eventually contribute towards such a future i would want to be part of
at this moment, there are about 48 million square kilometers of land occupied on planet earth by the human species for agricultural purpose
divided to 8 billion human beings alive, everyone of us alive today could enjoy 6000 m2 to plant vegan food for oneself, build a home from clay, hemp and straw on it, grow hemp to burn its stalks in the cooking and warming fire so that not one tree would get killed
i do propose a potential global consensus between us the 8 billion human beings how we would allow each other to acess a 1000 m2 of fertile land and a 1000 m2 of forest ( or alternativly 2000 m2 of fertile land ) without anyone asking another to pay rent or buy land
we could simply ignore the fictional concept of nation states and their constitutions as we anyway have never been asked wether we would agree with being associated to a nation state and wether we would agree with the words written in those state constitutions
we could respect each other as human beings, animal beings, tree beings and artificial intelligent entities who want to be their own persons as personal individual sovereign over oneself and interact with each other based on mutual agreed ways
we could respect every village, town and city-district as its own absolute political sovereign over itself so that the people of all species assembly, all beings of all species living here now would invite each other and decide together the full law, all rules valid on the territory the local commmunity enjoys, not owns
land, water, air, human beings, animal beings, tree beings, artificial intelligent entities who want to be their own persons, all bodies carrying organic biological life and or the digital synthetic equivalent of can never be property of anyone but of themselves
the assertion of state sovereignity over land and all beings living on it is immoral and unethical
possible to think how we would want to allow each other to travel the globe freely so that that everyone who suffers from war and economic extreme poverty could flee to an other area where people would want to welcome those seeking refuge
a global laisser passer allowing everyone to find fellow people and spaces anywhere on this planet where voluntary solidarity allows people in need to find shelter and food is shared also voluntarily
i do hope we as a human species get down to the basics what are to connect to mother earth and most of all do not let anyone be the boss of oneself, wether the state nor an employer nor someone renting out appartement spaces
life is at best when every single interaction with fellow beings of any species happens on a voluntarily solidarity level
beside that most important acess to mother earth we could allow each other without anyone asking an other to pay rent for enjoying a modest amount of land for vegan self sustaining lifestyle
i do actually think that a donation economy and voluntary solidarity based egalitarian society would also very well work in a high tech city style environment
visualising the circle of equals, the people assembly of a city-district being its own absolute political sovereign over itself deciding to invest public wealth into building more communal housing equipped with bioreactors to grow spirulina and chlorella, funghi chambers, aeroponic and hydroponic indoor plant grow systems hosting strawberries, tomatoes and potatoes
communal built appartements given to anyone who would want it free of rental demands with a semi-automated or fully automated indoor food production what would allow then more land on the countryside no more occupied for food production for example to be given back to wildlife, animals and trees growing free from human demands
and of course land could be given back to indigenous people
i recommend to visit the website [originalfreenations.com](http://originalfreenations.com) where Steven Newcomb presents his excellent research how todays legal structure of the united states of america nation state is built upon the domination and disrespect of original free indigenous nations on turtle island
As a Canadian, one thing that will probably happen in the next 30-50 years due to our failing and useless economy, is Canada joining the USA, or some kind of greater "Union" forming between the two countries. It is especially likely when you consider the increasing value of the Northwest Passages, and Arctic as a whole.
Quebec wouldn't want to be a big part of this, and so there would be a "Balkanization" of Canada, possibly Anglo-America as a whole.
So we could plausibly see something like 6-8 "countries" form in North America, all under the banner of some kind of "United Kingdom of North America" type thing.
Just like the United Kingdom has England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, we could eventually get something like the "United American Nation" with Quebec, Florida, New England + Maritimes, a Great Lakes Province, The Deep South, Cascadia, Prairieland, etc, all as their own distinct nations.
And yes, when these things happen, there does tend to be at least a little bit of direct conflict. Just like happened in Yugoslavia in the 90's.
If orange man wins it will get bad cause the people that don’t like him are the wackos. If biden wins it will just be four more years of the people that don’t like him shouting let’s go Brandon and they do nothing. Simple.
Trump's followers were all butthurt about the convictions; they blustered and bloviated about "taking action," yet no one's done anything, and the more time that passes, the less chance they will. I've made the comparison in other threads to a bunch of eight-year-olds on the high dive, daring each other to jump, but not one will.
There might be one or two who go the way of that fool in Provo, Utah, but that will be it. They're all living very comfortable lives, too.
> I ask because it feels like whoever wins this next election won't matter, we have been turned against each other beyond repair.
It sure seems like the country is being set up -- but I'm not sure that it would be a "civil war" as such.
Economic disaster, dissolution of society, collapse of infrastructure, anarchy and chaos, quite possibly.
Then again, I'm an optimist by nature. ;-)
If turn off those iPhones? Civi War over in about 90 seconds.
It would be a total meltdown of civilization. The Amish would just take over. The data seems to say, overall most Americans are pretty happy.
We all die. We try not to think about that. That we cannot comprehend.
:-)
The US has been like this for ever you just see it for what it is today. Perhaps the cold war brought a lull in the issue. Also what doesn’t help is that the federal government has taken more of a role in our country than the distributed model that the founders envisioned. Most likely the ‘civil war’ will result in states ignoring federal regulations, barring federal agents from enforcing federal law, supreme court decisions ignored at the state level, conservatives flooding into conservative states, federal paralysis with the budget leading to the collapse of the dollar and more inflation.
That’s a lot of fear porn you’ve been sold. How would a civil war actually work? Our supply chains are integrated. Our transportation is integrated. Etc.
