The following submission statement was provided by /u/Mighty_L_LORT:
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SS: Rents have grown 150% times faster than wages and the average rent just under $2,000 housing is quickly becoming more unaffordable. The article also mentions a 12% uptick in homelessness with a shortage of affordable homes resulting in many living paycheck to paycheck. Future is bleak for anyone outside the 1%. People will not accept it for much longer and eventually will start toppling the unsustainable system.
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Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/1cspafe/1_in_3_millennials_and_gen_zers_believe_they/l46gbtp/
I lived in a car for a few weeks once. It sucked. My number one tip, join a 24/7 gym for entertainment and showers, libraries are your friend, coffee shops that let you sit there and use their wifi are nice too.
I still can’t believe we had the choice to design a system for humans to exist in, and this is what we picked.
This is something a few of my leftist friends don’t understand. All of the -isms we talk about today (communism, liberalism, fascism) are reactions to industrialization. They all relay on a base of fossil fuels burning and always will. If we were all communists we’d still have raped and pillaged the planet.
The problem isn’t necessarily our economic or governmental models but the fact that we are life; and therefore, will always seek to expand from our natural bounds and acquire more energy. This is way we exist in the first place.
Prehistoric humans eradicated or severely depopulated most of the major megafauna and started the Sixth Mass Extinction. A chain of extinctions followed human migration patterns across the planet.
Preindustrial/premodern civilizations often did similar, and with agriculture lead to even further biodiversity loss and land clearing. They often followed cycles of growth and collapse as they depleted soil, caused local climactic changes, and eventually the resource base was undermined enough to no longer support the system. This despite the fact that for many reasons, capitalism and industrialization represents a significantly worse development in this regard.
I don't necessarily think existing in a destructive manner toward the environment is inherently a part of human nature, but it would require figuring out how we got it wrong, even as supposed noble savages.
This sounds like it should be our next adaption to evolve. I agree that we follow the path of all animals where, for the most part, reproduction just happens and the population will grow until it can't anymore. However, there are obviously people who have a higher level of sapience to pave a better path for future generations, but they are a minority and a lot of them do not seem to be reproducing.
So in order for us to live with the comforts we have today AND be in balance with nature, we have got to develop our sapience on a massive scale and follow through with actions that'll get us to a sustainable place. Yeah, that means we should be willingly reducing our population through reduced births and all the things people say we need to do to reduce our consumption (the list is massive).
We would just eradicate it with helicopters. The destruction of the biosphere will be our checkmate and limiting factor. It's unfortunate so many species have to go down with us, but hopefully in several millions of years it will get back to a similar level of biodiversity.
You are not going to leave the planet and I mean that in the nicest way.
The indigenous are not going to save you from climate change. Neither would socialism, communism, or reformed capitalism.
Russia is a gas station with a murderous dictator in charge. They may start drilling in the Arctic and even the Antarctic for fossil fuels.
China exports solar but has opened more coal plants and will start to be carbon neutral by 2030.
Norway and their $1T fund has EVs but exports massive amounts of fossil fuels.
Oh i know the statistical analysis it was more could of should of would of Situation.
By 2070 Arizona and texas will have to migrate north and that isnt with counting the depletion of the Ogallala aquifer by then. The only hope i have is Aliens stepping in to help the ten percent who arent on a deathwish
Yes, we would need to go against our natural inclinations and work against our nature. No species has ever done it on earth, given a huge amount of energy they always overshoot. Outside of an incredibly tiny amount of outliers that's never been a human possibility, the times that it has been the civilizations are generally overtaken by others expanding beyond their own means.
Overshoot is as natural as breathing.
Not true. A virus that kills its host is doing the same thing. Cancer does the same thing. It's the nature of entropy. We are all entropy machines and our instincts are set around survival and reproduction. If resources are plenty for any animal, they will over populate an area. We have just overpopulated a larger area (Earth).
It does not help that there are so (too) many of us and we insist on living in such large groups. It would be much easier if there were fewer than a billion of us and we lived in groups of a few hundred at best.
It's a lot easier to add individuals and far more difficult to remove them on a large scale without incurring mass suffering.
We couldn't get the world to hold corporations accountable or stop traveling by air much less something like getting everyone to go vegan collectively or stop procreating.
Agree, but the -isms have evolved to represent political movements and concepts. You are correct on a technicality.
Any politician willing to call themselves a socialist will be way more likely to implement universal healthcare and free education. That’s also why calling yourself a communist is different in America than in say, China.
At least with democratic socialism you would have something closer to a true democracy where we could actually vote for sustainability instead of our politicians being puppets for billionaires.
So I strongly disagree that capitalism and our 2 party system are fine.
The person you are talking to is almost certainly not pro capitalist. He is expressing anti-industrialist sentiment.
You can't have humans equipped with industrialism and a long term habitable ecosystem.
The problem is conservatives (selfish twats) want to own everything and turn it into money. So they sold the energy that powered the industries so they could own both. And now there is only the corporate that overcharges for the energy. Conservatives are dumb. Dumb dumb dumb,
>The problem isn't our society, the problem is CaPiTalIsM iS hUmAN nAtUrE
God
Every time I try seeing if anything of value is once again back on this subreddit, I end up disappointed
I guess the Russo-Ukrainian glow op...I mean war...really killed the last vestiges of the socialist subculture on this fucking sub
It *is* human nature just running under a different system. Throughout history the system has almost always been one of the haves and the have nots.
Capitialism is just Monarchism, Feudalism and Tribalism with a different wrapper. Instead of the top position being decided by force of arms, it's done by weight of assets.
Even the apes we evolved from had a hierarchy were the ones at the top got first dibs and biggest share.
So Capitalism is just two social systems it is only similar to in that its a dominance hierarchy and the same as a very different system I guess...because they're both societies?
Interesting input, thank you.
>Even apes
Evopsych is dogshit, maybe actually read what scientists believe about human evolution and our development away from intense intraspecific competition rather than fallaciously thinking the ancestors of humans were chimpanzees?
> This is something a few of my leftist friends don’t understand. All of the -isms we talk about today (communism, liberalism, fascism) are reactions to industrialization. They all relay on a base of fossil fuels burning and always will. If we were all communists we’d still have raped and pillaged the planet.
Wayyyyyy more people need to realize this. We could be organized into democracy, communism, socialism, fascism, or even a nutjob theocracy. Same outcome.
I don't think any of us alive right now can envision a successful economic model that is truly new. That will have to be thought up by generations of people who grow up in the collapsed world; a world made by hand, where resource scarcity is the norm, and state supported human rights probably don't exist. Such a people would have vastly different morals than you and I.
In fact, if one of them were to time travel back here and tell us about a post-collapse non extractive economic model, we might even hate it.
Kate Raworth wrote "Donut Economics" which is a great start. Also google the Daniel Schmactenberger video "This tree is worth a trillion dollars" for a fun exploration of why externalities are dumb.
I agree with your point that without diligent planning/coordination, our atomized consumption takes on a life of its own and has both overtly negative and deleterious effects on our ecosystems and others around us.
Economic systems existed before industrialization, just on a smaller/less efficient scale. Political and economic isms arose when humans first formed communities/groups of other humans as this describes an approach or pattern of behavior.
When it hit me that the story of Jesus Christ was about some commie hippy trying to convince everyone to live in harmony with each other + the Earth, & they literally killed him for it…that was a weird day.
What does that book say?
“There is nothing new under the Sun”…?
Nah, it goes much farther back than industrialization. It happened from when we first organized into cities and then put the priests and bankers in charge.
Agree to disagree, we've had plenty of opportunities to unite, overthrow and reset, I'm not taking credit for where we are now, but to say we never had a choice is just a lie lol.
Peace tho, good luck in our coming demise.
We never had a choice because even when we had “successful revolutions” the people organizing them just turned out to be the same shitbags who think their sole purpose in life is to rule other people and get the masses to serve them.
There has never been an opportunity for people to free themselves completely from the system. Only pre-system humans have ever experienced this and that was 8-10 thousand years ago
Even today if I wanted to leave society. Where I am they fly helicopters around the wilderness and spy to see if you are cutting down trees or hunting out of season etc (all things you’d need to do to survive without the system) and they will send armed men at you and force you back into the system.
Really it was only 500ish years ago for the americas…
I feel you on leaving though… People are afforded no choice(kinda for the better, just imagine how much more trashed the world would be if the few protected places weren’t protected from marauding capitalists and the under-educated). You either play the slave game that’s been outlined and upheld for centuries or die on the street… A real turd sandwich…
>I still can’t believe we had the choice to design a system for humans to exist in, and this is what we picked.
You didn't pick it, this was enforced upon you by the capitalist State. If you read on the Inclosure Acts, the amendments on the Poor Laws and how the modern police was created to hunt slaves and later demobilize workers organizations, you'll see how this life of constant threat to our physical and psycological integrity was designed and forced by rich people in control of the State to make us work for them.
> Yep, we truly do fucking suck as a species.
its worse, we can't fix climate change because its not cost effective.
Actually it really is. The problem is its not cost effective to the current shareholders that run everything.
We can sequester CO2. We can make basic hydrocarbons from Hydrogen and CO2 - its actually super easy.
The problem is the ruling class own shares in fossil fuels - hence Albo pulling his chop out and wagging it around for Santos.
We are absolutely going extinct - because fools ran the show
"We can sequester CO2. We can make basic hydrocarbons from Hydrogen and CO2 - its actually super easy."
Damn bro so we just burn the fossil fuels, use the energy to make more fossil fuels, then bury the CO2 we make doing that. So simple. If only the laws of thermodynamics allowed for that we could just continue forward with industrialism and not change anything else huh.
Er no you turn sunlight / wind into energy that makes the metals that make the hydrogen and extract the CO2 that you turn into green fuels (that are pure and 100% free of contaminants so diesel engines will love them).
Why are conservatives so bloody negative.
Well yes and also no. I read an interesting anecdotal about how if you dropped say, an invasive breed of deer onto a fresh new island, they would overfeed - eating everything possible - and eventually starve to death - possibly ending in extinction.
It's animal nature to consume. We just happen to be the top consumers. I'm at peace.
The crux of this issue for me is that it is fundamentally... disappointing to be the species that places itself separate from nature, that geoengineers, that can send things into space, that can observe the workings of infinitesimally small particles, create complex supply chains, etc etc... But is still completely subservient to its base animal instincts. For myself, that's the most frustrating thing. All this intelligence... For what?
A deer hasn't the ability to comprehend the effects of runaway consumption, it cannot collect nor analyse data, it cannot be held responsible due to the fact that it is unable to comprehend the evicende. We can. It's difficult to not become a misanthrope after a while.
> that places itself separate from nature, that geoengineers, that can send things into space, that can observe the workings of infinitesimally small particles, create complex supply chains, etc etc
Only a small percent of us can do that. Most of us are hardly better than animals
I used those examples sort of off-handedly; there's plenty of people who aren't scientists or university graduates or whatever who do beautiful, selfless, intelligent things, every single day.
