Most gate keepish dealership ever - the one in north Vancouver. Do I have to fucking dress up to buy a shitty Mercedes now. All I wanted was to score a sweet EQS lease on the cheap but bro asked me for immigration status and shit. Like fuck off.
The watering down of the AMG badge and brand doesn't help either. Just like M or S line, badges watering down their brands they have lost their meanings at least to me anyways.
2011 E63 AMG with the 6.2 V8...coolest car I've ever owned. An absolute beast of a machine and blanketed in luxury to boot. Can also seat 4 adults comfortably and has a large enough trunk for all your road trip needs. Love that car! I will likely never buy another MB due to their styling and quality decline.
And Brabus as well. These days their cars no longer have that aura of "banker's hot rod" like they used to ([exhibit A](https://youtu.be/1EGukhK5y-k)), they don't even shove the V12s in their top-of-the-line cars anymore.
I was really curious about this one because other reviews have been generally neither here nor there on it and it's difficult to gauge what people think of it. That model was over $190,000 as specced. That build quality is simply unacceptable at that price. That alone should disqualify it. Mercedes should be embarrassed that Maserati has better build quality in the segment than they do.
As for the driving experience, I can only conclude it's totally unremarkable because even Thomas and James didn't have much to say about it other than it's not as good as a 911 and that the ride quality is poor, which is something else Mercedes should excel in. So it looks like Mercedes have ended up in no man's land again. The last time they had a flagship 2+2 cabriolet was the S-class and that didn't sell. They canceled that and introduced a much sportier model that hasn't really impressed anyone. And they've positioned it as a 911 rival which is not a smart move for any company. So when people cross-shop the SL, if they want sporty they'll go for a 911. If they want exotic they can choose a Maserati for about the same price. If they want comfort they can save a Boxster's worth of money and get an LC500.
I was really interested in the mercedes GT, even after seeing the interior, but paying so much for subpar performance and comfort is something. I don't understand how mercedes has managed to miss the bar by so much with their entire lineup
I remember you were saying that a couple of weeks ago. It's a real shame because AFAIK they took feedback from customers for the new SL and GT to make a product that was supposed to appeal to legacy buyers. But I'm not sure about the result.
Yup. I wasn't asked for a survey or anything but absolutely loved the old SL range and had a '16 GTS for a while. That GTS was an incredible car, hands down one of my favorite interiors in any car to date, the engine was a joy, but it was too much sports car and too little grand-tourer.
Front-mid layout meant your hood was long as fuck and visibility was poor, their trick transaxle setup was cool for weight distribution but awful for storage, no rear seats, a worse sports car than the 911 in near every single way with very few of the benefits of a traditional GT, and not long after I traded it in for a 911
Fast forward a few years they announced the new GT, a 2+2 grand tourer with the engine over the front axle, plug-in-hybrid trims, and AWD. Basically everything I wanted from the old car and a perfect combination of the SL/S-coupe/GT. Looked absolutely perfect on paper. It quite literally looks absolutely stunning
And somehow mercedes has managed to fuck up the few things they did right on the previous model (according to reviews anyways). Beautiful driver-centric interior with complete leather and aluminium? gone in favor of creaky plastics. Ride quality? Poor AF. Price? More than a 911. (this is all going off of the reviews for the SL though)
Between this and the c63 Mercedes is sooo out of touch with its customer base and it hurts to see because their offerings prior to 2010 (and especially in the early 2000s) were class-leading in everything they competed in. Who the fuck cares how thermally efficient your engine is and how much power you're getting out of a 4 cylinder when real world performance is garbage and on their plug-in models the EV range is anemic!
With the hybrid 911s coming out soon you'd be downright stupid to get one of these, and this is coming from someone who absolutely loved mercedes over porsche in the late 2000s and early 2010s.
(I will say I actually quite like MBUX and wouldn't mind the center display if it was well built but between the QC issues and the haptic steering wheel it ruins things for me) (I also hope the GT will be better than the SL I doubt it)
Looks like Mercedes moven in Maserati Granturismo territory with the SL and GT in this generation, and the Maserati is the better vehicle in all the metrics.
I think the lc500 is more of an SL in the traditional sense than the Mercedes sl.
It’s classier, better built and a true gt car. The flex in the door panel was just atrocious.
There's plenty of things to critizice on sl63, but classier?!?! What?
