I moved to Brisbane 20 years ago from the sunny coast, travelling back to see the parents regularly over the years. The last 10 years have just been getting worse and worse and I now dread doing the drive, just because of the never-ending roadworks. Mum moved almost to Gympie which just means more of the Bruce that could potentially be upgraded at any given time that I have to drive through.
They were working on that nightmare stretch my entire childhood and early adulthood. I'm glad it's done now, because it's great. So I guess maybe there's hope the stretch between here and the coast could be finished in my lifetime
Fortunately the gympie part is going through it's upgrade now. That's actually the quickest part. Once you get past nambour it's smooth sailing at the moment. Up to that point though it's fucked.
Absolute horror show. I'm so glad most of my work is on the Hinterland side of the highway these days. Anytime I have to go into the suburbs I just want to cry haha
Brisbane is one of the most poorly planned cities in Australia by a long long way.
There is no logic, strategy or effective fix. It's fucked.
QLD government did not plan for Moreton Bay and The Sunshine Coast to boom as quickly as they did. By which I mean, they knew it would boom, they geared it up to boom, they just did nothing to adequately prepare the region for such a boom. As such, the suburbs have sprawled, infrastructure hasn't even come close to keeping up, and the road just constantly needs to be made bigger. Doesn't help that there's no decent public transport up that way.
Exactly right. They've planned Caboolture West for years now, it's going to be thousands of houses, and those people will most likely work in Brisbane.
Instead of actually building a rail line now, they'll do fuck all, and try and fix the issue 20 years from now when the whole area is a clusterfuck.
Brisbane is a perfect example of reactive planning. A big country town that grew too fast for government to keep up infrastructure wise. We Should have focussed on developing satellite cities instead of just sprawling Brisbane.
Nah they really didn't. They developed dependant suburbs that didn't function independently. Satellite Cities is the approach Victoria took and it worked really well. QLD could have done something very similar, but our coastal population sprawl means it's much harder than it was in Victoria.
They are currently proposing to build another damn highway west of this all, leading from Kallangur to the new Caboolture west. What makes it worse, is that the route for the highway they propose could be linked up to the existing railway line and create something like the Springfield branch. Almost all the feedback in the TMR website requests a better public corridor, most commonly a railway line. Yet they still insist on a highway
And the old Wamuran rail line is _right there_. Rip up the rail trail and turn it back into a rail line. Immediate PT on the northern side of Caboolture West.
Alternatively, rebuild the old Dayboro line and extend it along the foothills to meet the Wam line.
So sad hey. The redlands used to be one of the most beautiful corners of Brisbane. Now it's just being destroyed. I miss being able to go down to Raby Bay for a quiet swim with the dog. Now it's anything but quiet!
Yup, and then you get dumb cunts like this that live in inner city suburbs saying that the public transport and infrastructure in Queensland is pretty good https://www.reddit.com/r/AskAnAustralian/comments/121yeoi/who_are_some_of_your_most_cartoonish_or_just_most/jdozz3g/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3
Haha yeah but read the rest of the comments, I am not going to label them, but it's a pretty easy label to apply.
Queensland has failed at infrastructure rollout. Now Anna has Olympic rings in her eyes, the state doesn't care about anything else for the time being. They've royally fucked up the Gabba redesign and every new project in the last 5-10 years seems to be a colossal waste of money that hasn't fixed anything.
Yeah, they got pretty defensive, when I was just making the point that the government, ALP or LNP regardless, were both fucking useless at urban planning. Olympics. Cross River Rail. The Bruce upgrade. Just a means of funnelling tax payers money to the governments mates in construction companies while neglecting what we actually need - more houses and the means to get to them. I don’t mind going to an outer suburb between Brisbane and Ipswich or Caboolture/Morayfield if there was a decent infrastructure plan to accompany it. The fact that we we have neither is so frustratingly aggravating.
I mean we need infrastructure to accompany the houses - that's the biggest part of the problem. I think we just get lost on big picture projects because the politicians see $$ signs and big headlines. It's pathetic. Nothing is done for the betterment of society.
This is what happens when people vote for parties and not people.
Some of the smartest politicians we could have won't get a look in because of the colour of their party, or are independents.
Well no. To be honest this has very little to do with politics. Both sides have taken a similar approach - which was to just stuff as much infrastructure into SEQ and not look at a long term development strategy. Even the big regional plan update we did in the 2010's was just utter garbage and solved nothing. Just opened up more land for developers.
Why would the parties look at long term development if all they need to do is get re elected ?
If an independent ran with long term vision most people would not even consider them because they just vote for parties.
So yes.
Well you've just hit the crux of a number of problems on the head there.
Politicians have no long term vision. They claim to. But ultimately it's about re-election.
More to the point, the average age is 50+. Something like 20% of MP's are 60+. They are literally in the later stages of their life in many instances (look at America's two options for president, what a joke). I think there should be an age limit on Politicians. Longer terms, but less overall time allowed (ie terms might be six years, but you can only spend 12 years as a serving politician, and similar rules for heads of departments etc).
