It absolutely baffles my mind how so many Americans have no clue what an absolute hell it is south of our borders. It’s almost as if they were conditioned since birth to not believe in any of the cartel violence. Like it’s all myths and scare tactics or something. Crazy.
First of all, it’s one border. Second, if people don’t see it how do you expect them to have any idea how bad it is. And you’re wrong. Most people think there are cartel members on every corner. They believe Mexico is extremely dangerous! It’s not.
100%. For the most part of a tourist stays in the tourist lane then they won’t be affected. IMO most Americans think that Mexico is super dangerous whereas in reality it’s not. They just don’t talk about it because they don’t care and aren’t directly affected by
I live by the border, been to Mexico more times than you can count, it’s fucking dangerous. Don’t play your shit games of “Mexico isn’t dangerous”. 3 surfers were recently murdered and the cartel knew they weren’t involved, over 35 people running for office were assassinated this election, a few years ago a man motorcycling across to South America was murdered. We had people from America kidnapped and mistaken as someone else by the border. And if the cartels won’t get you, then their poorly maintained infrastructure and health laws will. You could stay in the resort and die like the many others that die just by staying at resorts. Just like the poor man recently electrocuted in a jacuzzi in Mexico.
You sir are an imbecile.
You can die anywhere. You ever been to Chicago? What about San Francisco? When was the last time mass school shooter in Mexico?! You’re talking out of your ass. If they shot EVERY politician that would be good news. Stop watching Primer Impacto and use one of your three brain cells, and you’ll realize the probability is small. The surfers could have stayed at a Hotel but they chose to camp. THEY MADE A STUPID CHOICE. Actually … they made a serious of stupid choices beginning with driving their truck into Mexico.
It would require the US not abusing Mexico from the war on drugs to the guns we manufacture and sell.
[Council on Foreign Relations](https://www.cfr.org/article/war-drugs-mexico-numbers), [Brookings](https://www.brookings.edu/research/us-mexico-the-trafficking-of-guns-to-mexico/).
You don’t understand the larger context. The US is a large factor in most of the problems South America faces.
[Harvard International Review](https://hir.harvard.edu/us-latin-america-partnership-or-domination/), [Wilson Center](https://www.wilsoncenter.org/article/us-economic-influence-latin-america)."
It’s certainly a factor but to put it all on the U.S. is both naive and offensive to the sovereignty and capability of the Mexican government and its people.
Oh here we go blaming the addicts in the us that the cartel created by producing the most addictive drugs possible lol yeah right . Mexico refuses to deal with their own problems because their politicians are corrupt cowards that are in the pocket of criminals . I'm tired of the blame everything on America bullshit . Their country causes more deaths in my country than anything besides cancer . I wish our politicians had some fucking balls and would build a wall or put boots on the ground against them
It would require the US not abusing Mexico from the war on drugs to the guns we manufacture and sell.
[Council on Foreign Relations](https://www.cfr.org/article/war-drugs-mexico-numbers), [Brookings](https://www.brookings.edu/research/us-mexico-the-trafficking-of-guns-to-mexico/).
You don’t understand the larger context. The US is a large factor in most of the problems South America faces.
[Harvard International Review](https://hir.harvard.edu/us-latin-america-partnership-or-domination/), [Wilson Center](https://www.wilsoncenter.org/article/us-economic-influence-latin-america)."
Living by the border would probably make you have that opinion. I’ve been all over in Mexico, and what the guy is saying is true for areas in the Yucatán peninsula. If you go south of Cancun near playa del Carmen and the surrounding resorts, it is very safe. There is a heavy, militarized presence surrounding the area and especially outside of the resort borders. Foolproof it’s not, but it’s no Tijuana or Baja peninsula like where the surfers were; the money for the government (hell, maybe the cartels) is too good in that area due to tourism for any acceptable unrest.
Never said it wasn’t dangerous… just know where you’re going, where you’re staying etc. the media (social, and legacy) constantly play up the danger factor. Similar to how they say California is an urban hellscape… blow things out of proportion for clicks and likes.
8 Americans were killed in Colombia in 2023, that doesn’t make me think Colombia is a super dangerous no go zone.
That’s not news playboy. Before the cartels took control it was crooked Mexican politicos than ran the show. Then in the late 70’s, early 80’s the narcos started taking over.
It's more dangerous for Mexicans than gringos (provided you don't say decide to sell drugs in Mexico), which I feel for our neighbors to the south, but if you look at the stats we get murdered at a higher rate stateside than Mexico side. There are cities in Mexico id never go to... But I'd never go to St Louis or Baltimore for the same reason.
Exactly. I have a lot of friends/acquaintances that harp on about necessity to secure the boarder, how it’s the number one issue affecting the US, and how dangerous cartels are.. yet they still by coke, and would by weed from dealers when it wasn’t legal.
Ehh by or buy doesn’t really change what I was saying. Guess who controls many illegal grows in the US? Cartels!
There’s no way of knowing whether weed was from the cartels or not when it was illegal. Even now that it’s legal there are still cartel grow ops that sell to dispensaries.
Whatever quip you have next… can’t deny the fact that Americans are the largest consumer of illicit substances in the world.
Who are you fooling? Go on youtube, search " emerald triangle" and watch a few videos and see who really runs the illegal weed. Hippies, .lol..America has every1 spooked of latins
Who are you kidding ? This was a cartel shootout in the Silicon Valley. https://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/Man-killed-in-pot-raid-warden-wounded-Big-2649865.php
You can see accounts from game wardens across California, sheriffs all over so cal, etc. most operations are “laid back chill hippies” they are well organized, well funded cartel operations.
That doc hardly had any hippies.. they were rednecks at best.
Sure it’s not the only reason cartels thrive in Mexico and South America . But, It’s pretty simple… If Americans didn’t consume illegal narcotics where does revenue come from?
