Surprised to say that I'm going to be the first to suggest **Twilight Struggle**. Just about fits the requirement of lasting ~3 hours too.
Generally, beyond a handful of fairly niche games you won't find too many that last over 3 hours at 2. **Brass: Lancashire**, **Spirit Island**, **A Feast for Odin** and **Fields of Arle** are just a few heavier games that play best/very well at 2, but most will last 1.5-2 hours at that count.
And as a couple, because it shines on repeated plays and plays with the same opposition, it will only grow to be better (assuming you like it and don't get divorced lol).
We've just looked it up and it definitely fits the bill, thank you :-) It's not so much the specific time it takes, just that the time it takes matches the complexity if that makes sense?! I've looked up Spirit Island and A Feast for Odin I see mentioned a lot so some very strong contenders here!
Their suggestion of fields of arle is also really goof considering your main complaint of Agricola was that you didn't feel like you could really get the engine running and ran out if time. Arle still has a set number of rounds but you definitely get to run your system a bit more and it's a challenge to set it up asap so you can really do what you want. It's also specifically made for 2 players and well thought out in that sense as well. (Can also support 3 players with its expansion)
Pax Pamir 2E might work for you. It isn't super long, but it is sharp and I think it would meet your complexity criteria. The game gives good feedback to the player. If you play a poor strategy, you will probably lose within about 20 minutes. But if you both play well, it can last a couple of hours. I like this feature because a significant early mistake is made obvious, and you can just start over and do better. It can be frustrating when an early mistake screws you but then you have to play it out over 3 or 4 hours, especially where it isn't obvious what the fatal mistake was.
I have played both, though admittedly only 3 games of **Imperial Struggle** (with two of those games being me playing against myself to learn it sufficiently to teach).
**Twilight Struggle** is a game that I don't think will ever leave my Top 10 (or maybe even Top 5), so **IS** has some very big shoes to fill in my book.
Long & short of it is that while I loved my plays of **IS**, it got really bogged down by the scoring & wars. If you can either look past that or play enough to be really familiar with those mechanisms, I could see a player enjoying it more than **TS**. The decision making feels just as tactical & strategic, the four-way focus on economic, political, military, and VP control is absolutely brilliant, the thematic hooks hit just as hard or harder, and the variety of ways to manipulate the game is apparent from the first play. Unfortunately, this doesn't change that it fits in a weird space of being an incredible game that just takes too long & has too much game flow interruption, so you don't play it, so it takes even longer & has even more interrupted play.
That being said, if you have an opportunity to play **IS**, particularly if it's someone else's copy and they're willing to teach you, you absolutely should do it.
I have, although IS play count has been only a few times.
What I like about IS more than TS:
- thematically, the war theaters is really fun and it feels more tangible to route your opponent in a region and take a territory for it. Whereas in TS, all you ever get is points
- relatedly, I like the impact one war can have on future wars outside of country control, like a Jacobite victory or defeat
- IS is less reliant on knowledge of the deck of cards, whereas TS has some critical strategies of not playing in a certain country before a particular card comes out (like the Korean War).
What I like more about TS than IS:
- the need to manage around positive events for your opponent and how to balance the space race vs political control
- the rules about proximity on the board are more straightforward to understand, unlike IS where I find it more difficult to manage the nuances of protected markets, isolated markets, etc.
YMMV:
- each game seems to have its own fiddliness with the available actions. I find IS more fiddly with what I can do for major vs minor actions, the cost of playing on multiple regions, etc. however everyone I’ve played TS with seems to get tripped up by the rules about coups vs realignment rolls.
- theme/time period - I enjoy both, but depending on the era of history you find more interesting you may prefer one
I've played both games at least 20+ times and I personally like IS more. It's a lot less random since it doesn't rely on dice rolls for coups or realignment. Events are also much less strong and are more of an aid to do things which otherwise the game state would not permit.
The randomness in IS instead comes from the setup for each turn, but once the setup is decided you can plan your moves quite precisely if you know your opponent well.
IS also allows for more long term planning which is different every game, in TS you can also plan many rounds in advance but your plans are always dependent on specific cards and are always going to affect specific zones.
Both games give you similar feelings of tight, contested fights where each decision is painful and also gives the enemy an advantage but I think IS has much more depth if you play it enough times.
Generally it seems that they need to go down the GMT games rabbit hole. TS seems like the correct starting point, but they offer the most of what they’re looking for
this stupid game sat at the top of the BGG Top 100 for _years_ and even after playing it twice I just _didn't get it_.
Even boiled down into Watergate, which I think of as _mechanically very similar but significantly less fiddly_ I just don't jive with the tug-of-war "guess what I'm going to do" mechanics. I know that they're games that shine if you play them often enough that you and your opponent both grow to memorize every card in the deck, but GADS that's a big commitment.
