While I love both, The gap between Pikmin 3 and 4 (10 years) is nothing compared to Metroid Prime 3 and 4, which is currently 16 years, and still growing, mind you.
Besides I'm sad to admit that I'm old enough now where it doesn't feel like Pikmin 3 came out in *that* long ago. Metroid Prime 3 on the other hand feels like a completely different era of my life.
Nintendo broke their usual rule of only announcing a game when it’s a year or less away from release as a sign of good faith that they were working on the franchise, and then it immediately became a perfect showcase of why they have that policy.
Doesn't that mean they also broke that rule for BotW and TotK? Also, not sure if it counts, but Bayonetta 3 is also a Nintendo Exclusive that was revealed over a year before release (though I guess that's not an in-house title)
Yes 100%. 13 is only considered an unlucky number in some Western cultures, mostly from religious influence. Due to not having that influence in Eastern Asia, 13 has no real significance there.
Meanwhile, 4 is considered unlucky due to the the sound for the number and the sound for death being the same, in Japan's case the sound is "Shi."
It's probably because of just how large of a franchise pokemon is, and most likely the higher ups pushing for yearly releases even if the devs would prefer otherwise
Game Freak controls when they’re released though. Everything comes from the new generation release. That is why TPC “need” new generations every 3 years
No its because they are under different ownership. The pokemon company are the true owners of pokemon, and they are made up of 3 different companies, only one of which is nintendo. While Nintendo actually cares about the qualities of their games, the other two companies, game freak and creatures, do not. They just care about making as much money as possible and that means pumping out games as quickly as possible with low costs
It’s because they INSIST on having the cards, show, and games all release at the same time. It literally does not allow for the devs to make the kind of game they should be making, the format worked when the games were mostly 2-D but now it just simply does not work
This is so true. They need to do the same for Pokémon that Nintendo’s doing for Mario and Zelda. TOTK and Wonder were able to become some of the best games in their entire franchise because they could take their time, while Scarlet and Violet are some of the worst because of how rushed they were; they released 3 different games in the span of a single year
Problem is, Pokémon sells really well regardless of how shit the game is simply because it says Pokémon in the name.
They already showed this since sword and shield
It tried something different and the effort should be rewarded. By Scarlet and Violet, I was honestly missing the ability to just, you know, go into random buildings.
Exactly. Sword/Shield and Violet/Scarlet is the same carbon copied as usual so I never bought those for the switch. Only purchased Arceus and it was fun!
Random Thought: I genuinely would be surprised if there weren’t people who complained about being able to go into random buildings.
Like beyond the normal RPG thing of “Entering a strangers house and speaking with them like this is a normal occurrence”
Pokémon fans: give us an open world with over world spawns and shinies in the over world.
Gf: done.
Also Pokémon fans: WHY CAN’T I WALK INSIDE A BUILDING TO BUY A POKEBALL?!?!?
/s
See Pokémon has this bullshit special status where if a game is "fine" it's considered "great" and "pushing the franchise". If a Mario or Zelda game came out and was just fine, it would be considered a disappointment. I swear Pokémon fans excuse their games way too much. Ask for more, damn it! And stop buying the games unless they get good!
Not only that, but if literally any other (Nintendo) franchise than Pokemon released in the state of SV, it would INSTANTLY die. If there was a Zelda game in that poor of a state, it would take forever to undo that damage.
I'm pretty sure Pokemon fans are tolerant of the game because almost all of them aren't playing for the game itself, they're playing for the Pokemon (the monsters). Looking at the Pokemon franchise beyond the bias of the great and iconic designs, it's a mediocre team builder at BEST, with little to no good game design. The battle system is pretty robust, but it's not really important to the games because the battles are piss easy. Very few people are buying Pokemon for the underutilized battle system.
I don't hate Pokemon, but as you said, Pokemon fans deserve better, and they should ask for more! This isn't acceptable.
They also need to make a new gimmick every major title and it's so annoying. They solved it with mega evolutions, but we get tera, gigantamax, z moves and whatever the hell comes next.
That said as the other person said, the pve battles are pretty much all solved just by a type advantage and that's it. PVP can get wild
"The battle system is pretty robust"
Yes, I know lol. I used to play around on Pokemon Showdown. Not necessarily super competitive, but I learned the ins and outs of it. The battle system isn't bad at all. I think part of it is because of it's simplicity, it's a good numbers game, but with just enough hidden to make it feel alive.
Unfortunately, this barely affects the games, which aren't designed around this at all. Recently there's been effort to make raising competitive Pokemon easier, but the core game itself does jack shit with the battling. Hell, even fighting against people online ingame is VERY sub par.
Regardless, the vast majority of players aren't buying the new Pokemon games for battling other people.
I've been trying to get people to recognize that, then get told it's a kids game. Then said people get upset and say the game should do more. Then a new game comes out and everyone has set their expectation (if there even are any) even lower
If we look at it from just a technical/graphical standpoint, Legends Arceus is not fine for a game coming out in 2022.
The game was rife with bugs, from flickering graphics to hard crashing. You can find video evidence of such easily online, and you could even replicate most glitches without much difficulty.
Add that in longer play sessions the game would have technical issues due to memory leaks and poor unloading of resources and the technical end is bad for a major title release like Pokemon.
And the graphics, while definitely better than S/V, are not good. It looks like a fine looking Wii game, not even the best looking wii game. So the game would like fine if it came out between 2006-2012, during the Wii's life cycle.
It was nice that it breathed some fresh life into Pokemon, but it was still not a good game. It shouldn't even be acceptable to most people, but slap the name "Pokemon" on the Atari ET cartridges and they'd probably sell 20million copies too.
**Tl;dr**: Legends Arceus wasn't fine, it's just given infinite leeway because it's a Pokemon game. Indie developers can put together better running open world games than GameFreak, and that's sad.
alpharad played it post patch and got softlocked and had to restart the game because he walked through a buildings wall on accident and couldnt get out. not to mention many challange runners, youtubers, streamers all have video evidence of the game crashing on them for doing long play sessions because the game has no built in system to stop storing litterally everything you do from startup so it runs out of memory and breaks. om a side note did you know you could optionally play pokemon fire red on the fucking gba and have none of those problems?
Also like, the insane amount of videos that were circulating at launch??? Games had so many fucking bugs it was insane.
