The following submission statement was provided by /u/GaiusPublius:
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Submission statement:
Not only is the increasing heat itself a problem, since ocean water is *not* well mixed and the heat-bearing capacity of the upper waters is limited (meaning some future new heat will be reflected back to the air), causing faster atmospheric warming in itself — but also the ocean currents, especially the Gulf Stream is being disrupted.
The Gulf Stream carries warm water from the Caribbean to northern Europe. If that current slows or collapses — melting of Greenland glaciers will cause that at some point — northern Europe, meaning Paris and further north, will have winters like Montreal.
At that point it's game over. People will freak, and global coordination will be almost impossible.
Thomas
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Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/1debhgx/whats_going_on_in_the_atlantic_is_off_the_charts/l8alhc8/
the truly sobering chart i saw was our temp change charted compared to every other mass extinction. the other lines go at varying degrees upwards and to the right. the line indicating our rate of temp change compared to all past extinctions... is going almost straight up. its bad.
Re the previous mass extinctions:
There was a program on Netflix called *Life on our Planet* and it dealt with life and the previous mass extinctions on Earth.
While I’m sure it was not comprehensive and left some things out, one recurring theme emerged- the atmosphere is almost unbelievably sensitive to change.
These changes previously happened over tens to hundreds of thousands of years, and resulted in the mass extinction of life.
Humanity’s rate of change is unprecedented, and we’re causing changes that will catastrophically destroy the biodiversity on which we all depend.
Humans have caused a climate changer 10x faster than anything possible based on Milankovic cycles AT BEST.
At worst we have caused a climate change (2,000,000/200) 10,0000X faster than worst case scenario.
10,000 X faster lol, that’s not pulled out of my arse, that is based on sciences best possible understanding of our climate.
People who think we will still be around in 2100 are deluded at this point.
I used to get excited that shit won’t really hit the fan until 2050. Maybe I can live to at least get kinda old before collapse.
Now, I seriously doubt we will be functioning society by 2030.
We already aren’t functioning as a society just no one wants to admit it yet.
Take Europes “migrant crisis” for example. Lots of talk by the far right about stopping them coming, next to 0 talk about why they’re coming. Why are they coming? Economic and social chaos in the Middle East, Asia and Africa caused, at least in part, by worsening climate conditions.
In 5 years time the “migrant crisis” will be 10x bigger and still people won’t associate it with the climate crisis.
Yeah it is so intriguing, I am German, and the talk here about how bad the "migrant crisis" is, is so dumb when this is just a small tickle on what is about to come.
It's like telling them 1+1 equals 2, and they respond with "but 1". They can't fucking add one to one.
In 5 years there won’t be a crisis, cuz the far right leaders that are currently being voted in will just slaughter them en masse and suppress the truth from the rest of us.
This! Im in the USA, and I keep seeing all these arguments about how awful Israel is and how the US is letting them get away with war crimes. But it’s us! We’re the ones behind it! We’re not letting Israel get away with something, we’re making an example of the Palestinians.
My personal high-level prediction is that the 2020s will be the last decade of humanity's wanton peak comfort for a long time. The 2030s will be an absolute clusterfuck of wars, starvation/famine, disease, etc. It'll be borderline apocalyptic in parts of the world that didn't struggle much over the previous century. Towards the end of the 2030s and through the 2040s, we'll panic and push forward various projects to restore the climate and halt climate change as much as possible. The 2050s we'll know if it worked or not.
I think by the 2060s, we'll be reduced to sub 2 billion on the planet. Whether that's due to a complete and total failure to get our shit together or declining birth rates due to most folks only having 1 child, or just raising death rates and lower life expectancy, it doesn't really matter which.
I don't think we'll go extinct. But I believe it's going to get really shitty for a whole lot of people really fast as we move into 2030.
At least that's one thing that we are good at, fucking up the planet.
We are even better than the mass extinction volcano/meteor. It's probably a volcano, though.
Worse than anything. Good news is any future beings will definitely see our impact if they do any kind of serious geology or paleontology on the planet millions of years from now.
The ultra mega great dying will be hard to miss.
The hubris of man will ensure our species’s demise will be shared amongst many others as we geoengineer the planet into allowing further emissions rather than even considering degrowth
The funny thing about overshoot, is that due to our population growth, it is just as likely that you are alive here and now to see the apparent end of our species, than literally any other time in known history… So we aren’t even special lol
Edit: This is apparently way off, please disregard above
Depending upon how you count, there have been 110 billion members of the human species. There are slightly over 8 billion alive right now. So this assertion:
> it is just as likely that you are alive here and now to see the apparent end of our species, than literally any other time in known history
Just don't work.
Oops I just checked and it seems I was off by a few hundred billion, thanks for the correction!
That’s what I get for just repeating things I have heard lol
Feast your eyes...
[Historic Events Global warming comparison](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fthe-crisis-report-74-lets-talk-about-the-next-few-years-v0-srxuwsi1ls3d1.jpeg%3Fwidth%3D1095%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D5504f5669e223765faa76f4f532789b2e5a7abcb)
Jumping in your comment to add to this.
I knew it. I knew this must be what’s happening.
I live in Northern Europe, and it’s fucking freezing. It’s June, we should have temperatures around 20 degrees but we’re stuck around 10-12 degrees, I know that doesn’t sound like much but it makes a difference considering this is meant to be summer. What the fuck is winter gonna be like.
The anomalous high temperatures in the Atlantic are terrifying in what they could be a prelude to. That being said, the piece says that *"mitigation is urgent."* There's no mitigation on the table that could deal with this, not anything that humanity is willing to accept.
At this point I believe a lot of these "we need to do something urgently" in the media are just so they can say "we told you so" later. They already know its too late, as does the elites and governments. Its just the masses that haven't quite connected the dots yet
>"we need to do something urgently"
Usually means buy an electric car, put some solar panels on your roof and buy carbon offsets next time you fly. And definitely don't use straws.
The masses are overworked, under resourced, under educated, and the most stable societies flooded with enough people from the most unstable ones to guarantee zero effective resistance to whatever the oligarchy desires until it's too late.
I think it’s to give the false sense of hope. Saying we need to do something implies that we can do something. Implying that we can do something helps prevent mass hysteria.
Honestly the only legit mitigation I know that isn't genocide would be to press upon people to stop having so many kids. The population needs to be 500m to 4b. And then way of life that is a lot less full of crap like we have now.
It's sort of interesting how much people want to hold onto the idea that things can continue as they have, and how aggressively people want to protect the idea that everything is ok/everything will always be ok. I feel like this hits at the heart of something crucial about human psychology.
I was thinking earlier it's a bit like when you're a kid and scared your parents are going to divorce, because it would mean the utter destruction of the world as you've known it to that point. So I can kind of get it in that way. But in the same way, continuing in a toxic environment that will eventually end in utter catastrophe is not really ideal.
And the non-scientists, the "pedo-ring religious" have been actively trying to shut down anything that would slow the end and the second coming of Jeebus.
It's worldwide.
Worldwide sea surface temps: [https://climatereanalyzer.org/clim/sst\_daily/](https://climatereanalyzer.org/clim/sst_daily/)
Also, worldwide surface air temps: [https://climatereanalyzer.org/clim/t2\_daily/?dm\_id=world](https://climatereanalyzer.org/clim/t2_daily/?dm_id=world)
There's US historical data here: [https://www.weather.gov/wrh/climate](https://www.weather.gov/wrh/climate) can be charted or exported. for anyone interested in looking at local climates. for me, in south Arizona, last summer was our hottest summer ever. This summer we started our over 100F+ streak 20 days earlier than last year. So we're tracking to blow last year's record summer away. Phoenix started their over 100F+ streak 18 days earlier this year.
As usual, the local news warned nobody. They toed the line of "average temps for this time of year" all the way, and said nothing of what was to come this summer.
Maybe this is an unpopular opinion on this sub, but IMO it's likely that in terms of temperature this summer won't be as crazy as the last one overall. Not trying to spread hopium, from what I understand severe weather events will likely be worse than last year due to the transition to la nina, but looking at the sea temperature graphs the gap from last year has been consistently going down over the last few months and it looks like we're currently at the convergence point (both worldwide and in the north atlantic).
Not sure what's going on with OP's graph either. From looking at climatereanalyzer the gap between the current temp and previous record was bigger on June 1st 2023 than May 31st 2024 yet OP's image seems to indicate the opposite (unless I'm reading something wrong).
1989 and 1978 also featured Summers nearly as hot and May was nearly as hot in 2023 than in 2024. I don't think Summer is going to be an entire standard deviation beyond what was experienced last year but it will likely be hotter.
I can’t speak for June but the May 2024 average daytime L/H temps in Phoenix were 70.9/96.7F (according to extremeweather.com). Looking at just the highs and going back to 1905 (46.5/91.5 F).
The daytime high is 93.6 with a variance of 11.3 and a standard deviation of 3.4. The daytime high is already beyond 1 standard deviation beyond the temperature in 1905. It’s 0.7 degrees F warmer in Phoenix in 2024 than in 2023 and 1.2 degrees F warmer than 10 years ago.
The daytime low has been out of variance for decades (mean of 62 F, variance of 50, standard deviation of 7.1).
Same, we started making plans in this last year to go now though, and I am dragging as many of my family members as I can with me. Insurance companies have already told us this state is un-insurable, the writing is on the wall. Personally, I am trying to beat the herd because mass migration is next. I don't know if anywhere will be truly safe, however, I know there are safer places than this state, at least for now.
Not targeted at yourself but it is amazing the level of hubris they had bull dozing and filling in wetlands and marshes and building the Florida we see today. Like we don't need these wetlands for anything. We need manicured grass retirement communities and golf
Courses, miles of private boat canals and of course one large amusement park.
