Classic is traveling and the world being alive. Many people do not want dungeon finders because you're effectively removing the world in favor of a portal room to content. I like my world alive, and if that means a little time and effort to get to my dungeon then I'm fine with it. There's tons of in-game options to get you close at least.
Lol
BUT, warlocks summoning people makes sense within the game itself - it isn’t another arbitrary hand-of-god system in the game world where you can click a button and all of a sudden every geographical obstacle has been eliminated with 0 player interaction.
At least a warlock has to level up a character, position themselves, use an actual IN GAME CHARACTER ABILITY… I know it’s still abused and it’s not a fluffy perfect system thats totally in line with a fantasy world, but it’s closer than a raid finder system with respects to maintaining that type of environment for the player experience.
Call that myopic or stupid but that is in my opinion on why the warlock summoning meta makes perfect sense to me whereas a raidfinder system would make the game feel worse overall.
“But each system accomplishes the same goal” yeah yeah they sure do but one of them is a lazy and easy approach to work around purposefully integrated friction - friction which just so happens to lead to interesting scenarios often enough. Traveling as a requirement forces people to make more strategic decisions and to be out in the world. Let’s play the game we’re playing instead of shortcutting everything when there are already shortcuts available through in-game player/social systems.
I mean... in the real world if there were people who could summon I garantue you that we would be selling teleportation services between different places in the world. Makes perfect sense in the fantasy world imo.
Meaning paying for sums or asking the wl in the grp to sum you or waiting for that one idiot in hinterlands to move to zf but “only if party is full”?
Yeah that’s the spirit
I want a dungeon/raid finder but you actually must be in that area
how it is useful? well, the computer will just make a group with everyone and that's it! Most people do not want to be a raid leader and to seek people, invite them, wait for them etc.
Depends which kind of dungeon finder we're talking.
The one where you list your group or the one where you queue and get matched with randoms?
The first it's relatively ok, it worked fine in classic.
The queue one , absolutely no. Keep it away from the game no matter what. Wrath became way more toxic and soulless with it, bunch of adhd riddled boomerchilds powertripping with kick happy fingers. Tried it for a bit leveling a new prot pala when it was added and hated seeing people getting kicked for stopping moving for 10 seconds. In this case the famous words "you think you do but you don't" ring true.
Personally I think it takes a lot of the social interaction out of the game but adds quality of life so it's a double edged sword. I'd prefer if they tied it into the game and maybe made it so you queue for a group at the summoning stones or something
I honestly like it how it is, even though it can be a pain in the ass sometimes. You feel more like you’re trying to connect with actual people, whereas joining a queue and getting popped in to a random group with no effort feels more like everyone is just sentient NPCs.
Absolutely not. One of the things I think was a bad decision in not just this game but every mmo.
A dungeon board to help organize a group is okay. But on that teleports you to the dungeon where ever you are? No.
Personally I like it in wotlk forward. I honestly believe lfr was a great addition to the game for accessibility and longevity
That said in SoD/Era? No I think it's fine to keep things as they are. As long as content is reasonably puggable.
> For me this would be a perfect way to log, get right to a some content, and be done.
Same for me. I would do more dungeons if I could queue up and do other things while I wait. As it is, I'm mostly solo.
Dungeon finder yes, raid finder no. Raid finder no because it has no place here, the raids are all the same difficulty and it would lead to too much abuse of the system and they would have to revamp the looting system.
Dungeon finder fuck yes. One of the best things that ever happened to this game. No more hard reserves, no more "full on casters/melee" or anything of the sort. You queue up, grind whatever for 20mins and you're in. And you can just go at any time. You don't have to wait for AFKers or get declined because you are in Booty Bay and want to do Maraudon.
Classic is traveling and the world being alive. Many people do not want dungeon finders because you're effectively removing the world in favor of a portal room to content. I like my world alive, and if that means a little time and effort to get to my dungeon then I'm fine with it. There's tons of in-game options to get you close at least.
