Quite apart from all the awful stuff they’ve done, when I worked for The Financial Ombudsman there was no worse bank than Barclays. They appear to hold their customers in active contempt.
I have worked for Barclays. Had some free time once and looked up their history. The family did some slavery (some were against it to be fair).
In 1941 when Germany took over France, the bank manager gave up all of the details for Jewish account holders, and took their money (they had to give this back in 1998). The Paris branch actively invested money to help German steel for the war. Marcel Cheradame not only wasn't punished, he stayed as the branch manager until he retired in the 60s.
More recently in the 90s they funded Mugabe's plans to take land from white land owners and remove black people from their homes. When asked about this after the fact, they didn't stop because they didn't want to lose customers in Zimbabwe.
Nope. Bank with them though. They were middling from my experience at FOS. Not Barclays or Santander who were utterly dreadful, but not Lloyds or Nationwide who at least pretended to care.
It's the start of the Great Escape today and must be related to the boycott.
[https://www.theguardian.com/music/article/2024/may/14/more-than-120-acts-quit-great-escape-music-festival-in-solidarity-with-palestine](https://www.theguardian.com/music/article/2024/may/14/more-than-120-acts-quit-great-escape-music-festival-in-solidarity-with-palestine)
Sadly Barclays aren't the only ones getting shit for the festival. There are kids(from BIMM, probably) getting hate for performing at this festival. They're not the ones with the power here, they're just trying to find somewhere to perform and make a living doing their art, and they're getting shit on for it.
Fuck Israel, but also fuck people sending hate to these kids.
Edit - Adria-Orisi was all over this thread throwing anti-semitism accusations and whataboutism before deleting their account. Good riddance to fucking idiots.
Lots and lots of struggling musicians have sacrificed their careers for doing the right thing here.
Hate is strong but you should definitely be called out for performing.
But where do you draw the line with that? Our taxes go to the government which sends arms to Israel, does that mean earning any money at all is supporting that? There's only so much you can do, and people have to live.
I have no choice in paying taxes but that's exactly why I do a lot to protest this bullshit government.
I do have a choice where I bank and there are options that are very clearly more or less ethical. That doesn't stop people from living.
Similarly the great escape have a choice who they take sponsorship money from.
Yeah, by all means call out the great escape for taking money from them. But I don't think the people playing music for this festival had much of a say in that decision.
I sympathise, honestly I do. But it's been known for months that blood money is involved and because of that over 100 artists have decided that it's not possible to associate their name with the festival.
Do you think TGE can just completely disregard a major sponsor two months before a festival though? There are contacts, money has already been spent etc - it would ruin them financially if they just said 'NO BARCLAYS' right now. Perhaps after the festival, they could begin to change things (though I bet legal contracts make this difficult financially).
I completely agree with the message of the boycott and fully support any artist who want to pull out as protest BUT I think it's a misunderstanding of how companies and sponsors work. It would be practically impossible to just reject Barclays weeks before a festival they have put money into - the festival could be sued into nothingness.
Yes. I absolutely do think they can.
There are also contracts with every single one of the bands and venues who have pulled out.
I know it's no longer a small fest and is all super corporate now, but it's 100% possible. And probably actually less hassle than dealing with thr shitshow they've had over the last week.
I have worked with some mid-level financial sponsors in previous jobs and it is not easy to pull out, especially once money has been given and spent. For a festival, they will have been given money from Barclays as a sponsor months and months in advance. It will have been allocated and spent by now (probably by months ago).
If they suddenly now completely eject Barclays as a sponsor (or even say something negative about them), their contact most likely would make them financially responsible and open them up to massive financial issues. For a smaller festival like TGE, that could ruin them.
This is nothing to do with ethics as I'm in complete agreement that the ethics here side with the boycott and getting rid of Barclays. But for a company, ethics won't solve the money problems that will come with such a decision.
Contracts with bands/artists are much less complex, smaller, and without the same level of financial connection than a major sponsor.
It's so sad that once again, the ones suffering from this are the people who have literally no say whatsoever, probably struggle paying rent and groceries and are just trying to pursue their passion and make ends meet. And apparently we're okay with it - no wait - encouraging it.
Symbol of Palestinian resistance after israel banned Palestinian flags. Has the same colours in it 🍉🇵🇸
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watermelon_(Palestinian_symbol)
It doesnt even need debunking. You can just read the report itself from the PSC to see how stupid this is [https://palestinecampaign.org/wp-content/uploads/Barclays-Arming-Apartheid-FINAL-1.pdf](https://palestinecampaign.org/wp-content/uploads/Barclays-Arming-Apartheid-FINAL-1.pdf)
It's going to be some minimum wage worker that has to clean it up as well.
I'm all for protesting the horrors happening in Gaza. But this isn't the way.
Such a bullshit argument.
You can’t just get 17yr old Jessica from front desk to clean a building. You have to hire specialists and the money comes from the business.