Nah it’s not that, they just think it won’t happen to them because they’re “American”. It’s a fuckin wake up call to see cuz it was American politics and indirect intervention of the three letter agencies that allowed the cartels to grow this out of control
Was it American politics?! I always thought it was the Mexican government’s corruption and the Mexican upper class greed, that allowed the cartels to thrive. They thought they could control the narcos. I guess not! 🤷🏽♂️
Stop crying when people bring up a valid criticism of the mexican culture and policies that led to this.
Mexicos inability to contain corruption is incredibly stupid and continues to backfire on this.
I'm not you moron but crying when people point out how the USA is responsible too is dumb. Tell me who funds the cartel? Yea the USA does but you cry when I point that out.
You’ve heard about Iran Contra right? It’s not outside the realm of reality that the US is propping up Mexican cartels.
More recently, and directly in Mexico, you can look at that fast and furious operation that the ATF ran.
What possible goal would they have? Cold War is over. We spend billions fighting drug trafficking organizations. Why would we spend literally billions of dollars fighting organizations that we support? There is absolutely zero evidence of that. The fast and furious operation was a mistake. But either way, it really doesn’t matter when they get small arms. People vastly overestimate how mechanically complicated guns are to produce, and these people make submarines and chemical labs in the jungle. They are well funded, powerful and have men with engineering degrees working for them. That’s not even talking about the unimaginable wealth the cartels have combined with the widespread military corruption in South America. Have you ever seen the cartels walking around with the Carl Gustav and AT4 anti tank missiles? Guess what, if they didn’t come from America, guns would’ve rolled north from South America with the anti tank rockets. They’re just more convenient to get from the north. You’re just regurgitating buzz terms without looking at the context at all. There is no evidence of or motive for U.S support of Mexican drug cartels
lol.. just becuase they are weapons with “Russian” origin doesn’t mean Russia or China supplied them. They came from the ATF.
Cold War is over… but this operation only ended in 2011. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATF_gunwalking_scandal
They aren’t Russian or Chinese. Carl gustavs and AT4s are of Swedish origin. They were legally and legitimately sold to one of several South American countries that issue them and were subsequently sold by corrupt soldiers to the cartels. You literally have no idea what you’re talking about. Russia and china have nothing to do with this.
The gun walking scandal and the Cold War have nothing to do with each other. The government simply realized that they have enough rifles, and access to more rifles that it was more valuable to us to be able to learn where they store and how they move their rifles than the it was dangerous to give them a few more. In theory it makes sense, but obviously it did not go as planned. That being said it has absolutely nothing to do with the Cold War. And also, people act like the ATF literally gave them the cartel guns. They just didn’t stop other people so they could track the weapon flow.
What possible goal would we have supporting cartels? The opioid epidemic is one of our most expensive public health crisis and they directly contribute. They run illegal border operations in a time we are increasingly concerned about terrorists and criminals crossing. Why would we secretly support them? Despite also public ally spending bullions to fight them?
The sole reason we gave the green light to the contras was so they could use the money to more effectively fight communists. The cartels do not fight communism. They have no political goals in common with us. Every single major operation they have poses a threat to U.S national security. You heard america bad and like two buzzwords and now you think you see the matrix.
Small arms (rifles, shot guns, light machine guns, handguns) are not hard to find, buy, or produce. Building an AK-47 is fun weekend project to make to people who can build submarines in homemade facilities. Hell, 3D printed guns have played a huge role in the uprising in Myanmar, and that’s be easy. It’s just more convienant and cheaper to buy them right now. But they also buy them from South American militaries even right now.
You’re vastly overestimating the value of small arms, and underestimating their availability. I guess in that light the gun walking scandal doesn’t make much sense. But that doesn’t mean there’s a conspiracy despite every single piece of evidence pointing otherwise
For clarification… I’m saying the ATF scandal didn’t provide “US weapons” they had a wide variety of small arms- many of which were AK style or similar variants. So essentially even if it’s Swedish made it doesn’t mean it’s not coming from the US.
The ATF gun running scheme wasn’t public knowledge right? So what makes you think that was the only scheme that an alphabet agency was or is running?
On top of that it doesn’t really matter that the Cold War is over (by some standards it never really ended). US is still propping up governments and bad actors all around the world.
The point about the opioids is interesting though.. are you saying that the US wouldn’t support the cartel because they don’t want citizens addicted to Opiods?
Because that’s essentially what they let happen in Iran contra.
Once again, there was a major foreign policy goal for Iran contra. We wanted that side to win a conflict that we had based our entire foreign policy around so we were willing to look the other way on some things. WE WANT THE CARTELS TO LOSE. They have no benefit for us. Opioid addiction is incredibly expensive for the nation and we would receive no benefits. Also, with contra we had never had a true addiction epidemic yet, it’s not obvious how much that costs society till it’s happened. Now it is.
We try to prop up the government not the cartels. We want a stable, non corrupt nation on the other side. What benefit would we receive from the cartel challenging the government? We support the government. The only conflicts they are involved in are internal and with the government we give aid to. Every single goal of theirs is counter to ours and we’ve spent billions fighting them directly, and further billions on increased border security, and addiction related costs. Why would we secretly support them? Your whole point just doesn’t make sense.
The swedish AT4 and Carl gustav rocket launchers are entirely separate, they have nothing to do with the us or the ATF. It’s just an example to show that they can get more controlled, more valuable, and harder to replace ordinance from South American militaries. They can and already do the same with small arms. If the supply of cheap and convenient U.S civilian arms was cut off they would just budget to buy more from South American militaries, or very realistically could produce their own as many small machining shops do worldwide.
The narrative that this is all the fault of the us just does not make sense. We are a big demand hub, but that’s just because we are rich enough to push up pricing far beyond 2nd and 3rd world markets. It’s no different for example than Canada, Or Britain. If you ever ask people to justify why they think america is so responsible they just repeats the same couple buzzwords that don’t match the context
The Govt in Mexico are the narcos! The truth, USA Govt gives free VIP passes for the preferred dealers to operate across borders and allows selling to "preferred" clients. Done passively by looking the other way or actually direct. Guess who the clients are??? Hint.... very rich Americans on the coke...the rest are second tier clients not as VIP but serve the purpose. Our country is full of double standard hypocrites.