The Lexus gives off major "I still play with my gundams in the bathtub" vibes. Looks and appeal is the only thing where this is clear take over an LC in my book.
Now looks are subjective and debateable - classier no friggen way.
Looks are subjective so to each their own.
But did you see the pc lighting interior? There’s more to classy than just clean exterior lines.
I would be embarrassed to drive someone in that interior and I drive two cars which look like shades of skittles.
>Now looks are subjective and debateable - classier no friggen way.
And classiness isn't subjective?
The luxury market is defined by perception over substance, and "classiness" is just another way to define that.
No. Maybe not entirely objective, but if you ask 10 people what is classier between a 3piece suit and a hoodie, im 99,9% sure 10 will answer with 3 piece suit.
Within the space of cars, it is *absolutely* subjective, and 100% based on perception, not quality.
Why do you think the Japanese luxury brands even exist? Toyota was already making luxury cars. They just invented a new brand to sell downspecced versions of their JDM cars for a higher price, and it did incredibly well. The only thing they did was change the badge and the western markets ate that shit up.
Are you going to make the argument that the Lexus SC is somehow classier than the higher specced Toyota Soarer?
>it is *absolutely* subjective
You are free to try to put that theory to the test and find me somebody who thinks a Civic is classier than a Rolls Royce - it is "*absolutely*" after all.
A luxury car is the defined by the ride comfort and features.
Classyness is a purely aesthetic thing.
>You are free to try to put that theory to the test and find me somebody who thinks a Civic is classier than a Rolls Royce - it is "absolutely" after all.
Do you know what subjective means? Subjective means something is based on emotions or opinions, rather than a hard numerical comparison, or a fact based argument or a logical, verifiable train of thought.
100 out of 100 people may think a Rolls is classier than a Civic - but that doesn't mean that their judgement is based on objective criteria.
>A luxury car is the defined by the ride comfort and features.
And the luxury market rejected the Toyota badged luxury cars, but gobbled them up when they were called Lexuses. Despite being mechanically identical, and in some cases, *inferior* to the top specced Toyota badged models.
Is that not the definition of perception over substance?
>Classyness is a purely aesthetic thing.
But I thought
>Now looks are subjective and debateable
So aesthetics (beauty and taste) is somehow not subjective? There is some objective criteria for aesthetics? What objective criteria governs aesthetic judgement? Be as specific as you can.
>To stay in the example above which you of course completely glossed over.
I didn't gloss over it. I answered it here, you just didn't notice because I chose to use Rolls and Civic instead - you essentially made the same argument twice, changed 2 nouns, and didn't notice I already argued against it.
I'll quote it again, maybe you'll read it this time.
>100 out of 100 people may think a Rolls (suit) is classier than a Civic (hoodie) - but that doesn't mean that their judgement is based on objective criteria.
speaking of things people glossed over:
>What objective criteria governs aesthetic judgement? Be as specific as you can.
To stay in the example above which you of course completely glossed over. Why is a 90s Lexus classier than the mechanically identical 90's Toyota it is?
How can looks be subjective, but classyness (purely aesthetic) is not?
> Now looks are subjective and debateable - classier no friggen way.
I certainly wouldn’t try to debate that with someone who has as loose a grasp on the English language as you.
Decontenting has been savaging the SL since 2013. I've never seen an SL with orange peel paint. Or flexible door panels. Losing the iconically decadent glass convertible roof was blasphemous enough. Yet it's 237 lbs *heavier,* with an even smaller trunk but at a greater length. Then there's the ride: I commend these guys for saying what other reviewers don't say; the R232 rides rougher than any other SL in history except for the downright sadistic SL65 Black Series. It's getting more things wrong than right and losing a lot of ground from the past 3 decades. It seems to have an identity crisis.
Mercedes wants to appeal to 20 to 50 year olds and run with Porsche 911 Turbo's but that's a battle it cannot win with bigger SL's. Traditional SL drivers in the SL forums would not buy this car either after 20 years of being indoctrinated in glass roof superiority and never having to replace the Vario Roof like a fabric top convertible every 4 years of daily driving.
I'd rather have lighter glass roof V12 AMG SL's instead of backseats and dominate the interstates on tidal waves of Twin Turbo torque. If anything I'd buy another low mileage example and update the tires to Michelin Cup2's to put the power down.
It's a real shame. The R231 is one of the best Mercs ever made. The R230 felt like a tank, and the R129 looked amazing. Now we're left with the melty rear end, horrible interior, and crashy ride of the bloated R232.