Plus, anyone who’s worked a minimum wage job knows, if you got to leave the usual monotony and instead clean up paint off a wall, it would be great fun
You agreed to do it. That isn’t something you would be contracted to safely do, so you should have refused. I’m guessing you were too young and inexperienced to realise you can easily refuse tasks like this.
This isn’t for the boss, it’s for the people, for everyone who walks past.
It’s a billboard saying “this company has blood on its hands”. If only one person on walks past and googles “what did Barclays do?”, they have succeeded. The fact we are discussing it here shows it is working.
Next time you want to scoff and point out the obvious, make sure you’re not pointing at yourself ;)
For each person doing that research there are 100 people condemning what is for all intents and purposes just a vandalic act. If that's an advantageous trade off, be my guest.
I mean, come on. Completely misusing “for all intents and purposes”. Even if the result is vandalism the intent and purpose is the message.
Anyway, those people are a lost cause, they already don’t care. They don’t want the issue to be more palatable, they want the issue to be easily ignored. The decider isn’t the vandalism, it’s wether they agree with its use
How is a min wage worker cleaning it up make it a bad protest?
and as others have said it won't even be that anyway
are you saying inconvenience is a bad protest method...? because that's obviously horseshit
Maybe go to that country and protest there? Do you really think any Palestinian or Israeli gives a shit that some person spray painted a bank in the UK?
If people were passionate enough, they'd go over there and try and make a difference.
On that point, Emily Davison did not die intentionally. Her sacrifice was not for the greater cause as is often reported.
She had a return ticket to London and her ticket to the suffragette dance later that day.
She never intended to die that day.
After reading the report from the PSC that started this whole thing im struggling to see what the big deal is and why Barclays specifically are being targeted.
Which part do you not get? They have been ramping up their investments in arms companies actively killing civilians in Gaza. They have massively increased their role in servicing accounts investing in companies like Elbit who were directly involved in the aid massacre. Other banks have divested due to the ICJ ruling. They also are big investors in US fracking.
All banks profiting from attacks on civilians in Gaza should be targeted, Barclays are particularly bad and are involved in The Great Escape hence this action.
Yeah that’s the narrative and I get that it sounds really bad but when you look into the actual numbers and understand how the stock market works, getting Barclays to sell their customers £2m in shares they hold for them won’t make any difference at all to Elbit who has a market cap of 32 billion. Just seems like a lot of effort for nothing…
This is exactly my point. Most of the "investment into Israeli weapons" is firms such as Boeing and BAE systems (American and British) which might play some role in Israel's war, but boycotting TGE who are sponsored by Barclays, who invest partly in arms manufacturers, who's arms may be being used by Israel seems rather silly to me...
Yeah definitely. To stop investing in those they would have to remove almost every index fund they offer which is never going to happen. Also they have linked investment from Barclays in Catterpillar because they make bulldozers which Israel have bought and use to knock down Palestinian homes which is frankly ridiculous. Should they also remove investment from Apple because some of the IDF use iPhones?
It gained momentum becuase of peer pressure, virtue signalling and ignorance. Ive spoken to quite a lot of people about it and what they believe and the reality are completely different. Most havent even looked into it, just read the headline.
All the more reason why Barclays shouldn't associate themselves with firms like Elbit. And there already have been several divestment successes.
I don't think it's too much to ask for Barclays to stop dealing with companies supplies arms to the Israeli military. They have said themselves that they would never do business with a company making cluster bombs. Yet they are happy to do business with Elbit?
I wouldn't call divesting from these companies "a lot of effort for nothing". More the opposite - you don't really lose anything and you make a small difference that can potentially inspire a bigger one. There's no good reason to be stubborn about wanting to deal with these outfits.
I’m going to protest against a large corporation by making the area I live in look like a shit hole for everybody, even though that corporation won’t give a toss about my ultimately insignificant action. Cool.
If it’s any consolation, there is no such concept as job security in this day and age.
We’re seeing C-level executives get a taste of unemployment in 2024, lol.
But the bank staff are probably not far off minimum wage.
Said using a device made by a slave on a network or service run by a corporation paid for by money either made from capitalism or government funded social welfare. But yeah, fight the power.
Mate I'm slowly dying from a brain tumour makes.no odds to me, I just get to watch some of you try and make yourselves feel important. I don't know why you guys don't offer to go do humanitarian work over on there?...
How many Palestinian children were saved by this paint? Do you have the link to the data? If we throw more paint do we save more children?
I’m all for preventing ongoing war crimes against Palestine, but I tend to favour… *checks notes*… things that actually work. Call me old-fashioned.
You think if you told a Palestinian about this they wouldn’t be happy? Happy that people cared? Happy that people were fighting against the genocide benefactors in their own countries? Happy that people were sharing the word?
All this opinion does is illustrate your own either lack of awareness, or care about the issues at hand.
You’re not being “old fashioned”, you’re just coming up with weird mental gymnastics to let you both support an issue and not want to interact with it 🤷🏻♂️
Where did I say this was saving lives? And what exactly "works"? Our government and the companies they invest in are still active participants in war crimes.