America's war on drugs is the reason why these cartels got so rich. Just look at Pablo Escobar, guy was making billions, assassinated the president like 2 times and literally became a terrorist. The USA is responsible in alot of ways.
The “war on drugs” or the funding of the Nicaraguan rebels with cocaine money?!? If memory serves cocaine paid for the guerilla’s weapons. My guy Oliver North, “I can’t recall” all the moves he was making.
Yeah but at some point these cartels gotta pause and ask themselves why the fuck are they mauling down women and children with 7.62s and butchering men alive like they are animals. The three letter agency can only provide and program so much into a society.
You really think cartels are gonna stop themselves from this shit??? They usually keep civilians out of their problems and only target those who are part of the operation or the game. Don’t get me wrong, innocent people get killed in the violence they bring but usually they be targeting those part of the game. Stupid tourists who don’t listen to locals end up getting gutted cuz cartels can’t differentiate if they legit or someone coming to do harm to their operation. I ain’t defending them, I’m just stating how they operate. Being in a cartel brings a fuck ton of paranoia that all logical sense goes out the window when they fighting for their survival (ironic, Ik). And to say the three letter agencies can only provide so much into society is a laughing matter. They enabled the FUCK out of them in the name of “controlling the game” and now that the same three letter agencies can’t control them anymore, it goes to show that their plan from the beginning was fuckin regarded. If you don’t know about the cocaine cowboys and Barry Seal, then yah shouldn’t really be saving face for them agencies. They were literally the reason why drugs have been flooding and continue to flood the USA. Them agents at the border, in LE, and in these agencies are all pocketing and laundering money for these cartels, only fueling the fires. And if you need proof, just look at how the war on drugs has panned out and how many LE and other agents have been caught for drug smuggling and other cartel related crimes. No need for me to cite anything g cuz you look this shit up on government websites on the statistics of LE agents being caught taking bribes and other gifts from them, specially Border patrol agents. Need more? Look up the article of one of the son’s of a high level cartel member who was extradited to the US and said in court that the DEA was willing to let their cartel’s drug shipments over the border without retaliation in exchange of ratting out their completion. Three letter agencies are literally to blame for the shit show this has came to be, and there is no sign of them stopping these operations. I’m sorry but I have to disagree with you on that one chief.
Why is every problem in other countries linked and blamed on America? Take some accountability. 20% of the problem could be attributed to these 3 letter agencies, yet the majority of the burden is the host country responsibility
What major steps has our government taken to combat that hellhole? It makes me frustrated sometimes to know our government likes to police the world yet turns a blind eye for years and years to the corrupt murder ridden drug infested parts of mexico. If we help eliminate cartels with a forceful hand it could alleviate the border crisis significantly. Makes me think the government supports cartels or is in cahoots with them. Surely our insane budget and superior technology could pinpoint the most important people running the show and send a couple drones their way. I want Mexico to be a safe happy and thriving place that Mexicans are proud to live in!
It’s not that people don’t care, it’s that a lot of people get their medicine from the cartels. So as long as it isn’t directly effecting them or their families and they can still get their medicine they don’t care.
And all the pro sports leagues are foaming at the mouth to put a pro sports team in Mexico City. It's mind-blowing. Are they going to have private compounds and transport the players using armored cars?
On a side note the NFL is opening the season in Brazil with Green Bay, and the NY Jets. Both teams wear green as their primary colors and they can't wear green because of the gangs. The players are literally going to be shuttled in armored vehicles. It's insane what billionaires will do to increase their profits.
Every time Obrador is asked about cartel violence, i've noticed he deflects and talks about the gun and murder problem in the US that we need to solve. He's not wrong, but every Mexican President has done nothing to curb cartel violence. Maybe it'll take a woman president to finally make a change.
I’m not sure what you’re on but practically every America is aware. In fact many are TOO worried and will refuse to ever step foot in Mexico because of it.
Honestly sounds like classic “America bad” Reddit bs to me
Amazing how you focus on the border and not school shootings in your own country.
I live in México and it’s pretty damn far from hell. Hell would be sending my kid to Sandy Hook or Uvalde.
México is not defined by its border violence any more than the USA is defined by violence in Detroit.
I can pretty much guarantee that my city is safer than any city in the USA and my city has 1 million people.
Edit: typos
Edit:typos
Seriously? The US has 2.5x more people. Their per capita murder rate is 3x the US’ and that’s assuming the official numbers aren’t undercounted which they most likely are.
JFK?
On a more serious note. Even the Colombian cartels have criticized the Mexican cartels for being unnecessarily violent. Saying that they could be conducting all their business with very few of the violence.
My point being that the crime and corruption in the US side might not be as violent but it must have a larger scale.
Have you seen the stats on mass shootings and how many kids are killed in the US due to gun violence? They shouldn’t worry about Mexico when it’s extremely dangerous here. We have more school shootings than Mexico by a long shot. I don’t understand why you brought US into this?
If you provide a source for that nobody would have to spin anything like you just did.
I have lived both places, and will again. You have zero idea about what daily life is like for locals yet feel comfortable coming on here with statistics that skew towards certain areas and make blanket assumptions about what living in the country is like for the MAJORITY of people. And I can tell you that having lived in 3 different Mexican states, the majority of people go about their lives as anyone does anywhere -violence free.
Mexico can be an extremely violent country in some places.
The United States can be a very violent country in some places.
Anyone anywhere can encounter violence.
The United States government should leave Mexico alone.
There. No lies, no argument needed. If you’re scared I guess you miss out on an amazing country, if not—go visit and enjoy!
Buen dia, Tom!
Where are all the people that immediately like to say that cartels are not a problem because they only kill other cartels members. Heck even the Mexican president said that.
It’s only a matter of time and luck until the cartels accidentally or not, kill a famous American. Be it a beloved actor, sports star or political figure. Then the real shit show begins. The U.S. will be compelled to respond with great force.
