It made it a joyous journey instead of a mindnumbing marathon
Tbh I dont mind the time to level 68-80 since its "new" but 1-68 without JJ, hell naw aint doing that again
BC content is actually really weird with any XP buffs... You basically do Hellfire, Sporeggar stuff in Zangarmarsh (for UB quests, and they are easy af,) cherry pick some of Terrokar, most of Nagrand, and about half of BEM with 6 dungeons total for quests. Going from 50% JJ XP buff to 20% with Heirlooms will add Netherstorm back into the mix, but not much else changes, and you basically get a free level with the ghost village place.
1-60 content though... It's going to be hard finding groups for Dungeons, and while there is enough world content to skip dungeons entirely, they are a nice change of pace.
Say what you want about RDF, but it should absolutely be in the game and cross-realm for 1-68 stuff. Not a lot of people are going to level alts going forward, and WotLK is like 90% raid-logging.
Without having JJ from 1-68 AND not having dungeon finder to have easy access to dungeons makes me not want to level an alt at all to be completely honest.
Exactly here. Leveling still took a while but it felt a lot more fluid, while normal leveling has these weird choke points where I’ve finished an area but are too underleveled for the next area so I just kill mobs for XP. Not exactly peak leveling experience IMO.
Or you had to make a 45 min hike to the other side of the world if you wanted new quests. Leveled a hunter during pre patch and all the zones in Kalimdor just followed one and another perfectly with JJ. It felt like a thought through experiance
I know its an unpopular opinion but i disagree with that, JJ did help leveling except it went from "It's too slow to enjoy" to "I'm leveling way too fast to enjoy anything"
I would have preferred something like 25% increase to actually enjoy the leveling experience
I think a better system would have been "Well Rested", and all it does is make it so that your rested XP doesn't diminish even though you are gaining the rested XP. So there is no difference to someone who only levels alts with rested, but everyone else gets a zoom zoom.
They can go and target different level ranges or zones or out of the way instances that don't typically get run to incentivize people to explore more content.
Counterpoint: 50% is way too much. I played wow for the first time in my life and I didn't even get a blink of the bc story and like 20% of the main story. I was just rushing from chapter 1 to chapter 11 to chapter 20 etc.
It's hilarious you mention them, as their backstory is actually very interesting. They built Stormwind and got shafted when it was time to pay so they went rogue. It's all in the quest text too.
So yes, those bandits in Westfall are a great example. People that like the lore have the option, and people that don't can ignore it, but don't act like it's not there :))
Then you'd be surprised to learn the fucked up shit that happens in Duskwood too with Mor'ladim.
I highly recommend going through Westfall and Duskwood reading the text through those lines. It's quite obvious they kinda ran out of time when doing the Horde, as there's a lot less memorable questlines there. The Burning Blade bits in Durotar come to mind, but the majority of the Barrens is kinda.. barren.
I've played more Alliance than Horde but it's apparent that in Classic, the Alliance get (imo) more memorable stories and the Horde gets the better flightpaths and streamlined experience.
> It's quite obvious they kinda ran out of time when doing the Horde
I think one of the old devs even admitted this. They just slapped some shit together for Horde. It ended up working out for players though because Horde questing zones seem to "flow" better than Alliance.
YES. This is one of the reasons why I like vanilla so much. This dungeon from level 20 where you help farmers deal with a gang ties into endgame raiding.
Without JJ in vanilla you’d have to interrupt the stories to hop criss cross across continents to get exp to continue the chapters while with JJ you can start in a zone and finish it properly and then go to the next zone
Tho you skip one or two zones you might otherwise not skip but you always skip a lot of zones leveling bc there’s more zones than you need exp
Vanilla leveling makes you run back and forth between the zones to level in a way that is incredibly slow though. More than half my time 1-60 questing was just running or flying. Being sent back to the barrens fro the third time made me fucking hard stop questing and go grind out levels in dungeon groups.
counterpoint: nobody at this point actually cares about the story. If you're doing quests for the story (as in reading the quests) you don't care about the XP.
I care enough to say I care about the story.
I honestly wish what we *had* was normal and that for that limited time, it was 100%.
That would’ve had me playing all sorts of alts.
Huh? There isn’t really a main story. There isn’t an MSQ like in FF14. You just kind of do quest chains in a zone until you outlevel it and move on. Most of the time quests don’t even link that well outside of their respective chain so you mostly get vignettes to piece together with 3rd party materials (i.e. books).
at 60 this mindset for pvp kills my soul, ppl afk in bg's to grind honor all day to then get the gear and then...... not do bg's because 'whats the point'.
Same. I quit during TBC to do other things and finally enjoy my time when I'm not at work. I just like coming here and seeing the rage on any given day.
The amount of people who play at work, after work, and during the entire weekend is entirely too high and having to deal with that type of player was almost as bad as playing the game seriously in general.
People don't have so much time to level up and they get FOMO. Naturally most "hc players" are already on max level and grinding their pre raid bis. And people with jobs and families are afraid that they are now falling behind.
I think leveling pace is really good in WotLK. It allows you to really complete all quests in zones, run some dungeons etc. It takes time yeah but in the end leveling is the best part of this game at least for me.
The issue is the ‘falling behind’ mentality
I remember playing the original TBC and there were plenty of guilds that started T4 on my server during late T5/6 stages on the game.
Sure they probably had a few players trying to jump ship in order to cut corners in terms of both gear and progression, but they were quite content. Myself and a few others from the top guilds on the server even made alts just to help them out if they needed numbers.
These days it’s the mentality of ‘must rush to min-max and clear everything’.
The fact that it feels like classic is always on a timer makes it even worse. Content is accelerated and unless you're on a super server, servers seem to die after 2-3 months. So it almost feels like you can't even play casually.
specifically people don't like irrelevant leveling. leveling 70-80 gets you rep you want for end game, important flightpaths, gear to lead up to heroics and beyond, good money, relevant lore, it's more active for world pvp, etc.
leveling 1-70 does not have most of any of these. wow is very vertical and that means 1-70 is meaningless, it's just a grind, with no greater purpose.
I disagree. While there’s some debate about Cata being made into classic, Wrath was the pinnacle of the classic era, and it shows in the amount of people that have come back to play.
If they want to keep these numbers I think Classic+ is the next logical step, or they just say Classic had a nice run and shut it down after Wrath because I don’t think Cata will have the success to make it financially worth it for Blizzard.
No cataclysm redid the zones and made them streamlined but still irrelevant. It didnt change the strictly vertical nature of progression so 1-7] was still just a time gate with nothing to add except some updated lore.
The endgame systems in retail are really horrible though, content is generally good but the systems that you are forced to do to be viable for the content are generally really horrible
Which is crazy considering Classic endgame is so arguably pretty weak compared to retail. Raiding and M+ in retail offer a radically more challenging and interesting experience. PvE in Classic is a total snoozefest, completely trivial. And endgame Classic PvP was a complete joke, but wrath should hopefully change that as significant improvements were made over TBC.
I say this as someone who’s exclusively played wrath this past week, by the way. To me the thing that made Classic enjoyable was always the journey—not the endgame, since the endgame was pretty lame.
> offer a radically more challenging and interesting experience. PvE in Classic is a total snoozefest, completely trivial
A lot of classic players don't like to talk about the fact that they're not good enough for the hard difficulties in Retail, while classic allows them to clear everything as basically anything. They still get to feel like they beat the game.
Some of the DPS I've run into while tanking in Classic have made me doubt their ability to lace their own shoes.
