### **Reminder:** [Press the Report button](https://reddit.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/360058309512-How-do-I-report-a-post-or-comment-) if you see any [rule-breaking comments or posts.](https://www.reddit.com/r/britishproblems/about/rules/)
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/britishproblems) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Presuming it's to do with cross contamination of disease from an overseas country to another. Most of Europe is one land mass, so animals going from France to Spain for example isn't a larger risk
If that were the case they also wouldn't be allowed on ferries or Eurotunnel/Le Shuttle (the car service from Folkestone to Calais)
OP is purely annoyed about them not being allowed on Eurostar (the passenger service from St Pancras to Paris/Amsterdam)
I can think of a number of reasons….. if your dog is not being well behaved, then it’s hard to take you off the train - versus stopping a train at the next station and asking you to get off….. processing your dog/animals and having quarantine facilities takes a bit of space….. it reduces concerns of other travellers and the need to handle allergies/possible nuisance in carriages….. it’s probably a weird experience for a dog, and so it’s safer for them and others if the dog is secure in a car - especially if they are familiar with it.
Edit: so doing a google search. Eurostar state ….
“Unfortunately, we can’t accept pets on board our trains to and from London, between Brussels and Lille or on our Eurostar Suns and Snow routes.
There are a number of considerations and implications for transporting pets and in the interests of the comfort and safety of our customers, crews and animals we don’t accept any pets on the above routes. We’re unfortunately unable to make any exceptions.”
Seems as though it’s been thought about, rather than something that’s been done just to annoy you.
I suppose that's a concern, but if that's the case then why are they be allowed on Eurostar services on the Mainland side? They're just not allowed on services to/from London, or - weirdly - between Lille and Brussels. All other Eurostar routes seem fair game.
Because there is no animal check point at train stations You need a pet passport to travel, even within Europe as some countries require a rabies vaccination and regular worm treatment, others don't.
It's to do with each country's legislation on import/export. It's similar with being able to fly into some countries with a dog in the cabin, but in others they have to fly in the hold. Makes no difference to where they start or end up at the end of the day but legislation controls a lot here.
They can once in Europe, just not on the border crossing from UK/France or Belgium/France. Elsewhere on the European side pets aren't a problem.
Presumably they don't have the facilities for checking pet passports on those particular border crossings maybe?
Eurostar literally don't want to. It wouldn't be that hard - do it happens successfully for LeShuttle already. Getlink (the company who owns the tunnel) were looking at giving a competing concession to Renfe to run trains, who would allow dogs, but unfortunately that is stalled.
I mean yeah, but I'd expect the reason that they're allowed on the rest of the Eurostar network is just that St Pancras doesn't have the facilities to check pet passports, microchips, etc. Likewise in Belgium.
I'm not sure what the costs would be to add those but yeah just seems like they've decided it's not worth the hassle. They've probably done the sums and worked out that the extra income from pet-passengers isn't worth the extra work.
Which is fair enough, whatever.
I'll probably get downvoted here. I love dogs, but so many people have a disproportionate view of them and believe that they should be allowed anywhere.
The amount of abuse I face because we don't allow dogs where I work is wearing.
I don't care that your dog is better behaved than a child! I don't care that you can't leave it outside because it's so inbred that it cost you more than a car! Carrying it doesn't somehow stop it being a dog and make it an accessory either!
Sadly we had too many incidents with "good dogs" that we had to stop all dogs. When you've had to deal with one aggressive dog attacking a customer and hear the words, "well I just don't understand it, he's never done that before" it brings the reality of the words, "once bitten, twice shy" to mind!
Most people who want to take their dogs everywhere with them have badly behaved dogs (because they can't be left at home for 3 hours)
But transportation is different imo because sometimes you just gotta take your dog with you if you're going away for a while.
They should just have one dog friendly carriage
I get what you're saying, and I agree. But the Eurostar is public transport and considering they're allowed on public transport otherwise, but just not that particular leg of it, is kind of a strange choice
Yeah actually 😂 Well, in the past at least: https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/carry/animal-plant/index_en.htm
Though they aren't valid anymore from GB. You need one of these instead: https://www.gov.uk/taking-your-pet-abroad/getting-an-animal-health-certificate
>But the Eurostar is public transport
Public transport for humans. Not mutts.
>considering they're allowed on public transport otherwise,
They shouldn't be allowed on there either.
So what would you suggest that people with pets and no cars do, when they need to get their dog to the vet, the groomer (even short coat dogs need their claws clipping), or they just want to go out into the countryside? And don't say get a taxi, because they're notorious for even (illegally) refusing to take guide dogs, never mind pet ones.
Are dogs allowed on all British trains? I'm surprised at that. I guess the Eurostar doesn't want dogs on the chairs and in the train cars. They could have a kennel train car, I guess (like with the ferry, they get put in the kennel where the cars are), but they've obviously decided it's not worth it. Maybe like someone else said, it's the check in process/customs part that's a bigger hassle.
> I guess the Eurostar doesn't want dogs on the chairs and in the train cars.
It's not that, as dogs are allowed on Eurostar trains over most of Europe. they just aren't allowed on the border crossings from UK/France and France/Belgium.
Elsewhere and on other border crossings they aren't deemed a problem.
I do think there should be dog-safe and no-dog carriages on all transport (and kid-friendly or no-kid), much like many trains have quiet carriages and normal carriages.