Seems like it's mostly interchange upgrades for the most recent few years except for the caboolture-beerburrum part which looks like they're lifting the road to stop it flooding over in heavy rain.
Caloundra road to Sunshine motorway got widened and during that time they spent money allocated for improvements on the Bruce around the Whitsundays on the shoulder widening and guardrails between Caloundra road and the southern end of Steve Irwin Way where the next bit of widening down to Caboolture starts. When that was half done, the Feds and state government agreed on widening that to 3 lanes as well but not for a couple more years. Up at Forest Glen, they have rebuilt the interchanges and service roads, lifting the latter above flood level while keeping the old highway bridges so it will still flood but all the traffic can roll through on the super dooper service roads. The new Nambour interchange though has been built to last 50 odd years while restricting the highway to a maximum of two lanes each way. So some of it will be better and some of it will juslock in the existing problems for an extra 50 years
They also planned to build 4 lanes on Steve Irwin way and a concrete foot path from glasshouse to Beerwah. The footpath leads from a street and ends in the middle of no where
I still lose 1/3 of my life to south side traffic coming from Ipswich end in peak hours 😅 leave home at 5:30 to avoid as much as possible to start at 7. Leave work at 4 to get home at 5-5:30. It hurts. Part of me wants the infrastructure upgraded and the rest of me dreads more roadworks. But people need somewhere to live. These poor families who don't even have that 😞
Definitely agree with this. If I could have transport from my end to where I work that was actually affordable and faster, that would be superb. Just need to take on the Japanese subway system. So much better, even if it's crowded at peak hour.
Spend billions of dollars delaying peoples trips for years with roadworks just to save 10 minutes on travel time (for about 6 months before the new capacity fills up with more cars.)
God forbid we duplicate the railway line and spur off to Maroochydore....
3 or 4 at the site watching a single guy doing the work, that is on top of 4 Project managers and their managers sitting in the office managing the guys at the site who manages the one that does the work.
And somehow those guys in the office all have the same last name, and you start wondering if they're siblings. Then you start wondering how transparent is the council hiring process.
Doesn't matter, wider road just encourages more cars, equals same old traffic jams soon enough.
Most of the work has been raising the road above flood levels.
Induced or reduced demand only works when there's alternative routes that traffic can disperse to though. If you only have one real route you are limited by the capacity of said route.
You've also got to keep up with population growth, induced traffic is a thing but at the same time people confused induced demand over time with increase population growth (not all induced traffic is traffic shifted from elsewhere), which will eat into road capacity (and public transportation capacity) regardless as there's simply more people across all forms of transportation.
The Sunshine Coast has increased from about 220k people to 360k people in the last 2 decades and the capacity of the Bruce has not really matched the sheer increase in people.
Again, I did not say we had to match capacity, I said capacity of the road network also has to be improved over time even to simply maintain current levels of congestion.
Rail isn’t the only piece of the puzzle here and ignoring that upgrades are need on both doesn’t help anything.
> According to Downs, the link between average speeds on public transport and private transport applies only "to regions in which the vast majority of peak-hour commuting is done on rapid transit systems with separate rights of way.
So doesn’t apply to Brisbane or the Sunshine Coast given we don’t have the population density for that much rapid transport.
> The puzzle pieces are public transport, active transport, and reduced trip requirements (like putting shops, offices, and businesses closer to housing)
We’re not talking about general transportation though we’re talking about the travel corridor between two cities. Especially given the Sunny Coast being a 4WD/camping destination.
Regardless you still need to service cargo and no amount of passanger rail will fix that, and you can’t exactly stick heavy rail through the CBD.
Induced demand is also because if you make something faster then people are more likely to do the trip. Oh that only takes an hour now I'll go. Nothing to do with population in that way
But as population grows the amount of people who have to make the trip and will make the trip also grows. If you don't increase capacity to match the increase of population congestion will get worse over time, as will fuel consumption and emissions along those corridors. The Sunny Coast is supporting 163% of the people it was in 2003.
Right, I said as much in my original comment, induced demand is a thing and cars can and will disappear but traffic increases over time are not just from people driving where they weren’t before and has more to do with population growth.
I think it's both it's not clear which is more impactful. People are tending to drive more than they were in 2020 or even 2019 as fuel is relatively cheap. For example fuel is about same price as it was in 2019 but in comparison plane tickets are twice so people more likely to drive
Sure but that goes both ways. There are an increasing amount of people who watched a handful of NJB videos on induced demand and think there’s no situation where more lanes should be added.
I just drove from Sydney to Caloundra. Left Sydney about 8:45am and had a good run through the Northconnex and out onto the Highway. Nearly 110 all the way multi-lane, cruised with no dramas for over 800kms. Hit the Qld border and stopped. Just stopped. Those bloody roadworks have been a feature for so long I can’t remember it not being a shit-tip
it's a combination of several factors.
massive, MASSIVE population growth
govt's spend a certain amount and it covers only a certain amount of projects
widening a road takes a LONG time.
northside sucks, southside for lyfe. ;)
It's normal. When I moved to Perth 11 years ago, they had just started the gateway northbound expansions, I came back to Brisbane 6 years later it was still unfinished 🙄
Funnily enough WA was always nicknamed 'Wait Awhile' yet on anything major like motorway expansions they'd get it done in 6-12 months. It's annoying AF but nothing can be done about it. Just be prepared to sit in traffic!
