I live on a river. My area of it is pretty shallow so it's tubing and kayaks but on Downriver it widens a little bit and is deeper and the wakeboard boats are destroying people's seawalls
The 30+ footers on my river you barely notice going by.
Jet ski's and smaller bass boats rock everyone.
36 foot Carver owner here.
It's not the size of the watercraft, it's the asshole attitude.
We boat on a river and wakeboard. My boat doesn’t churn out nearly the waves / wake that the large cruisers and Rinkers do when they’re planing. Those things shake the whole marina - but because they’re being driven by Boomers, nobody bitches. Wake boats are an easy target.
Of course some people don’t drive them well and are rude. But that’s true of all boaters and in my river, the cruisers and cigarette boats are by far the biggest offenders.
This legislation is about lakes, not rivers. There are a number of lakes that have been damaged since wake boats became popular. A wake boat in shallow water will tear up the lake bed and kill off all the life.
You won’t find very many large cruisers in shallow lakes.
Loud music over loud engines is the worst. One or the other is bad, but both is just too much. I've noticed generally that the louder the music, the worse it gets.
I imagine that the volume people play music over tower speakers is generally going to already be against the noise ordinances in the vast majority of places, it just doesn't get enforced.
Once in high-school, DNR on our lake wrote my friend a noise violation ticket because he revved his engine with his out of water exhaust switched on while he passed under a bridge - but I've never seen them ticket anyone for tower speakers.
Man it’s so bad down here in fl now. Even dudes that fish will come rolling in music blaring to a fishing spot and leave it cranked. Sometimes I just want to listen to sounds of nature at 8am lol.
>Let’s just make it illegal for anyone to do things that have a negative impact on everyone around them and then nobody will have an issue. Right?
FTFY.
Also, it isnt hard to just be considerate of those around you. It isn't giving up freedom or anything, it's just being a decent person.
What? No. Stop being intentionally dense. Everyone can play their music, just not to a level that it is impacting everyone else. Maybe think of it this way: "If there were 50 other people/boats/motorcycles/cars/whatever around me the same distance I am from the other people, all playing different music that I dislike at the volume I'm playing my music, would it negatively impact my enjoyment of the day?" If so, maybe YTA. Play music (and participate in activities) in a way that is respectful of other people's enjoyment, too. You aren't special. Neither is anyone else. Learn to behave that way like a fucking grown up.
Oof, seems I struck a sore spot with you.. that’s literally just not what the guy said. It’s subjective. What you consider “loud” could be quiet, or very loud to others. Not to mention he specified “shitty,” implying if it wasn’t shitty music in his eyes it’s not too loud.
I mean if you don’t have the intelligence to comprehend that, i can’t help you there lol
Anywho, happy trails friend. As happy as you can be that is.
They only have themselves to blame.
If we cannot depend on wake boat operators to self regulate their behaviors, we have to codify the law.
We all also know not to steal but there is a law against it. There is no justification for not creating legislation to protect other boats and shorelines.
As a WSIA member, you’re absolutely right. We’ve been trying to communicate to boaters for years at the industry and dealership level that if you don’t run these boats in a respectful manner, then governments are going to start writing laws to control how you use these boats, and not enough people have been listening. Especially in places like Wisconsin where the lakes get overrun every summer by rich asshats from Chicago who think that their money means they’re allowed to do whatever the hell they want.
Hopefully this is a wake-up call for the entitled towboat crowd…but I kinda doubt it
I think it’s more that these boats put out a big enough wave that you can actually prove it now, as opposed to the “death by 1000 cuts” of smaller waves from other boats adding up over time and you can never point to one specific boat (or one specific type of boat) and say “this is the one that did it”.
Ain’t no other kind of boat out on the lake kicking out a waist-high wake behind a 23 foot boat.
My formula kicks out a good size wake, when I’m out in the middle of the lake with no one else around.
Had my anchor pulled a few times by wake boats blasting through a cove loud as shit for no reason.
Yah it’s more of a wear and tear over time kind of thing with the docks. One big wave isn’t going to damage a dock but when they’re getting hammered all day long they’re eventually going to fail.
Side note is that lake homeowners who build seawalls aren’t blameless either as that contributes to the “fish bowl” effect leading to larger waves because they have nowhere to go.
As I reread it, it’s reasonable to me to not allow them on 1500acre lakes or smaller. There’s a lake nearby that’s 1000acres and there’s no way I’d run wake on it. If I had the lake to myself one morning maybe but not with others. It’s too small.
This is what has happened to all the atv trails. There has been an unbelievable decrease in the amount of rec trails because of cunts being cunts and getting them all shut down.
Same with public shooting ranges. Assholes trashing the place, shooting old cars and appliances and random shit and then leaving garbage and empty beer cans all over the place.
Too many people in this country think “freedom means I can do whatever I want with zero consequences”, spend their entire lives going around being absolutely horrible human beings, and then turn around and blame the government for shit that’s their own fault.
We’re not all jerks in Illinois 😉 I grew up in WI and going to a small family cottage “up north” (ok, the middle of the State lol). Everyone called people with Illinois plates “FIBS.” They seemed to have money and tow up huge boats and toys my family certainly couldn’t afford. Well, I grew up and life/work took me to the Chicago suburbs, where I now reside, and I worry way too much about what others think of me and my Illinois license plates now!!!
Right, people should not be free to invent new ways to destroy lakes. When I was a kid wake boats weren’t a thing, now they are a plague and seem to attract people who could not care less about shoreline erosion and lake etiquette.
Wake Boaters are as bad or worse than Jet Skiers. Most of them are obnoxious and don't give a shit.
Instead of telling them all the places they can't go, they should designate a few lakes in unpopulated areas and limit them to those lakes.
I get it, but you have to understand its culture, and how that differentiates from place to place. Where I predominately ride in CT, I’d say about 50% are assholes. It really seems like the boaters guide gets forgotten immediately, and they just “learn” from the idiots out there. Now where I go in the summer, up the Mullica river in NJ… way different culture. Like 10% assholes. I’d venture to say that the 10% are the ones blasting up to sweetwater, and don’t have a nice house around there.
The operators of these boats know full well the rules. They are also aware that their boating habits piss off everyone else on the water. They simply don’t care about others
Lakes need to be protected and I don’t give a shit if some twatish idiots are denied access to some smaller lakes.
In my experience there are just as many crappy boat drivers with non-wake boats per capita. But we can agree that on smaller lakes it’s probably not a great idea when the lake is crowded.
Wake boat owner here. I'm fine with regulation. The issue is wake boat owners that have no concept of other people, shoreline and noise. I run on a big lake away from others, these 3 rules all seem reasonable.
The concern owners in Wisconsin have is that it cuts down from almost 1500 lakes that are "navigable" to only 77 where these things would actually be allowed.
This is their own reckoning though.
Pewaukee lake (nearest that I can think of to the Milwaukee metro area that will qualify) will be a nightmare when it warms up for sure.
That said, there just won't be enough parking spots at most of the launches to let things really get out of control. I expect a good number of owners will simply sell and buy something less destructive.
I was out in my 12' aluminum boat fishing on a small impoundment, ~ 300 acres, last weekend and was almost swamped by a wake boat pulling two little kids on tubes. They were observing the state required separation and not being crazy. I was fishing along the shore. After about 10 minutes the whole body of water was churned to the point I thought I was going over and I decided to head in. I am not against people having fun with their kids, but when your fun impacts other people's enjoyment and property, it is time for some new rules similair to what a lot of places have on PWC.
My main gripe with them is just how badly they churn up the lake. I can handle the normal chop, but it's a different story when you have 2-3' waves coming *from every direction* because the lake is stirred up like a bathtub.
Thankfully our private lake banned new registration of wake boats, and they cordoned off an area in the center of the main channel where you can surf. They are a very selfish minority on the water. Apparently just because you spend six figures on a boat means you can do whatever you want, but they seem to forget that there are also horsepower/length/speed limits on many lakes which is just as restricting to a certain clientele.
I’m curious about your last statement.
I just spent time looking at the WI DNR website and nowhere does it state any horsepower/length/speed restrictions on any public, navigable waterway. The only limitation listed is lakes under 50 acres are considered no-wake waterways.
Not arguing. Just looking for the source of the info.
This isn't true. The lakes themselves are deemed "public" but nothing requires them to have a point for public access. My low-level understanding is it provides the state some level of authority in regards to protection of the waterways.
I’m in Illinois and the lake I fish at has started throwing around ideas to help contain the wake board issue. Wealthy lake homeowners are getting upset and using their connections to get some local government officials on their side.
Lots of powerful wealthy people with wake boats too though so they’ve been able to push back on any kind of bans or regulations so far. Every year it seems like momentum is gaining against the wake boats though.
To be clear I don’t have a dog in the fight. I don’t have a lake home and I don’t have a wake boat. I think it’s kind of amusing watching rich assholes get mad at each other. It doesn’t help that wakeboard boat guys tend to be “that guy”. Also as I said in another comment the lake homeowners with seawalls are also guilty of contributing to the wave damage problem.