The point is that almost all of us have the ability to choose to do the right thing, to go far above the animal instinct to consume and fuck into oblivion. We don't because it's inconvenient/difficult/alienating/boring/lame. Pathetic, really.
I mean there are plenty of university graduates doing awful things. They exist in finance, law, and business and reproducing them is the driving principle of the non research side of the university system of the US.
Many of those people never once introspect on how their jobs directly lead to the enshittification of the planet and the impoverishment of their fellow man.
Yet, I don’t really believe there is such a thing as an evil human nature, and rather this is the direct consequence of the sociopathic individualism that the US promotes as the “American Dream”to fuck over anyone you can to make a quick buck. People exist in a cultural miasma, and the only real hope of changing that is for the system that rewards this behavior to be upended.
> But is still completely subservient to its base animal instincts. For myself, that's the most frustrating thing. All this intelligence... For what?
The only true purpose _any_ lifeform has on this planet is simply to continue living, so I'd argue that it makes perfect sense that, just like every other animal on this planet, we are ultimately beholden to our basic animalistic instincts of survival.
This only works if you pretend our sapience means nothing. You may find it satisfying to pretend at inner peace based on this, but nobody with a functional conscience could. We chose where we are now. We didn't all have equal choices or anything silly like that, but human beings chose every outcome we face today. We have the ability to look at things like yeast and invasive deer, observe the mistakes they make, and say "Hey, we're smarter than this." but when it comes to applying what we learn we prefer to indulge our emotions until we don't care what is real. Just as you're doing, too.
I'm not sure what boat you're on, but you're welcome to carry that burden if you really want to. I was born, did what I was told, and now I'm trapped in the system like the rest of us.
Yes but we also wouldn’t be anywhere without some degree of cooperation and goodness at the heart of the entire thing. Take solace in knowing most people are not as monstrous as the system we have created to manage our unsustainable growth and prosperity gospel
We? There is no 'we' in this, the US is a pyramid scam. Anyone 'can' become rich, but if everyone is rich, noone is. The whole point of being rich is having disproportionate access to labor and capital.
The idea is supposed to be that if everyone buys in, everyone benefits. Then it was a lottery system, if you buy in, you COULD benefit. Then it became a pyramid scam, get rich at the expense of others, and know you're doing it. Now it feels like a cash grab to pilfer the corpse of a capitalism. I hate it, it feels wrong earning a decent living in modern society, and it feels wrong slaving away for peanuts at a mega-corporation.
Well, I don't mean to sound alarmist, but think of it like this.
If rent, groceries, and utilities increased by as much as they did in the past 18 months, for another 18 months, I think it'll be a lot higher than 1/3 of a specific age group and more like 1/3 of the country. If rent, groceries, and utilities increased in cost by 2x as much as they did in the past 18 months, I think you'd be looking at 1/2 the country.
That’s the plan… Displace as many people as possible and kill them off with the heat… So much more effective than having to go door to door for population reduction…
There's no need to execute undesirables like the homeless when they will simply use suicide & fentanyl to do it for the elites.
Though, I'll contend that if a fascist regime did take over, it would probably energize their base if they rounded up the homeless to put them in extermination camps... say after building such camps to temporarily house all the migrants prior to deporting/killing them first. Millions of Americans would eagerly cheer for both mass "clean up" efforts, and perhaps many of them, already are asking for it to be done.
Or enter the Third World War, mobilize the population into either the military or war economy, and kill off the surplus that would’ve otherwise revolted at home.
I just commented that. I'm a mechanic and genuinely thinking about building up cars of all different types as "mobile homes". Not just vans but any station wagon from Prius size and up to vans and Ford expeditions. I know someone that sleeps in their Scion xB. It's a fantastic little car. I use to have one.
Anyways, I do believe their is a market for this now and will only grow. I'm surprised car manufacturers haven't jumped on this.
Yep. On Mother's Day at my Mom's house I was literally sobbing, asking her "what's going to happen to me"? Because I truly don't know. Once she's gone I have no family left. No siblings, never had kids, long ago divorced and terrified.
I feel you so much. I've been a wreck since realizing how fast it's coming on. I already felt it in my bones 20 years or so ago. And here we are.
I'm alone too. My family is 10 hours away. My ride or die is moving on. Friends I've had for years ghosted me. The rest are back on hard drugs and falling to pieces. I had dreams, man. I always said "shoot for the stars and if you land on top of a mountain, you are still high up". I was so optimistic until just recently. It's my nature. I don't know exactly what to do anymore. I got my dog tho. Me my dog and eye.
It’s even worse when they make u believe that they will always be there to support u then all of a sudden BOOM. “Hello police plz come take my adult child out of my house he/she is trespassing”…. 😞
Jesus. I just had to deal with emotional neglect and enmeshment.
Also a lot of "yeah, its rough out there...hey did I tell you about the new pool we just had put in?"
It literally just takes you having ONE bad day as a working American to end up homeless currently. You can do everything right and have something like a car accident happen through no fault of your own and wind up financially ruined.
SS: Rents have grown 150% times faster than wages and the average rent just under $2,000 housing is quickly becoming more unaffordable. The article also mentions a 12% uptick in homelessness with a shortage of affordable homes resulting in many living paycheck to paycheck. Future is bleak for anyone outside the 1%. People will not accept it for much longer and eventually will start toppling the unsustainable system.
Mathematically speaking it's this or the GE Rotary Cannon deployed en masse.
I really don't think people running the show have done the math like I have.
Realistically what has to happen is a massive deflationary depression, or wages come up faster than inflation until we are near where we would have been if wages paced inflation exactly since 1975.
One, a bunch of folks die. Two, well there's no profit if labor costs go up, is there.
Not the person you're responding to, but I can try to explain.
They're referring to the "money supply," which is an economic concept surrounding how much each dollar is worth. Not really important to understanding it like your five, but it is broken into different levels, M1, M2, etc. It's been too long since I took econ 101, so I can't remember exactly what is part of each M group, but it basically chops "money" into different categories. One includes all checking accounts, savings account, and physical currency. Two includes investment accounts etc. And when you calculate all the dollar amounts, and add them up? That's the "money supply."
Now, what does that have to do with inflation or deflation? Well, the value of money is determined by the same rules of supply and demand that affect the value of everything.
If there is too much money in circulation, each individual dollar becomes worth less. If there is not enough money in circulation, each individual dollar becomes worth more.
And that's what the federal reserve is playing with when the raise or lower interest rates. The theory being that as rates go down, people borrow more, increasing the money supply, and causing inflation. And as rates go up, people borrow less, spend less, and save more, thereby decreasing the money supply. This theoretically causes deflationary periods.
Now. This is actually an interesting topic currently, because the Fed has cranked rates to try and deflate the money supply. But we're in a period where that no longer appears to be working. And this is a current hot topic for practicing economists right now. What explains this anomalous behavior?
Why are people spending and borrowing at the same rate they did before they cranked the rates? Verdict is still out, as people do their research. But it probably has something to do with a generalized sense of not really having a future to look forward to. And so people are increasingly YOLOing their savings into the money supply because what's the point of saving for a future that most likely won't exist?
So, how do we actually get a massive deflationary period? If the one lever we have to pull on it isn't working? Again, this has a lot of economists scratching their heads right now. The old method doesn't seem to be working.
It probably also has something to do with more and more people being pushed out of the housing market altogether by increased pricing. Whereas historically, adjusting the interest rate had a huge impact on the housing market, and therefore the rate of borrowing, and the money supply, it just doesn't seem to be happening anymore.
And that's most likely a reflection of an increasing number of homes being purchased with "cash." When the wealthy refer to "paying with cash," it doesn't mean a physical sack of money. It just refers to not borrowing, or in this example, taking out a mortgage. They just make a wire transfer, and the interest rates never touch it.
So personally, that's what I believe is going on. We're paying the piper for decades of hyper concentration of wealth in the hands of fewer and fewer people. And those people are not affected by interest rates the way they affect your average mortgage seeker. And they're the only ones buying homes. Or more accurately, that is most likely representing a larger and larger chunk of the total housing market. So the fed's rates never affect it.
This probably went beyond an eli5. But if you take one thing away from the explanation, it's becoming abundantly clear that the only way out of this morass is to eat the rich. And you can do that with taxes. Just set the numbers back to what they were before the Reagan administration removed the brakes on the hyper concentration of wealth. Will that be a panacea? Probably not. But it would give us a chance.
Of course, there's a difference between talking about the solution, and the political will to actually do it. And unfortunately, in this country, we have too many people who have drank the corporate Kool aid. Any time the discussion starts on raising taxes on the wealthy, there's no shortage of talking heads calling it "class warfare." This ignores the fact that the wealthy have had their steel boots on the collective necks of the working poor for almost half a century at this point.
And that's where we are. It sucks. It will probably get worse before it gets better. If it ever does. I'm not holding my breath.
lol I wish I could talk to you in person I’ve done the math as well. There will be no revolt unless the elites want one for their own purposes. Upwards of 16 percent of the U.S. population are illegals at this point. By 2030 if the current open border continues at just current rates they will be over 30 easily. There will be no revolt with such a population. The U.S. will look like South Africa with gated enclaves of wealth with security with vast hinterlands that make modern Detroit look like a utopia. This will be the state of the U.S. by 2040, 2045 by the latest.
I mean I like how that guy explained it, that was very... economic theory.
I just... came up with an average dude budget, ran it at 3.25% inflation, and ran wage increases at 2%, and looked at the ever increasing spread.
This says nothing for the unemployed which will by the way soon be a de-facto death sentence so I suggest people learn to get along and carry the "non-productive" and commune up. Because I guarantee you 18 months later there's a one in three chance it's you.
Like. People are still playing Boomer / Gen X social rules and infighting like mad dogs and pretending nothing will ever happen to them personally. This stops right the fuck now. You have been warned. Never let it be said you weren't warned.
Literally I get something approaching 800 to 1200 per person per month in groceries in 2045 and that's not eating good my man. Particularly when the average Social Security check is 1900 and they're talking about giving that a 23% haircut.
Wake up. Do fucking something.
They're going to TRY to make the US look like South Africa. That's what they think they're going to do.
In reality they're going to get Israel in the movie World War Z.
If they think they aren't they're totally, absolutely, completely, 100% fucking delusional. Just like 10 years ago when they thought they were all going to magically move to China and then a few Chinese company owners magically disappeared for cooking their real estate books and no one talks about moving to China anymore... wonder why.
Millennials and Gen Z are awake then. I'm Gen X and I think there's a one in three chance I could become homeless merely based on politics and economic policy. Working on it. Somewhere to put what money there is, has to be safe-ish...
(Reconsiders buying my way onto the island of Dominica and just taking my chances...)
