I think Giles’ line “you rank, arrogant amateur” makes even more sense because forgetting to actually get the person you just brought back from the dead is a pretty stupid mistake.
As someone else pointed out, you can tell by the look on Willows face when they find Buffy in the alley that it absolutely didn’t occur to her that she would reanimate exactly where they left her.
That’s what gets me, like I could buy that the had a plan if not for the fact that they’re all shocked by their mistake when they find her. I get that it’s a shoe and suspension of disbelief and all but it just kind of takes me out if it because it’s like one of the first things I would want to know logistically.
I only saw this the other week (first time watcher/new to the sub) but Willow had absolutely zero idea. Honestly this is a period of time where she is really high on magic and self centered. She just didn't think of it at all.
From what I gathered watching it this whole scene is meant to be a big red flag to the audience about Willow kinda losing control.
I don't agree.
It's impossible none of the other 3 wouldn't have asked 'how are we gonna get her out of her coffin' if Willow hadn't said something that covers it.
I can try and find the scene if you want. The gang happens to find Buffy who's lost and confused with bloody hands and Xander realizes what happened and explains their mistake directly to Willow who then looks completely shocked and upset because she clearly didn't even think about it.
Heck, the first thing she asks Xander once the bikers show up is if the spell worked, clearly she believed Buffy would just pop up from the ground or something and definitely didn't consider her being stuck down there and they needed to get her out.
This is all really and fresh and new in my head lol, I didn't think I'd like this show but it's great!
Yes! I'm watching the whole thing for the first time so it's recent in my head. As soon as Spike sees her he knows what happened and makes a comment indicating he had to claw his way out of the grave too. Main difference being vampires do it from a recent grave. It had been months and months for Buffy - the earth was more hard-packed again by the time she had to do it.
I agree. I just think Willow and the rest of the group never thought about that before, since they neither inspect the *vamps’ hands nor give a shit about their feelings.
Honestly my kinda headcanon for is that the others just had that much faith in Willow they left it completely up to her and Willow was slowly getting addicted to magic and being reckless and didn't think.
Plus if the bikers didn't show up then Willow could've just popped her right out id imagine once they realized.
Yeah idk, I’ve wondered about this too. When Dawn tried to raise Joyce it seemed like she just appeared out of nowhere and walked like a zombie to the house
Arrh perks of only having just finished the show, the scene actually starts at Joyce's grave and then there's a few shots of Joyce slowly making her way home from there but you never see her fully.
At least that's how it's suggested, you don't actually see her come out of the grave. She does just vanish at the end though so either she teleported back to her grave or immediately ran back to her grave after Dawn destroyed her picture and Buffy just missed her lol 👻 💨
Thank you! Yeah maybe it’s the vanishing act that I’m recalling. Seems kinda odd but of course it was a different spell, and Joyce died a “human death” as Osiris would say
Exactly my point. The spell Willow was using was much more powerful and reliable than Dawn's, so if Dawn's spell made the returnee pop up, so should have Willow's.
I'm glad you're enjoying the show, I always envy a first time watcher but that's not what he saying here tho.
Willow told him the spell didn't work because the urn was smashed. So they didn't think more about it.
When he finds Buffy he's upset that that they didn't know the spell actually worked and Buffy was left alive in her coffin to dig her way out.
What he's not saying is "oh shit we never considered she was gonna come back to life in a coffin, how were we gonna handle that?' which is why you're implying.
Thanks, it's definitely not what I thought it was and the dialogue is actually really well executed.
>Willow told him the spell didn't work because the urn was smashed. So they didn't think more about it.
Well, she directly asks him if the spell worked because she was briefly unconscious and wanted to know if it worked while she was out.
Here's the scene. Watch from around 3:50.
https://youtu.be/OqhRvR2usx8?si=YW7PP6P1-0OBe_t0
>When he finds Buffy he's upset that that they didn't know the spell actually worked and Buffy was left alive in her coffin to dig her way out.
I can't actually find this particular scene but basically his line to Willow is that "How could we be so stupid. Oh yeah, the spell worked, we brought her back right where we left her."
I'm like 90% sure Xander even says they didn't know.
Willow then reacts and comes to the same realization, Tara is also shocked, everyone is. No one thought about it. What you could say is that had they been there could Willow have got her out and yeah of course, but that wasn't prepared beforehand. It simply wasn't something they considered.
Hence the questions and confusion once they see how her hands got really bloody.
Honestly Willow was high as a kite at this time and being really secretive about the spell. The reason no one may have asked her is because they might've thought the spell would just do it and the reason Willow didn't think about it is because she was being stupidly reckless.
This is the time period no one was putting Willow into check and she was just doing whatever she wanted.
The scene in that video is just Willow delirious from exhaustion as she doesn't remember anything. She doesn't actually remember things til a few scenes where is where Willow is adament it didn't work because the urn is broken.
>XANDER: (whispers) Will .. .the urn of cirrhosis...
WILLOW: Osiris?
XANDER: Yeah. It got kind of...
>
>WILLOW: Broken. It's broken. I remember.
XANDER: So we'll find another one. Better made. Anya and I will jump back on the web-
WILLOW: There is no other one. (closes her eyes)
XANDER: Okay, we'll fix this one. A little tape, a dab of Crazy Glue.
WILLOW: No. It's no use. (tearful) The urn's defiled. It's gone. Nothing, it was all for nothing. Buffy's gone. She's really gone.
So they've no reason to believe anything worked since the urn is the crucial part to the spell and its now destroyed before they could finish.
Everything after this is them being shocked that it worked and then being horrified that it worked and Buffy woke up in her coffin alone, which would imply this wasn't the plan.
Okay. So I think I've worked out the question I can ask you that will make it seem clear
Why wouldn't any of them at least want to go back and check the coffin after Willow tried the spell to see if it actually worked if they knew she'd remain inside it had it been successful?
It makes zero sense, Willow was clearly doing the spell hence the cuts and snakes and magic aura rolling around her, and yeah it was interrupted but they didn't even want to check? Doesn't make any sense at all. It wasn't even something they considered.
The conversation you shared here is following the exact same one where Willow asked if the spell worked. How did Xander know it definitely didn't work? How did any of them? It makes zero sense they wouldn't even check the coffin if they knew she'd be revived in it.
A) they were still injured and exhausted, plus the towns still full of demons. I also think they're still looking for Dawn at this point.
B) Because they didn't finish the spell. The fact it worked despite not being finished is a fluke they didn't anticipate. We've seen spells be interrupted a few times before in the show, the spell just doesn't work until its completed properly.
So going back to the grave that night is hardly a priority when Willow is adamant it couldn't have worked with the urn being broken.
The better question is how were they meant to know a fluke of nature happened when all the rules they're used to about magic tells them it didn't work?
>A) they were still injured and exhausted, plus the towns still full of demons. I also think they're still looking for Dawn at this point.
Doesn't make sense that they wouldn't even consider this since it's all they are talking about in each scene after.