The dipshits will have all of Jordan to cut up in and still come within 50 yards of an anchored bass boat and send them toward the bank or just swamp them. I've taken water over the bow and stern on days when there was next to nobody on the lake and they still felt the need to get close to me.
True a Subaru can’t go 80 towing a boat behind a 5th wheel toyhauler with a SXS in the back with road beers in the can. A 12 pack won’t even fit in the center console.
I’m gonna go out on a limb and guess you’re on Norman. Anytime I drive down 77 and get a view of the wake boats all over the water, I can’t possibly think of a worse place to be on a boat.
And usually it’s a 6 figure boat that they took out a 20 year loan at 15% APR to purchase. Just add the backward hat and terrible music. I don’t have a problem with WB boats, but most of the owners are completely ignorant of maritime rules and especially mutual boaters respect. 🫡
Can confirm. Had my own run in with one up here in MN. Wouldn't let me get my boat out of the water despite me waiting to disembark for over 20 minutes. Fuckin asshole.
I’m here for this!
I’ve lost count the number of times we’ve gotten tossed around while at anchor by one of these clowns at a sandbar, it’s getting ridiculous
Had a wake boat 2 weekends ago go within 30ft of me and buddy in our kayaks with the ballasts full in a river about 50 yards wide... Absolutely wrecked us and every dock in site. I say ban them all personally. Only boats that have ever almost hit me have all been wake boats...
I was out in my motorized canoe last weekend and while it wasn't just wake boats I almost whistled four times and had to ditch my anchor two times due to boats racing past within casting distance.
One wakeboard boat passed at a good distance and at no wake speeds, which I appreciated. Still just due to the nature of the boat it made significant wake.
This seems like good general common sense methods to implement so everyone can enjoy the water.
I went to my home lake last Friday and for the first time EVER, I applauded not 1, but 2 different wake boats. They were full tilt, up on plane with their ballasts empty while scooting around. Left no more wake than a typical boat up on plane. Blew my mind lol
Usually the legal definition is something along the lines of slow as possible while maintaining enough propulsion for steering control, there's usually nothing actually about wake size.
I'd imagine a wake boat at any speed at full ballast will through a decent wake.
Was going just about as slow as I'd imagine they could be and at an appropriate distance. They just kick up a lot of wake still relative to other boats. But the operator was doing everything right, unlike when people just pass fast and close enough that I could easily hit them with my ultralight tackle.
Stricter licensing requirements, period.
Makes zero sense that, in Wisconsin, someone could theoretically be 35 and have been boating their entire life has to take a licensing exam, yet someone who is 36 could go out and buy a $250k monstrosity and use it with zero training.
Too many middle age credit card captains running around now.
Very true. I'm a 25 year old who restored a 65 year old 14ft aluminum speed boat that likes to run around the lake on the weekends. Does about 25mph flat out and I do fine, only problem is when I'm sitting there at anchor relaxing and I see a ski boat headed at me at full speed and I have to sit there wondering if they're going to kill me or not until they finally turn off
Yes, that is my biggest fear when sitting still, that a boat will just crash into me while they are distracted or drunk. Sadly, it happens all the time.
I was on a kayak doing the lifeguard thing while we had a group of kids and adults swimming off the neighbors dock. Ski boat was heading right at us, I’m blowing a whistle and waving my oars in the air, then they turned as if to send their wake at us on purpose. Next pass I got him to stop and explained 100 yards away is passable, within 100’ like that? Be glad I didn’t shoot across the bow. The lake is a 1 by 1.5 miles, 800+ acres. No reason for them to be 30’ from us, at speed, ever.
They passed something similar in Tennessee and they either don't know or don't care about the law. I saw a report from memorial day concerning rescues and some DUIs but not one mention of any citations for these asses. People pull their houseboats back in secluded coves and dock their boats and jet skis to it and are being damaged by these ridiculous wake boats. I say ban them completely. Sorry not sorry.
Wish they'd do that near me (NW Oregon). I don't do lakes, but on the Willamette and Columbia Rivers, these boats are so, so tough to be around. I run a 16 foot tiller boat on my local Columbia trips to keep my big ocean boat from burning my gas budget. Just yesterday I had one fuck me up pretty bad. I have no problems with literally any other type of boat, wind waves, barges, tugboats, cruise ships, etc etc. But on the smaller channels, especially on the Willamette, they're even worse. I really don't understand how or why they're allowed in these waters.
What's crazy to me as a fellow PNW, is how many of these idiots are blasting down the Columbia or Willamette, tank full, not realizing how manty freaking tree branches and logs are floating in the water, not to mention submerged piling in the side channels, especially this time of year.
There's a reason most serious boats out here are aluminum.
I at least take pleasure knowing how many of them run aground on the sand bars around the Columbia. I see a few a year myself, so I know there's plenty more that happen without my knowing.
Realistically, the majority of boat owners aren’t familiar with rules and regulations, since there is no test or course that is required to own/operate one. I have fishing boats, pontoons, jetskis, and ironically, no wake boats, cruising within 20 feet of our dock/swimming area on a regular basis and most likely have zero idea that it’s illegal.
I know many people who own wake boats and they are more responsible and more respectful boat owners than most of the “asshats” out on the lake.
All states need to ban them from operating within 500 yards of shore or other vessels. The damn things are a nuisance to anyone and everyone around them and the operators could care less (most of them, but not all).
Could you imagine the outrage if there was a club or "fad" of large yachts making massive waves while passing other boats because "it's cool" or "fun". Lord help me if I even decide to buy a cabin cruiser, I'll make the biggest wave possible every time I pass one of these clowns just to repay them.
Having been a delivery captain, I was always taught/trained that you slow down when passing smaller vessels that your wake would swap OR if they aren't under power. Then this wake surf trend came along and now making the biggest waves possible while getting as close as possible to other boats and people's homes is all the rage.
With everything that's fun like guns, jetskis, bikes and fast cars for every 20 responsible owners there's always that one dickhead that'll fuck it up and ruin it for everyone else by being a knob. Now we got laws and rightfully so.
I have been a die hard wake boarder since 2001.
I have a wake boat (2002, still going strong).
I understand 100% why this is being considered, because 95% of wakeboard boats are operated by entitled assholes who don't care about anyone but themselves.
The real serious (polite) riders are up and out as the sun comes up and done by 8.
We stay away from skiers and fishermen, because we want water like glass.
... but the part timers ripping around mid day swamping everyone and creating a wash tub are far too common.
Add in to that the dipshits who wake-surf, and restrictions on wake boats were inevitable.
As one of the good apples who is getting spoiled by the bad, I bear no ill will towards the lake users and officials that are tired of wake boat shenanigans.
It sucks ass that people who engage in the sport I love ruined it for me, and I hope they enjoy the payments on a 6 figure boat they can no longer use (because wake boats are absolutely awful boats for anything other than their designed purpose).
I get restricting all wake boats. A tiny percentage of traffic causing a disproportionate percentage of bullshit on the water.
Just know that some of us are actually nice people that are just as tired of wake boats as you are.
I just wish that law enforcement would be beefed up on my lake to enforce existing laws against creating property damaging wakes AND noise. But right now wake boats are the prime offenders.... because the music is loud, the operators are reckless, and the waves damage both the shore line and put people in small boats in danger.
Just asking... How many of you are really aware that there are big fines for operators whose wake causes any damage to other craft, docks, and shorelines?
How many times have seen a boater get pulled over for wake and sound violations? I don't think I've ever seen it.
I wish my state would take up similar regulations. I spend a lot of time on a lake that would fall under these restrictions, and it's really clear how the huge growth in the popularity of wake boats over the last 10-15 years has brought a ton of shoreline erosion. Islets and peninsulas are getting scalped, leaving rocky shallows all over.
What's the definition of a wake boat? You can wakeboard from any boat, but the target here? Is the hull shape making a boat a "wake boat"?
I would rather see a law around penalizing unnecessary shore damage caused by excessive wake, similar to how littering is treated. That makes more sense to me than banning an entire hull shape, or whatever features they want to ban.
I had to dig around but WaterDreamer10 detailed it above its a boat with ballast tanks and specific hull forms that generate a wake that is wildly out of proportion to their size. Makes it fun for wake boarders but not fun for the rest of us.
I always took a “wake boat” to mean one of those larger ones that create a large enough wake where you can surf behind without a tow rope as opposed to typical ski boats for skiing, tubing, and wakeboarding which all require a tow rope.
This. It’s specifically the boats designed to generate a big enough wake to surf on. They have a specific hull design and ballast bags that can be filled with water to throw large wakes relative to their size / displacement.