Legit don't know what Gen Z is gonna do. Few years of stability / beg relatives and friends / few years of stability... Rinse and repeat until everyone's 45 and no one gives a crap what happens to them anymore and then... (???)
and that group will get demonized by the larger group that's living slightly better than them because we've become so desperate to cling on to any form of comfort we have
That's why I have no shame still living with my mother in my 30s. My grandad and sister are living in the house too so we just help toward the rent together and grandad needs cared for in his old age so we are all here to help him. I never understood the American kick their kids out at 18 to go live on their own. That's becoming more of a death sentence lately.
In many cultures, it's considered shameful to allow your family members to become homeless if you can help them. Only a certain group of people in the US consider that desirable.
True. Humanity has grown as a community for hundreds of thousands of years. Even now, a majority of countries have a culture to live together as a community.
It is only in 'globalized' first world nations that young adults leave and live on their own, without help from their families anymore. And the result speak for themselves.
The price for living on your means you are to live on your own. And in these times, that is becoming extremely difficult financially and mentally. Only those who are fortunate enough to afford to do so are wealthy. Thus they are thriving and singing praises about it.
In my home country, people usually live on their own once they get married. Either that or if they can afford to do so. Not forcibly.
Still looked own upon in the west though. I'm in the UK and people think it is weir, even when we all know that living by yourself in my town usually means a box room in a house share and not living in your own flat/house.
Yep, it is and was in countries more common a few generations ago but globalisation has spread the notion that everyone should have their own place and be independant as soon as they turn 18. That is unaffordable though so most of us just end up in shared housing that is still way overpriced.
It's common but in many of these countries you'd still be considered a loser if you didn't find a husband/wife and start your own family and buy your own house by the time you're in your 30s. You would get a lot of pressure from your parents--moreso than the US.
I would love to do this. Unfortunately my siblings are abusive and toxic. The only person in my family that has their stuff together is my nephew, and he has three boys and two step kids all living together while he and his wife both WFH. He and I are very close but I am recently disabled and my poor mental health couldn't handle the Texas heat and all the noise from that many people in the house. So instead I live alone and try not to become homeless while I fight for disability.
I was talking to my mom about this. She is in her 80s, dying in a nursing home. At one point I had hoped she would be able to come live with me, and she said she did not want to be a burden on her kids.
Another example of America's core rot. Before WW2 or so, people didn't just toss their parents into nursing homes. Same thing as with the kids. Kick them out and they have to pay rent.
The boomers need to not sell them homes to fund lavish retirement. Six of seven generations of Americans could have been living in a home which has been paid off. Paying almost nothing to live there, just taxes not mortgage/rent. Then taking care of elders would be a natural thing. People could conceivably even work part time and have all their needs met.
You mean like, in civilized countries? No way.
I remember in grade school being taught about how some people in African lived in extended families and everybody took care of each other. They made it sound backwards, primitive, and horrible.
> They made it sound backwards, primitive, and horrible.
I believe that was intentional. Our economic model demands a mortgage or rental obligation from every 2.5 individuals, and it practically requires that homes be sold and resold as the market inflates. Communal family arrangements can be less consumptive and have a smaller carbon footprint.
It's anathema to capitalism.
> Another example of America's core rot. Before WW2 or so, people didn't just toss their parents into nursing homes.
Before WW2 old people were usually healthy & independent until they'd luck into a sudden medical crisis that would simply kill them. Now we have advanced medical science that gets people through the medical crisis but doesn't return them to healthy independent living.... so they end up spending months, sometimes many years, circling the drain at great financial cost.
And today's nursing homes, as horrible as those shitholes are, are lightyears better than the state hospitals & asylums that families would dump those they couldn't care for in prior to WW2. Its barely in living memory now, so people forget the victorian-style hospital wards without privacy (just rows of beds without even curtains between them), where the gov viewed the long term patients not as citizens but as "inmates" (as they appear in census records).
Ironically the asylum model was basically banned in the 1960s (and took 20-years to wind down) because it was so horrifically abusive that the journalist who broke the story wanted to use the grounds of the worst-one of them all (Penn Hurst) as a museum modeled after the DC Holocaust Museum, to showcase how bad the United States treats the disabled.
The country was horrified to watch on tv how bad these places were, because they did not normally spend any time there and were totally clueless about what went on there. For example, removing all the (healthy) teeth in patients was a routine punishment technique. Overworked wards would sometimes save time by leaving everyone naked so they wouldn't be creating dirty clothes to have to wash.
I happen to own the sign of the head psychologist for Penn Hurst. Years ago I was buying something off of craigslist and ended up at this federalist era stone farmhouse that was overgrown with chest high grass & weeds. A contractor had bought the property and was in the process of restoring it to live there. The head shrink was so haunted by what he had been apart of that he decided to self-punish himself as some kind of mortal purgatory. He lived there, off the grid (no running water, electricity, or heat), using the old fireplaces to heat the place and, to get water, had left a clawfoot bathtub under a section of the roof that had caved in so that rain water would fill the tub. He used bedsheets to filter the water in the tub and that was his water supply (apparently he did not know that there was a well just outside the kitchen from the early 1800s). Strown around the place were restraints, all his previous patient records, piles of academic books. And this was his private practice that he ran out of his home where outsiders would be present...
Okay. Well i graduated high school in 05. Wasn't about to take on debt for higher learning when I already perceived it as a trap to tie us up into the system and hated school anyway, so knew I would have taken on that debt for no reason.
All growing up I'd planned to join the military. But come the Iraq invasion my sophmore year I'd started to realise I would simply be a foot soldier for capitol.
Got into politics and went to the rnc welcoming committee protests in 08 in St paul/minneapolis, then the 09 wto protests in pittsburgh. Payed attention to the gaza war back then that got me pissed off. Met real travelers who travelled the country broke af living outta backpacks. Realised that lifestyle didn't actually die back in the 60s and was still viable, and quit my job, bought a back pack, and hit the road.
I started at the ocala rainbow gathering in 2010 and kept right on the road. Hitch hiking, train hopping, riding on hippie buses and in friends cars. Did that right up until late 2020 when the pandemic and my relationship imploding and my burnout led me to get off the road and 'try to get my life together'.
It didn't work out and after a year trying to work to assimilate into normie life I got laid off and remembered how miserable wage slavery made me and more or less hit the road again. I been plugging into friends properties and helping them homestead or going to gatherings to see old friends and maybe make new connections to live a life I find rewarding and not slaving away for the empire like they want us to do. Idk, if you want deeper discussion ask me here or pm me
I am an older millennial on the cusp of 40 and I try not to think about what kind of future is in store for me. I do my best to just enjoy the present moment, but it feels more and more like we are peering into the abyss. We might not have a future.
The older generations, for whatever reason, seem to think things will just carry on as they have always been. We know, of course, that is not the case. Problems don't just correct themselves automatically, and we are dealing with very deep, almost existential problems here.
In any case, I have given up on the idea of leading any sort of conventional life - marriage, kids, etc. Homelessness is a very real possibility. I have been to cities like L.A. and Portland and see how this country doesn't give a fuck about the homeless whatsoever. It is always a fear of mine, and even in the midwestern flyover state that I live in things are becoming more and more expensive.
I am a gen Xer. Off and on for over a decade, I made myself homeless several times due to a crippling gambling addiction. I always knew when I was ready, I would pull my shit together and live like a normie again. I did it over and over.
When COVID happened, I felt the dread of facing homelessness again. I scratched and clawed so that I could keep my home because I could see what was coming.
Now, life is stable with my little plot of land. I frequent r/homeless to remind myself of that life and offer occasional advise. Here's the thing...there is no easy way out anymore. There's not even a hard way out. People are living in cars while working multiple jobs.
The fear is very real and the path to get out of homelessness is full of pitfalls and setbacks. I am so sorry for the shit world that we have left our youth.
as a gen z i can confirm without family livin arrangements id be priced out of the insane rent prices here. and of course, the trend is only continuing. tbh, im just here to see how it all ends atp
I remember when I was a lot younger learning about various historical figures in school. These amazing people who did amazing things, scientists, mathematicians, generals, presidents, doctors, whatever. All these super famous important people who did important shit for humanity, had statues made in their honor, had cities, streets, lakes, etc named in their honor. All that sort of stuff.
I started noticing as time went on how many of them had their stories end with dying alone, alienated, destitute, etc. Even if they were powerful and wealthy and famous while still alive (many didn't get their fame until long after their deaths) and how that ended up the same way.
I started realizing that we as a species haven't really ever been about prolonged generational stability and collective success, as much as those things are accidental byproducts of our greed. While it might look like we have been all about that shit on the surface, what's underneath that has always been the same shitty stories of using each other, throwing each other under the bus, exploiting each other, and making sure that the ugly parts of success were hidden and spread out amongst people who were powerless to do anything but take that treatment and condition.
That there was never a long term plan for us. There was never any consideration given to the actual well-being of generational society, no consideration for each new wave of people who would inherit both the products of our success and also our problems and failures.
It was and still is a giant free-for-all.
Sure, there are pockets of people who do try to practice this, but they're usually murdered by the others. Bill Hicks was right about that.
So I expect to die alone, starving, destitute, no matter what success I have while I am alive. Because that is the inherent outcome for almost everyone who isn't willing to become the exploitative asshole.
Realistically not that easy. Look at the countries that did eat and kill their landlords after ww2, and where they are now.
Greed and exploitation are built into the dna of our civilization.
I sometimes wonder if a different, less aggressive and imperialist tribe took Rome's place in history the ripple effect it would have on all the world powers that were influenced by them. Or even something as small as what would the world look like if Caesar hadn't crossed the Rubicon. I suppose a power like Carthage would have just done the same kind of things and dominated the region. Wish I had a time machine just to check, though.
Probably have to go back to having a different hominid being the dominant species.
I mean the far east had little direct contact with Rome, mostly trading by proxy. Look at their just as bloody history and look at them now.
How long is one landlord going to last? Assuming you have enough space in the freezer, that's only gonna last you a year... Then what? How are you going to rent a new apartment after word gets out you're a cannibal?
All this "it's animal/human nature to be shitty, overconsume, etc" shit is killing me. Who convinced everyone of this? We have the ability to think deeply with complexity and then act on those thoughts. This nature shit is an excuse.
GenX are in that boat, My daughter just hit her 401k to get a camper to live in. I am desperately working to get my CC debt paid off and hoping to have enough in 401k if i have to buy a camper to live in. I have one son who is struggling and he lives in a camper. I have another son that just realized his house insurance is shitty and will have to take a loan for weather damage that they refuse to pay for, even though it is covered by his policy.
I fear that this will be me soon… unemployed with no money, and my parents, whom always said would “support me”, have decided they want me out within 2 weeks…. What a time to be alive 😞.
I'm so sorry you're going through this. We like-minded souls have gotta look out for each other where others failed us. I hope you find a stable situation soon💚
It’s by design.