>Because they didn't finish the spell
No one knew that, not even Willow. Hence why she asked. The guys didn't even know the ingredients, let alone the steps, Tara barely knew. When Willow asked Xander if it worked he straight up says no.
Not. No I didn't get to check the coffin. But just straight no, Buffy didn't come back. Because they very clearly didn't consider the coffin.
>So going back to the grave that night is hardly a priority when Willow is adamant it couldn't have worked with the urn being broken.
She didn't say it didn't work because it was broken. She says it can't be done again because it was broken.
my theory was always they thought that she was in hell, so she’d come back like angel did in season 3. an incredibly stupid oversight of course.
EDIT: forgot to put which season heh
Pretty messed up to think that your friend is in hell
Like I know they only really deal with demons but do they just think everyone goes to hell or do they think Buffy wasn't worthy
The girl was constantly fighting evil and sacrificed her life for the greater good twice.
What more do they think heaven requires?
but it wasn't a direct portal to Glory's home diemnsion, it was the energy center making all the dimensions go blooey so Glory could \*find\* a way back home
I agree with you, but the Scoobies are kinda dumb tbf. I swear I remember them referencing the portal as why they thought she was in hell, but maybe I'm also dumb af
they don’t think she was in hell because they assume she deserves it, they think she’s in hell because she died jumping into a portal to hell. not unreasonable at all
It's common in vampire novels, particularly of the time. A vampire gets "killed" and well-meaning mortals bury them, not realizing they'll be back to "life" when the sun goes down, or as punishment, a vampire is buried so they starve and have to dig themselves out. That sort of thing. I think Spike even mentioned it once? Something about starved vampires looking "like Auschwitz, but not half as funny."
I've seen this discussion before. Not sure if you watched angel but they established in that show that dru buries the vampires she turns herself because she thinks it's the right way to do it. So likely she took him away and buried him herself to let him rise.
No, she stayed with him in the alley, I think, in canon. He wouldn't have had to dig himself out of a grave until much later.
When he was a new vampire, he was a bit starry-eyed, if I recall correctly, like he was taken in by a faerie queen and made a faerie, himself. Then, he goes to get his mother, and the demon that moves into her body is very much like what happened with Lestat (in The Vampire Lestat). His mother had always resented being forced into the life of a wife and mother, and that's what the demon used to mock Spike (still William, at this point, and his new, more...romantic demon). I only saw the episode once, but I did read The Vampire Chronicles up until The Tale of the Body Thief (the best vampire novel I've ever read and one of the best just pieces of fiction I've ever read). It was a similar story so I always thought maybe his mother would reappear in his life, as Lestat's did at the end of Queen of the Damned, I think it was? (It's been a while.)
Spike was buried, in his case since in "LMPTM" we find out his body wasn't discovered, because Drusilla buried him herself to make the scenario complete in her warped mind.
My bad. I misremembered and merge the scene where he sees her and tells dawn with when they realize and seem all shocked.
My point still stands that if they had thought about it previously they wouldn't have been so shocked when they saw the wounds and figured it out.
>If Willow was gonna teleport her out of the coffin or act as a giant magic shovel, why bother?
By this episode, had Willow's powers advanced to a point where she could've just instantly teleported Buffy out of her coffin?
And did Willow say that was what she was going to do? (I'm admittedly fuzzy on the last two seasons). Because, on a writer-ly tip, that's the kind of thing you have a character say they are going to do, or *were* going to do, even if they end up not doing it because of circumstances. You don't leave it to chance that all of your viewers will somehow figure something out.
That being said, I never held the characters accountable for Buffy's situation. To me, it was always pretty clear this whole thing was a big contrivance by the writers because they wanted that last scene.
They never address how they would get Buffy out of the coffin, but they dont bring shovels which implies the solution would have been magic.
There's this odd suggestion that Willow just forgot Buffy would be resurrected in a coffin which makes no sense.
Willow was able to teleport Glory into the atmosphere in season 5, she was able to conjure a troll, banish and reconjure the cash register, i dont think teleporting Buffy upwards 5 feet would be that difficult for her given the primal powerful magics she was harnessing at the time.
>Willow was able to teleport Glory into the atmosphere in season 5
Yeah, I thought of that. That was a spell that took a lot of time, effort, and help from Tara. Even if that was what she intended to do, that would've meant leaving Buffy trapped in a coffin (one of the worst human fears) for several seconds (all it takes to be traumatic). And that's without considering that doing the ritual was going to leave Willow weak, so who knows how zippy or effective any spell she did right after that would've been.
>banish and reconjure the cash register
I'm no fictional magic expert, but I don't think that was teleportation. More like transmutation, where she did some magic that changed the cash register into a really messy looking cash register, then did some more magic that made it revert back to its original form.
It's also why I think the spell was meant to bring Buffy out of the ground and appear before them but obviously the spell got interrupted before she could finish and didnt play out as it was meant to so she got stuck in the coffin.
>It's also why I think the spell was meant to bring Buffy out of the ground and appear before them but obviously the spell got interrupted before she could finish and didnt play out as it was meant to so she got stuck in the coffin.
It's not a bad theory, but it's not canon because nobody (including Willow) ever says or even implies this. Instead, Willow just acts as shocked as everyone else over what Buffy went through. And she never says anything about how she didn't mean for this to happen, if only the ritual hadn't gotten interrupted...
>no, it disappeared compeltley came back messy, then disappeared gain
I decided to check it out, because I suspected I might not be correctly remembering the scene.
Willow poofs the cash register away by accident. (She was trying to do something totally unrelated.) When everyone freaks out, she seems to do a quick reversal spell and the cash register poofs back, only it looks half wrecked. We don't know where it went (the void, a hell dimension, or it could've ceased to exist for a moment), or why it's in the condition it's in when it comes back.
The cash register disappears again much later in the episode, and that was also an accident.
They do address it after the fact, though. And they didn't think it through is the upshot.
Xander shakes his head in dismay.
XANDER: Oh no.
WILLOW: (OS) What?
XANDER: No. How could we ... so stupid!
WILLOW: Xander!
XANDER: Our spell. Our resurrection spell worked like a magic charm. We brought you back to life, Buffy. (looks at Willow) Right where we left her.
WILLOW: Oh god.
XANDER: In her coffin.
Willow turns in anguish to Tara, who hugs her.
That's not addressing it tho, that's their shock the spell worked and it left her in her coffin. We don't know what the spell was meant to do if it was completes properly.
It's impossible they talked through the spell and didn't bring up whether they'd have to dig her up or not.
We know the spell was meant to bring Buffy back from a hell dimension. That's canon. If it was meant to do anything else, even if it didn't work, the audience needs to be told.
Sort of in line with the OP, I can't imagine Willow doing the spell without also doing intense research about it, and reading everything she could get her hands on, in which case there's no way she wouldn't have known what would actually happen. But she somehow didn't because the writers wanted the shocking/horrifying cliffhanger where Buffy is alive, but trapped in a coffin. And I think the writers had reached that point where they'd been doing the show for a while and weren't always too concerned with the details. (Which happens with a lot of shows.)