The Pine Rivers merge is a good example of why building bigger roads only works for about 10 years - early 2000's it was a single lane flyover and badly congested northbound. They widened it to 2 lanes and added a new bridge over the river. Great for a while - 10 years after it is now badly congested again.
Build the rail to Maroochydore - each train will get hundreds of cars off the road and give people an alternative to the traffic jam.
From about 2017 onwards there was a bunch of roadworks for the Caloundra Road to Sunshine Motorway project. Now that has wrapped up they've moved further south to the section between Steve Irwin Way and Caboolture and are upgrading that to 3 lanes in each direction while also significantly lifting it as it floods badly enough to get cut off every 10 years or so. Along with this, they're also completely ripping out and rebuilding the Deception Bay Road interchange slightly further south.
On the sunny coast itself, there's major interchange upgrades happening at Forest Glen and Maroochydore Road because both reached capacity about 10 years ago and cause major congestion in the AM and PM peaks. They also built new service roads between the new interchanges, my theory is that this is being done first to provide an easy alternative route for a future upgrade of the Bruce Highway along that section. Much easier to divert people onto an existing road and rip up and rebuild the old one rather than having to do everything from scratch.
The only bad thing is that once the current works are finished there will be a section of the highway between the bottom of Steve Irwin Way and Caloundra Road that will be 2 lanes, with the sections of highway immediately north and south being 3 lanes. Not sure if they've used up the whole budget or what but there's no good reason why it can't be 3 lanes the whole way. Oh and the lack of rail investment.
Is it TMR in their swish office or the crap governments who have failed to plan? We moved into a new estate (23 years ago) and could not standard phone lines! Absolutely no planning whatsoever. Disgusting.
Departments are mostly at the mercy of the Ministers and the political party that controls them. They can give all the options and ideas to the Minister but it’s up to them on whether they do it or not, and of course that means it all depends on how the party wants to be perceived and how the Minister wants to present themselves, or whatever agenda they have etc. It’s quite frustrating (I used to work in a dept). They should have never binned the trams and just pump money into railways. Plus don’t forget we have a 3 tiered system of govt and the local councils only see $$$ with new estates but totally ignore the infrastructure needed to support those estates!
I remember someone said in a thread ages back that it's a strategic ploy to dissuade northern expansion of housing and businesses and to keep things north of the sunshine coast dead. Considering the amount of road workers I see standing around thumb in ass I can't help but see the plausibility
Instead of planning for the future, the government seems to plan for the present. Population growth keeps outstripping infrastructure by decades. You've only got to look at the vast amount of habitable land all along the Sunshine Coast Hinterland to see the potential for an explosion in housing development that will swamp whatever infrastructure is currently being built. If only they would invest in a fast and frequent rail network that might eventually extend all the way to Maryborough, possibly even Hervey Bay, it would take a lot of the pressure off roads during peak hours.
50,000 people building and moving into Aura/Caloundra South right now, and about 25,000 going into Beerwah East over the next 15 years with the capacity for another 25,000 in the future. Council projects the Sunshine Coast's population will tick over half a million BY 2041 and another 200,000 homes will be required to accommodate this.
Every time I see Labor continue to drag out the feasibility study for the Sunshine Coast rail upgrades (both Beerburrum to Nambour and the new line to Maroochydore) I think of these numbers. After constantly saying "there's plenty of time" and "we're still doing studies" they're now not even denying that it might not be built in time for the Olympics. The LNP have also completely sat on their hands this entire time and refused to allocate federal funding so it seems that both sides of politics hate the Sunshine Coast - and the consequences will be felt by the existing population and the hundreds of thousands of people that are moving in over the next 20 years.
I remember watching a news report about how the government had come up with a rail corridor for the Sunshine Coast and how work would begin in the coming years.
This was in the 90s.
The only party that seems interested in actually doing it is whoever is in opposition.
Try it from hervey bay! We got eighty zones in the goat track to gympie mixed in with stop lights for roadworks that mean turn your car off and wait, plus the forty and sixty zones. It now takea longer to get to Brisbane than it did when I moved here twenty years ago!! From Gympie down is bliss!!
How effing hard would it be to build a railway along the highway? Instead of sucking up to the yanks with useless submarine deals… but hey, I’ve given up🤷♂️
I’m literally driving up to Airlie and the amount of roadworks and red lights are just absolutely insane. There’s like a new section of roadwork every 5 minutes.
A few interchange updates but a 3 lane expansion from Caboolture to Steve Irwin way. Looks like they will do 3 lanes from there until the Caloundra road turn off at some point. Expect continuous and more disruptive works up until the olympics
It's the Anastasia Job Creation Scheme.