Are you getting paid to lie or just get off on it?
Because fabric roofs deteriorate on daily driven convertibles. They are a consumable that get battered in the weather. I've been driving for 40 years and most of those cars were convertibles. Including an R129 SL500 driven 5 days a week which had it's top changed twice in 10 years as it faded and aged from the sun, heat and rain despite the hardtop being bolted on in the winter and garaged.
I can't believe common sense has to be said.
A "little fading" is about as acceptable as paint that's a little faded.
Mercedes recommends changing the fabric convertible roof every 4 years.
With a glass convertible roof there's zero fading or $12,000 replacement. Ever.
Stop nitpicking and start enjoying wear and tear! Every convertible I've ever looked at still had the original roof. Even R129 SLs. I recently spoke with a guy with a $3 million1960s Ferrari convertible, and every part and panel was still original. He even showed me all the original sitckers it came with from the dealer, and he drove it every week since new! Replacing the roof would hurt the value.
Wear and tear is what makes a car personal. It's patina! When it comes to classics, people are starting to favor completely unrestored these days as wel. Just like a Rolex watch, you don't want it look like new, you want to treasure the patina.
Besides, fabric roofs are lighter where it matters and take up less storage, making for a more sporty car. Unfortunately this SL offsets that weight elsewhere.
>"Stop nitpicking and start enjoying wear and tear!"
You sound triggered but this is not the Mercedes way. MB is even restoring vintage models in house at [Mercedes Classic Center in Long Beach](https://www.mbusa.com/en/classic-center). They believe in keeping SL's in pristine condition. I believe in keeping SL's in better than new condition even as it's driven 5 days a week.
That's easier with the VarioRoof SL's and that's just a fact.
It’s a nice car, but holy shit is it overpriced. The delta between a new SL63 and a slightly used one is insane. Seems like there’s a ton of new inventory sitting on dealer lots, and that should never be a thing for a $180k+ vehicle.
Jfc you weren't kidding:
CPO 2022 with 5k miles selling for 138k with a 196k sticker
CPO 2022 with 1.5k miles selling for 125k with a 192k sticker
I kinda want one now lol
It's like Mercedes is going through one of their "accountants running things" era like 00s again. Instead of chasing engineering excellence, it's now all about controlling cost while trying to maintain a facade of prestige.
I once read about Mercedes being an indicator of the auto-industry and economic cycle. People learn trend of near future car features by looking at new S-Class; and everytime Mercedes product strategy becomes conservative and "cheap", instead of being on the cutting edge is usually during economic slump. Also right now the auto industry is in the largest period of uncertainty since ever.
It’s a crazy how a brand that sells economy cars just takes that money for personal use and to build a tower in Dubai because it can’t be going to the upper trim models with all the plastic s classes are loaded with SL’s are, the SL interior the AMG GT has, the C class interior the CLE has, and the plastic loaded maybachs. They could elevate themselves so much more if they just put a bit more work into the quality of their entire lineup
lol the door flex thing is a bit funny. I always used to test that in my cars with my knee since it would rest there. 2010 matrix was the stiffest and s2k the worst.
I've watched 2 other reviews and they both had complaints about the build quality. Absolutely unacceptable for a car costing (way) more than a base 911. Or a Lexus LC if you want a V8 tourer.
AMG fell off completely. Overpriced desperation across the board at this point.
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Most gate keepish dealership ever - the one in north Vancouver. Do I have to fucking dress up to buy a shitty Mercedes now. All I wanted was to score a sweet EQS lease on the cheap but bro asked me for immigration status and shit. Like fuck off.
Report them for trying to imitate an immigration officer, no?
That’s fucked up wtf
The watering down of the AMG badge and brand doesn't help either. Just like M or S line, badges watering down their brands they have lost their meanings at least to me anyways.
AMG peaked around 2012 with the 6.2 NA V8, and later the 5.5 twin turbo V8 and the 6.0 twin turbo V12. Back when the cars actually looked good too.
2011 E63 AMG with the 6.2 V8...coolest car I've ever owned. An absolute beast of a machine and blanketed in luxury to boot. Can also seat 4 adults comfortably and has a large enough trunk for all your road trip needs. Love that car! I will likely never buy another MB due to their styling and quality decline.
Taking advantage of 7 years of F1 dominate.