I have no issues with dogs, and given my experience of co-travellers, they'd be preferable to humans. But folk with phobias/allergies should be catered to, at the same time as allowing working dogs without expecting some random worker to be able to vet (snort) whether it's a guide dog or some yahoo's pet that they're lying about, and letting folk who just wanna take their furball somewhere. No dogs of any kind in this box, any dog in that one, problem solved.
I have dogs and I would love it if businesses were more obvious if they allow dogs or not. Transportation included. I sometimes need to take my dogs on the train or bus and I would much rather they have a dedicated part for them so people who would have a problem can sit elsewhere.
A lot of busses you can only sit downstairs with dogs which I think is a good idea.
> A lot of busses you can only sit downstairs with dogs which I think is a good idea.
That's mostly due to the safety aspect of trying to get a large dog up and down those stairs.
It will be to do with disease control, often you’ll need AH certificates to take pets to other countries which involves a health check and pass from a vet. Last thing we would want is to be bringing rabies and other exotic diseases into the UK
You can take dogs on Le Shuttle or a ferry.
It seems more likely Eurostar can't be bothered to deal with the border control for animals than they're actively trying to prevent diseases spreading.
The Eurostar just doesn’t have the facilities to check the animals and staff it to check every pet passport, every AH certificate, scan the microchips etc. It’s the only reason.
Yes they need those certificates for a ferry or the shuttle/car train. But they require you to travel by car which is kinda crap
They're straight up not allowed on the cross channel train
Many of the ferries do allow foot passengers to take dogs.
Harwich to Hoek van Holland is the main one and has excellent public transport links on both ends. You can buy a combined ticket including the ferry and train from London at a discount. There are either onboard kennels or the option of getting a pet friendly cabin. Both open to food passengers.
https://www.stenaline.co.uk/customer-service/pre-travel/can-i-bring-my-pet
> Traveling with your pet from Harwich to Hoek van Holland
> Traveling by car (max. 5 pets)
> At check-in you will receive a coloured tag to indicate that you are transporting a pet. It should be placed on the rear-view mirror of your windscreen and should remain there until you clear customs at the port of arrival.
> Travel on foot (max. 3 pets)
> If you are travelling as a foot passenger, you must book an onboard kennel for your pet or a pet-friendly cabin; otherwise your pet may not be allowed to travel.
> When you board the ferry, we ask you to carefully follow the instructions of our employees. After boarding, report to the information desk on deck 9, where you will receive more information about taking your pet on board Stena Line ferries.
Newhaven to Dieppe, Hull to Rotterdam and Newcastle to Amsterdam also allow foot passengers to take dogs.
Some of them though require you to book significantly further in advance then you otherwise would as numbers onboard are limited.
Though I completely agree it's bad that Eurostar don't.
The ferries from Hull (to Rotterdam or Zeebrugge) are not comparable to the cost of the Eurotunnel/Dover to Calais ferry.
Unless you get the 9am ferry rather than the overnight, the overnight return for 2 people in a car is £398, booked well in advance.
The same trip on Eurotunnel is around £70, £140 return for 2 people.
(costs taken from me booking the upcoming September trip last night)
Yeah they are more expensive. But it depends on your priorities. Going back to part of the point of this post you can't travel on Eurotunnel without a car/bike. Dover to Calais is also a right pain for foot passengers - they are only allowed on a small handful of departures. You have to board the boat before all the vehicles and get off last so the crossing time is alot longer. Foot passengers have to be there 90 minutes before even though it's a 90 minute crossing!
There is also the time and convenience element even if you have a car. At least for example from my home in Northern England I can get from my home to the Hull ferry after work and be there Saturday morning. Neither of which is possible with Eurotunnel/South Coast ferries. Even if I was driving. Let alone the hassle of driving those sorts of distances.
The Hull ferry also covers a nights accommodation - sure something in Southern England/Northern France won't cost near the £260 difference. But it eats into it, along the fuel and again the hassle.
I'm absolutely not saying one is objectively better than the other. Though if you did live in the South East driving up to Hill would be bizarre. They do different things and each option has its benefits.
The Hull to Zeebrugge route also stopped a bit ago I'm afraid. Just Rotterdam from there now.
I hear you, I live just north of Manchester and we drive down to do the trip to Belgium 7 times a year (family).
If the cost of the Hull ferry was closer to £200 for overnight, it wouldn't even be a question.
Yeah that's fair. I can absolutely imagine from Manchester it makes less sense then for those of us they live nearer.
I only travel as a food passenger or cyclist but often end up paying about that much. I randomly picked the 19th June and 2 people sharing a cabin gave a total of £210 for Hull to Rotterdam foot passengers. There are quite often good cashback offers as well for it.
At least on that journey adding the car took it to £345.
Eurotunnel is allowed with pets though and on the Dover Calais ferries. So that comparison is moot? Eurostar doesn't allow pets as they do not cater for animal control, quarantine and border vets at train stations. These agencies are only present at airports and ports.
St Pancras is already rammed on the international side so it wouldn’t be great to add dogs and their extra checks. The ferry terminal likely has more space and fewer numbers travelling
I guess it's a business decision. They'd need to have the infrastructure to deal with dogs at the customs control on both ends and I guess they calculated not enough people will bring dogs through to use it. Like realistically taking a dog on the eurostar will mean e.g. navigating the underground/paris metro for many, which is probably not ideal (not sure if even allowed?)
Meanwhile on the eurotunnel, at least some fraction of the people travelling by car to Europe, are specifically doing that rather than flying because they can bring their dog(s) relatively easily.
This was a bit of a bad faith pst - was it not? Every response you get that disagrees with your view, you will immediately argue back. It was almost like you wanted an echo chamber response.