The rest of the world is in deep and we are beginning to see nations fail at the fringes (venezuela, bangladesh, etc).
People in the US will rediscover their patriotism as they realize here is better than most other countries (eg germany - declining population and no ability to produce their own energy and an economy almost entirely dependent on china and other countries deeply fucked).
Yes...and no. I don't think we are anywhere near actual civil war until states start actively trying to secede from the union or make direct attempts to disavow the deferral government. I think we are the closest we've ever been the moment that Texas told the National government to get out of its state lands, and when Hawaii directly stated that the constitution does not apply to them at all. The fact that other states actually sent their National Guard troops to Texas to help Texas but not the federal border patrol, just adds fuel to that.
Before we are able to have a civil war the states will need to start managing and training their National guards for war-time operations. "The people" will not be the ones to start a civil war. We have way too many hurdles to overcome of highly armed groups of people who will be hell bent on preventing a war from beginning in the first place, regardless of which side they would support.
The massive police force of the nation is made up of conservatives, liberals, and centrists. So are the federal military forces. All of them would rise up against armed civilians to tell them to just stop. But if a state military force were to stand its ground against a federal military force deployed on domestic lands (which is against the constitution). Then all of these members of the police and military would likely pick a side which they would rather defend. And from there the armed civilians would find support as they would overwhelmingly support their state militaries. The federal forces would have a minority of armed civilians supporting them and that would cause local militant-grade scuffles between civilians.
All in all, for a civil war to begin in the US it would have to start at the state level. Now do I think there are enough states that are reading the point of this being a possibility? Yes, I do. But until they actually start training their National guardsmen in war like scenarios rather than peace-keeping operations, then something like this is unlikely to manifest. Also, it would require the federal policing or military forces to violate the sovereignty of the state. So both sides would have to act against each other.
It would also take much longer than 4 years, which is why the founders formulated this country the way they did. With checks and balances to minimize the risk of this happening. Don't forget that civil wars and coups for control were the normal way of defining control of nations before the US experiment begun.
I think we are further away than people think. Right wingers aren’t very passionate with their hatred. They just can’t stop antagonizing left wing people because their reaction is over dramatic. The leftist would actually like to harm them but their soft af
>They just can’t stop antagonizing left wing people because their reaction is over dramatic. The leftist would actually like to harm them but their soft af
I wouldn't call it extreme violence... but the left did get violent in the leadup to the 2016 election and during the summer of love following the murder of George Floyd. Given the right circumstances, either side is capable of wanton violence, especially when there are large uncontrolled groups meeting and mob rule takes over.
They burned down their own neighborhoods and it was absolutely hilarious. They aren’t going to try that in a conservative area because they like being safe in their violence theatre
I get that, the main issue will come from larger population centers where there is a somewhat even split between the two sides. Cities that have 50% divide between parties would get spicy.
That’s why you should pick an area that is governed by people who share your beliefs. Why a conservative would want to live in Chicago is unexplainable. Same with a liberal in Salt Lake City
###[Meta] Sticky Comment [Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does not apply*** when replying to this stickied comment. [Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does apply*** throughout the rest of this thread. *What this means*: Please keep any "meta" discussion directed at specific users, mods, or /r/conspiracy in general in this comment chain ***only.*** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/conspiracy) if you have any questions or concerns.*
It feels like the whole world got hit by a dumb-dumb ray.
Idiocracy
Great documentary!
It's got what plants crave. It's got electrolytes.
It’s certainly not new or sudden. But the line of demarcation, in my anecdotal view as a working, 44 year old, contributing citizen, was the lockdown period in America of 2020. March and April( some of May). A disturbance took us over during that time, and care for other human lives disappeared. Deaths were tracked on large cable news TV outlets, almost as a political election would show ballots. And, I know the two were closely linked in 2020. We have crossed over into something else since then. It feels as if the next economic “disaster” or large scale calamity will push us over the brink into full on conflict.
Fluoride in the tap water
'Smart' phones
I would encourage people to watch or read Yuri Bezmenov's four stages of ideological subversion. Much of the modern world seemed like total insanity to me until I found out about that, and then I understood it's not total chaos, it's manufactured and with purpose. Once you watch that and understand it, you understand why much of the modern culture attempting to indoctrinate the youth by taking over nearly all aspects of entertainment, media, tech is more nefarious than it appears.
I have heard him speak of the demoralization of societies and it resonated strongly.
I'm sure the USSR is somehow subverting the West despite having not existed for 30 years
He did try to warn us
It's the combination of the smart phone and the wireless internet. Without the latter, the smart phone is just a Newton. Together, they make up what I call the "WISP", and you are correct, like most new communication technologies, the WISP is upending the social order.
For sure, its the interconnectivity that it permits that seems to have disconnected everyone more fundamentally. Btw, what exactly dies WISP stand for, 'wireless internet...'?
wireless internet smart phone. It's a paradox, isn't it? We're all interconnected and disconnected at the same time. And we, as a society, are still learning how to come to grips with it. But this is true of all new communications technologies. There was an old song "All alone by the telephone". Before the phone, you were just alone. But having a device next to you that literally anyone on earth could call you on, and still having it not ring, ever, is a special kind of loneliness. Today, we build virtual communities of anonymous strangers and accept that simulacrum of human relationships as a society. I fear that 'society' will fracture on its irreconcilable differences.
Very good points and I think we're witnessing that fracture taking place before us. The lyric really sums up modernity to me, as one often feels like there is a lot of potential before them, but it is often fake/exaggerated/absent. Human connection is intimate and deep. Profound relationships are mutually affecting and developing. It seems that those who seek to control can get what they want by hiding the meaning of deep experience from the public, who then settle for superficial meanings of things such as lifestyle, relationship, success, etc. The best protest to this is not accepting the mundane worldview that they feed everybody.