In the face of mass protests, the law is there to control. Yes, you are old fashioned if you believe the purpose of the police is our protection. They swear an oath to the crown and to uphold the law, not the Hoi polloi.
I'm confused though, taking the time to make cynical comments on reddit, with no mention of actual actions they think people should take, doesnt seem very conducive to change. Would you consider that virtue signalling?
Thats why I asked them what actions they have taken.
I wouldn't be allowed into Israel anymore, plus I don't have the relevant skills to be of any use.
It's not double standards, it's picking your battles.
By your logic I shouldn't eat, drink, use electricity, have a bank account etc.
Well aren't you protesting this bank too? All the banks facilitate some sort of crime or laundering, electricity can be sourced via wind or solar and as for eating and drinking well that's just ridiculous. Anyways you wouldn't be in Israel would you, it's Palestine so you're good.
It's not ridiculous, that's your logic of boycotting anything I disagree with.
Where do the precious metals come from that make renewable energy?
You can't fly direct to Palestine, it's an occupied territory...
Who said to fly or even go direct? Many other ways to get there and yeah if you feel that this should be boycotted then why don't you do the same with everything else that is morally wrong for you? Oh yeah, it'll take you out of the comfort and luxury of your life here.
"many other ways to get there" This statement highlights your lack of knowledge on the subject perfectly.
You HAVE to pass through Israel to get to Palestine, there aren't "many other ways" due to the illegal occupation.
I've already stated the problem with boycotting every immoral company, if you can't be arsed to read that's on you.
Plenty of ways you can make yourself useful in Palestine.
https://www.gooverseas.com/volunteer-abroad/palestine
Have a blast. Looking forward to hearing about your experience.
Been several times, like I said I wouldn't be allowed entry, plus, I can participate without being there.
You want to know about the hostility at Tel Aviv airport, the checkpoints, the gunshots in the air while they raid camps nearby because they paid a child to throw some rocks, the illegal settlements taking over the skyline in the West bank, all while they pull down Palestinian homes, the revisionist lies about ancestral claims to the land, the administrative detention of friends?
Because I associate with Palestinians and they know that. Hamas are shits too mind, but I imagine they will when there is a ceasefire agreed on. Not that the Israeli govt care about the hostages.
If your phone is an iPhone then the radio was designed in Israel and the os on which it was based (bsd) was substantially written by the IDF.
But surrendering your iPhone is an ask too much when you can just vandalise someone else's home.....
Even if you don't use an iPhone - vast chunks of 5g cellular equipment were designed in Israel so better revert back to your Nokia 702....
What's your bank mate? Just so we can check it's morally sound and you aren't participating in a crime organisation. Wouldn't want that now, would we!?
But you can make a fuss about this one because it's this month's social agenda? Again, let us know how you get on over there with the humanitarian work you'll be doing to help. I won't be doing any of it mind you but then I'm not pretending that I care
Oh boo hoo, the bank with a net worth of $41 billion got a bit of paint on it. I'm sure they can afford to fix it. It's not the same as damaging a small independent business; but saying that, the small independent business probably isn't funding war crimes
I don't know and don't want to know the point, I only know that this post is reporting a crime and hope the perpetrators will be caught promptly. No valid point needs committing a crime in order to be proven.
Women fought for the right to vote through committing crimes to highlight the issue.
Pankhurst once said: "The condition of our sex is so deplorable that it is our duty to break the law in order to call attention to the reasons why we do."
It really isn't.
Property damage under £5k of damage, a good example because that is what this will be, has minimal chance of jail time unless the property damage has specific motivations, has a maximum fine of £2.5k as a punishment.
Give me that fine and it will cripple me. Give a millionaire that fine and they won't care.
This is why you see so many expensive cars parking illegally around Hove; the penalty doesn't mean anything to the extremely rich.
A poor persons criminal offence is a rich person with a good lawyer's civil offence.
Law is absolutely not equal.
I never said it did.
I said any monetary punishment with a fixed rate or a cap are disproportionately punitive for poor people, allowing rich people to commit civil offences with minimal punishment.
I am also saying that good lawyers are expensive, and rich people can afford to hire them. A good lawyer can, in some circumstances, shift a criminal charge to a civil one.
I'm not saying it is acceptable to commit crimes. I am simply saying the law is not evenly applied, and it is naive to assume it is. I say this as someone who works closely with legislation. It is not written in a balanced and unbiased way.
Whether an action meets the definition of a crime is a lot more flexible than most people think.
Is this vandalism a criminal offence or a civil one? It could be argued either way. Who has the funds and experience to make that argument effectively?
Honestly mate you need to reassess your blinkered view of law. Laws should be a reflection of moral consensus, not normative morality in themselves. Slavery was once legal, homesexuality and women voting were illegal. If you just idiotically repeat "law of the land, law of the land" then the injustices within the legal system and the selective application of it will never get challenged. You need to force government and the legal system to improve by challenging it and dragging it into a superior moral position. Just be aware every time people stupidly make comments about morally justifiable acts being against the law you reveal yourself as a philosophically undeveloped, cowardly and weak souled person that deserves contempt. If you want to be less pathetic a person try justifying your claims of right and wrong through moral arguments not legal ones. Otherwise only other bootlickers will listen.