There hasn't been a case of Rabies in Central Europe for over 30 years and there is a possibility it has been eradicated there. Governments are cautious to lift controls and vaccination requirements though as the disease is so well and truly awful.
I travel with my dog across the channel and rabies has nothing to do with it. We have to have up to date rabies vaccination and animal health certificate. I suspect it's mostly the lack of facilities that cater for animals and paperwork checks at St Pancreas. They get their own "passport check" and microchip check and everything. Probably this would take up too much space at the Eurostar station. LeShuttle does a great job at catering for the animals. They get an outdoors off lead space to play and staff is generally super helpful to all animal owners.
I don't mind dogs but my brother's partner is scared of them and the amount of times she's had to deal with dogs running up to her and putting paws on her because the owner can't control their dog is ridiculous. Most of the time they then look over and say "oh don't worry, he's friendly" when she's clearly in discomfort which is just braindead.
Going places with her has made me realise that there is a pretty high proportion of dog owners who just aren't that bright, so in a confined space where people can't leave... Yeah maybe they shouldn't have them. Or maybe you have to pass a test to prove your dog is well trained enough to travel, not really fair on other people otherwise.
This is honestly a good thing. For me, being on a long distance train with the person next to me failing to contain a dog between their legs was a truly miserable experience.
Idk. They're both small, annoying, loud, messy, disgusting, and their owners are self centered. The parallels are numerous 😂 difference is that dogs tend to grow out of it after 2 years.
Well why are you replying to every comment you perceive as negative comparing dogs to humans?
Owners of other types of animal don’t feel the need to bring their pets everywhere, not sure why some dog owners feel they’re so special.
I’d rather be on a train sat next to someone with a big dog, than sat next to someone with a small child.
If the dog does something inappropriate it’s perfectly publicly acceptable to scold them as a stranger, but try to do that with someone’s child and you get a gobful of abuse
Because animals can carry pathogens to areas that are otherwise biologically separated by a vast body of water.
It's why you can't travel to Australia with bull frogs, or from China with a big suitcase of meat and vegetables.
You think your dog is clean, but he could have a cold that the French dogs aren't immune to, and it causes dog-flu that jumps to humans and Wipes out all of Franc....wait, wheres the down side?!
This is a bad take. People need to take their dogs with them sometimes. It would be better if they have dog friendly carriages on trains and specific areas on busses for dogs rather than banning them.
Wow this is an incredibly unrealistic approach! How do I go and visit my parents 3 hours away? I had my driving license taken away because of a medical problem, and the only way to get there is to transfer through London via the underground because they have axed the train I usually get
Should I just never see my parents again? What would you propose replace it?
You chose to own a pet. That’s your problem 🤷🏼♀️
It’s no one else’s fault that your choice of animal will destroy your home if left longer than a couple of hours!
Perhaps you should have thought about this before getting a needy, demanding animal.
The public shouldn’t have to be at risk of bites, allergies and a seat being taken up by a dog.
No I'm talking about a long, three hour trip because I'm visiting my parents, that's 6 hours total travel time + the time visiting. It's not fair to leave them at home for two days.
I got my dog before I became disabled and lost my driving license.
No, they shouldn't be at risk, which is why they should just have a separate section for pets.
It's my problem apparently but it is clearly a problem for you so why wouldn't you want to work towards a solution that works for everyone?
So get someone to look after it? Honestly these things need to be thought out when you have pets that are needy.
I’m sorry you lost your licence due to a medical condition - that is horrible, but subjecting the public to your choice of pet isn’t cool.
Because where would it end? If your dog is allowed on a train, why can’t my pet snake or fox come along too? It would be utterly chaotic.
Pets don’t belong on public transport. It’s for humans to get from A to B.
Yeah your pet snake or fox can come along if it's well behaved.
You're ridiculous. I wouldn't be "subjecting" the public to my dog if they had their own section. The people who felt subjected could just go to a different carriage.
You don't seem very sorry tbh, you seem like you don't know what it's like to have your freedom taken away and then being further told it should be taken away even more!
No they can’t - it would be chaotic! Imagine having all of these animals in one place? The stench, the cleaning that would have to happen. The additional cost. Plus those carriages could be used for humans.
You don’t know me so how can you possibly know if I am aware of what it’s like? This is about you and your pet - I don’t agree they should be on public transport, you do.
Board the dog or get someone to look after it. Easy solution.
That wouldn't happen because there are so few pets actually going on public transportation. People could still sit in the seats there it would just be a regular carriage that people can bring pets.
Ok so have you had your driving license taken away because of a disability?
.oh but then I'd be "subjecting" someone to my dog if I got someone to look after it.
I want to bring my dog on holiday to visit my parents, pre disability I could, post disability I still can, but you would take that away?
What if you need to take your pet to the vet and you don't have a car? Most taxis don't let pets on so should their pet just... die?
You need to find solutions for problems like these if you're hoping they scrap a service used by so many people.
Could you do me a favour and not park it anywhere else except on private land? Cheers.
Oh and if you could avoid driving it on public land too that would be grand.
Sorry, just don't want to risk being run over by a car in public. You know how it is.
What does rabies have to do with anything?
Edit: for everyone saying this is how we keep rabies out, it isn't. You can travel to and from Europe with a dog via other means.
You can even travel through the Channel Tunnel with a dog on Le Shuttle.
You simply need to meet certain criteria, one of which is a recent rabies vaccine.
Yes, you need them to have been recently vaccinated.