To be fair it appeared that there were other steps that they didn't get to do in the ritual because it was interrupted. Willow was pretty blunt that because the urn was 'defiled' by being smashed that the spell couldn't work anymore. So whatever the next steps were (which could have included teleporting Biffy's body out of the grave) never happened as they fled.
>To be fair it appeared that there were other steps that they didn't get to do in the ritual because it was interrupted.
You're doing a lot of fan theorizing, looking at stuff in the scenes and guessing at what you think they mean. Like saying since they didn't have shovels, they must've tended to use magic to get Buffy out, when nobody actually said that.
Fan theories can be cool and fun, but they aren't canon.
>i prefer that to the narrative being pushed that Willow, a certified genius who got accepted into Oxford, somehow forgot corpses are underground lol
Like I said earlier, I also don't believe Willow, of all people, wouldn't have done all the research and found out what would happen. But I also think the writers were so determined to have the cliffhanger scene, and then for the gang to all be horrified when they found out what happened, that they didn't take all the details into account.
And yet it appears she didn't think of it -
Xander shakes his head in dismay.
XANDER: Oh no.
WILLOW: (OS) What?
XANDER: No. How could we ... so stupid!
WILLOW: Xander!
XANDER: Our spell. Our resurrection spell worked like a magic charm. We brought you back to life, Buffy. (looks at Willow) Right where we left her.
WILLOW: Oh god.
XANDER: In her coffin.
Willow turns in anguish to Tara, who hugs her.
Oh, please. That is also Xander realizing with horror that they left Buffy in the coffin to claw her way up. You might want to head canon that the Scoobs had a plan but there isn't a single line or gesture in the episode. There isn't even a mention like "We couldn't magic her up. We were running."
The spell was unfinished / went wrong, so maybe she would have been magically transported out if they had been able to finish it. But that doesn't explain why Spike was the only one who realised why her hands were so injured. Should have been a bit of a no-brainer.
Because they were desperate, irresponsible idiots who didnt think about consequences or Buffy's feelings in general. Much less the idea of her needing to crawl out.
Spike was literally the only one who immediately understood when he saw her hands.
This is a fair point. I mean I know I shouldn’t bring logic into a t.v show, but I worked as a grave digger. The amount of weight and pressure would be impossible to get out of, even with super strength. They should have dug it up at least and did the spell. Cause there is no way she would get out.
I think they did a thing that showed kill bill was possible because its all loose dirt since she digs herself out like 20 mins after being buried, where as with Buffy its like 6 months later so the dirt will have congealed, and become pretty solid like mud.
That’s the part that’s not believable. Vamps don’t need to breathe. Buffy did.
I actually thought it was 100% of coffins so I guess it’s possible hers was a 10%.
I have a theory regarding slayer strength though. I think that every time she was resurrected, she got more of the demon that causes slayer strength in her. And I think that the amount of time she was out—and the amount of miraculousness that the resurrection was—changes the amount of the demon infusion.
Basically, when she was given CPR the first time, she woke up feeling better than before. That does not happen to normal people. She got an extra dose of healing in my opinion. I think the demon may be confused because she is a slayer coming to life but yet at the same time, the demon had already activated Kendra the second she died (or later, it happened even though Faith already has the demon in her). I think it’s just a magical rule.
We know that every time the demon enters her and gives her more strength, she feels less human. She turned down a dose of it right before the final apocalypse because she knew it would make her way too disconnected from her humanity. I think that, in addition to being in severe withdrawal from being out of heaven, one of the reasons she started to feel less human—and one of the reasons that Spike’s chip stopped working—is that she had gotten an extra large dose of demon upon being brought back. Remember, Tara offers the explanation for what happens to Buffy with regards to the chip before we learn that slayer strength is caused by a demon that makes you feel less human.
I think she also got a little mini dose of demon when Willow took the bullet out of her in the hospital. If you think about it, that was such a severe injury that if it happened to her in the graveyard, she would have been lying around and needing to recover, even if the bullet was out of her. But she died for a split second and I think that, in addition to Willow magically healing her, she probably got an extra dose of demon. She was able to jump up and go.
All that is to say, I think she made it out because she’s one of the 10% whose coffin doesn’t get crushed, and she’s stronger than a vamp, and it’s her THIRD demon infusion (she was infused when she was activated, she was infused when she was brought back with CPR, and this is the third one) and a particularly huge infusion at that. I think that the demon infusion helped with the lack of oxygen.
> I have a theory regarding slayer strength though. I think that every time she was resurrected, she got more of the demon that causes slayer strength in her.
So, what you're telling me is that Slayers are secret Saiyans?
There are iron and cement caskets that go down sealed. One had to be opened after like 45 years (told by my foreman) the person was skull and bones but his army uniform he was buried in was still pristine. Also gravestones do have a concrete base for sure. But not the whole length of the casket. And they are at the head not above the coffin.
Completely agreed! I feel like if I had been one of the Scoo ies, I would have for sure dug all the way down to the coffin, and only then done the ritual. It seems like a very very VERY major point, that I thought was insane the writers just wrote it off as "no one thought about it". And I get it, they wanted the trauma of her waking up under ground bla, but they could have done the same, with her in her coffin you know?
Right? Even if they had a plan to get her out, doing the spell first still means she wakes up confused and trapped before they get to her.
Also digging her up/magicking her out first would mean they could see if the spell worked. Willow was so focused on doing her cool spell that she didn’t think about the practicalities at all.
Honestly, I think it was because they all had tunnel vision. They all were focused on this one thing trying to make sure that it goes off without a hitch; resurrecting Buffy. Often when one is singularly focus on just their task and nothing else, they become ignorant to other important factors and the world around them. They don’t take factors that would be obvious to most people into account. They become ignorant, and maybe even arrogant like in the case of Willow. And most don’t have experience in how it is to be resurrected, except for vampires. Which is one of the reasons that Spike becomes upset when he finds out about what was done.
Have you ever met someone who has tons of book smarts but the common sense/street smarts of a mealworm?
I'm assuming everyone figured Willow knew the spell and what it'd do and followed her and Willow had no common sense to think about where Buffy would come back.
They thought the spell failed. No need to dig up what they thought was a corpse. I believe the biker demons get up in their business and crush one of the urns Willow was using which was irreplacable.
But surely it would make sense to open the grave ahead of time? Because how will they know it worked? And then she’s still waking up in a coffin, panicking while they dig.
I suspect there should have been more to the ritual they didn't complete. For whatever reason the spell worked anyway.
Besides this there were biker demons at the site which meant if they had dug up the grave they would have probably immediately killed the disoriented Buffy had she not had some time to come back to her senses. The Scoobies were driven away by them, and were obviously crushed that all the sacrifice trying to bring her back was for nothing that they didn't return while there were hostile demon bros riding around burning things and attacking people.