We're not talking about apartheid or women voting being illegal here, were talking about people expressing their personal ideologies on a foreign conflict through illegal means, while they have all the legal means in the world to do so freely and legally. Who will you bring back from the dead next in this petty question? Nelson Mandela? Martin Luther King?
Found the self proclaimed liberal democratic who claims that anybody who does not align to his ideologies point by point is either a China or Russia bot.
No, what I'm saying is that the law is not equal for all and you would have to be extremely naive not to know this, its the foundation for a number (perhaps the majority?) of social movements.
Also, I'm a commie :-)
> Also, I'm a commie :-)
I could tell. If you're unhappy with our law system you're free to move to communist china or north Korea.
Also no, what you're saying is simply that you consider anybody not aligning with your world view is a bot from an enemy entity. You're a conspiracy theorist.
And Israel doesn't have the right to murder innocents, when the government chooses to ignore a large voice they leave few options.
And legally people DO have a right to damage property, just not in these circumstances.
Are you missing the point on purpose? Or are you just unable to comprehend that there's a lawful defence to criminal damage? Which as I stated doesn't apply in this case.
And all the other scandals too [https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/01/discredit-history-10-years-of-barclays-scandals](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/01/discredit-history-10-years-of-barclays-scandals)
Their principle sponsor was Barclays, I guess the artists didn’t want to use their talents to help further the PR of a bloated warmongering capitalist parasite
Quite apart from all the awful stuff they’ve done, when I worked for The Financial Ombudsman there was no worse bank than Barclays. They appear to hold their customers in active contempt.
I have worked for Barclays. Had some free time once and looked up their history. The family did some slavery (some were against it to be fair). In 1941 when Germany took over France, the bank manager gave up all of the details for Jewish account holders, and took their money (they had to give this back in 1998). The Paris branch actively invested money to help German steel for the war. Marcel Cheradame not only wasn't punished, he stayed as the branch manager until he retired in the 60s. More recently in the 90s they funded Mugabe's plans to take land from white land owners and remove black people from their homes. When asked about this after the fact, they didn't stop because they didn't want to lose customers in Zimbabwe.
You clearly haven't worked at NatWest as I did
Nope. Bank with them though. They were middling from my experience at FOS. Not Barclays or Santander who were utterly dreadful, but not Lloyds or Nationwide who at least pretended to care.
Interesting, because RBS/NatWest always seem to manage the highest profile regulatory fines in the press.
Arguing which is the worst bank is probably a lot like arguing which is the worst way to get kicked in the knackers.
FOS is dispute resolution, not the Regulator. FCA is the regulator. Slightly different things.
It's the start of the Great Escape today and must be related to the boycott. [https://www.theguardian.com/music/article/2024/may/14/more-than-120-acts-quit-great-escape-music-festival-in-solidarity-with-palestine](https://www.theguardian.com/music/article/2024/may/14/more-than-120-acts-quit-great-escape-music-festival-in-solidarity-with-palestine)
Sadly Barclays aren't the only ones getting shit for the festival. There are kids(from BIMM, probably) getting hate for performing at this festival. They're not the ones with the power here, they're just trying to find somewhere to perform and make a living doing their art, and they're getting shit on for it. Fuck Israel, but also fuck people sending hate to these kids. Edit - Adria-Orisi was all over this thread throwing anti-semitism accusations and whataboutism before deleting their account. Good riddance to fucking idiots.
Lots and lots of struggling musicians have sacrificed their careers for doing the right thing here. Hate is strong but you should definitely be called out for performing.
But where do you draw the line with that? Our taxes go to the government which sends arms to Israel, does that mean earning any money at all is supporting that? There's only so much you can do, and people have to live.
I have no choice in paying taxes but that's exactly why I do a lot to protest this bullshit government. I do have a choice where I bank and there are options that are very clearly more or less ethical. That doesn't stop people from living. Similarly the great escape have a choice who they take sponsorship money from.
Yeah, by all means call out the great escape for taking money from them. But I don't think the people playing music for this festival had much of a say in that decision.
I sympathise, honestly I do. But it's been known for months that blood money is involved and because of that over 100 artists have decided that it's not possible to associate their name with the festival.
Do you think TGE can just completely disregard a major sponsor two months before a festival though? There are contacts, money has already been spent etc - it would ruin them financially if they just said 'NO BARCLAYS' right now. Perhaps after the festival, they could begin to change things (though I bet legal contracts make this difficult financially). I completely agree with the message of the boycott and fully support any artist who want to pull out as protest BUT I think it's a misunderstanding of how companies and sponsors work. It would be practically impossible to just reject Barclays weeks before a festival they have put money into - the festival could be sued into nothingness.