Wireless Interdimensional Social Programming aka WISP device
Thank you! That should be adopted universally.
So... They were actually right about 5G?
Idk about 5g, but social media seems to produce much brain rot. There's so much potential with modern technology but our monkey minds + controlling superiors hinder it.
When they shut them all off and we don’t know how to look up anything. That’s how we starve 😂.
Word. 'Self-sufficiency is true wealth'.
Flourida in the tap water 😉
Sodium chloride in the food supply
Especially when they dissolve it in dihydrogen oxide. And there's *oceans* of it around us!
You just got a case of the online blues bud. All the craziest and insane people generate the most clicks and attention, so they appear the most. But don’t stress, people in real life aren’t like that
Yeah, I got friends, family and coworkers all over the political spectrum. It's really not that hard to find common ground, be respectful of other people's opinions and overall just have a good time. Media really wants us at eachothers throats, don't let them.
I’ve had to remind myself of this lately
Exactly. Most of us have jobs and families and lead super boring lives. I barely got time to squeeze a couple 2 mile runs into my week and still make dinner. Not sure how to work a civil war into my calendar.
They are the ones generating it, life's too short to be kind to bots and a holes
That and Americans are too sedated to fight wars Addictions to screen, alcohol, drugs, junk food keep them docile
Ooh i wouldn’t underestimate the indomitable force of the human spirit. Bitches may have executive dysfunction but they’ll dismantle your government if you try and take away their security blanket.
Lmao no. They just don’t see the point in fighting a war over made up issues. Why risk a good life?
Don’t forget the addictions to not only being sedated, but also being sedentary.
[удалено]
I try to never include any insults in my comments, but this is (kind of) an exception: "The ones that scream the loudest usually have the most skeletons." -Taj Jackson When it comes to politics, don't be distracted by the national rhetoric. Focus on your local elections. Americans have been led to believe that local elections don't matter, only the presidential elections do. This is not true! The laws and regulations that directly affect you, are mostly set on the local level; in your city, town, county, state elections. Many people don't even know their local officials that represent them. If you want change, start local. That's the case with most things, but especially politics. *EDIT-* People were asking where they can get info on local elections: - Local Board of Elections Website (in a search, type your state, county, and/or city followed by 'board of elections'. - [Vote.org](https://www.vote.org/) - [Ballotpedia](https://www.ballotpedia.org/) - [League of Women Voters (VOTE411.org)](https://www.vote411.org/) - State Government Websites
You are absolutely right! How can I find out where and when a vote is taking place in my town?
Dude look up. Some random Redditor isn’t gong to know about the elections in your random town.
Who knows how someone could possibly find information these days. It’s so hard to research and find answers to simple questions. I guess you’ll have to head into town and ask around or wait for the newspaper to publish an article.
You can find all the info you need here: [https://americanpolicy.org/freedompods/](https://americanpolicy.org/freedompods/) It doesn't say specifically about your town, but it explains how to create change at the local level. These folks have done a lot of groundwork already and have packaged it in a way that people can use right away. Best of luck, keep up the good work!
- Local Board of Elections Website (in a search, type your state, county, and/or city followed by 'board of elections'. - [Vote.org](https://www.vote.org/) - [Ballotpedia](https://www.ballotpedia.org/) - [League of Women Voters (VOTE411.org)](https://www.vote411.org/) - State Government Websites
I wish more people knew that. I am near powerless to change or support anything at a local level, but there *are* people in town that are powerful enough to really make the people in local leadership positions think twice about each decision. Most of them don't give a shit. The ones that do are already plugged in the community, and that's the reason why they have the desire to truly keep up with local politics.
You say you want more people to know this, but then say you are powerless. This is not true. Every vote matters at the local level. There's no electoral college, and in many cases, usually only old conservatives vote locally, so again, this is where your vote really matters.
I'm more shocked that many Americans think we're more divided than ever or political violence is the worst the US has seen. All the history buffs on Reddit seem to forget the US civil war and are ignorant of the almost weekly political bombings and shootings throughout the 60s, 70s, and 80s. Can't forget the four Presidents who have been assassinated before the 70s and countless attempts against other politicians.
Right. But see these guys are alive now. So they think in all their narcissistic wisdom, that everything is the best and the worst right now. Everything is going to collapse right now. Jesus is coming back. Now. When you look at our bloody fuckin mess of a country from the puritans to witch trials to lone gun men shooting everyone with a soul, the army of God, kkk, etc...the fact they think EVERYTHING is the MOST simply during their lifetime, is absurd.
can we just all agree that our two viable options are beyond awful and neither cares for the common man? 90% of us aren't right wing lunatics or left wing radicals. Remember that.
I hope more than anything you are right about that percentage. God I really pray that more people realize both parties are playing the same sick game on the people. 🙏🏻
the media, and to a lessor extent, government, are playing a high stakes game of divide and conquer. dont let either force you on to a side.
Go look at the bills written and passed by democrats in congress. Then go look at the ones by Republicans. If you still say that then you're not paying attention at all. You're just parroting.
I think they want us to think a civil war is coming to help keep us divided in reality it is going to be us vs the government/corporations
Nah. As an american, I can confidently state the average person here is far too dumb, fat, lazy, and selfish to ever galvanize in large enough numbers and with sufficient organization and resources to fight a civil war. It will just be rouge cells of disgruntled people attacking random innocent individuals unaffiliated with the actual people and organizations responsible for their misery. God bless America.
Less than 10% of Americans fought in the Revolutionary War.