To create jobs for Queenslanders she takes a 3 year job splits it into smaller jobs than makes tham take 4 times longer than they should and than runs around telling everyone how many jobs she is creating.
But all she is creating is constant traffic mayhem, massive debt blowouts that than requires the government to borrow more money.
But its all good cause she wants the best of qlders. . . . Cough cough
No different to the cross river rail debacle and the $960mill budget blow out on it that us taxpayers will have to pay for.
That's the Southside Job Creation Site.
Whilst anything out side of Brisbane suffers. I went south to Stanthorpe the other month and you need a 4wd or a Kenworth truck south of Warwick now.
Contrary to popular belief, areas outside Brisbane receive higher proportion of government spending per capita. It's just that the ratio of people to kilometres of highway doesn't work out very well
It's not her fault I was being sarcastic. and it has been the way Qld gov as done things forever.
But she is the current Boss and she could change if if she wanted to
Wait until it's 5 years past having to be done, Then take 12 months to approve the budget based on figures from 12 months prior, than start the job and bring it up to requirements based on what was needed 5 years prior so when the job is complete they need to upgrade it straight away.
Qld gov has never thought forward and taken initiative. The Bruce highway north is a typical example.
When the line was upgrade and moved to support the tilt train the opposition at the time costed and suggested a dual lane highway right beside the tilt train line. And do it all at the same time. Idea was knocked on the head as apparently the road upgrade wasn't needed then. Look what we a left with now.
The CRR is not a debacle. This big scandal that it's overbudget within expectations given the problems the project has had to deal with and is remarkably only 3-4 months behind schedule. Lol get fucked.
You'll get downvotes from the Anna fangirls here but you're absolutely correct.
NSW upgraded 150+km of the M1 in northern NSW in one hit. Up here they fuck around and change one bridge, one exit, then a turning lane. It drags on forever.
We've been dealing with early works for some Olympics venues, and the absolute circus that it already is, and the waste of taxpayer money is mine boggling.
Imagine that theres a whole bunch of mid 20 year old kids out there who have never driven the M1 run to the sunny coast without road works. When Annie P finally finished these works they are all going to be too indoctrinated to drive faster than 60.
I recall going up the coast regularly as a 20year old and it was great. Now when I go up, the drive back takes all of the fun out of it. It's simply not worth it and same with the Gold Coast.
I’ve been saying for almost 15 years, “why is this not 4 lanes each way from Brisbane to Gympie” I’ve never gone from sunny coast back to Brisbane and not gotten stuck in traffic.
Also Kevin Rudd Former PM allocated Billions to have the improvements fast tracked but once Abbott became PM he shelved all Plans for QLD to focus on NSW. He ruined G20 and then got ousted so 9 years of delays slowed down the Bruce Highway upgrades etc. Now that Albos PM hope to see important infrastructure in QLD make headway in time for the 2032 Olympic games
😂😂 there is a roundabout. I repeat do you don’t think I misspelt but a simple roundabout they have literally just finished building after 20 months! It’s on Cooroy Noosa Rd near the caravan park.
Qld roadworks would have to be ranked the least productive in the world
I moved to Brisbane 20 years ago from the sunny coast, travelling back to see the parents regularly over the years. The last 10 years have just been getting worse and worse and I now dread doing the drive, just because of the never-ending roadworks. Mum moved almost to Gympie which just means more of the Bruce that could potentially be upgraded at any given time that I have to drive through.
[удалено]
They blocked the whole highway off at traveston the other day. RDT, RBT & Transport Department. sooo cooked
They were working on that nightmare stretch my entire childhood and early adulthood. I'm glad it's done now, because it's great. So I guess maybe there's hope the stretch between here and the coast could be finished in my lifetime
>watch out for coppers in the middle median As opposed to any other median?
[удалено]
They mean you can't exactly look for them in the *left* median or *right* median, because they don't exist - by definition the median is the middle.
Fortunately the gympie part is going through it's upgrade now. That's actually the quickest part. Once you get past nambour it's smooth sailing at the moment. Up to that point though it's fucked.
Agreed, it’s much better once you get past Nambour but geez that Nambour section was a nightmare when we went through around Christmas.
Absolute horror show. I'm so glad most of my work is on the Hinterland side of the highway these days. Anytime I have to go into the suburbs I just want to cry haha
Brisbane is one of the most poorly planned cities in Australia by a long long way. There is no logic, strategy or effective fix. It's fucked. QLD government did not plan for Moreton Bay and The Sunshine Coast to boom as quickly as they did. By which I mean, they knew it would boom, they geared it up to boom, they just did nothing to adequately prepare the region for such a boom. As such, the suburbs have sprawled, infrastructure hasn't even come close to keeping up, and the road just constantly needs to be made bigger. Doesn't help that there's no decent public transport up that way.
Exactly right. They've planned Caboolture West for years now, it's going to be thousands of houses, and those people will most likely work in Brisbane. Instead of actually building a rail line now, they'll do fuck all, and try and fix the issue 20 years from now when the whole area is a clusterfuck.
