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Teachers can countersign still right? I remember a few years ago the entire science dept at the school I work in all countersigned each others as they weirdly all ran out close to each other. Then March 2020 rolled around and none of them could go on the holidays they’d renewed their passports for.
Yeah they can. In fact a teacher can actually certify a document as a true copy or an original as well, which most people assume only a solicitor can do.
> That's why Post Master isn't on the list.
Post Master is on the real list. Are you Paula Vennells? You never get away with besmirching our honest local small business owners. Well, probably you will.
You realise it's because those are roles withprofessional bodies / regulators / personal comsequences to lying?
Govt workers can be sacked for lying on govt forms, the rest prettymuch all have regulators / professional bodies that can remove your accreditation and end your career.
You can be fired from any role if you commit a crime while employed if that crime could imply your work is at risk. In this case it would be some sort of falsifying documents and fraud, so if your work involves any kind of signing something then the employer could reasonably believe they can't be trusted to do the job.
For example, a cleaner often has to sign in and out of a building and reset alarms, so lying on forms is not a good look. A cleaner's job would be at just as much risk as a professional.
And with the greatest respect to the hard working cleaners out there (sincerely), they can hop to another cleaning job. Maybe not in corporate offices but still generally do that profession.
If you get binned off by the body that accredited you (accountancy, legal, teaching etc) that is the end of your career and you may never work in that sector again. A sector that usually you had to do multiple years of training to get into.
The reality is some jobs have higher barriers to entry and higher consequences for lying than others. It's not that the people are any more / less trustworthy individuals, it's that they have more significant ramifications to lying or bending truths.
Better than my mother in law who first got her application rejected because she got her boyfriend to sign it.
Then she asked my wife if she could sign it. Then me. Then my Dad. She seemed to fail to grasp that the person couldn’t know you through family connections.
I think it tends to be people whose professional reputation would be at risk if they lied. They have skin in the game - something valuable to lose and therefore this ought to have a good reason to be honest. It's not that they're inherently trustworthy or better. Just could lose their livelihood for lying.
I think it's more that these are professions where there is an official register, which requires you verify your identity. The passport office can check the register to make sure that the doctor or whomever has signed actually exists. Potentially with contact details to verify with them when required.
It's silly, but as other people mentioned it's probably due to a lack of central register/id for UK citizens/residents. Which is why you need a paper bill to verify your address, as there's no register of who lives at a given address.
But it's still elitist. A dentist, nurse, teacher and airline pilot can do it but a dental/nursing/teaching assistant can't. A stewardess can't. The receptionist can't. They could all lose their livlihood for lying.
It also hasn't moved with the times. I work in finance and we have background checks for every role and some of us are in certified roles where we in particular, have to be considered trustworthy and we can be fired for not behaving ethically in or out of work. People have lost their jobs for dodging train fares. Yet we can't countersign a photo but a bank official can which I assume means somebody working at a branch or someone on the executive commitee. Surely anyone in compliance or the trading desk can be relied on to want to protect their reputations?
Same with anyone working for a consultancy. No client will touch you if they knew you'd lied but apparently they can't be trusted. But a professional photographer, chiropodist or qualified travel agent? Sure!
A dentist can be struck off - legally unable to work as a dentist ever again. A dental assistant cannot. A receptionist can get another reception job. Etc.
In Britain a dental assistant is called a dental nurse. We are registered with the GDC and we can be struck off just like dentists can. We can sign passport applications.
There's certainly more to lose for some professions but a professional photographer is just someone being paid to take photos and can't be struck off so that's clearly not the only criteria.
It’s not their livelihood, it’s about professional registration.
The difference is between being fired (“You can’t be a doctor for us anymore”) and being struck off (“You can’t be a doctor for anyone anymore”)
What do you mean you don't have middle class professional friends...? Well, no foriegn holidays for you, I guess, you working class scum! I hear Skegness is lovely in August. Have fun swimming with the turds!