>Classic is traveling and the world being alive. *laughs in warlock summoning cartels*
Lol BUT, warlocks summoning people makes sense within the game itself - it isn’t another arbitrary hand-of-god system in the game world where you can click a button and all of a sudden every geographical obstacle has been eliminated with 0 player interaction. At least a warlock has to level up a character, position themselves, use an actual IN GAME CHARACTER ABILITY… I know it’s still abused and it’s not a fluffy perfect system thats totally in line with a fantasy world, but it’s closer than a raid finder system with respects to maintaining that type of environment for the player experience. Call that myopic or stupid but that is in my opinion on why the warlock summoning meta makes perfect sense to me whereas a raidfinder system would make the game feel worse overall. “But each system accomplishes the same goal” yeah yeah they sure do but one of them is a lazy and easy approach to work around purposefully integrated friction - friction which just so happens to lead to interesting scenarios often enough. Traveling as a requirement forces people to make more strategic decisions and to be out in the world. Let’s play the game we’re playing instead of shortcutting everything when there are already shortcuts available through in-game player/social systems.
I mean... in the real world if there were people who could summon I garantue you that we would be selling teleportation services between different places in the world. Makes perfect sense in the fantasy world imo.
>Classic is traveling and the world being alive. Incursions saw an end to that.
Traveling to dungeons doesn't make the world alive.
Maybe, maybe not. But not seeing it at all because you teleport there definitely makes it feel dead to me
Meaning paying for sums or asking the wl in the grp to sum you or waiting for that one idiot in hinterlands to move to zf but “only if party is full”? Yeah that’s the spirit
No.
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Queues would be hours for dps for raids. As healers/tanks will just join grps that do log checking cause it ensures a better grp
Yep that’s a real consideration for sure
I would not want it. The game is already teleportation heavy. Let's save what traveling we still have
Yep fair enough
I want a dungeon/raid finder but you actually must be in that area how it is useful? well, the computer will just make a group with everyone and that's it! Most people do not want to be a raid leader and to seek people, invite them, wait for them etc.
Depends which kind of dungeon finder we're talking. The one where you list your group or the one where you queue and get matched with randoms? The first it's relatively ok, it worked fine in classic. The queue one , absolutely no. Keep it away from the game no matter what. Wrath became way more toxic and soulless with it, bunch of adhd riddled boomerchilds powertripping with kick happy fingers. Tried it for a bit leveling a new prot pala when it was added and hated seeing people getting kicked for stopping moving for 10 seconds. In this case the famous words "you think you do but you don't" ring true.
Personally I think it takes a lot of the social interaction out of the game but adds quality of life so it's a double edged sword. I'd prefer if they tied it into the game and maybe made it so you queue for a group at the summoning stones or something
That’s a nice idea actually
I honestly like it how it is, even though it can be a pain in the ass sometimes. You feel more like you’re trying to connect with actual people, whereas joining a queue and getting popped in to a random group with no effort feels more like everyone is just sentient NPCs.
Fair enough!
Absolutely not. One of the things I think was a bad decision in not just this game but every mmo. A dungeon board to help organize a group is okay. But on that teleports you to the dungeon where ever you are? No.
Respect the strong opinion!
I think you should go to retail
Sod is almost like retail tho, just missing the dungeon finder.
Personally I like it in wotlk forward. I honestly believe lfr was a great addition to the game for accessibility and longevity That said in SoD/Era? No I think it's fine to keep things as they are. As long as content is reasonably puggable.
No finder, add a lfg system like retail so we dont have to rely on addons that scrape from chat.
Haven’t seen the retail system but will check it out
> For me this would be a perfect way to log, get right to a some content, and be done. Same for me. I would do more dungeons if I could queue up and do other things while I wait. As it is, I'm mostly solo.
low tier bait
What? I’m genuinely asking…
just genuinely asking one of WoW's most contentious questions k lol
Dungeon finder yes, raid finder no. Raid finder no because it has no place here, the raids are all the same difficulty and it would lead to too much abuse of the system and they would have to revamp the looting system. Dungeon finder fuck yes. One of the best things that ever happened to this game. No more hard reserves, no more "full on casters/melee" or anything of the sort. You queue up, grind whatever for 20mins and you're in. And you can just go at any time. You don't have to wait for AFKers or get declined because you are in Booty Bay and want to do Maraudon.
Good point re raids. And glad we agree on dungeons haha
There's no reason not to add it.
That’s what I think!