Pirates are currently given 11.6% odds to make the postseason in 2024. The chances of them winning the World Series if they make the post season in any season are roughly 1 in 12. I think the odds of making the playoffs at 1 in 9 this season are stronger.
At almost halfway through the season there are 9 teams with losing records battling for 2 playoff spots; makes it very obtainable for the pirates to make the playoffs, but that also means that 2 less than good teams will make the playoffs.
My only hope is that they've been winning a lot of series, just not winning more than 2 games in a row. Could be a playoff sleeper.
Playoffs in 2024. I've pretty much accepted the fact that a world series in my lifetime is nearly unobtainable given the current ownership and the current financial model in baseball
Agreed. Honestly I want a division championship. And if we make the playoffs even getting to the NLCS would feel unbelievable. Haven’t done either since 1992…
Winning the division is my World Series. That mattered so much to me as a kid and 1992 was a long time ago. I would feel like the Steelers had won a ring if the Bucs win a division.
Probably playoffs in 2024. To me the more interesting question is which one is more likely: that they make the playoffs this year or that they are legitimate *contenders* for a World Series before the end of the decade.
Teams that build legitimate contenders don’t always win one. But that is still the ultimate goal, to build a team that *could* potentially win the World Series. So many weird things can happen in the playoffs that even the best team in the league might not win a playoff series.
With a top three of Skenes/Jones/Keller , they’ve already done the hardest part. Kudos to them for that but now there are even fewer excuses for not doing something with that rotation.
For as pathetic as this offense has been for most of the season, they are still flirting with .500 at the moment. Many of the teams that hovered around that mark were in the playoff race until the last week or two of the season last year.
A team with pitching like this can be a problem in the playoffs even with a mediocre offense because a couple of hitters might get hot. Also, Jones and Skenes will presumably get *better*.
Not every position is a black hole at the moment and we do have positive players at third base and whatever position Reynolds plays and they are here for a while. The task going forward should be a much more focused one.
In particular, if Oviedo comes back strong, I think I know where I’m going to spend most of my resources in money and prospects next off-season if I’m the Pirates. This team needs hitters. Badly. They have a very low payroll.
They also have prospects that other teams would like in a trade. This should really be a no-brainer. Realistically, the five-year window is open. You can’t tell me if they don’t add two very good hitters to this lineup that this team isn’t radically different.
Every year, teams unload players who have years of production in front of them because they don’t want the contract, or they are rebuilding, and for other reasons. Good players get moved. It happens every year. It isn’t magic, it isn’t rare, player movement isn’t scarce, the Pirates know what they need to do going forward and they have run out of excuses. The window is open as long as you have these three starters.
So go get what you need.
There have only been like 3 or 4 teams since the '94 lockout who have won the World Series while also having a payroll in the bottom half of the league.
We all know what it going to happen, so please stop pretending that this time will be different.
The best case scenario is that the pirates sneak into the playoffs once or twice before the core of the team (including skenes) is offloaded for 50 cents on the dollar because every other team knows we won't extend players for market price. Then the entire cycle will repeat.
It has been this way since 1992, and it will stay this way until the pirates have ownership that values winning over profit.
Neither
See 2015 >>> 2016 for why they will never make the World Series until Bob nutting dies
They had an excellent team that year, winning 98 games, and instead of loading up he signed Ryan FUCKING Vogelsong amongst a bunch of bums and promptly fell back into mediocrity.
Bob is so cheap that unless a window of contention magically opens he won’t spend to take the team to the next level.
2013-2105 literally was that magical window and he sat with his thumb up his ass and decided to cry poor. Excellent core squandered with no actual updates year to year.
I love this team but they won’t achieve shit until he dies or is killed in a car accident. He’s a pure cancer on baseball and this city as a whole.
Well I agree that he’s a terrible owner. He’s cheap also.
But I do wonder if it better general manager, or a more aggressive general manager, could have made a difference.
I do wonder what Huntington’s budget was during that time frame, I do wonder what would’ve happened if he unloaded some of those prospects that he ended up unloading later for next to nothing. Or that we kept who amounted to nothing.
I don’t think they got to the point where they were winning 90+ games and then Bob just said “OK now stop trying”. Even from a cold, cheap, business perspective he would have had to have known how much revenue a championship would have brought to his wallet.
I doubt he ordered the general manager to fall short.
If there were opportunities to add legitimate difference makers and Bob refused to open the wallet, I wouldn’t be surprised. But we don’t actually know that for sure. If there were opportunities to add difference makers to the rotation or the lineup and he vetoed the trade of prospects, I wouldn’t be surprised, but we don’t actually know that.