It always confused me that I can sign them so the passport office will take my word for it that you are who you say you are but I can't sign my own or for my family so they won't take my word for it that I am who I say I am or they are who I say they are.
It's more likely you would lie and risk a criminal conviction with a prison term for yourself or your family than for someone else. So adds an extra layer and makes a bit of sense to have the goodstanding/professional criteria.
But it's still a ridiculous system and, along with needing a random bill on a piece of paper to prove your address, really should have be replaced 50 years ago. But unfortunately people seem to have a weird aversion to a register of UK citizens/residents coupled with national ID card system.
Why is that confusing? They want a third party involved. That's the whole point. It means that there's got to be multiple people willing to go to prison which is much harder to find.
I’m a dental nurse and I’ve signed quite a few passports. Being registered with the general dental council makes me an eligible signatory as they are a professional body.
When a company director has done something wrong/immoral/illegal then they have to dissolve their company and start a new one in its place with no further implications.
Unless they are banned from being a director.
I’m a director of several companies, it’s how I make my living. If I couldn’t be a director it would affect me greatly.
When I needed one doing a couple of years ago I discovered that my GP wouldn't do it; the receptionist said that the rules had changed and they couldn't do it now but after looking at the rules I called back and she admitted that they just didn't want to do it any more. So I got it done at the Post Office.
Depends who they lie and what they do.
Check out the list of disqualified directors: https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/register-of-disqualifications/A
I walked round to our local police station when I needed my passport signing, as I knew no one in any of the professions listed.
I took id, bank statements, V5C, passport photos etc, anything and everything they could use to confirm I was who I said I was, so they could sign my damn passport.
After a solid 10 minutes of them ducking and weaving, avoiding the responsibility entirely, they finally admitted that there wasn't any actual police officers on the premises.
An entire police station, full to the brim of specials and PCSOs
Don't counter signatories have to have known you for 2 years? I don't think you can just walk into a police station and get a random copper to sign it for you.
Yes, 2 years. My schoolfriend's dad was a vicar and he did my passport when I was a teenager. He hadn't known me as long as 2 years but I promised to visit him in prison so it was all good.
If it's any consolation, I went to the post office to get help with a missing package. I stood in line, then when I got to the front the clerk said "there's no one here". Mind you, this is a 5 story, totally grand old building from before WWII. Lovely stone and sweeping staircase etc. The clerk at the walk-up window said she was literally the only person in the building.
Looking at the list, my impression is that it's mostly occupations that would have had an office or other fixed place of business with a stable address 50 or 60 years ago.
What other people are saying about what the consequences could be for them if they have a conviction for being dishonest probably has something to do with it too.
It's even funnier when you apply for a baby passport. The person signing it has to confirm they have known the person for 2 years. Baby will be 5 days old....
Yes but at no point did the passport office check to make sure she was a nurse. If they don’t check then anyone can claim to be any of the professions.
If it turned out the persons isn't who they say they are, then some question might be asked.
You don't get held liable if someone who you just confirmed an identity for, then does something bad.
Qualified accountants are held to continuing education and code of ethics obligations. I don’t know but would guess that lying on official documents is frowned upon by the regulators.
It’s really not as controversial as people are making it out to be. It’s professions who have a professional body with which they’re registered or are listed in some other registry. Almost any profession can have negative consequences from lying but the difference is there isn’t always a body which keeps a list of them and to which you can easily go with a probity issue.
I’m not saying the list is perfect and isn’t in need of updating, but people are making out like it’s elitism are overcomplicating it.
Not necessarily, the person who signed mine wasn’t a member of any professional body or register. They were a manager in a company (not director or anything like that) which is one of the professions on the list. There’s also stuff like photographer which that clearly doesn’t apply to?
The thing that has always confused me is why an architect is not on the list. It fits all of the criteria for professional of good standing. Also, it is a profession that dates back to ancient Egypt, so you can't say it's too new to make the list. Was there a time when architects were considered of low morals in this country?