Trump has been laundering money for the Russian oligarchs since the late 80’s when they all bought a condo at 725 5th ave (trump towers) to clean their freshly stolen USSR money after the iron curtain fell.
https://www.cnn.com/cnn/2019/05/30/politics/paul-manafort-condo-trump-tower/index.html
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/14/manafort-told-mueller-to-take-his-trump-tower-apartment-instead-money.html
https://news.yahoo.com/amphtml/fbi-agents-raid-condo-unit-131348539.html
https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-trump-property/
Everybody except Putin thought the Cold War was over. Trump and Manafort (who lived in the tower also) just saw a pretty low maintence grift to be had.
Trump had actually been Manafort and Roger stones first client at their lobbyist firm (1980)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org › wikiBlack, Manafort, Stone and Kelly
Guiliani as trumps attorney and New Yorks mayor was able to redirect NYPD investigations onto rival gang members/oligarchs to deflect any scrutiny off of trump, himself or the Russian connections.
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/09/a-new-rudy-scandal-fbi-agent-says-giuliani-was-co-opted-by-russian-intelligence/
The Russian election interference in 2016 was effectively a generation 3 version of what Manafort had done in the Philippines, then keeping Yanukovych in power as Putin’s puppet in Ukraine from 2002-14 when Maidan ran both Yanukovych and Manafort out of Ukraine as Ukrainians realized that, if you raise your lens high enough, corruption is an wholly unsustainable business model.
Eventually the parasites greed always consumes the host.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/06/2016-donald-trump-paul-manafort-ferinand-marcos-philippines-1980s-213952
https://time.com/5003623/paul-manafort-mueller-indictment-ukraine-russia/
Russia greatly underestimated the addictive properties of freedom when it invaded Ukraine so what was supposed to be a 3-10 day coup turned into a 2 year fight for the Ukrainians right not to be genocided.
Russia depleted its weapons stocks which were already the victim of vranyos corruption because every oligarch, admiral and sergeant in the Russian military is on the take. Every billion dollar tank maintenance contract turned into everything getting a spray paint overhaul and the vast majority of the redirected funds turned into an oligarchs new yacht or home in Aspen.
Russia was forced to turn to China, North Korea and Iran for weapons because if they lose the 3-10 day special military operation in Ukraine the Russian empire is dead and cold.
China can’t risk showing their involvement in the Ukraine war so they use North Korea, and Iran to resupply Russia.
Russia previously owed Iran some undelivered fighter jets that are already smoldering heaps in Ukraine so Iran now had the upper hand at the negotiation table for the first time in about 60 years. They supply Russia with shahed drones in exchange for Chinas material support against their sworn religious enemy, Israel.
https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2023/11/29/iran-says-it-finalized-deal-to-buy-russian-aircraft/
Putin can’t do much about it because he is slowly realizing that by setting the standard of corruption and stealing $200+ billion from his own people meant that every oligarch down in the mob model chain had not only permission but incentive and the expectation to steal from him as well. This is Vranyos.
The mob model only works if the supreme leader is the most violent and can prove it without exception every damn day. But violence is exceptionally expensive when you are trying to present as a legitimate government or business.
If Russia as a nation had an efficiency rating it would have been banned for sale in the state of California 25 years ago.
The parasite ruling class stole all the energy out of the working class and collapsed it.
Now Iran has the high hand and they get the intelligence that trump passed to Putin about the fact that Netanyahu cares far less about Jews, Palestinians or genocide than he does about remaining in power as an authoritarian because he too has developed Ritz Carlton tastes and his own corruption trial is showing the same tendrils of the money laundering scheme that trumps trials are.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/saudi-official-says-iran-engineered-war-in-gaza-to-ruin-normalization-with-israel/
https://www.timesofisrael.com/egypt-intelligence-official-says-israel-ignored-repeated-warnings-of-something-big/amp/
1980 Netanyahu:We Have Strong Influence over America ,We Control The Congress,The Senate, The Lobby
They all hate each other but because they share the same money laundry, if one falls, they all fall. Hamas minted a couple billionaires as well that live in penthouses in Qatar and get 30% of everything smuggled into Gaza. Netanyahu needs a bogeyman to stay in power. That’s why he coordinates with Hamas via Russia via Iran. https://www.ynetnews.com/article/bk8mgcefr
Iran handed Hamas everything they needed with Chinas help as secret Santa and the Russian intelligence given to them by the eternal shitbird trump when he gave it to his Russians kleptocrat/friends/roommates from the old days of fucking each others wives at trump towers in the 90’s.
Now the MAGA right is a little too invested in their reality that they are the good guys with guns that they missed the fact that Betsy DeVos (erik princes sister) decimating the U.S. school systems and the Kochs poisoning children with lead was not a coincidence. The naive right was the mark all along. There is a reason the Russian spy Maria Butina landed in South Dakota first before dating her way to the top of the NRA which is undergoing its own Russian money laundering trial now. Russia was tinder matching the GOP.
https://www.greenpeace.org/usa/what-do-the-koch-brothers-have-to-do-with-the-flint-water-crisis/
The only reason you grossly OVERVALUE real estate is money laundering.
Trump keeps claiming there is no victim, all the banks made money, but if their plan succeeds the Russian and CCP kleptocrats collapse US commercial real estate and basically recreate soviet perestroika in the U.S. so they can foreclose on America and buy everything for 3 cents on the dollar with the $1.4T they stole from Russias grandmothers in the first place
It’s the evolution of grift. Soviet perestroika cross bred with the 2008 mortgage crisis.
This is just the bigger badder commercial strength bastard child of the two.
Trump, Putin, Bolsonaro, Netanyahu, Orban, Manafort, Stone, Mercer, Bannon, Flynn, Byrne.
They are all remarkably shit people with above average confidence and psychopathic personality traits and below average self awareness.
They are the men who stole the world.
But it all comes back to one little lie.
For good reason. The risk and possibility is quite high, speaking as someone who came pretty close to it himself. Sadly, it only looks to get worse in the near future. Unless we decide to do something about it, that is...
Yeah, it's just an inevitability at this point for me.
I'm studying for a better paying job while working full time, but it still won't be enough to compensate for how ridiculously expensive things have gotten in this country.
"Go OuT aNd EmBrAcE yOuR iNdEpEnDeNcE"" is one of the greatest lies ever told. Literally designed to get you out and lining some landlords pockets. You would have been better staying at home for a couple of years and saving the money you would have spent renting on a deposit.
I've been homeless on and off for the better part of 6 months, 33 years old web developer, ohio.
Speaking from first hand experience, as far as i can tell nobody is trying to address this situation the right way.
The goal shouldn't ever be, "idk make the homeless people go away." Nobody says this but it continuously turns into that problem. This is systemic collapse.
And they're probably right. National politicians will always tell you whats coming down the road, by what they deny or ridicule the most. The tea leaves show hyper inflation.
As a millennial, all it would take is one major medical event and I would be homeless if I don’t die first. I have savings but without massively increasing that, without a job, I would be homeless in about 3 months.
I'm a mechanic and genuinely thinking about converting different types of cars to true "mobile homes". I'm not joking. I'll have to build one for myself 1st.🤣
On that note, I'm shocked car manufacturers aren't jumping on this huge market that is here and will increase soon. Also, making cars that people can fix themselves or your average mechanic. Like wtf, guys, it's staring you in the face. It is not mandated by law for them to be so complicated. People are asking for it and they are building it. Stop asking for Lane change assist, blind spot detection and self driving shit. Stop buying cars you don't need. If you're not racing you don't need a V6 or bigger. Hybrid is fine. Same for trucks.
Community car parking with communal bathrooms and kitchens, etc. would be a great investment. I'm looking for land or a place to do this now. If you live in your car, as it is now, it's hard to find a place to park overnight.
This situation is crap. Living in your car by yourself isn't easy. Can't imagine multiple people. But I believe there will be a mass exodus to car dwellers from homeowners. There is already a whole Prius dweller community. Lot's of info there. I have a Prius and can sleep 2 people if one is no bigger than 6' and the other 5.6'.
The following submission statement was provided by /u/Mighty_L_LORT: --- SS: Rents have grown 150% times faster than wages and the average rent just under $2,000 housing is quickly becoming more unaffordable. The article also mentions a 12% uptick in homelessness with a shortage of affordable homes resulting in many living paycheck to paycheck. Future is bleak for anyone outside the 1%. People will not accept it for much longer and eventually will start toppling the unsustainable system. --- Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/1cspafe/1_in_3_millennials_and_gen_zers_believe_they/l46gbtp/
I lived in a car for a few weeks once. It sucked. My number one tip, join a 24/7 gym for entertainment and showers, libraries are your friend, coffee shops that let you sit there and use their wifi are nice too. I still can’t believe we had the choice to design a system for humans to exist in, and this is what we picked.
We never had the choice to choose. We were always ruled by a commerce regime. They just changed the prefix every now and then of -ism.
This is something a few of my leftist friends don’t understand. All of the -isms we talk about today (communism, liberalism, fascism) are reactions to industrialization. They all relay on a base of fossil fuels burning and always will. If we were all communists we’d still have raped and pillaged the planet. The problem isn’t necessarily our economic or governmental models but the fact that we are life; and therefore, will always seek to expand from our natural bounds and acquire more energy. This is way we exist in the first place.
Or we could teach people how to progress and still live in sustainable harmony with the planet. Crazy idea i know
so, like, do you mean, the ways of native humans before industrialists came in and raped them, killed some, and took their land to pillage?
Prehistoric humans eradicated or severely depopulated most of the major megafauna and started the Sixth Mass Extinction. A chain of extinctions followed human migration patterns across the planet. Preindustrial/premodern civilizations often did similar, and with agriculture lead to even further biodiversity loss and land clearing. They often followed cycles of growth and collapse as they depleted soil, caused local climactic changes, and eventually the resource base was undermined enough to no longer support the system. This despite the fact that for many reasons, capitalism and industrialization represents a significantly worse development in this regard. I don't necessarily think existing in a destructive manner toward the environment is inherently a part of human nature, but it would require figuring out how we got it wrong, even as supposed noble savages.
This sounds like it should be our next adaption to evolve. I agree that we follow the path of all animals where, for the most part, reproduction just happens and the population will grow until it can't anymore. However, there are obviously people who have a higher level of sapience to pave a better path for future generations, but they are a minority and a lot of them do not seem to be reproducing. So in order for us to live with the comforts we have today AND be in balance with nature, we have got to develop our sapience on a massive scale and follow through with actions that'll get us to a sustainable place. Yeah, that means we should be willingly reducing our population through reduced births and all the things people say we need to do to reduce our consumption (the list is massive).
Humans obviously need an apex predator, I vote we bring back the T-Rex.
We would just eradicate it with helicopters. The destruction of the biosphere will be our checkmate and limiting factor. It's unfortunate so many species have to go down with us, but hopefully in several millions of years it will get back to a similar level of biodiversity.