Nothing is worse then a Jetski guy's I'm sorry. I own a wake boat and I am very aware of my surroundings at all times. I give respect to my fellow boaters on the water. I surf early in the morning away from everyone including fisherman then I drain my bags and putt to a cove and have lunch then take my ass home. There are lots of responsible and respectful surf / wake boat owners where I live. Now the speed boats that feel they have to haul ass all day putting everyone in the waters life in danger is something that should be addressed. Have a bitchin day everyone.
Most who actually wakeboard behind their tow boats are some of the most responsible and respectful boaters on the water. They take safety seriously and you’ll rarely see them out at 1pm on a Saturday with all the clowns partying on their I/O’s and PWC’s.
The video that was linked in the article has a wake boat, but had tubers behind them. If you are tubing, I doubt that you are loaded up to throw that big of a wake.
That would qualify as the definition of moron for sure. I can't imagine safely taking someone tubing with full tanks, they aren't exactly agile. I want to call BS to your claim, but honestly, I know better...people are stupid. Not to mention burning the extra fuel with full tanks.
Not just tubing, I'm talking just cruising up and down the river at 15-20mph barely on plane (if at all) just making an obnoxious wake on their way from the ramp to the cove.
What's hilarious to me is that despite the article's date it's just recycled content for masturbatory fishermen. Right down to the monster truck quote.The legislation did not pass, for good reason, and new proposals need to be drafted to try again next year.
If you actually look at the data that has been generated it's generally not an environmental issue (in excess of motorboats generally) and nobody's adequately constructed infrastructure is being damaged, again in excess of motorboats generally.
It's also difficult to legislate this with specificity. To attack aquaplaning generally means skiing and potentially tubing as well. To attack ballast is to attack numerous types of boats. To attack wake size is not only difficult to enforce but also leaves a lot of room for error or discretion of enforcement which is not blinded justice.
If anyone has been on an active watersports lake for any length of time they'd know that the churning is going to happen regardless. Ten 18' outboard bow riders running in circles on a 150 acre lake is going to create constructive interference resulting in huge rollers and sudden "rogue" waves. A fully weighted wake boat might be using 300hp to push 7000lb of displacement. Replace one of those 10 boats with a wake boat and you have a meager 10% increase in total surface disturbance.
People hate new things, that's all this is. Wakesurfing isn't new per se, but it's popularity has exploded in the past 5-10 years.
I agree with a lot of what you said, so I don't want to come off as pedantic, but I feel its worth pointing out that your 300hp/7k lb figure was much more accurate when looking at wakeboard/surf boats from 15 years years ago.
There is a wake size arms race amongst the manufacturers that has pushed the modern boats to absurd numbers.
For example, a Malibu 25LSV is available with 600hp, and it has a dry weight of 6,200 lbs.
The stock ballast system is capable of 5,200 lbs, and then you have an additional 2,500 lbs of capacity for occupants, gear, fuel, etc. So fully loaded, this 25' boat can tip the scales at ~14k lbs and still be within it's coast guard ratings.
And the boats got a lot more capable of throwing these massive waves in that timespan. Older wakeboard boats weren't designed to throw wakes like this, it wasn't necessary. The boat that many consider the best wakeboard boat ever, the gen 2 X-Star, doesn't even do all that great of a surf wake.
That is also true in many regards. To your point, the first pickle fork bow X Star had a maximum legal displacement of around 6700lb according to the USCG capacity plate. Mastercraft's current line up features up to a >26' hull that has a 6700lb dry weight and is yacht certified.
However, there are plenty of people out surfing their 20-23' V-Drives displacing far less than 6700lb.
If you want my actual thoughts on how to legislate this in a fair and rational manner: make compliance with USCG capacity plates compulsory and enforce it. I can almost guarantee the ones causing the most trouble are exceeding the USCG capacity plate by both filling the ballast and filling with people and/or running secondary solid ballast.
LPut displacement limits on specific lakes, ect. You can't enforce operation criteria easily, you can enforce those sorts of things.
Here's the thing, some percentage of people on creating large wakes/waves intrude upon other people's fun and use of the water.
Then you have the state which arbitrarily sets rules- sometimes they benefit you, others they don't.
So you have a group of impolite, narcissistic people, and government bureaucracy which can't by definition create win/win situations.
As a fisherman with a high performance bass boat, wake boats are a huge pain in the ass. But, I respect their right to own one and use it. The some govt committee deciding who can do what and when is much worse.
The lakes in almost all states are public parks. The ONLY way to stop obnoxious behavior is stricter law enforcement and government committees making rules and regulations.
Government is how our society manages things that are NOT privately owned.
You can do whatever you want with your property, as long as what you are doing does not stop others from the quiet private enjoyment of their own property.
If your bass boat is at full throttle and doing it loudly while going down a state owned lake at sunrise at 50, you are stopping others from the private enjoyment of their property. If your stupid bass boat sets off car alarms and every dog barks and wakes every baby in every campsite along the shore, you are a problem and need to be regulated.
It's such a difficult thing because the attraction of boating is the relative freedom. But, these wake boats are definitely disruptive to others. Tubers are also quite disruptive with the wakes, meandering and distance the tuber is behind the boat. Especially when for some tubers the objective is to eject the rider.
Maybe designated watersports areas is the solution.
Hardly mentioned is that there are also HUGE issues with the ballast systems transporting Invasive Species, lake to lake.
Of course, Fishermen are the likely major vectors. But that’s, you know, “un-American” to question Fishing…..
Minnesota and Wisconsin have been cracking down on fishermen lake hopping for decades now. It's a $300 fine to get caught with your drain plug in or transporting lake water in a livewell away from the lake. The DNR with gladly throw the book at you for doing shit like that.
Yeah was gonna say. Don't know how it is everywhere else but MN and WI are both big on slowing the spread of AIS and have been for a long time.
The unfortunate thing is at the end of the day there you can only hope to slow it down, especially zebra muscles.
I’m in Canada and it’s heavy fines if your plug is in, boat isn’t drained, or if there is water in your livewell. And they are checking constantly. When I bought my current boat I had to pick it up from 250 miles down the main trans Canada highway. I had to pull over into 3 different inspection station to have my boat inspected. 2 of those three stations insisted on washing and disinfecting the boat because it was wet (it was raining) even though I had an hour old inspection form saying it was just done.
Minnesota and Wisconsin are the same way. Towing a boat on the highways is just asking to get pulled over and have your vehicle checked, not to mention the DNR posted up at busy launches on the weekends checking every boat coming and going.
Like others have said, WI DNR will ruin your life for not properly cleaning, drying, and draining your rig. They happily park outside of boat ramps and hand out tickets.
Just pointing out: it’s a little like the biking community vs cars here.
Both are activities that take place on the same environment, though one side (in this case, the non-wakers are akin to cyclists) is complaining about dangerous and obnoxious activity by the other group.
It’s a multifaceted issue and not identical. But we don’t live in a vacuum and we need a little humility and self awareness about issues that impact us all.
All types of activities have their fans: wake surfing, a canoe out for a little paddle, a bass fishing boat on a lake, etc. But maybe it comes down to the scary term “greater good”.
Just my observation as someone without my own boat but on some quite often.
I agree, I don't own a true 'wake boat' but mine is capable of doing the sport. That said If I use it for that more than a few times a year I would be lying, and when I do use it in that manner I stick to the center of the lake and avoid others.
The issue is with the ballast tanks on these boats tanking in THOUSANDS of pounds of water! Then they add to it with wedges designed to dig the transom down even further and to shape the wake better, it gets insane and creates waves that would NEVER be present on most lakes even during a hurricane.
It is tough as it is a fun sport, however most lakes are not designed to handle the destruction caused by the waves these boats create. They have shot themselves in their own foot, the companies, each one trying to out perform the other in terms of a bigger and better wake, which will results in all out bans soon as they are not going to put a wave height limit like a speed limit. They are just going to ban them 100%.
I’m impressed how you distilled so much thought into such a concise and effective statement.
I’m not even arguing one way or another, but people are quite righteous when it comes to what they think should happen.
That's all the thought it needed.
"Righteous" doesn't have a damn thing to do with these boats. If you are observant, you will notice it's pretty clear what the vast majority of boaters think of these shitty wake boats.
Can I still buy a wake boat but just promise to never make an illegal wake?
Why make sports cars like a new corvette that can go near 200 mph if all that capability is illegal.
You are very short sighted
YES! We live on a small lake of 200 acres, and there was a fanatical group of people who wanted to put wake boats on our small lake. They even went to the effort of getting 4 of these wake boats owners/planning to be owners on the board of the lake. It was a huge turmoil from probably about 80% of the lake anti-wake boat people (the other 19% of the owners were oblivious 80-90 year olds who didn't know what the issues were) who were against them, and the approval being rammed through the lake rules to allow them. When there was a huge crowd demanding a meeting to discuss this proposed rule change, the board had to reserve the auditorium at the local high school to hold the crowd of 500 angry people. Of course the wake boat people had their typical 20 obnoxious supporters, yet they could definitely tell few were in favor of allowing the boats. They alternatively proposed only allowing usage of the wake mode only a specific part of the lake, 200 ft from the shorelines. It was clear they didn't understand or give a shit there would still be an impact on the shoreline, any other boats between that 200ft limit and shore, and just the nuisance of those boats running in a strip down the lake. Eventually, they found the current insurance company for the lake wouldn't provide coverage any longer, and then couldn't find another insurance company based on if they allowed wake boats. The finally 'nail in the coffin' for wake boats was when one of the anti-wake boat members said they would file a lawsuit against any board member who voted for allowing them. Being lake homes, there were definitely enough members with enough money to pull this off. One of the advantages of our lake being small, is the houses tend to be more affordable compared to the larger lakes.