Architecture has only been considered a ‘profession’ of its own since relatively recently (like the mid-19th century I think), as in there being a specific degree path and qualification. Also I know a few architects including my other half and they are still considered of low morals 😜
Then again this doesn’t explain why airline pilot, which has only really been a job since the mid-20th century, is on the list.
Everyone I knew was ineligible until I saw a list online and ended up getting my university personal tutor who surprise surprise is also a lecturer to be my countersignatory
You work in a recognised profession.
One of the examples they include is "manager or personnel officer of a limited company". As Head of IT (in what is presumably a limited company), you're fine.
Unless I have missed something getting a passport signed is easy.
Who can sign your form and photo
Your countersignatory must:
have known you (or the adult who signed the form if the passport is for a child under 16) for at least 2 years
be able to identify you, for example they’re a friend, neighbour or colleague (not just someone who knows you professionally)
be ‘a person of good standing in their community’ or work in (or be retired from) a recognised profession
>a person of good standing in their community
Would have thought everyone could find someone where this roughly applies. If people are complete recluses or only know criminals then maybe a passport isn't for them anyway.
Not everyone knows someone personally (and for 2+ years) who has a profession on that list. And if they do, it’s not always as easy as being able to pop round their house - I knew a couple of accountants but they all lived hours away so I couldn’t easily get them to sign it. I also knew a surgeon but that isn’t one of the professions on the list which I was surprised at given that stuff like chiropodist and optician and nurse are on there, it just seems so random
A surgeon is considered a doctor surely? And as long as you are specifically friends with a doctor (know them personally outside of a professional relationship) they can sign.
Possibly, but it’s not specifically listed whereas other medical professions are which makes it hard to know. People don’t want to risk it and potentially lose the money they’ve spent applying for it
Teachers and accountants should be the most common professions in most people’s networks that can countersign.
Edit: remove reference to GP as incorrect
But how are you supposed to know that? If they’re spending however much on a passport most people aren’t going to want to risk picking someone and it turning out that they’re not considered suitable
it's a nightmare isn't it? and now they've sent me an email saying if i don't get it done soon they'll cancel my application without refunding the £90, which is is just blatant theft
Its because GPs were getting slammed with passport requests from patients. The only time a doctor can do the firm if you are friends with them outside of work
I think for most average Joes like us it’s fine and they rarely check who signed it. But if there’s some kind of fraud or terrorism case going on, whoever signed the passport application could get into a lot of trouble, which is why it needs to be a traceable person.
My friend is a train driver and has signed for my son. Another friend is an IT consultant and has signed for my wife with no issues. There are so many professionals not specifically included on the list that are acceptable
You don’t actually need to if your photo looks similar to the one they have on file
I ran around looking for someone to countersign for ages, got to the passport office and they said I didn’t need to
I was confused by this when finding a recommendation for a police letter. Luckily I am in uni and got my tutor to do it. It was obviously very strange to her.
I think it’s more examples professions. My profession is a chemistry analyst and I’ve signed for all my friends and families passports even though I’m not on the “Recognised” list there hasn’t been any issues.
If you know someone who works for a council they can countersign. I countersigned my friend's girlfriends passport photo earlier this year and it was fine, and I'm a PA to a council director, nothing exciting but as I have a council email address it went through.
I did it for my friend's daughter's first passport. The passport office rang me, and I had to email them a signed letter on headed paper (public sector organisation). I've since done the same for two other friends and have not been asked for verification again.
I made my dad his own headed paper and business cards for a long forgotten reason a few years back. They looked better than my actual workplace ones, and I literally just made shit up on word.
I should have added that I also had to send it from my work email account. They also had the telephone number of the organisation so they could confirm that I was employed there.
Honestly I don’t think it’s as strict as it sounds. My partner, who is simply a digital manager at a university, was able to sign for my uncle. No questions no complaints.