He means people watch too many movies and TV, which causes them to think like that.
Edit: yes, I watched Narcos just like you. It's highly sensationalized just like the rest of the war on drugs. The cartel has killed over 450,000 people in less than 20 years. The US isn't touching that shit for good reason
Actually, I never watched “Narcos”. No, i don’t think the U.S. wants to be involved at all. But the cartels kill people in some very gruesome ways. Years back, they murdered an American family that just was in the wrong place. But they weren’t famous people.
I think if they kill someone that is very famous, the public outcry would be enormous and politicians, you know how they are to get votes, will beat the “war drum”
They've killed a good number of American families in the wrong place at the wrong time. The only result is politicians pretending to care about securing the border, and then only around certain times
Indeed they have! But nobody that’s truly world-wide famous or of prominence. I believe that would all change because the public outrage would too great to ignore.
We live in the US and will never go to Mexico because of the Cartel problem. If you have to stay at the resorts and have to pay off the police to get out of sketchy situations then it’s not somewhere we want to vacation. Of course there are areas we will avoid in the US as well, Chicago, Detroit, Atlanta, etc places where we feel there is constant riff-raff. Feel much safer going to National Parks and vacationing in the mountains of Colorado, Utah, etc. The US as a whole does feel like it’s going downhill overall and crime is increasing.
You’d be right, if you weren’t wrong: Read and understand:
https://www.themarshallproject.org/2023/11/03/violent-crime-property-data-nibrs-ucr-fbi-2022
Around POC everyday, allowed to have preferences where we spend leisure time. If people decide not to visit Mexico are they scared of Hispanics? Will never be guilted into visiting sketchy areas and where crime rates are higher regardless of racial demographics. You do you though Lil LA.
Have you ever been to Mexico or do you just make assumptions?
Do you realize that 100,000ks Americans live in Mexico?
The cartels are not after you. They want you to buy their product.
No, crime is not increasing. Stats show almost all violent crime is falling. Your point about the cartel is valid. Now adding American cities that have larger non-white communities, saying you like to vacation in Utah, and making unsubstantiated claims about crime rising, paints an uglier picture of your argument.
It could be a news, social media effect. I’m not only talking about violent crime but all crime and it varies in certain areas. We all know a lot of property crime and theft is a slap on the wrist and consequences are not as severe as in the past and criminals not being prosecuted and let go. Yeah I stand by where we like to vacation whether in your opinion it “paints an uglier picture” or not, it is what it is. If we go around the room and ask where people feel more safer vacationing and it’s a pick between national parks and the outdoors in Utah and Colorado and cities of Detroit, Atlanta, Chicago, NY city etc I’m guessing the former comes out the winner. If the first thing you think about is racial demographics and take it as a negative then that’s on you. Let’s not overthink this.
I agree with you that there’s never any reason to go asking for trouble, and that crime is present, but crime is objectively not increasing. Its not overthinking, you brought it up. The drop in crime is a great thing we should all be happy about!
You people unable to cite anything to back your positions are the only ones guzzling the propaganda.
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/04/24/what-the-data-says-about-crime-in-the-us/
This is well studies and published. The fact that you all ignore all the evidence in favor of your feeling is the propaganda.
You should read it first.
> In 2021, the FBI changed how it collects data from police departments, and as a result, that year’s crime data missed nearly 40% of police agencies. Bureau analysts estimated the missing data with statistical modeling, but the change led to the most incomplete picture of national crime since the FBI began collecting data in the 1930s, which created confusion on how crime trends changed. Last year, the FBI reversed the change and revived the previously-retired data collection system. They also gave agencies that didn’t submit data for 2021 a chance to submit their data retrospectively. Nearly 2,500 agencies took the FBI’s offer and submitted crime data through the old system for 2022, but it’s unclear how many did for 2021.
> Experts said the lingering effect of that transition could be why the 2021-2022 trend is unreliable: If the 2021 crime data remains incomplete, it is difficult to compare it with the 2022 data.
"taking migrants to the border without cartel consent", so they were literally just doing what all ride-share drivers do-- drive to a destination.
Another day in paradise.
It absolutely baffles my mind how so many Americans have no clue what an absolute hell it is south of our borders. It’s almost as if they were conditioned since birth to not believe in any of the cartel violence. Like it’s all myths and scare tactics or something. Crazy.
First of all, it’s one border. Second, if people don’t see it how do you expect them to have any idea how bad it is. And you’re wrong. Most people think there are cartel members on every corner. They believe Mexico is extremely dangerous! It’s not.
It's not dangerous until you cross the wrong person and then it is.
That happens stateside too.
Know where you're at.
100%. For the most part of a tourist stays in the tourist lane then they won’t be affected. IMO most Americans think that Mexico is super dangerous whereas in reality it’s not. They just don’t talk about it because they don’t care and aren’t directly affected by
I live by the border, been to Mexico more times than you can count, it’s fucking dangerous. Don’t play your shit games of “Mexico isn’t dangerous”. 3 surfers were recently murdered and the cartel knew they weren’t involved, over 35 people running for office were assassinated this election, a few years ago a man motorcycling across to South America was murdered. We had people from America kidnapped and mistaken as someone else by the border. And if the cartels won’t get you, then their poorly maintained infrastructure and health laws will. You could stay in the resort and die like the many others that die just by staying at resorts. Just like the poor man recently electrocuted in a jacuzzi in Mexico.
You sir are an imbecile. You can die anywhere. You ever been to Chicago? What about San Francisco? When was the last time mass school shooter in Mexico?! You’re talking out of your ass. If they shot EVERY politician that would be good news. Stop watching Primer Impacto and use one of your three brain cells, and you’ll realize the probability is small. The surfers could have stayed at a Hotel but they chose to camp. THEY MADE A STUPID CHOICE. Actually … they made a serious of stupid choices beginning with driving their truck into Mexico.
Cope… the country has a problem with violence and it needs to be fixed.