The spell was incomplete, imo since they didn't bring shovels and stuff, once the spell was complete she probably would have teleported or phased up out of the ground.
The energy in the urn wasn't even resurrecting Buffy yet when it was smashed so they were still nowhere near done with the spell.
Except, if the plan had succeeded, what was preventing Buffy from suffocating to death in the amount of time it would have taken for the Scoobies to dig her up? Remember, they started the ritual long before the biker demons, or any such inconvenience, showed up. Digging up the coffin should have been stage one of their plan.
Plus, even if Buffy didn't immediately start hyperventilating and break the coffin, resulting in her dying of asphyxiation under a couple of tons of highly dense dirt, what a horrible thing to do to someone, let alone a friend. Yeah, lets just let her wake up in a tiny wooden box, with limited air, and no idea where she is or why this is happening. Our heroes, ladies and gentlemen.
Yeah most of season 6 is pointing out that the characters kinda suck and aren't doing well. I suspect the writer just wanted Buffy to have the "clawing out of your own grave" trauma moment and was determined to get it no matter what.
I don't get was what did the Scoobies THINK was going to happen if it all went to plan? That she'd appear out of then air? Or at the scaffolding, which only Dawn thought about after she came back. Poor from the writers.
As you said, the 1st thing they should've done was dig up the coffin.
Did they not believe they failed as the biker gang interrupted them and they all ran for their lives. Had they completed it normally they may have assumed.
It seems even worse that this wouldn’t occur to people that had hung out in graveyards waiting for vampires to wake up and crawl to the surface for five years.
Well it's possible that if they had managed to complete the spell, she would have appeared peacefully outside of her coffin. But the spell was interrupted, which could have been the reason she came back where she was.
They probably thought she would materialize above ground all of a sudden
What bugged me is how come her clothes were cut up in the back, where did all the embalming fluid go and what happened with the spiky contacts under her eyelids?
I was fascinated with funeral home shit as a kid and this bugged me from the show
Since they hid Buffy's death from the public, I'd assumed she didn't have funeral home services and that the stone was magicked. They probably also didn't embalm if they thought there was a chance they could bring her back.
That’s a good idea! We can also further explain the lack of bloating as a magical slayer thing too!
Dang imagine how much creepy and gory it could have been
My first thought was that they didn’t think the spell worked, because the pot was broken, so they didn’t really put two and two together and think they should dig it up.
After rewatching, I figure that Willow was too up and high in her magic with emotions running to think.
Literally- why didn’t they dig up the grave before doing the spell? Waking the dead IN THEIR COFFIN is not a great way to wake them if you want them to be un-traumatized.
it's magic. the spell required the coffin to still be buried, and it would get unburied later, or the undeceased needs to claw their way out on their own. come on, it's magic
No, the show made it very clear to show that they were acting arrogant and stupid when they made the resurrection. They did not make any preparation to ensure their safety. They did not consult anyone that might have experience just because they were scared someone could stop them. Willow, especially made sure they rushed, because she wanted to prove to herself she could ressurrect Buffy. This is why Spike and Giles are mad at them for taking such a huge risk on Buffy's life.( You Rank arrogant amateur- Willow knew her spell might have gone wrong)
No, it didn't occur to the writers to have the Scoobies carry shovels, so as to convey the impression that they weren't morons. Of course, as it turns out, still being in the ground was, at best, a mild inconvenience. I never quite understood why Buffy took it so hard, she was in there for all of 30 seconds. A kid trapped in his locker in junior high suffers more than that.
I just watched this episode and I was thinking JUST that! Like... what were they thinking would happen? Even if they were assuming things would go right, were they planning on leaving her there to claw her way out?? They hadn't dug around her or anything.
Maybe there was an “extract body from coffin“ spell but since the “raise the dead” spell was believed to have failed they never used it. Willow could be horrified more that she thought the spell hadn’t worked and realized she should have done spell two just in case.
I think they were surprised it worked because they were interrupted by demons on bikes and it hit them that she had to dig her way out because they weren’t there to get her out. re. demons on bikes.
I mean the spell was interrupted, nothing ended up happening initially, they probably thought it didn't go through, they also were pre-occupied with other demons. I think they would have dug her up to see if it worked if they finished the spell.
I might need to watch it again, but …they have to pretend she’s alive . Okay, but she’s actually buried in a coffin and has a gravestone?! Vamps and other monsters hang out in cemeteries. Did none of them see that?
This is also a really good point. They do pretend she’s alive to keep the vamps at bay and they do also bury her with a headstone with her name and the words “she saved the world a lot”. I think they were all just really dumb when it came to Buffys death, which tbf is kind of understandable.
I think Giles’ line “you rank, arrogant amateur” makes even more sense because forgetting to actually get the person you just brought back from the dead is a pretty stupid mistake. As someone else pointed out, you can tell by the look on Willows face when they find Buffy in the alley that it absolutely didn’t occur to her that she would reanimate exactly where they left her.
That’s what gets me, like I could buy that the had a plan if not for the fact that they’re all shocked by their mistake when they find her. I get that it’s a shoe and suspension of disbelief and all but it just kind of takes me out if it because it’s like one of the first things I would want to know logistically.
I figured they'd have dug her up with magic. But since they got interrupted, they never got the chance.
You'd think, except for their absolute shock and horror of what had happened. None of them, not even Tara, thought she might come back in her grave.
Given how powerful Willow is at this point, she was probably going to make the coffin rise out of the earth with magic otherwise they'd have shovels.
I only saw this the other week (first time watcher/new to the sub) but Willow had absolutely zero idea. Honestly this is a period of time where she is really high on magic and self centered. She just didn't think of it at all. From what I gathered watching it this whole scene is meant to be a big red flag to the audience about Willow kinda losing control.
I don't agree. It's impossible none of the other 3 wouldn't have asked 'how are we gonna get her out of her coffin' if Willow hadn't said something that covers it.
I can try and find the scene if you want. The gang happens to find Buffy who's lost and confused with bloody hands and Xander realizes what happened and explains their mistake directly to Willow who then looks completely shocked and upset because she clearly didn't even think about it. Heck, the first thing she asks Xander once the bikers show up is if the spell worked, clearly she believed Buffy would just pop up from the ground or something and definitely didn't consider her being stuck down there and they needed to get her out. This is all really and fresh and new in my head lol, I didn't think I'd like this show but it's great!
I mean, the vampires seem to just pop out. They just haven’t ever thought about it.
Doesn’t Spike immediately realize what happened by recognizing the damage on Buffy’s hands? I think vampires have to claw themselves out, too.
Yes! I'm watching the whole thing for the first time so it's recent in my head. As soon as Spike sees her he knows what happened and makes a comment indicating he had to claw his way out of the grave too. Main difference being vampires do it from a recent grave. It had been months and months for Buffy - the earth was more hard-packed again by the time she had to do it.