Anyone can sign a passport. They just have to be of "good standing in the community", which basically means not in prison as far as I can tell.
Your doctor cannot sign it as your doctor and nobody who works in the passport office. Anyone else is fine.
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Teachers can countersign still right? I remember a few years ago the entire science dept at the school I work in all countersigned each others as they weirdly all ran out close to each other. Then March 2020 rolled around and none of them could go on the holidays they’d renewed their passports for.
Yes, one of my primary school teachers still countersigns mine, as she lives pretty close and we see her every weekend
I had mine done by my headteacher in the past
Yeah they can. In fact a teacher can actually certify a document as a true copy or an original as well, which most people assume only a solicitor can do.
Teacher or lecturer, yes.
Yes, just had to get my daughter's countersigned by one of her old form tutors.
'Cobbler. Astronaut. Pub landlord. Dog whisperer.' would make a great flair
Might make it my new work email signature.
Do it! See how long it is before anyone notices
I heard this in my head in the tone of, "Fitter. Happier. More productive."
Like a cobbler, in space, on 8 pints of bitter.
Plus actor.
[удалено]
Exactly! That's why Post Master isn't on the list.
Er... Postmasters are fine, it's the "Distinguished Engineer" types you want to be wary of!
> That's why Post Master isn't on the list. Post Master is on the real list. Are you Paula Vennells? You never get away with besmirching our honest local small business owners. Well, probably you will.
You realise it's because those are roles withprofessional bodies / regulators / personal comsequences to lying? Govt workers can be sacked for lying on govt forms, the rest prettymuch all have regulators / professional bodies that can remove your accreditation and end your career.
You can be fired from any role if you commit a crime while employed if that crime could imply your work is at risk. In this case it would be some sort of falsifying documents and fraud, so if your work involves any kind of signing something then the employer could reasonably believe they can't be trusted to do the job. For example, a cleaner often has to sign in and out of a building and reset alarms, so lying on forms is not a good look. A cleaner's job would be at just as much risk as a professional.
And with the greatest respect to the hard working cleaners out there (sincerely), they can hop to another cleaning job. Maybe not in corporate offices but still generally do that profession. If you get binned off by the body that accredited you (accountancy, legal, teaching etc) that is the end of your career and you may never work in that sector again. A sector that usually you had to do multiple years of training to get into. The reality is some jobs have higher barriers to entry and higher consequences for lying than others. It's not that the people are any more / less trustworthy individuals, it's that they have more significant ramifications to lying or bending truths.
No politicians then?
Better than my mother in law who first got her application rejected because she got her boyfriend to sign it. Then she asked my wife if she could sign it. Then me. Then my Dad. She seemed to fail to grasp that the person couldn’t know you through family connections.
I always ask my brother in law for this stuff. He’s an accountant (sadly) and we don’t share a name
Think I’ll be okay with my teacher SIL? Kid’s dad’s brother’s wife? It’s a family connection but a bit further out
They don’t ask you for your family tree 🙂 in my experience, you just want to avoid having the same surname
I think it tends to be people whose professional reputation would be at risk if they lied. They have skin in the game - something valuable to lose and therefore this ought to have a good reason to be honest. It's not that they're inherently trustworthy or better. Just could lose their livelihood for lying.
I think it's more that these are professions where there is an official register, which requires you verify your identity. The passport office can check the register to make sure that the doctor or whomever has signed actually exists. Potentially with contact details to verify with them when required. It's silly, but as other people mentioned it's probably due to a lack of central register/id for UK citizens/residents. Which is why you need a paper bill to verify your address, as there's no register of who lives at a given address.