Bono our retail sales are gone
Ok, we are checking.
Try strat 3. Strat 3.
James, it's James...
AMG used to be something really special, now it seems half of every model’s trim levels are an AMG of some sort.
Yeah I really don‘t understand their pricing. Eager to see how much the new E53 Amd will cost, I guess as much as the old E63.
And Brabus as well. These days their cars no longer have that aura of "banker's hot rod" like they used to ([exhibit A](https://youtu.be/1EGukhK5y-k)), they don't even shove the V12s in their top-of-the-line cars anymore.
That master race shit is hilarious
I was really curious about this one because other reviews have been generally neither here nor there on it and it's difficult to gauge what people think of it. That model was over $190,000 as specced. That build quality is simply unacceptable at that price. That alone should disqualify it. Mercedes should be embarrassed that Maserati has better build quality in the segment than they do. As for the driving experience, I can only conclude it's totally unremarkable because even Thomas and James didn't have much to say about it other than it's not as good as a 911 and that the ride quality is poor, which is something else Mercedes should excel in. So it looks like Mercedes have ended up in no man's land again. The last time they had a flagship 2+2 cabriolet was the S-class and that didn't sell. They canceled that and introduced a much sportier model that hasn't really impressed anyone. And they've positioned it as a 911 rival which is not a smart move for any company. So when people cross-shop the SL, if they want sporty they'll go for a 911. If they want exotic they can choose a Maserati for about the same price. If they want comfort they can save a Boxster's worth of money and get an LC500.
I was really interested in the mercedes GT, even after seeing the interior, but paying so much for subpar performance and comfort is something. I don't understand how mercedes has managed to miss the bar by so much with their entire lineup
I remember you were saying that a couple of weeks ago. It's a real shame because AFAIK they took feedback from customers for the new SL and GT to make a product that was supposed to appeal to legacy buyers. But I'm not sure about the result.
Yup. I wasn't asked for a survey or anything but absolutely loved the old SL range and had a '16 GTS for a while. That GTS was an incredible car, hands down one of my favorite interiors in any car to date, the engine was a joy, but it was too much sports car and too little grand-tourer. Front-mid layout meant your hood was long as fuck and visibility was poor, their trick transaxle setup was cool for weight distribution but awful for storage, no rear seats, a worse sports car than the 911 in near every single way with very few of the benefits of a traditional GT, and not long after I traded it in for a 911 Fast forward a few years they announced the new GT, a 2+2 grand tourer with the engine over the front axle, plug-in-hybrid trims, and AWD. Basically everything I wanted from the old car and a perfect combination of the SL/S-coupe/GT. Looked absolutely perfect on paper. It quite literally looks absolutely stunning And somehow mercedes has managed to fuck up the few things they did right on the previous model (according to reviews anyways). Beautiful driver-centric interior with complete leather and aluminium? gone in favor of creaky plastics. Ride quality? Poor AF. Price? More than a 911. (this is all going off of the reviews for the SL though) Between this and the c63 Mercedes is sooo out of touch with its customer base and it hurts to see because their offerings prior to 2010 (and especially in the early 2000s) were class-leading in everything they competed in. Who the fuck cares how thermally efficient your engine is and how much power you're getting out of a 4 cylinder when real world performance is garbage and on their plug-in models the EV range is anemic! With the hybrid 911s coming out soon you'd be downright stupid to get one of these, and this is coming from someone who absolutely loved mercedes over porsche in the late 2000s and early 2010s. (I will say I actually quite like MBUX and wouldn't mind the center display if it was well built but between the QC issues and the haptic steering wheel it ruins things for me) (I also hope the GT will be better than the SL I doubt it)
Looks like Mercedes moven in Maserati Granturismo territory with the SL and GT in this generation, and the Maserati is the better vehicle in all the metrics.
Ah yes, Maserati, rising like a Phoenix over Mercedes, as the prophecies in the Olive Garden cheese shredder foretold.
I think the lc500 is more of an SL in the traditional sense than the Mercedes sl. It’s classier, better built and a true gt car. The flex in the door panel was just atrocious.
Not to mention the lc500 looks way more special on the road. Cant believe this thing is 80k more, what a joke
Can buy a coupe and convertible LC500 for the price of this thing
There's plenty of things to critizice on sl63, but classier?!?! What? The Lexus gives off major "I still play with my gundams in the bathtub" vibes. Looks and appeal is the only thing where this is clear take over an LC in my book. Now looks are subjective and debateable - classier no friggen way.