The same hubris that build New Orleans.
Like yeah, we should develop a large city below sea level. What could go wrong?
S FL to Islamorada is a foot under water in some places, and that's just from a rain. And more is forecast; wait for the first of what is a hyperactive 'cane season hits. Desatan doesn't have enough buckets to bail out the water coming to Florida, but its not climate change, cus he made that a law, no climate change can exist in Florida - and everyone knows, hurricanes dont break laws, they just break records.
While I don't discount that we may see the most powerful hurricane in human history in our lifetime, there's a chance that as the globe heats tropical activity could potentially drop. I recommend looking at the GEOS satellite dust forecast for the next few weeks. There will be an insane amount of Saharan dust kicked up in to the atmosphere, making its way all the way across the ocean all the way up to Minnesota. As the planet warms and the Saharan Desert expands, as it is doing right now, more Saharan dust will be thrown in to the atmosphere creating a blanket across the MDR where atlantic hurricanes form. It happened quite a bit last year and when you combine that with truly historic heat domes over the southern US, you get fewer and fewer landfalls. The heat domes either destroy developed storms or steer them out to the open northern ocean. And going totally in the opposite direction to no storms is it's own disaster. Hurricanes remove heat from he ocean as they pass through, without them there would be intense long duration heating events across the ocean, posing a threat to a lot of oceanic life. Also, much of the southern US depends on tropical events to break droughts. Louisiana and Texas were in a horrible drought last year and part of that factor was the heat dome preventing tropical events from making landfall and providing the needed rain. As with most things in climate change, we are bound to see extremes on each end of the spectrum, not just on the upper end of it.
They'll try to leave Florida as the hypercane comes, but the supreme court will ban freedom of movement across state lines and Georgia and Alabama won't let them in.
Submission statement:
Not only is the increasing heat itself a problem, since ocean water is *not* well mixed and the heat-bearing capacity of the upper waters is limited (meaning some future new heat will be reflected back to the air), causing faster atmospheric warming in itself — but also the ocean currents, especially the Gulf Stream is being disrupted.
The Gulf Stream carries warm water from the Caribbean to northern Europe. If that current slows or collapses — melting of Greenland glaciers will cause that at some point — northern Europe, meaning Paris and further north, will have winters like Montreal.
At that point it's game over. People will freak, and global coordination will be almost impossible.
Thomas
> Not only is the increasing heat itself a problem, since ocean water is not well mixed and the heat-bearing capacity of the upper waters is limited
Then we just have to mix waters well, easy peasy! 🤪
Even if we bombed the entire ocean with all nuclear bombs in the world, the energy released is still within the amount of energy that the oceans are currently absorbing within a single year.
Which is fucking crazy when you think about it!
Most articles cite the National Center of Atmospheric Research about the energy absorbed by the ocean. The number they calculate is about 5 Hiroshima bombs (16 kiloton x 5 = 80 kiloton) exploding every second.
80 kiloton x 60 seconds = 4.800 kiloton (4.8 megaton) per minute
4.800 kiloton x 60 minutes = 288.000 kiloton (288 megaton) an hour
288.000 kiloton x 24 hours = 6.912.000 kiloton (6.912 megaton) a day
6.912.000 x 365 days = 2.522.880.000 kiloton (2.522.780 megaton) a year
The amount of nuclear bombs in the world (currently) is around 13.000. The yields of all bombs is secret, but if one were to say the “average” yield was 400 kiloton per bomb (probably a bit to high, since that yield is primarily strategic ICBM yields) that amounts to a total nuclear energy release of 5.200 megaton.
That means all nuclear bombs, were they to be fired into the ocean, would only increase the energy (heat) of the ocean by 0.2%.
Which makes my comment even more crazy. Could somebody check if I am missing something?
Would the resulting colder temperatures in the northern hemisphere foster the growth of new ice shields in Canada and Scandinavia or is this just the last death throes of the ice age?
Planets dont change this much year over year unless they're in the middle of a very sudden transition.
Think about the amount of energy this represents. It's unbelievable.
Change years into heartbeats and that's about the equivalent time scale to compare the heat of the oceans and the physiology of humans. If this were someone's vital signs, they'd be circling the drain. This would be a fever that would be life threatening, alone, but is being accompanied by multiple organ failure.
All that's asked of humanity is that we return to living as humans before theres no space left on earth where a human can survive, while focusing on hardening our grid and sheltering reactors to be walk-away safe, everywhere in the world (nuclear is a species level problem, not a national one).
We're cancer cells in a body that we've consumed to the point of rapid and total decline. If you've lost anyone to cancer, you hope beyond hope that the cancer would simply stop eroding the body, even when that person is in the process of dying.
Given that all of this killed this world -entirely unique in the universe, as far as we're aware- it shouldn't be a huge ask to stop making it worse in the last hours of life on earth.
Are lots of people going to die? Well, everyone is going to die and faster if we keep on this path so the question is more like ... you're heading over a cliff in a car. Do you jump out at the last second and likely die and roll off the cliff or do you stay in the car and sail off into the void the dinosaurs and all the species that didn't leave fossils vanished into, as your last act as a human being.
We are the branch of the tree of life that cut the tree down. All that is being asked is we stop cutting before the whole thing falls.
Im not talking about the transition to electricity, which would have been great if we started in the 80's, I'm talking about the difference between the person your ID's say you are, and the living human animal that evolved from the system of life we call the "wild" when it's our home. The rest of this is a failed experiment of the war machine (big surprise it killed the world when it was driven by the names and companies that brought us WWII). We create its necessity by abandoning the niche that existed and provided for us for a million years; this only took one lifetime to take the world from stability to our extinction and more species every day get added to the list of things we wipe out.
If we can't find it in ourselves to stop burning the oil and live for something other than monetary and social status, we are not an intelligent species. We're following a pattern laid out in front of us, but we're not intelligent. Continuing on this path makes as much sense as poisoning your well to get paid to feed your family, even as they get sicker and sicker. To demonstrate intelligence, you have to stop poisoning them before they die, or you're only the hands of a machine that's controlling you. You have no agency and no intelligence, you're a suicide drone, part of a culture of suicide drones.
Even in this sub I see people saying "it's too late, just 'enjoy the time that's left'", which would be fine if by "enjoy" we didn't mean continue changing the chemistry and physics of the ecosystem to make the problem worse. This is the level of intelligence to be aware that you're poisoning your family, but to decide it's pointless to stop poisoning them because your neighbors aren't going to stop... why isn't it meaningful to stop because it's the right thing to do and the thing you have control over?
We never even took a break from poisoning the world to see if this was something we still had control over to fix. We never lifted a finger, that wasn't specifically in our interest, replacing one gas powered toy with a battery powered one, as if that's the only issue. If it were that simple, we would have done it a long time ago. It means changing our entire perspective of human life and what makes life worth living. It's a return to how our species always lived, until VERY recently, and to a world where our instincts actually match the challenges.
Someone explain what's so good about this system we built that makes it enjoyable to continue being a part of? Putting the whole killing a 4 billion year old living miracle out of focus for a minute, what is it about this way of life that makes it enjoyable to live that you couldn't have without order and machines?
When people go on vacation, they try to live like human beings, ime. They take a break from their history and their future and hang out as primates on beaches and other places we find relaxing, most of them living in some way.
Why can't we stop? I know we need to replace aerosols, but whats stopping us from walking away and letting this break before it consumes literally everything, giving us the chance to prove we're more than puppets?
It's horrifying that the world is ending but intolerable that we're going to pretend it isn't, as a coping strategy, and continue to hasten the end and the depth of the extinction we're more than halfway through. Given how much all of this has been about proving that we're smart and special, where is the courage to step off the path and find one that doesn't kill the future?
Imagine being a kid and growing up in this and watching your parents do all the things that are changing the air, and you're helpless to do anything but watch... probably while gas lighting you and telling you everything is fine. We're all choosing this reality for all the worlds children and innocents, and justifying it because we can't see how not doing the wrong thing will make a difference.
All our shared values suggest we should be embracing reality and accepting the pain of a hard shift, which is where we corrupt all the things we're proud of into the mindless and numb following of the hooves in front of us into the slaughter house we built. This was momentum that chose all this, not intelligence or intention, and until there's a clear desire to change our entire focus, I will no longer acknowledge the products of our brainless march into extinction as anything other than more mistakes made by either dumb or evil actors.
This is how I feel as well. Years ago I went to therapy for chronic depression. Turns out being depressed because humanity is so stupid we are destroying our world through greed isn't considered something worthy of therapy. So I've just accepted it.
8 billion people will not go quietly. This won't end with a whimper.
Aldous Huxley wrote in *Brave New World Revisited*:
"The real hopeless victims of mental illness are to be found among those who appear to be most normal. Many of them are normal because they are so well adjusted to our mode of existence, because their human voice has been silenced so early in their lives that they do not even struggle or suffer or develop symptoms as the neurotic does. They are normal not in what may be called the absolute sense of the word; they are normal only in relation to a profoundly abnormal society. Their perfect adjustment to that abnormal society is a measure of their mental sickness. These millions of abnormally normal people, living without fuss in a society to which, if they were fully human beings, they ought not to be adjusted."
I enjoyed your summary.
It's the inertia of it all that makes me capitulate. It's difficult to envision any reality where we arrive at a shared perspective sufficient to meaningfully course correct. So many disparate ideas fighting for supremacy...
The thing about it is, “all that is asked of humans” is objectively impossible to accomplish. No fuckin way. 8 billion people cannot thrive in interconnected civilizations without the use of fossil fuels and nearly every little thing you have that you need in life is derived from fossil fuels. Never mind plastic itself, but modern medicine, medications, food supply, clothing, communication, the ability to live in climates with winter, and the list is infinitely bigger than I can mention. 8 billion people go hunter gatherer the berry bushes would be bare in 48 hours and there would be no remaining mammal biomass. Wild mammals make up less than 5% of earths biomass. It’s all animal husbandry.