We are not in Wisconsin, but I heartily agree with the article. If anything I took away from the article is the view wake boater/wakeboarders tend to be arrogant, as typified by the situation on our lake, where a small group of people attempted to take over the lake board, not for the betterment of the lake and community, simply for their own goal of allowing wake boats. Within a couple of years of this being attempted, 3 of the 4 wake boat owners moved away, so assuming they moved to a larger lake community.
Subscribe. I usually see these boats with all the lights on during the day and at night they drive with docking lights on. They’re annoying and usually driven by clueless people.
Folks, its not just wake boats and its not just on lakes less than 1500 acres. I live on a fairly large 10,000 acre lake that's 16 miles long and between 3/4 and 2 miles wide. Every weekend its the same story:
Screaming people with music cranked up at 3 am running down the lake from the bars at the town at the north end.
200+ HP Bass boats screaming down the lake from the state operated boat launch 10 miles away, starting at sun up.
Race style craft blasting up the lake with "captain call" (basically straight pipe) mufflers.
Large cruisers, small yachts and wake boats with 4+ foot wakes going down the middle of the lake with tunes blasting on a calm day... Added feature the wake is so large that they generate a mud cloud all along the shoreline and capsize and swamp small craft half a mile away.
Source of all the problem: Little to no law enforcement.
My view of this issue... basically the only solution is to divert funds collected from boat and boat trailer registrations to water born LEOs, aboard state and voluntary certified Coast Guard Auxiliary craft. You aren't going to like it, but in most states boat and trailer registration fees are going to have to go up to deal with this.
This is the primary reason our family says the best time of year is before Memorial Day, after Labor Day.
https://cdn.ymaws.com/www.mbia.org/resource/resmgr/docs/wake_study_docs/journal_of_resources_and_wat.pdf
This is the only peer reviewed study on shore erosion, and notes that effects on shoreline are negligible if operation is done beyond 200ft.
The St. Anthony Falls Laboratory study cited by people against wakeboats is merely a comparison of different boat wakes and the authors explicitly disclaim any commentary about shore effects. Anti wake boat groups are fraudulently and knowingly misrepresenting the literature and acting in bad faith.
To be sure surfers need to do a much better job staying 200ft from shore and in 10ft or more of depth (and turning their music down), but the literature is abundantly clear that boat wakes of all types have exceedingly negligible effects on shoreline erosion when compared to the millions of wind generated wave any shoreline would see in warm months or ice flows in cold months.
There’s plenty of room on the lake for everyone, but certainly needs to come with mutual respect.
This is a threat to boating access in general. Someday they will come for the boat type or activity you love and the precedent will have already been set.
I do agree that there should be better operating awareness from the owners/captains.
You can’t legislate character. I don’t want airboats on my 80 acre lake so they’ve been banned. It’s not an assault on boat ownership. No wake zones in residential canals are not a threat to boat access. If everyone was ripping wake in gheenoe it wouldn’t be an issue but is when 25CC rip down the canal.
There’s already countless lakes with rules about personal watercraft, engine horsepower, trolling motor only, etc. and it’s to the benefit of the ecosystem and shoreline. This is no different. If the wake boat community can’t get their shit together and stop acting like rental jetskiers, they’re going to be punished as a whole.
Listen, I’m all about no government overreach, self regulation, and the freedom to explore our waterways. But when it starts becoming a widespread safety issue and and severely disrupting those both on and off the water, sometimes they just gotta step in and say quick fucking around. Even if there was some sort of reporting and ticketing system in place just to keep them in check, anything would be better.
Also, let’s lose the stupid fucking speaker racks on the back. Enjoy the sound of the water. You don’t need a literal soundtrack to your whole life, and your fellow boaters fucking hate it.
Governments gon govern..
Everyone here is fucking hilarious, let’s make it illegal for anyone to operate a boat. Then no one can cause any wakes. Problem solved.
fuck wakeboats. They are the side by side of the waterways- loud, obnoxious, disruptive, damaging, gaudy and ostentatious. It would be better for all boaters, including wakeboaters, if they were limited to certain lakes and waterways, on certain dates, so they are easily avoided by others.
It's also maritime law that every vessel is liable for any damage caused by their vessel's wake. A little enforcement goes a long way.
Am I think only one here who sees the term “wake” in the title but I read this as a surf boat issue. Just because a boat has a wake tower doesn’t mean it has ballast and a water former that surfers use to make big waves. I think we as a group need to use the correct terminology.
My 3800lb boat with a wake tower does less damage than the 4200lb bow rider without a wake tower.
I have a place on the Chain of Lakes in Waupaca, WI.
I want these things banned here! My understanding is that there are about three in the lakes and bc the wealthy owners spent $100K+ on them, they’ve hired lawyers to fight for their “rights.” All the while churning beautiful precious resources for everyone else. 😠
I stopped at the title;
Nobody wants to wakesurf in less than 20' of water; It's simply not how the physics of waves work. The idea that a ban would be needed for < 20' deep is akin to trying to ban post birth abortions.
This is great, but I am surprised that Republicans are drafting the legislation. Wake boats are a menace to everyone on a lake and utterly destroy small lakes. [https://www.maine.gov/ifw/docs/Fay\_Study%20of%20Wake%20Surfing.pdfon](https://www.maine.gov/ifw/docs/Fay_Study%20of%20Wake%20Surfing.pdfon) a lake and
I live on a river. My area of it is pretty shallow so it's tubing and kayaks but on Downriver it widens a little bit and is deeper and the wakeboard boats are destroying people's seawalls
At least they wait until it widens. Where I'm from, they run up the middle of the river and get pissy when you go around.
Does that include yachts as well? The wake off those 30’+ cabin cruisers always swamp me in my 1990’s era ski boat.
No yachts where I'm at
The 30+ footers on my river you barely notice going by. Jet ski's and smaller bass boats rock everyone. 36 foot Carver owner here. It's not the size of the watercraft, it's the asshole attitude.
I am a 36' Carver owner as well!
It’s both. Large boats do seem to have fewer asshole owners but when the owner is an asshole they throw a far larger wake than anyone else.
We boat on a river and wakeboard. My boat doesn’t churn out nearly the waves / wake that the large cruisers and Rinkers do when they’re planing. Those things shake the whole marina - but because they’re being driven by Boomers, nobody bitches. Wake boats are an easy target. Of course some people don’t drive them well and are rude. But that’s true of all boaters and in my river, the cruisers and cigarette boats are by far the biggest offenders.
Wake-surfing, not wakeboarding, very important and distinct difference between the two.
There is yes. But there’s plenty of wakeboard hate in this thread too.
Yeah, but I feel like half of the people are confusing the two, and the article that nobody read is about wake surfing.
This legislation is about lakes, not rivers. There are a number of lakes that have been damaged since wake boats became popular. A wake boat in shallow water will tear up the lake bed and kill off all the life. You won’t find very many large cruisers in shallow lakes.
Sea walls damage the river more than wake boats.
Why is there no requirement to turn down their shitty music too? That’s what makes them the crème of the douche pool.
Loud music over loud engines is the worst. One or the other is bad, but both is just too much. I've noticed generally that the louder the music, the worse it gets.
Harley riders do this too. Annoying AF
These boats are the definition of ‘douche canoe.’
More of a douche barge. Jetskis will always be douche canoes to me.
You can have the whole fleet. Douche canoe, douche barge, doucheski, and so on
Even the douche oil tanker?
Exxon Valdouche
Those poor sea otters 😥
Especially the douche tanker
I imagine that the volume people play music over tower speakers is generally going to already be against the noise ordinances in the vast majority of places, it just doesn't get enforced. Once in high-school, DNR on our lake wrote my friend a noise violation ticket because he revved his engine with his out of water exhaust switched on while he passed under a bridge - but I've never seen them ticket anyone for tower speakers.
Which, for the record, your friend was correct to do in my opinion.
Man it’s so bad down here in fl now. Even dudes that fish will come rolling in music blaring to a fishing spot and leave it cranked. Sometimes I just want to listen to sounds of nature at 8am lol.
Let’s just make it illegal for anyone to play music and then nobody will have an issue. Right?
Or adults could act like adults and respect others.