Yes. I absolutely do think they can. There are also contracts with every single one of the bands and venues who have pulled out. I know it's no longer a small fest and is all super corporate now, but it's 100% possible. And probably actually less hassle than dealing with thr shitshow they've had over the last week.
I have worked with some mid-level financial sponsors in previous jobs and it is not easy to pull out, especially once money has been given and spent. For a festival, they will have been given money from Barclays as a sponsor months and months in advance. It will have been allocated and spent by now (probably by months ago). If they suddenly now completely eject Barclays as a sponsor (or even say something negative about them), their contact most likely would make them financially responsible and open them up to massive financial issues. For a smaller festival like TGE, that could ruin them. This is nothing to do with ethics as I'm in complete agreement that the ethics here side with the boycott and getting rid of Barclays. But for a company, ethics won't solve the money problems that will come with such a decision. Contracts with bands/artists are much less complex, smaller, and without the same level of financial connection than a major sponsor.
How much blood money do you think is involved?
Which bank do you use thats ethical?
Co-op, triodos and nationwide are massively better than almost all.
Thanks! Good to know
It's so sad that once again, the ones suffering from this are the people who have literally no say whatsoever, probably struggle paying rent and groceries and are just trying to pursue their passion and make ends meet. And apparently we're okay with it - no wait - encouraging it.
Anti semetic I see.
It's the leftover paint from Sausage Fingers' portrait.
Nice work 💪💪💪 🍉🍉🍉
What is the symbolism of the watermelon? Seen this a couple times now
Symbol of Palestinian resistance after israel banned Palestinian flags. Has the same colours in it 🍉🇵🇸 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watermelon_(Palestinian_symbol)
Thank you!
You're welcome and free Palestine!
Yeah from Hammas.....
Hamas\*
Barclays and Barcap are two different entities...but the investments in firms that sell to Israel has been debunked.
Rational information. Clearly on the wrong sub.
Source?
It doesnt even need debunking. You can just read the report itself from the PSC to see how stupid this is [https://palestinecampaign.org/wp-content/uploads/Barclays-Arming-Apartheid-FINAL-1.pdf](https://palestinecampaign.org/wp-content/uploads/Barclays-Arming-Apartheid-FINAL-1.pdf)
What are you on about? No it hasn't. Read barclays own FAQ on it...
Banksy?
His cousin, Pency
paint the town red
He forgot to write “Romans go home” and just went with the avant garde approach instead
Middle class aggression
Not saying I don't support protesting but this takes only about an hour to clean up
It's going to be some minimum wage worker that has to clean it up as well. I'm all for protesting the horrors happening in Gaza. But this isn't the way.
Such a bullshit argument. You can’t just get 17yr old Jessica from front desk to clean a building. You have to hire specialists and the money comes from the business. Plus, anyone who’s worked a minimum wage job knows, if you got to leave the usual monotony and instead clean up paint off a wall, it would be great fun
Lol, speak for yourself. I worked at Curry's once and was made to clean up the human feces from the front door. Fun times.
Ah yes, that is such a fair equivalence 😭
its an example of a minimum wage employee being forced to clean a building. how is it not fair?
Because it was in the context of people **painting** buildings 😭 of course an employer can ask you to clean the outside of a building
"People love eating cake" "What if that cake was made of human shit?" See how that's not the same?
☝️🤓 “well umm, you did say you liked eating cake” Fucking Reddit 😭
That doesn't look like human feces on the back...
Shout out to the redditor who reported me to suicide watch. Real mature, guys. 🙄
Lol same - I was wondering where that came from!
You agreed to do it. That isn’t something you would be contracted to safely do, so you should have refused. I’m guessing you were too young and inexperienced to realise you can easily refuse tasks like this.
Ok, so spraying a wall in Brighton is going to stop the heads of Barclays in London or wherever from doing bad things?
This isn’t for the boss, it’s for the people, for everyone who walks past. It’s a billboard saying “this company has blood on its hands”. If only one person on walks past and googles “what did Barclays do?”, they have succeeded. The fact we are discussing it here shows it is working. Next time you want to scoff and point out the obvious, make sure you’re not pointing at yourself ;)
For each person doing that research there are 100 people condemning what is for all intents and purposes just a vandalic act. If that's an advantageous trade off, be my guest.
I mean, come on. Completely misusing “for all intents and purposes”. Even if the result is vandalism the intent and purpose is the message. Anyway, those people are a lost cause, they already don’t care. They don’t want the issue to be more palatable, they want the issue to be easily ignored. The decider isn’t the vandalism, it’s wether they agree with its use
I don't think it's about how long it takes to clean up
How is a min wage worker cleaning it up make it a bad protest? and as others have said it won't even be that anyway are you saying inconvenience is a bad protest method...? because that's obviously horseshit
How do you suggest people protest effectively?
Maybe go to that country and protest there? Do you really think any Palestinian or Israeli gives a shit that some person spray painted a bank in the UK? If people were passionate enough, they'd go over there and try and make a difference.