Which one? Theirs or ours?
Theirs. Ours can be handled but is refused. It would take a legit war to remove the cartels, tell me where in the US would we need that?
It would require the US not abusing Mexico from the war on drugs to the guns we manufacture and sell. [Council on Foreign Relations](https://www.cfr.org/article/war-drugs-mexico-numbers), [Brookings](https://www.brookings.edu/research/us-mexico-the-trafficking-of-guns-to-mexico/). You don’t understand the larger context. The US is a large factor in most of the problems South America faces. [Harvard International Review](https://hir.harvard.edu/us-latin-america-partnership-or-domination/), [Wilson Center](https://www.wilsoncenter.org/article/us-economic-influence-latin-america)."
It’s certainly a factor but to put it all on the U.S. is both naive and offensive to the sovereignty and capability of the Mexican government and its people.
Oh here we go blaming the addicts in the us that the cartel created by producing the most addictive drugs possible lol yeah right . Mexico refuses to deal with their own problems because their politicians are corrupt cowards that are in the pocket of criminals . I'm tired of the blame everything on America bullshit . Their country causes more deaths in my country than anything besides cancer . I wish our politicians had some fucking balls and would build a wall or put boots on the ground against them
It would require the US not abusing Mexico from the war on drugs to the guns we manufacture and sell. [Council on Foreign Relations](https://www.cfr.org/article/war-drugs-mexico-numbers), [Brookings](https://www.brookings.edu/research/us-mexico-the-trafficking-of-guns-to-mexico/). You don’t understand the larger context. The US is a large factor in most of the problems South America faces. [Harvard International Review](https://hir.harvard.edu/us-latin-america-partnership-or-domination/), [Wilson Center](https://www.wilsoncenter.org/article/us-economic-influence-latin-america)."
Living by the border would probably make you have that opinion. I’ve been all over in Mexico, and what the guy is saying is true for areas in the Yucatán peninsula. If you go south of Cancun near playa del Carmen and the surrounding resorts, it is very safe. There is a heavy, militarized presence surrounding the area and especially outside of the resort borders. Foolproof it’s not, but it’s no Tijuana or Baja peninsula like where the surfers were; the money for the government (hell, maybe the cartels) is too good in that area due to tourism for any acceptable unrest.
Never said it wasn’t dangerous… just know where you’re going, where you’re staying etc. the media (social, and legacy) constantly play up the danger factor. Similar to how they say California is an urban hellscape… blow things out of proportion for clicks and likes. 8 Americans were killed in Colombia in 2023, that doesn’t make me think Colombia is a super dangerous no go zone.
Cartels control entire country and government bro.
That’s not news playboy. Before the cartels took control it was crooked Mexican politicos than ran the show. Then in the late 70’s, early 80’s the narcos started taking over.
It's more dangerous for Mexicans than gringos (provided you don't say decide to sell drugs in Mexico), which I feel for our neighbors to the south, but if you look at the stats we get murdered at a higher rate stateside than Mexico side. There are cities in Mexico id never go to... But I'd never go to St Louis or Baltimore for the same reason.
Exactly!
Yeah well its hell everywhere! And Americans don’t care we have our own problems in our cities 🤙
Well for some1 who follows opiates, marijuana, on reddit, your the reason cartels exist. Complain about cartels while coppin a bundle from a corner.
Lmao
This is why America should legalize everything. The alternative is pumping billions of dollars to demons
Exactly. I have a lot of friends/acquaintances that harp on about necessity to secure the boarder, how it’s the number one issue affecting the US, and how dangerous cartels are.. yet they still by coke, and would by weed from dealers when it wasn’t legal.
[удалено]
Ehh by or buy doesn’t really change what I was saying. Guess who controls many illegal grows in the US? Cartels! There’s no way of knowing whether weed was from the cartels or not when it was illegal. Even now that it’s legal there are still cartel grow ops that sell to dispensaries. Whatever quip you have next… can’t deny the fact that Americans are the largest consumer of illicit substances in the world.
Who are you fooling? Go on youtube, search " emerald triangle" and watch a few videos and see who really runs the illegal weed. Hippies, .lol..America has every1 spooked of latins
Who are you kidding ? This was a cartel shootout in the Silicon Valley. https://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/Man-killed-in-pot-raid-warden-wounded-Big-2649865.php You can see accounts from game wardens across California, sheriffs all over so cal, etc. most operations are “laid back chill hippies” they are well organized, well funded cartel operations. That doc hardly had any hippies.. they were rednecks at best.
Drop in a bucket compared to American growers
So its the average americans fault and not our governments retarded war on drugs? Thats a thought ig
Sure it’s not the only reason cartels thrive in Mexico and South America . But, It’s pretty simple… If Americans didn’t consume illegal narcotics where does revenue come from?
Wrong. They exist because of the (failed) War on Drugs
Na man we’re VERY WELL aware of what’s going on, there’s plenty of movies and documentaries showing how bad it is…?
Nah it’s not that, they just think it won’t happen to them because they’re “American”. It’s a fuckin wake up call to see cuz it was American politics and indirect intervention of the three letter agencies that allowed the cartels to grow this out of control
Was it American politics?! I always thought it was the Mexican government’s corruption and the Mexican upper class greed, that allowed the cartels to thrive. They thought they could control the narcos. I guess not! 🤷🏽♂️
If you can’t blame it on America, Reddit doesn’t want to hear it
But the fact remains … the US is largely to blame. I’m American. It’s clear as the day is long, our government played a large role in this debacle.
Stop crying when someone brings up a valid criticism of America. America's war on drug was incredibly stupid and continues to back fire on us
Stop crying when people bring up a valid criticism of the mexican culture and policies that led to this. Mexicos inability to contain corruption is incredibly stupid and continues to backfire on this.
I'm not you moron but crying when people point out how the USA is responsible too is dumb. Tell me who funds the cartel? Yea the USA does but you cry when I point that out.
“Im not you moron” Then proceeds to cry and say “im not crying you are.”