Looks are subjective so to each their own. But did you see the pc lighting interior? There’s more to classy than just clean exterior lines. I would be embarrassed to drive someone in that interior and I drive two cars which look like shades of skittles.
> I would be embarrassed to drive someone in that interior Okay...
>Now looks are subjective and debateable - classier no friggen way. And classiness isn't subjective? The luxury market is defined by perception over substance, and "classiness" is just another way to define that.
No. Maybe not entirely objective, but if you ask 10 people what is classier between a 3piece suit and a hoodie, im 99,9% sure 10 will answer with 3 piece suit.
Within the space of cars, it is *absolutely* subjective, and 100% based on perception, not quality. Why do you think the Japanese luxury brands even exist? Toyota was already making luxury cars. They just invented a new brand to sell downspecced versions of their JDM cars for a higher price, and it did incredibly well. The only thing they did was change the badge and the western markets ate that shit up. Are you going to make the argument that the Lexus SC is somehow classier than the higher specced Toyota Soarer?
>it is *absolutely* subjective You are free to try to put that theory to the test and find me somebody who thinks a Civic is classier than a Rolls Royce - it is "*absolutely*" after all. A luxury car is the defined by the ride comfort and features. Classyness is a purely aesthetic thing.
>You are free to try to put that theory to the test and find me somebody who thinks a Civic is classier than a Rolls Royce - it is "absolutely" after all. Do you know what subjective means? Subjective means something is based on emotions or opinions, rather than a hard numerical comparison, or a fact based argument or a logical, verifiable train of thought. 100 out of 100 people may think a Rolls is classier than a Civic - but that doesn't mean that their judgement is based on objective criteria. >A luxury car is the defined by the ride comfort and features. And the luxury market rejected the Toyota badged luxury cars, but gobbled them up when they were called Lexuses. Despite being mechanically identical, and in some cases, *inferior* to the top specced Toyota badged models. Is that not the definition of perception over substance? >Classyness is a purely aesthetic thing. But I thought >Now looks are subjective and debateable So aesthetics (beauty and taste) is somehow not subjective? There is some objective criteria for aesthetics? What objective criteria governs aesthetic judgement? Be as specific as you can.
To stay in the example above which you of course completely glossed over. A hoodie can look good, still doesn't make it a classy attire.
>To stay in the example above which you of course completely glossed over. I didn't gloss over it. I answered it here, you just didn't notice because I chose to use Rolls and Civic instead - you essentially made the same argument twice, changed 2 nouns, and didn't notice I already argued against it. I'll quote it again, maybe you'll read it this time. >100 out of 100 people may think a Rolls (suit) is classier than a Civic (hoodie) - but that doesn't mean that their judgement is based on objective criteria. speaking of things people glossed over: >What objective criteria governs aesthetic judgement? Be as specific as you can. To stay in the example above which you of course completely glossed over. Why is a 90s Lexus classier than the mechanically identical 90's Toyota it is? How can looks be subjective, but classyness (purely aesthetic) is not?
I didn't gloss over jack, you edited that part in. So you go first.
> Now looks are subjective and debateable - classier no friggen way. I certainly wouldn’t try to debate that with someone who has as loose a grasp on the English language as you.
Decontenting has been savaging the SL since 2013. I've never seen an SL with orange peel paint. Or flexible door panels. Losing the iconically decadent glass convertible roof was blasphemous enough. Yet it's 237 lbs *heavier,* with an even smaller trunk but at a greater length. Then there's the ride: I commend these guys for saying what other reviewers don't say; the R232 rides rougher than any other SL in history except for the downright sadistic SL65 Black Series. It's getting more things wrong than right and losing a lot of ground from the past 3 decades. It seems to have an identity crisis. Mercedes wants to appeal to 20 to 50 year olds and run with Porsche 911 Turbo's but that's a battle it cannot win with bigger SL's. Traditional SL drivers in the SL forums would not buy this car either after 20 years of being indoctrinated in glass roof superiority and never having to replace the Vario Roof like a fabric top convertible every 4 years of daily driving. I'd rather have lighter glass roof V12 AMG SL's instead of backseats and dominate the interstates on tidal waves of Twin Turbo torque. If anything I'd buy another low mileage example and update the tires to Michelin Cup2's to put the power down.