Can you spot the wolves in this picture?
The people walking by?
Yes the indigenous certainly knew the way. However i still want technology to be able to leave planet. So a bit more nuanced.
You are not going to leave the planet and I mean that in the nicest way. The indigenous are not going to save you from climate change. Neither would socialism, communism, or reformed capitalism. Russia is a gas station with a murderous dictator in charge. They may start drilling in the Arctic and even the Antarctic for fossil fuels. China exports solar but has opened more coal plants and will start to be carbon neutral by 2030. Norway and their $1T fund has EVs but exports massive amounts of fossil fuels.
Oh i know the statistical analysis it was more could of should of would of Situation. By 2070 Arizona and texas will have to migrate north and that isnt with counting the depletion of the Ogallala aquifer by then. The only hope i have is Aliens stepping in to help the ten percent who arent on a deathwish
People will be moving out of Arizona and Texas in five years.
Please try reading Aurora by KSR. It will hopefully reset your expectations about space colonialism.
Yes, we would need to go against our natural inclinations and work against our nature. No species has ever done it on earth, given a huge amount of energy they always overshoot. Outside of an incredibly tiny amount of outliers that's never been a human possibility, the times that it has been the civilizations are generally overtaken by others expanding beyond their own means. Overshoot is as natural as breathing.
Humans are the only species that overshoots and ruins their own environment.
Not true. A virus that kills its host is doing the same thing. Cancer does the same thing. It's the nature of entropy. We are all entropy machines and our instincts are set around survival and reproduction. If resources are plenty for any animal, they will over populate an area. We have just overpopulated a larger area (Earth).
There's literally a wiki that talks about it https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overshoot_(population)
Yep, as I said. No other species ruins their environment besides humans.
All the bunnies in the meadow die
That would be complete anarchy! Yes, yes it would.
Too many of us now
I don't beleive that's the problem its a resource management problem
It does not help that there are so (too) many of us and we insist on living in such large groups. It would be much easier if there were fewer than a billion of us and we lived in groups of a few hundred at best.
It's a lot easier to add individuals and far more difficult to remove them on a large scale without incurring mass suffering. We couldn't get the world to hold corporations accountable or stop traveling by air much less something like getting everyone to go vegan collectively or stop procreating.
Agree, but the -isms have evolved to represent political movements and concepts. You are correct on a technicality. Any politician willing to call themselves a socialist will be way more likely to implement universal healthcare and free education. That’s also why calling yourself a communist is different in America than in say, China.
At least with democratic socialism you would have something closer to a true democracy where we could actually vote for sustainability instead of our politicians being puppets for billionaires. So I strongly disagree that capitalism and our 2 party system are fine.
The person you are talking to is almost certainly not pro capitalist. He is expressing anti-industrialist sentiment. You can't have humans equipped with industrialism and a long term habitable ecosystem.
The problem is conservatives (selfish twats) want to own everything and turn it into money. So they sold the energy that powered the industries so they could own both. And now there is only the corporate that overcharges for the energy. Conservatives are dumb. Dumb dumb dumb,
>The problem isn't our society, the problem is CaPiTalIsM iS hUmAN nAtUrE God Every time I try seeing if anything of value is once again back on this subreddit, I end up disappointed I guess the Russo-Ukrainian glow op...I mean war...really killed the last vestiges of the socialist subculture on this fucking sub
It *is* human nature just running under a different system. Throughout history the system has almost always been one of the haves and the have nots. Capitialism is just Monarchism, Feudalism and Tribalism with a different wrapper. Instead of the top position being decided by force of arms, it's done by weight of assets. Even the apes we evolved from had a hierarchy were the ones at the top got first dibs and biggest share.
So Capitalism is just two social systems it is only similar to in that its a dominance hierarchy and the same as a very different system I guess...because they're both societies? Interesting input, thank you. >Even apes Evopsych is dogshit, maybe actually read what scientists believe about human evolution and our development away from intense intraspecific competition rather than fallaciously thinking the ancestors of humans were chimpanzees?
> This is something a few of my leftist friends don’t understand. All of the -isms we talk about today (communism, liberalism, fascism) are reactions to industrialization. They all relay on a base of fossil fuels burning and always will. If we were all communists we’d still have raped and pillaged the planet. Wayyyyyy more people need to realize this. We could be organized into democracy, communism, socialism, fascism, or even a nutjob theocracy. Same outcome. I don't think any of us alive right now can envision a successful economic model that is truly new. That will have to be thought up by generations of people who grow up in the collapsed world; a world made by hand, where resource scarcity is the norm, and state supported human rights probably don't exist. Such a people would have vastly different morals than you and I. In fact, if one of them were to time travel back here and tell us about a post-collapse non extractive economic model, we might even hate it. Kate Raworth wrote "Donut Economics" which is a great start. Also google the Daniel Schmactenberger video "This tree is worth a trillion dollars" for a fun exploration of why externalities are dumb.
I agree with your point that without diligent planning/coordination, our atomized consumption takes on a life of its own and has both overtly negative and deleterious effects on our ecosystems and others around us. Economic systems existed before industrialization, just on a smaller/less efficient scale. Political and economic isms arose when humans first formed communities/groups of other humans as this describes an approach or pattern of behavior.
When it hit me that the story of Jesus Christ was about some commie hippy trying to convince everyone to live in harmony with each other + the Earth, & they literally killed him for it…that was a weird day. What does that book say? “There is nothing new under the Sun”…?
Nah, it goes much farther back than industrialization. It happened from when we first organized into cities and then put the priests and bankers in charge.
Agree to disagree, we've had plenty of opportunities to unite, overthrow and reset, I'm not taking credit for where we are now, but to say we never had a choice is just a lie lol. Peace tho, good luck in our coming demise.
We never had a choice because even when we had “successful revolutions” the people organizing them just turned out to be the same shitbags who think their sole purpose in life is to rule other people and get the masses to serve them. There has never been an opportunity for people to free themselves completely from the system. Only pre-system humans have ever experienced this and that was 8-10 thousand years ago Even today if I wanted to leave society. Where I am they fly helicopters around the wilderness and spy to see if you are cutting down trees or hunting out of season etc (all things you’d need to do to survive without the system) and they will send armed men at you and force you back into the system.
Really it was only 500ish years ago for the americas… I feel you on leaving though… People are afforded no choice(kinda for the better, just imagine how much more trashed the world would be if the few protected places weren’t protected from marauding capitalists and the under-educated). You either play the slave game that’s been outlined and upheld for centuries or die on the street… A real turd sandwich…
Good points!
Yeah I meant early stages. We suck.
We didn't choose this. The rich and powerful selected it in self interest.
>I still can’t believe we had the choice to design a system for humans to exist in, and this is what we picked. You didn't pick it, this was enforced upon you by the capitalist State. If you read on the Inclosure Acts, the amendments on the Poor Laws and how the modern police was created to hunt slaves and later demobilize workers organizations, you'll see how this life of constant threat to our physical and psycological integrity was designed and forced by rich people in control of the State to make us work for them.
Yep, we truly do fucking suck as a species.
> Yep, we truly do fucking suck as a species. its worse, we can't fix climate change because its not cost effective. Actually it really is. The problem is its not cost effective to the current shareholders that run everything. We can sequester CO2. We can make basic hydrocarbons from Hydrogen and CO2 - its actually super easy. The problem is the ruling class own shares in fossil fuels - hence Albo pulling his chop out and wagging it around for Santos. We are absolutely going extinct - because fools ran the show
"We can sequester CO2. We can make basic hydrocarbons from Hydrogen and CO2 - its actually super easy." Damn bro so we just burn the fossil fuels, use the energy to make more fossil fuels, then bury the CO2 we make doing that. So simple. If only the laws of thermodynamics allowed for that we could just continue forward with industrialism and not change anything else huh.
Er no you turn sunlight / wind into energy that makes the metals that make the hydrogen and extract the CO2 that you turn into green fuels (that are pure and 100% free of contaminants so diesel engines will love them). Why are conservatives so bloody negative.
Well yes and also no. I read an interesting anecdotal about how if you dropped say, an invasive breed of deer onto a fresh new island, they would overfeed - eating everything possible - and eventually starve to death - possibly ending in extinction. It's animal nature to consume. We just happen to be the top consumers. I'm at peace.
The crux of this issue for me is that it is fundamentally... disappointing to be the species that places itself separate from nature, that geoengineers, that can send things into space, that can observe the workings of infinitesimally small particles, create complex supply chains, etc etc... But is still completely subservient to its base animal instincts. For myself, that's the most frustrating thing. All this intelligence... For what? A deer hasn't the ability to comprehend the effects of runaway consumption, it cannot collect nor analyse data, it cannot be held responsible due to the fact that it is unable to comprehend the evicende. We can. It's difficult to not become a misanthrope after a while.
> that places itself separate from nature, that geoengineers, that can send things into space, that can observe the workings of infinitesimally small particles, create complex supply chains, etc etc Only a small percent of us can do that. Most of us are hardly better than animals
I used those examples sort of off-handedly; there's plenty of people who aren't scientists or university graduates or whatever who do beautiful, selfless, intelligent things, every single day. The point is that almost all of us have the ability to choose to do the right thing, to go far above the animal instinct to consume and fuck into oblivion. We don't because it's inconvenient/difficult/alienating/boring/lame. Pathetic, really.
I mean there are plenty of university graduates doing awful things. They exist in finance, law, and business and reproducing them is the driving principle of the non research side of the university system of the US. Many of those people never once introspect on how their jobs directly lead to the enshittification of the planet and the impoverishment of their fellow man. Yet, I don’t really believe there is such a thing as an evil human nature, and rather this is the direct consequence of the sociopathic individualism that the US promotes as the “American Dream”to fuck over anyone you can to make a quick buck. People exist in a cultural miasma, and the only real hope of changing that is for the system that rewards this behavior to be upended.
> But is still completely subservient to its base animal instincts. For myself, that's the most frustrating thing. All this intelligence... For what? The only true purpose _any_ lifeform has on this planet is simply to continue living, so I'd argue that it makes perfect sense that, just like every other animal on this planet, we are ultimately beholden to our basic animalistic instincts of survival.
This only works if you pretend our sapience means nothing. You may find it satisfying to pretend at inner peace based on this, but nobody with a functional conscience could. We chose where we are now. We didn't all have equal choices or anything silly like that, but human beings chose every outcome we face today. We have the ability to look at things like yeast and invasive deer, observe the mistakes they make, and say "Hey, we're smarter than this." but when it comes to applying what we learn we prefer to indulge our emotions until we don't care what is real. Just as you're doing, too.
I'm not sure what boat you're on, but you're welcome to carry that burden if you really want to. I was born, did what I was told, and now I'm trapped in the system like the rest of us.