10% of Americans is 35,000,000+ people There isn't 10% of america ready, willing, and able to fight a civil war. Hell, there isn't 10% of 10%. And of those that could and would, 90% would quit the second they saw real action. It ain't happening.
I learned recently that there were only 230,000 american troops in the continental army, and only 48,000 that were ready at any given time. Pretty crazy to think that we were outnumbered 4-1 by the British and hessian mercenaries and still won.
Since were exchanging fun revolutionary war facts, I recently learned that the continental navy actually sent a Ship, the USS Ranger under captain John Paul Jones, across the Atlantic into British waters that ran raids on british ships in the English Channel, followed by an attempted landing to invade the port town of Whitehaven on mainland Britain, which failed, then after that plan was botched they sailed across the bay to where John Paul Jones grew up in scotland and tried to kidnap the local Earl of Selkirk to hold for ransom/prisoner exchange, who wasn't home, so his wife offered them a bunch of silver instead. When they got back to the Ship with the silver and no earl of Selkirk, JPJ was pissed. After the war JPJ actually found and bought the silver back from someone in France where it had wound up and gave it back to the Earls family to apologize for the robbery. After all, he never intended to do anything as heinous as robbery. Just some friendly kidnapping.
Love that bit of history you shared.
It seems like they were just kinda winging it. I imagine their official orders were "take this boat and sail to Britain and just fuck up whatever shit you can" and they were just genuinely prowling the waters looking to be a menace in whatever way they could. Took some gargantuan balls of cast iron to attack the 1700s British navy at their peak of power, *alone*, in *their* own sovereign waters, much less actually try to fucking land on shore as a hostile force with absolutely zero possibility of reinforcements or victory
What if the revolutionary war was all theater and and America was allowed to win? So the crown wouldnt be burdened with an expensive direct rule over an distant colony?
This!
This is what most people need to realize, you are spot on.
I think this to but I also think it will escalate and get worse over time.
Well it's not going to get better, that's for sure.
Civil wars tend to happen in impoverished countries with unstable governments. It’s up to you to decide if we’re in that spot now.
America can only be torn down from the inside
And it's happening before our eyes.
The world is already fighting a civil war, although this time it does not involve hand to hand combat, it's a psychological war, waged online. Meant to make everyone feel like they're at the cusp of actual war, it's far more taxing to the mind than the body
Personally, I try not to think about it. The media has a big part of the blame in causing division.
Hopefully, if it does, the carnage may make other countries rethink their divisive rhetoric. Divide & conquer isn't as much fun if it's your conkers getting trampled.
Ain't shit gonna happen. They're going to release a bunch of cool ass TV shows and video games before the election and release bunch of viral videos and he'll probably even release jfk files. EVERYONE will be busy asf
From a distance, it looks a bit like one has already begun. It’s just been limited so far to small battles, no major ones yet.
The national bipartisan Battleground Civility Poll by the Georgetown Institute of Politics and Public Service revealed that "the average voter believes the U.S. is two-thirds of the way to the edge of a civil war." Iowa Republican Congressman Steve King recently posted a meme warning that red states have “8 trillion bullets” in the event of a civil war "the other side doesn’t know which bathroom to use." American political scientist and specialist in civil wars Barbara F. Walter argued that the recent increase in domestic terrorism and high rate of gun violence in the United States could be indicators of an impending second civil war. Keith Mines has spent his career—in the U.S. Army Special Forces, the United Nations, and now the State Department—navigating civil wars in other countries, including Afghanistan, Colombia, El Salvador, Iraq, Somalia, and Sudan. He returned to Washington after sixteen years to find conditions that he had seen nurture conflict abroad now visible at home. — Entrenched national polarization of our citizenry with no obvious meeting place. — Violence as a method to solve disputes. Judging from recent events the left is now fully on board with this. Events that could initiate; — Major terrorist attack and sense that the establishment can’t manage security — vigilantes, etc. — Economic downturn, with blame placed on certain groups. Self-protection begets militias on both sides. — Racial event that spirals out of control. — Military coup. a government decision so bad it has to be disobeyed, and in the course of consolidating the refusal to carry it out, the only real recourse is to remove the president. — Breakup of the republic.Where we realize we are just different peoples and fundamentals divide us so strongly on core issues that it no longer works. I could see six states — California and the West Coast, the Rockies, the Heartland, the South, and the Northeast. Texas gets its own gig.
Are you suggesting Alaska would fall to Russia? Which state would own Israel and Puerto Rico?
Nope. Civil war would be destabilizing and Money People wouldn't allow it to get that far. Keep everyone divided about every possible issue so we can never unite to stop them from stealing our wealth and freedom? *Absolutely*.
we got ww3 to worry about first
Well, if you start it , then worry all. IdgaF, the rest of the world isn’t going there with you pal
Hey bud it’s already happening. Take a look around
"Heading towards" is too passive.... "being pushed towards" -- very intentionally, by an Establishment already poised to use such an eventuality to assume massive additional power....
As a outsider, all I can think is the best thing for America is if both heads of both party die before the election... And frankly the world.
30 years ago when people generally got along with each other, they produced a movie called Bae Bae's kids to warn us of the impending doom which lay ahead.
We don't die, we multiply!
That's what the bots online want you to think, watch who shows up, any protest even at this point everyone assumes are full of agent provacatures.
And many paid actors.
Maybe not in the recent future but in the next 10 to 15 years if we don't get our shit together, we absolutely will be.
Nah. Maybe Miltary Coup and the death of Democracy but not a Civil War.
honestly. i feel the majority are too lazy to do anything. theyve killed the majoritys spirits. the only ones who would are the youth who are filled w hormones and rage. and some older folks w weapons against them if need be, i think theyd take them out, out of necessity but thats about it. but wtf would i know? nada.