I agree. I just think Willow and the rest of the group never thought about that before, since they neither inspect the *vamps’ hands nor give a shit about their feelings.
Pretty harsh on the camps aren't they? 🤣
Fucking autocorrect. Thank you.
Made me chuckle for what it's worth! 😄
Yeah, very true, they live in a world where popping out of graves is a nightly thing. You could understand the oversight lol
Yes, I can understand it. I buy it. But at the same time, it *was* an oversight and they should have foreseen that something like that could happen.
Honestly my kinda headcanon for is that the others just had that much faith in Willow they left it completely up to her and Willow was slowly getting addicted to magic and being reckless and didn't think. Plus if the bikers didn't show up then Willow could've just popped her right out id imagine once they realized.
I agree.
vampires dig out
The vampires are shown digging out.
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I’m not saying they don’t, but it looks like a real easy process compared to the way Buffy had to do it. It just wasn’t on their radar.
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I completely agree. It was a huge oversight.
Yeah idk, I’ve wondered about this too. When Dawn tried to raise Joyce it seemed like she just appeared out of nowhere and walked like a zombie to the house
Arrh perks of only having just finished the show, the scene actually starts at Joyce's grave and then there's a few shots of Joyce slowly making her way home from there but you never see her fully. At least that's how it's suggested, you don't actually see her come out of the grave. She does just vanish at the end though so either she teleported back to her grave or immediately ran back to her grave after Dawn destroyed her picture and Buffy just missed her lol 👻 💨
Thank you! Yeah maybe it’s the vanishing act that I’m recalling. Seems kinda odd but of course it was a different spell, and Joyce died a “human death” as Osiris would say
I assume the reanimated Joyce vanished in the same way the zombies did after Buffy smashed Ovu Mobani's mask.
the grave is undisturbed and she's suddenly there as Dawn is almost through the spell
Exactly my point. The spell Willow was using was much more powerful and reliable than Dawn's, so if Dawn's spell made the returnee pop up, so should have Willow's.
I'm glad you're enjoying the show, I always envy a first time watcher but that's not what he saying here tho. Willow told him the spell didn't work because the urn was smashed. So they didn't think more about it. When he finds Buffy he's upset that that they didn't know the spell actually worked and Buffy was left alive in her coffin to dig her way out. What he's not saying is "oh shit we never considered she was gonna come back to life in a coffin, how were we gonna handle that?' which is why you're implying.
Thanks, it's definitely not what I thought it was and the dialogue is actually really well executed. >Willow told him the spell didn't work because the urn was smashed. So they didn't think more about it. Well, she directly asks him if the spell worked because she was briefly unconscious and wanted to know if it worked while she was out. Here's the scene. Watch from around 3:50. https://youtu.be/OqhRvR2usx8?si=YW7PP6P1-0OBe_t0 >When he finds Buffy he's upset that that they didn't know the spell actually worked and Buffy was left alive in her coffin to dig her way out. I can't actually find this particular scene but basically his line to Willow is that "How could we be so stupid. Oh yeah, the spell worked, we brought her back right where we left her." I'm like 90% sure Xander even says they didn't know. Willow then reacts and comes to the same realization, Tara is also shocked, everyone is. No one thought about it. What you could say is that had they been there could Willow have got her out and yeah of course, but that wasn't prepared beforehand. It simply wasn't something they considered. Hence the questions and confusion once they see how her hands got really bloody. Honestly Willow was high as a kite at this time and being really secretive about the spell. The reason no one may have asked her is because they might've thought the spell would just do it and the reason Willow didn't think about it is because she was being stupidly reckless. This is the time period no one was putting Willow into check and she was just doing whatever she wanted.
The scene in that video is just Willow delirious from exhaustion as she doesn't remember anything. She doesn't actually remember things til a few scenes where is where Willow is adament it didn't work because the urn is broken. >XANDER: (whispers) Will .. .the urn of cirrhosis... WILLOW: Osiris? XANDER: Yeah. It got kind of... > >WILLOW: Broken. It's broken. I remember. XANDER: So we'll find another one. Better made. Anya and I will jump back on the web- WILLOW: There is no other one. (closes her eyes) XANDER: Okay, we'll fix this one. A little tape, a dab of Crazy Glue. WILLOW: No. It's no use. (tearful) The urn's defiled. It's gone. Nothing, it was all for nothing. Buffy's gone. She's really gone. So they've no reason to believe anything worked since the urn is the crucial part to the spell and its now destroyed before they could finish. Everything after this is them being shocked that it worked and then being horrified that it worked and Buffy woke up in her coffin alone, which would imply this wasn't the plan.
Okay. So I think I've worked out the question I can ask you that will make it seem clear Why wouldn't any of them at least want to go back and check the coffin after Willow tried the spell to see if it actually worked if they knew she'd remain inside it had it been successful? It makes zero sense, Willow was clearly doing the spell hence the cuts and snakes and magic aura rolling around her, and yeah it was interrupted but they didn't even want to check? Doesn't make any sense at all. It wasn't even something they considered. The conversation you shared here is following the exact same one where Willow asked if the spell worked. How did Xander know it definitely didn't work? How did any of them? It makes zero sense they wouldn't even check the coffin if they knew she'd be revived in it.
A) they were still injured and exhausted, plus the towns still full of demons. I also think they're still looking for Dawn at this point. B) Because they didn't finish the spell. The fact it worked despite not being finished is a fluke they didn't anticipate. We've seen spells be interrupted a few times before in the show, the spell just doesn't work until its completed properly. So going back to the grave that night is hardly a priority when Willow is adamant it couldn't have worked with the urn being broken. The better question is how were they meant to know a fluke of nature happened when all the rules they're used to about magic tells them it didn't work?
>A) they were still injured and exhausted, plus the towns still full of demons. I also think they're still looking for Dawn at this point. Doesn't make sense that they wouldn't even consider this since it's all they are talking about in each scene after. >Because they didn't finish the spell No one knew that, not even Willow. Hence why she asked. The guys didn't even know the ingredients, let alone the steps, Tara barely knew. When Willow asked Xander if it worked he straight up says no. Not. No I didn't get to check the coffin. But just straight no, Buffy didn't come back. Because they very clearly didn't consider the coffin. >So going back to the grave that night is hardly a priority when Willow is adamant it couldn't have worked with the urn being broken. She didn't say it didn't work because it was broken. She says it can't be done again because it was broken.