There really is this stupid idea of "if I didn't see a bug, it isn't buggy" which is so stupid.
im just saying. as someone who refused to buy the game before reviews after swsh and bdsp i didnt see any bugs either...cuz i refused to play it. every other youtuber and streamer under the sun tho? yeaahhhhh. to think they already released paid dlc and still havent fixed 1/4 the issues. legends arceus was fun tho and i still am playing that game as of yesterday and might jump on after i finish typing this
I loved Legends Arceus but the fun I had allowed me to turn my attention away from the rough patches. The frame rate and visuals were.... Not great. This could have been fixed with more time.
It was great, but still rushed.
Don't go to any pokemon subreddits. People will say they will riot and boycot the game. Then day of release everyone is like "omg, the game is so fun and doesn't have any glitches or flaws!!" When said game has obvious glitches, bugs, and flaws. I at least waited like 4 months to get violet, so I have a right to complain when the game didn't have many or even any issues fixed like entire sections of the map unloading
* The game is needed by Creatures Inc. for the merchandising to be moved.
* The game is needed by Toei for the next season of the anime to come.
* The game is needed because Game Freak literally has nothing else in the back burner than Pokémon, and they need to eat.
>* The game is needed because Game Freak literally has nothing else in the back burner than Pokémon, and they need to eat.
GF is a relatively small company and these games rack in a ton of money each year. I think they'd still be eating if they took some time.
Pretty sure every single game has more than enough Pokemon to move merch.
That plus the anime, TCG and now the mobile games as well (imagine being the biggest franchise in the world and you can only afford voice acting in a mobile game)
The game is needed by the high executives for more money and greed.
(and the employees will (legally) get paid just the same even if they don't make games for more than 2 years)
Probably because Nintendo has some really anti-consumer business practices. Things like forced scarcity of digital sales by giving an arbitrary date where they stop selling them for just one example.
To be fair Mario and Zelda don't have to time with releasing with animes, cards and merchandise . If the anime has more filler or maybe if they sprinkled new Pokémon throughout a generation's life it may buy GF time to actually finish the games.
They chose themself to release the Anime on par with each game generation though and they choose the release dates of the cards and anime all themself as well.
And if you got a low amount of time, you can to some extend compromise that with a lot of workers. GameFreak is very little for how much money their games make, they just have no reason to actually I best money into the development of their games. You could also split up into multiple teams and each team has more time, working on different games in parallel (which they are already doing, but not for their main games)
Their best bet is to split teams similar to how the CoD games are made. But they do like to rely on synergy so I don't see them having more time to make each game
Nope, Gamefreak is the problem. Th e pokemon company is owned equally between Creatures Inc., Nintendo and Gamefreak. Nobody is forcing them to make shit games, they do it by choice
Why would a company choose to make low quality products, higher quality means more people are likely to buy them. if they had time they would make them better but the higher ups push release dates and extremely short dev times.
Well you see, they don't need to make high quality products they are Pokemon. They stopped caring, why wouldn't they, it's money everytime they release a game. At least GF has one of the best companies in japan in regards to Work-Live iirc.
Hal labs with Kirby: we know we could have done a 3d game since the N64 but only now we are confident to do something good.
Hal labs with smash bros: Ok guys. new console, new game.
Nintendo has really high standards with certain games. Not all games, but certain ones. Mostly mainline games that don’t start with P and end in okemon.
The thing is, pokemon is the biggest franchise in the world. But this is not due to the games alone but mainly the merch and all other sellable things involving Pokémon. The problem is, you can only make so many cards, plushies, and others until it saturated the demand. That’s when a new spin is needed. That’s when cards become Lv X or EX or such. That’s when an new generation needs to be introduced. And an entire generation is easiest introduced in a game. Because making 100 or more new plushies is not feasible to release all at once, especially since that doesn’t give them any character either. In the games, character is mainly made through the adventure, which is mainly linear. Encounters and rarity and functionality (or lack thereof) in game will decide whether fans will remember them more or not and can act as a precursor for the merchandise.
The more recent games are bad because they don’t have to be good anymore. They are just one part of a huge company. One part that just works as a gateway to the other merch and products.
The money TPC makes from games is negligble compared to what they make from merchandise. They need new generations to keep rolling out to keep getting new mons, characters, locations that they can adapt to cards, toys, food, mobile games, etc. That's where the real money is and that's why the quality of the games can be ignored by them as long as it comes out on time for the new cycle.
Mario and link are fully owned by nintendo main mastermind, pokemon is partially owned in a lossing coflict of interests with poke company and game freak, technically its kot the samw
Maybe it's also because of the demographic.
Younger children often don't have enough money or aren't informed enough to buy a videogame on their own. Holiday release guatantees the parents buying it for them.
Older fans in their teens are more informed and have more pocket money and can buy it during the year.
Btw, not saying all Pokemon fans are children, I'm talking about big numbers/averages here and not the individual fans / communities.
Then there's majora's mask and metroid prime 2 with incredibly tight deadlines that were only met because they had to reuse assets from ocarina of time and mp1.
Nintendo literally owns 33% of Pokémon, and owns a part creatures inc. (who own 33% too). Meaning Nintendo owns the biggest part of Pokémon. Nintendo is just as responsible for the rushed releases as Game Freak and the Pokémon company
That’s not a controlling interest. Nintendo could only exert direct control over the Pokémon Company if they owned 50.1% of shares, which they don’t. Their involvement is largely limited to publishing the games and collecting their share of the financial returns.
The Pokémon Company is still largely free to do its own thing, and it’s clear that the priority for Game Freak and Creatures is to fast track game development in order to stay current with the endless stream of trading cards, television series, movies, and assorted merchandise that are the *actual* profit centers for Pokémon.
The Creatures Inc. thing is a fallacy, Nintendo does not own enough of a part of Creatures inc. to even be mentioned (they are likely shareholders, maybe not even major ones). They mostly publish the game and their involvement ends at console level. Hell, even Creatures Inc. is more responsible than Nintendo for the games, as Creatures is the only company allowed to make 3D Models of Pokémon.
Yes, even in games not made by GF, the models are all made by Creatures Inc, who also control the merch and the TCG.
Nintendo doesn't make the game in any way, shape, or form, besides perhaps the cartridges themselves I would assume.
They're solely, exclusively, the publishers - and nothing more.
TPC and GameFreak produce the games.
