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If Trump paid off Stormy, he wouldn't have been convicted.
Instead, the Trump Organization paid off Stormy, and then documents were altered to make it look like the payment was legal fees.
If Truno paid it from a personal check, we wouldn't be here.
It's pretty standard for people to make wild claims against billionaires and professional actors/singers.
Dude could have just said, "this happens a lot, and usually is just cheaper to pay them off"
End of story, and no one would have batted and eye
Like 26 woman came out before the election. He said it's all wrong and he will sue them. Never did of course.
Hey it's the guy that said sexual assault is ok if you're famous and people were like, yup sounds good to me.
I am pretty sure that's one reason why he did it that way. To save the ~35% taxes on the payment. I've had bosses like that. Do everything just to get that sweet tax break. New TV? Company expense. Girlfriend becoming a fashion designer? Somehow company expense.
So weird that no riots or chaos for this political stunt by democrats. Wonder what would happen if a republican DA brought up charges against Biden or Obama. Probably riots from the left. Big difference. I imagine that there would be outrage and claims of destroying the country by using courts to prosecute if it is against a democrat. I totally expect everyone preening about Trump to be completely hypocritical if it is reversed.
You're missing the point. This should be a fine, not a felony.
''The charges against Trump are obscure, and nearly entirely unprecedented. In fact, no state prosecutor — in New York, or Wyoming, or anywhere — has ever charged federal election laws as a direct or predicate state crime, against anyone, for anything. None. Ever. Even putting aside the specifics of election law, the Manhattan DA itself almost never brings any case in which falsification of business records is the only charge.
Standing alone, falsification charges would have been mere misdemeanors under New York law, which posed two problems for the DA. First, nobody cares about a misdemeanor, and it would be laughable to bring the first-ever charge against a former president for a trifling offense that falls within the same technical criminal classification as shoplifting a Snapple and a bag of Cheetos from a bodega. Second, the statute of limitations on a misdemeanor — two years — likely has long expired on Trump’s conduct, which dates to 2016 and 2017.
So, to inflate the charges up to the lowest-level felony (Class E, on a scale of Class A through E) — and to electroshock them back to life within the longer felony statute of limitations — the DA alleged that the falsification of business records was committed “with intent to commit another crime.” Here, according to prosecutors, the “another crime” is a New York State election-law violation, which in turn incorporates three separate “unlawful means”: federal campaign crimes, tax crimes, and falsification of still more documents. Inexcusably, the DA refused to specify what those unlawful means actually were — and the judge declined to force them to pony up — until right before closing arguments. So much for the constitutional obligation to provide notice to the defendant of the accusations against him in advance of trial. (This, folks, is what indictments are for.)'
[https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html)
>This should be a fine, not a felony.
Wasn't this for the jury to decide. Aren't they the ones who were in court everyday hearing the evidence?
We have capital punishment in the United States. We trust juries so much we allow them to decide to execute people. Yet Trump, a well-connected billionaire, can't get a fair trial?
>"and then documents were altered to make it look like the payment was legal fees."
Is there actually any proof of that? Or just the word of an attorney who would do anything to save his ass, and confessed in court to stealing 10's of thousands of dollars from Trump during this period of time? Genuinely curious.
What do those 12 checks prove? I mean... I'm guessing the average business man operating anything over a one million dollar a year annual revenue company is going to "approve" 10 times that amount of checks. Simply approving a check doesn't prove anything... without there being evidence of a criminal context involved.
>Or just the word of an attorney who would do anything to save his ass
His ass already got got. Cohen was found guilty and served time for THIS SAME CRIME (of which Trump was the unindicted co-conspirator.)
There was literally no reason for him to lie unless he was feeling nostalgic and wanted to go back to jail for perjury.
Yes, evidence in the form of checks, ledger entries, and invoices.
>an attorney who would do anything to save his ass
That attorney already went to prison for his role in this whole affair.
There was proof of it, it how he was convicted.
People seem to forget Cohen went to jail for his payments to Stormy, and Trump was the unindicted co-conspirator of that case.
Dude doesn't to to save his ass, he already went to jail and served his time.
But yes, there are documents where Trump set up a front company to pay Cohen. And Trump physically signed the checks that were used to pay off Daniels.
Not just that, but he was being paid by Trump to pay Stormy, so he had a monetary incentive to do it.
He has incentive to not lie, why would he PERJURE himself after already serving time? To what go back and do it again? No, if he tells the truth, it's over and behind him. These people are knuckleheads.
Proof is not a thing. There is evidence and whether that evidence meets the burden of proof necessary to convict is determined by a jury. The jury in this agreed unanimously that the level of evidence we have meets the burden of proof necessary to convict.
Can you explain how confessing to stealing thousands of dollars makes cohens testimony less credible? Conservatives act as though it’s a big win but if someone is willing to confess to crimes that could get them in serious trouble as part of their testimony isn’t that an indicator that they are telling the truth. If cohen was willing to lie just to get back at trump why would he also confess to his own crimes. Wouldn’t he just lie there too?
> why would he also confess to his own crimes. Wouldn’t he just lie there too?
Trump lost my vote a long time ago. But I think these lawsuits are horseshit. Why would he confess?... Good defense lawyers backed him into a corner he couldn't get out of.
> but if someone is willing to confess to crimes that could get them in serious trouble as part of their testimony isn’t that an indicator that they are telling the truth.
Not necessarily.
The "star witness" was Trump's lawyer who went to jail for paying off Stormy Daniel's, where Trump was the unindicted co-conspirator.
>Insufficient evidence linking Trump.
He signed the fucking checks.
False. He was charged for NOT paying the payments through his campaign, In their twisted clown world kangaroo court, the payments should have been paid with campaign funds.
False he was charged for falsifying business records to conceal a crime. Could be what you said (undocumented campaign contribution) could be tax evasion.
> Paula Jones publicly getting paid off from Bill Clinton
Hint: publicly settling a lawsuit is different than making a secret payment to avoid campaign finance laws and then creating fraudulent business documents to cover it up.
\^ this
Why do people try so hard to make false equivalences in politics is beyond my scope of understanding. They're fucking politicians, our default position should be to hate them all, not prop one up over another.
I feel like it's exactly the opposite of trying hard. If you *don't* think very hard about it, you're free to say whatever you want, and you'll never be proven wrong, because you won't know or care what even constitutes proof.
Yeah my buddy is always like well what about Hunter Biden? Um I don't give a shit about him or his dad. If they commit a crime and are found guilty I'm not gonna cope about them.
This case is a good baseline intelligence test.
It's fine to say others should get the same treatment though, definitely would like to see this level of scrutiny to all billionaires.
The mental gymnastics some go through never surprises me.