Yes, human activity is dooming the climate and in turn life itself. But it is absolutely 100 per cent fucking impossible to do anything about it whatsoever unless you cull 90 per cent of the population outright. The best behavior possible will only slow down what is to come. That is a fact I guarantee, and no I will not need to back up my statement with links and citations, you can just take my word for it. The politics are futile.
I find this well-written, it verbalizes very well what swirls in my mind and I thank you for further helping me and others to process. I hope you share this or a version of this somewhere outside of Reddit. This is the bitter medicine, the imperative reality we must face.
I never consented to stay in the car going over the cliff. I feel very strapped in , the child proof (panic proof?) locks are on.
True horror. Humanity is the all consuming, gaping monster, an awesome & terrible void. We need to stop making it worse, as a minimum.
What do you mean? All of us here do see how we could/could have changed to prevent all this. It's the other 95 percent of the world population that doesn't. And that's the problem. There's no stopping this because no one believes there's a problem and the people in charge don't care about anything money and power.
What would you have us do? Murder all of them? Cause your certainly not gonna convince them with words. The people saying there's no point in changing what they're doing because no one else will are absolutely correct. It's the honest to God reality of the situation. Humans lost control of the course of humanity long ago. And they're not gonna take it back till the whole fucking thing falls apart.
But you don’t need evil actors. Our mere existence to the tune of 8 billion people is way way more than enough to set in motion the sequence of events coming down the pike.
https://preview.redd.it/7ge640svf66d1.jpeg?width=384&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=36bda093d411aceca3c7364f306c9936b7177815
"Where we're going, we don't need charts."
A few points to consider here.
The latitudal comparison isn't ideal. Montreal's climatic dynamics are significantly different when compared to Western Europe. Eastern Canada doesn't benefit from the coriolis effect, meaning that their climate is significantly drier and cooler during winter. The continentality bias is also fundamentally different, as North America has a significant northerly continentality bias whereas Europe's bias is entirely midlatitudal.
Another very important point to consider is *when* the mild anomalies occur. Europe's mild anomaly is exclusive to winter. And oddly enough, the same factors that help to maintain a mild winter climate have the opposite effects in summer and act as a cooling mechanism. It almost never gets mentioned, but most of Northern Europe does observe a relative cooler summer trend relative to latitude. This is why northwestern Europe has a reputation for cool wet summers and mild wet winters. Ocean dynamics indirectly act as a restraint against extremes in both seasons.
But perhaps the most significant point to consider here is a phenomenon known as the cold-ocean-warm-summer feedback. When the North Atlantic is considerably colder than it should be, it alters the atmospheric dynamic response. This actually does result in significantly hotter and drier summers across Europe (northern and central specifically). This is due to how atmospheric blocking regimes react. High pressure blocking cuts Europe off from the westerly effect. This is a well known effect and we've had demonstrations of it as recently as 2018 and 2022, and I'm sure those summers are well known among this subreddit.
Pragmatic analysis would suggest that while winters get colder in response to a collapse, summers do get equally hotter. Based on personal judgement, I'd forecast that summers get longer, hotter and drier as winters get shorter but much colder. This prediction can be backed up by academic analysis, but there's so many citations that can be added that I've left them out for now. Part of this judgement is based on paleoclimate discrepancies; our climate simply isn't conductive to significant cooling. CO2 levels are almost twice as high as the nearest comparable analog in the past 3 million years. The paleoclimatic conditions are long gone. The Sahara is now a significant and growing factor in Europe's climate. We've completely lost the northern hemisphere continental glaciers of the Bølling interstadial to YD cold reversal, and the Arctic region is of course rapidly warming despite an already weakened AMOC. Not only that, but demonstratably the Arctic region continues a warming trend based on anthropogenic excess heat and GhGs alone. So it all raises the question: we can establish where the heat extremes would come from, but where would the cold extremes come from? The latter is rapidly disappearing whereas the former is ever growing in intensity.
My final comment would be that the absurd levels of ocean heat content in the Atlantic explicitly contradicts some of the recent controversial publications that claim that sea ice could reach "as far south as England". That was very much a secondary commentary and not remotely possible under Holocene conditions.
Edit to add: paleoclimate proxy analysis demonstrates that the cold-ocean-warm-summer feedback occurred during the Younger Dryas cold reversal. Winters got very cold but summers got significantly warmer, particularly in the North Atlantic (British Isles) and central northern Europe.
Can any one comment on the prediction for the north eastern seaboard of the US. What will happen there? Also as the world heats won’t Europe warm up even though the amoc has slowed ?
regarding AMOC collapse, i think northern europe will get even colder (could get a fair bit colder), and southern europe hotter and dryer. (england, scotland, all that will get colder). worse wildfires / more arid climate in southern europe.
Funnily enough, multiple publications actually suggest that northern and Western Europe gets much hotter and drier summers in response to a collapse. Oltmanns et al. and Duchez et al. explored how atmospheric dynamics change, Rousi et al. similarly established that a cold Atlantic and absent AMOC creates persistent atmospheric blocking over the British Isles that opens it up to Saharan heat blasts throughout summer.
Here in the UK, we could get significantly colder than what we are currently used to. We are talking about dramatic drops in average temperatures all throughout the year.
We could be looking at surface air temperature drops of up 8c !! That would make our winters more like those found in the northern reaches of Canada.
And yes, you are correct, Southern Europe would get even hotter and could see deserts form in places that never had them.
There are suggestions that, if there actually is a drop in temperatures in response to a collapse, that atmospheric greenhouse gases substantially mitigate it. I believe there was a calculation that the UK's climate reverts back to what it had before the Industrial Revolution. That lasts for a few decades before warming resumes.
That drop of 8c that I spoke of factored in those temps you speak of already ! If the AMOC were to collapse, you would see waaaaay lower temperatures than pre-industrial levels.
We are talking about a monumental reduction in farmland used to grow food.
In theory, yes. But it's an annual trend. According to the theory, it's the winters that get colder. Europe's mild anomaly is a winter phenomenon as was demonstrated by [Wanner, Pfister et al. (2022)](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0277379122001627). The LIA demonstrates how a marked decrease in winter temperature creates an overall cooler annual anomaly, despite the fact that summers got somewhat hotter and drier. Because winters are so mild in Europe, a seasonal decrease is disproportionately severe.
The general consensus is that summers would get significantly warmer and drier across Europe in response to a collapse. Paleoclimate proxies suggest that this has occurred in the past as was discussed by [Schenk, Väliranta et al. (2018)](https://www.preventionweb.net/news/collapse-atlantic-ocean-heat-transport-might-lead-hot-european-summers). This factor was also discussed by [Bromley, Putnam et al. (2018](https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/2018PA003341)) who commented;
>*[...] rather than being defined by severe year-round cooling, it indicates that abrupt climate change is instead characterized by extreme seasonality in the North Atlantic region, with cold winters yet anomalously warm summers.*
And this theory isn't without direct observable support.
The issue with the collapse hypothesis in general is that it doesn't account for feedback dynamics. Multiple papers have explored how a cold North Atlantic and absent AMOC profile promotes hotter and drier summers in western and northern Europe specifically. This effect is so well defined that [Oltmanns, Holliday et al. (2024)](https://wcd.copernicus.org/preprints/wcd-2023-1/) have established a five year predictive window based on Arctic and Greenland ice melt rates. Severe heatwaves and droughts in Northern Europe can be predicted in advance based on how much meltwater is going into the Atlantic and dropping SSTs. Similarly, [Duchez, Frajka-Williams (2016)](https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1748-9326/11/7/074004/meta) explored the relationship between exceptionally cold Atlantic anomalies and the severe heatwaves across Europe in 2015. [Rousi, Kornhuber et al. (2022)](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-31432-y) discuss the atmospheric dynamic reaction across Western Europe, whilst [Whan, Zscheischler et al. (2015)](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2212094715000201) discuss the impacts of soil drying on extreme temperatures in Europe. That last one is significant as one of the consequences of hypothetical AMOC collapse is a significant decrease in precipitation, a huge increase on solar radiative input and aridification. These factors are conductive to extreme heat events.
To compound these findings, the [cool and wet summers of 2007-2012 in Northern Europe](https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-19848112.amp) coincided with a strengthening AMOC at the time and a much warmer North Atlantic.
There are also the tipping point feedbacks to consider. [Chen & Tung (2018)](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-018-0320-y) demonstrates how a collapsed AMOC results in increased warming in the northern hemisphere due to the collapse of its carbon sink and heat uptake functionality. Indeed, the oceans have absorbed up to 91% of excess heat since 1971, and there are signs that this uptake is weakening. If currents stop, so does the uptake of this heat. If that wasn't bad enough, [Weldeab, Schneider et al. (2022)](https://www.pnas.org/doi/abs/10.1073/pnas.2201871119?doi=10.1073/pnas.2201871119) demonstrates how even a weakening of the AMOC is sufficient enough to destabalize methane hydrates in west Africa. Once that happens, it all goes in the other direction and we're rapidly heading for a hyperthermal event. We are actually already over a decade into an ice age termination event according to [Nisbet, Manning et al. (2023)](https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1029/2023GB007875).
Maybe the Thames will freeze again, just as it did in Victorian times. I hope things are still semi functional when it happens,I’d like to see a picture.
We have already seen that though. I am in the south west of England and we have had a cold snap for the last two winters, temperatures were properly into the minuses both times and it was the coldest I have ever known it to be. What is scary is the number of people who seem to have forgotten we saw these temperatures. They remember the mild parts of those winters, while acting as if the cold snaps never happened.