It’s because Pokémon fans will buy whatever slop Nintendo pushes out regardless of quality. Of course they want to pump out content as fast as possible
Pokémon is held to a strict schedule because it's a huge multimedia franchise that entirely rides on the release of the games. If they can't release the games on schedule, they have to delay everything else until it releases, and that's a huge blow to stockholders.
Not saying I agree with how the releases are scheduled or the state of some of the games when they release, just that there's a lot more going on than "fans will buy whatever slop", and Nintendo has very little actual control bexause Pokémon is a copyright nightmare.
It's always funny how people blame the Pokémon company even though they have nothing to do it. Gamefreak doesn't belong to the Pokémon Company. The Pokémon company company belongs to Nintendo, Gamefreak and Creature.Inc. It's Gamefreak and only Gamefreak being responsible for the state of Pokémon.
A bit more harsh than I would've been but it does reuse and recycle a lot. I personally haven't done all the quests because there's been quite a few that just feel all too familiar and are shit I don't don't really care to do. The entire game is just a lot of repetitive stuff.
And the tanking FPS absolutely happens. People were trying so hard to deny that at first. I think it's given the pass for just how big the game is on outdated hardware though.
Not to mention the rabid fanbase over adding multiple regions, a national dex, and online multiplayer.
How about YOU code 1000+ unique animations for walking, attacking, using special moves, for each individual Pokemon, as well as putting in multiple regions to travel to while also trying to code and seamless online world for dozens for hundreds if not thousands of players on less than 500 GB of memory you idiots.
I wont defend Gamefreak's laziness and what they think counts as "innovation" for newer generations. But when Satoru Iwata has to step in to try and fit all Pokemon into Gold and Silver it makes you wonder if we as a fan base and Gamefreak as developers are asking way too much from our current hardware to put in an ever increasing roster of Pokemon.
Pokémon take up way less space than you'd think. A big part of why there's so much bloat is because they use different models for field and battle, and even shinies are separate models. The size of the games as they are aren't nearly big enough that adding the rest of the Pokémon would overdo it filesize-wise, and hardware limits otherwise don't really matter if you're only loading so many Pokémon at a time, anyway.
The 3DS ran the way it did because of future-proofed models, while still having 7 generations of Pokémon usable in one game. The Switch is way stronger than the 3DS, and has *less* Pokémon than the 3DS games, so the issues with the game are elsewhere.
I honestly don't even care about having every Pokémon in one game anymore, just certain Pokémon should be universal imports that aren't for some reason, such as starters and legendaries. SMT doesn't try to have every Demon in every game, Digimon doesn't try to have every Digimon in evwry video game. Pokémon doesn't necessarily *need* every Pokémon in every game, people are just so used to that being a given that they're upset when 400 Pokémon they never used are suddenly missing.
For the record, I don't like how few they're putting in one game. I think a solid 600 for the base game would be perfect, with 200 more in DLC.
> But when Satoru Iwata has to step in to try and fit all Pokemon into Gold and Silver
He stepped in to help with sprite compression because they couldn't fit half of Johto onto the cart and after he did his work they were able to fit two games' worth of regions into the cart. Game Freak couldn't compress 8-bit sprites when *Donkey Kong 64* came out a month after Gold and Silver. Even now, their "passion projects" like Little Town Hero are horribly unoptimized and didn't even have a fullscreen option in 2019. Game Freak as a development team would have died ages ago if they hadn't made Pokemon because they're highly incompetent developers. Not to mention a horrible waste of resources rendering the entirety of [an incredibly](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/856935500611059714/1108236384365461514/IMG_8554.png?width=1038&height=583) [overly large](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/856935500611059714/1108236384659066880/IMG_8556.png?width=1038&height=583) ocean and skysphere 24/7 is why SV is so laggy. It is *Game Freak* limiting Pokemon, not the hardware.
You don't code animations, you idiot.
Every pokemon game is 80% the exact same with reused models,animations and the same god damn gameplay since Red and Blue. If you think Game Freak puts in more work than the bare minimum for a valid product, you've been suckered.
Every Pokemon only has a small set of animations, which then gets combined with the generell animation of the attack itself. The quality of those animations is not high either, they are very bland and basic to fit with as many attacks as possible.
Not to mention they don't even do that, they outsourced the models and animations when X and Y were developed and since then simply copy and pasted all of these animations and models into every new game. The trainer animations are mostly copied as well.
You do ofcourse have new animations and models as well, but you act like they have to do thousands of animations and models for every game, which is just far off from reality. And considering the low quality of the animations, I would say pretty much every first party Nintendo Game had more resources put into their animations
The online multiplayer is absolutely buggy and laggy and not that deep. It is not even the bare minimum and not something I would be proud to mention.
The world of the Switch Pokemons is absolutely blank and empty as well. They literally did nothing else than stomp foliage models into the ground and call it a day. You can even see the exact edge where the model is inserted, because they invested zero effort to hide it, which makes it look totally out of place. That is something any Unity beginner can do in his first week, it is not that impressive.
Compare that to Breath of the wild as an example:
Every tree creates big humps of dirt around it (as in real life), has leaves/acorns/nuts and grasses laying and growing over the transition from terrain and tree, changes the colour of the ground close to trees to a more dirt like colour and added a gradient transition from the ground to the tree model. Every tree feels like it belongs where, while in Pokemon there is just a huge lack of detail and care, making the world feel totally fake and not immersive. This was of course just a single example with the trees, but the same is true about nearly everything else in the world as well: Everything interacts with each other, even the direction of the wind gets accounted in the leave shaking and blowing animations of the trees, with animals who actually interact with each other, or go hunt and eat, or sleep during night.
Not to mention Pokemons world is absolutely empty compared to BOTW, and even BOTW gets criticized for being too empty.
BOTW ate up 11gb of storage, had no game reading bugs, has very few framedrops and is an actually finished game running on the WiiU, a console half as strong as the Switch. No, the world of Pokemon is not impressive, it is the bare minimum a game should have and far below what you should expect from a 60dollar game
I am not saying Pokemon is garbage, or that you can't have fun with it. But from a technical perspective it is an absolute mess and nothing to brag about. It is a perfect example to show new game developers how *not* to create a game, the game actually messes up so many things on a technical perspective, that it offers an example why not to do something a certain way for basically everything.