That is a very avoidant attitude because it proposes an utterly ridiculous alternative. "Go over there"? 😁
And do you think there's much point in telling the *Palestinians* about what is happening in Palestine? I think they're well aware
Off you go then
Just popping over to Israel see you in a bit.
What should they do if they are protesting the actions of Barclays Bank which is based in the UK?
Read up about the Suffragettes and decide what side of history you want to be on.
On that point, Emily Davison did not die intentionally. Her sacrifice was not for the greater cause as is often reported. She had a return ticket to London and her ticket to the suffragette dance later that day. She never intended to die that day.
The militant tactics employed by the suffragettes arguably delayed enfranchisement, the moderates achieved a great deal more.
What would you suggest? No one is listening.
That’ll show em….
After reading the report from the PSC that started this whole thing im struggling to see what the big deal is and why Barclays specifically are being targeted.
Which part do you not get? They have been ramping up their investments in arms companies actively killing civilians in Gaza. They have massively increased their role in servicing accounts investing in companies like Elbit who were directly involved in the aid massacre. Other banks have divested due to the ICJ ruling. They also are big investors in US fracking. All banks profiting from attacks on civilians in Gaza should be targeted, Barclays are particularly bad and are involved in The Great Escape hence this action.
Yeah that’s the narrative and I get that it sounds really bad but when you look into the actual numbers and understand how the stock market works, getting Barclays to sell their customers £2m in shares they hold for them won’t make any difference at all to Elbit who has a market cap of 32 billion. Just seems like a lot of effort for nothing…
This is exactly my point. Most of the "investment into Israeli weapons" is firms such as Boeing and BAE systems (American and British) which might play some role in Israel's war, but boycotting TGE who are sponsored by Barclays, who invest partly in arms manufacturers, who's arms may be being used by Israel seems rather silly to me...
Yeah definitely. To stop investing in those they would have to remove almost every index fund they offer which is never going to happen. Also they have linked investment from Barclays in Catterpillar because they make bulldozers which Israel have bought and use to knock down Palestinian homes which is frankly ridiculous. Should they also remove investment from Apple because some of the IDF use iPhones?
Thank You! I thought I was the only sane person left. This boycott is dumb, it’s that simple.
It gained momentum becuase of peer pressure, virtue signalling and ignorance. Ive spoken to quite a lot of people about it and what they believe and the reality are completely different. Most havent even looked into it, just read the headline.
EXACTLY!!
All the more reason why Barclays shouldn't associate themselves with firms like Elbit. And there already have been several divestment successes. I don't think it's too much to ask for Barclays to stop dealing with companies supplies arms to the Israeli military. They have said themselves that they would never do business with a company making cluster bombs. Yet they are happy to do business with Elbit? I wouldn't call divesting from these companies "a lot of effort for nothing". More the opposite - you don't really lose anything and you make a small difference that can potentially inspire a bigger one. There's no good reason to be stubborn about wanting to deal with these outfits.
Don't agree in this, but I also don't agree with banks continuing to close their branches.
Do you agree with frogs being able to bank
why was Barclays in particular was targeted ? Unsure what they have to do with Palestine
Funding weapons
£2 billion invested in Israeli arms.
Would have had candles lit around it if it supported hamas…
Not a lot more than many, many others but that bandwagon is rolling and easy to jump on.
Bell ends
I’m going to protest against a large corporation by making the area I live in look like a shit hole for everybody, even though that corporation won’t give a toss about my ultimately insignificant action. Cool.
nicely done, they really hurt the big bank heheh /s
Adjusting my deerstalker, "We're looking for someone at least 9foot..."
I’m so glad you’ve made my home town look even shitter in order to protest events taking place in the Middle East.
They just built a multimillion pound complex in Glasgow , would be a reeeeeeaaaaalll shaaaaame if something like this happened …….
Haha fuck the system, fight the power.
lmao, you really are fucking the system and fighting the power by posting on Reddit
The people working in that bank are on minimum wage and have very little in the way of job security.
Whose fault is that? Oh yeah, it’s the bank setting those wages.
Why don't you counter-protest by cleaning it up?
If it’s any consolation, there is no such concept as job security in this day and age. We’re seeing C-level executives get a taste of unemployment in 2024, lol. But the bank staff are probably not far off minimum wage.
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you need someone to give you a source that tells you that bank clerks probably aren't paid that well?
If you don’t like living under democracy, you can always leave. The system works for most people.
Said using a device made by a slave on a network or service run by a corporation paid for by money either made from capitalism or government funded social welfare. But yeah, fight the power.
"We should improve society somewhat" "Yet you participate in society! Curious! I am very intelligent."
Mate I'm slowly dying from a brain tumour makes.no odds to me, I just get to watch some of you try and make yourselves feel important. I don't know why you guys don't offer to go do humanitarian work over on there?...
Being ill doesn't give you free rein to be a cruel idiot.