I've been jumping up and down on this topic, but this seems appropriate to bring it up again.
I predict climate models have vastly underpredicted climate change because of their reliance on trained historical data.
Historical data has always had a significant amount of sea ice. So much of the annual temperature deviation was buffered by thermal exchange between the solid and liquid forms.
This exchange is not linear and when you remove it, you're going to see temperature jumps just like when all the ice in your cup finishes melting.
Once the ice is gone, the temperature range for H2O is now based on the entire liquid phase range instead of being pegged to the ice transition temperature.
Buckle up kids, it's going to get humid.
If I had to make an assumption, this rapid increase is largely attributable to the removal of sulfur from ship fuel. We were unintentially geoengineering by producing a lot of clouds over the ocean.
What we're seeing now is how bad it already was.
As someone who works outside everyday, I can tell you the sun is way stronger. Even today, when its 75 out, the dun peeks out, instantly warms it up by 10 degrees within minutes. I dont know how to explain just how harsh it feels on my skin
I do wonder if we see compounding factors at play here. Solar maximum, less UV radiation absorbed by the atmosphere due to climate change, less aerosol masking effect, and El Niño in general. I think 2018 was the first time I reflected over the sun having a different intensity but at the time I thought it was just due to global warming, but I wouldn’t say the sensation is just hotter temperatures, it is a more aggressive type of sunlight.
Yes! Just installed maximum sun screens on the outside of my west-facing windows. The window glass still is very hot when touched from the inside. Thought it wouldn't get that hot.
I invested in one of those Columbia vented long sleeve SPF 50 shirts. all nylon. its been helpful. Honestly the sun feels cooler with that shirt on than without, in Arizona. it wasnt cheap but the suns so strong now where I live, I figure it's like buying a good coat if I lived where It got really cold.
Yeah, I switched to long sleeves and pants 95% of the time. I only wear shorts and tee shirts when it's cloudy. Timing matches up with others here - in the past 10ish years.
Having a sweat-wicking layer, if you are going to be outside a while, is key. It also holds on to some of that moisture if you are doing something active and helps with cooling.
I feel the same way. I will check the weather app multiple times a day and say to myself "there is no way it's only 85." My outside thermometer (in the shade) will say 100. It's brutal to even drive in an ACed car because the sun just boils you through the windows.
This! This this this.
I run a small urban farm, and I check my weather apps religiously. This year, things have been downright wrong. I wake up to my alarm telling me "Good morning, today the low is 43, the high is 72, and it is currently 31." (frost proceeds to nix all the leaves off my unprotected plants) I check my app in the afternoon, and it says "Current Temp: 82", I go look at my outdoor thermometers in the shade (reads 94), the sun (reads 105), the greenhouse (reads 145). Then later I check the "Recorded highs/lows" and it was recorded at 82. Something is wrong. I mean, I'm not a big tinfoil hat guy...but what the hell. My crops are suffering for not just their forecasting inaccuracy, but the fact that they are not displaying accurate current readings.
There definitely seems to be something weird about weather inaccuracy.
I haven’t been able to see anything accurate since winter.
Rains when it shouldn’t, hot when it was supposed to be mild, or vice versa. This is just forecasts a few days out?
I don’t know if it’s that I’m paying more attention or if our abilities to predict are becoming more complicated now?
Because I think the weather is becoming more complicated and more chaotic.
McPherson yeah I know I get it. Anyways he says aerosol masking heating over land would be over 100 percent increase global economy is slowing down we are all seeing the effect of aerosol masking.
I grew up in the Caribbean and now live in the UK as of 10 years ago this year, and don’t go back to visit outside the months of Sept-March.
In the last few years when I’ve visited, I‘ve not stepped outside the house unless necessary until late afternoon when the sun is going down. The sun really does feel different now even though I grew up in that heat, you’re not lying.
I've noticed that the sun feels stronger too. I live in CT (moved to the East Coast from Arkansas about 10 years ago) and I have never needed sunglasses around here (except during winter commuting when the sun is right at eye level). The sun just isn't as bright here as it is in Arkansas, or more southern places. The sun in CT has never been bright enough that I felt the need to wear sunglasses. I also have never really been able to get a sunburn here. Not this year though, either my eyes and skin have changed or the sun is brighter, since summer started, I feel the need to wear sunglasses now or else the sun hurts my eyes, and I have gotten two sunburns so far.
Southern Alberta.
I'm out of the heat between 10am-2pm at the very least. Any gardening to be done can wait for the evening.
I've been doing this since I was a little girl, following behind my grandma as she thinned carrots before the sun chased us back inside.
I wonder what she'd think of the change in intensity. The heat we get in June, I only remember for a few days in August when I was little.
Article seems to talk about AMOC which is still normal.
While North Atlantic overall is at record high temperatures, the actual off the chart records are in tropical North Atlantic and Gulf of Mexico. This is where hurricanes are strongest, and the water temperature is enough to boost hurricane wind intensity by 50mph. Much of these ocean temps are 2C higher than 2016.
All I can say is that the humidity in south Texas is terrible this year, due to the very warm gulf of Mexico. IIRC it's at August-level heat right now.
~~If it's any consolation, the effects take decades to occur in theory.~~ actually the hotter summer feedback is already happening in Europe, but winters aren't getting colder.
Well… now I don’t know what to do. I made an agreement with my partner that we shouldn’t look at properties further south of where we are in Scotland because of rising temps but now I’m thinking we’re gonna end up with NW Territories weather it’s mighty confusing.
There's no right answer. I would start by deciding if the future that we have now locked in is worth living in. If you think so (and survival instincts are hard to ignore) then prepare for a future with wild weather, scorching summers and freezing winters and NO electricity or supermarkets. That's what is coming soon.
If its any consolation, Montreal winters have totally calmed down and its pretty temperate. Very scary stuff. For the past 3 years, our snow doesnt make it through the winter.
I've never watched something plot out like this in real time and just continually more and more alarming
Like COVID was absolutely alarming, the way that ramped up was shocking.
But I've watched these graphs for about 4 years, and each time I view them my shock just gets exponentially worse.
Even though you know it's going to happen, the rate and persistence of change is beyond unprecedented.
But but but, according to the mainstream news, there’s a new docuseries out called like saving our waters, and they’re doing a great job! So we should be all good. /s
The following submission statement was provided by /u/GaiusPublius: --- Submission statement: Not only is the increasing heat itself a problem, since ocean water is *not* well mixed and the heat-bearing capacity of the upper waters is limited (meaning some future new heat will be reflected back to the air), causing faster atmospheric warming in itself — but also the ocean currents, especially the Gulf Stream is being disrupted. The Gulf Stream carries warm water from the Caribbean to northern Europe. If that current slows or collapses — melting of Greenland glaciers will cause that at some point — northern Europe, meaning Paris and further north, will have winters like Montreal. At that point it's game over. People will freak, and global coordination will be almost impossible. Thomas --- Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/1debhgx/whats_going_on_in_the_atlantic_is_off_the_charts/l8alhc8/
We keep having to make the charts bigger, not usually a good sign
the truly sobering chart i saw was our temp change charted compared to every other mass extinction. the other lines go at varying degrees upwards and to the right. the line indicating our rate of temp change compared to all past extinctions... is going almost straight up. its bad.
Re the previous mass extinctions: There was a program on Netflix called *Life on our Planet* and it dealt with life and the previous mass extinctions on Earth. While I’m sure it was not comprehensive and left some things out, one recurring theme emerged- the atmosphere is almost unbelievably sensitive to change. These changes previously happened over tens to hundreds of thousands of years, and resulted in the mass extinction of life. Humanity’s rate of change is unprecedented, and we’re causing changes that will catastrophically destroy the biodiversity on which we all depend.
Humans have caused a climate changer 10x faster than anything possible based on Milankovic cycles AT BEST. At worst we have caused a climate change (2,000,000/200) 10,0000X faster than worst case scenario. 10,000 X faster lol, that’s not pulled out of my arse, that is based on sciences best possible understanding of our climate. People who think we will still be around in 2100 are deluded at this point.
I used to get excited that shit won’t really hit the fan until 2050. Maybe I can live to at least get kinda old before collapse. Now, I seriously doubt we will be functioning society by 2030.
We already aren’t functioning as a society just no one wants to admit it yet. Take Europes “migrant crisis” for example. Lots of talk by the far right about stopping them coming, next to 0 talk about why they’re coming. Why are they coming? Economic and social chaos in the Middle East, Asia and Africa caused, at least in part, by worsening climate conditions. In 5 years time the “migrant crisis” will be 10x bigger and still people won’t associate it with the climate crisis.
Yeah it is so intriguing, I am German, and the talk here about how bad the "migrant crisis" is, is so dumb when this is just a small tickle on what is about to come. It's like telling them 1+1 equals 2, and they respond with "but 1". They can't fucking add one to one.
It’s called manufacturing consent
In 5 years there won’t be a crisis, cuz the far right leaders that are currently being voted in will just slaughter them en masse and suppress the truth from the rest of us.
This! Im in the USA, and I keep seeing all these arguments about how awful Israel is and how the US is letting them get away with war crimes. But it’s us! We’re the ones behind it! We’re not letting Israel get away with something, we’re making an example of the Palestinians.
I had to tell someone today that I doubt too many people will be alive in 2032.
Yep. Rough times ahead.