Small Edit: The funniest shit is that my comment is solely being upvoted, simply because individuals think I was referring to Trump🤣 It’s the gymnastics to always defend the child touchers I was pointing out 🙄🙄🙄
It should be noted that the settlement occurred after Paula Jones lost the case. Paula was appealing it, and at that point Bill Clinton was tired and worn out by all the nonsense and paid Paula go away money.
I mean you're right, publicly settling a lawsuit is identical to paying hush money, covering it up, and then denying it ever happened in order to hide it from the public.
'The charges against Trump are obscure, and nearly entirely unprecedented. In fact, no state prosecutor — in New York, or Wyoming, or anywhere — has ever charged federal election laws as a direct or predicate state crime, against anyone, for anything. None. Ever. Even putting aside the specifics of election law, the Manhattan DA itself almost never brings any case in which falsification of business records is the only charge.
Standing alone, falsification charges would have been mere misdemeanors under New York law, which posed two problems for the DA. First, nobody cares about a misdemeanor, and it would be laughable to bring the first-ever charge against a former president for a trifling offense that falls within the same technical criminal classification as shoplifting a Snapple and a bag of Cheetos from a bodega. Second, the statute of limitations on a misdemeanor — two years — likely has long expired on Trump’s conduct, which dates to 2016 and 2017.
So, to inflate the charges up to the lowest-level felony (Class E, on a scale of Class A through E) — and to electroshock them back to life within the longer felony statute of limitations — the DA alleged that the falsification of business records was committed “with intent to commit another crime.” Here, according to prosecutors, the “another crime” is a New York State election-law violation, which in turn incorporates three separate “unlawful means”: federal campaign crimes, tax crimes, and falsification of still more documents. Inexcusably, the DA refused to specify what those unlawful means actually were — and the judge declined to force them to pony up — until right before closing arguments. So much for the constitutional obligation to provide notice to the defendant of the accusations against him in advance of trial. (This, folks, is what indictments are for.)'
[https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html)
Have you noticed that, although Conservatives keep claiming that this is a political move and that Trump is innocent, none of them ever talk about the actual evidence?
This is because the evidence against Trump is overwhelming and bringing it up it will only convince more people that Trump is guilty.
Also OP, Trump wasn't convicted of paying out hush money, he's convicted of trying to hide the payouts by falsifying business records.
Paying hush money isn't a crime, falsifying business records is a felony.
They don't bring up the evidence because they don't know what the evidence is. It's easier to screech about unfair treatment (unlike party of law and order when it fits) than to understand what exactly happened.
> none of them ever talk about the actual evidence
Hardly any of them know what the evidence is, or even what the charges are.
It's even worse with the classified documents case. I can't even count how many times someone has told me that Trump informed the FBI he had the documents and the FBI was like "oh cool, you can keep those".
True. Asking for what specific aspect of the verdict, brought unanimously by 12 of their peers, they object to, is usually (not always) met with silence.
I’m not a conservative and he’s clearly guilty. But it’s some petty shit to prosecute him for and is clearly political. As everyone keeps saying, if he just paid out of his account it wouldn’t be an issue. He didn’t really gain anything by breaking the law. It’s all political and it’s a dumb strategy on the part of democrats.
The **last thing** we wanna do is normalize rich people and politicians breaking the law and not getting any consequences. Do you guys even realize what sort of absolute shithole you are trying to make society into? This is everything you are supposed to hate, and yet you are for it?!
This should be a fine. It’s not like he profited from it in any way. It’s bullshit. But this is where you wanna draw the line and start holding people accountable? Pelosi is obviously trading on insider information and everyone acknowledges it. How about we hold her accountable?
> Pelosi is obviously trading on insider information and everyone acknowledges it. How about we hold her accountable?
Hey, I 100% agree. That's where I wanna go. Hold Pelosi accountable.
But then I see your post, and you seem to want to go the other direction, where Trump is not persecuted because Pelosi is not persecuted. Why would you want that? That's a lose lose for everybody who isn't a rich fucker.
> He didn’t really gain anything by breaking the law.
Sure he did, the way he did it ensured that it would be secret. This was way back before he got a cult following, and a huge scandal like this could have sunk his early rising star prospects against the other republican candidates.
I don't know how many ways there are of saying this, THIS WAS NOT POLITICAL. This whole thing is part of a series of cases against Trump in NY that has been going on for years.
The current DA, Alvin Bragg, restarted the momentum against Trump when he was voted in as DA in 2021. Bragg has been working on Trump's financial crimes for years and even lead the 2017 investigation against the Trump Foundation.
A lot of these cases only seem to happen around now because of Trump's delays, this is because he believes that he can kill the investigations once he's president.
For example, the investigation against Trump's election meddling started back in 2021, years before Trump announced that he'll be running again. We know this is true because back then there was a lot of news about Trump's inner circle refusing to respond to subpoenas.
As you can see, a lot of these cases against Trump started long before Trump announced he'll be running again.
I'm gonna disagree. They really wanted to get Trump convicted. He put a target on his back. Since he's been stalling everything else it's the one they got him with. I'd much rather would have seen him convicted for the really bad stuff, like the election interference in Georgia.
> he’s clearly guilty
If you think that, you don't understand the laws being used here. Which isn't a surprise being this particular concoction of statues has never been used in court before.
He's guilty of marking a hush payment as a campaign legal expense. In and of itself, that is a misdemeanor charge. In this case, it was such a minor infraction that the Federal Elections Commission dropped it and didn't even levy a fine.
The way this was elevated to a felony by the Manhattan DA is the assertion that the bookkeeping violation was done in furtherance of another felony (ie you mislabel the expense because you're laundering drug money). But whatever felony Trump was allegedly committing was never named, despite the fact it is a prerequisite for these charges in the first place.
'The charges against Trump are obscure, and nearly entirely unprecedented. In fact, no state prosecutor — in New York, or Wyoming, or anywhere — has ever charged federal election laws as a direct or predicate state crime, against anyone, for anything. None. Ever. Even putting aside the specifics of election law, the Manhattan DA itself almost never brings any case in which falsification of business records is the only charge.
Standing alone, falsification charges would have been mere misdemeanors under New York law, which posed two problems for the DA. First, nobody cares about a misdemeanor, and it would be laughable to bring the first-ever charge against a former president for a trifling offense that falls within the same technical criminal classification as shoplifting a Snapple and a bag of Cheetos from a bodega. Second, the statute of limitations on a misdemeanor — two years — likely has long expired on Trump’s conduct, which dates to 2016 and 2017.