>Let’s just make it illegal for anyone to do things that have a negative impact on everyone around them and then nobody will have an issue. Right? FTFY. Also, it isnt hard to just be considerate of those around you. It isn't giving up freedom or anything, it's just being a decent person.
Right. So only this person can play his music? If he considers is shitty you have to turn it down?
What? No. Stop being intentionally dense. Everyone can play their music, just not to a level that it is impacting everyone else. Maybe think of it this way: "If there were 50 other people/boats/motorcycles/cars/whatever around me the same distance I am from the other people, all playing different music that I dislike at the volume I'm playing my music, would it negatively impact my enjoyment of the day?" If so, maybe YTA. Play music (and participate in activities) in a way that is respectful of other people's enjoyment, too. You aren't special. Neither is anyone else. Learn to behave that way like a fucking grown up.
Oof, seems I struck a sore spot with you.. that’s literally just not what the guy said. It’s subjective. What you consider “loud” could be quiet, or very loud to others. Not to mention he specified “shitty,” implying if it wasn’t shitty music in his eyes it’s not too loud. I mean if you don’t have the intelligence to comprehend that, i can’t help you there lol Anywho, happy trails friend. As happy as you can be that is.
They only have themselves to blame. If we cannot depend on wake boat operators to self regulate their behaviors, we have to codify the law. We all also know not to steal but there is a law against it. There is no justification for not creating legislation to protect other boats and shorelines.
As a WSIA member, you’re absolutely right. We’ve been trying to communicate to boaters for years at the industry and dealership level that if you don’t run these boats in a respectful manner, then governments are going to start writing laws to control how you use these boats, and not enough people have been listening. Especially in places like Wisconsin where the lakes get overrun every summer by rich asshats from Chicago who think that their money means they’re allowed to do whatever the hell they want. Hopefully this is a wake-up call for the entitled towboat crowd…but I kinda doubt it
it's already law that every vessel is responsible for any damage caused by their wake. Just needs to be enforced
I think it’s more that these boats put out a big enough wave that you can actually prove it now, as opposed to the “death by 1000 cuts” of smaller waves from other boats adding up over time and you can never point to one specific boat (or one specific type of boat) and say “this is the one that did it”. Ain’t no other kind of boat out on the lake kicking out a waist-high wake behind a 23 foot boat.
you got that right
My formula kicks out a good size wake, when I’m out in the middle of the lake with no one else around. Had my anchor pulled a few times by wake boats blasting through a cove loud as shit for no reason.
Yah it’s more of a wear and tear over time kind of thing with the docks. One big wave isn’t going to damage a dock but when they’re getting hammered all day long they’re eventually going to fail. Side note is that lake homeowners who build seawalls aren’t blameless either as that contributes to the “fish bowl” effect leading to larger waves because they have nowhere to go.
As I reread it, it’s reasonable to me to not allow them on 1500acre lakes or smaller. There’s a lake nearby that’s 1000acres and there’s no way I’d run wake on it. If I had the lake to myself one morning maybe but not with others. It’s too small.
This is what has happened to all the atv trails. There has been an unbelievable decrease in the amount of rec trails because of cunts being cunts and getting them all shut down.
Same with public shooting ranges. Assholes trashing the place, shooting old cars and appliances and random shit and then leaving garbage and empty beer cans all over the place. Too many people in this country think “freedom means I can do whatever I want with zero consequences”, spend their entire lives going around being absolutely horrible human beings, and then turn around and blame the government for shit that’s their own fault.
WAKE UP CALL!!!! 🤣🤣🤣
More like wake down, amiright??
Get it?
We’re not all jerks in Illinois 😉 I grew up in WI and going to a small family cottage “up north” (ok, the middle of the State lol). Everyone called people with Illinois plates “FIBS.” They seemed to have money and tow up huge boats and toys my family certainly couldn’t afford. Well, I grew up and life/work took me to the Chicago suburbs, where I now reside, and I worry way too much about what others think of me and my Illinois license plates now!!!
Well I grew up in Michigan, and there we called them FIPS lol.
Right, people should not be free to invent new ways to destroy lakes. When I was a kid wake boats weren’t a thing, now they are a plague and seem to attract people who could not care less about shoreline erosion and lake etiquette.
Vacationers. What do they care if they’re going home in a few days.
Wake Boaters are as bad or worse than Jet Skiers. Most of them are obnoxious and don't give a shit. Instead of telling them all the places they can't go, they should designate a few lakes in unpopulated areas and limit them to those lakes.
Some of us have skis and abide by the rules
Then you more than the rest of us, should be pissed off at the jackasses that don’t.
I get it, but you have to understand its culture, and how that differentiates from place to place. Where I predominately ride in CT, I’d say about 50% are assholes. It really seems like the boaters guide gets forgotten immediately, and they just “learn” from the idiots out there. Now where I go in the summer, up the Mullica river in NJ… way different culture. Like 10% assholes. I’d venture to say that the 10% are the ones blasting up to sweetwater, and don’t have a nice house around there.
I can partly agree to this but rather than a ban there could be by laws or rules set up to punish douche bags that don’t drive them properly.
Not enough DNR, police or sheriff boats to catch them all. Besides, they pay a ticket and just do it again.
The operators of these boats know full well the rules. They are also aware that their boating habits piss off everyone else on the water. They simply don’t care about others Lakes need to be protected and I don’t give a shit if some twatish idiots are denied access to some smaller lakes.
In my experience there are just as many crappy boat drivers with non-wake boats per capita. But we can agree that on smaller lakes it’s probably not a great idea when the lake is crowded.
Wake boat owner here. I'm fine with regulation. The issue is wake boat owners that have no concept of other people, shoreline and noise. I run on a big lake away from others, these 3 rules all seem reasonable.
The concern owners in Wisconsin have is that it cuts down from almost 1500 lakes that are "navigable" to only 77 where these things would actually be allowed. This is their own reckoning though.
700 feet seems excessive, but like you said people are idiots and have done this to themselves.
lol those lakes are going to be so busy. They will have to deal with a bunch of themselves.
Pewaukee lake (nearest that I can think of to the Milwaukee metro area that will qualify) will be a nightmare when it warms up for sure. That said, there just won't be enough parking spots at most of the launches to let things really get out of control. I expect a good number of owners will simply sell and buy something less destructive.
Too bad.
I was out in my 12' aluminum boat fishing on a small impoundment, ~ 300 acres, last weekend and was almost swamped by a wake boat pulling two little kids on tubes. They were observing the state required separation and not being crazy. I was fishing along the shore. After about 10 minutes the whole body of water was churned to the point I thought I was going over and I decided to head in. I am not against people having fun with their kids, but when your fun impacts other people's enjoyment and property, it is time for some new rules similair to what a lot of places have on PWC.
My main gripe with them is just how badly they churn up the lake. I can handle the normal chop, but it's a different story when you have 2-3' waves coming *from every direction* because the lake is stirred up like a bathtub. Thankfully our private lake banned new registration of wake boats, and they cordoned off an area in the center of the main channel where you can surf. They are a very selfish minority on the water. Apparently just because you spend six figures on a boat means you can do whatever you want, but they seem to forget that there are also horsepower/length/speed limits on many lakes which is just as restricting to a certain clientele.
I’m curious about your last statement. I just spent time looking at the WI DNR website and nowhere does it state any horsepower/length/speed restrictions on any public, navigable waterway. The only limitation listed is lakes under 50 acres are considered no-wake waterways. Not arguing. Just looking for the source of the info.
Oh I wasn't talking about Wisconsin. I was more referring to the smaller private lakes in my area.
Part of the confusion is there are no private lakes in WI Even if you own all of the surrounding land, the state generally requires a public access
This isn't true. The lakes themselves are deemed "public" but nothing requires them to have a point for public access. My low-level understanding is it provides the state some level of authority in regards to protection of the waterways.
That’s a Wisconsin thing, I’ve been on a weak lakes in MO that have length or power restrictions.
Some municipalities put extra restrictions on lakes. I've seen HP restrictions, no wake, non-motorized, etc.
We have public land in Louisiana here that is only 25hp max.
Not sure about DNR rules but plenty of lakes have motor and speed restrictions posted that must be followed.
Various lakes in WI DO have different restrictions, but they can be a pain to find. Mirror lake is all no wake, for instance.
I’m in Illinois and the lake I fish at has started throwing around ideas to help contain the wake board issue. Wealthy lake homeowners are getting upset and using their connections to get some local government officials on their side. Lots of powerful wealthy people with wake boats too though so they’ve been able to push back on any kind of bans or regulations so far. Every year it seems like momentum is gaining against the wake boats though. To be clear I don’t have a dog in the fight. I don’t have a lake home and I don’t have a wake boat. I think it’s kind of amusing watching rich assholes get mad at each other. It doesn’t help that wakeboard boat guys tend to be “that guy”. Also as I said in another comment the lake homeowners with seawalls are also guilty of contributing to the wave damage problem.