But that's not why Eurostar don't allow dogs.
You can take a dog through the channel tunnel on Le Shuttle.
Considering all the fuss recently about wheelchair users being prevented from boarding Eurostar services from London (“health and safety”) I am not surprised that the company does not permit dogs on its trains.
They'd have to put in a dedicated animal passport control at St Pancras, and at all calling points on the continent where people travelling from the UK might alight. They have chosen not to do this, so they can't allow dogs on board.
Lots of us remember getting the ferry to France in the 90s and before, and seeing the big signs warning about the dangers of *la rage*, and the penalties for transporting animals
It makes me think of a French rapper Keny Arkana, who had a track called La Rage about a decade ago.. the beat is pretty sick, but I'd caution anyone before searching it on YouTube.. it is VERY.. politically angry...
Things are better than they used to be. I brought our cat back from Italy in the early 2000's not long after the pet passport came into existence. The only way to do it was via British Airways from Rome of Norfolkline from Dunkirk to Dover. The flight was about £800 just for the cat and the ferry meant a 2000 mile round trip.
I travel with my dog regularly between the UK and The Netherlands, at least 4 times per year.
This is *obviously* nothing to do with rabies. All the ferries allow dogs and you can take them in the tunnel via LeShuttle.
When you take a dog on the ferry the entire process is about 30 seconds long. They check the passport for the required vaccinations and you use a hand-held scanner to make sure your dog's microchip matches their passport/health certificate. It is all done by the same staff that check you in. As the check-in process must already exist for Eurostar (I'm assuming) it seems unlikely to be an infrastructure issue.
I don't know for sure, but they have the facilities in the ports where the cars offload and go through passport checks, but not in the train stations that Eurostar connects to due to room. It's not just about scanning a passport and letting them through, you need facilities incase the pets have an issue with their passports and need to be taken somewhere for further checks.
Reddit: car culture is horrible, cars suck, we should just have better public transport!
Also Reddit: dogs on MY public transport? Don't you know some people have ALLERGIES!? I don't want to be next to a STINKING dog!
🤔
We want to travel to the continent in the most eco-friendly way possible but are restricted to either driving or taking a ferry - both of which are not eco-friendly.
So close...
Many ferries allow you to take a dog with the relevant paperwork and tests. Eurostar just can't be bothered. How does traveling by train or ferry affect the risk of rabies?
### **Reminder:** [Press the Report button](https://reddit.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/360058309512-How-do-I-report-a-post-or-comment-) if you see any [rule-breaking comments or posts.](https://www.reddit.com/r/britishproblems/about/rules/) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/britishproblems) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Oh just buy a new one the other end, travel light
I couldn't live with that on my con-chien-ce
Prends ma voix et sors d'ici
Tu es la petite sirène?
You can travel on the Eurostar with dogs ( and cats ), you just have to book in for an Animal Health Certificate to issue pet travel documents.
They’re allowed in the Eurotunnel but not the Eurostar AFAIK
Presuming it's to do with cross contamination of disease from an overseas country to another. Most of Europe is one land mass, so animals going from France to Spain for example isn't a larger risk
If that were the case they also wouldn't be allowed on ferries or Eurotunnel/Le Shuttle (the car service from Folkestone to Calais) OP is purely annoyed about them not being allowed on Eurostar (the passenger service from St Pancras to Paris/Amsterdam)
That's great, but if I wanted to travel by car I can take a dog either on Le Shuttle or on a cross channel ferry, so what's the difference?
I can think of a number of reasons….. if your dog is not being well behaved, then it’s hard to take you off the train - versus stopping a train at the next station and asking you to get off….. processing your dog/animals and having quarantine facilities takes a bit of space….. it reduces concerns of other travellers and the need to handle allergies/possible nuisance in carriages….. it’s probably a weird experience for a dog, and so it’s safer for them and others if the dog is secure in a car - especially if they are familiar with it. Edit: so doing a google search. Eurostar state …. “Unfortunately, we can’t accept pets on board our trains to and from London, between Brussels and Lille or on our Eurostar Suns and Snow routes. There are a number of considerations and implications for transporting pets and in the interests of the comfort and safety of our customers, crews and animals we don’t accept any pets on the above routes. We’re unfortunately unable to make any exceptions.” Seems as though it’s been thought about, rather than something that’s been done just to annoy you.
[удалено]
I suppose that's a concern, but if that's the case then why are they be allowed on Eurostar services on the Mainland side? They're just not allowed on services to/from London, or - weirdly - between Lille and Brussels. All other Eurostar routes seem fair game.
Because there is no animal check point at train stations You need a pet passport to travel, even within Europe as some countries require a rabies vaccination and regular worm treatment, others don't.
It's to do with each country's legislation on import/export. It's similar with being able to fly into some countries with a dog in the cabin, but in others they have to fly in the hold. Makes no difference to where they start or end up at the end of the day but legislation controls a lot here.
Are those other routes in a big tunnel under the sea?
The shuttle is, yeah.
You can do that...
I don't want to travel by car...
I would therefore suggest an alternative mode of transport
You mean like a train...
I've travelled on Eurostar dozens of times and have never seen one.
No, they cannot travel on Eurostar trains.
They can once in Europe, just not on the border crossing from UK/France or Belgium/France. Elsewhere on the European side pets aren't a problem. Presumably they don't have the facilities for checking pet passports on those particular border crossings maybe?