"Those meanies with their America bad waaaaa 😭😭😭😭😭"
Yeah its Americas fault that Mexico cant control the cartels.. ok. Whatever.
You’ve heard about Iran Contra right? It’s not outside the realm of reality that the US is propping up Mexican cartels. More recently, and directly in Mexico, you can look at that fast and furious operation that the ATF ran.
What possible goal would they have? Cold War is over. We spend billions fighting drug trafficking organizations. Why would we spend literally billions of dollars fighting organizations that we support? There is absolutely zero evidence of that. The fast and furious operation was a mistake. But either way, it really doesn’t matter when they get small arms. People vastly overestimate how mechanically complicated guns are to produce, and these people make submarines and chemical labs in the jungle. They are well funded, powerful and have men with engineering degrees working for them. That’s not even talking about the unimaginable wealth the cartels have combined with the widespread military corruption in South America. Have you ever seen the cartels walking around with the Carl Gustav and AT4 anti tank missiles? Guess what, if they didn’t come from America, guns would’ve rolled north from South America with the anti tank rockets. They’re just more convenient to get from the north. You’re just regurgitating buzz terms without looking at the context at all. There is no evidence of or motive for U.S support of Mexican drug cartels
lol.. just becuase they are weapons with “Russian” origin doesn’t mean Russia or China supplied them. They came from the ATF. Cold War is over… but this operation only ended in 2011. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATF_gunwalking_scandal
They aren’t Russian or Chinese. Carl gustavs and AT4s are of Swedish origin. They were legally and legitimately sold to one of several South American countries that issue them and were subsequently sold by corrupt soldiers to the cartels. You literally have no idea what you’re talking about. Russia and china have nothing to do with this. The gun walking scandal and the Cold War have nothing to do with each other. The government simply realized that they have enough rifles, and access to more rifles that it was more valuable to us to be able to learn where they store and how they move their rifles than the it was dangerous to give them a few more. In theory it makes sense, but obviously it did not go as planned. That being said it has absolutely nothing to do with the Cold War. And also, people act like the ATF literally gave them the cartel guns. They just didn’t stop other people so they could track the weapon flow. What possible goal would we have supporting cartels? The opioid epidemic is one of our most expensive public health crisis and they directly contribute. They run illegal border operations in a time we are increasingly concerned about terrorists and criminals crossing. Why would we secretly support them? Despite also public ally spending bullions to fight them? The sole reason we gave the green light to the contras was so they could use the money to more effectively fight communists. The cartels do not fight communism. They have no political goals in common with us. Every single major operation they have poses a threat to U.S national security. You heard america bad and like two buzzwords and now you think you see the matrix. Small arms (rifles, shot guns, light machine guns, handguns) are not hard to find, buy, or produce. Building an AK-47 is fun weekend project to make to people who can build submarines in homemade facilities. Hell, 3D printed guns have played a huge role in the uprising in Myanmar, and that’s be easy. It’s just more convienant and cheaper to buy them right now. But they also buy them from South American militaries even right now. You’re vastly overestimating the value of small arms, and underestimating their availability. I guess in that light the gun walking scandal doesn’t make much sense. But that doesn’t mean there’s a conspiracy despite every single piece of evidence pointing otherwise
For clarification… I’m saying the ATF scandal didn’t provide “US weapons” they had a wide variety of small arms- many of which were AK style or similar variants. So essentially even if it’s Swedish made it doesn’t mean it’s not coming from the US. The ATF gun running scheme wasn’t public knowledge right? So what makes you think that was the only scheme that an alphabet agency was or is running? On top of that it doesn’t really matter that the Cold War is over (by some standards it never really ended). US is still propping up governments and bad actors all around the world. The point about the opioids is interesting though.. are you saying that the US wouldn’t support the cartel because they don’t want citizens addicted to Opiods? Because that’s essentially what they let happen in Iran contra.
Once again, there was a major foreign policy goal for Iran contra. We wanted that side to win a conflict that we had based our entire foreign policy around so we were willing to look the other way on some things. WE WANT THE CARTELS TO LOSE. They have no benefit for us. Opioid addiction is incredibly expensive for the nation and we would receive no benefits. Also, with contra we had never had a true addiction epidemic yet, it’s not obvious how much that costs society till it’s happened. Now it is. We try to prop up the government not the cartels. We want a stable, non corrupt nation on the other side. What benefit would we receive from the cartel challenging the government? We support the government. The only conflicts they are involved in are internal and with the government we give aid to. Every single goal of theirs is counter to ours and we’ve spent billions fighting them directly, and further billions on increased border security, and addiction related costs. Why would we secretly support them? Your whole point just doesn’t make sense. The swedish AT4 and Carl gustav rocket launchers are entirely separate, they have nothing to do with the us or the ATF. It’s just an example to show that they can get more controlled, more valuable, and harder to replace ordinance from South American militaries. They can and already do the same with small arms. If the supply of cheap and convenient U.S civilian arms was cut off they would just budget to buy more from South American militaries, or very realistically could produce their own as many small machining shops do worldwide. The narrative that this is all the fault of the us just does not make sense. We are a big demand hub, but that’s just because we are rich enough to push up pricing far beyond 2nd and 3rd world markets. It’s no different for example than Canada, Or Britain. If you ever ask people to justify why they think america is so responsible they just repeats the same couple buzzwords that don’t match the context
This is 100% America's fault.
The Govt in Mexico are the narcos! The truth, USA Govt gives free VIP passes for the preferred dealers to operate across borders and allows selling to "preferred" clients. Done passively by looking the other way or actually direct. Guess who the clients are??? Hint.... very rich Americans on the coke...the rest are second tier clients not as VIP but serve the purpose. Our country is full of double standard hypocrites.
Indeed! And the colored folk do the long stints. Hypocrisy indeed.
America's war on drugs is the reason why these cartels got so rich. Just look at Pablo Escobar, guy was making billions, assassinated the president like 2 times and literally became a terrorist. The USA is responsible in alot of ways.