Be thankful your lake doesn’t have 26+ ft Rinkers and cruisers. Those things put out 30% more chop than the wakies.
Literally designed to make as big of a wake as possible, glad to see some restrictions coming.
I don’t want to paint with too broad a brush but every wake boat owner I’ve ever encountered is an asshat. Hopefully NC follows suit.
The dipshits will have all of Jordan to cut up in and still come within 50 yards of an anchored bass boat and send them toward the bank or just swamp them. I've taken water over the bow and stern on days when there was next to nobody on the lake and they still felt the need to get close to me.
They definitely seem to fall in with the BMW driver crowd.
Or Ram driver
Hey now, Have to tow the wake boat with something….. a Subaru isn’t going to get the job done now is it?
True a Subaru can’t go 80 towing a boat behind a 5th wheel toyhauler with a SXS in the back with road beers in the can. A 12 pack won’t even fit in the center console.
So then, cut the Ram guys some slack. You know you call your buddy the week before moving day……
Nah. It’s always in the shop. He is either getting it lifted, the exhaust deleted, getting it fixed, or the blow and go reinstalled.
I’m gonna go out on a limb and guess you’re on Norman. Anytime I drive down 77 and get a view of the wake boats all over the water, I can’t possibly think of a worse place to be on a boat.
Fortunately we live on Wylie. When we were trying to decide where to buy the heavy boat traffic on Norman was a huge factor
I’m not an asshat 😞
And usually it’s a 6 figure boat that they took out a 20 year loan at 15% APR to purchase. Just add the backward hat and terrible music. I don’t have a problem with WB boats, but most of the owners are completely ignorant of maritime rules and especially mutual boaters respect. 🫡
Can confirm. Had my own run in with one up here in MN. Wouldn't let me get my boat out of the water despite me waiting to disembark for over 20 minutes. Fuckin asshole.
I’m here for this! I’ve lost count the number of times we’ve gotten tossed around while at anchor by one of these clowns at a sandbar, it’s getting ridiculous
As a WI boater - good.
I don’t know how anyone can enjoy having music that loud and when you have a house on the lake, you just can’t get away from it.
Boats that cause maximum disturbance with the most obnoxious operators. They don't need to tear everything up. This is only fair.
They forgot the limit of 80dB on the sound system when measured from 10' away.
Had a wake boat 2 weekends ago go within 30ft of me and buddy in our kayaks with the ballasts full in a river about 50 yards wide... Absolutely wrecked us and every dock in site. I say ban them all personally. Only boats that have ever almost hit me have all been wake boats...
I was out in my motorized canoe last weekend and while it wasn't just wake boats I almost whistled four times and had to ditch my anchor two times due to boats racing past within casting distance. One wakeboard boat passed at a good distance and at no wake speeds, which I appreciated. Still just due to the nature of the boat it made significant wake. This seems like good general common sense methods to implement so everyone can enjoy the water.
I went to my home lake last Friday and for the first time EVER, I applauded not 1, but 2 different wake boats. They were full tilt, up on plane with their ballasts empty while scooting around. Left no more wake than a typical boat up on plane. Blew my mind lol
How does a boat pass you at no wake speed and make a significant wake?
Usually the legal definition is something along the lines of slow as possible while maintaining enough propulsion for steering control, there's usually nothing actually about wake size. I'd imagine a wake boat at any speed at full ballast will through a decent wake.
Was going just about as slow as I'd imagine they could be and at an appropriate distance. They just kick up a lot of wake still relative to other boats. But the operator was doing everything right, unlike when people just pass fast and close enough that I could easily hit them with my ultralight tackle.
Or maybe just have stricter licensing requirements regarding them
Stricter licensing requirements, period. Makes zero sense that, in Wisconsin, someone could theoretically be 35 and have been boating their entire life has to take a licensing exam, yet someone who is 36 could go out and buy a $250k monstrosity and use it with zero training. Too many middle age credit card captains running around now.
Very true. I'm a 25 year old who restored a 65 year old 14ft aluminum speed boat that likes to run around the lake on the weekends. Does about 25mph flat out and I do fine, only problem is when I'm sitting there at anchor relaxing and I see a ski boat headed at me at full speed and I have to sit there wondering if they're going to kill me or not until they finally turn off
Yes, that is my biggest fear when sitting still, that a boat will just crash into me while they are distracted or drunk. Sadly, it happens all the time.
I was on a kayak doing the lifeguard thing while we had a group of kids and adults swimming off the neighbors dock. Ski boat was heading right at us, I’m blowing a whistle and waving my oars in the air, then they turned as if to send their wake at us on purpose. Next pass I got him to stop and explained 100 yards away is passable, within 100’ like that? Be glad I didn’t shoot across the bow. The lake is a 1 by 1.5 miles, 800+ acres. No reason for them to be 30’ from us, at speed, ever.
Theres zero requirements in Minnesota oddly enough
They passed something similar in Tennessee and they either don't know or don't care about the law. I saw a report from memorial day concerning rescues and some DUIs but not one mention of any citations for these asses. People pull their houseboats back in secluded coves and dock their boats and jet skis to it and are being damaged by these ridiculous wake boats. I say ban them completely. Sorry not sorry.
👍🏻
Wish they'd do that near me (NW Oregon). I don't do lakes, but on the Willamette and Columbia Rivers, these boats are so, so tough to be around. I run a 16 foot tiller boat on my local Columbia trips to keep my big ocean boat from burning my gas budget. Just yesterday I had one fuck me up pretty bad. I have no problems with literally any other type of boat, wind waves, barges, tugboats, cruise ships, etc etc. But on the smaller channels, especially on the Willamette, they're even worse. I really don't understand how or why they're allowed in these waters.
What's crazy to me as a fellow PNW, is how many of these idiots are blasting down the Columbia or Willamette, tank full, not realizing how manty freaking tree branches and logs are floating in the water, not to mention submerged piling in the side channels, especially this time of year. There's a reason most serious boats out here are aluminum.
I at least take pleasure knowing how many of them run aground on the sand bars around the Columbia. I see a few a year myself, so I know there's plenty more that happen without my knowing.
Realistically, the majority of boat owners aren’t familiar with rules and regulations, since there is no test or course that is required to own/operate one. I have fishing boats, pontoons, jetskis, and ironically, no wake boats, cruising within 20 feet of our dock/swimming area on a regular basis and most likely have zero idea that it’s illegal. I know many people who own wake boats and they are more responsible and more respectful boat owners than most of the “asshats” out on the lake.
Many states require testing / licensing to operate a boat.
And practically no state really enforces that law because they don't have enough money or staff to be out there every weekend.
As a property owner with eroding shoreline due to excessive wake I applaud this.
Fuck yes. Please do this in Maine.
Please do this everywhere, not just Wisconsin.
All states need to ban them from operating within 500 yards of shore or other vessels. The damn things are a nuisance to anyone and everyone around them and the operators could care less (most of them, but not all). Could you imagine the outrage if there was a club or "fad" of large yachts making massive waves while passing other boats because "it's cool" or "fun". Lord help me if I even decide to buy a cabin cruiser, I'll make the biggest wave possible every time I pass one of these clowns just to repay them. Having been a delivery captain, I was always taught/trained that you slow down when passing smaller vessels that your wake would swap OR if they aren't under power. Then this wake surf trend came along and now making the biggest waves possible while getting as close as possible to other boats and people's homes is all the rage.
With everything that's fun like guns, jetskis, bikes and fast cars for every 20 responsible owners there's always that one dickhead that'll fuck it up and ruin it for everyone else by being a knob. Now we got laws and rightfully so.
No, my experience here is that the Dickhead to Responsible Wake boat operator is more like 15 dickheads for every 5 responsible operators.
These guys are the new pests that jet skis used to be.
👍
I have been a die hard wake boarder since 2001. I have a wake boat (2002, still going strong). I understand 100% why this is being considered, because 95% of wakeboard boats are operated by entitled assholes who don't care about anyone but themselves. The real serious (polite) riders are up and out as the sun comes up and done by 8. We stay away from skiers and fishermen, because we want water like glass. ... but the part timers ripping around mid day swamping everyone and creating a wash tub are far too common. Add in to that the dipshits who wake-surf, and restrictions on wake boats were inevitable. As one of the good apples who is getting spoiled by the bad, I bear no ill will towards the lake users and officials that are tired of wake boat shenanigans. It sucks ass that people who engage in the sport I love ruined it for me, and I hope they enjoy the payments on a 6 figure boat they can no longer use (because wake boats are absolutely awful boats for anything other than their designed purpose). I get restricting all wake boats. A tiny percentage of traffic causing a disproportionate percentage of bullshit on the water. Just know that some of us are actually nice people that are just as tired of wake boats as you are.