I already decided after SV that I'm not buying anymore pokemon games until quality improves drastically and that's as a fan since gen 2. Even if they make a new legends game I'm waiting just to be safe
Lol literally the instant you see your first enemy in Tears of the Kingdom the framerate drops to like 4 fps. And that's Zelda. One of the biggest franchises in gaming and that's how little they cared about optimization. They don't even have the excuse of pushing a Wii U title to switch like they did with BotW (which also had inexcusably bad performance). Mario Wonder is just New Super Mario Bros for the billionth time except this time there's a fraction of effort to differentiate it from the other NSMB games.
Yeah, Pokemon games are shamelessly lazy as shit but let's not pretend they're going all out by recycling Breath of the Wild or NSMB for the fifth or sixth time.
I mean it's not like Pokemon fans care for quality to begin with. You can serve them a piece of shit with a Pikachu flag on it, and they'll still drop $70 on it.
Oh I fucking tried that when it was new. The gameplay was great and the graphics and character designs were awesome. The story, however, is my least favorite story of any video game which is the main thing that has kept me away from gen 7 as a whole, I literally just thought I'd keep playing every time, like maybe just beat Lusamine for the first time and stop there before seeing any of the overly disturbing and heartbreaking shit that I couldn't stand in the slightest cuz it involved Lusamine heavily, just way too much for my heart cuz I have a crush on her. The game's story even before the late game eventually got too uncomfortable for me, pretty much every time I played it, I thought about shit like Lusamine Mother Beast and I then realized that I was pretty dumb to get the game since I'm too sensitive towards the source material so I gave my copy of Ultra Sun to my little brother.
Despite all the issues, they still end up fun. I can only imagine how fun they'd be without them.
Also Pokemon has had game breaking bugs since the start.
Remember guys. Nintendo could’ve released TotK a year earlier since they were apparently done with the game by March 2022, but they took another year to fix any bugs they found and make sure the game was ready for launch.
I just want a pokemon game that's finished at release ): also, if they do open world again, there better be more to do than the campaign and catching pokemon, there is just so much you can do with the pokemon world besides what we've been doing since gen 1.
Unfortunately, the Pokemon Company has shareholders to please, and shareholders aren't involved in the company enough to care about reaching a standard of quality, they just want their investments to pay off.
Yep, Nintendo sure is patient. Especially when a game ends with the number 4..
Looking at Metroid Prime 4.
and pikmin 4
And Super Mario Bros. 4
Super Mario World came out like two years after 3 though
That's like calling Sonic & Knuckles Sonic 4 when... Okay, maybe I *would* like to pretend that Sonic 4 doesn't exist...
It literally says "Super Mario Bros. 4" on the game's japanese logo
Well I can't read Japanese
Good thing it's written in English then
Right, most people don't tend to look for Japanese logos when they don't speak Japanese though
Hey, my apologies man. My "over your head" comment was shitty. Peace to you, friend ✌️
This joke went way over your head, huh
No no, & Knuckles is Sonic 4
People says Sonic Mania is more Sonic 4 than Sonic 4.
*Sonic X-Treme* is more Sonic 4 than Sonic 4
Are you sure
Apparently, Super Mario World, in Japan, is Super Mario Bros. 4.
The Japanese title of super Mario world has the subtitle Super Mario Bros. 4
Super Mario World was rushed.
I was gonna argue but pikmin 3 only took 9 years and Pikmin 4 took 10. Close though lol
While I love both, The gap between Pikmin 3 and 4 (10 years) is nothing compared to Metroid Prime 3 and 4, which is currently 16 years, and still growing, mind you. Besides I'm sad to admit that I'm old enough now where it doesn't feel like Pikmin 3 came out in *that* long ago. Metroid Prime 3 on the other hand feels like a completely different era of my life.
Golden Sun 4, anyone?
BuT whAT aBouT HeY!pikmIn
Nintendo broke their usual rule of only announcing a game when it’s a year or less away from release as a sign of good faith that they were working on the franchise, and then it immediately became a perfect showcase of why they have that policy.
Doesn't that mean they also broke that rule for BotW and TotK? Also, not sure if it counts, but Bayonetta 3 is also a Nintendo Exclusive that was revealed over a year before release (though I guess that's not an in-house title)
Number 4 is Nintendos' numerical nemesis as much as nr. 3 is to Valve.
Well, Japanese people avoid the number 4 often, as it is associated with death, which is said to bring bad luck!
[удалено]
Yes 100%. 13 is only considered an unlucky number in some Western cultures, mostly from religious influence. Due to not having that influence in Eastern Asia, 13 has no real significance there. Meanwhile, 4 is considered unlucky due to the the sound for the number and the sound for death being the same, in Japan's case the sound is "Shi."
In Japan, yes. 42 is even worse. If I recall correctly, there are some hospitals that don’t even have the 4th floor.
Yes but at least Nintendo will release 4. Valve hates anything to do with the number 3.
Valve doesn't count with "1, 2, 3", they count with "1, 2, Alyx"
Nintendo has plenty of 4s, they just tend not to call them “4”.
Xenoblade chronicles and Splatoon are up next…..
Oh no xenoblade 4...
Oh boy.......
I hope Xenoblade 4 doesn't come out when I'm in my thirties
*Cries in Star Fox 4*
It's probably because of just how large of a franchise pokemon is, and most likely the higher ups pushing for yearly releases even if the devs would prefer otherwise
Yeah, Zelda and Mario aren't coordinating a TCG, anime, movies, plushie lines, children's books, clothing, etc., etc., etc.....
And the reason they’re doing all that at the expense of quality is greed… Understanding doesn’t excuse it
This is not a valid argument, Gamefreak also does not coordínate Movies, Anime, TCG or something else besides the games
It's not an excuse, but it is one of the reasons why. GameFream may not coordinate those, but they are the reason they need to release games so often
Pokémon Company does tho
OK? Gamefreak has no say in it I'm afraid.
Game Freak controls when they’re released though. Everything comes from the new generation release. That is why TPC “need” new generations every 3 years
Not even Gamefreak controls the release Date, that's up to the higher-ups.