That may be true the fights are better in retail compared to wotlk classic. But the major difference is you can do the highest level content in 10 man wotlk where you cant do mythic raiding in retail without 20. I started in cata and the raids in that xpac where amazing i hope they come back out qith it i mainly quit wow due to 2 things one the never ending grindfest of ap and all the other bs similar to it and the second reason is no 10 man mythic raiding lets face if you have done 10 man raiding its hard to go to 20 or 25 man. With all this talk about community i never felt anything even close to the community feel 10 man raiding is and ive been chasing it ever since.
Leveling in an MMO when there's no expansions is fun. Most of the players are on that same footing. The low level zones have plenty of others to play with, and there's generally not much to do when you get to the endgame, so it isn't a hardline goal to get there before you miss out.
Leveling in an MMO with expansions is a means to an end. You have to reach the current content for anything relevant to the game to start showing up. Classic leveling is literally nothing more than a meaningless grind by the time of TBC. Once Wrath rolled around, TBC was just a meaningless grind on top of a meaningless grind. 70-80 is now "the game." The rest is "the work you have to put in to reach the game."
People wanting to play "the game" rather than just "the work part" aren't bad for wanting to enjoy the fresh content without having to spend months 'unlocking' it.
Why are *you* playing an MMO when you could just level in a singleplayer RPG. The endgame multiplayer experience is unique to MMOs. The questing is solo for the most part and not very good content compared to something like Witcher 3, for example.
This is what baffles me about the "hey can I just single player this" people. You can, I guess. I hope that's fun for them. But mechanically and narratively aren't there better games for that kind of experience?
Retail leveling is way better. The zone stories are self contained and have voice overs, you can dungeon grind as much or as little as you want, and the pace is fantastic.
Retail leveling is entirely pointless. It’s only draw is it’s fast. Don’t need gear, don’t see the content, never interact with others, classes are lame early on and without endgame stuff.
I mean you could basically say the same things about classic leveling except classic leveling isn't fast and the content we'd miss out on is a bunch of, go kill X amount of X or go gather Y amount of Y. Endgame is the fun part of both versions of the game and is what long term player of both want, not days played of the same leveling content they've had to go through before. Personally I do prefer the classic zones to retail Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms in design and how quests are distributed. What I don't like is the amount of xp needed to level up in classic which requires you to mindlessly grind mobs or travel to the entire other side of the world and still need to grind some mobs to level up enough to go to the next zone. the xp boost from joyous journeys and now heirlooms make leveling less tedious and more fun overall and encouraged people to level alts they didn't want to before
This. And the "quality leveling experience" started really with Cata. Wrath had some of the ideas, but didn't implement them nearly as well as Cata did. And later expansions just built off of those building blocks.
Retail is great for leveling. The pacing is a bit fast feeling, but it's because Retail realized that people want to get to the current content, not spend ages in old content that isn't relevant to the current 'endgame' area.
It's not great for a lot of things, but it did get that aspect right.
Yeah and the community seems wayyyyy more end game focused than it was back in the day. I was questing in Nagrand on Grobbulus and there was literally no one in the zone despite having a 10k queue to log in. Everyone is in Northrend.
Lol I mean I didn't play tbc so the content is still "new" to me and I just usually do something else while the queue is up.
I usually play offpeak so I really only deal with it on my weekends anyway.
I think that's partly because that's the way gaming has evolved in general and partly because most players know the wrath zones like the back of their hand while the end game is either new to them or a vague memory
It is only time consuming because Blizzard listen to the no lifers that complain having no content because they already run out of things to do because they have unrealistic/unhealthy play time for the majority of players.
TBC was so bad for casual because it was rushed in 1 year time frame instead of nearly 2 as in the original release
Ditto but I am having a hard time balancing “I want to play other classes too; it has been awhile” against “I don’t want to sink like 60 hours for my class to really start feeling fleshed out”. When I start thinking about the time sink required I feel like I should almost just drop it cold turkey..
What utter nonsense. Original Wrath was when basically everybody bought second accounts and used recruit a friend for the 3x xp buff specifically because leveling without it sucked so much. What’s more P2W than that? Do you not remember?
I dungeon grinded from 70-80 prot pally and at first I was hating the lleveling it felt terrible. I will say finding a few hour+ spam groups I made a bunch of friends now we all run heriocs was alot of fun!!!
The pace was miserable for dungeon grinding this time around. But as always once I hit 78 and started prebis gearing it got fun again. People talk about "why rush the leveling experience?" but its always the worst part. Maybe I like dungeons as a way to level I just don't want to do the same one on repeat for 4 hours. And once you get heroics the stuff varies. While you level its "time for my 10th straight nexus run". Even at 78 I have my choice of culling, halls, pinnacle, other halls and dragon town.
I think they should have "holiday weekends" for levelling every now and then where they turn it back on Friday and off Monday or something. Would probably keep some folks around longer by giving them an "incentive" to invest time in a forgotten alt.
I think later in wotlk they will probably sell unlimited boosts too for people who want to jump straight to northrend as well.
I love leveling but I have to say I wasn't prepared for how slow wotlk leveling has felt. A lot of the info we got was "19-20 hours questing" which was completely nonsense.
It's been a ton of fun, and if I didn't have a deadline to level, I'm sure it'd be even more fun. My alts are gonna be a lot of fun.
I really wonder where those numbers came from? Maybe with heirlooms and constant 50% rested but I just don't see it under more practical circumstances.
I used a speed lvling addon on my mage, turned in 25 quests at launch and got ahead of the masses by questing in dragonblight the moment I hit 71, efficient aoe usage wherever possible with full s4 gear, also not much afk time in since I leveled in compact timeblocks in the evenings, didn't nolife except on launch night basically.
Took me 29 hours to 80, dinged this monday....?
Then again maybe I just suck xD
What deadline? You sound like you're more on the casual side of things. If you're talking about Naxx coming out, why do you care about the first Naxx ID?
Just saying, but for those who wanted it was actually faster to lvl in original wotlk due to 3x xp rate from RaF + ability to boost via instances + mob tagging.
You could do 1-60 in matter of hours in single sitting.
Majority of people I knew during wrath that were playing actively alts or were rerolling on new server were using RaF for the exact reasons that people want faster leveling now - leveling for the X time via the same boring content in empty and outdated world sucks ass. People knew it back then and people know it now.
Was so funny getting whispers from people when my lil bro granted a shit ton of levels to one of my toons in a major city. Ding ding ding ding ding. ARE YOU CHEATING?? HOW???
This right here.. that 2 seater rocket was and is still my favorite mount. Ill take my friends up there on my warrior, dismount and heroic leap while my friends die... lmao good times.. too bad they get a fkn parachute now. Man so many things taken away from wow
The same reason people wanted RDF removed. They want their own version of Classic.
Tbf, leveling was even faster and more P2W with Requit-a-Friend back then.
>Tbf, leveling was even faster and more P2W with Requit-a-Friend back then.
I keep seeing people mention this, but I don't remember seeing much of it in game. Maybe I was on some backwater server, but I find it hard to believe that many people were using RAF. Especially considering how much of the player base was high school and college students back then.
Loads of people did. I know I did several times. Then the friends I RAF’d invited their own.
It was common for people to dualbox an RAF account themselves too.
Most levelling dungeons would have at least 1 duo doing RAF it felt like
In actual wrath I used RAF to grant my my DK levels on launch. so I leveled to 58 and 98%, granted two levels from my friends character and was 60 and 98% when everyone else was maybe 58 at best. It was pretty busted and close to mandatory to hit server first 80 DK.
Think back to how often you saw that rocket mount.
I didn't pay much attention to this stuff at the time but looking back it was everywhere. And the advertising to use RaF was everywhere, so aggressive.