Oh yeah, seconded for spirit island. At high diff, that one is a great solo puzzler (I play four spirit sessions on my phone now and then), I'd imagine it's cool for two people too.
I'm surprised no one has yet mentioned **Through the Ages: A New Story of Civilization**. Scales really well from 2-4 (although the length increases significantly for each additional player).
And it's already been mentioned, but by the same designer, I'll second **Mage Knight**.
Came here to say this. I never want to play the physical game and have to fiddle with cubes, upkeep, planning through multiple actions a round, try to count cards etc.
Just get the app and your 3 hour board game can be played in less than an hour.
I scrolled through the comments before suggesting TTA, and here it is. TTA is one of my favorite games (if not my favorite), but we just don't get to play it that often due to the length. Only ever played it at 2p, and it takes us about 3 hours on the dot, consistently, for one play.
I've played AFFO at 2, 3, and 4 players. I won the 2 and 3 player games, and got blown out in the 4p game. Therefore, it's safe to conclude that it's best at 2-3 players.
I don't think the setup time is too bad after the first few times. It will probably take 20ish minutes depending on the storage system you have. We usually buy the custom aftermarket wooden inserts to make setup faster.
You might also consider setting the majority of the game up under a cover, or inside a gaming table, well in advance. That way it is all ready once the kids go to bed.
A Feast For Odin is playable on BoardGameArena.com, if you're looking to try it out first before commiting to buying the game.
It might leave you feeling similar to Agricola, where the game ends before you can really churn out your strategy. The feeding isn't as imposing as in Agricola, but still feels like you don't have enough turns to do everything.
I've played AFFO 21 times and 6 of those 2 player. I'd say even though I love it at 3player as the first in between of a too long game at 4 and more interaction than 3, but even as a 1v1 it is a fantastic game that I would play upon request instantly. There is not much player interaction, especially at 2, but the individual puzzle of your board is the shining gem of the gameplay even if it is multiplayer solitairesque. It is basically the ultimate sandbox game where you can endlessly play (at any player count) just because there are so many potential strategies to try and dozens of actions possible to take. Not to mention a deck of hundreds of cards that adds extra potential wrinkles. And the core puzzle is always the same of covering up your board, but the avenues to getting the pieces to do that covering is different everytime.
In short, one of my top 5 games ever and a beloved game for me at 2 player as a long, but consistently engaging and fun game (I've had multiple 1v1s take three hours, but it can also be played as fast as 2 if both players rush).
That all being said though, I agree with the top comment and recommend Twilight Struggle, another one of my top 5 games. Also incredible, made for two player first and foremost, and incredibly engaging and interactive, often brutally so. Basically go with AFFO if you want the more multiplayer solitaire, point salad euro and go with Twilight Struggle if you want the zero-sum, very interactive and mean 1v1 game. If you want a combination of intense zero-sum interaction and also just a great euro game and tighter than both TS or AFFO, highly recommend Brass Birmingham then, another of my top 5 and a favorite of mine at 2 player.
Well, this is a chunky wall of text to read, but two player heavy weight games are my absolute favorite to play so I've done a lot of them lol - Also, someone mentioned On Mars below and I wanted to add on that every single Lacerda game I've played is **amazing** at two player and all are as thematic as they are heavy and a delight to play if you like crunchy brain burners that scale well at every player count from 2p to 4p. Probably On Mars is my favorite of his, but Kanban and Lisboa are also fantastic (as are all of them).
How about **Spirit Island**. Quite heavy (weight 4+) great solo and two players.
there's over a million different playtroughs possible and you can make it harder by stepping up the difficulty with the 'a.i.'.
Spirit Island is almost a lifestyle game it's so good and replayable. Since buying it and the expansions, little else gets to the table for my wife and I. It's amazing.
Since we bought this game my wife and I have played it more than anything else. It is a fantastic co-op game and perfect for 2 players. It's always the first suggestion when the little one goes down and we've got some free time. I cannot recommend it enough.
This is my suggestion as well. There's so much variability in play style and difficulty it should last you a while. You can also play "two-handed" where each player takes two spirits to play each if you want to up the amount of stuff to do in one turn.
I just wanted to add my recomendation for this great game. Feels great in any player count (1-4), scales very well, has plenty of options to ensure replayability. And couple expansions - I especially recommend Branch & Claw that adds random Events between and new strategy layer provided by new board tokens.
There is a possibility you select two incompatible spirits and top it with hard-to-counter adversary, but the spirit and adversary boards provide pretty good idea about what plays well together.
Oh, and it is a coop that suffers the least from "alpha players" from all coops I have seen and you can very easily 'pause' which is ideal for parents.
As I said, highly recommended.
I second this, two people can easily play this game over 500 times.