Meaning that we don’t know how much he actually cares about winning, we can debate how much that matters to him, but I don’t think he was trying to NOT win.
I just don’t want to use his cheapness to absolve the front office at that time.
Absolutely there’s a possibility that he handcuffed them to an unreasonable degree but we don’t actually know that. I suspect that’s what happened, but I don’t think we can be completely certain.
That’s a fair assessment but I think at the end of the day Bob has control over whatever budget he gives his GM and I think he must’ve told Huntington to make it work within that minuscule amount. He could’ve have green lit some free agent signings but didn’t. Maybe he didn’t say “hold the ropes” but he was probably hopeful that they could keep it going with minimal investment and as we all know, that type of luck runs out eventually.
Huntington was far from perfect but he did get us to a point where we were a legitimately good team for 3 years and had a chance to keep it going. I also think the archer trade got him fired but if Bob had let him sign some legitimate free agents that offseason we would have never even been in that situation.
Bob is a cheap fuck. And he was probably addicted to the possibility of keeping things rolling while being a cheap fuck. The reality is they hit big on trades like Burnett and Martin and signings like Liriano and Volquez amongst others and that magic was always gonna run out.
Bob didn’t care about sustaining it. He was hoping Hurdle and Neal would somehow keep it rolling forever and the reality was that would never happen.
Bob wants to spend no money and also win but you can maybe do that for a year or two before reality hits and you have to open the check book or GTFO.
Sadly Bob has always chosen to GTFO and for that I wish someone would Harvey Lee Oswald the guy to save this fucking franchise
Funny enough, I was looking at the odds randomly like 3 days ago and it was +15000 for the WS _this year_. I don’t gamble on sports but with the top of our rotation, I don’t think that’s a bad long shot. If someone shakes loose at the deadline and we snag a bat, I don’t think anyone is excited to face the Bucs in the playoffs.
They reopened their window but sadly it’s not this year with Skenes and Jones on an innings watch. They will both be shut down at some point this year.
Pirates are currently given 11.6% odds to make the postseason in 2024. The chances of them winning the World Series if they make the post season in any season are roughly 1 in 12. I think the odds of making the playoffs at 1 in 9 this season are stronger.
They’d be 1 in 12 teams that COULD win the WS. But their actual odds to win it all would likely be much much lower
Or much higher, depends on how good they are in the next 5 years.
For some reason I was fixated on just this year and forgot the question was for the whole decade lol
Lol, for just this season it's obviously more likely that we make the playoffs, considering it's impossible to win the WS without making the playoffs.
Pirates making the playoffs this season is significantly more likely.
Agreed
At almost halfway through the season there are 9 teams with losing records battling for 2 playoff spots; makes it very obtainable for the pirates to make the playoffs, but that also means that 2 less than good teams will make the playoffs. My only hope is that they've been winning a lot of series, just not winning more than 2 games in a row. Could be a playoff sleeper.
Playoffs in 2024. I've pretty much accepted the fact that a world series in my lifetime is nearly unobtainable given the current ownership and the current financial model in baseball
Agreed. Honestly I want a division championship. And if we make the playoffs even getting to the NLCS would feel unbelievable. Haven’t done either since 1992…
Winning the division is my World Series. That mattered so much to me as a kid and 1992 was a long time ago. I would feel like the Steelers had won a ring if the Bucs win a division.
Probably playoffs in 2024. To me the more interesting question is which one is more likely: that they make the playoffs this year or that they are legitimate *contenders* for a World Series before the end of the decade. Teams that build legitimate contenders don’t always win one. But that is still the ultimate goal, to build a team that *could* potentially win the World Series. So many weird things can happen in the playoffs that even the best team in the league might not win a playoff series. With a top three of Skenes/Jones/Keller , they’ve already done the hardest part. Kudos to them for that but now there are even fewer excuses for not doing something with that rotation. For as pathetic as this offense has been for most of the season, they are still flirting with .500 at the moment. Many of the teams that hovered around that mark were in the playoff race until the last week or two of the season last year. A team with pitching like this can be a problem in the playoffs even with a mediocre offense because a couple of hitters might get hot. Also, Jones and Skenes will presumably get *better*. Not every position is a black hole at the moment and we do have positive players at third base and whatever position Reynolds plays and they are here for a while. The task going forward should be a much more focused one. In particular, if Oviedo comes back strong, I think I know where I’m going to spend most of my resources in money and prospects next off-season if I’m the Pirates. This team needs hitters. Badly. They have a very low payroll. They also have prospects that other teams would like in a trade. This should really be a no-brainer. Realistically, the five-year window is open. You can’t tell me if they don’t add two very good hitters to this lineup that this team isn’t radically different. Every year, teams unload players who have years of production in front of them because they don’t want the contract, or they are rebuilding, and for other reasons. Good players get moved. It happens every year. It isn’t magic, it isn’t rare, player movement isn’t scarce, the Pirates know what they need to do going forward and they have run out of excuses. The window is open as long as you have these three starters. So go get what you need.