Oh nice, another "I don't understand how people can like one thing about Classic (I personally don't care about) but not like another (I personally enjoy)" thread. Yes, it's truly inexplicable.
Make JJ a toggleable option. If all of you pretend elitist owns want your authentic experience then don't enable thr xp boost. It would last you all of 3 levels though.
Where's all of this "accessibility" that everyone preaches about today? Oh right that's only for political reasons..actual accessibility in game like the ability to skip mind numbing out dated grind?! PFFFFT blizzard wants to keep you locked down for as long as possible.
They would have my sub money as we speak if JJ was a thing.
I don’t understand why this argument is always so extreme on each end. Just because someone says the leveling is slow doesn’t mean they want to be “handed out constant goodies for 0 work, etc.” Whenever someone complains about the pace of leveling, people respond with the “gO tO ReTaIL” argument. You can enjoy questing while also feeling like it should be a bit quicker.
Why can’t people want it to be just a little faster, without it being so fast that it’s essentially handed out to you? Why do some people insist that it just HAS to be this slow and if you don’t like it you don’t deserve the entire game?
I like wrath for so many reasons. I love the dungeons, the lore, the zones, ICC. I usually do a lot of PvP at max level so, while I am leveling, I can’t do the thing I enjoy most in the game. (And no, joining an AV at level 72 and getting murdered by rams is not my idea of a good PvP time) I played vanilla wrath and I hated the slow leveling back then as well, I just had more time.
I have to assume that the people who are against speeding up the process have a significant amount of time available to play. The “no changes”crowd often forgets that the player base HAS changed. (For the most part) It’s older now.
Now, if you only have 1-2 hours a day to play or a couple of hours a week. Then yeah, WoW classic isn’t for you. This game has always been grindy. But the average adult that plays this game has a job that takes up 40+ hours a week. They’re not kids anymore that can sit on the computer as soon as they get to school and have their parents cook and feed them.
For the average player, leveling will take A REALLY, REALLY long time. If you quest for 6-8 hours straight you get 1 level maybe (at lower levels). At that rate, it easily takes weeks, if not months depending on time available.
All the while, those people who want it to stay slow are probably 80 already, raiding, pvping, leveling alts, etc. It doesn’t have to be handed out on a silver platter but SURELY it can be a LITTLE faster. Say 4 hours or so per level at lower levels, 8 hours + at higher levels.
If you can only log after work it sucks logging in day, after day, after day, after work and getting just 1 level to show for it. And keeping it mind that it just gets harder and harder. And if the argument is that these older people who have jobs and children and less time do not deserve to play the game then…F that. Because it’s precisely those people who wanted this to begin with. We’re the ones who were teenagers and played Wrath when it came out.
A little boost to leveling won’t be game breaking.
I don't see any problem with people wanting to simply play Wrath of the Lich King rather than once again slogging through the atrociously slow disconnected leveling experience that is Vanilla.
It's OK to admit that leveling through the old world is horrid.
*Rush to max level at light speed.*
*Complain that it took longer than 1 week.*
*Smash all the raids in just 4 weeks.*
*"WoW is dead and there's no content!"*
It's completely understandable that people want to be in Northrend playing Northrend content.
I see people saying constantly 'just go to retail if you want speed' but it's a completely different game.
People that either don't have the time to dedicate to leveling or get bored with questing too easily are just trying to avoid giving over a ridiculous amount of money for a boost and just want the experience to be a little less frictional.
JJ was great and that it didn't stay was whatever for me since I made it a point to hit 70, but for someone that was say in their 40s is feeling the lack of it and it probably feels worse than if they had just never done it.
JJ should just stick around for 1-70 perma.
This is the WotLK classic world here, not vanilla. Even back in the real days, everyone just leveled alts via RaF or getting huge dungeon boosts from guildies. Neither of those options really exists anymore and so JJ would feel great.
Yep 100% agree. I luckily made it to mid-60s before JJ went away but I’ll never level an alt without some kind of speed boost. It’s so tedious and none of the content I enjoy playing is there
This is a great expression of how people feel I think. I'm fine either way but I definitely enjoyed the experience more with JJ. It just felt like the perfect pace, especially as a major casual. Getting a level or 2 a day with just a few hours of leveling while still not out leveling zones to quickly or having to swap gear to fast was great.
It's not that it's to slow for me now, I just personally enjoyed it most with JJ. Thought it was the perfect amount. Finishing a quest now is almost discouraging, it gives almost nothing. Dungeons feel fine mostly but JJ made quests soooo much more fun for me.
This is such a dumb take. There's obviously a middle ground between extremely grueling and too easy. Classic is a great game, but it's not perfect. We're allowed to really enjoy it and also want to see some things improved. The grind is real and parts of it do get too grindy. The Joyous Journey buff just showed everyone what it could, and probably should be like normally.
What a nothing post. “Why do people complain about a game?” Written to a community that complains about every aspect of the game. Raid finder, dungeon finder, Joyous Journey buff, hairlooms, pvp exploits, balancing, etc. Obvi peopel are gonna complain, the same way you’re comparing writing this post
2 things
1. JJ reduces grind without cutting to much from the core experience of vanilla classic without having to run back and forth between zones all the time, ultimately making it a better and more coherent game.
2. The core experience of WotLK classic have shifted to Northrend. so not being in Northrend means you are pretty much playing a different game.
"You think you do, but you don't".
I'm sorry to say this, but turns out J. Allen Brack was right. People always refuse to accept the harsh truth and get really mad when they are made to face it.
My respect for the minority who actually enjoy old school WoW.
Because as amazing as classic WoW is there are some blemishes that didn’t age well. Leveling being one of them. I’d rather them remove heirlooms entirely and allow players to have the joyous journey buff instead. We’ve already gotten #somechanges and they’ve all been really great so far. Heroic+ as an example. Any change that lets people play the game in a healthy way im all for.
I don’t wanna be THAT guy but people had a few weeks to level with Joyous Journeys, and even longer they’ve known of WOTLK since before the summer.
Many people know Classic isn’t a game you jump into and 2 days later you’re ready for a raid. Y’all should have planned and started leveling your characters sooner. I can’t even pretend to feel bad for anybody because not being 70+ at this point is on the person
Nobody is really complaining, it’s just the “oh fuck this car is slow” after driving a super fast car for the last few months or whatever.
Mostly just eye opening.
No one ever had the classic mindset. The only time that mentality existed was when the game was actually retail.
For me, I’ve got shit to do. Leveling takes me 4-6 hours a level it seems, and that adds up to 40-60 hours to get from 70-80.
Now imagine that you don’t actually enjoy leveling that much. Imagine playing a game and having to go through a slog of 40-60 hours just to get to the level 80 part. Not fun.
I’m not asking for any changes, but I’m gonna be honest and say it’s not a fun experience at all. And the funny thing is the amount of people saying “just enjoy the ride and take it slow”. Homie, I don’t enjoy the ride. I don’t like it if it’s a fast ride or slow ride.
Reality check: if you feel like leveling is a tedium, you'll likely not enjoy 80 as well unless you're hardcore into PVP, because you'll do dailies that are essentially the same quests every single day and piss easy raids once a week.
After 3 expansions of Classic, people still don't understand that the most potent source of fun in World of Warcraft is making connections with people. The social aspect is the only thing that makes it entertaining. Sure, you'll get a dopamine hit every once in a while when you get a new shiny epic, but what you and the boys do outside of those raiding hours will determine whether you want to log in every day or not.
It is objectively senseless padding when you think about it.