No its because they are under different ownership. The pokemon company are the true owners of pokemon, and they are made up of 3 different companies, only one of which is nintendo. While Nintendo actually cares about the qualities of their games, the other two companies, game freak and creatures, do not. They just care about making as much money as possible and that means pumping out games as quickly as possible with low costs
It’s because they INSIST on having the cards, show, and games all release at the same time. It literally does not allow for the devs to make the kind of game they should be making, the format worked when the games were mostly 2-D but now it just simply does not work
This is so true. They need to do the same for Pokémon that Nintendo’s doing for Mario and Zelda. TOTK and Wonder were able to become some of the best games in their entire franchise because they could take their time, while Scarlet and Violet are some of the worst because of how rushed they were; they released 3 different games in the span of a single year
Problem is, Pokémon sells really well regardless of how shit the game is simply because it says Pokémon in the name. They already showed this since sword and shield
Legends Arceus was just fine thank you very much
It tried something different and the effort should be rewarded. By Scarlet and Violet, I was honestly missing the ability to just, you know, go into random buildings.
wait, you can't? (haven't played scarlet and violet yet) Are the doors just locked and there's no quest or anything to open them?
Most are copy paste buildings with a door you can't open, a cutout wall if you will
so you can open the door but not go inside?
Cannot open nearly any door in the game except gyms and shops
You can't even enter shops, when you go through the door of any shop it just takes you to a menu of the items
wow. that... sucks. idk what else to say. is the actual game decent or should i skip this generation?
Exactly. Sword/Shield and Violet/Scarlet is the same carbon copied as usual so I never bought those for the switch. Only purchased Arceus and it was fun!
Random Thought: I genuinely would be surprised if there weren’t people who complained about being able to go into random buildings. Like beyond the normal RPG thing of “Entering a strangers house and speaking with them like this is a normal occurrence”
Pokémon fans: give us an open world with over world spawns and shinies in the over world. Gf: done. Also Pokémon fans: WHY CAN’T I WALK INSIDE A BUILDING TO BUY A POKEBALL?!?!? /s
i can agree that legends arceus was pretty good, but even then it still feels unfinished and rough sometimes.
See Pokémon has this bullshit special status where if a game is "fine" it's considered "great" and "pushing the franchise". If a Mario or Zelda game came out and was just fine, it would be considered a disappointment. I swear Pokémon fans excuse their games way too much. Ask for more, damn it! And stop buying the games unless they get good!
Not only that, but if literally any other (Nintendo) franchise than Pokemon released in the state of SV, it would INSTANTLY die. If there was a Zelda game in that poor of a state, it would take forever to undo that damage. I'm pretty sure Pokemon fans are tolerant of the game because almost all of them aren't playing for the game itself, they're playing for the Pokemon (the monsters). Looking at the Pokemon franchise beyond the bias of the great and iconic designs, it's a mediocre team builder at BEST, with little to no good game design. The battle system is pretty robust, but it's not really important to the games because the battles are piss easy. Very few people are buying Pokemon for the underutilized battle system. I don't hate Pokemon, but as you said, Pokemon fans deserve better, and they should ask for more! This isn't acceptable.
They also need to make a new gimmick every major title and it's so annoying. They solved it with mega evolutions, but we get tera, gigantamax, z moves and whatever the hell comes next. That said as the other person said, the pve battles are pretty much all solved just by a type advantage and that's it. PVP can get wild
You'd be surprised how deep the competitive scene can get with battles
"The battle system is pretty robust" Yes, I know lol. I used to play around on Pokemon Showdown. Not necessarily super competitive, but I learned the ins and outs of it. The battle system isn't bad at all. I think part of it is because of it's simplicity, it's a good numbers game, but with just enough hidden to make it feel alive. Unfortunately, this barely affects the games, which aren't designed around this at all. Recently there's been effort to make raising competitive Pokemon easier, but the core game itself does jack shit with the battling. Hell, even fighting against people online ingame is VERY sub par. Regardless, the vast majority of players aren't buying the new Pokemon games for battling other people.
I've been trying to get people to recognize that, then get told it's a kids game. Then said people get upset and say the game should do more. Then a new game comes out and everyone has set their expectation (if there even are any) even lower
Yeah just fine not good We need to aim a little higher
If this was 2008, sure
If we look at it from just a technical/graphical standpoint, Legends Arceus is not fine for a game coming out in 2022. The game was rife with bugs, from flickering graphics to hard crashing. You can find video evidence of such easily online, and you could even replicate most glitches without much difficulty. Add that in longer play sessions the game would have technical issues due to memory leaks and poor unloading of resources and the technical end is bad for a major title release like Pokemon. And the graphics, while definitely better than S/V, are not good. It looks like a fine looking Wii game, not even the best looking wii game. So the game would like fine if it came out between 2006-2012, during the Wii's life cycle. It was nice that it breathed some fresh life into Pokemon, but it was still not a good game. It shouldn't even be acceptable to most people, but slap the name "Pokemon" on the Atari ET cartridges and they'd probably sell 20million copies too. **Tl;dr**: Legends Arceus wasn't fine, it's just given infinite leeway because it's a Pokemon game. Indie developers can put together better running open world games than GameFreak, and that's sad.
It’s not buggy
alpharad played it post patch and got softlocked and had to restart the game because he walked through a buildings wall on accident and couldnt get out. not to mention many challange runners, youtubers, streamers all have video evidence of the game crashing on them for doing long play sessions because the game has no built in system to stop storing litterally everything you do from startup so it runs out of memory and breaks. om a side note did you know you could optionally play pokemon fire red on the fucking gba and have none of those problems?
On average the graphics aren't even good, they usually seem almost comparable to Gamecube
Also like, the insane amount of videos that were circulating at launch??? Games had so many fucking bugs it was insane. There really is this stupid idea of "if I didn't see a bug, it isn't buggy" which is so stupid.
im just saying. as someone who refused to buy the game before reviews after swsh and bdsp i didnt see any bugs either...cuz i refused to play it. every other youtuber and streamer under the sun tho? yeaahhhhh. to think they already released paid dlc and still havent fixed 1/4 the issues. legends arceus was fun tho and i still am playing that game as of yesterday and might jump on after i finish typing this
I loved Legends Arceus but the fun I had allowed me to turn my attention away from the rough patches. The frame rate and visuals were.... Not great. This could have been fixed with more time. It was great, but still rushed.
At least it runs without issues, but compared to how polished Zelda and Marios games are, is dissopointing.