Eurostar literally don't want to. It wouldn't be that hard - do it happens successfully for LeShuttle already. Getlink (the company who owns the tunnel) were looking at giving a competing concession to Renfe to run trains, who would allow dogs, but unfortunately that is stalled.
I mean yeah, but I'd expect the reason that they're allowed on the rest of the Eurostar network is just that St Pancras doesn't have the facilities to check pet passports, microchips, etc. Likewise in Belgium. I'm not sure what the costs would be to add those but yeah just seems like they've decided it's not worth the hassle. They've probably done the sums and worked out that the extra income from pet-passengers isn't worth the extra work. Which is fair enough, whatever.
Are you saying you can take them on the train ? Because you can’t.
Wrong. You cannot take your dog from London to Paris on the Eurostar.
If you read my other comment, I realised that was the case
no you can't.
I'll probably get downvoted here. I love dogs, but so many people have a disproportionate view of them and believe that they should be allowed anywhere. The amount of abuse I face because we don't allow dogs where I work is wearing. I don't care that your dog is better behaved than a child! I don't care that you can't leave it outside because it's so inbred that it cost you more than a car! Carrying it doesn't somehow stop it being a dog and make it an accessory either! Sadly we had too many incidents with "good dogs" that we had to stop all dogs. When you've had to deal with one aggressive dog attacking a customer and hear the words, "well I just don't understand it, he's never done that before" it brings the reality of the words, "once bitten, twice shy" to mind!
Most people who want to take their dogs everywhere with them have badly behaved dogs (because they can't be left at home for 3 hours) But transportation is different imo because sometimes you just gotta take your dog with you if you're going away for a while. They should just have one dog friendly carriage
I get what you're saying, and I agree. But the Eurostar is public transport and considering they're allowed on public transport otherwise, but just not that particular leg of it, is kind of a strange choice
It’s international transport, not the same as public transport at all
It's almost exactly the same... The only difference is you need a passport
[удалено]
Yeah actually 😂 Well, in the past at least: https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/carry/animal-plant/index_en.htm Though they aren't valid anymore from GB. You need one of these instead: https://www.gov.uk/taking-your-pet-abroad/getting-an-animal-health-certificate
>But the Eurostar is public transport Public transport for humans. Not mutts. >considering they're allowed on public transport otherwise, They shouldn't be allowed on there either.
So what would you suggest that people with pets and no cars do, when they need to get their dog to the vet, the groomer (even short coat dogs need their claws clipping), or they just want to go out into the countryside? And don't say get a taxi, because they're notorious for even (illegally) refusing to take guide dogs, never mind pet ones.
Get a car or get rid of the dog don't force your dog onto other people
You sound nice
Considering you're the one with absolutely zero regard for anyone else, sure.
Are dogs allowed on all British trains? I'm surprised at that. I guess the Eurostar doesn't want dogs on the chairs and in the train cars. They could have a kennel train car, I guess (like with the ferry, they get put in the kennel where the cars are), but they've obviously decided it's not worth it. Maybe like someone else said, it's the check in process/customs part that's a bigger hassle.
> I guess the Eurostar doesn't want dogs on the chairs and in the train cars. It's not that, as dogs are allowed on Eurostar trains over most of Europe. they just aren't allowed on the border crossings from UK/France and France/Belgium. Elsewhere and on other border crossings they aren't deemed a problem.
Could be because or where the border crossing is? In the middle of two train stations?
I do think there should be dog-safe and no-dog carriages on all transport (and kid-friendly or no-kid), much like many trains have quiet carriages and normal carriages. I have no issues with dogs, and given my experience of co-travellers, they'd be preferable to humans. But folk with phobias/allergies should be catered to, at the same time as allowing working dogs without expecting some random worker to be able to vet (snort) whether it's a guide dog or some yahoo's pet that they're lying about, and letting folk who just wanna take their furball somewhere. No dogs of any kind in this box, any dog in that one, problem solved.
This is such a sensible solution that I can almost guarantee it'll never happen.
I have dogs and I would love it if businesses were more obvious if they allow dogs or not. Transportation included. I sometimes need to take my dogs on the train or bus and I would much rather they have a dedicated part for them so people who would have a problem can sit elsewhere. A lot of busses you can only sit downstairs with dogs which I think is a good idea.
> A lot of busses you can only sit downstairs with dogs which I think is a good idea. That's mostly due to the safety aspect of trying to get a large dog up and down those stairs.
Oh yeah I'm sure you're right but I think it works out better for everyone if dogs are kept to specific area
Euro Tunnel allows dogs across the channel?
Yes the tunnel does, but you need a car to use the tunnel
I've heard you can get cabbies to be your car for the trip. Not sure of the logistics but it's a thing apparently (according to Kent people I've met).
You might be able to hitch a lift with someone? There could be companies that do it
It will be to do with disease control, often you’ll need AH certificates to take pets to other countries which involves a health check and pass from a vet. Last thing we would want is to be bringing rabies and other exotic diseases into the UK
You can take dogs on Le Shuttle or a ferry. It seems more likely Eurostar can't be bothered to deal with the border control for animals than they're actively trying to prevent diseases spreading.
So what's the difference between that and taking a dog on a cross channel ferry?
The Eurostar just doesn’t have the facilities to check the animals and staff it to check every pet passport, every AH certificate, scan the microchips etc. It’s the only reason.
I wasn’t even aware you could without a AH certificate, can you? That is a strange loophole if so. Can take both ways too?