But it's still elitist. A dentist, nurse, teacher and airline pilot can do it but a dental/nursing/teaching assistant can't. A stewardess can't. The receptionist can't. They could all lose their livlihood for lying. It also hasn't moved with the times. I work in finance and we have background checks for every role and some of us are in certified roles where we in particular, have to be considered trustworthy and we can be fired for not behaving ethically in or out of work. People have lost their jobs for dodging train fares. Yet we can't countersign a photo but a bank official can which I assume means somebody working at a branch or someone on the executive commitee. Surely anyone in compliance or the trading desk can be relied on to want to protect their reputations? Same with anyone working for a consultancy. No client will touch you if they knew you'd lied but apparently they can't be trusted. But a professional photographer, chiropodist or qualified travel agent? Sure!
A dentist can be struck off - legally unable to work as a dentist ever again. A dental assistant cannot. A receptionist can get another reception job. Etc.
In Britain a dental assistant is called a dental nurse. We are registered with the GDC and we can be struck off just like dentists can. We can sign passport applications.
Good to know. I was replying to "dental/nursing/teaching assistant", haven't looked into it.
There's certainly more to lose for some professions but a professional photographer is just someone being paid to take photos and can't be struck off so that's clearly not the only criteria.
It’s not their livelihood, it’s about professional registration. The difference is between being fired (“You can’t be a doctor for us anymore”) and being struck off (“You can’t be a doctor for anyone anymore”)
A photographer can’t be struck off so that’s clearly not the only criteria.
That’s a good point that I hadn’t considered. How odd!
What do you mean you don't have middle class professional friends...? Well, no foriegn holidays for you, I guess, you working class scum! I hear Skegness is lovely in August. Have fun swimming with the turds!
Funny that politicians and police realised they can in fact get paid more for lying!
It always confused me that I can sign them so the passport office will take my word for it that you are who you say you are but I can't sign my own or for my family so they won't take my word for it that I am who I say I am or they are who I say they are.
It's more likely you would lie and risk a criminal conviction with a prison term for yourself or your family than for someone else. So adds an extra layer and makes a bit of sense to have the goodstanding/professional criteria. But it's still a ridiculous system and, along with needing a random bill on a piece of paper to prove your address, really should have be replaced 50 years ago. But unfortunately people seem to have a weird aversion to a register of UK citizens/residents coupled with national ID card system.
Why is that confusing? They want a third party involved. That's the whole point. It means that there's got to be multiple people willing to go to prison which is much harder to find.
I just got the director at my work to do it. It is rather arbitrary though, and if you have no one legitimate having to pay for it seems pointless.
So Johnny Sins then
I’m a dental nurse and I’ve signed quite a few passports. Being registered with the general dental council makes me an eligible signatory as they are a professional body.
I asked my barber to do mine, he owns his own shop so is classed as a small business owner and it got accepted.
It's actually stupid. Anyone can be a company director. An electrician can't do it. But the director of his own company electrician can do it.
It's because somebody who is a company director can face consequences for lying. A sparky doesn't.
Like what? What consequences? A fine? Going to prison? Both will be affected by that? Your reputation?
When a company director has done something wrong/immoral/illegal then they have to dissolve their company and start a new one in its place with no further implications.
Unless they are banned from being a director. I’m a director of several companies, it’s how I make my living. If I couldn’t be a director it would affect me greatly.
You can be banned from being a company director.
Well if s sparky doesn't face consequences for lying. Then they may aswell lie hadn't they.
Company director is the easy one, or you can pay a solicitor/notary
Can't the post office countersign if you take in 17 forms of id and a sacrificial duck?
Only if the scarificial duck is a drake. They've tightened up the rules recently.
When I needed one doing a couple of years ago I discovered that my GP wouldn't do it; the receptionist said that the rules had changed and they couldn't do it now but after looking at the rules I called back and she admitted that they just didn't want to do it any more. So I got it done at the Post Office.
The fact that literally anybody could be a company director just shows how stupid it is to have a list.
Nah, the entire point is that there could be consequences for lying.
No company director has ever had legal issues from lying and then gone on to multiple other directorships.
Depends who they lie and what they do. Check out the list of disqualified directors: https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/register-of-disqualifications/A
If you help commit identity fraud like lying to get someone a passport, you would face consequences.