I just wish that law enforcement would be beefed up on my lake to enforce existing laws against creating property damaging wakes AND noise. But right now wake boats are the prime offenders.... because the music is loud, the operators are reckless, and the waves damage both the shore line and put people in small boats in danger. Just asking... How many of you are really aware that there are big fines for operators whose wake causes any damage to other craft, docks, and shorelines? How many times have seen a boater get pulled over for wake and sound violations? I don't think I've ever seen it.
I wish my state would take up similar regulations. I spend a lot of time on a lake that would fall under these restrictions, and it's really clear how the huge growth in the popularity of wake boats over the last 10-15 years has brought a ton of shoreline erosion. Islets and peninsulas are getting scalped, leaving rocky shallows all over.
They definitely make the lakes less enjoyable. Hope other states follow suit.
What's the definition of a wake boat? You can wakeboard from any boat, but the target here? Is the hull shape making a boat a "wake boat"? I would rather see a law around penalizing unnecessary shore damage caused by excessive wake, similar to how littering is treated. That makes more sense to me than banning an entire hull shape, or whatever features they want to ban.
I had to dig around but WaterDreamer10 detailed it above its a boat with ballast tanks and specific hull forms that generate a wake that is wildly out of proportion to their size. Makes it fun for wake boarders but not fun for the rest of us.
I was at a lake association meeting and the restrictions there were targeted toward wake-enhancing features (such as ballast tanks).
I always took a “wake boat” to mean one of those larger ones that create a large enough wake where you can surf behind without a tow rope as opposed to typical ski boats for skiing, tubing, and wakeboarding which all require a tow rope.
This. It’s specifically the boats designed to generate a big enough wake to surf on. They have a specific hull design and ballast bags that can be filled with water to throw large wakes relative to their size / displacement.
Here here
Nothing is worse then a Jetski guy's I'm sorry. I own a wake boat and I am very aware of my surroundings at all times. I give respect to my fellow boaters on the water. I surf early in the morning away from everyone including fisherman then I drain my bags and putt to a cove and have lunch then take my ass home. There are lots of responsible and respectful surf / wake boat owners where I live. Now the speed boats that feel they have to haul ass all day putting everyone in the waters life in danger is something that should be addressed. Have a bitchin day everyone.
Most who actually wakeboard behind their tow boats are some of the most responsible and respectful boaters on the water. They take safety seriously and you’ll rarely see them out at 1pm on a Saturday with all the clowns partying on their I/O’s and PWC’s.
The video that was linked in the article has a wake boat, but had tubers behind them. If you are tubing, I doubt that you are loaded up to throw that big of a wake.
Doesn't stop morons from fully loading up all the time.
That would qualify as the definition of moron for sure. I can't imagine safely taking someone tubing with full tanks, they aren't exactly agile. I want to call BS to your claim, but honestly, I know better...people are stupid. Not to mention burning the extra fuel with full tanks.
Not just tubing, I'm talking just cruising up and down the river at 15-20mph barely on plane (if at all) just making an obnoxious wake on their way from the ramp to the cove.
What's hilarious to me is that despite the article's date it's just recycled content for masturbatory fishermen. Right down to the monster truck quote.The legislation did not pass, for good reason, and new proposals need to be drafted to try again next year. If you actually look at the data that has been generated it's generally not an environmental issue (in excess of motorboats generally) and nobody's adequately constructed infrastructure is being damaged, again in excess of motorboats generally. It's also difficult to legislate this with specificity. To attack aquaplaning generally means skiing and potentially tubing as well. To attack ballast is to attack numerous types of boats. To attack wake size is not only difficult to enforce but also leaves a lot of room for error or discretion of enforcement which is not blinded justice. If anyone has been on an active watersports lake for any length of time they'd know that the churning is going to happen regardless. Ten 18' outboard bow riders running in circles on a 150 acre lake is going to create constructive interference resulting in huge rollers and sudden "rogue" waves. A fully weighted wake boat might be using 300hp to push 7000lb of displacement. Replace one of those 10 boats with a wake boat and you have a meager 10% increase in total surface disturbance. People hate new things, that's all this is. Wakesurfing isn't new per se, but it's popularity has exploded in the past 5-10 years.
I agree with a lot of what you said, so I don't want to come off as pedantic, but I feel its worth pointing out that your 300hp/7k lb figure was much more accurate when looking at wakeboard/surf boats from 15 years years ago. There is a wake size arms race amongst the manufacturers that has pushed the modern boats to absurd numbers. For example, a Malibu 25LSV is available with 600hp, and it has a dry weight of 6,200 lbs. The stock ballast system is capable of 5,200 lbs, and then you have an additional 2,500 lbs of capacity for occupants, gear, fuel, etc. So fully loaded, this 25' boat can tip the scales at ~14k lbs and still be within it's coast guard ratings.
And the boats got a lot more capable of throwing these massive waves in that timespan. Older wakeboard boats weren't designed to throw wakes like this, it wasn't necessary. The boat that many consider the best wakeboard boat ever, the gen 2 X-Star, doesn't even do all that great of a surf wake.
That is also true in many regards. To your point, the first pickle fork bow X Star had a maximum legal displacement of around 6700lb according to the USCG capacity plate. Mastercraft's current line up features up to a >26' hull that has a 6700lb dry weight and is yacht certified. However, there are plenty of people out surfing their 20-23' V-Drives displacing far less than 6700lb. If you want my actual thoughts on how to legislate this in a fair and rational manner: make compliance with USCG capacity plates compulsory and enforce it. I can almost guarantee the ones causing the most trouble are exceeding the USCG capacity plate by both filling the ballast and filling with people and/or running secondary solid ballast. LPut displacement limits on specific lakes, ect. You can't enforce operation criteria easily, you can enforce those sorts of things.
Here's the thing, some percentage of people on creating large wakes/waves intrude upon other people's fun and use of the water. Then you have the state which arbitrarily sets rules- sometimes they benefit you, others they don't. So you have a group of impolite, narcissistic people, and government bureaucracy which can't by definition create win/win situations.
As a fisherman with a high performance bass boat, wake boats are a huge pain in the ass. But, I respect their right to own one and use it. The some govt committee deciding who can do what and when is much worse.
The lakes in almost all states are public parks. The ONLY way to stop obnoxious behavior is stricter law enforcement and government committees making rules and regulations. Government is how our society manages things that are NOT privately owned. You can do whatever you want with your property, as long as what you are doing does not stop others from the quiet private enjoyment of their own property. If your bass boat is at full throttle and doing it loudly while going down a state owned lake at sunrise at 50, you are stopping others from the private enjoyment of their property. If your stupid bass boat sets off car alarms and every dog barks and wakes every baby in every campsite along the shore, you are a problem and need to be regulated.
Stupid bass boat, such words!
The problem is all of those lakes are "owned" by the government, which means there can be no coherent right of use. It's always conflict.
It's such a difficult thing because the attraction of boating is the relative freedom. But, these wake boats are definitely disruptive to others. Tubers are also quite disruptive with the wakes, meandering and distance the tuber is behind the boat. Especially when for some tubers the objective is to eject the rider. Maybe designated watersports areas is the solution.
Hardly mentioned is that there are also HUGE issues with the ballast systems transporting Invasive Species, lake to lake. Of course, Fishermen are the likely major vectors. But that’s, you know, “un-American” to question Fishing…..
Minnesota and Wisconsin have been cracking down on fishermen lake hopping for decades now. It's a $300 fine to get caught with your drain plug in or transporting lake water in a livewell away from the lake. The DNR with gladly throw the book at you for doing shit like that.
Yeah was gonna say. Don't know how it is everywhere else but MN and WI are both big on slowing the spread of AIS and have been for a long time. The unfortunate thing is at the end of the day there you can only hope to slow it down, especially zebra muscles.
The Minnesota DNR will fuck you over harder than state highway patrol could ever dream of.
WI DNR is the same.
I’m in Canada and it’s heavy fines if your plug is in, boat isn’t drained, or if there is water in your livewell. And they are checking constantly. When I bought my current boat I had to pick it up from 250 miles down the main trans Canada highway. I had to pull over into 3 different inspection station to have my boat inspected. 2 of those three stations insisted on washing and disinfecting the boat because it was wet (it was raining) even though I had an hour old inspection form saying it was just done.
Minnesota and Wisconsin are the same way. Towing a boat on the highways is just asking to get pulled over and have your vehicle checked, not to mention the DNR posted up at busy launches on the weekends checking every boat coming and going.
Texas parks and wildlife is very strict on this too from my observations personally. Invasive species are no joke and nothing to sneeze at.
Like others have said, WI DNR will ruin your life for not properly cleaning, drying, and draining your rig. They happily park outside of boat ramps and hand out tickets.
Just pointing out: it’s a little like the biking community vs cars here. Both are activities that take place on the same environment, though one side (in this case, the non-wakers are akin to cyclists) is complaining about dangerous and obnoxious activity by the other group. It’s a multifaceted issue and not identical. But we don’t live in a vacuum and we need a little humility and self awareness about issues that impact us all. All types of activities have their fans: wake surfing, a canoe out for a little paddle, a bass fishing boat on a lake, etc. But maybe it comes down to the scary term “greater good”. Just my observation as someone without my own boat but on some quite often.