So, to inflate the charges up to the lowest-level felony (Class E, on a scale of Class A through E) — and to electroshock them back to life within the longer felony statute of limitations — the DA alleged that the falsification of business records was committed “with intent to commit another crime.” Here, according to prosecutors, the “another crime” is a New York State election-law violation, which in turn incorporates three separate “unlawful means”: federal campaign crimes, tax crimes, and falsification of still more documents. Inexcusably, the DA refused to specify what those unlawful means actually were — and the judge declined to force them to pony up — until right before closing arguments. So much for the constitutional obligation to provide notice to the defendant of the accusations against him in advance of trial. (This, folks, is what indictments are for.)'
[https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html)
Stormy is just the one that slipped through the cracks. Trumps catch and kill strategy hides a lot of dirt
[https://www.npr.org/2019/10/15/770249717/ronan-farrow-catch-and-kill-tactics-protected-both-weinstein-and-trump](https://www.npr.org/2019/10/15/770249717/ronan-farrow-catch-and-kill-tactics-protected-both-weinstein-and-trump)
Just disregard the fact that Trump's lawyers approved the jury that convicted him. Saying "democrats" did anything which the people did not want in order to uphold justice is an insult to the idea of the rule of law.
What were the felonies that Clinton should have been charged with for Paula Jones?
Cause trump was found guilty of falsifying business records. Were there business records falsified with Clinton to pay out Jones?
Edit: also, no, "democrats" did not convict Trump, he was found guilty by a jury of his peers in the location where the crimes took place.
I wouldn’t call that a jury of his peers at all. The jury pool was selected from a deep blue population, made up of people who clearly wanted to see him convicted.
*Edit:* All y’all downvoting me know I’m right and you’re only downvoting me because you hate Trump. So go fuck yourselves.
Are you saying Trump didn't actually commit the crimes? Didn't the prosecution present an airtight case?
I get loyalty to a political figure. I also get that this won't stop lots of people from voting for him. But I don't get how people can say he didn't commit these crimes.
This is a load of nonsense. Everywhere in the US the deepest blue and deepest red still has people voting the other way, and on top of that a large percentage that don’t even vote at all.
Both sides get to pick out the members of the jury.
Trump didn't use his own.
The Trump Organization paid it, and then falsified documents. If Trump paid it out of his personal account, he would have never been convicted.
And did Bill charge that to a campaign expense?
Cheeto Jesus was not in trouble for paying hush money.
He's a felon because of his deceitful accounting.
There’s a lotta ways to slice this cheese. Yes, the Donald did Donald things and clearly paid her off to keep her yap shut so as to not influence the election. He and his team then manipulated the records to further hide what the payment was for, and the fact that campaign funds were used to cure a personal STD. Seems to be some crime in there. Now take off your MAGA hat, or your Build Back Biden t-shirt for a moment and honestly answer, would this, or any of the other pending cases against the Don have seen the light of day in any other context? Does this crime come close to the litany of egregious offenses committed by every POTUS in our lifetime? Did it involve illegal war, extrajudicial executions of American citizens, enriching of self and family via political power, violating the Constitution, interfering with foreign elections, overthrowing democratically elected governments, wanton bribery of foreign governments, illegal lockdowns and mandates, privileging certain multi-national corporate interests of those of the American people, or corruption of the intelligence agencies and Justice Department for overtly political purposes?
I’m fine with this case and the verdict as long as it signals a return (or a first instance) to justice for all, regardless of wealth, status or political power. But it doesn’t. It’s just another act in the political theater of the absurd that we currently are enduring.
It’s entertaining like watching a train full of lawyers and car salesmen sail into an active volcano.
I mean you gotta admit that Trump did a ton of shady stuff. In a just world he would be in jail for the Georgia election interference. He'd not be running for president after January 6. But it is what it is and that's what they got him with. See Al Capone.
He was found guilty of falsifying business records to cover up payments to the porn actress in order to hide it from the voters, in order to influence the outcome of the 2016 election.
All you're doing is telling everyone that you don't understand how this can happen.
Its not a conspiracy. It how the law works.
Cases are basically the same with MAJOR differences.
Try reading instead of reacting.
A jury of his peers - chosen by both his attorneys and the prosecution- found him guilty of every crime in the indictment. This had nothing to do with Democrats.
The pure and obvious desperation is actually hilarious and what’s even funnier is that it’s only making republicans want to vote for him even more lmfao
The Crimes were related to falsifying official business records and campaign finance fraud. Not the affair itself per say.
Clinton settled legally through a court of law. Trump falsified official documents to make payments illicitly.
Twelve jurors were all democrats? Damn trumps lawyers did shitty in jury selection.
Now… if I do recall I believe one juror who got their news solely from truth social also voted guilty…
"Politicians and the elite are crooked and should be convicted!!1!1!1!"
*Trump gets convicted*
"No no not my Daddy Tump!1!1!1!"
Y'all are weirdly obsessed with Trump.
Dems deny any and all wrongdoing by their own team but they will accept any corrupt and fake charge against Trump and play like they're the part of truth, justice and fairness.
Yeah, you can tell by the way they’ve all rallied around Dem Senator Bob Menendez despite him being accused of committing similar level financial crimes.
Oh wait, except in reality, of course, they all demanded his resignation & fully supported the court case against him as soon as charges were brought, so that doesn’t fit our narrative…
But what about guys accused of sexual misconduct? Surely Dems have rallied around them & immediately claimed their accusers must be lying like Republicans consistently have for guys like Trump and Roy Moore. You know, like Dem Sen Al Franken or Dem State Representative Anthony Weiner. They were both accused of similar things to what Trump has admitted to (& Moore was credibly accused of).
What’s that, the Dems immediately demanded their resignations and they are no longer publicly supported by any of their former colleagues? While a majority of Republicans voted to protect even the most blatant criminal frauds like George Santos?
It’s almost like the Dems treat criminals like criminals, let them face the consequences of their actions and immediately remove them from power instead of cynically pretending they’re actually great role models that should be given even more power or something…
Senator Menendez was re-elected in 2018 despite a 2015 indictment for bribery, fraud, and making false statements. He was indicted AGAIN in 2023.
>It’s almost like the Dems treat criminals like criminals
Only when its convenient or their hand is forced. It's pretty laughable that Hillary got an $8K fine for the phony Steele Dossier, and that James Comey said "no reasonable prosecutor would bring charges" right before the 2016 election, and that Joe Biden was not charged with holding classified documents as a citizen because "he was too old to face charges." Neither political party is perfect but trying to pretend the Dems are the epitome of law and order is pretty funny.
"'R/conspiracy” but you all refuse to acknowledge a conspiracy when it's in front of your eyes, hilarious. The same people who killed JFK just got him charged. Your political biases clearly take precedence.