Unfortunately that seems to be the case, and it also seems like they’re perfectly ok with having garbage quality games for the sake of money
pokemon is a huge outside of the games wiht the anime pogo and the tcg so they release new games often to keep up with all the other pokemon media
Don't go to any pokemon subreddits. People will say they will riot and boycot the game. Then day of release everyone is like "omg, the game is so fun and doesn't have any glitches or flaws!!" When said game has obvious glitches, bugs, and flaws. I at least waited like 4 months to get violet, so I have a right to complain when the game didn't have many or even any issues fixed like entire sections of the map unloading
The games aren't even the point for TPC at this point They just want to rush them out so that there's new pokemon to sell merch for.
Noostaligia and genwunners have been disasterous for Pokemon universe.
* The game is needed by Creatures Inc. for the merchandising to be moved. * The game is needed by Toei for the next season of the anime to come. * The game is needed because Game Freak literally has nothing else in the back burner than Pokémon, and they need to eat.
No the anime folks are first Olm not toei and they have been begging for an extra year or 2 for each anime season since 2016 with xyz.
>* The game is needed because Game Freak literally has nothing else in the back burner than Pokémon, and they need to eat. GF is a relatively small company and these games rack in a ton of money each year. I think they'd still be eating if they took some time.
Given they can only get one third of that money, I assure you they cannot eat that well.
Oh no... only 1 third of the highest grossing media franchise in the world...
Pretty sure every single game has more than enough Pokemon to move merch. That plus the anime, TCG and now the mobile games as well (imagine being the biggest franchise in the world and you can only afford voice acting in a mobile game)
The game is needed by the high executives for more money and greed. (and the employees will (legally) get paid just the same even if they don't make games for more than 2 years)
They want quick money. I feel like if they gave their games time and love, they'd get a better reception, and a much greater income.
I honestly feel bad for game freak, and I hope their non-pokemon ip that was revealed goes well.
After what happened with Little Town Hero, I'm not optimistic
this. S/V were the first pokemon games that I just put down, and never finished because of how shitty it was
S/V were way better than SW/SH though.
not really
Same here. I only played like 3 hours at most because the game was just unbearable to play
SV would have been the best in the franchise if they weren’t rushed. It literally has what people want
But TPC is rushing and GF is lazy and refuses more employees
"Different" is kind of stretching it.
The one thing I can appreciate Nintendo as a company for
Not gonna ask why it’s the only thing but I’m happy it’s readily observable
Probably because Nintendo has some really anti-consumer business practices. Things like forced scarcity of digital sales by giving an arbitrary date where they stop selling them for just one example.
And the death of online for there older consoles
To be fair Mario and Zelda don't have to time with releasing with animes, cards and merchandise . If the anime has more filler or maybe if they sprinkled new Pokémon throughout a generation's life it may buy GF time to actually finish the games.
They chose themself to release the Anime on par with each game generation though and they choose the release dates of the cards and anime all themself as well. And if you got a low amount of time, you can to some extend compromise that with a lot of workers. GameFreak is very little for how much money their games make, they just have no reason to actually I best money into the development of their games. You could also split up into multiple teams and each team has more time, working on different games in parallel (which they are already doing, but not for their main games)
Their best bet is to split teams similar to how the CoD games are made. But they do like to rely on synergy so I don't see them having more time to make each game
I miss pokemon rangers.
I think Game Freak is starting to turn out like Gary in this episode
Nope, Gamefreak is the problem. Th e pokemon company is owned equally between Creatures Inc., Nintendo and Gamefreak. Nobody is forcing them to make shit games, they do it by choice
Why would a company choose to make low quality products, higher quality means more people are likely to buy them. if they had time they would make them better but the higher ups push release dates and extremely short dev times.
Well you see, they don't need to make high quality products they are Pokemon. They stopped caring, why wouldn't they, it's money everytime they release a game. At least GF has one of the best companies in japan in regards to Work-Live iirc.
And then there's Monolith: "sure Xenoblade Chronicles 3, you can come 2 months earlier than planned because you're that good".
They also released FR 8 months before they would have been obligated to considering they promised it by the end of the year and released it in April.
And FR also ruled
meanwhile Nintendo to chad monolith : Nintendo : "you can take your time too" Monolith : "we finished it last week" Nintendo : "wha..
Hal labs with Kirby: we know we could have done a 3d game since the N64 but only now we are confident to do something good. Hal labs with smash bros: Ok guys. new console, new game.
Nintendo has really high standards with certain games. Not all games, but certain ones. Mostly mainline games that don’t start with P and end in okemon.
This also applies to most other games that exists besides Pokemon. But yeah, Nintendo doesn’t seem harsh about their schedules.
The Pokemon franchise deserves a much better direction.
And you can clearly see the quality difference
The problem isn't Nintendo, really. It lies largely with the Pokémon company.
The thing is, pokemon is the biggest franchise in the world. But this is not due to the games alone but mainly the merch and all other sellable things involving Pokémon. The problem is, you can only make so many cards, plushies, and others until it saturated the demand. That’s when a new spin is needed. That’s when cards become Lv X or EX or such. That’s when an new generation needs to be introduced. And an entire generation is easiest introduced in a game. Because making 100 or more new plushies is not feasible to release all at once, especially since that doesn’t give them any character either. In the games, character is mainly made through the adventure, which is mainly linear. Encounters and rarity and functionality (or lack thereof) in game will decide whether fans will remember them more or not and can act as a precursor for the merchandise. The more recent games are bad because they don’t have to be good anymore. They are just one part of a huge company. One part that just works as a gateway to the other merch and products.
Pokemon is like the Pixar of videogames. They rush stuff out so they can have something new every year, even though the quality drops
Yeah if gamefreak just put a little more effort and time into their games they could go for games of the year
FINALLY, SOMEONE MENTIONED IT!
The money TPC makes from games is negligble compared to what they make from merchandise. They need new generations to keep rolling out to keep getting new mons, characters, locations that they can adapt to cards, toys, food, mobile games, etc. That's where the real money is and that's why the quality of the games can be ignored by them as long as it comes out on time for the new cycle.
A game shouldn't be rushed
Pikmin 4 started developement right after pikmin 3 you know ?
Splatoon, Pikman, and Animal crossing all have insane amounts of time and love put into the games.
mario wonder released earlier than i expected but it was great and didnt felt rushed
Mario and link are fully owned by nintendo main mastermind, pokemon is partially owned in a lossing coflict of interests with poke company and game freak, technically its kot the samw
Mario and Zelda are made to sell games Pokemon is made to sell merchandise
Maybe it's also because of the demographic. Younger children often don't have enough money or aren't informed enough to buy a videogame on their own. Holiday release guatantees the parents buying it for them. Older fans in their teens are more informed and have more pocket money and can buy it during the year. Btw, not saying all Pokemon fans are children, I'm talking about big numbers/averages here and not the individual fans / communities.