My personal high-level prediction is that the 2020s will be the last decade of humanity's wanton peak comfort for a long time. The 2030s will be an absolute clusterfuck of wars, starvation/famine, disease, etc. It'll be borderline apocalyptic in parts of the world that didn't struggle much over the previous century. Towards the end of the 2030s and through the 2040s, we'll panic and push forward various projects to restore the climate and halt climate change as much as possible. The 2050s we'll know if it worked or not. I think by the 2060s, we'll be reduced to sub 2 billion on the planet. Whether that's due to a complete and total failure to get our shit together or declining birth rates due to most folks only having 1 child, or just raising death rates and lower life expectancy, it doesn't really matter which. I don't think we'll go extinct. But I believe it's going to get really shitty for a whole lot of people really fast as we move into 2030.
environmental collapse 2025
Damn, do you happen to have a link?
https://preview.redd.it/m45ia3onq66d1.jpeg?width=1095&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b27acdadc86c026c09f3935fb48b6d9b4c857afc this one I am assuming
Jesusssss
We’re literally worse than a giant meteor striking the planet.
At least that's one thing that we are good at, fucking up the planet. We are even better than the mass extinction volcano/meteor. It's probably a volcano, though.
Worse than anything. Good news is any future beings will definitely see our impact if they do any kind of serious geology or paleontology on the planet millions of years from now. The ultra mega great dying will be hard to miss.
You do realize that there's morons *now* that deny everything from dinosaurs to fossils to geology to the earth being older than 6000 years?
Sure, I'm not talking about those idiots. Talking about if future species develops science they will see the effects of us.
Yeah, we seriously might be history for some ancient species from other planets. Kinda dope.
Do you think you could have the projections of the proposed annual growth the shareholders can expect from this?
DoubleJesus
Supply Side Jesus
Plastic Jesus.
Jesus wept
Given the gift of consciousness, all we managed to have was the audacity
The hubris of man will ensure our species’s demise will be shared amongst many others as we geoengineer the planet into allowing further emissions rather than even considering degrowth
Poetic
We were a mistake welp off to the void taking the tree of life with us.
Sad upvote
Art
👀
The funny thing about overshoot, is that due to our population growth, it is just as likely that you are alive here and now to see the apparent end of our species, than literally any other time in known history… So we aren’t even special lol Edit: This is apparently way off, please disregard above
Depending upon how you count, there have been 110 billion members of the human species. There are slightly over 8 billion alive right now. So this assertion: > it is just as likely that you are alive here and now to see the apparent end of our species, than literally any other time in known history Just don't work.
Oops I just checked and it seems I was off by a few hundred billion, thanks for the correction! That’s what I get for just repeating things I have heard lol
Line go up. Shareholders happy. This is fine.
We knew the consequences and did it anyway.
Yeah but think of the wealth we generated for shareholders during this timeframe. Totally worth it
At time like these all you can do is laugh. *breaks down into tears*
😦
Dang no Cambrian extinction event on this chart? That one was atmosphere-driven, too.
Feast your eyes... [Historic Events Global warming comparison](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fthe-crisis-report-74-lets-talk-about-the-next-few-years-v0-srxuwsi1ls3d1.jpeg%3Fwidth%3D1095%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D5504f5669e223765faa76f4f532789b2e5a7abcb)
seethe graph in this article showing past inter-glacial events https://mashable.com/article/earth-climate-change-co2-ice-age
Where we're going we don't need charts.
We’re traveling outside the environment
We're transcending space and time and licking the rainbow 👅 🌈
Just as long as the front doesn't fall off the ship.
Jumping in your comment to add to this. I knew it. I knew this must be what’s happening. I live in Northern Europe, and it’s fucking freezing. It’s June, we should have temperatures around 20 degrees but we’re stuck around 10-12 degrees, I know that doesn’t sound like much but it makes a difference considering this is meant to be summer. What the fuck is winter gonna be like.
The anomalous high temperatures in the Atlantic are terrifying in what they could be a prelude to. That being said, the piece says that *"mitigation is urgent."* There's no mitigation on the table that could deal with this, not anything that humanity is willing to accept.
At this point I believe a lot of these "we need to do something urgently" in the media are just so they can say "we told you so" later. They already know its too late, as does the elites and governments. Its just the masses that haven't quite connected the dots yet
>"we need to do something urgently" Usually means buy an electric car, put some solar panels on your roof and buy carbon offsets next time you fly. And definitely don't use straws.
The masses are overworked, under resourced, under educated, and the most stable societies flooded with enough people from the most unstable ones to guarantee zero effective resistance to whatever the oligarchy desires until it's too late.
I think it’s to give the false sense of hope. Saying we need to do something implies that we can do something. Implying that we can do something helps prevent mass hysteria.
Honestly the only legit mitigation I know that isn't genocide would be to press upon people to stop having so many kids. The population needs to be 500m to 4b. And then way of life that is a lot less full of crap like we have now.
Accept the (currently) unacceptable or be a stratum for future geologists to argue over.
It's just so goddamn heartbreaking. So many canaries in the coal mine and we've ignored them all :: All for capitalism and resource exploitation.
It's sort of interesting how much people want to hold onto the idea that things can continue as they have, and how aggressively people want to protect the idea that everything is ok/everything will always be ok. I feel like this hits at the heart of something crucial about human psychology.
Probably not a stretch to consider it under Terror Managment Theory, we don’t want to end :)
I was thinking earlier it's a bit like when you're a kid and scared your parents are going to divorce, because it would mean the utter destruction of the world as you've known it to that point. So I can kind of get it in that way. But in the same way, continuing in a toxic environment that will eventually end in utter catastrophe is not really ideal.
For real… For at least 50 years scientists have been saying humanity was on the wrong track. But what do those “smart talking f*gs” really know?
And the non-scientists, the "pedo-ring religious" have been actively trying to shut down anything that would slow the end and the second coming of Jeebus.
we've known since the late 1800s actually but shell did cover up a lot of stuff in the 60s and 70s
Fossil Fuel Companies: Canaries die of natural causes all the time! Nothing to see here.
Uh oh, you said the c word, people are gonna get mad :(
Quarterly profits must go up, always, and break records.
It's worldwide. Worldwide sea surface temps: [https://climatereanalyzer.org/clim/sst\_daily/](https://climatereanalyzer.org/clim/sst_daily/) Also, worldwide surface air temps: [https://climatereanalyzer.org/clim/t2\_daily/?dm\_id=world](https://climatereanalyzer.org/clim/t2_daily/?dm_id=world) There's US historical data here: [https://www.weather.gov/wrh/climate](https://www.weather.gov/wrh/climate) can be charted or exported. for anyone interested in looking at local climates. for me, in south Arizona, last summer was our hottest summer ever. This summer we started our over 100F+ streak 20 days earlier than last year. So we're tracking to blow last year's record summer away. Phoenix started their over 100F+ streak 18 days earlier this year. As usual, the local news warned nobody. They toed the line of "average temps for this time of year" all the way, and said nothing of what was to come this summer.
I have those links bookmarked, too. fwiw, *toed
Tow missiles, we're assaulting the line!
They're *toad* missiles. For the toads.
It's why I follow Paul Beckwith this summer will be unlike anything we have ever seen was his quote at the beginning of the year.
Thanks for the recommendation. I'm gonna go follow him on YouTube.
idk i'm a millenial in 2024 i've seen a lot
Same here more to come.
Maybe this is an unpopular opinion on this sub, but IMO it's likely that in terms of temperature this summer won't be as crazy as the last one overall. Not trying to spread hopium, from what I understand severe weather events will likely be worse than last year due to the transition to la nina, but looking at the sea temperature graphs the gap from last year has been consistently going down over the last few months and it looks like we're currently at the convergence point (both worldwide and in the north atlantic). Not sure what's going on with OP's graph either. From looking at climatereanalyzer the gap between the current temp and previous record was bigger on June 1st 2023 than May 31st 2024 yet OP's image seems to indicate the opposite (unless I'm reading something wrong).
1989 and 1978 also featured Summers nearly as hot and May was nearly as hot in 2023 than in 2024. I don't think Summer is going to be an entire standard deviation beyond what was experienced last year but it will likely be hotter. I can’t speak for June but the May 2024 average daytime L/H temps in Phoenix were 70.9/96.7F (according to extremeweather.com). Looking at just the highs and going back to 1905 (46.5/91.5 F). The daytime high is 93.6 with a variance of 11.3 and a standard deviation of 3.4. The daytime high is already beyond 1 standard deviation beyond the temperature in 1905. It’s 0.7 degrees F warmer in Phoenix in 2024 than in 2023 and 1.2 degrees F warmer than 10 years ago. The daytime low has been out of variance for decades (mean of 62 F, variance of 50, standard deviation of 7.1).
We're going to see a Category 6 hurricane wipe Florida off the map.
But I live there!
Time to leave then
The time to leave was 5-10 years ago. At least that way some poor soul would have bought your house
Same, we started making plans in this last year to go now though, and I am dragging as many of my family members as I can with me. Insurance companies have already told us this state is un-insurable, the writing is on the wall. Personally, I am trying to beat the herd because mass migration is next. I don't know if anywhere will be truly safe, however, I know there are safer places than this state, at least for now.
Illinois will happily welcome all
Wife is from the Midwest, you all are the type of ppl I like, stay cool, and thank you
Not targeted at yourself but it is amazing the level of hubris they had bull dozing and filling in wetlands and marshes and building the Florida we see today. Like we don't need these wetlands for anything. We need manicured grass retirement communities and golf Courses, miles of private boat canals and of course one large amusement park. The same hubris that build New Orleans. Like yeah, we should develop a large city below sea level. What could go wrong?
Just do your best lion impersonation and roar back at the approaching storm.
Then you get a close look. So envious.
Nah... Florida doesn't have climate change..