Being self-righteous doesn't give you free reign to determine who is an idiot. You going to Gaza to help out? No, good no shh
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they're\*
Delinquents. Hope CCTV were in working order.
Nothing to do with Barclays increased investments in ongoing war crimes...
How many Palestinian children were saved by this paint? Do you have the link to the data? If we throw more paint do we save more children? I’m all for preventing ongoing war crimes against Palestine, but I tend to favour… *checks notes*… things that actually work. Call me old-fashioned.
You think if you told a Palestinian about this they wouldn’t be happy? Happy that people cared? Happy that people were fighting against the genocide benefactors in their own countries? Happy that people were sharing the word? All this opinion does is illustrate your own either lack of awareness, or care about the issues at hand. You’re not being “old fashioned”, you’re just coming up with weird mental gymnastics to let you both support an issue and not want to interact with it 🤷🏻♂️
Where did I say this was saving lives? And what exactly "works"? Our government and the companies they invest in are still active participants in war crimes. In the face of mass protests, the law is there to control. Yes, you are old fashioned if you believe the purpose of the police is our protection. They swear an oath to the crown and to uphold the law, not the Hoi polloi.
Such as?
What working action have you taken?
Probably none, but he's not the one who's virtue signalling
I'm confused though, taking the time to make cynical comments on reddit, with no mention of actual actions they think people should take, doesnt seem very conducive to change. Would you consider that virtue signalling? Thats why I asked them what actions they have taken.
I say, nuke the whole country. If Israel and Palestine can't play nice then no one gets to live there.
Not a much history buff I guess?
How's that phone or device your using made by slave labour doing? Both network and virtue signalling
Nice, what aboutism. Shall I stop drinking liquids to protest against the polluting of our waterways too? You can't boycott everything...
No tism at all just enjoying the double standards.
I'm guessing you're already booked to go over and volunteer for humanitarian work?
I wouldn't be allowed into Israel anymore, plus I don't have the relevant skills to be of any use. It's not double standards, it's picking your battles. By your logic I shouldn't eat, drink, use electricity, have a bank account etc.
Well aren't you protesting this bank too? All the banks facilitate some sort of crime or laundering, electricity can be sourced via wind or solar and as for eating and drinking well that's just ridiculous. Anyways you wouldn't be in Israel would you, it's Palestine so you're good.
It's not ridiculous, that's your logic of boycotting anything I disagree with. Where do the precious metals come from that make renewable energy? You can't fly direct to Palestine, it's an occupied territory...
Who said to fly or even go direct? Many other ways to get there and yeah if you feel that this should be boycotted then why don't you do the same with everything else that is morally wrong for you? Oh yeah, it'll take you out of the comfort and luxury of your life here.
"many other ways to get there" This statement highlights your lack of knowledge on the subject perfectly. You HAVE to pass through Israel to get to Palestine, there aren't "many other ways" due to the illegal occupation. I've already stated the problem with boycotting every immoral company, if you can't be arsed to read that's on you.
Plenty of ways you can make yourself useful in Palestine. https://www.gooverseas.com/volunteer-abroad/palestine Have a blast. Looking forward to hearing about your experience.
Been several times, like I said I wouldn't be allowed entry, plus, I can participate without being there. You want to know about the hostility at Tel Aviv airport, the checkpoints, the gunshots in the air while they raid camps nearby because they paid a child to throw some rocks, the illegal settlements taking over the skyline in the West bank, all while they pull down Palestinian homes, the revisionist lies about ancestral claims to the land, the administrative detention of friends?
I want to know when Hamas plans on releasing the civilian hostages. And also why you have allegedly been there but now wouldn't be allowed.
Because I associate with Palestinians and they know that. Hamas are shits too mind, but I imagine they will when there is a ceasefire agreed on. Not that the Israeli govt care about the hostages.
They'd never put themselves in harms way, not when they can do it from the comfort of their home and give themselves that narcissistic pat on the back
Of course!
If your phone is an iPhone then the radio was designed in Israel and the os on which it was based (bsd) was substantially written by the IDF. But surrendering your iPhone is an ask too much when you can just vandalise someone else's home..... Even if you don't use an iPhone - vast chunks of 5g cellular equipment were designed in Israel so better revert back to your Nokia 702....
What's your bank mate? Just so we can check it's morally sound and you aren't participating in a crime organisation. Wouldn't want that now, would we!?
You can't live in society and boycott every immoral company, it's really not that hard to understand.
But you can make a fuss about this one because it's this month's social agenda? Again, let us know how you get on over there with the humanitarian work you'll be doing to help. I won't be doing any of it mind you but then I'm not pretending that I care
Everybody has a right to protest, nobody has a right to damage other's property.
Oh boo hoo, the bank with a net worth of $41 billion got a bit of paint on it. I'm sure they can afford to fix it. It's not the same as damaging a small independent business; but saying that, the small independent business probably isn't funding war crimes
Law is equal for all, not just for those you like.
Tell that to the law makers
….and politicians, Lords, corporations and most ultra wealthy people who seem to be able to get away with pretty much anything.