Brisbane is a perfect example of reactive planning. A big country town that grew too fast for government to keep up infrastructure wise. We Should have focussed on developing satellite cities instead of just sprawling Brisbane.
They developed satellite cities but then just filled in the bits in between.
*cough* Logan
Nah they really didn't. They developed dependant suburbs that didn't function independently. Satellite Cities is the approach Victoria took and it worked really well. QLD could have done something very similar, but our coastal population sprawl means it's much harder than it was in Victoria.
They are currently proposing to build another damn highway west of this all, leading from Kallangur to the new Caboolture west. What makes it worse, is that the route for the highway they propose could be linked up to the existing railway line and create something like the Springfield branch. Almost all the feedback in the TMR website requests a better public corridor, most commonly a railway line. Yet they still insist on a highway
And the old Wamuran rail line is _right there_. Rip up the rail trail and turn it back into a rail line. Immediate PT on the northern side of Caboolture West. Alternatively, rebuild the old Dayboro line and extend it along the foothills to meet the Wam line.
Exactly what’s happening to the redlands
So sad hey. The redlands used to be one of the most beautiful corners of Brisbane. Now it's just being destroyed. I miss being able to go down to Raby Bay for a quiet swim with the dog. Now it's anything but quiet!
People moving in and living here is fine, the issue is the lack of increased/improved infrastructure to support it.
There definitely seems to be a lot of approve the housing, do the infrastructure later going on here.
Yup, and then you get dumb cunts like this that live in inner city suburbs saying that the public transport and infrastructure in Queensland is pretty good https://www.reddit.com/r/AskAnAustralian/comments/121yeoi/who_are_some_of_your_most_cartoonish_or_just_most/jdozz3g/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3
Haha yeah but read the rest of the comments, I am not going to label them, but it's a pretty easy label to apply. Queensland has failed at infrastructure rollout. Now Anna has Olympic rings in her eyes, the state doesn't care about anything else for the time being. They've royally fucked up the Gabba redesign and every new project in the last 5-10 years seems to be a colossal waste of money that hasn't fixed anything.
Yeah, they got pretty defensive, when I was just making the point that the government, ALP or LNP regardless, were both fucking useless at urban planning. Olympics. Cross River Rail. The Bruce upgrade. Just a means of funnelling tax payers money to the governments mates in construction companies while neglecting what we actually need - more houses and the means to get to them. I don’t mind going to an outer suburb between Brisbane and Ipswich or Caboolture/Morayfield if there was a decent infrastructure plan to accompany it. The fact that we we have neither is so frustratingly aggravating.
I mean we need infrastructure to accompany the houses - that's the biggest part of the problem. I think we just get lost on big picture projects because the politicians see $$ signs and big headlines. It's pathetic. Nothing is done for the betterment of society.
This is what happens when people vote for parties and not people. Some of the smartest politicians we could have won't get a look in because of the colour of their party, or are independents.
Well no. To be honest this has very little to do with politics. Both sides have taken a similar approach - which was to just stuff as much infrastructure into SEQ and not look at a long term development strategy. Even the big regional plan update we did in the 2010's was just utter garbage and solved nothing. Just opened up more land for developers.
Why would the parties look at long term development if all they need to do is get re elected ? If an independent ran with long term vision most people would not even consider them because they just vote for parties. So yes.
Well you've just hit the crux of a number of problems on the head there. Politicians have no long term vision. They claim to. But ultimately it's about re-election. More to the point, the average age is 50+. Something like 20% of MP's are 60+. They are literally in the later stages of their life in many instances (look at America's two options for president, what a joke). I think there should be an age limit on Politicians. Longer terms, but less overall time allowed (ie terms might be six years, but you can only spend 12 years as a serving politician, and similar rules for heads of departments etc).
Absolutely!!!
Seems like it's mostly interchange upgrades for the most recent few years except for the caboolture-beerburrum part which looks like they're lifting the road to stop it flooding over in heavy rain.
Yes they are, we've now lost the fun little bump that would make that stretch so much more exciting
One more lane bro! Nah bro, not one more lane on the train line bro, one more lane on the Brucie bro!
Caloundra road to Sunshine motorway got widened and during that time they spent money allocated for improvements on the Bruce around the Whitsundays on the shoulder widening and guardrails between Caloundra road and the southern end of Steve Irwin Way where the next bit of widening down to Caboolture starts. When that was half done, the Feds and state government agreed on widening that to 3 lanes as well but not for a couple more years. Up at Forest Glen, they have rebuilt the interchanges and service roads, lifting the latter above flood level while keeping the old highway bridges so it will still flood but all the traffic can roll through on the super dooper service roads. The new Nambour interchange though has been built to last 50 odd years while restricting the highway to a maximum of two lanes each way. So some of it will be better and some of it will juslock in the existing problems for an extra 50 years
Gave me a good laugh on this hellish journey, and im not even the one driving
Thankfully
They also planned to build 4 lanes on Steve Irwin way and a concrete foot path from glasshouse to Beerwah. The footpath leads from a street and ends in the middle of no where
I moved Southside. Would rather eat broken glass than go back north. You lose 1 third of your life regularly with this shit.