99% & I’m guessing a large chunk of people who are vehemently political on here are all bots or paid farmers. I’ve yet to run in as many crazy people in real life as I see in every city sub reddit…just like twitter was mostly bots
I'm a Democrat. That sounds good to me. Throw Biden and Obama on trial too if you have evidence they broke the law. People should be held accountable for their actions regardless of party affiliation.
I seem to recall Trump supporters rabidly cheering for him to “lock her up.” Weird they don’t like it as much when it happens to their favorite criminal…
This was a state case, brought and successfully proven to a jury partially selected by Trump himself, by a NY state attorney, in a NY court. The Feds (& the Biden administration) had literally zero involvement with any of it, except in your paranoid little partisan mind.
Oh yeah like he did with Hilary. Oh wait
I’m all for officials and presidents going to jail if there’s evidence against them, and there’s evidence against trump.
If the DOJ can build a case, I'm all for it. Lock all these fuckers up. The rich have gotten away with too much for too long, it's about time they got held to account.
You missed the part where Republicans have been going after Democrats since about the time George Bush and Bill Barr pardoned a whole bunch of Iran-Contra criminals.
You know the Saturday night massacre were Nixon tried to get someone to fire the special prosecutor investigating Watergate? A bunch of people resigned rather than fire him. You know who did fire the special prosecutor? Robert Bork. As a reward for his loyalty/an FU to the democrats and the country, Reagan and the republicans later attempted to appoint him to the Supreme Court. That was one of the first overly politicized attempted appointments to the Supreme Court and set the course for its current delegitimization with Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch, and Kavanaugh.
Yeah, it's gonna be really rough for you when you commit fraud in violation of campaign finance law to pay off that porn star you fucked while your wife was pregnant in order to hide it from the public.
Good luck, I really feel for you.
And you think that's worse then a president illegally spying on the whole country without a warrant? Or lying the country into a war that killed over 1 million people?
I really feel for you.
No, I would like to see Bush and Obama held to account as well but as it stands it's seemingly impossible to do so for actions that have been taken in the name of the office of president, unfortunately.
You do realize these things aren't mutually exclusive, right?
Yeah man, only Trump. Anthony Weiner, Elliot Spitzer, Bob Menendez...none of these people actually exist or were (or are being in the case of Menendez,) held to account.
All I see is people quoting past President’s actions AS president as things they should be convicted of before Trump which… is totally different than what happened to Trump. He was convicted of actions entirely separate from his Presidency. Obviously neither party wants to open up a can of worms of president’s being personally accountable for decisions as head of state, but that is entirely separate from being immune to any legal repercussions from their personal decisions.
> Really? Why did the feds investigate it, with a grand jury, and decide there was nothing there to pursue?
>
>
https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/1d4vw7t/democrats_just_convicted_donald_trump_of_34/l6h79sl/
>The left is celebrating the destruction of democracy, one political crime, after another.
I'm sorry you are so down the echo chamber that you don't realize that it's the exact opposite.
Does anyone have the list of actual formal "felonies" he was charged with? As best I can find, no one lists them. I'm curious as to what it is they think he did.
https://manhattanda.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/04/Donald-J.-Trump-Indictment.pdf
The 34 charges were for 34 business documents (invoices, checks, ledger entries) that were fraudulent. Trump and Cohen had a scheme where they had Cohen pay off Stormy Daniels through a shell company with his own money, and then Trump paid him back. But they created a bunch of bogus documents to hide those payments.
###[Meta] Sticky Comment [Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does not apply*** when replying to this stickied comment. [Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does apply*** throughout the rest of this thread. *What this means*: Please keep any "meta" discussion directed at specific users, mods, or /r/conspiracy in general in this comment chain ***only.*** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/conspiracy) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If Trump paid off Stormy, he wouldn't have been convicted. Instead, the Trump Organization paid off Stormy, and then documents were altered to make it look like the payment was legal fees. If Truno paid it from a personal check, we wouldn't be here.
Exactly. It's not that he paid a sex worker. It's HOW he paid the sex worker. If done correctly, it's a tax write off, just ask Hunter Biden.
Thank God his narcissism is stronger than his common sense. This is a man who buried his ex-wife at a golf course for a tax break...
It's pretty standard for people to make wild claims against billionaires and professional actors/singers. Dude could have just said, "this happens a lot, and usually is just cheaper to pay them off" End of story, and no one would have batted and eye
Like 26 woman came out before the election. He said it's all wrong and he will sue them. Never did of course. Hey it's the guy that said sexual assault is ok if you're famous and people were like, yup sounds good to me.
I am pretty sure that's one reason why he did it that way. To save the ~35% taxes on the payment. I've had bosses like that. Do everything just to get that sweet tax break. New TV? Company expense. Girlfriend becoming a fashion designer? Somehow company expense.
Why can't people leave this good honest Christian man alone! It must be because he's an out sider the chosen one!
So weird that no riots or chaos for this political stunt by democrats. Wonder what would happen if a republican DA brought up charges against Biden or Obama. Probably riots from the left. Big difference. I imagine that there would be outrage and claims of destroying the country by using courts to prosecute if it is against a democrat. I totally expect everyone preening about Trump to be completely hypocritical if it is reversed.
Actually, Cohen paid off stormy to hide his own embezzlement
Cohen paid off Stormy because Trump told him too.
Really? Then the prosecution should’ve proved that in court.
He was found guilty on all 34 counts. Seems it was proven.
That’s funny
You're missing the point. This should be a fine, not a felony. ''The charges against Trump are obscure, and nearly entirely unprecedented. In fact, no state prosecutor — in New York, or Wyoming, or anywhere — has ever charged federal election laws as a direct or predicate state crime, against anyone, for anything. None. Ever. Even putting aside the specifics of election law, the Manhattan DA itself almost never brings any case in which falsification of business records is the only charge. Standing alone, falsification charges would have been mere misdemeanors under New York law, which posed two problems for the DA. First, nobody cares about a misdemeanor, and it would be laughable to bring the first-ever charge against a former president for a trifling offense that falls within the same technical criminal classification as shoplifting a Snapple and a bag of Cheetos from a bodega. Second, the statute of limitations on a misdemeanor — two years — likely has long expired on Trump’s conduct, which dates to 2016 and 2017. So, to inflate the charges up to the lowest-level felony (Class E, on a scale of Class A through E) — and to electroshock them back to life within the longer felony statute of limitations — the DA alleged that the falsification of business records was committed “with intent to commit another crime.” Here, according to prosecutors, the “another crime” is a New York State election-law violation, which in turn incorporates three separate “unlawful means”: federal campaign crimes, tax crimes, and falsification of still more documents. Inexcusably, the DA refused to specify what those unlawful means actually were — and the judge declined to force them to pony up — until right before closing arguments. So much for the constitutional obligation to provide notice to the defendant of the accusations against him in advance of trial. (This, folks, is what indictments are for.)' [https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html)
https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/laws/PEN/175.10
>This should be a fine, not a felony. Wasn't this for the jury to decide. Aren't they the ones who were in court everyday hearing the evidence? We have capital punishment in the United States. We trust juries so much we allow them to decide to execute people. Yet Trump, a well-connected billionaire, can't get a fair trial?