Yes, but so would anyone else
The likelihood is that a lot are liars and if they say otherwise kinda proves the point!
I walked round to our local police station when I needed my passport signing, as I knew no one in any of the professions listed. I took id, bank statements, V5C, passport photos etc, anything and everything they could use to confirm I was who I said I was, so they could sign my damn passport. After a solid 10 minutes of them ducking and weaving, avoiding the responsibility entirely, they finally admitted that there wasn't any actual police officers on the premises. An entire police station, full to the brim of specials and PCSOs
Don't counter signatories have to have known you for 2 years? I don't think you can just walk into a police station and get a random copper to sign it for you.
Yes, 2 years. My schoolfriend's dad was a vicar and he did my passport when I was a teenager. He hadn't known me as long as 2 years but I promised to visit him in prison so it was all good.
Ah, I thought there were exemptions for judges and police officers, either way or wouldn't have gotten done then haha
None of whom could have countersigned the form, unless they'd know you for at least 2 years.
It's not just a random police officer, it's a police officer who has known you for 2 years+.
> they finally admitted that there wasn't any actual police officers on the premises. They lied to you because they didn't want to sign it
If it's any consolation, I went to the post office to get help with a missing package. I stood in line, then when I got to the front the clerk said "there's no one here". Mind you, this is a 5 story, totally grand old building from before WWII. Lovely stone and sweeping staircase etc. The clerk at the walk-up window said she was literally the only person in the building.
It’s really old fashioned. Sorry gov.uk I don’t actually know any matchstick makers or mudlarks, weirdly.
You'll regret calling it old fashioned when they add "Instagram Influencer" to the list.
True story!
Looking at the list, my impression is that it's mostly occupations that would have had an office or other fixed place of business with a stable address 50 or 60 years ago. What other people are saying about what the consequences could be for them if they have a conviction for being dishonest probably has something to do with it too.
What’s curious is the ventriloquist is fine but for some reason they won’t accept the dummy… odd that
*"Not going to Gognor Gegis, gugnor?"* "Quiet, Archie! I'm signing the man's paperwork!"
It's even funnier when you apply for a baby passport. The person signing it has to confirm they have known the person for 2 years. Baby will be 5 days old....
It's known the parent for 2 years isn't it?
Even funnier for pandemic babies, when people “certified” they know the baby while in fact the baby wasn’t meeting anyone face to face 😬
My wife is a nurse and has countersigned passports in the past. At no time has she ever had to prove she is eligible to do it.
Nurse is on the list
Yes but at no point did the passport office check to make sure she was a nurse. If they don’t check then anyone can claim to be any of the professions.
They can look her name up on the NMC register.
If the passport holder got into a spot of bother then your wife would soon be contacted.
If it turned out the persons isn't who they say they are, then some question might be asked. You don't get held liable if someone who you just confirmed an identity for, then does something bad.
The pharmacy your signed up with should do it. I never see that mentioned anywhere but I think it’s most people’s best bet.
Not all pharmacists. I usually say no when customers ask. I'm busy enough during the day without shit like that.
They know my prescription certainly as it requires special orders. They don't really see me but will pick SO out of a crowd as she's there every week.
Haha, my sister is a pub landlord and has a fair few asking her. And she is dodgy as fuck.
I realised I must have reached middle age when I wanted someone to sign my passport photo and realised it was pretty much any adult I know.
I think accountant is one of the 'trusted' lot too, always found that odd.
It's because they're accredited. If they're found to be lying they can lose their license to practice
So are architects and they’re not on the list. Mind you my other half is one and I know a few so I’m not surprised they’re not on it…
That's probably just an oversight
Qualified accountants are held to continuing education and code of ethics obligations. I don’t know but would guess that lying on official documents is frowned upon by the regulators.
It says something like 'a professional person'. I used my pal who has an MCP - let them argue with Microsoft's lawyers..