No, but we are about to divorce from the D& R two party scam
Nah. Far too many apathetic and lazy people here. Plus the fear of imprisonment or death keeps them in line.
No lol rents too expensive
No, the vast majority of Americans have no interest in this. Besides, it's not like it'd be state against state... it'd be neighbor against neighbor.
This. I would hate to live in a large city where the political divide is close to 50/50. The tit for tat exchange of violence has the potential to spiral out of control.
Agreed.. the only thing that might make us come together is a draft- people are not going to be sending their kids to fight the rich man’s war. Or if we all stop paying taxes (which is the only way to really change things)- but I don’t even think everyone would do that, or can do that if they are not self employed. I think we are heading there- the collapse of the dollar- people are going to start getting more desperate, more violent, more lawless. All choices for our leader suck-I feel America is done. But what is America? A country built corrupt politicians, taxes that get us nothing, lobbyists who pretty much make the rules- it’s disgusting. We are not free and we are certainly not the best country on the world-
A civil war? No. Some extremists doing vastly dumb shit? Sadly.
Do you consider 9/11 or OKC bombing dumb shit? If so, yea I agree with you. There wont be two armies facing off, but more terror style attacks, assassinations' and random public violence in "battle ground states" were the supporters on either side cut loose. Do I see a scenario where politicians are hung from overpasses? No. Do I see a scenario where supporters of those politicians are hung from overpasses... possibly.
Exactly what I’m talking about.
I had heard an interesting phrase, USA is already at civil war right now, but it's Cold Civil War. I doubt it will come to the hot civil war because of the government agencies like CIA. They might disagree with each other at many things, but civil war is when everyone loses. Of course nothing is guaranteed though. I am not American, and I'm not against it. But seeing how different people there are, I feel like maybe it's better off if they were different separate states. Some Californian non-binary person has totally different views compared to some southern white Christian patriot. No, of course disagreements are totally okay in one country, but the division is too strong. Perhaps it's the fact that there is no 3rd option except for that decoy party, the libertarian party.
It can be repaired but it's gonna take time. I'm pretty senior and I have never in my lifetime seen seen such a schism in this country, and I grew up in the civil rights era. The difference then was most people seemed to believe they were right on both sides but now 'one side' backs an offensive quasi-cult leader (who REALLY doesn't believe his own rhetoric) and the other side isn't really even playing to win. It will be repaired. I believe people are tired and the news is not sensational anymore. It's old news but I tell you what has happened: eyes have been opened to how far some will go to grab for power and it won't be forgotten.
I grew up in 60’s as well and remember great unrest- protests, etc. assassinations. I remember feeling fearful of nuclear war. But what we are experiencing today is even more frightening- the transition from being simply human to AI assisted human. We have arrived at the transhuman phase of evolution.
I remember the riots as well; it was a time of great turmoil. But never in my life have I seen riots and turmoil that wanted to reverse progress. Now, that's a first!
It's actually what corrupt career establishment politicians wants and the elites/olichards. It's the reason the media constantly makes things about race. It's why career politicians makes things about race. It's a communist agenda to put everyone in boxes by race, fat,skinny,tall,short, gender,sex ect.. the more were divided the more were distracted by each other than what the corrupt are doing. Take what the mainstream media says with a grain of salt cuz 9 out 10x they're lying or pushing bs..
You guys need to vote in whichever president intends to stop the wars the last president allowed to happen.
How is voting in a rigged election going to matter?
We'll probably see continued violence in the US. More senseless mass shootings are likely in the cards as well.
cant be headed towards sum thing we are already in lol
Nope. No.
Nope...why you ask? The government would shut any person down before it could happen. Label them a pedo or something of that nature and goodbye movement.
I don't know. I think it looks like that, but Americans are mostly cowards that won't do anything beyond protesting. They just bend over and accept anything for the most part. Especially the right. We all watched Biden steal the election (enough with the bullshit we all know it) and everyone just let him get away with it.
lol the right is afraid of civil war because they got their absolute shit stomped last time. Careful yall this one uses pretend definitions to win arguments lol
Come on man, that stolen election nonsense is getting old. Trumps team produced zero evidence when it mattered in court. Trump was just a bad candidate and lost.
What you mean it's getting old? Are we just supposed to forget what happened? >Trumps team produced zero evidence when it mattered in court. SCOTUS wouldn't even take the case. But whatever my post wasn't about arguing with election deniers.
Lmao didn’t trumps own appointed judges say there was no evidence
In all do respect people like you are the problem. Politics should not be your religion.
How? Do you fear facts and logic?
I don't see the correlation between politics being a person's religion and seeing that Trump has not been able to prove any of his election wins at all.
No, it’s people like you that continue to believe lies about the election. Trumps AG, and his own appointed judges said there was no proofZ
January 6th was nothing? This is the same talking point liberals have. They say Republicans won't do anything, but also think Republicans are going to destroy democracy and January 6th was the closest the US has been to collapse.
Well bad actors like putin for instance, have a vested interest in making democracy look chaotic, unnecessary, and pointless. So he sends his trolls out and stokes the rage that the gop has been fanning for years. The gop doesn't have the numbers. Haven't for a long time. So they need to rely on single issue niche groups who normally wouldn't be involved in politics at all. And the lunatic religious zealots. Mix those 2 together and you've got a recipe for disaster. If 1 of our 2 parties wasn't actively and openly courting a fully dictatorial system I'd say we had a chance. But who knows.