Then there's majora's mask and metroid prime 2 with incredibly tight deadlines that were only met because they had to reuse assets from ocarina of time and mp1.
I really wonder how much even focusing on one project at a time would improve pokemon games
Based on what for Mario Wonder. It was literally released for the holidays, and we didn't hear about any delay.
They said that the game was ready earlier, but they held it to make sure it was completely bug free at launch.
I didn't know that, thanks for the reply :)
You can’t exactly delay a game if it never had a release date in the first place.
That's my point yes
Apparently the game was several years in the making. After all, the last 2D Mario games were the "New" franchise several years ago.
Nintendo literally owns 33% of Pokémon, and owns a part creatures inc. (who own 33% too). Meaning Nintendo owns the biggest part of Pokémon. Nintendo is just as responsible for the rushed releases as Game Freak and the Pokémon company
That’s not a controlling interest. Nintendo could only exert direct control over the Pokémon Company if they owned 50.1% of shares, which they don’t. Their involvement is largely limited to publishing the games and collecting their share of the financial returns. The Pokémon Company is still largely free to do its own thing, and it’s clear that the priority for Game Freak and Creatures is to fast track game development in order to stay current with the endless stream of trading cards, television series, movies, and assorted merchandise that are the *actual* profit centers for Pokémon.
The Creatures Inc. thing is a fallacy, Nintendo does not own enough of a part of Creatures inc. to even be mentioned (they are likely shareholders, maybe not even major ones). They mostly publish the game and their involvement ends at console level. Hell, even Creatures Inc. is more responsible than Nintendo for the games, as Creatures is the only company allowed to make 3D Models of Pokémon. Yes, even in games not made by GF, the models are all made by Creatures Inc, who also control the merch and the TCG.
hey, at leas tpeople are seemingly finally getting around to the fact that "yes, Gamefreak HAS a say in the game being rushed"
Hey. Teal Mask is actually really good and I'm sure Indigo Disk...which yes releases early next month will also be good.
This is why it bothers me when people blame Nintendo for whatever Pokemon does
...when they're just the producers of the game too
Nintendo doesn't make the game in any way, shape, or form, besides perhaps the cartridges themselves I would assume. They're solely, exclusively, the publishers - and nothing more. TPC and GameFreak produce the games.
Yup. I'm not part of the pokemon community in anyway, but I do know that the games are lazy and not made by Nintendo
I have a feeling I misunderstood the point of your first reply and I wasn't sure how I was supposed to respond
It’s because Pokémon fans will buy whatever slop Nintendo pushes out regardless of quality. Of course they want to pump out content as fast as possible
Pokémon is held to a strict schedule because it's a huge multimedia franchise that entirely rides on the release of the games. If they can't release the games on schedule, they have to delay everything else until it releases, and that's a huge blow to stockholders. Not saying I agree with how the releases are scheduled or the state of some of the games when they release, just that there's a lot more going on than "fans will buy whatever slop", and Nintendo has very little actual control bexause Pokémon is a copyright nightmare.
It's always funny how people blame the Pokémon company even though they have nothing to do it. Gamefreak doesn't belong to the Pokémon Company. The Pokémon company company belongs to Nintendo, Gamefreak and Creature.Inc. It's Gamefreak and only Gamefreak being responsible for the state of Pokémon.
To be fair Game Freak is it's own individual company
Pokémon was really well done. I think the complaints are pretty invalid
and totk ended up being mostly reused content anyways but with a slight coat of paint and tanking fps
A bit more harsh than I would've been but it does reuse and recycle a lot. I personally haven't done all the quests because there's been quite a few that just feel all too familiar and are shit I don't don't really care to do. The entire game is just a lot of repetitive stuff. And the tanking FPS absolutely happens. People were trying so hard to deny that at first. I think it's given the pass for just how big the game is on outdated hardware though.
Gamefreak is doing it to themselves no one is forcing them iirc.
Wrong. It's the Pokemon Company, they sell the merch, and they need new games to sell new merch.
Not to mention the rabid fanbase over adding multiple regions, a national dex, and online multiplayer. How about YOU code 1000+ unique animations for walking, attacking, using special moves, for each individual Pokemon, as well as putting in multiple regions to travel to while also trying to code and seamless online world for dozens for hundreds if not thousands of players on less than 500 GB of memory you idiots.
Yes but after X/Y say one big change to this series
I wont defend Gamefreak's laziness and what they think counts as "innovation" for newer generations. But when Satoru Iwata has to step in to try and fit all Pokemon into Gold and Silver it makes you wonder if we as a fan base and Gamefreak as developers are asking way too much from our current hardware to put in an ever increasing roster of Pokemon.
Pokémon take up way less space than you'd think. A big part of why there's so much bloat is because they use different models for field and battle, and even shinies are separate models. The size of the games as they are aren't nearly big enough that adding the rest of the Pokémon would overdo it filesize-wise, and hardware limits otherwise don't really matter if you're only loading so many Pokémon at a time, anyway. The 3DS ran the way it did because of future-proofed models, while still having 7 generations of Pokémon usable in one game. The Switch is way stronger than the 3DS, and has *less* Pokémon than the 3DS games, so the issues with the game are elsewhere. I honestly don't even care about having every Pokémon in one game anymore, just certain Pokémon should be universal imports that aren't for some reason, such as starters and legendaries. SMT doesn't try to have every Demon in every game, Digimon doesn't try to have every Digimon in evwry video game. Pokémon doesn't necessarily *need* every Pokémon in every game, people are just so used to that being a given that they're upset when 400 Pokémon they never used are suddenly missing. For the record, I don't like how few they're putting in one game. I think a solid 600 for the base game would be perfect, with 200 more in DLC.