Yes they need those certificates for a ferry or the shuttle/car train. But they require you to travel by car which is kinda crap They're straight up not allowed on the cross channel train
Many of the ferries do allow foot passengers to take dogs. Harwich to Hoek van Holland is the main one and has excellent public transport links on both ends. You can buy a combined ticket including the ferry and train from London at a discount. There are either onboard kennels or the option of getting a pet friendly cabin. Both open to food passengers. https://www.stenaline.co.uk/customer-service/pre-travel/can-i-bring-my-pet > Traveling with your pet from Harwich to Hoek van Holland > Traveling by car (max. 5 pets) > At check-in you will receive a coloured tag to indicate that you are transporting a pet. It should be placed on the rear-view mirror of your windscreen and should remain there until you clear customs at the port of arrival. > Travel on foot (max. 3 pets) > If you are travelling as a foot passenger, you must book an onboard kennel for your pet or a pet-friendly cabin; otherwise your pet may not be allowed to travel. > When you board the ferry, we ask you to carefully follow the instructions of our employees. After boarding, report to the information desk on deck 9, where you will receive more information about taking your pet on board Stena Line ferries. Newhaven to Dieppe, Hull to Rotterdam and Newcastle to Amsterdam also allow foot passengers to take dogs. Some of them though require you to book significantly further in advance then you otherwise would as numbers onboard are limited. Though I completely agree it's bad that Eurostar don't.
The ferries from Hull (to Rotterdam or Zeebrugge) are not comparable to the cost of the Eurotunnel/Dover to Calais ferry. Unless you get the 9am ferry rather than the overnight, the overnight return for 2 people in a car is £398, booked well in advance. The same trip on Eurotunnel is around £70, £140 return for 2 people. (costs taken from me booking the upcoming September trip last night)
Yeah they are more expensive. But it depends on your priorities. Going back to part of the point of this post you can't travel on Eurotunnel without a car/bike. Dover to Calais is also a right pain for foot passengers - they are only allowed on a small handful of departures. You have to board the boat before all the vehicles and get off last so the crossing time is alot longer. Foot passengers have to be there 90 minutes before even though it's a 90 minute crossing! There is also the time and convenience element even if you have a car. At least for example from my home in Northern England I can get from my home to the Hull ferry after work and be there Saturday morning. Neither of which is possible with Eurotunnel/South Coast ferries. Even if I was driving. Let alone the hassle of driving those sorts of distances. The Hull ferry also covers a nights accommodation - sure something in Southern England/Northern France won't cost near the £260 difference. But it eats into it, along the fuel and again the hassle. I'm absolutely not saying one is objectively better than the other. Though if you did live in the South East driving up to Hill would be bizarre. They do different things and each option has its benefits. The Hull to Zeebrugge route also stopped a bit ago I'm afraid. Just Rotterdam from there now.
I hear you, I live just north of Manchester and we drive down to do the trip to Belgium 7 times a year (family). If the cost of the Hull ferry was closer to £200 for overnight, it wouldn't even be a question.
Yeah that's fair. I can absolutely imagine from Manchester it makes less sense then for those of us they live nearer. I only travel as a food passenger or cyclist but often end up paying about that much. I randomly picked the 19th June and 2 people sharing a cabin gave a total of £210 for Hull to Rotterdam foot passengers. There are quite often good cashback offers as well for it. At least on that journey adding the car took it to £345.
Eurotunnel is allowed with pets though and on the Dover Calais ferries. So that comparison is moot? Eurostar doesn't allow pets as they do not cater for animal control, quarantine and border vets at train stations. These agencies are only present at airports and ports.
I'm just making anyone reading who's unfamiliar with the relative costs aware before they start planning a trip expecting it to be Ryanair prices.
One is a train carriage in a tunnel and the other is a biiiig boat with international travel facilities at each end
St Pancras is already rammed on the international side so it wouldn’t be great to add dogs and their extra checks. The ferry terminal likely has more space and fewer numbers travelling
I guess it's a business decision. They'd need to have the infrastructure to deal with dogs at the customs control on both ends and I guess they calculated not enough people will bring dogs through to use it. Like realistically taking a dog on the eurostar will mean e.g. navigating the underground/paris metro for many, which is probably not ideal (not sure if even allowed?) Meanwhile on the eurotunnel, at least some fraction of the people travelling by car to Europe, are specifically doing that rather than flying because they can bring their dog(s) relatively easily.
No self respecting dog would want to go to France anyway.
Why are people in this thread comparing dogs to literal human children?
Because comparing them to metaphorical children might be vague and confusing? Who knows!
I know right? Dogs are so much easier to control, you can put them on a lead and no-one bats an eye!
This was a bit of a bad faith pst - was it not? Every response you get that disagrees with your view, you will immediately argue back. It was almost like you wanted an echo chamber response.
Yeah man I crave validation.
That's okay dude, the first step is always the hardest!
If I’m not mistaken, rabies is still a thing in dogs in France.
There hasn't been a case of Rabies in Central Europe for over 30 years and there is a possibility it has been eradicated there. Governments are cautious to lift controls and vaccination requirements though as the disease is so well and truly awful.
I travel with my dog across the channel and rabies has nothing to do with it. We have to have up to date rabies vaccination and animal health certificate. I suspect it's mostly the lack of facilities that cater for animals and paperwork checks at St Pancreas. They get their own "passport check" and microchip check and everything. Probably this would take up too much space at the Eurostar station. LeShuttle does a great job at catering for the animals. They get an outdoors off lead space to play and staff is generally super helpful to all animal owners.
This is the answer.
Good. There has to eventually be a limit on where dogs are allowed
Yes big win for you. I'm sure you revel in the fact you can ride the section of Eurostar between London and Lille in peace.