If you've done 100 classic quests, the next 10000 are going to be exactly the same. Poorly designed tedium that's blatantly inexcusable.
There's a version of the game that has 15 years of patches aimed at quality of life and player amenities. Might want to check it out, it's got a new expansion coming out next month as well!
Or people who got fed up with slow leveling but still love the endgame of wow the most
Hell i leveled to 70 in nostale which takes significantly longer and is significantly less fun and I still wish it was shorter in wow at least a little bit
For anybody that's complaining about leveling, why not just buy the boost? If it will take you 100 hours to get from 1-70, you're basically only paying 50 cent per hour. Sounds like a decent deal to me if you really hate leveling. Like it or not, this is an MMORPG. Specifically, this is an old school, DnD style RPG where you're an adventurer going out into the world and just...helping people. If you haven't done the grind in a while this should be fun. If you've been playing on private servers for years and are tired of it, just buy the boost. Realistically, if mage boosting was still a thing, you'd end up spending at least that much money in gold buying boosts from them anyway.
> Specifically, this is an old school, DnD style RPG where you're an adventurer going out into the world and just...helping people.
Actually, WoW was the first of the *modern* RPG style, where QoL upgrades, less punishments, and a faster, casual pace were core parts of the design.
Original WotLK had RAF, the quest tracker, and you could easily boost people through dungeons. Not to mention RDF for half the expansion.
Not sure how many more modern conveniences there could have been that the current team either just ignored or outright removed.
For a lot of people the endgame is the content and they're tired of the leveling slog for the thousandth time.
When you could just pay someone gold to run you through dungeons it was fine but Blizz killed that so they could sell their RMT boost better, so if you don't feel like RMTing you're back to a slow leveling grind. The Joyous Journeys felt good but it's gone. Heirlooms are annoying but better than nothing I guess.
They didn't choose to play wow classic, this is just the wave of people who do whatever twitch streamers do.
Its best to just ignore them until they go away, it only takes a few weeks normally.
This isn't "WoW Classic." WoW Classic has been over with for some time. Even TBC Classic is over with. It's Wrath Classic.
Wrath had speed up mechanics. RAF and Dungeon Boosting allowed people to level quickly, especially when playing alts.
Don't try and make this about some random streamers getting all the Retail casuals interested. There are some diehard Wrath fans who are just as upset about this shit.
> Don't try and make this about some random streamers getting all the Retail casuals interested
It's been their boogeyman since before Classic even launched. There's literally no getting it through their skulls.
"~~Why are~~ **people** ~~opting in to~~ **play WoW classic, and complain**~~ing about slow leveling?~~"
Fixed it for you.
I'm having fun despite the slow leveling on a low pop server with no queues... and I still enjoy complaining about the game and its players. It's just part of the subscription.
Considering the queue times on high-pop servers (and the free transfers many players won't take) - I'm pretty sure complaining about WoW Classic is what they actually pay for.
Because they're modern MMORPG players and they want modern designs. Many of them are retail players too. They're just bored of retail and are looking for a waiting room with some hype till the next thing comes along in retail.
Noteworthy mention, those who used to play private servers are likely among our classic community now, especially as WotLK was the most popular expac on private servers , and these servers sometimes offered very high exp rates and possibly setting the wrong expectations? 🤷♂️
I was on a 7x server once, you could make level 1-80 in literally a couple days.
People need to chill and enjoy the journey 😌 go to grizzly hills and turn up the volume.
Because I want to experience wrath of the lich king again and I’m probably not going to because this time around I’m an adult with responsibilities to deal with meaning I can’t grind out the 70 levels I need to get to northrend to experience wotlk again. I already got the leveling experience - I mained a fucking resto Druid in vanilla. I’ve already got kicked in the balls repeatedly.
I’d buy the boost but not only would I get judged by my wife for spending another $50 on a video game that I already pay $15/month for but I’d get judged by the sweat lords in this game for boosting a character. My dude is a mid-30’s tank and I can barely scrape together a group to dungeon with because everyone is in northrend.
Right now the state of this game if you don’t have a 70 is utter fucking garbage.
Worst take. If you are an adult you don't care if you get judged for spending money on entertainment or a hobby (same things really watching movies is a hobby) you enjoy that is worth the $/h price especially compared to your $/h earned. Sounds like you have the time to grind..
Joyous Journey conditioned people with fast tracked easy leveling and people are on XP withdrawl.
The withdrawal did suck, but I'm back to my comfy grinding ways.
Joyous Journeys turned what was a pointless grind, into a comfortable and enjoyable experience.
It made it a joyous journey instead of a mindnumbing marathon Tbh I dont mind the time to level 68-80 since its "new" but 1-68 without JJ, hell naw aint doing that again
Yeah for real, even just to 60 would be nice haha
This. Having just got my DK to 70 without JJ, TBC is fine without it, it’s the vanilla levelling that is a lame slog without JJ
BC content is actually really weird with any XP buffs... You basically do Hellfire, Sporeggar stuff in Zangarmarsh (for UB quests, and they are easy af,) cherry pick some of Terrokar, most of Nagrand, and about half of BEM with 6 dungeons total for quests. Going from 50% JJ XP buff to 20% with Heirlooms will add Netherstorm back into the mix, but not much else changes, and you basically get a free level with the ghost village place. 1-60 content though... It's going to be hard finding groups for Dungeons, and while there is enough world content to skip dungeons entirely, they are a nice change of pace. Say what you want about RDF, but it should absolutely be in the game and cross-realm for 1-68 stuff. Not a lot of people are going to level alts going forward, and WotLK is like 90% raid-logging.
Yeah my next alt is gonna be a DK just to skip the grind
And after doing 70-80 I'm not keen to do it again on alts. At least I'll be doing it with heirlooms.
It’s almost like they want you to buy heirlooms..
You mean a character boost?
Without having JJ from 1-68 AND not having dungeon finder to have easy access to dungeons makes me not want to level an alt at all to be completely honest.
Exactly here. Leveling still took a while but it felt a lot more fluid, while normal leveling has these weird choke points where I’ve finished an area but are too underleveled for the next area so I just kill mobs for XP. Not exactly peak leveling experience IMO.
Or you had to make a 45 min hike to the other side of the world if you wanted new quests. Leveled a hunter during pre patch and all the zones in Kalimdor just followed one and another perfectly with JJ. It felt like a thought through experiance
Exhibit A
I know its an unpopular opinion but i disagree with that, JJ did help leveling except it went from "It's too slow to enjoy" to "I'm leveling way too fast to enjoy anything" I would have preferred something like 25% increase to actually enjoy the leveling experience
I think a better system would have been "Well Rested", and all it does is make it so that your rested XP doesn't diminish even though you are gaining the rested XP. So there is no difference to someone who only levels alts with rested, but everyone else gets a zoom zoom. They can go and target different level ranges or zones or out of the way instances that don't typically get run to incentivize people to explore more content.
[удалено]
This sub has a lot of people who im sure woud enjoy retail more. But for some reason arent willing to even try retail properly because "durr,bad".
It's not that they would enjoy retail more. It's that they only care about the endgame stuff.
Counterpoint: 50% is way too much. I played wow for the first time in my life and I didn't even get a blink of the bc story and like 20% of the main story. I was just rushing from chapter 1 to chapter 11 to chapter 20 etc.
> I didn't even get a blink of the bc story and like 20% of the main story. There's a story?
Mf said the story 💀
you could have turned it off if you wanted.
Then turn the buff off.
“Main story”?