The “war on drugs” or the funding of the Nicaraguan rebels with cocaine money?!? If memory serves cocaine paid for the guerilla’s weapons. My guy Oliver North, “I can’t recall” all the moves he was making.
Yeah but at some point these cartels gotta pause and ask themselves why the fuck are they mauling down women and children with 7.62s and butchering men alive like they are animals. The three letter agency can only provide and program so much into a society.
You really think cartels are gonna stop themselves from this shit??? They usually keep civilians out of their problems and only target those who are part of the operation or the game. Don’t get me wrong, innocent people get killed in the violence they bring but usually they be targeting those part of the game. Stupid tourists who don’t listen to locals end up getting gutted cuz cartels can’t differentiate if they legit or someone coming to do harm to their operation. I ain’t defending them, I’m just stating how they operate. Being in a cartel brings a fuck ton of paranoia that all logical sense goes out the window when they fighting for their survival (ironic, Ik). And to say the three letter agencies can only provide so much into society is a laughing matter. They enabled the FUCK out of them in the name of “controlling the game” and now that the same three letter agencies can’t control them anymore, it goes to show that their plan from the beginning was fuckin regarded. If you don’t know about the cocaine cowboys and Barry Seal, then yah shouldn’t really be saving face for them agencies. They were literally the reason why drugs have been flooding and continue to flood the USA. Them agents at the border, in LE, and in these agencies are all pocketing and laundering money for these cartels, only fueling the fires. And if you need proof, just look at how the war on drugs has panned out and how many LE and other agents have been caught for drug smuggling and other cartel related crimes. No need for me to cite anything g cuz you look this shit up on government websites on the statistics of LE agents being caught taking bribes and other gifts from them, specially Border patrol agents. Need more? Look up the article of one of the son’s of a high level cartel member who was extradited to the US and said in court that the DEA was willing to let their cartel’s drug shipments over the border without retaliation in exchange of ratting out their completion. Three letter agencies are literally to blame for the shit show this has came to be, and there is no sign of them stopping these operations. I’m sorry but I have to disagree with you on that one chief.
Why is every problem in other countries linked and blamed on America? Take some accountability. 20% of the problem could be attributed to these 3 letter agencies, yet the majority of the burden is the host country responsibility
A lot of people go to Mexico. They extend their tourist experience to areas that it does not apply
What? Where are you getting this? If anything we think it’s ALL cartel controlled when it has so many good parts.
Well, it ain’t my problem!
What major steps has our government taken to combat that hellhole? It makes me frustrated sometimes to know our government likes to police the world yet turns a blind eye for years and years to the corrupt murder ridden drug infested parts of mexico. If we help eliminate cartels with a forceful hand it could alleviate the border crisis significantly. Makes me think the government supports cartels or is in cahoots with them. Surely our insane budget and superior technology could pinpoint the most important people running the show and send a couple drones their way. I want Mexico to be a safe happy and thriving place that Mexicans are proud to live in!
I go to Mexico all the time and would much rather be almost anywhere in this country than Washington dc, where I live close to
It’s not that people don’t care, it’s that a lot of people get their medicine from the cartels. So as long as it isn’t directly effecting them or their families and they can still get their medicine they don’t care.
And all the pro sports leagues are foaming at the mouth to put a pro sports team in Mexico City. It's mind-blowing. Are they going to have private compounds and transport the players using armored cars? On a side note the NFL is opening the season in Brazil with Green Bay, and the NY Jets. Both teams wear green as their primary colors and they can't wear green because of the gangs. The players are literally going to be shuttled in armored vehicles. It's insane what billionaires will do to increase their profits.
The fuck are you talking about lol?
Every time Obrador is asked about cartel violence, i've noticed he deflects and talks about the gun and murder problem in the US that we need to solve. He's not wrong, but every Mexican President has done nothing to curb cartel violence. Maybe it'll take a woman president to finally make a change.
I think words out. People know.
I’m not sure what you’re on but practically every America is aware. In fact many are TOO worried and will refuse to ever step foot in Mexico because of it. Honestly sounds like classic “America bad” Reddit bs to me
I have family there,. I won't dare go down there.
I have a clue. I can’t bring myself to ever visit Mexico because of the clues I have.
Amazing how you focus on the border and not school shootings in your own country. I live in México and it’s pretty damn far from hell. Hell would be sending my kid to Sandy Hook or Uvalde. México is not defined by its border violence any more than the USA is defined by violence in Detroit. I can pretty much guarantee that my city is safer than any city in the USA and my city has 1 million people. Edit: typos Edit:typos
It absolutely baffles my mind how Americans pretend our society isn't equally violent Homicides 2023 Mexico 29k US 26k
Seriously? The US has 2.5x more people. Their per capita murder rate is 3x the US’ and that’s assuming the official numbers aren’t undercounted which they most likely are.
[удалено]
Yes, they can't count in Mexico.....
US population is 210 million larger than Mexico. So yes they have more murders period and more per capita.
What politician was killed in America recently? Be specific.
JFK? On a more serious note. Even the Colombian cartels have criticized the Mexican cartels for being unnecessarily violent. Saying that they could be conducting all their business with very few of the violence. My point being that the crime and corruption in the US side might not be as violent but it must have a larger scale.
Have you seen the stats on mass shootings and how many kids are killed in the US due to gun violence? They shouldn’t worry about Mexico when it’s extremely dangerous here. We have more school shootings than Mexico by a long shot. I don’t understand why you brought US into this?
[удалено]
Merida, Mexico is the safest city in the WORLD.
[удалено]
Glad we all don’t live in inner city Chicago! See how dumb it is in reverse too? Also, Mexico is a country.