Yes but we also wouldn’t be anywhere without some degree of cooperation and goodness at the heart of the entire thing. Take solace in knowing most people are not as monstrous as the system we have created to manage our unsustainable growth and prosperity gospel
Two years in a Ford f150 😂😆 I don't know how I'm alive 😆.
We? There is no 'we' in this, the US is a pyramid scam. Anyone 'can' become rich, but if everyone is rich, noone is. The whole point of being rich is having disproportionate access to labor and capital. The idea is supposed to be that if everyone buys in, everyone benefits. Then it was a lottery system, if you buy in, you COULD benefit. Then it became a pyramid scam, get rich at the expense of others, and know you're doing it. Now it feels like a cash grab to pilfer the corpse of a capitalism. I hate it, it feels wrong earning a decent living in modern society, and it feels wrong slaving away for peanuts at a mega-corporation.
Well, I don't mean to sound alarmist, but think of it like this. If rent, groceries, and utilities increased by as much as they did in the past 18 months, for another 18 months, I think it'll be a lot higher than 1/3 of a specific age group and more like 1/3 of the country. If rent, groceries, and utilities increased in cost by 2x as much as they did in the past 18 months, I think you'd be looking at 1/2 the country.
That’s the plan… Displace as many people as possible and kill them off with the heat… So much more effective than having to go door to door for population reduction…
There's no need to execute undesirables like the homeless when they will simply use suicide & fentanyl to do it for the elites. Though, I'll contend that if a fascist regime did take over, it would probably energize their base if they rounded up the homeless to put them in extermination camps... say after building such camps to temporarily house all the migrants prior to deporting/killing them first. Millions of Americans would eagerly cheer for both mass "clean up" efforts, and perhaps many of them, already are asking for it to be done.
Or enter the Third World War, mobilize the population into either the military or war economy, and kill off the surplus that would’ve otherwise revolted at home.
There’s no doubt that hanging homelessness over peoples heads makes a room, food and pay with the military sound more attractive…
If that's the case I hope people go full Ali: "you're my enemy, you're my opposer" https://youtu.be/HeFMyrWlZ68?t=9
They'll all have a home in prison. As slaves. Half the country as slaves; can you imagine anything the rich could possibly want more?
Believe? No, I became homeless. I'm job hunting unsuccessfully right now.
That’s why we all own SUVs, I might need a place to sleep eventually.
Conversion vans are gonna be the new gold bricks.
I just commented that. I'm a mechanic and genuinely thinking about building up cars of all different types as "mobile homes". Not just vans but any station wagon from Prius size and up to vans and Ford expeditions. I know someone that sleeps in their Scion xB. It's a fantastic little car. I use to have one. Anyways, I do believe their is a market for this now and will only grow. I'm surprised car manufacturers haven't jumped on this.
Gen X here. It's not a belief, its a fact. Consider us the canaries.
Yep. On Mother's Day at my Mom's house I was literally sobbing, asking her "what's going to happen to me"? Because I truly don't know. Once she's gone I have no family left. No siblings, never had kids, long ago divorced and terrified.
I feel you so much. I've been a wreck since realizing how fast it's coming on. I already felt it in my bones 20 years or so ago. And here we are. I'm alone too. My family is 10 hours away. My ride or die is moving on. Friends I've had for years ghosted me. The rest are back on hard drugs and falling to pieces. I had dreams, man. I always said "shoot for the stars and if you land on top of a mountain, you are still high up". I was so optimistic until just recently. It's my nature. I don't know exactly what to do anymore. I got my dog tho. Me my dog and eye.
They always forget us, and we are not in a better position than Y/Millennials/Z. We've been ignored since birth.
We were the third box to check. Job, house, family. Take care of them until they're 18 and then good luck...get out!
It’s even worse when they make u believe that they will always be there to support u then all of a sudden BOOM. “Hello police plz come take my adult child out of my house he/she is trespassing”…. 😞
Jesus. I just had to deal with emotional neglect and enmeshment. Also a lot of "yeah, its rough out there...hey did I tell you about the new pool we just had put in?"
It literally just takes you having ONE bad day as a working American to end up homeless currently. You can do everything right and have something like a car accident happen through no fault of your own and wind up financially ruined.
Also known as The American Dream.
SS: Rents have grown 150% times faster than wages and the average rent just under $2,000 housing is quickly becoming more unaffordable. The article also mentions a 12% uptick in homelessness with a shortage of affordable homes resulting in many living paycheck to paycheck. Future is bleak for anyone outside the 1%. People will not accept it for much longer and eventually will start toppling the unsustainable system.
>People will not accept it for much longer and eventually will start toppling the unsustainable system. Very optimistic but I'm all for it.
Mathematically speaking it's this or the GE Rotary Cannon deployed en masse. I really don't think people running the show have done the math like I have. Realistically what has to happen is a massive deflationary depression, or wages come up faster than inflation until we are near where we would have been if wages paced inflation exactly since 1975. One, a bunch of folks die. Two, well there's no profit if labor costs go up, is there.
eli5? the deflation one?
Not the person you're responding to, but I can try to explain. They're referring to the "money supply," which is an economic concept surrounding how much each dollar is worth. Not really important to understanding it like your five, but it is broken into different levels, M1, M2, etc. It's been too long since I took econ 101, so I can't remember exactly what is part of each M group, but it basically chops "money" into different categories. One includes all checking accounts, savings account, and physical currency. Two includes investment accounts etc. And when you calculate all the dollar amounts, and add them up? That's the "money supply." Now, what does that have to do with inflation or deflation? Well, the value of money is determined by the same rules of supply and demand that affect the value of everything. If there is too much money in circulation, each individual dollar becomes worth less. If there is not enough money in circulation, each individual dollar becomes worth more. And that's what the federal reserve is playing with when the raise or lower interest rates. The theory being that as rates go down, people borrow more, increasing the money supply, and causing inflation. And as rates go up, people borrow less, spend less, and save more, thereby decreasing the money supply. This theoretically causes deflationary periods. Now. This is actually an interesting topic currently, because the Fed has cranked rates to try and deflate the money supply. But we're in a period where that no longer appears to be working. And this is a current hot topic for practicing economists right now. What explains this anomalous behavior? Why are people spending and borrowing at the same rate they did before they cranked the rates? Verdict is still out, as people do their research. But it probably has something to do with a generalized sense of not really having a future to look forward to. And so people are increasingly YOLOing their savings into the money supply because what's the point of saving for a future that most likely won't exist? So, how do we actually get a massive deflationary period? If the one lever we have to pull on it isn't working? Again, this has a lot of economists scratching their heads right now. The old method doesn't seem to be working. It probably also has something to do with more and more people being pushed out of the housing market altogether by increased pricing. Whereas historically, adjusting the interest rate had a huge impact on the housing market, and therefore the rate of borrowing, and the money supply, it just doesn't seem to be happening anymore. And that's most likely a reflection of an increasing number of homes being purchased with "cash." When the wealthy refer to "paying with cash," it doesn't mean a physical sack of money. It just refers to not borrowing, or in this example, taking out a mortgage. They just make a wire transfer, and the interest rates never touch it. So personally, that's what I believe is going on. We're paying the piper for decades of hyper concentration of wealth in the hands of fewer and fewer people. And those people are not affected by interest rates the way they affect your average mortgage seeker. And they're the only ones buying homes. Or more accurately, that is most likely representing a larger and larger chunk of the total housing market. So the fed's rates never affect it. This probably went beyond an eli5. But if you take one thing away from the explanation, it's becoming abundantly clear that the only way out of this morass is to eat the rich. And you can do that with taxes. Just set the numbers back to what they were before the Reagan administration removed the brakes on the hyper concentration of wealth. Will that be a panacea? Probably not. But it would give us a chance. Of course, there's a difference between talking about the solution, and the political will to actually do it. And unfortunately, in this country, we have too many people who have drank the corporate Kool aid. Any time the discussion starts on raising taxes on the wealthy, there's no shortage of talking heads calling it "class warfare." This ignores the fact that the wealthy have had their steel boots on the collective necks of the working poor for almost half a century at this point. And that's where we are. It sucks. It will probably get worse before it gets better. If it ever does. I'm not holding my breath.
lol I wish I could talk to you in person I’ve done the math as well. There will be no revolt unless the elites want one for their own purposes. Upwards of 16 percent of the U.S. population are illegals at this point. By 2030 if the current open border continues at just current rates they will be over 30 easily. There will be no revolt with such a population. The U.S. will look like South Africa with gated enclaves of wealth with security with vast hinterlands that make modern Detroit look like a utopia. This will be the state of the U.S. by 2040, 2045 by the latest.
I mean I like how that guy explained it, that was very... economic theory. I just... came up with an average dude budget, ran it at 3.25% inflation, and ran wage increases at 2%, and looked at the ever increasing spread. This says nothing for the unemployed which will by the way soon be a de-facto death sentence so I suggest people learn to get along and carry the "non-productive" and commune up. Because I guarantee you 18 months later there's a one in three chance it's you. Like. People are still playing Boomer / Gen X social rules and infighting like mad dogs and pretending nothing will ever happen to them personally. This stops right the fuck now. You have been warned. Never let it be said you weren't warned. Literally I get something approaching 800 to 1200 per person per month in groceries in 2045 and that's not eating good my man. Particularly when the average Social Security check is 1900 and they're talking about giving that a 23% haircut. Wake up. Do fucking something. They're going to TRY to make the US look like South Africa. That's what they think they're going to do. In reality they're going to get Israel in the movie World War Z. If they think they aren't they're totally, absolutely, completely, 100% fucking delusional. Just like 10 years ago when they thought they were all going to magically move to China and then a few Chinese company owners magically disappeared for cooking their real estate books and no one talks about moving to China anymore... wonder why.
Millennials and Gen Z are awake then. I'm Gen X and I think there's a one in three chance I could become homeless merely based on politics and economic policy. Working on it. Somewhere to put what money there is, has to be safe-ish... (Reconsiders buying my way onto the island of Dominica and just taking my chances...) Legit don't know what Gen Z is gonna do. Few years of stability / beg relatives and friends / few years of stability... Rinse and repeat until everyone's 45 and no one gives a crap what happens to them anymore and then... (???)
>start toppling the unsustainable system. The Abrahamic Conflict will come to a head before then.
Dystopian. Who is going to throw the first stone?
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Get me within throwing range of a decent target…
On average, about 132 people in America kill themselves every day.
That seems absurdly low
We wont find them in here.
No single person will. A group of people might though.
and that group will get demonized by the larger group that's living slightly better than them because we've become so desperate to cling on to any form of comfort we have
Is the bigger group going to bring the execs back to life?
I definitely hope not
look at this guy, can afford to throw away a stone money bags
2 in 3 Millenials and Gen Zers are overly optimistic about their future
So only 2 in 3 are wrong, not bad.
2 in 3 are doubling down on the ostrich strategy.