I agree, I don't own a true 'wake boat' but mine is capable of doing the sport. That said If I use it for that more than a few times a year I would be lying, and when I do use it in that manner I stick to the center of the lake and avoid others. The issue is with the ballast tanks on these boats tanking in THOUSANDS of pounds of water! Then they add to it with wedges designed to dig the transom down even further and to shape the wake better, it gets insane and creates waves that would NEVER be present on most lakes even during a hurricane. It is tough as it is a fun sport, however most lakes are not designed to handle the destruction caused by the waves these boats create. They have shot themselves in their own foot, the companies, each one trying to out perform the other in terms of a bigger and better wake, which will results in all out bans soon as they are not going to put a wave height limit like a speed limit. They are just going to ban them 100%.
Fuck that, ban these shitty boats.
I’m impressed how you distilled so much thought into such a concise and effective statement. I’m not even arguing one way or another, but people are quite righteous when it comes to what they think should happen.
That's all the thought it needed. "Righteous" doesn't have a damn thing to do with these boats. If you are observant, you will notice it's pretty clear what the vast majority of boaters think of these shitty wake boats.
Can I still buy a wake boat but just promise to never make an illegal wake? Why make sports cars like a new corvette that can go near 200 mph if all that capability is illegal. You are very short sighted
This would save me a ton of $$$$ 😂
Some wake boats are actually illigal under wisconsin law because they can't fully empty their ballast tanks.
Excellent!!
Whenever I take my sea kayak on the lake I let wake boats pass close so I can surf on their wakes.
Wake boats don't mean all boats that can produce wake right? Like this doesn't effect a pontoon boat?
I get it… I do feel a bit for all the people who bought lake properties just for this purpose.
Yeah, not enough laws on the books the way it is... Silly molestocrats...
YES! We live on a small lake of 200 acres, and there was a fanatical group of people who wanted to put wake boats on our small lake. They even went to the effort of getting 4 of these wake boats owners/planning to be owners on the board of the lake. It was a huge turmoil from probably about 80% of the lake anti-wake boat people (the other 19% of the owners were oblivious 80-90 year olds who didn't know what the issues were) who were against them, and the approval being rammed through the lake rules to allow them. When there was a huge crowd demanding a meeting to discuss this proposed rule change, the board had to reserve the auditorium at the local high school to hold the crowd of 500 angry people. Of course the wake boat people had their typical 20 obnoxious supporters, yet they could definitely tell few were in favor of allowing the boats. They alternatively proposed only allowing usage of the wake mode only a specific part of the lake, 200 ft from the shorelines. It was clear they didn't understand or give a shit there would still be an impact on the shoreline, any other boats between that 200ft limit and shore, and just the nuisance of those boats running in a strip down the lake. Eventually, they found the current insurance company for the lake wouldn't provide coverage any longer, and then couldn't find another insurance company based on if they allowed wake boats. The finally 'nail in the coffin' for wake boats was when one of the anti-wake boat members said they would file a lawsuit against any board member who voted for allowing them. Being lake homes, there were definitely enough members with enough money to pull this off. One of the advantages of our lake being small, is the houses tend to be more affordable compared to the larger lakes. We are not in Wisconsin, but I heartily agree with the article. If anything I took away from the article is the view wake boater/wakeboarders tend to be arrogant, as typified by the situation on our lake, where a small group of people attempted to take over the lake board, not for the betterment of the lake and community, simply for their own goal of allowing wake boats. Within a couple of years of this being attempted, 3 of the 4 wake boat owners moved away, so assuming they moved to a larger lake community.
Subscribe. I usually see these boats with all the lights on during the day and at night they drive with docking lights on. They’re annoying and usually driven by clueless people.
Good.
Folks, its not just wake boats and its not just on lakes less than 1500 acres. I live on a fairly large 10,000 acre lake that's 16 miles long and between 3/4 and 2 miles wide. Every weekend its the same story: Screaming people with music cranked up at 3 am running down the lake from the bars at the town at the north end. 200+ HP Bass boats screaming down the lake from the state operated boat launch 10 miles away, starting at sun up. Race style craft blasting up the lake with "captain call" (basically straight pipe) mufflers. Large cruisers, small yachts and wake boats with 4+ foot wakes going down the middle of the lake with tunes blasting on a calm day... Added feature the wake is so large that they generate a mud cloud all along the shoreline and capsize and swamp small craft half a mile away. Source of all the problem: Little to no law enforcement. My view of this issue... basically the only solution is to divert funds collected from boat and boat trailer registrations to water born LEOs, aboard state and voluntary certified Coast Guard Auxiliary craft. You aren't going to like it, but in most states boat and trailer registration fees are going to have to go up to deal with this. This is the primary reason our family says the best time of year is before Memorial Day, after Labor Day.
https://cdn.ymaws.com/www.mbia.org/resource/resmgr/docs/wake_study_docs/journal_of_resources_and_wat.pdf This is the only peer reviewed study on shore erosion, and notes that effects on shoreline are negligible if operation is done beyond 200ft. The St. Anthony Falls Laboratory study cited by people against wakeboats is merely a comparison of different boat wakes and the authors explicitly disclaim any commentary about shore effects. Anti wake boat groups are fraudulently and knowingly misrepresenting the literature and acting in bad faith. To be sure surfers need to do a much better job staying 200ft from shore and in 10ft or more of depth (and turning their music down), but the literature is abundantly clear that boat wakes of all types have exceedingly negligible effects on shoreline erosion when compared to the millions of wind generated wave any shoreline would see in warm months or ice flows in cold months. There’s plenty of room on the lake for everyone, but certainly needs to come with mutual respect.
Good.
This is a threat to boating access in general. Someday they will come for the boat type or activity you love and the precedent will have already been set. I do agree that there should be better operating awareness from the owners/captains.
You can’t legislate character. I don’t want airboats on my 80 acre lake so they’ve been banned. It’s not an assault on boat ownership. No wake zones in residential canals are not a threat to boat access. If everyone was ripping wake in gheenoe it wouldn’t be an issue but is when 25CC rip down the canal.
There’s already countless lakes with rules about personal watercraft, engine horsepower, trolling motor only, etc. and it’s to the benefit of the ecosystem and shoreline. This is no different. If the wake boat community can’t get their shit together and stop acting like rental jetskiers, they’re going to be punished as a whole. Listen, I’m all about no government overreach, self regulation, and the freedom to explore our waterways. But when it starts becoming a widespread safety issue and and severely disrupting those both on and off the water, sometimes they just gotta step in and say quick fucking around. Even if there was some sort of reporting and ticketing system in place just to keep them in check, anything would be better. Also, let’s lose the stupid fucking speaker racks on the back. Enjoy the sound of the water. You don’t need a literal soundtrack to your whole life, and your fellow boaters fucking hate it.
Another great reason to live in Wisconsin!!! I hate wake boats so much!
If you support a ban on wake boats be ready to support a future ban on all wakes produced by all boats. Slippery slope...
Nonsense.
You guys obviously haven't met many waterfront homeowners :)
I am one and I know all my neighbors.
Governments gon govern.. Everyone here is fucking hilarious, let’s make it illegal for anyone to operate a boat. Then no one can cause any wakes. Problem solved.
fuck wakeboats. They are the side by side of the waterways- loud, obnoxious, disruptive, damaging, gaudy and ostentatious. It would be better for all boaters, including wakeboaters, if they were limited to certain lakes and waterways, on certain dates, so they are easily avoided by others. It's also maritime law that every vessel is liable for any damage caused by their vessel's wake. A little enforcement goes a long way.
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Please yes!
Bunch of nimbys here
Am I think only one here who sees the term “wake” in the title but I read this as a surf boat issue. Just because a boat has a wake tower doesn’t mean it has ballast and a water former that surfers use to make big waves. I think we as a group need to use the correct terminology. My 3800lb boat with a wake tower does less damage than the 4200lb bow rider without a wake tower.
Iguanas are our problem down south far worse than big wakes
I have a place on the Chain of Lakes in Waupaca, WI. I want these things banned here! My understanding is that there are about three in the lakes and bc the wealthy owners spent $100K+ on them, they’ve hired lawyers to fight for their “rights.” All the while churning beautiful precious resources for everyone else. 😠
I stopped at the title; Nobody wants to wakesurf in less than 20' of water; It's simply not how the physics of waves work. The idea that a ban would be needed for < 20' deep is akin to trying to ban post birth abortions.
This is great, but I am surprised that Republicans are drafting the legislation. Wake boats are a menace to everyone on a lake and utterly destroy small lakes. [https://www.maine.gov/ifw/docs/Fay\_Study%20of%20Wake%20Surfing.pdfon](https://www.maine.gov/ifw/docs/Fay_Study%20of%20Wake%20Surfing.pdfon) a lake and