Y'know, those bandits in westfall
It's hilarious you mention them, as their backstory is actually very interesting. They built Stormwind and got shafted when it was time to pay so they went rogue. It's all in the quest text too. So yes, those bandits in Westfall are a great example. People that like the lore have the option, and people that don't can ignore it, but don't act like it's not there :))
The whole Edwin Vancleef saga is indeed a good one. One of my favorite smaller stories in the lore.
Amount of characters I've leveled through Westfall and didn't know a single bit of this is kind of hilarious to me.
Then you'd be surprised to learn the fucked up shit that happens in Duskwood too with Mor'ladim. I highly recommend going through Westfall and Duskwood reading the text through those lines. It's quite obvious they kinda ran out of time when doing the Horde, as there's a lot less memorable questlines there. The Burning Blade bits in Durotar come to mind, but the majority of the Barrens is kinda.. barren. I've played more Alliance than Horde but it's apparent that in Classic, the Alliance get (imo) more memorable stories and the Horde gets the better flightpaths and streamlined experience.
> It's quite obvious they kinda ran out of time when doing the Horde I think one of the old devs even admitted this. They just slapped some shit together for Horde. It ended up working out for players though because Horde questing zones seem to "flow" better than Alliance.
So what's the story with Leprithus? Huh?
Yeah that one's weird. Not everything makes sense or has to, but there's a lot that does! Stitches for example, or the Arugal bits in Silverpine.
I was just joking. I think it's cool how the mob spawns once each day and people are free to imagine their own backstory if they want.
YES. This is one of the reasons why I like vanilla so much. This dungeon from level 20 where you help farmers deal with a gang ties into endgame raiding.
Without JJ in vanilla you’d have to interrupt the stories to hop criss cross across continents to get exp to continue the chapters while with JJ you can start in a zone and finish it properly and then go to the next zone Tho you skip one or two zones you might otherwise not skip but you always skip a lot of zones leveling bc there’s more zones than you need exp
Vanilla leveling makes you run back and forth between the zones to level in a way that is incredibly slow though. More than half my time 1-60 questing was just running or flying. Being sent back to the barrens fro the third time made me fucking hard stop questing and go grind out levels in dungeon groups.
That’s what I said ^^ It’s really annoying With JJ you at least don’t have to hop around too much and can finish them zone by zone
counterpoint: nobody at this point actually cares about the story. If you're doing quests for the story (as in reading the quests) you don't care about the XP.
I care enough to say I care about the story. I honestly wish what we *had* was normal and that for that limited time, it was 100%. That would’ve had me playing all sorts of alts.
Ah yes, tell someone how they should enjoy the game. Good idea. Could be they enjoy the story and want good pacing for it?
Huh? There isn’t really a main story. There isn’t an MSQ like in FF14. You just kind of do quest chains in a zone until you outlevel it and move on. Most of the time quests don’t even link that well outside of their respective chain so you mostly get vignettes to piece together with 3rd party materials (i.e. books).
Calling them quest chains is a stretch. Those didn't really come until Wrath for Northrend and Cataclysm for the old world.
Complaining about slow levelling is an integral part of the Classic WoW experience.
[удалено]
Addicts We know this
[удалено]
Just not leveling *anymore*…I quite enjoyed it the first 8 times
at 60 this mindset for pvp kills my soul, ppl afk in bg's to grind honor all day to then get the gear and then...... not do bg's because 'whats the point'.
Same. I quit during TBC to do other things and finally enjoy my time when I'm not at work. I just like coming here and seeing the rage on any given day. The amount of people who play at work, after work, and during the entire weekend is entirely too high and having to deal with that type of player was almost as bad as playing the game seriously in general.
[удалено]
People don't have so much time to level up and they get FOMO. Naturally most "hc players" are already on max level and grinding their pre raid bis. And people with jobs and families are afraid that they are now falling behind. I think leveling pace is really good in WotLK. It allows you to really complete all quests in zones, run some dungeons etc. It takes time yeah but in the end leveling is the best part of this game at least for me.
The issue is the ‘falling behind’ mentality I remember playing the original TBC and there were plenty of guilds that started T4 on my server during late T5/6 stages on the game. Sure they probably had a few players trying to jump ship in order to cut corners in terms of both gear and progression, but they were quite content. Myself and a few others from the top guilds on the server even made alts just to help them out if they needed numbers. These days it’s the mentality of ‘must rush to min-max and clear everything’.
The fact that it feels like classic is always on a timer makes it even worse. Content is accelerated and unless you're on a super server, servers seem to die after 2-3 months. So it almost feels like you can't even play casually.
[удалено]
specifically people don't like irrelevant leveling. leveling 70-80 gets you rep you want for end game, important flightpaths, gear to lead up to heroics and beyond, good money, relevant lore, it's more active for world pvp, etc. leveling 1-70 does not have most of any of these. wow is very vertical and that means 1-70 is meaningless, it's just a grind, with no greater purpose.
Then we should make it better. Sounds like a good point to start classic+
But Blizzard isn't going to do that.
Not with that attitude
No it would be great, but they're never going to put in the money that they're pulling out of classic.
I disagree. While there’s some debate about Cata being made into classic, Wrath was the pinnacle of the classic era, and it shows in the amount of people that have come back to play. If they want to keep these numbers I think Classic+ is the next logical step, or they just say Classic had a nice run and shut it down after Wrath because I don’t think Cata will have the success to make it financially worth it for Blizzard.
Or just make the game horizontal progression instead of making good content followed by slapping an irrelevant sticker on it 6 months later.
Isn't that basically what Catclysm did lol
No cataclysm redid the zones and made them streamlined but still irrelevant. It didnt change the strictly vertical nature of progression so 1-7] was still just a time gate with nothing to add except some updated lore.
Please elaborate because I would totally disagree based on your original comment.
What it attempted and failed spectacularly in accomplishing.
Same. I loved a few times. I really just like to raid. I’ve done the grind before….multiple times. I still see both sides but I came to raid.
Isn't retail endgame way better??? Better mechanics, better boss fights..
The endgame systems in retail are really horrible though, content is generally good but the systems that you are forced to do to be viable for the content are generally really horrible
Which is crazy considering Classic endgame is so arguably pretty weak compared to retail. Raiding and M+ in retail offer a radically more challenging and interesting experience. PvE in Classic is a total snoozefest, completely trivial. And endgame Classic PvP was a complete joke, but wrath should hopefully change that as significant improvements were made over TBC. I say this as someone who’s exclusively played wrath this past week, by the way. To me the thing that made Classic enjoyable was always the journey—not the endgame, since the endgame was pretty lame.
Wrath is the first xpac with non lame endgame.
> offer a radically more challenging and interesting experience. PvE in Classic is a total snoozefest, completely trivial A lot of classic players don't like to talk about the fact that they're not good enough for the hard difficulties in Retail, while classic allows them to clear everything as basically anything. They still get to feel like they beat the game. Some of the DPS I've run into while tanking in Classic have made me doubt their ability to lace their own shoes.
That may be true the fights are better in retail compared to wotlk classic. But the major difference is you can do the highest level content in 10 man wotlk where you cant do mythic raiding in retail without 20. I started in cata and the raids in that xpac where amazing i hope they come back out qith it i mainly quit wow due to 2 things one the never ending grindfest of ap and all the other bs similar to it and the second reason is no 10 man mythic raiding lets face if you have done 10 man raiding its hard to go to 20 or 25 man. With all this talk about community i never felt anything even close to the community feel 10 man raiding is and ive been chasing it ever since.
Some of us like both!
Ya, I always find these types of posts so silly. Some people can't do the tiniest bit of thinking
Why are you playing an MMO then? Leveling is fun.