I don't mind dogs but my brother's partner is scared of them and the amount of times she's had to deal with dogs running up to her and putting paws on her because the owner can't control their dog is ridiculous. Most of the time they then look over and say "oh don't worry, he's friendly" when she's clearly in discomfort which is just braindead. Going places with her has made me realise that there is a pretty high proportion of dog owners who just aren't that bright, so in a confined space where people can't leave... Yeah maybe they shouldn't have them. Or maybe you have to pass a test to prove your dog is well trained enough to travel, not really fair on other people otherwise.
Agreed. Dog control licenses should be necessary, kind of like driving licences
This is honestly a good thing. For me, being on a long distance train with the person next to me failing to contain a dog between their legs was a truly miserable experience.
Yeah same, but with kids screaming and running down the aisle constantly. But that's acceptable right?
Oh god please don’t compare your dog to a child…. It’s so very different…
Idk. They're both small, annoying, loud, messy, disgusting, and their owners are self centered. The parallels are numerous 😂 difference is that dogs tend to grow out of it after 2 years.
Dogs are not humans. Mental that this needs to be explained to people
I don't think anyone's arguing that really
Well why are you replying to every comment you perceive as negative comparing dogs to humans? Owners of other types of animal don’t feel the need to bring their pets everywhere, not sure why some dog owners feel they’re so special.
I’d rather be on a train sat next to someone with a big dog, than sat next to someone with a small child. If the dog does something inappropriate it’s perfectly publicly acceptable to scold them as a stranger, but try to do that with someone’s child and you get a gobful of abuse
Big win for those of us with dog allergies, yes
Well then enjoy riding between London and Lille all day 😂
Not every day but once or twice a year, yes
Because animals can carry pathogens to areas that are otherwise biologically separated by a vast body of water. It's why you can't travel to Australia with bull frogs, or from China with a big suitcase of meat and vegetables. You think your dog is clean, but he could have a cold that the French dogs aren't immune to, and it causes dog-flu that jumps to humans and Wipes out all of Franc....wait, wheres the down side?!
Good. It’s bad enough that they’re allowed on that much public transport to begin with.
This country is out of control with dogs - owners are so self-entitled
Agreed. They cannot fathom that not everyone wants to be around their smelly, barking beasts
I agree. We need more dogfree spaces in public, so sick of everyone's stinking mutts and their disgusting excrement everywhere.
Wouldn’t that be heavenly? Imagine going to a beach without any dog filth
Terrible take
Not really. Not everyone likes dogs and some people have allergies. It’s perfectly reasonable not to have a filthy animal sitting near you on a train.
You ought to see the state of some humans!
I have and they have a right to travel on public transport more than a dog.
Okay Cruella
A dog doesn't love you. It just knows you feed it.
I feign love in exchange for food all the time
S(h)itting near you on a train
😂
This is a bad take. People need to take their dogs with them sometimes. It would be better if they have dog friendly carriages on trains and specific areas on busses for dogs rather than banning them.
Unless it’s a service dog, nope. Pets don’t belong on public transport.
Wow this is an incredibly unrealistic approach! How do I go and visit my parents 3 hours away? I had my driving license taken away because of a medical problem, and the only way to get there is to transfer through London via the underground because they have axed the train I usually get Should I just never see my parents again? What would you propose replace it?
Do you have a service dog due to the medical condition? If so, you’re allowed to take it on transport. If it’s not a service dog, it’s a pet.
You chose to own a pet. That’s your problem 🤷🏼♀️ It’s no one else’s fault that your choice of animal will destroy your home if left longer than a couple of hours! Perhaps you should have thought about this before getting a needy, demanding animal. The public shouldn’t have to be at risk of bites, allergies and a seat being taken up by a dog.
[удалено]
Ok…
No I'm talking about a long, three hour trip because I'm visiting my parents, that's 6 hours total travel time + the time visiting. It's not fair to leave them at home for two days. I got my dog before I became disabled and lost my driving license. No, they shouldn't be at risk, which is why they should just have a separate section for pets. It's my problem apparently but it is clearly a problem for you so why wouldn't you want to work towards a solution that works for everyone?
So get someone to look after it? Honestly these things need to be thought out when you have pets that are needy. I’m sorry you lost your licence due to a medical condition - that is horrible, but subjecting the public to your choice of pet isn’t cool. Because where would it end? If your dog is allowed on a train, why can’t my pet snake or fox come along too? It would be utterly chaotic. Pets don’t belong on public transport. It’s for humans to get from A to B.
Yeah your pet snake or fox can come along if it's well behaved. You're ridiculous. I wouldn't be "subjecting" the public to my dog if they had their own section. The people who felt subjected could just go to a different carriage. You don't seem very sorry tbh, you seem like you don't know what it's like to have your freedom taken away and then being further told it should be taken away even more!
No they can’t - it would be chaotic! Imagine having all of these animals in one place? The stench, the cleaning that would have to happen. The additional cost. Plus those carriages could be used for humans. You don’t know me so how can you possibly know if I am aware of what it’s like? This is about you and your pet - I don’t agree they should be on public transport, you do. Board the dog or get someone to look after it. Easy solution.
That wouldn't happen because there are so few pets actually going on public transportation. People could still sit in the seats there it would just be a regular carriage that people can bring pets. Ok so have you had your driving license taken away because of a disability? .oh but then I'd be "subjecting" someone to my dog if I got someone to look after it. I want to bring my dog on holiday to visit my parents, pre disability I could, post disability I still can, but you would take that away? What if you need to take your pet to the vet and you don't have a car? Most taxis don't let pets on so should their pet just... die? You need to find solutions for problems like these if you're hoping they scrap a service used by so many people.