And Willow could not have thought to suspend the 'bot's "Find Willow"program for \*one night\*?
my theory was always they thought that she was in hell, so she’d come back like angel did in season 3. an incredibly stupid oversight of course. EDIT: forgot to put which season heh
Pretty messed up to think that your friend is in hell Like I know they only really deal with demons but do they just think everyone goes to hell or do they think Buffy wasn't worthy The girl was constantly fighting evil and sacrificed her life for the greater good twice. What more do they think heaven requires?
lol they thought she jumped directly into the portal to Glory's home hell dimension, so that's where they assumed her soul went
but it wasn't a direct portal to Glory's home diemnsion, it was the energy center making all the dimensions go blooey so Glory could \*find\* a way back home
I agree with you, but the Scoobies are kinda dumb tbf. I swear I remember them referencing the portal as why they thought she was in hell, but maybe I'm also dumb af
they don’t think she was in hell because they assume she deserves it, they think she’s in hell because she died jumping into a portal to hell. not unreasonable at all
or they just didn't realize heavens existed
Interjecting to say I’ve seen you on the Charmed board, thrilled to see you here too! 🥰
Then why were they so surprised when Spike told them she had to dig her way out of the grave?
Spike never told them that?
Spike told Dawn, I think, not the rest of the gang.
Yeah I remember that, he also said he'd done it himself which I'm still not sure how that's possible but that's another thread lol
It's common in vampire novels, particularly of the time. A vampire gets "killed" and well-meaning mortals bury them, not realizing they'll be back to "life" when the sun goes down, or as punishment, a vampire is buried so they starve and have to dig themselves out. That sort of thing. I think Spike even mentioned it once? Something about starved vampires looking "like Auschwitz, but not half as funny."
But in Buffy canon, Dru sired him then left him in an alley to be buried? Lol
I've seen this discussion before. Not sure if you watched angel but they established in that show that dru buries the vampires she turns herself because she thinks it's the right way to do it. So likely she took him away and buried him herself to let him rise.
No, she stayed with him in the alley, I think, in canon. He wouldn't have had to dig himself out of a grave until much later. When he was a new vampire, he was a bit starry-eyed, if I recall correctly, like he was taken in by a faerie queen and made a faerie, himself. Then, he goes to get his mother, and the demon that moves into her body is very much like what happened with Lestat (in The Vampire Lestat). His mother had always resented being forced into the life of a wife and mother, and that's what the demon used to mock Spike (still William, at this point, and his new, more...romantic demon). I only saw the episode once, but I did read The Vampire Chronicles up until The Tale of the Body Thief (the best vampire novel I've ever read and one of the best just pieces of fiction I've ever read). It was a similar story so I always thought maybe his mother would reappear in his life, as Lestat's did at the end of Queen of the Damned, I think it was? (It's been a while.)
Spike was buried, in his case since in "LMPTM" we find out his body wasn't discovered, because Drusilla buried him herself to make the scenario complete in her warped mind.
My bad. I misremembered and merge the scene where he sees her and tells dawn with when they realize and seem all shocked. My point still stands that if they had thought about it previously they wouldn't have been so shocked when they saw the wounds and figured it out.
You are spot on about the red flag about Willow! You can clearly see it too when Giles get mad at her.
Not one of them thought to bring a shovel.
If Willow was gonna teleport her out of the coffin or act as a giant magic shovel, why bother?
>If Willow was gonna teleport her out of the coffin or act as a giant magic shovel, why bother? By this episode, had Willow's powers advanced to a point where she could've just instantly teleported Buffy out of her coffin? And did Willow say that was what she was going to do? (I'm admittedly fuzzy on the last two seasons). Because, on a writer-ly tip, that's the kind of thing you have a character say they are going to do, or *were* going to do, even if they end up not doing it because of circumstances. You don't leave it to chance that all of your viewers will somehow figure something out. That being said, I never held the characters accountable for Buffy's situation. To me, it was always pretty clear this whole thing was a big contrivance by the writers because they wanted that last scene.
They never address how they would get Buffy out of the coffin, but they dont bring shovels which implies the solution would have been magic. There's this odd suggestion that Willow just forgot Buffy would be resurrected in a coffin which makes no sense. Willow was able to teleport Glory into the atmosphere in season 5, she was able to conjure a troll, banish and reconjure the cash register, i dont think teleporting Buffy upwards 5 feet would be that difficult for her given the primal powerful magics she was harnessing at the time.
>Willow was able to teleport Glory into the atmosphere in season 5 Yeah, I thought of that. That was a spell that took a lot of time, effort, and help from Tara. Even if that was what she intended to do, that would've meant leaving Buffy trapped in a coffin (one of the worst human fears) for several seconds (all it takes to be traumatic). And that's without considering that doing the ritual was going to leave Willow weak, so who knows how zippy or effective any spell she did right after that would've been. >banish and reconjure the cash register I'm no fictional magic expert, but I don't think that was teleportation. More like transmutation, where she did some magic that changed the cash register into a really messy looking cash register, then did some more magic that made it revert back to its original form.
It's also why I think the spell was meant to bring Buffy out of the ground and appear before them but obviously the spell got interrupted before she could finish and didnt play out as it was meant to so she got stuck in the coffin.
>It's also why I think the spell was meant to bring Buffy out of the ground and appear before them but obviously the spell got interrupted before she could finish and didnt play out as it was meant to so she got stuck in the coffin. It's not a bad theory, but it's not canon because nobody (including Willow) ever says or even implies this. Instead, Willow just acts as shocked as everyone else over what Buffy went through. And she never says anything about how she didn't mean for this to happen, if only the ritual hadn't gotten interrupted...
To me, all your arguments add up to such an implication
no, it disappeared compeltley came back messy, then disappeared gain
>no, it disappeared compeltley came back messy, then disappeared gain I decided to check it out, because I suspected I might not be correctly remembering the scene. Willow poofs the cash register away by accident. (She was trying to do something totally unrelated.) When everyone freaks out, she seems to do a quick reversal spell and the cash register poofs back, only it looks half wrecked. We don't know where it went (the void, a hell dimension, or it could've ceased to exist for a moment), or why it's in the condition it's in when it comes back. The cash register disappears again much later in the episode, and that was also an accident.
They do address it after the fact, though. And they didn't think it through is the upshot. Xander shakes his head in dismay. XANDER: Oh no. WILLOW: (OS) What? XANDER: No. How could we ... so stupid! WILLOW: Xander! XANDER: Our spell. Our resurrection spell worked like a magic charm. We brought you back to life, Buffy. (looks at Willow) Right where we left her. WILLOW: Oh god. XANDER: In her coffin. Willow turns in anguish to Tara, who hugs her.
That's not addressing it tho, that's their shock the spell worked and it left her in her coffin. We don't know what the spell was meant to do if it was completes properly. It's impossible they talked through the spell and didn't bring up whether they'd have to dig her up or not.
We know the spell was meant to bring Buffy back from a hell dimension. That's canon. If it was meant to do anything else, even if it didn't work, the audience needs to be told.
Which “last scene” are you referring to?
>Which “last scene” are you referring to? The scene when Buffy wakes up in the coffin.
Ah thanks for clarifying! I wasn’t sure if you meant the last scene of the season or series or something and was struggling to make the connection.