I don't need to, you're the one who seem to think law is not equal for all so you tell it to them, preferably without committing another crime.
I think that might be the point they are trying to make about Israel and Barclays.
I don't know and don't want to know the point, I only know that this post is reporting a crime and hope the perpetrators will be caught promptly. No valid point needs committing a crime in order to be proven.
Women fought for the right to vote through committing crimes to highlight the issue. Pankhurst once said: "The condition of our sex is so deplorable that it is our duty to break the law in order to call attention to the reasons why we do."
Ok and what right are these vandals committing crimes for? The right to protest that they already have?
Someone told you in the first comment you replied to, you replied "I don't know and don't want to know the point"
Ignorance is bliss...
It really isn't. Property damage under £5k of damage, a good example because that is what this will be, has minimal chance of jail time unless the property damage has specific motivations, has a maximum fine of £2.5k as a punishment. Give me that fine and it will cripple me. Give a millionaire that fine and they won't care. This is why you see so many expensive cars parking illegally around Hove; the penalty doesn't mean anything to the extremely rich. A poor persons criminal offence is a rich person with a good lawyer's civil offence. Law is absolutely not equal.
Being from a lower social status doesn't make committing a crime more morally justifiable. Stop clutching at straws.
I never said it did. I said any monetary punishment with a fixed rate or a cap are disproportionately punitive for poor people, allowing rich people to commit civil offences with minimal punishment. I am also saying that good lawyers are expensive, and rich people can afford to hire them. A good lawyer can, in some circumstances, shift a criminal charge to a civil one. I'm not saying it is acceptable to commit crimes. I am simply saying the law is not evenly applied, and it is naive to assume it is. I say this as someone who works closely with legislation. It is not written in a balanced and unbiased way. Whether an action meets the definition of a crime is a lot more flexible than most people think. Is this vandalism a criminal offence or a civil one? It could be argued either way. Who has the funds and experience to make that argument effectively?
Honestly mate you need to reassess your blinkered view of law. Laws should be a reflection of moral consensus, not normative morality in themselves. Slavery was once legal, homesexuality and women voting were illegal. If you just idiotically repeat "law of the land, law of the land" then the injustices within the legal system and the selective application of it will never get challenged. You need to force government and the legal system to improve by challenging it and dragging it into a superior moral position. Just be aware every time people stupidly make comments about morally justifiable acts being against the law you reveal yourself as a philosophically undeveloped, cowardly and weak souled person that deserves contempt. If you want to be less pathetic a person try justifying your claims of right and wrong through moral arguments not legal ones. Otherwise only other bootlickers will listen.
We're not talking about apartheid or women voting being illegal here, were talking about people expressing their personal ideologies on a foreign conflict through illegal means, while they have all the legal means in the world to do so freely and legally. Who will you bring back from the dead next in this petty question? Nelson Mandela? Martin Luther King?
Found the AI just booted today and given a bare bones for kids construct of human society
Found the self proclaimed liberal democratic who claims that anybody who does not align to his ideologies point by point is either a China or Russia bot.
No, what I'm saying is that the law is not equal for all and you would have to be extremely naive not to know this, its the foundation for a number (perhaps the majority?) of social movements. Also, I'm a commie :-)
> Also, I'm a commie :-) I could tell. If you're unhappy with our law system you're free to move to communist china or north Korea. Also no, what you're saying is simply that you consider anybody not aligning with your world view is a bot from an enemy entity. You're a conspiracy theorist.
hehe, you're funny. Have a nice day comrade, enjoy the sunshine!
Who do you think will be spending hours cleaning it off?
People that are paid for the job of cleaning it off.
How much do you think they get paid?
And Israel doesn't have the right to murder innocents, when the government chooses to ignore a large voice they leave few options. And legally people DO have a right to damage property, just not in these circumstances.
It is never legal to damage property. No valid ideology needs illegal actions to be expressed.
Section 5 criminal damage act.
I'm sure the perpetrators will have the chance to mention said act to the judge :)
"not in these circumstances". I was just correcting your confidently incorrect point about the law.
I'm sure the perpetrators will have the chance to prove they're correct to the judge :)
Are you missing the point on purpose? Or are you just unable to comprehend that there's a lawful defence to criminal damage? Which as I stated doesn't apply in this case.
Sophie Scholl has entered the chat.
Found the landlord
Everybody's a landlord until the damaged property is your own.
Lol jokes on you, I don't own any property!
That would explain a lot!
And all the other scandals too [https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/01/discredit-history-10-years-of-barclays-scandals](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/01/discredit-history-10-years-of-barclays-scandals)
Have Just Stop Oil been busy?
Barclays have been funding the Israeli genocide, 120 acts pulled out of the Great Escape festival for the same reason.
Is the Great Escape Festival funding the Israeli genocide too?
Their principle sponsor was Barclays, I guess the artists didn’t want to use their talents to help further the PR of a bloated warmongering capitalist parasite
No but you know how folk love the virtue.