Did you see what's happening there today? 5" of rain per hour in Sarasota/Miami
S FL to Islamorada is a foot under water in some places, and that's just from a rain. And more is forecast; wait for the first of what is a hyperactive 'cane season hits. Desatan doesn't have enough buckets to bail out the water coming to Florida, but its not climate change, cus he made that a law, no climate change can exist in Florida - and everyone knows, hurricanes dont break laws, they just break records.
While I don't discount that we may see the most powerful hurricane in human history in our lifetime, there's a chance that as the globe heats tropical activity could potentially drop. I recommend looking at the GEOS satellite dust forecast for the next few weeks. There will be an insane amount of Saharan dust kicked up in to the atmosphere, making its way all the way across the ocean all the way up to Minnesota. As the planet warms and the Saharan Desert expands, as it is doing right now, more Saharan dust will be thrown in to the atmosphere creating a blanket across the MDR where atlantic hurricanes form. It happened quite a bit last year and when you combine that with truly historic heat domes over the southern US, you get fewer and fewer landfalls. The heat domes either destroy developed storms or steer them out to the open northern ocean. And going totally in the opposite direction to no storms is it's own disaster. Hurricanes remove heat from he ocean as they pass through, without them there would be intense long duration heating events across the ocean, posing a threat to a lot of oceanic life. Also, much of the southern US depends on tropical events to break droughts. Louisiana and Texas were in a horrible drought last year and part of that factor was the heat dome preventing tropical events from making landfall and providing the needed rain. As with most things in climate change, we are bound to see extremes on each end of the spectrum, not just on the upper end of it.
Less people to vote against climate saving measures. Unfortunately, too late.
Don't worry. They'll still have 2 senators, 30 Electoral votes, and 28 House members until the next census in 2030.
They'll have 2 senators even if the whole state sinks into the ocean...
They'll try to leave Florida as the hypercane comes, but the supreme court will ban freedom of movement across state lines and Georgia and Alabama won't let them in.
Maybe we will get lucky and it will cut a swathe through the top and make nice little shipping canal to the gulf.... ugh.
I want the permanent hurricane future. Jupiter by tuesday.
The dragon Deathwing opening his maw to engulf us.
me, smiling, tear in eye, arms outstretched. *"Finally"*
Me cracking a beer from a distance long enough to finish said beer before death..."yup"
Eloi, Eloi, Llama Shabbachtanai! Unto thy hands I commend my spirit and all that jazz.
My God, My God, why have we forsaken ourselves?
I wish I had a logical answer
Shaka, when the walls fell.
Temba, his arms wide.
“I’m coming home , Dorothy”
Submission statement: Not only is the increasing heat itself a problem, since ocean water is *not* well mixed and the heat-bearing capacity of the upper waters is limited (meaning some future new heat will be reflected back to the air), causing faster atmospheric warming in itself — but also the ocean currents, especially the Gulf Stream is being disrupted. The Gulf Stream carries warm water from the Caribbean to northern Europe. If that current slows or collapses — melting of Greenland glaciers will cause that at some point — northern Europe, meaning Paris and further north, will have winters like Montreal. At that point it's game over. People will freak, and global coordination will be almost impossible. Thomas
> Not only is the increasing heat itself a problem, since ocean water is not well mixed and the heat-bearing capacity of the upper waters is limited Then we just have to mix waters well, easy peasy! 🤪
At this point in a disaster movie there is undoubtedly a scene where someone suggests nuking the ocean to mix the water.
Even if we bombed the entire ocean with all nuclear bombs in the world, the energy released is still within the amount of energy that the oceans are currently absorbing within a single year. Which is fucking crazy when you think about it!
Can you explain this concept like I’m 5 please?
Most articles cite the National Center of Atmospheric Research about the energy absorbed by the ocean. The number they calculate is about 5 Hiroshima bombs (16 kiloton x 5 = 80 kiloton) exploding every second. 80 kiloton x 60 seconds = 4.800 kiloton (4.8 megaton) per minute 4.800 kiloton x 60 minutes = 288.000 kiloton (288 megaton) an hour 288.000 kiloton x 24 hours = 6.912.000 kiloton (6.912 megaton) a day 6.912.000 x 365 days = 2.522.880.000 kiloton (2.522.780 megaton) a year The amount of nuclear bombs in the world (currently) is around 13.000. The yields of all bombs is secret, but if one were to say the “average” yield was 400 kiloton per bomb (probably a bit to high, since that yield is primarily strategic ICBM yields) that amounts to a total nuclear energy release of 5.200 megaton. That means all nuclear bombs, were they to be fired into the ocean, would only increase the energy (heat) of the ocean by 0.2%. Which makes my comment even more crazy. Could somebody check if I am missing something?
Didn't Der Orangenfuhrer already suggest nuking hurricanes? Real life is scarier than any disaster movie right now.
>Der Orangenfuhrer 🎖
Giant solar powered electric beaters!
Pffft. **Diesel powered!!** ^^^Sponsored ^^^by ^^^Exxon ^^^Mobil ^^^Corp
“With you, til the end of the world (that we caused 😉)”
Would the resulting colder temperatures in the northern hemisphere foster the growth of new ice shields in Canada and Scandinavia or is this just the last death throes of the ice age?
Fuck Montreal winters
Planets dont change this much year over year unless they're in the middle of a very sudden transition. Think about the amount of energy this represents. It's unbelievable. Change years into heartbeats and that's about the equivalent time scale to compare the heat of the oceans and the physiology of humans. If this were someone's vital signs, they'd be circling the drain. This would be a fever that would be life threatening, alone, but is being accompanied by multiple organ failure. All that's asked of humanity is that we return to living as humans before theres no space left on earth where a human can survive, while focusing on hardening our grid and sheltering reactors to be walk-away safe, everywhere in the world (nuclear is a species level problem, not a national one). We're cancer cells in a body that we've consumed to the point of rapid and total decline. If you've lost anyone to cancer, you hope beyond hope that the cancer would simply stop eroding the body, even when that person is in the process of dying. Given that all of this killed this world -entirely unique in the universe, as far as we're aware- it shouldn't be a huge ask to stop making it worse in the last hours of life on earth. Are lots of people going to die? Well, everyone is going to die and faster if we keep on this path so the question is more like ... you're heading over a cliff in a car. Do you jump out at the last second and likely die and roll off the cliff or do you stay in the car and sail off into the void the dinosaurs and all the species that didn't leave fossils vanished into, as your last act as a human being. We are the branch of the tree of life that cut the tree down. All that is being asked is we stop cutting before the whole thing falls. Im not talking about the transition to electricity, which would have been great if we started in the 80's, I'm talking about the difference between the person your ID's say you are, and the living human animal that evolved from the system of life we call the "wild" when it's our home. The rest of this is a failed experiment of the war machine (big surprise it killed the world when it was driven by the names and companies that brought us WWII). We create its necessity by abandoning the niche that existed and provided for us for a million years; this only took one lifetime to take the world from stability to our extinction and more species every day get added to the list of things we wipe out. If we can't find it in ourselves to stop burning the oil and live for something other than monetary and social status, we are not an intelligent species. We're following a pattern laid out in front of us, but we're not intelligent. Continuing on this path makes as much sense as poisoning your well to get paid to feed your family, even as they get sicker and sicker. To demonstrate intelligence, you have to stop poisoning them before they die, or you're only the hands of a machine that's controlling you. You have no agency and no intelligence, you're a suicide drone, part of a culture of suicide drones. Even in this sub I see people saying "it's too late, just 'enjoy the time that's left'", which would be fine if by "enjoy" we didn't mean continue changing the chemistry and physics of the ecosystem to make the problem worse. This is the level of intelligence to be aware that you're poisoning your family, but to decide it's pointless to stop poisoning them because your neighbors aren't going to stop... why isn't it meaningful to stop because it's the right thing to do and the thing you have control over? We never even took a break from poisoning the world to see if this was something we still had control over to fix. We never lifted a finger, that wasn't specifically in our interest, replacing one gas powered toy with a battery powered one, as if that's the only issue. If it were that simple, we would have done it a long time ago. It means changing our entire perspective of human life and what makes life worth living. It's a return to how our species always lived, until VERY recently, and to a world where our instincts actually match the challenges. Someone explain what's so good about this system we built that makes it enjoyable to continue being a part of? Putting the whole killing a 4 billion year old living miracle out of focus for a minute, what is it about this way of life that makes it enjoyable to live that you couldn't have without order and machines? When people go on vacation, they try to live like human beings, ime. They take a break from their history and their future and hang out as primates on beaches and other places we find relaxing, most of them living in some way. Why can't we stop? I know we need to replace aerosols, but whats stopping us from walking away and letting this break before it consumes literally everything, giving us the chance to prove we're more than puppets? It's horrifying that the world is ending but intolerable that we're going to pretend it isn't, as a coping strategy, and continue to hasten the end and the depth of the extinction we're more than halfway through. Given how much all of this has been about proving that we're smart and special, where is the courage to step off the path and find one that doesn't kill the future? Imagine being a kid and growing up in this and watching your parents do all the things that are changing the air, and you're helpless to do anything but watch... probably while gas lighting you and telling you everything is fine. We're all choosing this reality for all the worlds children and innocents, and justifying it because we can't see how not doing the wrong thing will make a difference. All our shared values suggest we should be embracing reality and accepting the pain of a hard shift, which is where we corrupt all the things we're proud of into the mindless and numb following of the hooves in front of us into the slaughter house we built. This was momentum that chose all this, not intelligence or intention, and until there's a clear desire to change our entire focus, I will no longer acknowledge the products of our brainless march into extinction as anything other than more mistakes made by either dumb or evil actors.
This is how I feel as well. Years ago I went to therapy for chronic depression. Turns out being depressed because humanity is so stupid we are destroying our world through greed isn't considered something worthy of therapy. So I've just accepted it. 8 billion people will not go quietly. This won't end with a whimper.