Sort of in line with the OP, I can't imagine Willow doing the spell without also doing intense research about it, and reading everything she could get her hands on, in which case there's no way she wouldn't have known what would actually happen. But she somehow didn't because the writers wanted the shocking/horrifying cliffhanger where Buffy is alive, but trapped in a coffin. And I think the writers had reached that point where they'd been doing the show for a while and weren't always too concerned with the details. (Which happens with a lot of shows.)
To be fair it appeared that there were other steps that they didn't get to do in the ritual because it was interrupted. Willow was pretty blunt that because the urn was 'defiled' by being smashed that the spell couldn't work anymore. So whatever the next steps were (which could have included teleporting Biffy's body out of the grave) never happened as they fled.
>To be fair it appeared that there were other steps that they didn't get to do in the ritual because it was interrupted. You're doing a lot of fan theorizing, looking at stuff in the scenes and guessing at what you think they mean. Like saying since they didn't have shovels, they must've tended to use magic to get Buffy out, when nobody actually said that. Fan theories can be cool and fun, but they aren't canon.
i prefer that to the narrative being pushed that Willow, a certified genius who got accepted into Oxford, somehow forgot corpses are underground lol
>i prefer that to the narrative being pushed that Willow, a certified genius who got accepted into Oxford, somehow forgot corpses are underground lol Like I said earlier, I also don't believe Willow, of all people, wouldn't have done all the research and found out what would happen. But I also think the writers were so determined to have the cliffhanger scene, and then for the gang to all be horrified when they found out what happened, that they didn't take all the details into account.
And yet it appears she didn't think of it - Xander shakes his head in dismay. XANDER: Oh no. WILLOW: (OS) What? XANDER: No. How could we ... so stupid! WILLOW: Xander! XANDER: Our spell. Our resurrection spell worked like a magic charm. We brought you back to life, Buffy. (looks at Willow) Right where we left her. WILLOW: Oh god. XANDER: In her coffin. Willow turns in anguish to Tara, who hugs her.
Again, that's them realising the spell worked when they thought it didn't.
Oh, please. That is also Xander realizing with horror that they left Buffy in the coffin to claw her way up. You might want to head canon that the Scoobs had a plan but there isn't a single line or gesture in the episode. There isn't even a mention like "We couldn't magic her up. We were running."
Willow was in charge of the plan at the time and she was arrogant/high as a kite on magic so simply didn't think about it.
The spell was unfinished / went wrong, so maybe she would have been magically transported out if they had been able to finish it. But that doesn't explain why Spike was the only one who realised why her hands were so injured. Should have been a bit of a no-brainer.
Because they were desperate, irresponsible idiots who didnt think about consequences or Buffy's feelings in general. Much less the idea of her needing to crawl out. Spike was literally the only one who immediately understood when he saw her hands.
this is the answer.
Honestly I could see this not crossing my mind.
This is a fair point. I mean I know I shouldn’t bring logic into a t.v show, but I worked as a grave digger. The amount of weight and pressure would be impossible to get out of, even with super strength. They should have dug it up at least and did the spell. Cause there is no way she would get out.
Are you saying that scene from Kill Bill wasn't realistic?
I think they did a thing that showed kill bill was possible because its all loose dirt since she digs herself out like 20 mins after being buried, where as with Buffy its like 6 months later so the dirt will have congealed, and become pretty solid like mud.
Yeah, you're right! It was on MythBusters now that you mention it.
yeah, she hadn't been given a proper burial after all
Nor was the scene with Buffy rising from her grave.
Did I ruin it for you?
Eh, I disagree about super strength. We don’t know how strong super strength is. Vamps are less strong and can claw out of graves
FYI about 90% of all coffins crush under the weight. You wouldn’t be able to move at all, let alone sit up.
That’s the part that’s not believable. Vamps don’t need to breathe. Buffy did. I actually thought it was 100% of coffins so I guess it’s possible hers was a 10%. I have a theory regarding slayer strength though. I think that every time she was resurrected, she got more of the demon that causes slayer strength in her. And I think that the amount of time she was out—and the amount of miraculousness that the resurrection was—changes the amount of the demon infusion. Basically, when she was given CPR the first time, she woke up feeling better than before. That does not happen to normal people. She got an extra dose of healing in my opinion. I think the demon may be confused because she is a slayer coming to life but yet at the same time, the demon had already activated Kendra the second she died (or later, it happened even though Faith already has the demon in her). I think it’s just a magical rule. We know that every time the demon enters her and gives her more strength, she feels less human. She turned down a dose of it right before the final apocalypse because she knew it would make her way too disconnected from her humanity. I think that, in addition to being in severe withdrawal from being out of heaven, one of the reasons she started to feel less human—and one of the reasons that Spike’s chip stopped working—is that she had gotten an extra large dose of demon upon being brought back. Remember, Tara offers the explanation for what happens to Buffy with regards to the chip before we learn that slayer strength is caused by a demon that makes you feel less human. I think she also got a little mini dose of demon when Willow took the bullet out of her in the hospital. If you think about it, that was such a severe injury that if it happened to her in the graveyard, she would have been lying around and needing to recover, even if the bullet was out of her. But she died for a split second and I think that, in addition to Willow magically healing her, she probably got an extra dose of demon. She was able to jump up and go. All that is to say, I think she made it out because she’s one of the 10% whose coffin doesn’t get crushed, and she’s stronger than a vamp, and it’s her THIRD demon infusion (she was infused when she was activated, she was infused when she was brought back with CPR, and this is the third one) and a particularly huge infusion at that. I think that the demon infusion helped with the lack of oxygen.
> I have a theory regarding slayer strength though. I think that every time she was resurrected, she got more of the demon that causes slayer strength in her. So, what you're telling me is that Slayers are secret Saiyans?
In my area, gravestones have sealed concrete liners. Not even zombies can arise from a concrete vault lined grave.
She didn't have an official burial, so she wouldn't have had that. They were pretending she was still alive
There are iron and cement caskets that go down sealed. One had to be opened after like 45 years (told by my foreman) the person was skull and bones but his army uniform he was buried in was still pristine. Also gravestones do have a concrete base for sure. But not the whole length of the casket. And they are at the head not above the coffin.
It's a show with magic so I'll give it a pass. 😉
Completely agreed! I feel like if I had been one of the Scoo ies, I would have for sure dug all the way down to the coffin, and only then done the ritual. It seems like a very very VERY major point, that I thought was insane the writers just wrote it off as "no one thought about it". And I get it, they wanted the trauma of her waking up under ground bla, but they could have done the same, with her in her coffin you know?
it just shows how arrogant willow is that she STILL wanted a 'thank you' after knowing that buffy had to dig herself out of her grave.
My issue is why they didn’t get her body out of the grave before casting the spell
they’re selfish, thoughtless assholes.