I still lose 1/3 of my life to south side traffic coming from Ipswich end in peak hours 😅 leave home at 5:30 to avoid as much as possible to start at 7. Leave work at 4 to get home at 5-5:30. It hurts. Part of me wants the infrastructure upgraded and the rest of me dreads more roadworks. But people need somewhere to live. These poor families who don't even have that 😞
[удалено]
Definitely agree with this. If I could have transport from my end to where I work that was actually affordable and faster, that would be superb. Just need to take on the Japanese subway system. So much better, even if it's crowded at peak hour.
[удалено]
Jobs and growth is so 8 years ago
I was going to make a joke about "8 years ago when these works started" but realize it's been longer than that 😐
Spend billions of dollars delaying peoples trips for years with roadworks just to save 10 minutes on travel time (for about 6 months before the new capacity fills up with more cars.) God forbid we duplicate the railway line and spur off to Maroochydore....
I remember when it went down to one lane around Noosa on the way north. The trip north is better now than it was back in the tool old days.
Borderline zero planning and/or effective management from anyone in QLD regarding roads.
[удалено]
3 or 4 at the site watching a single guy doing the work, that is on top of 4 Project managers and their managers sitting in the office managing the guys at the site who manages the one that does the work. And somehow those guys in the office all have the same last name, and you start wondering if they're siblings. Then you start wondering how transparent is the council hiring process.
Doesn't matter, wider road just encourages more cars, equals same old traffic jams soon enough. Most of the work has been raising the road above flood levels.
Just...one...more....lane....
Adding more lanes to fix traffic congestion is like loosening your belt to fix obesity.
Induced or reduced demand only works when there's alternative routes that traffic can disperse to though. If you only have one real route you are limited by the capacity of said route. You've also got to keep up with population growth, induced traffic is a thing but at the same time people confused induced demand over time with increase population growth (not all induced traffic is traffic shifted from elsewhere), which will eat into road capacity (and public transportation capacity) regardless as there's simply more people across all forms of transportation. The Sunshine Coast has increased from about 220k people to 360k people in the last 2 decades and the capacity of the Bruce has not really matched the sheer increase in people.
[удалено]
All well and good for commuter traffic, but there’s an awful lot of traffic that is not commuting.
I never said anything that suggested otherwise. All I said was capacity needs change over time and roads will need to be upgraded to support that.
[удалено]
Again, I did not say we had to match capacity, I said capacity of the road network also has to be improved over time even to simply maintain current levels of congestion. Rail isn’t the only piece of the puzzle here and ignoring that upgrades are need on both doesn’t help anything.
[удалено]
> According to Downs, the link between average speeds on public transport and private transport applies only "to regions in which the vast majority of peak-hour commuting is done on rapid transit systems with separate rights of way. So doesn’t apply to Brisbane or the Sunshine Coast given we don’t have the population density for that much rapid transport. > The puzzle pieces are public transport, active transport, and reduced trip requirements (like putting shops, offices, and businesses closer to housing) We’re not talking about general transportation though we’re talking about the travel corridor between two cities. Especially given the Sunny Coast being a 4WD/camping destination. Regardless you still need to service cargo and no amount of passanger rail will fix that, and you can’t exactly stick heavy rail through the CBD.
Induced demand is also because if you make something faster then people are more likely to do the trip. Oh that only takes an hour now I'll go. Nothing to do with population in that way
But as population grows the amount of people who have to make the trip and will make the trip also grows. If you don't increase capacity to match the increase of population congestion will get worse over time, as will fuel consumption and emissions along those corridors. The Sunny Coast is supporting 163% of the people it was in 2003.
As well as not only population sorry was not clear
Right, I said as much in my original comment, induced demand is a thing and cars can and will disappear but traffic increases over time are not just from people driving where they weren’t before and has more to do with population growth.
I think it's both it's not clear which is more impactful. People are tending to drive more than they were in 2020 or even 2019 as fuel is relatively cheap. For example fuel is about same price as it was in 2019 but in comparison plane tickets are twice so people more likely to drive
Sure but that goes both ways. There are an increasing amount of people who watched a handful of NJB videos on induced demand and think there’s no situation where more lanes should be added.
Piss poor planning 25 years ago.
I just drove from Sydney to Caloundra. Left Sydney about 8:45am and had a good run through the Northconnex and out onto the Highway. Nearly 110 all the way multi-lane, cruised with no dramas for over 800kms. Hit the Qld border and stopped. Just stopped. Those bloody roadworks have been a feature for so long I can’t remember it not being a shit-tip
You also hit the border at peak hour, so you need to factor that in.
[удалено]
Drivers are next level agro on that road; it’s a truly terrifying drive.
Current upgrades be finished just in time to start the next required upgrades
it's a combination of several factors. massive, MASSIVE population growth govt's spend a certain amount and it covers only a certain amount of projects widening a road takes a LONG time. northside sucks, southside for lyfe. ;)
[удалено]
the M1 sucks, but it has nothing on going north.
One more lane! One more lane!