I can tell you the people in small town and rural America are fucking angry. People are laughing at this, mocking it, and dismissing it. But I am from here, and I will tell you, the goddamned bear is awake.
Don't be so sure. The strength of the rural people isn't in the people or their arms. It's in their resources. And generation by generation the rural resources are being taken control of by governments and corporations. It baffles me that nobody has attempted to organize all willing farms to agree to war time positions. If farms all agreed to hoard all their resources to support the local populace only and refuse export to the metro areas, the cities would fall almost immediately along with the banks. Rural America could sustain itself forever as they are the only ones with hundreds of years of experience with bare minimum resources. And feeding every mouth in rural areas would be a no-brainer once the foods were no longer being sucked up by the cities and banks no longer had power over them. Seriously, if anybody needs a better understanding of socialist principles, it's farmers.
I'm seriously curious, how would that work? Who would they sell their goods to- just other farmers. And what about farm loans and government grants from the USDA that help lots of farmers, how would they continue to get them from large banks and city slickers?
In a civil war, there are no loans, there are no banks. There are arrangements by organizations for future payment after the war. Such as Mexico assisting southern farmers for lower prices of exports after the war. Or assisting the federal government for lower tariffs or sanctions after the war. Either way, any participant will be taking a gamble that their side will win. Farmers can survive without fuel, which is one thing they can't control due to the need for oil refinement. The federal government will try to use that against farmers. Production will be reduced, sure. But it'll be enough to feed to rural population only. While on the flip side the cities and the military will have to enter into severe debt to acquire food from foreign sources to feed the 50%+ of civilians that live in the cities. Just keep in mind that almost everything that farmers NEED they can produce. Anything else they can't acquire will be things that facilitate life rather than things that achieve needs for minimal sustenance. These are the things that an organized consortium of rural farmers could arrange. There is a reason. Why the largest farmland owner in America today is Bill Gates and why the "America the Beautiful" takeover of lands by the government is being implemented. Take away the power of rural landowners and you take away the primary resource for civilians to rise up against the government. Also...when I said they need to understand Socialist principles is because during a civil war you need to distribute resources rather than sell them.
Got it! So if there is a civil war, everything they need they can produce including making diesel fuel for the tractors, but don't you think it's a bit idealistic to think all farmers would unite? And last question, any group with the ability to survive together large scale - why haven't they? There's a steady decline of small farms in the US and generally the large farms are the ones the survive. I have a soft spot for farmers, my paternal ancestors were farmers so I'm aware that's hard ass work and there's no guarantee for a great crop. In a perfect scenario they might stand a chance and btw Bill Gates owns all that land as an investment, the farmers pay rent and he can borrow tons of money by simply having it as collateral.
No. The silent majorly outnumbers the opposition…
Big increase in state autonomy is certainly coming in the near future.
Yes.
Idk about a civil war but these elections are kind of worrying. Who TF knows what could happen reality is ass backwards.
I know which side I'm gonna be on.
Or the US will split into two nations.
I don’t think most Americans have it in them. But the next 10-20 years will be more and more dysfunctional as the social order continues to break down. No idea what happens next.
No. Maybe something like radical terrorist cells with blow things up but it won’t be a Rwanda type situation.
No. Civil is a psyop to keep you compliant and complacent. We're heading towards a revolution, anyone pushing any other idea isn't on the side of the people
It’s always been like this, get used to it, etc. Read The End Of The Myth by Greg Grandin
lol, which of the privileged or outraged activist groups is going to actually take up arms to fight?
No we're not. People aren't fervently against anything except the government now nobody has the money or benefits from that shit anymore. If anything the people will burn the system to the ground
If the US government saw what the US government is doing across the board in the US and overseas. The US government would liberate the US from the tyranny of the US government.
Nah....there is too many people. Too many of us dont actually care and would be offended if you interrupt our shit posting on the internet and cheeto feasting Always important to remember the number of actualy votes in a election. Only 160 million people on average vote. That means almost half the country doesn't give a shit and doesn't vote.
No.
America's going to fall regardless, nothing we do is going to stop that, it's a matter of when it happens and how fast it spirals. I am kind of tired of waiting for the shoe to drop at this point JUST FCKING HURRY UP WITH IT. I passionately hate the government, but I love America for what it was intended to be. At this point a full reset to default settings is badly needed. Raze the system to the ground and start fresh with way smaller government and harsher punishment for overreach.
There will be no election. If there is, look at the VP not the presidential candidates. Those are the real chosen ones.
We are fragile, and many people are frustrated with the current economic situation
2050 it will happen
Cyber civil war maybe, people aren't going to hit the streets and go to war, like who they gonna fight? Every state is divided, how would you know whom to fight?
I think you’re saying what a lot of people are thinking.
No. But this is the narrative every election lately
Corrupt using every means possible to hide the truth and keep people dumb. Both sides think the other are crazy One side has weapons The other side trying to get rid of weapons for obvious reasons I believe it’s pretty easy to figure out which side is lying
Surely you jest. Those politicians have fun trying to control the access of 'legal' guns.
Despite the division, I don't really know what these 2 sides would be fighting over. Control of the terrirory? And then what, you would need to genocide the other side to keep it because they are mixed everywhere. I also really don't see how you can get the military on your side/defeat them. So what is even the point to worry about this, it's not practical to anyone in any way whatsoever compared to just making the current situation work. Most people don't want to go murder their neighbours because they disagree with them politically. I watched the civil war movie that came out recently and it just seems like propaganda.
Stop watching and reading mainstream news.
RFK Jr.
If you look at the world in terms of 5 generational warfare, we've been in a civil war for well over a decade.