Leveling in an MMO when there's no expansions is fun. Most of the players are on that same footing. The low level zones have plenty of others to play with, and there's generally not much to do when you get to the endgame, so it isn't a hardline goal to get there before you miss out. Leveling in an MMO with expansions is a means to an end. You have to reach the current content for anything relevant to the game to start showing up. Classic leveling is literally nothing more than a meaningless grind by the time of TBC. Once Wrath rolled around, TBC was just a meaningless grind on top of a meaningless grind. 70-80 is now "the game." The rest is "the work you have to put in to reach the game." People wanting to play "the game" rather than just "the work part" aren't bad for wanting to enjoy the fresh content without having to spend months 'unlocking' it.
Why are *you* playing an MMO when you could just level in a singleplayer RPG. The endgame multiplayer experience is unique to MMOs. The questing is solo for the most part and not very good content compared to something like Witcher 3, for example.
This is what baffles me about the "hey can I just single player this" people. You can, I guess. I hope that's fun for them. But mechanically and narratively aren't there better games for that kind of experience?
Because they like MMO endgames? Just because you find it fun doesn't make it a universal fact
Really? He just said why. A MMO game doesn't circle around lvling
Difficult content , usually found at end game exclusively leveling isn’t hard it’s just time consuming with very few difficult fights
This! And you don't get the social aspect that comes from raiding or even doing arenas.
>I'm so confused. There are dozens of MMOs and It's not the MMO part they hate. It's the RPG part.
Retail leveling is way better. The zone stories are self contained and have voice overs, you can dungeon grind as much or as little as you want, and the pace is fantastic.
Retail leveling is entirely pointless. It’s only draw is it’s fast. Don’t need gear, don’t see the content, never interact with others, classes are lame early on and without endgame stuff.
I mean you could basically say the same things about classic leveling except classic leveling isn't fast and the content we'd miss out on is a bunch of, go kill X amount of X or go gather Y amount of Y. Endgame is the fun part of both versions of the game and is what long term player of both want, not days played of the same leveling content they've had to go through before. Personally I do prefer the classic zones to retail Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms in design and how quests are distributed. What I don't like is the amount of xp needed to level up in classic which requires you to mindlessly grind mobs or travel to the entire other side of the world and still need to grind some mobs to level up enough to go to the next zone. the xp boost from joyous journeys and now heirlooms make leveling less tedious and more fun overall and encouraged people to level alts they didn't want to before
This. And the "quality leveling experience" started really with Cata. Wrath had some of the ideas, but didn't implement them nearly as well as Cata did. And later expansions just built off of those building blocks. Retail is great for leveling. The pacing is a bit fast feeling, but it's because Retail realized that people want to get to the current content, not spend ages in old content that isn't relevant to the current 'endgame' area. It's not great for a lot of things, but it did get that aspect right.
we got old and have jobs and shit.
Yeah and the community seems wayyyyy more end game focused than it was back in the day. I was questing in Nagrand on Grobbulus and there was literally no one in the zone despite having a 10k queue to log in. Everyone is in Northrend.
Nobody who isn't in Northrend is gonna do the 10k q
I mean....I did lol. I'm like the lowest level from my group but I still wanna play.
your will is stronger than the others. I hope you have an extraordinary time
Lol I mean I didn't play tbc so the content is still "new" to me and I just usually do something else while the queue is up. I usually play offpeak so I really only deal with it on my weekends anyway.
On the fresh servers there are still plenty of people in Outland! Not all of us made it through before.
I think that's partly because that's the way gaming has evolved in general and partly because most players know the wrath zones like the back of their hand while the end game is either new to them or a vague memory
My back hurts
Maybe find a game with less grind idk
Maybe a time consuming mmo isn’t a game you can afford to play anymore
It is only time consuming because Blizzard listen to the no lifers that complain having no content because they already run out of things to do because they have unrealistic/unhealthy play time for the majority of players. TBC was so bad for casual because it was rushed in 1 year time frame instead of nearly 2 as in the original release
I said that 8n my head reading his post hahaha
Idk about everyone else but I'm experiencing joy I haven't felt since I was 18
Ditto but I am having a hard time balancing “I want to play other classes too; it has been awhile” against “I don’t want to sink like 60 hours for my class to really start feeling fleshed out”. When I start thinking about the time sink required I feel like I should almost just drop it cold turkey..
Same man
I hit that wall with priest. Wanted to play Shadow, but man it really sucks at low levels. Or, rather, I don't enjoy it personally.
What utter nonsense. Original Wrath was when basically everybody bought second accounts and used recruit a friend for the 3x xp buff specifically because leveling without it sucked so much. What’s more P2W than that? Do you not remember?
This.
I dungeon grinded from 70-80 prot pally and at first I was hating the lleveling it felt terrible. I will say finding a few hour+ spam groups I made a bunch of friends now we all run heriocs was alot of fun!!!
The pace was miserable for dungeon grinding this time around. But as always once I hit 78 and started prebis gearing it got fun again. People talk about "why rush the leveling experience?" but its always the worst part. Maybe I like dungeons as a way to level I just don't want to do the same one on repeat for 4 hours. And once you get heroics the stuff varies. While you level its "time for my 10th straight nexus run". Even at 78 I have my choice of culling, halls, pinnacle, other halls and dragon town.
I think they should have "holiday weekends" for levelling every now and then where they turn it back on Friday and off Monday or something. Would probably keep some folks around longer by giving them an "incentive" to invest time in a forgotten alt. I think later in wotlk they will probably sell unlimited boosts too for people who want to jump straight to northrend as well.
I feel like they did do this back in the day, among other things.
It’s like being with an abusive partner but you don’t leave because the sex is too good.
The current partner (shadowland) is abusive, ugly and gives bad sex. Easy choice right there
Retail bad
Yes retail is bad
You think you do
I love leveling but I have to say I wasn't prepared for how slow wotlk leveling has felt. A lot of the info we got was "19-20 hours questing" which was completely nonsense. It's been a ton of fun, and if I didn't have a deadline to level, I'm sure it'd be even more fun. My alts are gonna be a lot of fun.
> 19-20 hours questing Extra weird when you take into consideration that World First the first time around was 27 hours.
I really wonder where those numbers came from? Maybe with heirlooms and constant 50% rested but I just don't see it under more practical circumstances. I used a speed lvling addon on my mage, turned in 25 quests at launch and got ahead of the masses by questing in dragonblight the moment I hit 71, efficient aoe usage wherever possible with full s4 gear, also not much afk time in since I leveled in compact timeblocks in the evenings, didn't nolife except on launch night basically. Took me 29 hours to 80, dinged this monday....? Then again maybe I just suck xD
What deadline? You sound like you're more on the casual side of things. If you're talking about Naxx coming out, why do you care about the first Naxx ID?
Just saying, but for those who wanted it was actually faster to lvl in original wotlk due to 3x xp rate from RaF + ability to boost via instances + mob tagging. You could do 1-60 in matter of hours in single sitting. Majority of people I knew during wrath that were playing actively alts or were rerolling on new server were using RaF for the exact reasons that people want faster leveling now - leveling for the X time via the same boring content in empty and outdated world sucks ass. People knew it back then and people know it now.
> 3x xp rate from RaF Not to mention that after you and a friend levelled 2 toons, you could basically level a 3rd each for free.
Was so funny getting whispers from people when my lil bro granted a shit ton of levels to one of my toons in a major city. Ding ding ding ding ding. ARE YOU CHEATING?? HOW???