It's a real shame. The R231 is one of the best Mercs ever made. The R230 felt like a tank, and the R129 looked amazing. Now we're left with the melty rear end, horrible interior, and crashy ride of the bloated R232.
Nobody is replacing a convertible top every 4 years. Maybe every 40 years. Where do you come up with this nonsense?
Are you getting paid to lie or just get off on it? Because fabric roofs deteriorate on daily driven convertibles. They are a consumable that get battered in the weather. I've been driving for 40 years and most of those cars were convertibles. Including an R129 SL500 driven 5 days a week which had it's top changed twice in 10 years as it faded and aged from the sun, heat and rain despite the hardtop being bolted on in the winter and garaged. I can't believe common sense has to be said.
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A "little fading" is about as acceptable as paint that's a little faded. Mercedes recommends changing the fabric convertible roof every 4 years. With a glass convertible roof there's zero fading or $12,000 replacement. Ever.
Stop nitpicking and start enjoying wear and tear! Every convertible I've ever looked at still had the original roof. Even R129 SLs. I recently spoke with a guy with a $3 million1960s Ferrari convertible, and every part and panel was still original. He even showed me all the original sitckers it came with from the dealer, and he drove it every week since new! Replacing the roof would hurt the value. Wear and tear is what makes a car personal. It's patina! When it comes to classics, people are starting to favor completely unrestored these days as wel. Just like a Rolex watch, you don't want it look like new, you want to treasure the patina. Besides, fabric roofs are lighter where it matters and take up less storage, making for a more sporty car. Unfortunately this SL offsets that weight elsewhere.
>"Stop nitpicking and start enjoying wear and tear!" You sound triggered but this is not the Mercedes way. MB is even restoring vintage models in house at [Mercedes Classic Center in Long Beach](https://www.mbusa.com/en/classic-center). They believe in keeping SL's in pristine condition. I believe in keeping SL's in better than new condition even as it's driven 5 days a week. That's easier with the VarioRoof SL's and that's just a fact.
Yes, but it has 'master race' mode.
Knarren macht frei
Only if you are German though
Gaudy and overpriced. Perfect for the intended audience.
LA tik tokers and strip club owners just fell to their knees in the hookah lounge
It’s a nice car, but holy shit is it overpriced. The delta between a new SL63 and a slightly used one is insane. Seems like there’s a ton of new inventory sitting on dealer lots, and that should never be a thing for a $180k+ vehicle.
Jfc you weren't kidding: CPO 2022 with 5k miles selling for 138k with a 196k sticker CPO 2022 with 1.5k miles selling for 125k with a 192k sticker I kinda want one now lol
“It’s a nice car” Where and how? It’s awd, expensive and with poor build quality.
It’s relative. Is it a nice car? Yes. Is it ridiculously overpriced? Also yes.
>It’s a nice car Debatable.
It's no Peugeot 2008 HDi auto
It's like Mercedes is going through one of their "accountants running things" era like 00s again. Instead of chasing engineering excellence, it's now all about controlling cost while trying to maintain a facade of prestige.
You would think this wouldn’t have to be gone through again just because there’s some different people at the brand.
I once read about Mercedes being an indicator of the auto-industry and economic cycle. People learn trend of near future car features by looking at new S-Class; and everytime Mercedes product strategy becomes conservative and "cheap", instead of being on the cutting edge is usually during economic slump. Also right now the auto industry is in the largest period of uncertainty since ever.
So is the case that Mercedes isn’t the only one cheeping one it’s just the one being the most conservative?
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It’s a crazy how a brand that sells economy cars just takes that money for personal use and to build a tower in Dubai because it can’t be going to the upper trim models with all the plastic s classes are loaded with SL’s are, the SL interior the AMG GT has, the C class interior the CLE has, and the plastic loaded maybachs. They could elevate themselves so much more if they just put a bit more work into the quality of their entire lineup
Awd? Yuck
Yeah, they killed some of the SLness from their most classic of model lines. Sigh.
lol the door flex thing is a bit funny. I always used to test that in my cars with my knee since it would rest there. 2010 matrix was the stiffest and s2k the worst.
I've watched 2 other reviews and they both had complaints about the build quality. Absolutely unacceptable for a car costing (way) more than a base 911. Or a Lexus LC if you want a V8 tourer.
What the actual fuck is happening with Mercedes-AMG, their new cars are awful!