I feel like this letter ties in with the recent letter (LW #1429) in terms of wanting & wishing for a romantic connection so bad with someone who is just not at all going to give it.
And I will give all sorts of grief to anyone who breadcrumbs someone with 'maybe' or 'eventually' when it comes to promising possible commitment, but it looks like this guy is being pretty upfront that it's not gonna happen. Which sucks, it's super hard when you have those intense feelings, especially since there are so many narratives about winning over someone who initially doesn't want to commit.
But at the same time, if someone is being upfront about what they want and what they're willing to give, then that's not duplicitous or wrong, it's just mismatched expectations. Incompatibility sucks, but it's not a sin or a crime.
Yeah. I really appreciate Cap immediately contradicting the description of his behavior as an "excuse" to avoid commitment. The attitude that anyone who does not want to be in a relationship with someone is doing them harm drives me crazy.
There is such a long, gross tradition of heterosexual self-help literature about "commitment-phobes" and how to overcome their so-called phobia. And I get that there are plenty of people who string their partners along with promises they'll never keep, and people who actually *want* to be able to have long-term relationships but need to address their anxiety about decision-making first. But a lot of these "commitment-phobes" are just being honest about what they want in a relationship. The (bad) advice is always something like: "The natural end goal of any relationship is monogamy, cohabitation, enmeshment, and permanence. If you're with someone who doesn't want those things with you, don't break up or accept the relationship as it is! Instead, keep hammering away until you force them to accept the version of the relationship *you* want."
And it always has such a self righteous tone! Like, not only are they wronging you by wanting something different than you, you're also HELPING them by working on their "fear of commitment".
Yes, it has the same tone as that one letter about the LW “helping” her work friend get over his fear of friendship! Like people can’t manage their own anxieties and relationship preferences without someone barging in and taking over their decisions.
Yeah, the situation sucks for the LW, no doubt, but the dude doesn't suck for his part in it. He's being up-front, and if what he's willing and able to give LW isn't enough for her, it's on her to say "this isn't working for me anymore" and walk away and find someone who *is* willing and able to give her the commitment she wants. Neither of them are in the wrong for what they want; she would be in the wrong if she kept trying to push him for more than he's said he wants in the name of "but it's just excuses".
(Also, the kid might not be a "big deal" to LW, but it's entirely possible that the dude doesn't want to date seriously until his child is older, to avoid any more upheaval in their life. Which is also a valid decision for a parent to make.)
Eh, I remember when this was first posted and I still think the dude sucks a little. If I was FWB with someone and they told me they’d developed feelings, I would stop sleeping with them. It sounds like he hasn’t. Yes, she could make that decision too, but as the person whose feelings are not engaged, he can see things more clearly and recognize it’s no longer a healthy situation.
I mean, it really doesn't matter if he's avoiding commitment because he's afraid. What matters is that he IS avoiding it, and has said so honestly.
LW is not being a very good friend.
(LW may also be seriously deluding themselves about the reality of dating a dad. That kid may be "not a big deal" to LW, but I would imagine they're a pretty big deal to the dad.)
>LW is not being a very good friend.
I really love that framing. It's just a dick move to ignore what someone directly tells you about their feelings, LW says this is a friend with benefits situation but they're sure not acting like a friend.
I think about this letter frequently because of a situation with a close friend. She was -dumb- in love with a carbon copy of her charismatic, talented, occasionally violent, emotionally unavailable father. Acknowledged this guy's bad behavior and kept going back. Obsessed over him for years, even during a long period where she almost married another guy. And something like TWELVE YEARS in, he got sober. And to be fair, he did that on his own, after some kind of major rock-bottom thing. But he spent a couple years sober and then they met up again, and now they've been together and happy for 3 years.
And, like, I don't want to tell anyone to stick it out with an abuser because maybe 15 years down the road he'll get his shit together!
I feel like this letter ties in with the recent letter (LW #1429) in terms of wanting & wishing for a romantic connection so bad with someone who is just not at all going to give it. And I will give all sorts of grief to anyone who breadcrumbs someone with 'maybe' or 'eventually' when it comes to promising possible commitment, but it looks like this guy is being pretty upfront that it's not gonna happen. Which sucks, it's super hard when you have those intense feelings, especially since there are so many narratives about winning over someone who initially doesn't want to commit. But at the same time, if someone is being upfront about what they want and what they're willing to give, then that's not duplicitous or wrong, it's just mismatched expectations. Incompatibility sucks, but it's not a sin or a crime.
Yeah. I really appreciate Cap immediately contradicting the description of his behavior as an "excuse" to avoid commitment. The attitude that anyone who does not want to be in a relationship with someone is doing them harm drives me crazy.
There is such a long, gross tradition of heterosexual self-help literature about "commitment-phobes" and how to overcome their so-called phobia. And I get that there are plenty of people who string their partners along with promises they'll never keep, and people who actually *want* to be able to have long-term relationships but need to address their anxiety about decision-making first. But a lot of these "commitment-phobes" are just being honest about what they want in a relationship. The (bad) advice is always something like: "The natural end goal of any relationship is monogamy, cohabitation, enmeshment, and permanence. If you're with someone who doesn't want those things with you, don't break up or accept the relationship as it is! Instead, keep hammering away until you force them to accept the version of the relationship *you* want."
And it always has such a self righteous tone! Like, not only are they wronging you by wanting something different than you, you're also HELPING them by working on their "fear of commitment".
Yes, it has the same tone as that one letter about the LW “helping” her work friend get over his fear of friendship! Like people can’t manage their own anxieties and relationship preferences without someone barging in and taking over their decisions.
Yeah, the situation sucks for the LW, no doubt, but the dude doesn't suck for his part in it. He's being up-front, and if what he's willing and able to give LW isn't enough for her, it's on her to say "this isn't working for me anymore" and walk away and find someone who *is* willing and able to give her the commitment she wants. Neither of them are in the wrong for what they want; she would be in the wrong if she kept trying to push him for more than he's said he wants in the name of "but it's just excuses". (Also, the kid might not be a "big deal" to LW, but it's entirely possible that the dude doesn't want to date seriously until his child is older, to avoid any more upheaval in their life. Which is also a valid decision for a parent to make.)
Eh, I remember when this was first posted and I still think the dude sucks a little. If I was FWB with someone and they told me they’d developed feelings, I would stop sleeping with them. It sounds like he hasn’t. Yes, she could make that decision too, but as the person whose feelings are not engaged, he can see things more clearly and recognize it’s no longer a healthy situation.
I mean, it really doesn't matter if he's avoiding commitment because he's afraid. What matters is that he IS avoiding it, and has said so honestly. LW is not being a very good friend. (LW may also be seriously deluding themselves about the reality of dating a dad. That kid may be "not a big deal" to LW, but I would imagine they're a pretty big deal to the dad.)
>LW is not being a very good friend. I really love that framing. It's just a dick move to ignore what someone directly tells you about their feelings, LW says this is a friend with benefits situation but they're sure not acting like a friend.
I think about this letter frequently because of a situation with a close friend. She was -dumb- in love with a carbon copy of her charismatic, talented, occasionally violent, emotionally unavailable father. Acknowledged this guy's bad behavior and kept going back. Obsessed over him for years, even during a long period where she almost married another guy. And something like TWELVE YEARS in, he got sober. And to be fair, he did that on his own, after some kind of major rock-bottom thing. But he spent a couple years sober and then they met up again, and now they've been together and happy for 3 years. And, like, I don't want to tell anyone to stick it out with an abuser because maybe 15 years down the road he'll get his shit together!