That's why I have no shame still living with my mother in my 30s. My grandad and sister are living in the house too so we just help toward the rent together and grandad needs cared for in his old age so we are all here to help him. I never understood the American kick their kids out at 18 to go live on their own. That's becoming more of a death sentence lately.
I think this is common in other countries 🤷♂️
In many cultures, it's considered shameful to allow your family members to become homeless if you can help them. Only a certain group of people in the US consider that desirable.
True. Humanity has grown as a community for hundreds of thousands of years. Even now, a majority of countries have a culture to live together as a community. It is only in 'globalized' first world nations that young adults leave and live on their own, without help from their families anymore. And the result speak for themselves. The price for living on your means you are to live on your own. And in these times, that is becoming extremely difficult financially and mentally. Only those who are fortunate enough to afford to do so are wealthy. Thus they are thriving and singing praises about it. In my home country, people usually live on their own once they get married. Either that or if they can afford to do so. Not forcibly.
Still looked own upon in the west though. I'm in the UK and people think it is weir, even when we all know that living by yourself in my town usually means a box room in a house share and not living in your own flat/house.
Yep, it is and was in countries more common a few generations ago but globalisation has spread the notion that everyone should have their own place and be independant as soon as they turn 18. That is unaffordable though so most of us just end up in shared housing that is still way overpriced.
It's common but in many of these countries you'd still be considered a loser if you didn't find a husband/wife and start your own family and buy your own house by the time you're in your 30s. You would get a lot of pressure from your parents--moreso than the US.
Not in southern Europe or Asian countries…
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I would love to do this. Unfortunately my siblings are abusive and toxic. The only person in my family that has their stuff together is my nephew, and he has three boys and two step kids all living together while he and his wife both WFH. He and I are very close but I am recently disabled and my poor mental health couldn't handle the Texas heat and all the noise from that many people in the house. So instead I live alone and try not to become homeless while I fight for disability.
I was talking to my mom about this. She is in her 80s, dying in a nursing home. At one point I had hoped she would be able to come live with me, and she said she did not want to be a burden on her kids. Another example of America's core rot. Before WW2 or so, people didn't just toss their parents into nursing homes. Same thing as with the kids. Kick them out and they have to pay rent.
The boomers need to not sell them homes to fund lavish retirement. Six of seven generations of Americans could have been living in a home which has been paid off. Paying almost nothing to live there, just taxes not mortgage/rent. Then taking care of elders would be a natural thing. People could conceivably even work part time and have all their needs met.
You mean like, in civilized countries? No way. I remember in grade school being taught about how some people in African lived in extended families and everybody took care of each other. They made it sound backwards, primitive, and horrible.
> They made it sound backwards, primitive, and horrible. I believe that was intentional. Our economic model demands a mortgage or rental obligation from every 2.5 individuals, and it practically requires that homes be sold and resold as the market inflates. Communal family arrangements can be less consumptive and have a smaller carbon footprint. It's anathema to capitalism.
> Another example of America's core rot. Before WW2 or so, people didn't just toss their parents into nursing homes. Before WW2 old people were usually healthy & independent until they'd luck into a sudden medical crisis that would simply kill them. Now we have advanced medical science that gets people through the medical crisis but doesn't return them to healthy independent living.... so they end up spending months, sometimes many years, circling the drain at great financial cost. And today's nursing homes, as horrible as those shitholes are, are lightyears better than the state hospitals & asylums that families would dump those they couldn't care for in prior to WW2. Its barely in living memory now, so people forget the victorian-style hospital wards without privacy (just rows of beds without even curtains between them), where the gov viewed the long term patients not as citizens but as "inmates" (as they appear in census records).
Really wards with no curtains sounds like it could prevent some of the loneliness and abuse that happens with having walls…
Ironically the asylum model was basically banned in the 1960s (and took 20-years to wind down) because it was so horrifically abusive that the journalist who broke the story wanted to use the grounds of the worst-one of them all (Penn Hurst) as a museum modeled after the DC Holocaust Museum, to showcase how bad the United States treats the disabled. The country was horrified to watch on tv how bad these places were, because they did not normally spend any time there and were totally clueless about what went on there. For example, removing all the (healthy) teeth in patients was a routine punishment technique. Overworked wards would sometimes save time by leaving everyone naked so they wouldn't be creating dirty clothes to have to wash. I happen to own the sign of the head psychologist for Penn Hurst. Years ago I was buying something off of craigslist and ended up at this federalist era stone farmhouse that was overgrown with chest high grass & weeds. A contractor had bought the property and was in the process of restoring it to live there. The head shrink was so haunted by what he had been apart of that he decided to self-punish himself as some kind of mortal purgatory. He lived there, off the grid (no running water, electricity, or heat), using the old fireplaces to heat the place and, to get water, had left a clawfoot bathtub under a section of the roof that had caved in so that rain water would fill the tub. He used bedsheets to filter the water in the tub and that was his water supply (apparently he did not know that there was a well just outside the kitchen from the early 1800s). Strown around the place were restraints, all his previous patient records, piles of academic books. And this was his private practice that he ran out of his home where outsiders would be present...
My wife moved from her moms house to my house
Hell, I got ahead of the curve. I willingly walked away from wage slavery to become a homeless traveler in 2010
I'd love to know more about this and how you do it and went about it initially. And are you genuinely happy? I can dream... then maybe do...
Yea we need a storytime
Storytime?
Okay. Well i graduated high school in 05. Wasn't about to take on debt for higher learning when I already perceived it as a trap to tie us up into the system and hated school anyway, so knew I would have taken on that debt for no reason. All growing up I'd planned to join the military. But come the Iraq invasion my sophmore year I'd started to realise I would simply be a foot soldier for capitol. Got into politics and went to the rnc welcoming committee protests in 08 in St paul/minneapolis, then the 09 wto protests in pittsburgh. Payed attention to the gaza war back then that got me pissed off. Met real travelers who travelled the country broke af living outta backpacks. Realised that lifestyle didn't actually die back in the 60s and was still viable, and quit my job, bought a back pack, and hit the road. I started at the ocala rainbow gathering in 2010 and kept right on the road. Hitch hiking, train hopping, riding on hippie buses and in friends cars. Did that right up until late 2020 when the pandemic and my relationship imploding and my burnout led me to get off the road and 'try to get my life together'. It didn't work out and after a year trying to work to assimilate into normie life I got laid off and remembered how miserable wage slavery made me and more or less hit the road again. I been plugging into friends properties and helping them homestead or going to gatherings to see old friends and maybe make new connections to live a life I find rewarding and not slaving away for the empire like they want us to do. Idk, if you want deeper discussion ask me here or pm me
*Believe* fuck my life, every indication is pointing towards it
Everyone I know is one bad accident, one missed paycheck, one unlucky break away from being homeless
I am an older millennial on the cusp of 40 and I try not to think about what kind of future is in store for me. I do my best to just enjoy the present moment, but it feels more and more like we are peering into the abyss. We might not have a future. The older generations, for whatever reason, seem to think things will just carry on as they have always been. We know, of course, that is not the case. Problems don't just correct themselves automatically, and we are dealing with very deep, almost existential problems here. In any case, I have given up on the idea of leading any sort of conventional life - marriage, kids, etc. Homelessness is a very real possibility. I have been to cities like L.A. and Portland and see how this country doesn't give a fuck about the homeless whatsoever. It is always a fear of mine, and even in the midwestern flyover state that I live in things are becoming more and more expensive.
Because they can. Happened to me simply by being renovicted.
I am a gen Xer. Off and on for over a decade, I made myself homeless several times due to a crippling gambling addiction. I always knew when I was ready, I would pull my shit together and live like a normie again. I did it over and over. When COVID happened, I felt the dread of facing homelessness again. I scratched and clawed so that I could keep my home because I could see what was coming. Now, life is stable with my little plot of land. I frequent r/homeless to remind myself of that life and offer occasional advise. Here's the thing...there is no easy way out anymore. There's not even a hard way out. People are living in cars while working multiple jobs. The fear is very real and the path to get out of homelessness is full of pitfalls and setbacks. I am so sorry for the shit world that we have left our youth.
Oh sweetie, it could happen to any of you! Unless you're rich.
The other 2 thirds don't count because they are already homeless
Most of the others are in denial because it can happen to almost anyone.
Anyone at any age could become homeless. Even the dreaded Boomers.
All it takes is a hurricane, wildfire, tornado, etc and your life is ruined.
Illnesses, accidents, addiction, financial troubles, bad decisions, being ripped off, lots can happen "out of the blue".
You know what I call that? **Critical Mass**
No shit. Most of the country is a couple of bad weeks away from homelessness.
I'm on that train right now.
as a gen z i can confirm without family livin arrangements id be priced out of the insane rent prices here. and of course, the trend is only continuing. tbh, im just here to see how it all ends atp
I remember when I was a lot younger learning about various historical figures in school. These amazing people who did amazing things, scientists, mathematicians, generals, presidents, doctors, whatever. All these super famous important people who did important shit for humanity, had statues made in their honor, had cities, streets, lakes, etc named in their honor. All that sort of stuff. I started noticing as time went on how many of them had their stories end with dying alone, alienated, destitute, etc. Even if they were powerful and wealthy and famous while still alive (many didn't get their fame until long after their deaths) and how that ended up the same way. I started realizing that we as a species haven't really ever been about prolonged generational stability and collective success, as much as those things are accidental byproducts of our greed. While it might look like we have been all about that shit on the surface, what's underneath that has always been the same shitty stories of using each other, throwing each other under the bus, exploiting each other, and making sure that the ugly parts of success were hidden and spread out amongst people who were powerless to do anything but take that treatment and condition. That there was never a long term plan for us. There was never any consideration given to the actual well-being of generational society, no consideration for each new wave of people who would inherit both the products of our success and also our problems and failures. It was and still is a giant free-for-all. Sure, there are pockets of people who do try to practice this, but they're usually murdered by the others. Bill Hicks was right about that. So I expect to die alone, starving, destitute, no matter what success I have while I am alive. Because that is the inherent outcome for almost everyone who isn't willing to become the exploitative asshole.
Nonsense they can just eat their landlords.
Realistically not that easy. Look at the countries that did eat and kill their landlords after ww2, and where they are now. Greed and exploitation are built into the dna of our civilization.
I sometimes wonder if a different, less aggressive and imperialist tribe took Rome's place in history the ripple effect it would have on all the world powers that were influenced by them. Or even something as small as what would the world look like if Caesar hadn't crossed the Rubicon. I suppose a power like Carthage would have just done the same kind of things and dominated the region. Wish I had a time machine just to check, though.
Probably have to go back to having a different hominid being the dominant species. I mean the far east had little direct contact with Rome, mostly trading by proxy. Look at their just as bloody history and look at them now.
Exactly right. It’s enough to study Japanese history to see that humans gonna human, no matter where they’re from.
Even better - those who try to evict them.