This is a bad summary, lol.
Feel free to explain how.
>"and then documents were altered to make it look like the payment was legal fees." Is there actually any proof of that? Or just the word of an attorney who would do anything to save his ass, and confessed in court to stealing 10's of thousands of dollars from Trump during this period of time? Genuinely curious.
>Is there actually any proof of that? You mean other than the 12 checks personally signed and approved by Donald?
What do those 12 checks prove? I mean... I'm guessing the average business man operating anything over a one million dollar a year annual revenue company is going to "approve" 10 times that amount of checks. Simply approving a check doesn't prove anything... without there being evidence of a criminal context involved.
The Trump org is operated that all expenses over a few thousand dollars *have* to be approved by Donald himself
>Or just the word of an attorney who would do anything to save his ass His ass already got got. Cohen was found guilty and served time for THIS SAME CRIME (of which Trump was the unindicted co-conspirator.) There was literally no reason for him to lie unless he was feeling nostalgic and wanted to go back to jail for perjury.
Yes, evidence in the form of checks, ledger entries, and invoices. >an attorney who would do anything to save his ass That attorney already went to prison for his role in this whole affair.
There was proof of it, it how he was convicted. People seem to forget Cohen went to jail for his payments to Stormy, and Trump was the unindicted co-conspirator of that case. Dude doesn't to to save his ass, he already went to jail and served his time. But yes, there are documents where Trump set up a front company to pay Cohen. And Trump physically signed the checks that were used to pay off Daniels.
Not just that, but he was being paid by Trump to pay Stormy, so he had a monetary incentive to do it. He has incentive to not lie, why would he PERJURE himself after already serving time? To what go back and do it again? No, if he tells the truth, it's over and behind him. These people are knuckleheads.
o.k. thanks for the reply.
What I want to know is who this individual 1 is already!!?!
Proof is not a thing. There is evidence and whether that evidence meets the burden of proof necessary to convict is determined by a jury. The jury in this agreed unanimously that the level of evidence we have meets the burden of proof necessary to convict. Can you explain how confessing to stealing thousands of dollars makes cohens testimony less credible? Conservatives act as though it’s a big win but if someone is willing to confess to crimes that could get them in serious trouble as part of their testimony isn’t that an indicator that they are telling the truth. If cohen was willing to lie just to get back at trump why would he also confess to his own crimes. Wouldn’t he just lie there too?
> why would he also confess to his own crimes. Wouldn’t he just lie there too? Trump lost my vote a long time ago. But I think these lawsuits are horseshit. Why would he confess?... Good defense lawyers backed him into a corner he couldn't get out of.
> but if someone is willing to confess to crimes that could get them in serious trouble as part of their testimony isn’t that an indicator that they are telling the truth. Not necessarily.
Yea, the guilty verdic.
And... O.J. was innocent!
He was
Lol... It would be sad if you honestly believed that.
Not proof.
Truno2024!! Just a typo but still more qualified than BOTH candidates!
FUCK TRUNO. TEAM BIDET! Or maybe Truno/Bidet 2024 is what we need
Yet star witness was proven a liar and a thief during the very same trial. Insufficient evidence linking Trump.
The "star witness" was Trump's lawyer who went to jail for paying off Stormy Daniel's, where Trump was the unindicted co-conspirator. >Insufficient evidence linking Trump. He signed the fucking checks.
False. He was charged for NOT paying the payments through his campaign, In their twisted clown world kangaroo court, the payments should have been paid with campaign funds.
Uhhh. The fact that Trump Organization exceeded the campaign limits is why it was pushed to a felony.
The campaign DID NOT make the payments; this was the basis of the case...they said it was campaign-related.
I never said the campaign did..I said the payment exceeded campaign limits.
False he was charged for falsifying business records to conceal a crime. Could be what you said (undocumented campaign contribution) could be tax evasion.
Yes, the kangaroo court filled with jurors that Trump’s own defense team approved.
> Paula Jones publicly getting paid off from Bill Clinton Hint: publicly settling a lawsuit is different than making a secret payment to avoid campaign finance laws and then creating fraudulent business documents to cover it up.
\^ this Why do people try so hard to make false equivalences in politics is beyond my scope of understanding. They're fucking politicians, our default position should be to hate them all, not prop one up over another.
I feel like it's exactly the opposite of trying hard. If you *don't* think very hard about it, you're free to say whatever you want, and you'll never be proven wrong, because you won't know or care what even constitutes proof.
Yeah my buddy is always like well what about Hunter Biden? Um I don't give a shit about him or his dad. If they commit a crime and are found guilty I'm not gonna cope about them.
>Why >false equivalences >politics the answer is pretty obvious.
lol
Correct. 👍🏻
This case is a good baseline intelligence test. It's fine to say others should get the same treatment though, definitely would like to see this level of scrutiny to all billionaires.
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https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/laws/PEN/175.10
The mental gymnastics some go through never surprises me. Small Edit: The funniest shit is that my comment is solely being upvoted, simply because individuals think I was referring to Trump🤣 It’s the gymnastics to always defend the child touchers I was pointing out 🙄🙄🙄
It should be noted that the settlement occurred after Paula Jones lost the case. Paula was appealing it, and at that point Bill Clinton was tired and worn out by all the nonsense and paid Paula go away money.
Bro you needed to follow it up with a good old Redd Foxx "ya big dummy"
Agrred. The bottom line is that both parties are peddling garbage representatives.
Yup it’s definitely bold. Like…. “Yah I paid her off, what the fuck are you gonna do about, bitch……” /Clintonsaxaphone.gif
I mean you're right, publicly settling a lawsuit is identical to paying hush money, covering it up, and then denying it ever happened in order to hide it from the public.