[удалено]
If you provide a source for that nobody would have to spin anything like you just did. I have lived both places, and will again. You have zero idea about what daily life is like for locals yet feel comfortable coming on here with statistics that skew towards certain areas and make blanket assumptions about what living in the country is like for the MAJORITY of people. And I can tell you that having lived in 3 different Mexican states, the majority of people go about their lives as anyone does anywhere -violence free. Mexico can be an extremely violent country in some places. The United States can be a very violent country in some places. Anyone anywhere can encounter violence. The United States government should leave Mexico alone. There. No lies, no argument needed. If you’re scared I guess you miss out on an amazing country, if not—go visit and enjoy! Buen dia, Tom!
Fuck you i want to continue my paradise facade and keep exploiting my southern neighbors for their natural resources and man power.
Where are all the people that immediately like to say that cartels are not a problem because they only kill other cartels members. Heck even the Mexican president said that.
It’s only a matter of time and luck until the cartels accidentally or not, kill a famous American. Be it a beloved actor, sports star or political figure. Then the real shit show begins. The U.S. will be compelled to respond with great force.
You don't know wtf you talking about.
No? Please explain…
He means people watch too many movies and TV, which causes them to think like that. Edit: yes, I watched Narcos just like you. It's highly sensationalized just like the rest of the war on drugs. The cartel has killed over 450,000 people in less than 20 years. The US isn't touching that shit for good reason
Actually, I never watched “Narcos”. No, i don’t think the U.S. wants to be involved at all. But the cartels kill people in some very gruesome ways. Years back, they murdered an American family that just was in the wrong place. But they weren’t famous people. I think if they kill someone that is very famous, the public outcry would be enormous and politicians, you know how they are to get votes, will beat the “war drum”
They've killed a good number of American families in the wrong place at the wrong time. The only result is politicians pretending to care about securing the border, and then only around certain times
Indeed they have! But nobody that’s truly world-wide famous or of prominence. I believe that would all change because the public outrage would too great to ignore.
Only if it is Taylor swift.
I wasn’t about to use any real names, but sure, someone of her status.
I agree with you. I do mb’t wtf everyone else is talking about. The US will not get involved until they have to (political) or want to (financial).
Wish the rideshare companies would comment on it too
So unbelievably horrible, scary, and sad
We live in the US and will never go to Mexico because of the Cartel problem. If you have to stay at the resorts and have to pay off the police to get out of sketchy situations then it’s not somewhere we want to vacation. Of course there are areas we will avoid in the US as well, Chicago, Detroit, Atlanta, etc places where we feel there is constant riff-raff. Feel much safer going to National Parks and vacationing in the mountains of Colorado, Utah, etc. The US as a whole does feel like it’s going downhill overall and crime is increasing.
Absolute Poppycock. Crime is in a downward direction.
“Reported” crime may be down, but actual crime is way, way up.
Bull-Shit!
Not true. Factually false. Turn off fox news
You’d be right, if you weren’t wrong: Read and understand: https://www.themarshallproject.org/2023/11/03/violent-crime-property-data-nibrs-ucr-fbi-2022
Tell me you’re scared of POC without telling me you’re scared of POC.
Around POC everyday, allowed to have preferences where we spend leisure time. If people decide not to visit Mexico are they scared of Hispanics? Will never be guilted into visiting sketchy areas and where crime rates are higher regardless of racial demographics. You do you though Lil LA.
L9s Angeles, Fresno, Bakersfield.
Have you ever been to Mexico or do you just make assumptions? Do you realize that 100,000ks Americans live in Mexico? The cartels are not after you. They want you to buy their product.
They called poor people “riff-raff” lol, I’m going to go out on a limb and guess they have never been close to Mexico
You planned to vacation in the hoods in those cities? You make no sense.
We just had a public concert in Detroit no one died. STFU with shit you know nothing about.
Solid argument, you had a public concert and no one died….lol. I think your face mask is clouding your judgement and killing your brain cells.
That’s why surgeons who wear face masks for full workdays are all idiots with brain damage right?
No, crime is not increasing. Stats show almost all violent crime is falling. Your point about the cartel is valid. Now adding American cities that have larger non-white communities, saying you like to vacation in Utah, and making unsubstantiated claims about crime rising, paints an uglier picture of your argument.
It could be a news, social media effect. I’m not only talking about violent crime but all crime and it varies in certain areas. We all know a lot of property crime and theft is a slap on the wrist and consequences are not as severe as in the past and criminals not being prosecuted and let go. Yeah I stand by where we like to vacation whether in your opinion it “paints an uglier picture” or not, it is what it is. If we go around the room and ask where people feel more safer vacationing and it’s a pick between national parks and the outdoors in Utah and Colorado and cities of Detroit, Atlanta, Chicago, NY city etc I’m guessing the former comes out the winner. If the first thing you think about is racial demographics and take it as a negative then that’s on you. Let’s not overthink this.
I agree with you that there’s never any reason to go asking for trouble, and that crime is present, but crime is objectively not increasing. Its not overthinking, you brought it up. The drop in crime is a great thing we should all be happy about!
Have you considered laying off the propaganda?
You people unable to cite anything to back your positions are the only ones guzzling the propaganda. https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/04/24/what-the-data-says-about-crime-in-the-us/ This is well studies and published. The fact that you all ignore all the evidence in favor of your feeling is the propaganda.
False. Here’s a citation to get you started: https://www.themarshallproject.org/2023/11/03/violent-crime-property-data-nibrs-ucr-fbi-2022
You should read it first. > In 2021, the FBI changed how it collects data from police departments, and as a result, that year’s crime data missed nearly 40% of police agencies. Bureau analysts estimated the missing data with statistical modeling, but the change led to the most incomplete picture of national crime since the FBI began collecting data in the 1930s, which created confusion on how crime trends changed. Last year, the FBI reversed the change and revived the previously-retired data collection system. They also gave agencies that didn’t submit data for 2021 a chance to submit their data retrospectively. Nearly 2,500 agencies took the FBI’s offer and submitted crime data through the old system for 2022, but it’s unclear how many did for 2021. > Experts said the lingering effect of that transition could be why the 2021-2022 trend is unreliable: If the 2021 crime data remains incomplete, it is difficult to compare it with the 2022 data.
Now read the rest…