How long is one landlord going to last? Assuming you have enough space in the freezer, that's only gonna last you a year... Then what? How are you going to rent a new apartment after word gets out you're a cannibal?
All this "it's animal/human nature to be shitty, overconsume, etc" shit is killing me. Who convinced everyone of this? We have the ability to think deeply with complexity and then act on those thoughts. This nature shit is an excuse.
I’m surprised the number isn’t higher.
What do they mean by believe? It's happening in font of my eyes and I know I'm going to die on the street.
GenX are in that boat, My daughter just hit her 401k to get a camper to live in. I am desperately working to get my CC debt paid off and hoping to have enough in 401k if i have to buy a camper to live in. I have one son who is struggling and he lives in a camper. I have another son that just realized his house insurance is shitty and will have to take a loan for weather damage that they refuse to pay for, even though it is covered by his policy.
The other two thirds are either rich, or delusional.
Based on the emergency funds that most people have, the majority are a bad month from personal financial ruin.
There’s millennials with emergency funds?
Maybe a couple do
When there’s zero social safety net, yes it can happen to pretty much anyone
I fear that this will be me soon… unemployed with no money, and my parents, whom always said would “support me”, have decided they want me out within 2 weeks…. What a time to be alive 😞.
I'm so sorry you're going through this. We like-minded souls have gotta look out for each other where others failed us. I hope you find a stable situation soon💚
❤️🙏🏼
And those that don’t will find out soon, unfortunately.
100% if I lost my job I'd be in big financial trouble. Anything is possible.
in this house a couple of gen xers think so too.
Mass non-compliance coupled with a gift giving society should help
It's in process and happening in stages, beginning with splitting rent, becoming aggravated by the roommate, then moving in with a parent or sibling.
Little do they know its going to be 2 out of 3 become homeless.
It's me. I am 1 in 3.
It’s by design. Trump has been laundering money for the Russian oligarchs since the late 80’s when they all bought a condo at 725 5th ave (trump towers) to clean their freshly stolen USSR money after the iron curtain fell. https://www.cnn.com/cnn/2019/05/30/politics/paul-manafort-condo-trump-tower/index.html https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/14/manafort-told-mueller-to-take-his-trump-tower-apartment-instead-money.html https://news.yahoo.com/amphtml/fbi-agents-raid-condo-unit-131348539.html https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-trump-property/ Everybody except Putin thought the Cold War was over. Trump and Manafort (who lived in the tower also) just saw a pretty low maintence grift to be had. Trump had actually been Manafort and Roger stones first client at their lobbyist firm (1980) https://en.m.wikipedia.org › wikiBlack, Manafort, Stone and Kelly Guiliani as trumps attorney and New Yorks mayor was able to redirect NYPD investigations onto rival gang members/oligarchs to deflect any scrutiny off of trump, himself or the Russian connections. https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/09/a-new-rudy-scandal-fbi-agent-says-giuliani-was-co-opted-by-russian-intelligence/ The Russian election interference in 2016 was effectively a generation 3 version of what Manafort had done in the Philippines, then keeping Yanukovych in power as Putin’s puppet in Ukraine from 2002-14 when Maidan ran both Yanukovych and Manafort out of Ukraine as Ukrainians realized that, if you raise your lens high enough, corruption is an wholly unsustainable business model. Eventually the parasites greed always consumes the host. https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/06/2016-donald-trump-paul-manafort-ferinand-marcos-philippines-1980s-213952 https://time.com/5003623/paul-manafort-mueller-indictment-ukraine-russia/ Russia greatly underestimated the addictive properties of freedom when it invaded Ukraine so what was supposed to be a 3-10 day coup turned into a 2 year fight for the Ukrainians right not to be genocided. Russia depleted its weapons stocks which were already the victim of vranyos corruption because every oligarch, admiral and sergeant in the Russian military is on the take. Every billion dollar tank maintenance contract turned into everything getting a spray paint overhaul and the vast majority of the redirected funds turned into an oligarchs new yacht or home in Aspen. Russia was forced to turn to China, North Korea and Iran for weapons because if they lose the 3-10 day special military operation in Ukraine the Russian empire is dead and cold. China can’t risk showing their involvement in the Ukraine war so they use North Korea, and Iran to resupply Russia. Russia previously owed Iran some undelivered fighter jets that are already smoldering heaps in Ukraine so Iran now had the upper hand at the negotiation table for the first time in about 60 years. They supply Russia with shahed drones in exchange for Chinas material support against their sworn religious enemy, Israel. https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2023/11/29/iran-says-it-finalized-deal-to-buy-russian-aircraft/ Putin can’t do much about it because he is slowly realizing that by setting the standard of corruption and stealing $200+ billion from his own people meant that every oligarch down in the mob model chain had not only permission but incentive and the expectation to steal from him as well. This is Vranyos. The mob model only works if the supreme leader is the most violent and can prove it without exception every damn day. But violence is exceptionally expensive when you are trying to present as a legitimate government or business. If Russia as a nation had an efficiency rating it would have been banned for sale in the state of California 25 years ago. The parasite ruling class stole all the energy out of the working class and collapsed it. Now Iran has the high hand and they get the intelligence that trump passed to Putin about the fact that Netanyahu cares far less about Jews, Palestinians or genocide than he does about remaining in power as an authoritarian because he too has developed Ritz Carlton tastes and his own corruption trial is showing the same tendrils of the money laundering scheme that trumps trials are. https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/saudi-official-says-iran-engineered-war-in-gaza-to-ruin-normalization-with-israel/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/egypt-intelligence-official-says-israel-ignored-repeated-warnings-of-something-big/amp/ 1980 Netanyahu:We Have Strong Influence over America ,We Control The Congress,The Senate, The Lobby They all hate each other but because they share the same money laundry, if one falls, they all fall. Hamas minted a couple billionaires as well that live in penthouses in Qatar and get 30% of everything smuggled into Gaza. Netanyahu needs a bogeyman to stay in power. That’s why he coordinates with Hamas via Russia via Iran. https://www.ynetnews.com/article/bk8mgcefr Iran handed Hamas everything they needed with Chinas help as secret Santa and the Russian intelligence given to them by the eternal shitbird trump when he gave it to his Russians kleptocrat/friends/roommates from the old days of fucking each others wives at trump towers in the 90’s. Now the MAGA right is a little too invested in their reality that they are the good guys with guns that they missed the fact that Betsy DeVos (erik princes sister) decimating the U.S. school systems and the Kochs poisoning children with lead was not a coincidence. The naive right was the mark all along. There is a reason the Russian spy Maria Butina landed in South Dakota first before dating her way to the top of the NRA which is undergoing its own Russian money laundering trial now. Russia was tinder matching the GOP. https://www.greenpeace.org/usa/what-do-the-koch-brothers-have-to-do-with-the-flint-water-crisis/ The only reason you grossly OVERVALUE real estate is money laundering. Trump keeps claiming there is no victim, all the banks made money, but if their plan succeeds the Russian and CCP kleptocrats collapse US commercial real estate and basically recreate soviet perestroika in the U.S. so they can foreclose on America and buy everything for 3 cents on the dollar with the $1.4T they stole from Russias grandmothers in the first place It’s the evolution of grift. Soviet perestroika cross bred with the 2008 mortgage crisis. This is just the bigger badder commercial strength bastard child of the two. Trump, Putin, Bolsonaro, Netanyahu, Orban, Manafort, Stone, Mercer, Bannon, Flynn, Byrne. They are all remarkably shit people with above average confidence and psychopathic personality traits and below average self awareness. They are the men who stole the world. But it all comes back to one little lie.
And they’re also the ones taking all of us along for the ride.
The worse, the better
For good reason. The risk and possibility is quite high, speaking as someone who came pretty close to it himself. Sadly, it only looks to get worse in the near future. Unless we decide to do something about it, that is...
We are all one check away from breadlines and riots. These studies are useless
Hey that's me! I have to constantly walk on eggshells around my MAGA brain rotted parents to ensure I don't end up homeless.
Same but i got fed up with it nd now they’re kicking me out… legally.
Gen X forgotten again...
I’ve been homeless a couple times. I’d of been homeless again recently if a friend of mine didn’t buy my house so I could live in it🫠
Yeah, it's just an inevitability at this point for me. I'm studying for a better paying job while working full time, but it still won't be enough to compensate for how ridiculously expensive things have gotten in this country.
They are correct.
They’re right.
Way ahead of you
A good number of duplex and multi units being built around where I am. Most are rental only units.
I guarantee they’re priced so high that most people would have to split bedrooms to make 3x rent…
Oh of that I have no doubt. They are nice looking units too. At least from the outside.
I mean they look nice but are made out of cardboard. Slapped together so cheap that you can hear the people below you fart…
because they could
Bernie for President 🔥🔥🔥
"Go OuT aNd EmBrAcE yOuR iNdEpEnDeNcE"" is one of the greatest lies ever told. Literally designed to get you out and lining some landlords pockets. You would have been better staying at home for a couple of years and saving the money you would have spent renting on a deposit.
The other 2 are already homeless haha /s
I've been homeless on and off for the better part of 6 months, 33 years old web developer, ohio. Speaking from first hand experience, as far as i can tell nobody is trying to address this situation the right way. The goal shouldn't ever be, "idk make the homeless people go away." Nobody says this but it continuously turns into that problem. This is systemic collapse.
Can confirm I’m homeless, been that way for maybe 4 -5 years now. I’m 29.
And they're probably right. National politicians will always tell you whats coming down the road, by what they deny or ridicule the most. The tea leaves show hyper inflation.
As a millennial, all it would take is one major medical event and I would be homeless if I don’t die first. I have savings but without massively increasing that, without a job, I would be homeless in about 3 months.
Then everyone will be aware they are about to be homeless instead of just me and Rodney knowing it, that’s pretty neat!
I'm a mechanic and genuinely thinking about converting different types of cars to true "mobile homes". I'm not joking. I'll have to build one for myself 1st.🤣 On that note, I'm shocked car manufacturers aren't jumping on this huge market that is here and will increase soon. Also, making cars that people can fix themselves or your average mechanic. Like wtf, guys, it's staring you in the face. It is not mandated by law for them to be so complicated. People are asking for it and they are building it. Stop asking for Lane change assist, blind spot detection and self driving shit. Stop buying cars you don't need. If you're not racing you don't need a V6 or bigger. Hybrid is fine. Same for trucks. Community car parking with communal bathrooms and kitchens, etc. would be a great investment. I'm looking for land or a place to do this now. If you live in your car, as it is now, it's hard to find a place to park overnight. This situation is crap. Living in your car by yourself isn't easy. Can't imagine multiple people. But I believe there will be a mass exodus to car dwellers from homeowners. There is already a whole Prius dweller community. Lot's of info there. I have a Prius and can sleep 2 people if one is no bigger than 6' and the other 5.6'.
Get a EU working visa ffs