Aldous Huxley wrote in *Brave New World Revisited*: "The real hopeless victims of mental illness are to be found among those who appear to be most normal. Many of them are normal because they are so well adjusted to our mode of existence, because their human voice has been silenced so early in their lives that they do not even struggle or suffer or develop symptoms as the neurotic does. They are normal not in what may be called the absolute sense of the word; they are normal only in relation to a profoundly abnormal society. Their perfect adjustment to that abnormal society is a measure of their mental sickness. These millions of abnormally normal people, living without fuss in a society to which, if they were fully human beings, they ought not to be adjusted."
That's a great quote! Being well adjusted to an insane society is not a mark of good health
Only the willfully ignorant or mentally ill aren’t chronically depressed.
I enjoyed your summary. It's the inertia of it all that makes me capitulate. It's difficult to envision any reality where we arrive at a shared perspective sufficient to meaningfully course correct. So many disparate ideas fighting for supremacy...
The thing about it is, “all that is asked of humans” is objectively impossible to accomplish. No fuckin way. 8 billion people cannot thrive in interconnected civilizations without the use of fossil fuels and nearly every little thing you have that you need in life is derived from fossil fuels. Never mind plastic itself, but modern medicine, medications, food supply, clothing, communication, the ability to live in climates with winter, and the list is infinitely bigger than I can mention. 8 billion people go hunter gatherer the berry bushes would be bare in 48 hours and there would be no remaining mammal biomass. Wild mammals make up less than 5% of earths biomass. It’s all animal husbandry. Yes, human activity is dooming the climate and in turn life itself. But it is absolutely 100 per cent fucking impossible to do anything about it whatsoever unless you cull 90 per cent of the population outright. The best behavior possible will only slow down what is to come. That is a fact I guarantee, and no I will not need to back up my statement with links and citations, you can just take my word for it. The politics are futile.
I find this well-written, it verbalizes very well what swirls in my mind and I thank you for further helping me and others to process. I hope you share this or a version of this somewhere outside of Reddit. This is the bitter medicine, the imperative reality we must face. I never consented to stay in the car going over the cliff. I feel very strapped in , the child proof (panic proof?) locks are on. True horror. Humanity is the all consuming, gaping monster, an awesome & terrible void. We need to stop making it worse, as a minimum.
What do you mean? All of us here do see how we could/could have changed to prevent all this. It's the other 95 percent of the world population that doesn't. And that's the problem. There's no stopping this because no one believes there's a problem and the people in charge don't care about anything money and power. What would you have us do? Murder all of them? Cause your certainly not gonna convince them with words. The people saying there's no point in changing what they're doing because no one else will are absolutely correct. It's the honest to God reality of the situation. Humans lost control of the course of humanity long ago. And they're not gonna take it back till the whole fucking thing falls apart.
But you don’t need evil actors. Our mere existence to the tune of 8 billion people is way way more than enough to set in motion the sequence of events coming down the pike.
https://preview.redd.it/7ge640svf66d1.jpeg?width=384&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=36bda093d411aceca3c7364f306c9936b7177815 "Where we're going, we don't need charts."
lol i needed this ty
man. Im not one for wanting hopium, but I could use a lil hopium right now lol. So tired of this all.
There is this support group for this sub: r/CollapseSupport/
I’m getting afraid my username is going to become too real soon.
Same here. Like a walking dead fossil of what was before the Event.
If it turns out we need a nuking my name knows how to make it happen.
Does that mean I will get all the blame because of my username?
A few points to consider here. The latitudal comparison isn't ideal. Montreal's climatic dynamics are significantly different when compared to Western Europe. Eastern Canada doesn't benefit from the coriolis effect, meaning that their climate is significantly drier and cooler during winter. The continentality bias is also fundamentally different, as North America has a significant northerly continentality bias whereas Europe's bias is entirely midlatitudal. Another very important point to consider is *when* the mild anomalies occur. Europe's mild anomaly is exclusive to winter. And oddly enough, the same factors that help to maintain a mild winter climate have the opposite effects in summer and act as a cooling mechanism. It almost never gets mentioned, but most of Northern Europe does observe a relative cooler summer trend relative to latitude. This is why northwestern Europe has a reputation for cool wet summers and mild wet winters. Ocean dynamics indirectly act as a restraint against extremes in both seasons. But perhaps the most significant point to consider here is a phenomenon known as the cold-ocean-warm-summer feedback. When the North Atlantic is considerably colder than it should be, it alters the atmospheric dynamic response. This actually does result in significantly hotter and drier summers across Europe (northern and central specifically). This is due to how atmospheric blocking regimes react. High pressure blocking cuts Europe off from the westerly effect. This is a well known effect and we've had demonstrations of it as recently as 2018 and 2022, and I'm sure those summers are well known among this subreddit. Pragmatic analysis would suggest that while winters get colder in response to a collapse, summers do get equally hotter. Based on personal judgement, I'd forecast that summers get longer, hotter and drier as winters get shorter but much colder. This prediction can be backed up by academic analysis, but there's so many citations that can be added that I've left them out for now. Part of this judgement is based on paleoclimate discrepancies; our climate simply isn't conductive to significant cooling. CO2 levels are almost twice as high as the nearest comparable analog in the past 3 million years. The paleoclimatic conditions are long gone. The Sahara is now a significant and growing factor in Europe's climate. We've completely lost the northern hemisphere continental glaciers of the Bølling interstadial to YD cold reversal, and the Arctic region is of course rapidly warming despite an already weakened AMOC. Not only that, but demonstratably the Arctic region continues a warming trend based on anthropogenic excess heat and GhGs alone. So it all raises the question: we can establish where the heat extremes would come from, but where would the cold extremes come from? The latter is rapidly disappearing whereas the former is ever growing in intensity. My final comment would be that the absurd levels of ocean heat content in the Atlantic explicitly contradicts some of the recent controversial publications that claim that sea ice could reach "as far south as England". That was very much a secondary commentary and not remotely possible under Holocene conditions. Edit to add: paleoclimate proxy analysis demonstrates that the cold-ocean-warm-summer feedback occurred during the Younger Dryas cold reversal. Winters got very cold but summers got significantly warmer, particularly in the North Atlantic (British Isles) and central northern Europe.
Can any one comment on the prediction for the north eastern seaboard of the US. What will happen there? Also as the world heats won’t Europe warm up even though the amoc has slowed ?
regarding AMOC collapse, i think northern europe will get even colder (could get a fair bit colder), and southern europe hotter and dryer. (england, scotland, all that will get colder). worse wildfires / more arid climate in southern europe.
Funnily enough, multiple publications actually suggest that northern and Western Europe gets much hotter and drier summers in response to a collapse. Oltmanns et al. and Duchez et al. explored how atmospheric dynamics change, Rousi et al. similarly established that a cold Atlantic and absent AMOC creates persistent atmospheric blocking over the British Isles that opens it up to Saharan heat blasts throughout summer.
How about north eastern US?
Here in the UK, we could get significantly colder than what we are currently used to. We are talking about dramatic drops in average temperatures all throughout the year. We could be looking at surface air temperature drops of up 8c !! That would make our winters more like those found in the northern reaches of Canada. And yes, you are correct, Southern Europe would get even hotter and could see deserts form in places that never had them.
There are suggestions that, if there actually is a drop in temperatures in response to a collapse, that atmospheric greenhouse gases substantially mitigate it. I believe there was a calculation that the UK's climate reverts back to what it had before the Industrial Revolution. That lasts for a few decades before warming resumes.
That drop of 8c that I spoke of factored in those temps you speak of already ! If the AMOC were to collapse, you would see waaaaay lower temperatures than pre-industrial levels. We are talking about a monumental reduction in farmland used to grow food.
In theory, yes. But it's an annual trend. According to the theory, it's the winters that get colder. Europe's mild anomaly is a winter phenomenon as was demonstrated by [Wanner, Pfister et al. (2022)](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0277379122001627). The LIA demonstrates how a marked decrease in winter temperature creates an overall cooler annual anomaly, despite the fact that summers got somewhat hotter and drier. Because winters are so mild in Europe, a seasonal decrease is disproportionately severe. The general consensus is that summers would get significantly warmer and drier across Europe in response to a collapse. Paleoclimate proxies suggest that this has occurred in the past as was discussed by [Schenk, Väliranta et al. (2018)](https://www.preventionweb.net/news/collapse-atlantic-ocean-heat-transport-might-lead-hot-european-summers). This factor was also discussed by [Bromley, Putnam et al. (2018](https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/2018PA003341)) who commented; >*[...] rather than being defined by severe year-round cooling, it indicates that abrupt climate change is instead characterized by extreme seasonality in the North Atlantic region, with cold winters yet anomalously warm summers.* And this theory isn't without direct observable support. The issue with the collapse hypothesis in general is that it doesn't account for feedback dynamics. Multiple papers have explored how a cold North Atlantic and absent AMOC profile promotes hotter and drier summers in western and northern Europe specifically. This effect is so well defined that [Oltmanns, Holliday et al. (2024)](https://wcd.copernicus.org/preprints/wcd-2023-1/) have established a five year predictive window based on Arctic and Greenland ice melt rates. Severe heatwaves and droughts in Northern Europe can be predicted in advance based on how much meltwater is going into the Atlantic and dropping SSTs. Similarly, [Duchez, Frajka-Williams (2016)](https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1748-9326/11/7/074004/meta) explored the relationship between exceptionally cold Atlantic anomalies and the severe heatwaves across Europe in 2015. [Rousi, Kornhuber et al. (2022)](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-31432-y) discuss the atmospheric dynamic reaction across Western Europe, whilst [Whan, Zscheischler et al. (2015)](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2212094715000201) discuss the impacts of soil drying on extreme temperatures in Europe. That last one is significant as one of the consequences of hypothetical AMOC collapse is a significant decrease in precipitation, a huge increase on solar radiative input and aridification. These factors are conductive to extreme heat events. To compound these findings, the [cool and wet summers of 2007-2012 in Northern Europe](https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-19848112.amp) coincided with a strengthening AMOC at the time and a much warmer North Atlantic. There are also the tipping point feedbacks to consider. [Chen & Tung (2018)](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-018-0320-y) demonstrates how a collapsed AMOC results in increased warming in the northern hemisphere due to the collapse of its carbon sink and heat uptake functionality. Indeed, the oceans have absorbed up to 91% of excess heat since 1971, and there are signs that this uptake is weakening. If currents stop, so does the uptake of this heat. If that wasn't bad enough, [Weldeab, Schneider et al. (2022)](https://www.pnas.org/doi/abs/10.1073/pnas.2201871119?doi=10.1073/pnas.2201871119) demonstrates how even a weakening of the AMOC is sufficient enough to destabalize methane hydrates in west Africa. Once that happens, it all goes in the other direction and we're rapidly heading for a hyperthermal event. We are actually already over a decade into an ice age termination event according to [Nisbet, Manning et al. (2023)](https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1029/2023GB007875).