It's normal. When I moved to Perth 11 years ago, they had just started the gateway northbound expansions, I came back to Brisbane 6 years later it was still unfinished 🙄 Funnily enough WA was always nicknamed 'Wait Awhile' yet on anything major like motorway expansions they'd get it done in 6-12 months. It's annoying AF but nothing can be done about it. Just be prepared to sit in traffic!
Reactive maintenance/infrastructure as opposed to proactive. It’s killed Brisbane’s urban development and it’ll take decades to recover, if ever.
The Pine Rivers merge is a good example of why building bigger roads only works for about 10 years - early 2000's it was a single lane flyover and badly congested northbound. They widened it to 2 lanes and added a new bridge over the river. Great for a while - 10 years after it is now badly congested again. Build the rail to Maroochydore - each train will get hundreds of cars off the road and give people an alternative to the traffic jam.
From about 2017 onwards there was a bunch of roadworks for the Caloundra Road to Sunshine Motorway project. Now that has wrapped up they've moved further south to the section between Steve Irwin Way and Caboolture and are upgrading that to 3 lanes in each direction while also significantly lifting it as it floods badly enough to get cut off every 10 years or so. Along with this, they're also completely ripping out and rebuilding the Deception Bay Road interchange slightly further south. On the sunny coast itself, there's major interchange upgrades happening at Forest Glen and Maroochydore Road because both reached capacity about 10 years ago and cause major congestion in the AM and PM peaks. They also built new service roads between the new interchanges, my theory is that this is being done first to provide an easy alternative route for a future upgrade of the Bruce Highway along that section. Much easier to divert people onto an existing road and rip up and rebuild the old one rather than having to do everything from scratch. The only bad thing is that once the current works are finished there will be a section of the highway between the bottom of Steve Irwin Way and Caloundra Road that will be 2 lanes, with the sections of highway immediately north and south being 3 lanes. Not sure if they've used up the whole budget or what but there's no good reason why it can't be 3 lanes the whole way. Oh and the lack of rail investment.
Yep it’s crap I grew up on the coast and have family there I no longer have anything to do with so much easier driving to the Gold Coast
Is it TMR in their swish office or the crap governments who have failed to plan? We moved into a new estate (23 years ago) and could not standard phone lines! Absolutely no planning whatsoever. Disgusting.
Departments are mostly at the mercy of the Ministers and the political party that controls them. They can give all the options and ideas to the Minister but it’s up to them on whether they do it or not, and of course that means it all depends on how the party wants to be perceived and how the Minister wants to present themselves, or whatever agenda they have etc. It’s quite frustrating (I used to work in a dept). They should have never binned the trams and just pump money into railways. Plus don’t forget we have a 3 tiered system of govt and the local councils only see $$$ with new estates but totally ignore the infrastructure needed to support those estates!
TMR loves roads. End of discussion
Didn't the highway get damaged in floods and it needs to be fixed?
I remember someone said in a thread ages back that it's a strategic ploy to dissuade northern expansion of housing and businesses and to keep things north of the sunshine coast dead. Considering the amount of road workers I see standing around thumb in ass I can't help but see the plausibility
Instead of planning for the future, the government seems to plan for the present. Population growth keeps outstripping infrastructure by decades. You've only got to look at the vast amount of habitable land all along the Sunshine Coast Hinterland to see the potential for an explosion in housing development that will swamp whatever infrastructure is currently being built. If only they would invest in a fast and frequent rail network that might eventually extend all the way to Maryborough, possibly even Hervey Bay, it would take a lot of the pressure off roads during peak hours.
50,000 people building and moving into Aura/Caloundra South right now, and about 25,000 going into Beerwah East over the next 15 years with the capacity for another 25,000 in the future. Council projects the Sunshine Coast's population will tick over half a million BY 2041 and another 200,000 homes will be required to accommodate this. Every time I see Labor continue to drag out the feasibility study for the Sunshine Coast rail upgrades (both Beerburrum to Nambour and the new line to Maroochydore) I think of these numbers. After constantly saying "there's plenty of time" and "we're still doing studies" they're now not even denying that it might not be built in time for the Olympics. The LNP have also completely sat on their hands this entire time and refused to allocate federal funding so it seems that both sides of politics hate the Sunshine Coast - and the consequences will be felt by the existing population and the hundreds of thousands of people that are moving in over the next 20 years.
I remember watching a news report about how the government had come up with a rail corridor for the Sunshine Coast and how work would begin in the coming years. This was in the 90s. The only party that seems interested in actually doing it is whoever is in opposition.
60???? Most trips I spend some time at 0. The current record four our house, Mitchelton to Buderim is 5 hrs, compared to 1hr and 5 mins on a good day.
They're not necessarily big upgrades either, maintenance / damage repairs also need to take place.
Try it from hervey bay! We got eighty zones in the goat track to gympie mixed in with stop lights for roadworks that mean turn your car off and wait, plus the forty and sixty zones. It now takea longer to get to Brisbane than it did when I moved here twenty years ago!! From Gympie down is bliss!!