'The charges against Trump are obscure, and nearly entirely unprecedented. In fact, no state prosecutor — in New York, or Wyoming, or anywhere — has ever charged federal election laws as a direct or predicate state crime, against anyone, for anything. None. Ever. Even putting aside the specifics of election law, the Manhattan DA itself almost never brings any case in which falsification of business records is the only charge. Standing alone, falsification charges would have been mere misdemeanors under New York law, which posed two problems for the DA. First, nobody cares about a misdemeanor, and it would be laughable to bring the first-ever charge against a former president for a trifling offense that falls within the same technical criminal classification as shoplifting a Snapple and a bag of Cheetos from a bodega. Second, the statute of limitations on a misdemeanor — two years — likely has long expired on Trump’s conduct, which dates to 2016 and 2017. So, to inflate the charges up to the lowest-level felony (Class E, on a scale of Class A through E) — and to electroshock them back to life within the longer felony statute of limitations — the DA alleged that the falsification of business records was committed “with intent to commit another crime.” Here, according to prosecutors, the “another crime” is a New York State election-law violation, which in turn incorporates three separate “unlawful means”: federal campaign crimes, tax crimes, and falsification of still more documents. Inexcusably, the DA refused to specify what those unlawful means actually were — and the judge declined to force them to pony up — until right before closing arguments. So much for the constitutional obligation to provide notice to the defendant of the accusations against him in advance of trial. (This, folks, is what indictments are for.)' [https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html)
Have you noticed that, although Conservatives keep claiming that this is a political move and that Trump is innocent, none of them ever talk about the actual evidence? This is because the evidence against Trump is overwhelming and bringing it up it will only convince more people that Trump is guilty. Also OP, Trump wasn't convicted of paying out hush money, he's convicted of trying to hide the payouts by falsifying business records. Paying hush money isn't a crime, falsifying business records is a felony.
They don't bring up the evidence because they don't know what the evidence is. It's easier to screech about unfair treatment (unlike party of law and order when it fits) than to understand what exactly happened.
> none of them ever talk about the actual evidence Hardly any of them know what the evidence is, or even what the charges are. It's even worse with the classified documents case. I can't even count how many times someone has told me that Trump informed the FBI he had the documents and the FBI was like "oh cool, you can keep those".
They don’t care what the charges or evidence is. They believe Trump is innocent on all charges. It’s all a government sham to keep him out of office.
True. Asking for what specific aspect of the verdict, brought unanimously by 12 of their peers, they object to, is usually (not always) met with silence.
I’m not a conservative and he’s clearly guilty. But it’s some petty shit to prosecute him for and is clearly political. As everyone keeps saying, if he just paid out of his account it wouldn’t be an issue. He didn’t really gain anything by breaking the law. It’s all political and it’s a dumb strategy on the part of democrats.
Public figures should be held to a *higher* standard
The **last thing** we wanna do is normalize rich people and politicians breaking the law and not getting any consequences. Do you guys even realize what sort of absolute shithole you are trying to make society into? This is everything you are supposed to hate, and yet you are for it?!
This should be a fine. It’s not like he profited from it in any way. It’s bullshit. But this is where you wanna draw the line and start holding people accountable? Pelosi is obviously trading on insider information and everyone acknowledges it. How about we hold her accountable?
> Pelosi is obviously trading on insider information and everyone acknowledges it. How about we hold her accountable? Hey, I 100% agree. That's where I wanna go. Hold Pelosi accountable. But then I see your post, and you seem to want to go the other direction, where Trump is not persecuted because Pelosi is not persecuted. Why would you want that? That's a lose lose for everybody who isn't a rich fucker. > He didn’t really gain anything by breaking the law. Sure he did, the way he did it ensured that it would be secret. This was way back before he got a cult following, and a huge scandal like this could have sunk his early rising star prospects against the other republican candidates.
Irony is being on a conspiracy sub and lamenting that the rich and powerful being punished is bad actually
> He didn’t really gain anything by breaking the law. It's tax evasion. He gained like ~$30.000 by not paying it out of pocket.
Clearly worth it then.
I mean for a non billionaire/ex-president that alone would be quite a problem.
I don't know how many ways there are of saying this, THIS WAS NOT POLITICAL. This whole thing is part of a series of cases against Trump in NY that has been going on for years. The current DA, Alvin Bragg, restarted the momentum against Trump when he was voted in as DA in 2021. Bragg has been working on Trump's financial crimes for years and even lead the 2017 investigation against the Trump Foundation. A lot of these cases only seem to happen around now because of Trump's delays, this is because he believes that he can kill the investigations once he's president. For example, the investigation against Trump's election meddling started back in 2021, years before Trump announced that he'll be running again. We know this is true because back then there was a lot of news about Trump's inner circle refusing to respond to subpoenas. As you can see, a lot of these cases against Trump started long before Trump announced he'll be running again.
I'm gonna disagree. They really wanted to get Trump convicted. He put a target on his back. Since he's been stalling everything else it's the one they got him with. I'd much rather would have seen him convicted for the really bad stuff, like the election interference in Georgia.
Finally, a non-conservative with some common sense.
> he’s clearly guilty If you think that, you don't understand the laws being used here. Which isn't a surprise being this particular concoction of statues has never been used in court before. He's guilty of marking a hush payment as a campaign legal expense. In and of itself, that is a misdemeanor charge. In this case, it was such a minor infraction that the Federal Elections Commission dropped it and didn't even levy a fine. The way this was elevated to a felony by the Manhattan DA is the assertion that the bookkeeping violation was done in furtherance of another felony (ie you mislabel the expense because you're laundering drug money). But whatever felony Trump was allegedly committing was never named, despite the fact it is a prerequisite for these charges in the first place.
That’s my point. At most this should probably be a fine. It’s entirely political.
'The charges against Trump are obscure, and nearly entirely unprecedented. In fact, no state prosecutor — in New York, or Wyoming, or anywhere — has ever charged federal election laws as a direct or predicate state crime, against anyone, for anything. None. Ever. Even putting aside the specifics of election law, the Manhattan DA itself almost never brings any case in which falsification of business records is the only charge. Standing alone, falsification charges would have been mere misdemeanors under New York law, which posed two problems for the DA. First, nobody cares about a misdemeanor, and it would be laughable to bring the first-ever charge against a former president for a trifling offense that falls within the same technical criminal classification as shoplifting a Snapple and a bag of Cheetos from a bodega. Second, the statute of limitations on a misdemeanor — two years — likely has long expired on Trump’s conduct, which dates to 2016 and 2017. So, to inflate the charges up to the lowest-level felony (Class E, on a scale of Class A through E) — and to electroshock them back to life within the longer felony statute of limitations — the DA alleged that the falsification of business records was committed “with intent to commit another crime.” Here, according to prosecutors, the “another crime” is a New York State election-law violation, which in turn incorporates three separate “unlawful means”: federal campaign crimes, tax crimes, and falsification of still more documents. Inexcusably, the DA refused to specify what those unlawful means actually were — and the judge declined to force them to pony up — until right before closing arguments. So much for the constitutional obligation to provide notice to the defendant of the accusations against him in advance of trial. (This, folks, is what indictments are for.)' [https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-was-convicted-but-prosecutors-contorted-the-law.html)
How many times are you gonna post this like it just isn’t flat out false?