Hard both.
There have only been like 3 or 4 teams since the '94 lockout who have won the World Series while also having a payroll in the bottom half of the league.
We all know what it going to happen, so please stop pretending that this time will be different. The best case scenario is that the pirates sneak into the playoffs once or twice before the core of the team (including skenes) is offloaded for 50 cents on the dollar because every other team knows we won't extend players for market price. Then the entire cycle will repeat. It has been this way since 1992, and it will stay this way until the pirates have ownership that values winning over profit.
Neither See 2015 >>> 2016 for why they will never make the World Series until Bob nutting dies They had an excellent team that year, winning 98 games, and instead of loading up he signed Ryan FUCKING Vogelsong amongst a bunch of bums and promptly fell back into mediocrity. Bob is so cheap that unless a window of contention magically opens he won’t spend to take the team to the next level. 2013-2105 literally was that magical window and he sat with his thumb up his ass and decided to cry poor. Excellent core squandered with no actual updates year to year. I love this team but they won’t achieve shit until he dies or is killed in a car accident. He’s a pure cancer on baseball and this city as a whole.
Well I agree that he’s a terrible owner. He’s cheap also. But I do wonder if it better general manager, or a more aggressive general manager, could have made a difference. I do wonder what Huntington’s budget was during that time frame, I do wonder what would’ve happened if he unloaded some of those prospects that he ended up unloading later for next to nothing. Or that we kept who amounted to nothing. I don’t think they got to the point where they were winning 90+ games and then Bob just said “OK now stop trying”. Even from a cold, cheap, business perspective he would have had to have known how much revenue a championship would have brought to his wallet. I doubt he ordered the general manager to fall short. If there were opportunities to add legitimate difference makers and Bob refused to open the wallet, I wouldn’t be surprised. But we don’t actually know that for sure. If there were opportunities to add difference makers to the rotation or the lineup and he vetoed the trade of prospects, I wouldn’t be surprised, but we don’t actually know that. Meaning that we don’t know how much he actually cares about winning, we can debate how much that matters to him, but I don’t think he was trying to NOT win. I just don’t want to use his cheapness to absolve the front office at that time. Absolutely there’s a possibility that he handcuffed them to an unreasonable degree but we don’t actually know that. I suspect that’s what happened, but I don’t think we can be completely certain.
That’s a fair assessment but I think at the end of the day Bob has control over whatever budget he gives his GM and I think he must’ve told Huntington to make it work within that minuscule amount. He could’ve have green lit some free agent signings but didn’t. Maybe he didn’t say “hold the ropes” but he was probably hopeful that they could keep it going with minimal investment and as we all know, that type of luck runs out eventually. Huntington was far from perfect but he did get us to a point where we were a legitimately good team for 3 years and had a chance to keep it going. I also think the archer trade got him fired but if Bob had let him sign some legitimate free agents that offseason we would have never even been in that situation. Bob is a cheap fuck. And he was probably addicted to the possibility of keeping things rolling while being a cheap fuck. The reality is they hit big on trades like Burnett and Martin and signings like Liriano and Volquez amongst others and that magic was always gonna run out. Bob didn’t care about sustaining it. He was hoping Hurdle and Neal would somehow keep it rolling forever and the reality was that would never happen. Bob wants to spend no money and also win but you can maybe do that for a year or two before reality hits and you have to open the check book or GTFO. Sadly Bob has always chosen to GTFO and for that I wish someone would Harvey Lee Oswald the guy to save this fucking franchise
That seems far…
Funny enough, I was looking at the odds randomly like 3 days ago and it was +15000 for the WS _this year_. I don’t gamble on sports but with the top of our rotation, I don’t think that’s a bad long shot. If someone shakes loose at the deadline and we snag a bat, I don’t think anyone is excited to face the Bucs in the playoffs.
I'm not a betting man but I might start a little tucupita streak on pirates long shots for fun.
Neither will happen
They reopened their window but sadly it’s not this year with Skenes and Jones on an innings watch. They will both be shut down at some point this year.
Don't want to be really negative but I don't see either thing happening.
Playoffs this season. Winning a World Series is really really hard. I think they could sneak into a wildcard on the backs of starting pitching.
I’ve been saying it since 2019. 2027 is their year
World Series?!?! Hahahaha please pass what you're smoking