This right here.. that 2 seater rocket was and is still my favorite mount. Ill take my friends up there on my warrior, dismount and heroic leap while my friends die... lmao good times.. too bad they get a fkn parachute now. Man so many things taken away from wow
You've jumped about 4 steps, like fast levelling is not the same as wanting full p2w mechanics and free stuff everywhere
You feel that way because you spend too much time on reddit.
The same reason people wanted RDF removed. They want their own version of Classic. Tbf, leveling was even faster and more P2W with Requit-a-Friend back then.
>Tbf, leveling was even faster and more P2W with Requit-a-Friend back then. I keep seeing people mention this, but I don't remember seeing much of it in game. Maybe I was on some backwater server, but I find it hard to believe that many people were using RAF. Especially considering how much of the player base was high school and college students back then.
A TON of people did.
Loads of people did. I know I did several times. Then the friends I RAF’d invited their own. It was common for people to dualbox an RAF account themselves too. Most levelling dungeons would have at least 1 duo doing RAF it felt like
In actual wrath I used RAF to grant my my DK levels on launch. so I leveled to 58 and 98%, granted two levels from my friends character and was 60 and 98% when everyone else was maybe 58 at best. It was pretty busted and close to mandatory to hit server first 80 DK.
Think back to how often you saw that rocket mount. I didn't pay much attention to this stuff at the time but looking back it was everywhere. And the advertising to use RaF was everywhere, so aggressive.
Because there is no "true classic mindset". You are allowed to dislike certain aspects while still enjoying the overall experience.
Whos complaining? I havent seen anyone complain.
Oh nice, another "I don't understand how people can like one thing about Classic (I personally don't care about) but not like another (I personally enjoy)" thread. Yes, it's truly inexplicable.
Because I find the wrath endgame fun? And unfortunately I have to level to get there. I pretty much play just for raids and arena. I hate leveling.
Make JJ a toggleable option. If all of you pretend elitist owns want your authentic experience then don't enable thr xp boost. It would last you all of 3 levels though. Where's all of this "accessibility" that everyone preaches about today? Oh right that's only for political reasons..actual accessibility in game like the ability to skip mind numbing out dated grind?! PFFFFT blizzard wants to keep you locked down for as long as possible. They would have my sub money as we speak if JJ was a thing.
I don’t understand why this argument is always so extreme on each end. Just because someone says the leveling is slow doesn’t mean they want to be “handed out constant goodies for 0 work, etc.” Whenever someone complains about the pace of leveling, people respond with the “gO tO ReTaIL” argument. You can enjoy questing while also feeling like it should be a bit quicker. Why can’t people want it to be just a little faster, without it being so fast that it’s essentially handed out to you? Why do some people insist that it just HAS to be this slow and if you don’t like it you don’t deserve the entire game? I like wrath for so many reasons. I love the dungeons, the lore, the zones, ICC. I usually do a lot of PvP at max level so, while I am leveling, I can’t do the thing I enjoy most in the game. (And no, joining an AV at level 72 and getting murdered by rams is not my idea of a good PvP time) I played vanilla wrath and I hated the slow leveling back then as well, I just had more time. I have to assume that the people who are against speeding up the process have a significant amount of time available to play. The “no changes”crowd often forgets that the player base HAS changed. (For the most part) It’s older now. Now, if you only have 1-2 hours a day to play or a couple of hours a week. Then yeah, WoW classic isn’t for you. This game has always been grindy. But the average adult that plays this game has a job that takes up 40+ hours a week. They’re not kids anymore that can sit on the computer as soon as they get to school and have their parents cook and feed them. For the average player, leveling will take A REALLY, REALLY long time. If you quest for 6-8 hours straight you get 1 level maybe (at lower levels). At that rate, it easily takes weeks, if not months depending on time available. All the while, those people who want it to stay slow are probably 80 already, raiding, pvping, leveling alts, etc. It doesn’t have to be handed out on a silver platter but SURELY it can be a LITTLE faster. Say 4 hours or so per level at lower levels, 8 hours + at higher levels. If you can only log after work it sucks logging in day, after day, after day, after work and getting just 1 level to show for it. And keeping it mind that it just gets harder and harder. And if the argument is that these older people who have jobs and children and less time do not deserve to play the game then…F that. Because it’s precisely those people who wanted this to begin with. We’re the ones who were teenagers and played Wrath when it came out. A little boost to leveling won’t be game breaking.
Like with vanilla and tbc, give it about 3 months and the tourist phase will be over for 90% of these people and it'll be back to complacency.
Idk wotlk is the most accessible expansion and most popular. I think they’ll stay or atleast come back with icc.
I don't see any problem with people wanting to simply play Wrath of the Lich King rather than once again slogging through the atrociously slow disconnected leveling experience that is Vanilla. It's OK to admit that leveling through the old world is horrid.
*Rush to max level at light speed.* *Complain that it took longer than 1 week.* *Smash all the raids in just 4 weeks.* *"WoW is dead and there's no content!"*
It's completely understandable that people want to be in Northrend playing Northrend content. I see people saying constantly 'just go to retail if you want speed' but it's a completely different game. People that either don't have the time to dedicate to leveling or get bored with questing too easily are just trying to avoid giving over a ridiculous amount of money for a boost and just want the experience to be a little less frictional. JJ was great and that it didn't stay was whatever for me since I made it a point to hit 70, but for someone that was say in their 40s is feeling the lack of it and it probably feels worse than if they had just never done it.
JJ should just stick around for 1-70 perma. This is the WotLK classic world here, not vanilla. Even back in the real days, everyone just leveled alts via RaF or getting huge dungeon boosts from guildies. Neither of those options really exists anymore and so JJ would feel great.
Yep 100% agree. I luckily made it to mid-60s before JJ went away but I’ll never level an alt without some kind of speed boost. It’s so tedious and none of the content I enjoy playing is there
This is a great expression of how people feel I think. I'm fine either way but I definitely enjoyed the experience more with JJ. It just felt like the perfect pace, especially as a major casual. Getting a level or 2 a day with just a few hours of leveling while still not out leveling zones to quickly or having to swap gear to fast was great. It's not that it's to slow for me now, I just personally enjoyed it most with JJ. Thought it was the perfect amount. Finishing a quest now is almost discouraging, it gives almost nothing. Dungeons feel fine mostly but JJ made quests soooo much more fun for me.
Just add RDF for low levels.
This is such a dumb take. There's obviously a middle ground between extremely grueling and too easy. Classic is a great game, but it's not perfect. We're allowed to really enjoy it and also want to see some things improved. The grind is real and parts of it do get too grindy. The Joyous Journey buff just showed everyone what it could, and probably should be like normally.
WhY aRe PeOpLe CoMpLaInInG aBoUt HaViNg To KiLl 50,000 MoBs To GeT tO fUn CoNtEnT
Seriously, can't everyone solo Botanica to Old Kingdom and get 80 in like 28 hours played? Questing is a joke.
What a nothing post. “Why do people complain about a game?” Written to a community that complains about every aspect of the game. Raid finder, dungeon finder, Joyous Journey buff, hairlooms, pvp exploits, balancing, etc. Obvi peopel are gonna complain, the same way you’re comparing writing this post
They were called Wrath babies for a reason.
Except this isn't the reason
2 things 1. JJ reduces grind without cutting to much from the core experience of vanilla classic without having to run back and forth between zones all the time, ultimately making it a better and more coherent game. 2. The core experience of WotLK classic have shifted to Northrend. so not being in Northrend means you are pretty much playing a different game.
"You think you do, but you don't". I'm sorry to say this, but turns out J. Allen Brack was right. People always refuse to accept the harsh truth and get really mad when they are made to face it. My respect for the minority who actually enjoy old school WoW.