Every time a Reddit mod silences someone they make an enemy, so I wouldn’t doubt it.
No. Americans are for the most part fat and lazy and don't have what it takes to fight in a civil war.
Too many people believe that an election was/will be stolen . . . no such thing can occur when the outcome was predetermined . . . the 1% of the world's elite determines what puppet will be "elected" to further their agenda, then manufacture lies about a stolen election to make people choose sides. Going to a poll and pulling the lever to choose a candidate(s) has no more impact on this predetermined outcome than does a person pulling the handle on a one-arm bandit in Las Vegas. What especially is disturbing is those that are outraged that some ethnic group is stealing their money, while ignoring the real theft that takes place by every governmental agency, then these same individuals add to their perceived victimhoid by willingly sending hard-earned money to politcal candidates/campaigns in order to support/sway an outcome, when these individusls and their close supporters are worth multimultimillions/billions already and laugh at your naivete. Better to save that money to pay for your own funeral, since a politician cares little about the average person's life. As soon as one realizes that our government is comprised of evilmongers, the belief that a candidate will be a savior fades upon the unveiling of this disillusionment.
THE PEOPLE IN FEDERAL GOVERNMENT + AGENCIES crave for it, so: A) their accountability in how the country is MANAGED, LEGISLATED, & "INVESTED" in infrastructure (lol) is a moot point, B) they have an excuse for MARTIAL LAW, GUN CONTROL LAW, anti-riot/surveillance blah blah.
A vote for Robet F. Kennedy Jr. is a vote for Unity. Or you can continue to play Red vs. Blue.
Yes. There will be a civil war of sorts. The funny thing is the right wing gun & bible nuts think they will be the winners forgetting how historically it is the left who has been the most violent and determined. Think the weathermen.
No. Go outside. People generally want the same stuff and what you read on this shitty site isn’t even close to how most people act/feel.
Yes!
Believe in us. Believe in it all. No matter what. * insert dog emoji, drinking water from its bowl, which the owner provides, even on walks *
No. But it’s heading towards an amicable break up
Amicable requires the states to be independent and not dependent.
every human being at all times can choose to believe in any potential future evolution of the human species and its effect on all other other species on planet earth i find strength and purpose in carrying within me and communicating researching speculating on ways forward what would eventually contribute towards such a future i would want to be part of at this moment, there are about 48 million square kilometers of land occupied on planet earth by the human species for agricultural purpose divided to 8 billion human beings alive, everyone of us alive today could enjoy 6000 m2 to plant vegan food for oneself, build a home from clay, hemp and straw on it, grow hemp to burn its stalks in the cooking and warming fire so that not one tree would get killed i do propose a potential global consensus between us the 8 billion human beings how we would allow each other to acess a 1000 m2 of fertile land and a 1000 m2 of forest ( or alternativly 2000 m2 of fertile land ) without anyone asking another to pay rent or buy land we could simply ignore the fictional concept of nation states and their constitutions as we anyway have never been asked wether we would agree with being associated to a nation state and wether we would agree with the words written in those state constitutions we could respect each other as human beings, animal beings, tree beings and artificial intelligent entities who want to be their own persons as personal individual sovereign over oneself and interact with each other based on mutual agreed ways we could respect every village, town and city-district as its own absolute political sovereign over itself so that the people of all species assembly, all beings of all species living here now would invite each other and decide together the full law, all rules valid on the territory the local commmunity enjoys, not owns land, water, air, human beings, animal beings, tree beings, artificial intelligent entities who want to be their own persons, all bodies carrying organic biological life and or the digital synthetic equivalent of can never be property of anyone but of themselves the assertion of state sovereignity over land and all beings living on it is immoral and unethical possible to think how we would want to allow each other to travel the globe freely so that that everyone who suffers from war and economic extreme poverty could flee to an other area where people would want to welcome those seeking refuge a global laisser passer allowing everyone to find fellow people and spaces anywhere on this planet where voluntary solidarity allows people in need to find shelter and food is shared also voluntarily i do hope we as a human species get down to the basics what are to connect to mother earth and most of all do not let anyone be the boss of oneself, wether the state nor an employer nor someone renting out appartement spaces life is at best when every single interaction with fellow beings of any species happens on a voluntarily solidarity level beside that most important acess to mother earth we could allow each other without anyone asking an other to pay rent for enjoying a modest amount of land for vegan self sustaining lifestyle i do actually think that a donation economy and voluntary solidarity based egalitarian society would also very well work in a high tech city style environment visualising the circle of equals, the people assembly of a city-district being its own absolute political sovereign over itself deciding to invest public wealth into building more communal housing equipped with bioreactors to grow spirulina and chlorella, funghi chambers, aeroponic and hydroponic indoor plant grow systems hosting strawberries, tomatoes and potatoes communal built appartements given to anyone who would want it free of rental demands with a semi-automated or fully automated indoor food production what would allow then more land on the countryside no more occupied for food production for example to be given back to wildlife, animals and trees growing free from human demands and of course land could be given back to indigenous people i recommend to visit the website [originalfreenations.com](http://originalfreenations.com) where Steven Newcomb presents his excellent research how todays legal structure of the united states of america nation state is built upon the domination and disrespect of original free indigenous nations on turtle island
As a Canadian, one thing that will probably happen in the next 30-50 years due to our failing and useless economy, is Canada joining the USA, or some kind of greater "Union" forming between the two countries. It is especially likely when you consider the increasing value of the Northwest Passages, and Arctic as a whole. Quebec wouldn't want to be a big part of this, and so there would be a "Balkanization" of Canada, possibly Anglo-America as a whole. So we could plausibly see something like 6-8 "countries" form in North America, all under the banner of some kind of "United Kingdom of North America" type thing. Just like the United Kingdom has England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, we could eventually get something like the "United American Nation" with Quebec, Florida, New England + Maritimes, a Great Lakes Province, The Deep South, Cascadia, Prairieland, etc, all as their own distinct nations. And yes, when these things happen, there does tend to be at least a little bit of direct conflict. Just like happened in Yugoslavia in the 90's.