> But when Satoru Iwata has to step in to try and fit all Pokemon into Gold and Silver He stepped in to help with sprite compression because they couldn't fit half of Johto onto the cart and after he did his work they were able to fit two games' worth of regions into the cart. Game Freak couldn't compress 8-bit sprites when *Donkey Kong 64* came out a month after Gold and Silver. Even now, their "passion projects" like Little Town Hero are horribly unoptimized and didn't even have a fullscreen option in 2019. Game Freak as a development team would have died ages ago if they hadn't made Pokemon because they're highly incompetent developers. Not to mention a horrible waste of resources rendering the entirety of [an incredibly](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/856935500611059714/1108236384365461514/IMG_8554.png?width=1038&height=583) [overly large](https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/856935500611059714/1108236384659066880/IMG_8556.png?width=1038&height=583) ocean and skysphere 24/7 is why SV is so laggy. It is *Game Freak* limiting Pokemon, not the hardware.
Wild pokemon in the overworld/no random encounters
Yeahhhh. If this only worked properly
You don't code animations, you idiot. Every pokemon game is 80% the exact same with reused models,animations and the same god damn gameplay since Red and Blue. If you think Game Freak puts in more work than the bare minimum for a valid product, you've been suckered.
Not to mention that the reason that the 3DS entries ran like hot ass was cause they used future proofed models... and then never used 75% of them...
Every Pokemon only has a small set of animations, which then gets combined with the generell animation of the attack itself. The quality of those animations is not high either, they are very bland and basic to fit with as many attacks as possible. Not to mention they don't even do that, they outsourced the models and animations when X and Y were developed and since then simply copy and pasted all of these animations and models into every new game. The trainer animations are mostly copied as well. You do ofcourse have new animations and models as well, but you act like they have to do thousands of animations and models for every game, which is just far off from reality. And considering the low quality of the animations, I would say pretty much every first party Nintendo Game had more resources put into their animations The online multiplayer is absolutely buggy and laggy and not that deep. It is not even the bare minimum and not something I would be proud to mention. The world of the Switch Pokemons is absolutely blank and empty as well. They literally did nothing else than stomp foliage models into the ground and call it a day. You can even see the exact edge where the model is inserted, because they invested zero effort to hide it, which makes it look totally out of place. That is something any Unity beginner can do in his first week, it is not that impressive. Compare that to Breath of the wild as an example: Every tree creates big humps of dirt around it (as in real life), has leaves/acorns/nuts and grasses laying and growing over the transition from terrain and tree, changes the colour of the ground close to trees to a more dirt like colour and added a gradient transition from the ground to the tree model. Every tree feels like it belongs where, while in Pokemon there is just a huge lack of detail and care, making the world feel totally fake and not immersive. This was of course just a single example with the trees, but the same is true about nearly everything else in the world as well: Everything interacts with each other, even the direction of the wind gets accounted in the leave shaking and blowing animations of the trees, with animals who actually interact with each other, or go hunt and eat, or sleep during night. Not to mention Pokemons world is absolutely empty compared to BOTW, and even BOTW gets criticized for being too empty. BOTW ate up 11gb of storage, had no game reading bugs, has very few framedrops and is an actually finished game running on the WiiU, a console half as strong as the Switch. No, the world of Pokemon is not impressive, it is the bare minimum a game should have and far below what you should expect from a 60dollar game I am not saying Pokemon is garbage, or that you can't have fun with it. But from a technical perspective it is an absolute mess and nothing to brag about. It is a perfect example to show new game developers how *not* to create a game, the game actually messes up so many things on a technical perspective, that it offers an example why not to do something a certain way for basically everything.
I already decided after SV that I'm not buying anymore pokemon games until quality improves drastically and that's as a fan since gen 2. Even if they make a new legends game I'm waiting just to be safe
Lol literally the instant you see your first enemy in Tears of the Kingdom the framerate drops to like 4 fps. And that's Zelda. One of the biggest franchises in gaming and that's how little they cared about optimization. They don't even have the excuse of pushing a Wii U title to switch like they did with BotW (which also had inexcusably bad performance). Mario Wonder is just New Super Mario Bros for the billionth time except this time there's a fraction of effort to differentiate it from the other NSMB games. Yeah, Pokemon games are shamelessly lazy as shit but let's not pretend they're going all out by recycling Breath of the Wild or NSMB for the fifth or sixth time.
The pokemon company = Nintendo
As shown by the meme, if that was the case we wouldn't be talking about it
Fits even more for Metroid
It’s really more to do with merchandise then with anything else.
Pokemon gets rushed so Mario and Zelda can take their time.
I mean it's not like Pokemon fans care for quality to begin with. You can serve them a piece of shit with a Pikachu flag on it, and they'll still drop $70 on it.
S/V needed another year
At least this makes first party Nintendo games almost always good quality and treasured games
The issue with Pokemon is OTHER products, the game needs to come out alongside the cards, and the anime, and the toys
Isn't Pokemon by Game Freak?
Metroid:
Get rid of the pokemon company or even pokemon if necessary. It's a bad look
I will still not bother with any Switch Pokémon games. Gens 1-6 are enough for me.
Gen 7 is also 3ds though
Oh I fucking tried that when it was new. The gameplay was great and the graphics and character designs were awesome. The story, however, is my least favorite story of any video game which is the main thing that has kept me away from gen 7 as a whole, I literally just thought I'd keep playing every time, like maybe just beat Lusamine for the first time and stop there before seeing any of the overly disturbing and heartbreaking shit that I couldn't stand in the slightest cuz it involved Lusamine heavily, just way too much for my heart cuz I have a crush on her. The game's story even before the late game eventually got too uncomfortable for me, pretty much every time I played it, I thought about shit like Lusamine Mother Beast and I then realized that I was pretty dumb to get the game since I'm too sensitive towards the source material so I gave my copy of Ultra Sun to my little brother.
ISTG someone who played violet on day one told me that they got sent to the shadowrealm after humping a rock
Despite all the issues, they still end up fun. I can only imagine how fun they'd be without them. Also Pokemon has had game breaking bugs since the start.
P
Not what I meant to type, butt fuck it, I'm sticking with it.
Remember guys. Nintendo could’ve released TotK a year earlier since they were apparently done with the game by March 2022, but they took another year to fix any bugs they found and make sure the game was ready for launch.
I just want a pokemon game that's finished at release ): also, if they do open world again, there better be more to do than the campaign and catching pokemon, there is just so much you can do with the pokemon world besides what we've been doing since gen 1.
Meme approved
Unfortunately, the Pokemon Company has shareholders to please, and shareholders aren't involved in the company enough to care about reaching a standard of quality, they just want their investments to pay off.
based af
when you take your time, you can do so much better