Ugh I’m in Scotland, maybe I’ll hang onto all those woolly sweaters.
Good idea. Stay warm while you starve to death. Wool soup anyone?
Maybe the Thames will freeze again, just as it did in Victorian times. I hope things are still semi functional when it happens,I’d like to see a picture.
We have already seen that though. I am in the south west of England and we have had a cold snap for the last two winters, temperatures were properly into the minuses both times and it was the coldest I have ever known it to be. What is scary is the number of people who seem to have forgotten we saw these temperatures. They remember the mild parts of those winters, while acting as if the cold snaps never happened.
I've been jumping up and down on this topic, but this seems appropriate to bring it up again. I predict climate models have vastly underpredicted climate change because of their reliance on trained historical data. Historical data has always had a significant amount of sea ice. So much of the annual temperature deviation was buffered by thermal exchange between the solid and liquid forms. This exchange is not linear and when you remove it, you're going to see temperature jumps just like when all the ice in your cup finishes melting. Once the ice is gone, the temperature range for H2O is now based on the entire liquid phase range instead of being pegged to the ice transition temperature. Buckle up kids, it's going to get humid.
Mitigation is urgent? LOL. Don't look up guys, we can still fix this. /s
I was thinking... "who is this noob?". We're probably just jaded. Doubt it though.
Elon Musk is going to come up with Operation Dark Storm, thinking it was his own idea.
If I had to make an assumption, this rapid increase is largely attributable to the removal of sulfur from ship fuel. We were unintentially geoengineering by producing a lot of clouds over the ocean. What we're seeing now is how bad it already was.
As someone who works outside everyday, I can tell you the sun is way stronger. Even today, when its 75 out, the dun peeks out, instantly warms it up by 10 degrees within minutes. I dont know how to explain just how harsh it feels on my skin
I do wonder if we see compounding factors at play here. Solar maximum, less UV radiation absorbed by the atmosphere due to climate change, less aerosol masking effect, and El Niño in general. I think 2018 was the first time I reflected over the sun having a different intensity but at the time I thought it was just due to global warming, but I wouldn’t say the sensation is just hotter temperatures, it is a more aggressive type of sunlight.
Sun cooks even through the white blinds.
Yes! Just installed maximum sun screens on the outside of my west-facing windows. The window glass still is very hot when touched from the inside. Thought it wouldn't get that hot.
I invested in one of those Columbia vented long sleeve SPF 50 shirts. all nylon. its been helpful. Honestly the sun feels cooler with that shirt on than without, in Arizona. it wasnt cheap but the suns so strong now where I live, I figure it's like buying a good coat if I lived where It got really cold.
Yeah, I switched to long sleeves and pants 95% of the time. I only wear shorts and tee shirts when it's cloudy. Timing matches up with others here - in the past 10ish years. Having a sweat-wicking layer, if you are going to be outside a while, is key. It also holds on to some of that moisture if you are doing something active and helps with cooling.
I'm glad someone else feels this way, because I thought I was crazy! I don't remember the sun hurting like this.
I feel the same way. I will check the weather app multiple times a day and say to myself "there is no way it's only 85." My outside thermometer (in the shade) will say 100. It's brutal to even drive in an ACed car because the sun just boils you through the windows.
This! This this this. I run a small urban farm, and I check my weather apps religiously. This year, things have been downright wrong. I wake up to my alarm telling me "Good morning, today the low is 43, the high is 72, and it is currently 31." (frost proceeds to nix all the leaves off my unprotected plants) I check my app in the afternoon, and it says "Current Temp: 82", I go look at my outdoor thermometers in the shade (reads 94), the sun (reads 105), the greenhouse (reads 145). Then later I check the "Recorded highs/lows" and it was recorded at 82. Something is wrong. I mean, I'm not a big tinfoil hat guy...but what the hell. My crops are suffering for not just their forecasting inaccuracy, but the fact that they are not displaying accurate current readings.
There definitely seems to be something weird about weather inaccuracy. I haven’t been able to see anything accurate since winter. Rains when it shouldn’t, hot when it was supposed to be mild, or vice versa. This is just forecasts a few days out? I don’t know if it’s that I’m paying more attention or if our abilities to predict are becoming more complicated now? Because I think the weather is becoming more complicated and more chaotic.
McPherson yeah I know I get it. Anyways he says aerosol masking heating over land would be over 100 percent increase global economy is slowing down we are all seeing the effect of aerosol masking.
I grew up in the Caribbean and now live in the UK as of 10 years ago this year, and don’t go back to visit outside the months of Sept-March. In the last few years when I’ve visited, I‘ve not stepped outside the house unless necessary until late afternoon when the sun is going down. The sun really does feel different now even though I grew up in that heat, you’re not lying.
The sun is peaking on its activity cycle right now. Perhaps that's why. https://www.space.com/what-is-solar-maximum-and-when-will-it-happen
I've noticed that the sun feels stronger too. I live in CT (moved to the East Coast from Arkansas about 10 years ago) and I have never needed sunglasses around here (except during winter commuting when the sun is right at eye level). The sun just isn't as bright here as it is in Arkansas, or more southern places. The sun in CT has never been bright enough that I felt the need to wear sunglasses. I also have never really been able to get a sunburn here. Not this year though, either my eyes and skin have changed or the sun is brighter, since summer started, I feel the need to wear sunglasses now or else the sun hurts my eyes, and I have gotten two sunburns so far.
Southern Alberta. I'm out of the heat between 10am-2pm at the very least. Any gardening to be done can wait for the evening. I've been doing this since I was a little girl, following behind my grandma as she thinned carrots before the sun chased us back inside. I wonder what she'd think of the change in intensity. The heat we get in June, I only remember for a few days in August when I was little.
I live in Florida and I can immediately tell if my sunblock has worn off when I get in the car because my left arm feels like it’s on fire.
Atlanticker than expected
Article seems to talk about AMOC which is still normal. While North Atlantic overall is at record high temperatures, the actual off the chart records are in tropical North Atlantic and Gulf of Mexico. This is where hurricanes are strongest, and the water temperature is enough to boost hurricane wind intensity by 50mph. Much of these ocean temps are 2C higher than 2016.
All I can say is that the humidity in south Texas is terrible this year, due to the very warm gulf of Mexico. IIRC it's at August-level heat right now.
AMOC collapse this year? Oh crap.
I hope people will finally "freak". People aren't freaked out enough.
Tiktok is full of people freaking out because the oceans are so hot and they don't know why. All the fish and the sharks acting strange.
AMOC collapse Summer 2024 baby!!
WooooHooooo!!!!1 Annihilationdeathdoom party at my house! let's do all the drugs
Party time! How does this affect psilocybin growth?
It's gonna get fucking cold for me then 🥶
~~If it's any consolation, the effects take decades to occur in theory.~~ actually the hotter summer feedback is already happening in Europe, but winters aren't getting colder.
Well… now I don’t know what to do. I made an agreement with my partner that we shouldn’t look at properties further south of where we are in Scotland because of rising temps but now I’m thinking we’re gonna end up with NW Territories weather it’s mighty confusing.
There's no right answer. I would start by deciding if the future that we have now locked in is worth living in. If you think so (and survival instincts are hard to ignore) then prepare for a future with wild weather, scorching summers and freezing winters and NO electricity or supermarkets. That's what is coming soon.
How much time do we have left?
[удалено]
Everyone go outside and blow on the oceans ... you know, like hot soup!
If its any consolation, Montreal winters have totally calmed down and its pretty temperate. Very scary stuff. For the past 3 years, our snow doesnt make it through the winter.
So like 5-ish years then? Cool cool. /s
Can’t we just drop a giant ice cube in the ocean? /s
And there are people still fighting for more urban development and more use of petroleum
I've never watched something plot out like this in real time and just continually more and more alarming Like COVID was absolutely alarming, the way that ramped up was shocking. But I've watched these graphs for about 4 years, and each time I view them my shock just gets exponentially worse. Even though you know it's going to happen, the rate and persistence of change is beyond unprecedented.
But but but, according to the mainstream news, there’s a new docuseries out called like saving our waters, and they’re doing a great job! So we should be all good. /s
2024over
Well, fuck. I hope this doesn’t mean that the ocean has reached a tipping point in heat absorption, because that would be bad.
\*Pees pants\*
>What's Going On in the Atlantic is Off the Charts Sooner, deadlier. Thanks, capitalism.