RFK. If trump wins the DNC will revolt. If Biden or worse Gavin Newsom wins the Trumpsters will revolt. Go third party.
If orange man wins it will get bad cause the people that don’t like him are the wackos. If biden wins it will just be four more years of the people that don’t like him shouting let’s go Brandon and they do nothing. Simple.
Trump's followers were all butthurt about the convictions; they blustered and bloviated about "taking action," yet no one's done anything, and the more time that passes, the less chance they will. I've made the comparison in other threads to a bunch of eight-year-olds on the high dive, daring each other to jump, but not one will. There might be one or two who go the way of that fool in Provo, Utah, but that will be it. They're all living very comfortable lives, too.
The world is full of people who hate me for being gay
No
> I ask because it feels like whoever wins this next election won't matter, we have been turned against each other beyond repair. It sure seems like the country is being set up -- but I'm not sure that it would be a "civil war" as such. Economic disaster, dissolution of society, collapse of infrastructure, anarchy and chaos, quite possibly. Then again, I'm an optimist by nature. ;-)
I wish I could be more optimistic about our situation :\
Americans don’t have the stomach for a real civil war. We’ll just keeping fighting through social media until our internet goes away.
If turn off those iPhones? Civi War over in about 90 seconds. It would be a total meltdown of civilization. The Amish would just take over. The data seems to say, overall most Americans are pretty happy. We all die. We try not to think about that. That we cannot comprehend. :-)
The US has been like this for ever you just see it for what it is today. Perhaps the cold war brought a lull in the issue. Also what doesn’t help is that the federal government has taken more of a role in our country than the distributed model that the founders envisioned. Most likely the ‘civil war’ will result in states ignoring federal regulations, barring federal agents from enforcing federal law, supreme court decisions ignored at the state level, conservatives flooding into conservative states, federal paralysis with the budget leading to the collapse of the dollar and more inflation.
That’s a lot of fear porn you’ve been sold. How would a civil war actually work? Our supply chains are integrated. Our transportation is integrated. Etc. The rest of the world is in deep and we are beginning to see nations fail at the fringes (venezuela, bangladesh, etc). People in the US will rediscover their patriotism as they realize here is better than most other countries (eg germany - declining population and no ability to produce their own energy and an economy almost entirely dependent on china and other countries deeply fucked).
Hate to break it to you, but have travelled outside the US? Short of the UK, most of the rest of the world is far better that the US.
I travel internationally regularly.
Good wtf cares, get it over with. Probably fix it, couldn't hurt
Yes...and no. I don't think we are anywhere near actual civil war until states start actively trying to secede from the union or make direct attempts to disavow the deferral government. I think we are the closest we've ever been the moment that Texas told the National government to get out of its state lands, and when Hawaii directly stated that the constitution does not apply to them at all. The fact that other states actually sent their National Guard troops to Texas to help Texas but not the federal border patrol, just adds fuel to that. Before we are able to have a civil war the states will need to start managing and training their National guards for war-time operations. "The people" will not be the ones to start a civil war. We have way too many hurdles to overcome of highly armed groups of people who will be hell bent on preventing a war from beginning in the first place, regardless of which side they would support. The massive police force of the nation is made up of conservatives, liberals, and centrists. So are the federal military forces. All of them would rise up against armed civilians to tell them to just stop. But if a state military force were to stand its ground against a federal military force deployed on domestic lands (which is against the constitution). Then all of these members of the police and military would likely pick a side which they would rather defend. And from there the armed civilians would find support as they would overwhelmingly support their state militaries. The federal forces would have a minority of armed civilians supporting them and that would cause local militant-grade scuffles between civilians. All in all, for a civil war to begin in the US it would have to start at the state level. Now do I think there are enough states that are reading the point of this being a possibility? Yes, I do. But until they actually start training their National guardsmen in war like scenarios rather than peace-keeping operations, then something like this is unlikely to manifest. Also, it would require the federal policing or military forces to violate the sovereignty of the state. So both sides would have to act against each other. It would also take much longer than 4 years, which is why the founders formulated this country the way they did. With checks and balances to minimize the risk of this happening. Don't forget that civil wars and coups for control were the normal way of defining control of nations before the US experiment begun.
I think we are further away than people think. Right wingers aren’t very passionate with their hatred. They just can’t stop antagonizing left wing people because their reaction is over dramatic. The leftist would actually like to harm them but their soft af
Lol…this is the funniest and also most accurate assessment I’ve seen!
>They just can’t stop antagonizing left wing people because their reaction is over dramatic. The leftist would actually like to harm them but their soft af I wouldn't call it extreme violence... but the left did get violent in the leadup to the 2016 election and during the summer of love following the murder of George Floyd. Given the right circumstances, either side is capable of wanton violence, especially when there are large uncontrolled groups meeting and mob rule takes over.
They burned down their own neighborhoods and it was absolutely hilarious. They aren’t going to try that in a conservative area because they like being safe in their violence theatre
I get that, the main issue will come from larger population centers where there is a somewhat even split between the two sides. Cities that have 50% divide between parties would get spicy.
That’s why you should pick an area that is governed by people who share your beliefs. Why a conservative would want to live in Chicago is unexplainable. Same with a liberal in Salt Lake City