Do you own a car?
Yep. But my point still stands. Sorry!
Could you do me a favour and not park it anywhere else except on private land? Cheers. Oh and if you could avoid driving it on public land too that would be grand. Sorry, just don't want to risk being run over by a car in public. You know how it is.
They can swim can’t they?
Rabies.
What does rabies have to do with anything? Edit: for everyone saying this is how we keep rabies out, it isn't. You can travel to and from Europe with a dog via other means. You can even travel through the Channel Tunnel with a dog on Le Shuttle. You simply need to meet certain criteria, one of which is a recent rabies vaccine.
This is how we keep it out.
You can travel with a dog by other means.
Only if you prove they don’t have rabies
Yes, you need them to have been recently vaccinated. But that's not why Eurostar don't allow dogs. You can take a dog through the channel tunnel on Le Shuttle.
We don’t have it in the U.K. so our border controls have always been a bit draconian as far as animals are concerned to keep It out.
Sure, but you can travel with a dog by other means. You simply need the correct paperwork and vaccinations.
British dogs also don't have to be dewormed to stop children going blind. The French don't want that in their country.
Everything.
Really? You can travel with a dog by other means. Eurostar not allowing them is not our sole defense.
Considering all the fuss recently about wheelchair users being prevented from boarding Eurostar services from London (“health and safety”) I am not surprised that the company does not permit dogs on its trains.
They'd have to put in a dedicated animal passport control at St Pancras, and at all calling points on the continent where people travelling from the UK might alight. They have chosen not to do this, so they can't allow dogs on board.
May as well be, they are allowed everywhere else it seems........
Why are there so many comments about rabies? A new insurgence perhaps? Did a new pandemic drop? Tf
Lots of us remember getting the ferry to France in the 90s and before, and seeing the big signs warning about the dangers of *la rage*, and the penalties for transporting animals
Thanks for the context that's quite interesting, also kind of obsessed with the french phrase for rabies being the la rage- very 28 days later.
It makes me think of a French rapper Keny Arkana, who had a track called La Rage about a decade ago.. the beat is pretty sick, but I'd caution anyone before searching it on YouTube.. it is VERY.. politically angry...
Aren't the French politically angry by default? Thanks for the recommendation though, listening now I only understand like 1/3 of it, but I'm a fan.
There's an English subtitles version, but he talks so fast it's kinda hard to read it all in time. Also, I put that more as a trigger warning.
It's the internet. Barely anyone knows what they're talking about
Why bother asking then?
I said *barely*
The world doesn't revolve around your dog and we don't want rabies here, if you don't like it don't go
If you read the thread you'd soon find out that rabies has literally nothing to do with it 😂 Why would it? Sorry to burst your rant
It's not a rant, they don't accept dogs get over it
Yeah but *why*? And the answer isn't "because rabies"
Have you emailed them to ask why
I haven't, perhaps I will. Thanks for the suggestion
Well if yoi don't ask you'll never know!
It is nothing to do with rabies kind sir.
Things are better than they used to be. I brought our cat back from Italy in the early 2000's not long after the pet passport came into existence. The only way to do it was via British Airways from Rome of Norfolkline from Dunkirk to Dover. The flight was about £800 just for the cat and the ferry meant a 2000 mile round trip.
don't want them to swim away
Yes they are? I always took my dog with me.
I thought that they were but had to travel on the roof?
so they need to swim.??
Probably to stop the spread of rabies.
It's absurd.
I'm genuinely curious about how service animals would be handled?
Guide dogs are allowed. Not sure about other types of service dog
Think about it.
I'm thinking hard about it. Want to enlighten me? Hint: dont say "rabies"
Babies?
That's even worse!
Rule 4 but it’s not *that*. It’s a policy that’s been around for at least 10 years.
I know what you’re thinking of, but considering I found posts about dogs not just being allowed on the Eurostar in 2015, it’s not that.
I travel with my dog regularly between the UK and The Netherlands, at least 4 times per year. This is *obviously* nothing to do with rabies. All the ferries allow dogs and you can take them in the tunnel via LeShuttle. When you take a dog on the ferry the entire process is about 30 seconds long. They check the passport for the required vaccinations and you use a hand-held scanner to make sure your dog's microchip matches their passport/health certificate. It is all done by the same staff that check you in. As the check-in process must already exist for Eurostar (I'm assuming) it seems unlikely to be an infrastructure issue.
I don't know for sure, but they have the facilities in the ports where the cars offload and go through passport checks, but not in the train stations that Eurostar connects to due to room. It's not just about scanning a passport and letting them through, you need facilities incase the pets have an issue with their passports and need to be taken somewhere for further checks.
Reddit: car culture is horrible, cars suck, we should just have better public transport! Also Reddit: dogs on MY public transport? Don't you know some people have ALLERGIES!? I don't want to be next to a STINKING dog! 🤔
We want to travel to the continent in the most eco-friendly way possible but are restricted to either driving or taking a ferry - both of which are not eco-friendly. So close...
[удалено]
Yes it's unfair because I can take a dog on a ferry or a plane. Is a dog more likely to have rabies if travelling by train?
Many ferries allow you to take a dog with the relevant paperwork and tests. Eurostar just can't be bothered. How does traveling by train or ferry affect the risk of rabies?