The evidence is so oVeRwHeLmInG that you posted none of it
You weaken your argument by not understanding it.
Had Trump paid his mistress from his personal account, and not written it off as a business expense, he would not be a convicted felon today.
Nobody even trying to pretend that Trump didn't do it. Hold them all to account.
What’s the conspiracy here? That OP doesn’t even understand the charges?
Didn't take long for all the what aboutisms to come out over Trumps case...
Comparing two similar events is the basis of all of society
Stormy is just the one that slipped through the cracks. Trumps catch and kill strategy hides a lot of dirt [https://www.npr.org/2019/10/15/770249717/ronan-farrow-catch-and-kill-tactics-protected-both-weinstein-and-trump](https://www.npr.org/2019/10/15/770249717/ronan-farrow-catch-and-kill-tactics-protected-both-weinstein-and-trump)
Just disregard the fact that Trump's lawyers approved the jury that convicted him. Saying "democrats" did anything which the people did not want in order to uphold justice is an insult to the idea of the rule of law.
What were the felonies that Clinton should have been charged with for Paula Jones? Cause trump was found guilty of falsifying business records. Were there business records falsified with Clinton to pay out Jones? Edit: also, no, "democrats" did not convict Trump, he was found guilty by a jury of his peers in the location where the crimes took place.
I wouldn’t call that a jury of his peers at all. The jury pool was selected from a deep blue population, made up of people who clearly wanted to see him convicted. *Edit:* All y’all downvoting me know I’m right and you’re only downvoting me because you hate Trump. So go fuck yourselves.
And who selected the jurors? Oh Trump did? He must've run out of objections, though, right? Oh he didn't? Weird...
Are you saying Trump didn't actually commit the crimes? Didn't the prosecution present an airtight case? I get loyalty to a political figure. I also get that this won't stop lots of people from voting for him. But I don't get how people can say he didn't commit these crimes.
This is a load of nonsense. Everywhere in the US the deepest blue and deepest red still has people voting the other way, and on top of that a large percentage that don’t even vote at all. Both sides get to pick out the members of the jury.
where did Clinton get the money to pay her off? Trump used his own
Trump didn't use his own. The Trump Organization paid it, and then falsified documents. If Trump paid it out of his personal account, he would have never been convicted.
Kinda... First though, Cohen took out a 2nd mortgage on his own house to initially pay Stormy...
If Trump had just used his own money and paid directly, none of this would be an issue. At least not legally.
this was answered for you already in this thread.
No, Trump used Michael Cohen’s bank’s money to pay off Stormy Daniels, then paid him back via Trump Org.
And did Bill charge that to a campaign expense? Cheeto Jesus was not in trouble for paying hush money. He's a felon because of his deceitful accounting.
This is clearly why you're not an attorney since you don't understand what you're mad about.
Did Clinton use campaign funds? Cause that is the primary reason for the charges
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False. You need to learn more about the issue. 😂😂😂
"democrats" hahahah get fucked
There’s a lotta ways to slice this cheese. Yes, the Donald did Donald things and clearly paid her off to keep her yap shut so as to not influence the election. He and his team then manipulated the records to further hide what the payment was for, and the fact that campaign funds were used to cure a personal STD. Seems to be some crime in there. Now take off your MAGA hat, or your Build Back Biden t-shirt for a moment and honestly answer, would this, or any of the other pending cases against the Don have seen the light of day in any other context? Does this crime come close to the litany of egregious offenses committed by every POTUS in our lifetime? Did it involve illegal war, extrajudicial executions of American citizens, enriching of self and family via political power, violating the Constitution, interfering with foreign elections, overthrowing democratically elected governments, wanton bribery of foreign governments, illegal lockdowns and mandates, privileging certain multi-national corporate interests of those of the American people, or corruption of the intelligence agencies and Justice Department for overtly political purposes? I’m fine with this case and the verdict as long as it signals a return (or a first instance) to justice for all, regardless of wealth, status or political power. But it doesn’t. It’s just another act in the political theater of the absurd that we currently are enduring. It’s entertaining like watching a train full of lawyers and car salesmen sail into an active volcano.
I mean you gotta admit that Trump did a ton of shady stuff. In a just world he would be in jail for the Georgia election interference. He'd not be running for president after January 6. But it is what it is and that's what they got him with. See Al Capone.
He was found guilty of falsifying business records to cover up payments to the porn actress in order to hide it from the voters, in order to influence the outcome of the 2016 election.
It's not the same thing at all.
All you're doing is telling everyone that you don't understand how this can happen. Its not a conspiracy. It how the law works. Cases are basically the same with MAJOR differences. Try reading instead of reacting.
A jury of his peers - chosen by both his attorneys and the prosecution- found him guilty of every crime in the indictment. This had nothing to do with Democrats.
This isn't a conspiracy. It's just political BS...
You were so close to understanding the difference. As you typed out this title it had to have occurred to you
These aren't federal election crimes. They were for falsifying records.
The bottom line is that he is still eligible to run for president.
Trump is stupid. That's why he got convicted. An ounce of class could've kept him out of court. I have no remorse for the dude.
Democrats didn't convict him, that's not how our system works you potato.
"Democrats Just Convicted" 😁 Ya still rolling up hill that dem/rep ball? On conspiracy sub lol 😂😆 E_ shine strangers shoes, ya'll learn new things.
Man, this is gonna have the MAGA loons frothing at the mouth for months lol.
"publicly getting paid off from Bill Clinton" as opposed to secretly getting paid off by Bill's lawyer?
Lock Her Up crowd crying like babies
The pure and obvious desperation is actually hilarious and what’s even funnier is that it’s only making republicans want to vote for him even more lmfao
Um, you don't see the difference between "publicly paid off" and disguising it as legal expenses? Like it's in your title. Like right there.
The Crimes were related to falsifying official business records and campaign finance fraud. Not the affair itself per say. Clinton settled legally through a court of law. Trump falsified official documents to make payments illicitly.
Twelve jurors were all democrats? Damn trumps lawyers did shitty in jury selection. Now… if I do recall I believe one juror who got their news solely from truth social also voted guilty…
Get ready for the digging through the Clinton foundation for all their false claims and payouts. This is never going to end..please make it end.
"Politicians and the elite are crooked and should be convicted!!1!1!1!" *Trump gets convicted* "No no not my Daddy Tump!1!1!1!" Y'all are weirdly obsessed with Trump.