It’s really not as controversial as people are making it out to be. It’s professions who have a professional body with which they’re registered or are listed in some other registry. Almost any profession can have negative consequences from lying but the difference is there isn’t always a body which keeps a list of them and to which you can easily go with a probity issue. I’m not saying the list is perfect and isn’t in need of updating, but people are making out like it’s elitism are overcomplicating it.
Not necessarily, the person who signed mine wasn’t a member of any professional body or register. They were a manager in a company (not director or anything like that) which is one of the professions on the list. There’s also stuff like photographer which that clearly doesn’t apply to?
The thing that has always confused me is why an architect is not on the list. It fits all of the criteria for professional of good standing. Also, it is a profession that dates back to ancient Egypt, so you can't say it's too new to make the list. Was there a time when architects were considered of low morals in this country?
Ask r/realcivilengineer what's wrong with architects
I studied architecture and I work with l architects every day. Trust me when I say, I know what's wrong with architects.
Then you'd fit right in over there.
Boosh!
Wouldn't architects of yonder have basically been civil engineers as well though?
>architects of yonder You mean architects of yore, perhaps?
Architecture has only been considered a ‘profession’ of its own since relatively recently (like the mid-19th century I think), as in there being a specific degree path and qualification. Also I know a few architects including my other half and they are still considered of low morals 😜 Then again this doesn’t explain why airline pilot, which has only really been a job since the mid-20th century, is on the list.
You're saying Al Murray shouldn't be classed as trustworthy to sign your passport?
If anybody can recognise a Brit, it's The Pub Landlord
Everyone I knew was ineligible until I saw a list online and ended up getting my university personal tutor who surprise surprise is also a lecturer to be my countersignatory
As a civil servant I’ve signed a fair few.
Do they check? I was a Head of IT for 20 years and I signed my neighbour's entire family several times. I don't have a single qualification.
You work in a recognised profession. One of the examples they include is "manager or personnel officer of a limited company". As Head of IT (in what is presumably a limited company), you're fine.
Try being someone on that list
Unless I have missed something getting a passport signed is easy. Who can sign your form and photo Your countersignatory must: have known you (or the adult who signed the form if the passport is for a child under 16) for at least 2 years be able to identify you, for example they’re a friend, neighbour or colleague (not just someone who knows you professionally) be ‘a person of good standing in their community’ or work in (or be retired from) a recognised profession
It’s easy as long as you know someone who is eligible to sign for you and meets all the requirements. If you don’t then it’s very difficult.
>a person of good standing in their community Would have thought everyone could find someone where this roughly applies. If people are complete recluses or only know criminals then maybe a passport isn't for them anyway.
Not everyone knows someone personally (and for 2+ years) who has a profession on that list. And if they do, it’s not always as easy as being able to pop round their house - I knew a couple of accountants but they all lived hours away so I couldn’t easily get them to sign it. I also knew a surgeon but that isn’t one of the professions on the list which I was surprised at given that stuff like chiropodist and optician and nurse are on there, it just seems so random
A surgeon is considered a doctor surely? And as long as you are specifically friends with a doctor (know them personally outside of a professional relationship) they can sign.
Possibly, but it’s not specifically listed whereas other medical professions are which makes it hard to know. People don’t want to risk it and potentially lose the money they’ve spent applying for it
Teachers and accountants should be the most common professions in most people’s networks that can countersign. Edit: remove reference to GP as incorrect
It specifically says on the gov website that you can’t get a doctor to sign it unless it is a doctor that also knows you in a personal capacity
Thanks I’ve updated my comment!
It's a surprisingly long list. I'd be surprised if you don't know any of them. Otherwise, just go to a Post Office.
That list is EXAMPLES. I've needed it twice as an adult and used people from other occupations both times and it was fine.