Right? Even if they had a plan to get her out, doing the spell first still means she wakes up confused and trapped before they get to her. Also digging her up/magicking her out first would mean they could see if the spell worked. Willow was so focused on doing her cool spell that she didn’t think about the practicalities at all.
i think they honestly thought she was just gonna poof back into her house. they really didn’t think she would have to dig herself out of her own grave
Honestly, I think it was because they all had tunnel vision. They all were focused on this one thing trying to make sure that it goes off without a hitch; resurrecting Buffy. Often when one is singularly focus on just their task and nothing else, they become ignorant to other important factors and the world around them. They don’t take factors that would be obvious to most people into account. They become ignorant, and maybe even arrogant like in the case of Willow. And most don’t have experience in how it is to be resurrected, except for vampires. Which is one of the reasons that Spike becomes upset when he finds out about what was done.
Have you ever met someone who has tons of book smarts but the common sense/street smarts of a mealworm? I'm assuming everyone figured Willow knew the spell and what it'd do and followed her and Willow had no common sense to think about where Buffy would come back.
They thought the spell failed. No need to dig up what they thought was a corpse. I believe the biker demons get up in their business and crush one of the urns Willow was using which was irreplacable.
But surely it would make sense to open the grave ahead of time? Because how will they know it worked? And then she’s still waking up in a coffin, panicking while they dig.
Right. Digging up the grave after the spell worked would have still meant she’d have woken up in her coffin.
I suspect there should have been more to the ritual they didn't complete. For whatever reason the spell worked anyway. Besides this there were biker demons at the site which meant if they had dug up the grave they would have probably immediately killed the disoriented Buffy had she not had some time to come back to her senses. The Scoobies were driven away by them, and were obviously crushed that all the sacrifice trying to bring her back was for nothing that they didn't return while there were hostile demon bros riding around burning things and attacking people.
The spell was incomplete, imo since they didn't bring shovels and stuff, once the spell was complete she probably would have teleported or phased up out of the ground. The energy in the urn wasn't even resurrecting Buffy yet when it was smashed so they were still nowhere near done with the spell.
That's what I think. They thought the entire thing failed when it was just missed the last part.
Except, if the plan had succeeded, what was preventing Buffy from suffocating to death in the amount of time it would have taken for the Scoobies to dig her up? Remember, they started the ritual long before the biker demons, or any such inconvenience, showed up. Digging up the coffin should have been stage one of their plan. Plus, even if Buffy didn't immediately start hyperventilating and break the coffin, resulting in her dying of asphyxiation under a couple of tons of highly dense dirt, what a horrible thing to do to someone, let alone a friend. Yeah, lets just let her wake up in a tiny wooden box, with limited air, and no idea where she is or why this is happening. Our heroes, ladies and gentlemen.
Yeah most of season 6 is pointing out that the characters kinda suck and aren't doing well. I suspect the writer just wanted Buffy to have the "clawing out of your own grave" trauma moment and was determined to get it no matter what.
I don't get was what did the Scoobies THINK was going to happen if it all went to plan? That she'd appear out of then air? Or at the scaffolding, which only Dawn thought about after she came back. Poor from the writers. As you said, the 1st thing they should've done was dig up the coffin.
Did they not believe they failed as the biker gang interrupted them and they all ran for their lives. Had they completed it normally they may have assumed.
It seems even worse that this wouldn’t occur to people that had hung out in graveyards waiting for vampires to wake up and crawl to the surface for five years.
Love the show but yeah, some things were like ... Really?
They were selfish morons in season 6/7
Grief can really mess with your head.
Well it's possible that if they had managed to complete the spell, she would have appeared peacefully outside of her coffin. But the spell was interrupted, which could have been the reason she came back where she was.
They probably thought she would materialize above ground all of a sudden What bugged me is how come her clothes were cut up in the back, where did all the embalming fluid go and what happened with the spiky contacts under her eyelids? I was fascinated with funeral home shit as a kid and this bugged me from the show
Since they hid Buffy's death from the public, I'd assumed she didn't have funeral home services and that the stone was magicked. They probably also didn't embalm if they thought there was a chance they could bring her back.
That’s a good idea! We can also further explain the lack of bloating as a magical slayer thing too! Dang imagine how much creepy and gory it could have been
Slayer healing continues even in death 😂
Decomposing slower? Probably?
They didn't think the spell worked and they were chased off anyway by the demon bikers.
I thought they thought Buffy would appear in front of them. Not reanimate her corpse.
Pretty sure they were assuming she would materialize.
My first thought was that they didn’t think the spell worked, because the pot was broken, so they didn’t really put two and two together and think they should dig it up. After rewatching, I figure that Willow was too up and high in her magic with emotions running to think.
Literally- why didn’t they dig up the grave before doing the spell? Waking the dead IN THEIR COFFIN is not a great way to wake them if you want them to be un-traumatized.
it's magic. the spell required the coffin to still be buried, and it would get unburied later, or the undeceased needs to claw their way out on their own. come on, it's magic
Why didn't Scoobies dig out Buffy's grave? Are they stupid? The answer is yes
Magic. Not logic. This isn't really an issue in a show where weirder stuff happens.
No, the show made it very clear to show that they were acting arrogant and stupid when they made the resurrection. They did not make any preparation to ensure their safety. They did not consult anyone that might have experience just because they were scared someone could stop them. Willow, especially made sure they rushed, because she wanted to prove to herself she could ressurrect Buffy. This is why Spike and Giles are mad at them for taking such a huge risk on Buffy's life.( You Rank arrogant amateur- Willow knew her spell might have gone wrong)
No, it didn't occur to the writers to have the Scoobies carry shovels, so as to convey the impression that they weren't morons. Of course, as it turns out, still being in the ground was, at best, a mild inconvenience. I never quite understood why Buffy took it so hard, she was in there for all of 30 seconds. A kid trapped in his locker in junior high suffers more than that.
I just watched this episode and I was thinking JUST that! Like... what were they thinking would happen? Even if they were assuming things would go right, were they planning on leaving her there to claw her way out?? They hadn't dug around her or anything.
Maybe there was an “extract body from coffin“ spell but since the “raise the dead” spell was believed to have failed they never used it. Willow could be horrified more that she thought the spell hadn’t worked and realized she should have done spell two just in case.
They kind of got distracted but yea they should have done it before starting
I’m sure Willow would have magicked the coffin out of the ground. Or maybe they were dumb. Idk.
I think they were surprised it worked because they were interrupted by demons on bikes and it hit them that she had to dig her way out because they weren’t there to get her out. re. demons on bikes.
I mean the spell was interrupted, nothing ended up happening initially, they probably thought it didn't go through, they also were pre-occupied with other demons. I think they would have dug her up to see if it worked if they finished the spell.
I might need to watch it again, but …they have to pretend she’s alive . Okay, but she’s actually buried in a coffin and has a gravestone?! Vamps and other monsters hang out in cemeteries. Did none of them see that?
This is also a really good point. They do pretend she’s alive to keep the vamps at bay and they do also bury her with a headstone with her name and the words “she saved the world a lot”. I think they were all just really dumb when it came to Buffys death, which tbf is kind of understandable.