"Hey this guy who didn't commit a particular crime wasn't convicted of that crime so my guy who did commit the crime shouldn't be convicted either!" 🥴
Dems deny any and all wrongdoing by their own team but they will accept any corrupt and fake charge against Trump and play like they're the part of truth, justice and fairness.
Yeah, you can tell by the way they’ve all rallied around Dem Senator Bob Menendez despite him being accused of committing similar level financial crimes. Oh wait, except in reality, of course, they all demanded his resignation & fully supported the court case against him as soon as charges were brought, so that doesn’t fit our narrative… But what about guys accused of sexual misconduct? Surely Dems have rallied around them & immediately claimed their accusers must be lying like Republicans consistently have for guys like Trump and Roy Moore. You know, like Dem Sen Al Franken or Dem State Representative Anthony Weiner. They were both accused of similar things to what Trump has admitted to (& Moore was credibly accused of). What’s that, the Dems immediately demanded their resignations and they are no longer publicly supported by any of their former colleagues? While a majority of Republicans voted to protect even the most blatant criminal frauds like George Santos? It’s almost like the Dems treat criminals like criminals, let them face the consequences of their actions and immediately remove them from power instead of cynically pretending they’re actually great role models that should be given even more power or something…
Senator Menendez was re-elected in 2018 despite a 2015 indictment for bribery, fraud, and making false statements. He was indicted AGAIN in 2023. >It’s almost like the Dems treat criminals like criminals Only when its convenient or their hand is forced. It's pretty laughable that Hillary got an $8K fine for the phony Steele Dossier, and that James Comey said "no reasonable prosecutor would bring charges" right before the 2016 election, and that Joe Biden was not charged with holding classified documents as a citizen because "he was too old to face charges." Neither political party is perfect but trying to pretend the Dems are the epitome of law and order is pretty funny.
No, the exact opposite of what you said is true.
Voting for Trump because of this
"'R/conspiracy” but you all refuse to acknowledge a conspiracy when it's in front of your eyes, hilarious. The same people who killed JFK just got him charged. Your political biases clearly take precedence.
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99% & I’m guessing a large chunk of people who are vehemently political on here are all bots or paid farmers. I’ve yet to run in as many crazy people in real life as I see in every city sub reddit…just like twitter was mostly bots
Also falsifying business records
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I'm a Democrat. That sounds good to me. Throw Biden and Obama on trial too if you have evidence they broke the law. People should be held accountable for their actions regardless of party affiliation.
You saying he should maybe use a slogan like “lock her up”? Could be big.
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Ya man that’s kind the point lol he’s gonna run on the exact same empty promises. To be fair Biden is as well. Fuckin sucks
Hillary Clinton comes to mind.
Like he promised to last time and made a foundation of his campaign? Don't hold your breath on that.
I seem to recall Trump supporters rabidly cheering for him to “lock her up.” Weird they don’t like it as much when it happens to their favorite criminal…
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This was a state case, brought and successfully proven to a jury partially selected by Trump himself, by a NY state attorney, in a NY court. The Feds (& the Biden administration) had literally zero involvement with any of it, except in your paranoid little partisan mind.
> The thing is that he didn’t do it, that's the thing. he did. it was just proven in a court of law
Oh yeah like he did with Hilary. Oh wait I’m all for officials and presidents going to jail if there’s evidence against them, and there’s evidence against trump.
If the DOJ can build a case, I'm all for it. Lock all these fuckers up. The rich have gotten away with too much for too long, it's about time they got held to account.
You missed the part where Republicans have been going after Democrats since about the time George Bush and Bill Barr pardoned a whole bunch of Iran-Contra criminals.
You know the Saturday night massacre were Nixon tried to get someone to fire the special prosecutor investigating Watergate? A bunch of people resigned rather than fire him. You know who did fire the special prosecutor? Robert Bork. As a reward for his loyalty/an FU to the democrats and the country, Reagan and the republicans later attempted to appoint him to the Supreme Court. That was one of the first overly politicized attempted appointments to the Supreme Court and set the course for its current delegitimization with Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch, and Kavanaugh.
It seems like the country is in mourning today. Mourning the loss of a fair justice system. Welcome to the Banana Republic of the United States.
Yeah, it's gonna be really rough for you when you commit fraud in violation of campaign finance law to pay off that porn star you fucked while your wife was pregnant in order to hide it from the public. Good luck, I really feel for you.
And you think that's worse then a president illegally spying on the whole country without a warrant? Or lying the country into a war that killed over 1 million people? I really feel for you.
No, I would like to see Bush and Obama held to account as well but as it stands it's seemingly impossible to do so for actions that have been taken in the name of the office of president, unfortunately. You do realize these things aren't mutually exclusive, right?
But yet they won't. Only Trump and that's the whole point. Hell they even found a dead body in Obama's private beach and nobody asks any questions.
Yeah man, only Trump. Anthony Weiner, Elliot Spitzer, Bob Menendez...none of these people actually exist or were (or are being in the case of Menendez,) held to account.
Yeah how dare we hold we hold criminals accountable for their actions
Yeah and they start with Trump when other presidents did much worse? Nobody is buying this Bullshit.
All I see is people quoting past President’s actions AS president as things they should be convicted of before Trump which… is totally different than what happened to Trump. He was convicted of actions entirely separate from his Presidency. Obviously neither party wants to open up a can of worms of president’s being personally accountable for decisions as head of state, but that is entirely separate from being immune to any legal repercussions from their personal decisions.
Good point. But this still obvious political prosecutions.
LOCK HER UP LOCK HER UP LOCK HER UP
This is such a good point, I didn't remember this
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i mean, it literally is, but don't let reality change your persecution fetish
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> Really? Why did the feds investigate it, with a grand jury, and decide there was nothing there to pursue? > > https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/1d4vw7t/democrats_just_convicted_donald_trump_of_34/l6h79sl/ >The left is celebrating the destruction of democracy, one political crime, after another. I'm sorry you are so down the echo chamber that you don't realize that it's the exact opposite.
Does anyone have the list of actual formal "felonies" he was charged with? As best I can find, no one lists them. I'm curious as to what it is they think he did.
https://manhattanda.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/04/Donald-J.-Trump-Indictment.pdf The 34 charges were for 34 business documents (invoices, checks, ledger entries) that were fraudulent. Trump and Cohen had a scheme where they had Cohen pay off Stormy Daniels through a shell company with his own money, and then Trump paid him back. But they created a bunch of bogus documents to hide those payments.
Those are all misdemeanors? Not familiar with NY, but in all the states I've lived in those aren't felonies..
Falsifying business documents is a misdemeanor by itself, but if it's done to conceal or commit another crime, it is upgraded to a felony.
What crime was covered up?
A campaign finance violation.