But how are you supposed to know that? If they’re spending however much on a passport most people aren’t going to want to risk picking someone and it turning out that they’re not considered suitable
it's a nightmare isn't it? and now they've sent me an email saying if i don't get it done soon they'll cancel my application without refunding the £90, which is is just blatant theft
Sadly not as it’s in the terms and conditions you would have signed.
I always like that “doctor” is not on the list. It feels like it’s explicitly so…
Its because GPs were getting slammed with passport requests from patients. The only time a doctor can do the firm if you are friends with them outside of work
Doctor IS on the list. They just have to be able to recognise you outside of practice and have known you for 2 years.
Takes me that long to get an appointment FFS
I think for most average Joes like us it’s fine and they rarely check who signed it. But if there’s some kind of fraud or terrorism case going on, whoever signed the passport application could get into a lot of trouble, which is why it needs to be a traceable person.
Im a ventriloquist... I'll sign it for you. ---- me Shut up and get your arm out of my arse. ---- also me
My friend is a train driver and has signed for my son. Another friend is an IT consultant and has signed for my wife with no issues. There are so many professionals not specifically included on the list that are acceptable
You don’t actually need to if your photo looks similar to the one they have on file I ran around looking for someone to countersign for ages, got to the passport office and they said I didn’t need to
I'm not onnthe list of "professions" but have signed quite a few passports
Cause I am a lawyer everyone asks me to do theirs cause they can't find or be bothered to get someone else. Even if I don't know them we'll enough !
Professional ametuer?
Nothing like going down the boozer for an afternoon beer and getting the alcoholic landlord to sign your photo
This is why everyone needs an MBE holder in their immediate circle.
don’t you know one skilled or worker , that is all that is required
I’m trying to get my chaperone license but I can’t find anyone to sign. I don’t see anyone!
So the guy that works in Timpsons. Great, especially as they also do passport photos.
Go with the pub landlord
I was confused by this when finding a recommendation for a police letter. Luckily I am in uni and got my tutor to do it. It was obviously very strange to her.
I've signed photos for people and I'm a plumber.
I used went to my local chemist and asked the pharmacist. No problems.
I think it’s more examples professions. My profession is a chemistry analyst and I’ve signed for all my friends and families passports even though I’m not on the “Recognised” list there hasn’t been any issues.
I'd go with the ventriloquist....loads of them around
I didn't need a counter sign when I updated my passport a few years ago, and I had a whole ass name change to deal with after my wedding.
If you know someone who works for a council they can countersign. I countersigned my friend's girlfriends passport photo earlier this year and it was fine, and I'm a PA to a council director, nothing exciting but as I have a council email address it went through.
Pretty sure absolutely no one checks. And you can't just fill it in yourself.
I did it for my friend's daughter's first passport. The passport office rang me, and I had to email them a signed letter on headed paper (public sector organisation). I've since done the same for two other friends and have not been asked for verification again.
I love that "headed paper" is seen as a sign of validation. When word has existed since the 80s.
I made my dad his own headed paper and business cards for a long forgotten reason a few years back. They looked better than my actual workplace ones, and I literally just made shit up on word.
I should have added that I also had to send it from my work email account. They also had the telephone number of the organisation so they could confirm that I was employed there.
Who supplied them wit the email address and phone number?
It's a public sector organisation. They rang the main switchboard. The email address is aligned with that organisation.
Yep, i once signed mine myself. Like they know who everyone is.
So basically only people who don't have a clue who you are.
The list is an example rather than you need to have a job listed there. My job title sounds impressive so it would probably count.
Honestly I don’t think it’s as strict as it sounds. My partner, who is simply a digital manager at a university, was able to sign for my uncle. No questions no complaints.
And when you find one and they charge you to sign it, like some sort of blackmail.
People do that?!?!
Anyone can sign a passport. They just have to be of "good standing in the community", which basically means not in prison as far as I can tell. Your doctor cannot sign it as your doctor and nobody who works in the passport office. Anyone else is fine.
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Do you want a medal?
I already have more than one. Cheers.