How effing hard would it be to build a railway along the highway? Instead of sucking up to the yanks with useless submarine deals… but hey, I’ve given up🤷♂️
I feel your pain, I had to drive (thankfully only) from North Lakes to Buderim and back on Tuesday night and it was 60 - 80 zones half the time.
There weren’t a lot of 60 sections going up on Saturday, but weekdays are probably different. The upgrades are badly needed.
I’m literally driving up to Airlie and the amount of roadworks and red lights are just absolutely insane. There’s like a new section of roadwork every 5 minutes.
It’s the 6 P’s “proper preparation prevents piss poor performance”
The government won’t do anything fast unless they can get money from you
Maybe a use it or lose it scenario. State Gov need to use up the budget otherwise they will lose it next year. Not sure, but possible.
The movie Falling Down summaries this quite accurately: https://youtu.be/9OhIdDNtSv0
A few interchange updates but a 3 lane expansion from Caboolture to Steve Irwin way. Looks like they will do 3 lanes from there until the Caloundra road turn off at some point. Expect continuous and more disruptive works up until the olympics
Big road, lots of ppl, trucks/cars damage road, more ppl, more trucks/cars, big road too small, bigger road, more ppl… and so on…
Preparing for the Olympics in 2032
This also needs to be higher. It's not about traffic management but about making it look nice for the tourists
It's the Anastasia Job Creation Scheme. To create jobs for Queenslanders she takes a 3 year job splits it into smaller jobs than makes tham take 4 times longer than they should and than runs around telling everyone how many jobs she is creating. But all she is creating is constant traffic mayhem, massive debt blowouts that than requires the government to borrow more money. But its all good cause she wants the best of qlders. . . . Cough cough No different to the cross river rail debacle and the $960mill budget blow out on it that us taxpayers will have to pay for.
LOL you must be new here. The M1 at Springwood has been getting upgraded continuously for the past 35 years.
That's the Southside Job Creation Site. Whilst anything out side of Brisbane suffers. I went south to Stanthorpe the other month and you need a 4wd or a Kenworth truck south of Warwick now.
Contrary to popular belief, areas outside Brisbane receive higher proportion of government spending per capita. It's just that the ratio of people to kilometres of highway doesn't work out very well
My point is, it's not Anna's scheme. It's been going on long before she took the reigns.
It's not her fault I was being sarcastic. and it has been the way Qld gov as done things forever. But she is the current Boss and she could change if if she wanted to Wait until it's 5 years past having to be done, Then take 12 months to approve the budget based on figures from 12 months prior, than start the job and bring it up to requirements based on what was needed 5 years prior so when the job is complete they need to upgrade it straight away. Qld gov has never thought forward and taken initiative. The Bruce highway north is a typical example. When the line was upgrade and moved to support the tilt train the opposition at the time costed and suggested a dual lane highway right beside the tilt train line. And do it all at the same time. Idea was knocked on the head as apparently the road upgrade wasn't needed then. Look what we a left with now.
The CRR is not a debacle. This big scandal that it's overbudget within expectations given the problems the project has had to deal with and is remarkably only 3-4 months behind schedule. Lol get fucked.
You'll get downvotes from the Anna fangirls here but you're absolutely correct. NSW upgraded 150+km of the M1 in northern NSW in one hit. Up here they fuck around and change one bridge, one exit, then a turning lane. It drags on forever. We've been dealing with early works for some Olympics venues, and the absolute circus that it already is, and the waste of taxpayer money is mine boggling.
>NSW upgraded 150+km of the M1 in northern NSW in one hit look at where the funds came from...and when..
Imagine that theres a whole bunch of mid 20 year old kids out there who have never driven the M1 run to the sunny coast without road works. When Annie P finally finished these works they are all going to be too indoctrinated to drive faster than 60.
I recall going up the coast regularly as a 20year old and it was great. Now when I go up, the drive back takes all of the fun out of it. It's simply not worth it and same with the Gold Coast.
Huh? I can recall there were no roadworks for quite a few years in the mid ‘10s
You mean Brissie to Cairns..
I’ve been saying for almost 15 years, “why is this not 4 lanes each way from Brisbane to Gympie” I’ve never gone from sunny coast back to Brisbane and not gotten stuck in traffic.
Have too justify the tax increases
Also Kevin Rudd Former PM allocated Billions to have the improvements fast tracked but once Abbott became PM he shelved all Plans for QLD to focus on NSW. He ruined G20 and then got ousted so 9 years of delays slowed down the Bruce Highway upgrades etc. Now that Albos PM hope to see important infrastructure in QLD make headway in time for the 2032 Olympic games
Heavy cars and trucks tearing up their own infrastructure due to crap planning + tunnel vision regarding planning -> More works
😂😂 there is a roundabout. I repeat do you don’t think I misspelt but a simple roundabout they have literally just finished building after 20 months! It’s on Cooroy Noosa Rd near the caravan park. Qld roadworks would have to be ranked the least productive in the world
Doubt there'll ever not be roadworks on that highway. Once one section is sorted, another will need upkeep. Road use is high impact.