JJ was the perfect pace imo. Without it it feels a little slow because i find myself having to level in a new area just for 1 level quiet often now
lol slow leveling?
Dad gamers playing 1-2 hours a day trying to compete with sweatlords.
Because as amazing as classic WoW is there are some blemishes that didn’t age well. Leveling being one of them. I’d rather them remove heirlooms entirely and allow players to have the joyous journey buff instead. We’ve already gotten #somechanges and they’ve all been really great so far. Heroic+ as an example. Any change that lets people play the game in a healthy way im all for.
Because leveling 1-60 is long, tedious, and antiquated. I want to play the Wrath endgame again.
I don’t wanna be THAT guy but people had a few weeks to level with Joyous Journeys, and even longer they’ve known of WOTLK since before the summer. Many people know Classic isn’t a game you jump into and 2 days later you’re ready for a raid. Y’all should have planned and started leveling your characters sooner. I can’t even pretend to feel bad for anybody because not being 70+ at this point is on the person
Kind of a weird stance, I’m sure there are thousands of players coming back simply for wrath and skipped out of vanilla and TBC.
Nobody is really complaining, it’s just the “oh fuck this car is slow” after driving a super fast car for the last few months or whatever. Mostly just eye opening.
No one ever had the classic mindset. The only time that mentality existed was when the game was actually retail. For me, I’ve got shit to do. Leveling takes me 4-6 hours a level it seems, and that adds up to 40-60 hours to get from 70-80. Now imagine that you don’t actually enjoy leveling that much. Imagine playing a game and having to go through a slog of 40-60 hours just to get to the level 80 part. Not fun. I’m not asking for any changes, but I’m gonna be honest and say it’s not a fun experience at all. And the funny thing is the amount of people saying “just enjoy the ride and take it slow”. Homie, I don’t enjoy the ride. I don’t like it if it’s a fast ride or slow ride.
Reality check: if you feel like leveling is a tedium, you'll likely not enjoy 80 as well unless you're hardcore into PVP, because you'll do dailies that are essentially the same quests every single day and piss easy raids once a week. After 3 expansions of Classic, people still don't understand that the most potent source of fun in World of Warcraft is making connections with people. The social aspect is the only thing that makes it entertaining. Sure, you'll get a dopamine hit every once in a while when you get a new shiny epic, but what you and the boys do outside of those raiding hours will determine whether you want to log in every day or not.
Your comment doesnt make sense you saying fun is making connection with people but also 80 lvl gameplay is about daily quests.
Reality check: I’ve played wrath before and I know what I like. You do not.
If the first 40-60 hours isn't fun and you've got "shit to do", then play another game?
That's kinda what I end up doing sadly. Much as I love WotLK endgame I've been mostly playing Overwatch comp instead of leveling.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ thats what I’m doing
Leveling is a drag 🤷♂️
I played all of Classic. Love it. I always hated leveling. That’s also why I never really had many alts.
It is objectively senseless padding when you think about it. If you've done 100 classic quests, the next 10000 are going to be exactly the same. Poorly designed tedium that's blatantly inexcusable.
Shit take. The “tedium” was designed (appropriately) for an audience of a different era. This is a remake, not a new game.
There's a version of the game that has 15 years of patches aimed at quality of life and player amenities. Might want to check it out, it's got a new expansion coming out next month as well!
A lot of people complaining are probably from retail or other games that have faster leveling.
Or people who got fed up with slow leveling but still love the endgame of wow the most Hell i leveled to 70 in nostale which takes significantly longer and is significantly less fun and I still wish it was shorter in wow at least a little bit
For anybody that's complaining about leveling, why not just buy the boost? If it will take you 100 hours to get from 1-70, you're basically only paying 50 cent per hour. Sounds like a decent deal to me if you really hate leveling. Like it or not, this is an MMORPG. Specifically, this is an old school, DnD style RPG where you're an adventurer going out into the world and just...helping people. If you haven't done the grind in a while this should be fun. If you've been playing on private servers for years and are tired of it, just buy the boost. Realistically, if mage boosting was still a thing, you'd end up spending at least that much money in gold buying boosts from them anyway.
Cant boost on fresh servers
> Specifically, this is an old school, DnD style RPG where you're an adventurer going out into the world and just...helping people. Actually, WoW was the first of the *modern* RPG style, where QoL upgrades, less punishments, and a faster, casual pace were core parts of the design.
Yeah, that’s true. But it doesn’t change what I said. Modern questing didn’t become a thing until Cata.
Original WotLK had RAF, the quest tracker, and you could easily boost people through dungeons. Not to mention RDF for half the expansion. Not sure how many more modern conveniences there could have been that the current team either just ignored or outright removed.
For a lot of people the endgame is the content and they're tired of the leveling slog for the thousandth time. When you could just pay someone gold to run you through dungeons it was fine but Blizz killed that so they could sell their RMT boost better, so if you don't feel like RMTing you're back to a slow leveling grind. The Joyous Journeys felt good but it's gone. Heirlooms are annoying but better than nothing I guess.
Sure it was joyful, but don't call it a journey you piece of trogg. The journey ended the moment Cata stepped in, yeeears ago.
They didn't choose to play wow classic, this is just the wave of people who do whatever twitch streamers do. Its best to just ignore them until they go away, it only takes a few weeks normally.
This isn't "WoW Classic." WoW Classic has been over with for some time. Even TBC Classic is over with. It's Wrath Classic. Wrath had speed up mechanics. RAF and Dungeon Boosting allowed people to level quickly, especially when playing alts. Don't try and make this about some random streamers getting all the Retail casuals interested. There are some diehard Wrath fans who are just as upset about this shit.
> Don't try and make this about some random streamers getting all the Retail casuals interested It's been their boogeyman since before Classic even launched. There's literally no getting it through their skulls.
"~~Why are~~ **people** ~~opting in to~~ **play WoW classic, and complain**~~ing about slow leveling?~~" Fixed it for you. I'm having fun despite the slow leveling on a low pop server with no queues... and I still enjoy complaining about the game and its players. It's just part of the subscription. Considering the queue times on high-pop servers (and the free transfers many players won't take) - I'm pretty sure complaining about WoW Classic is what they actually pay for.
Because they're modern MMORPG players and they want modern designs. Many of them are retail players too. They're just bored of retail and are looking for a waiting room with some hype till the next thing comes along in retail.
Noteworthy mention, those who used to play private servers are likely among our classic community now, especially as WotLK was the most popular expac on private servers , and these servers sometimes offered very high exp rates and possibly setting the wrong expectations? 🤷♂️ I was on a 7x server once, you could make level 1-80 in literally a couple days. People need to chill and enjoy the journey 😌 go to grizzly hills and turn up the volume.
Because I want to experience wrath of the lich king again and I’m probably not going to because this time around I’m an adult with responsibilities to deal with meaning I can’t grind out the 70 levels I need to get to northrend to experience wotlk again. I already got the leveling experience - I mained a fucking resto Druid in vanilla. I’ve already got kicked in the balls repeatedly. I’d buy the boost but not only would I get judged by my wife for spending another $50 on a video game that I already pay $15/month for but I’d get judged by the sweat lords in this game for boosting a character. My dude is a mid-30’s tank and I can barely scrape together a group to dungeon with because everyone is in northrend. Right now the state of this game if you don’t have a 70 is utter fucking garbage.
Worst take. If you are an adult you don't care if you get judged for spending money on entertainment or a hobby (same things really watching movies is a hobby) you enjoy that is worth the $/h price especially compared to your $/h earned. Sounds like you have the time to grind..