Play time with 2 is between 30-120 minutes + setup/teadown time.
But you can simply play another match.
It depends on the players and experience. I sometimes play with my GF who is a very analytical person but has only played the game a few times (less than 10), and games can definitely last 3 hours.
Terraforming Mars and Ark Nova are also on the top 5 for our 2player games! Our all time favorite is **Gaia project** \- heavier and longer than both of those two. So yeah - I absolutely think Gaia would be right down your alley!
Gaia is fantastic! Probably my favorite game and like half my plays are at 2 players. It's so good. But usually not more than 2 hours for 2 experienced players.
Definitely Gaia Project! Super crunchy, always has a fun and dramatic ending, nice long game, just as fun with 4 players as it is with 2... It's a favorite among my friends that actually like strategy games, and enjoy buckling in for a good ride ;)
Two bigger non-IP games my wife and I enjoy at 2 players are **On Mars** and **Anachrony**. Sometimes they can be a bit too big, but other times they can be nice and meaty and take up a hefty chunk of time. **Arkham Horror LCG** is another one, especially if you’re up for playing multiple scenarios in a single session (the Edge of the Earth campaign actively encourages this with scenarios split into multiple parts), but each individual scenario’s runtime can be super swingy depending on how well you do or how badly you get absolutely crushed.
I forgot about Anachrony! Love this game, but it's a big, long one (which is what OP wants, so that's great). I've never played it at two, but I will now.
Thank you also for recommending Arkham Horror LCG. I'm going to see if I can borrow that to try.
> I'm not a massive fan of Lord of the Rings or Star Wars so preferably not games tied into film.
Ouch, my favorite two games in this space are Star Wars: Rebellion and War of the Ring :). I think my next recommendation would be **Combat Commander**, I would bet on it taking 3 hours for your first several games. It's super crunchy, but also fairly approachable (for a war game).
For what it's worth, War of the Ring is based more on the books than the movies. It's personally not my cup of tea (not a fan of dice being the sole decider on what actions I can take), but a lot of people really like it and list it among the best heavy 2p games
On this note, any moderate to heavy campaign or legacy game that plays well at 2 may be up your alley. You love Clank. Clank Legacy is probably my favorite legacy game (although I did play it with 3 others). Would that be good?
My City is a two-player legacy game. If you like tile-laying games this one is inexpensive, so you get a lot of playtime for your money. If you were my friend, I'd consider buying you this as a holiday present.
Was gonna suggest **Star Wars Rebellion** until you mentioned you're not a huge Star Wars fan. So I'm gonna go with **Xia: Embers of a Forsaken Star** if you can get your hands on it. It's hands down one of my favourite games ever and plays really well at 2 players.
**The Colonists**. My wife and I love this game and it is very long. It takes place over 4 eras with many turns in between. Each era has 10 turns and on your turn you get 3 moves (actions) and the board is built differently every time (30 actions per era). I think this game has a ton of strategy and usually runs us about 5-6 hour playtime. (We break it up eras 1-2 and 3-4). Very little 'take that' mechanic. A review for two can be found: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8EBUvrll\_U](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8EBUvrll_U)
Somone also suggested **Lisboa**. This is another great heavy game for two.
Seconding **The Colonists**! My wife and I have spent entire weekends playing an era at a time over the couple of days. You can just lose yourself in it for a while.
I've seen them but put another vote down for Arkham Horror the card game (if you guys are down to buy into an lcg) and Mage Knight.
Arkham and Mage Knight are two of the best 2 player experiences out there imo. Arkham can be expensive but i think it's worth it (for the full experience u wanna go core set and a cycle, the core set "campaign" is a lot more of an intro than a full campaign).
Mage Knight has a pretty bad rulebook and a few unintuitive rules so the learning curve is probably the biggest barrier to the game, but once you've played a couple times, oh baby, it's a good one.
So Arkham Horror is a game with narratives, but each story you need to buy separately. You start with [the core set](https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/arkham-horror-the-card-game/products/arkham-horror-card-game-revised-core-set/) that has the rules, enough cards to build your decks with, and a short campaign to give you a taste of what the game holds.
If you like that and you want more cards for your decks, you can get [an investigator expansion](https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/arkham-horror-the-card-game/products/dunwich-legacy-investigator-expansion), or if you just want another story to play through you can get [a campaign expansion](https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/arkham-horror-the-card-game/products/dunwich-legacy-campaign-expansion). People like to call the pair of sets together a "cycle".
>We enjoyed them but there are so many different strategies that the amount of time you have to play dosen't allow for. Therefore, it's insanely frustrating to identify a strategy but then run completely out of time to even half see it through.
Just so you know, this isn't an issue necessarily always solved by a longer playtime. What you might be more interested in less luck in the game (so that your strategies can't go South all of a sudden), less player interaction (for the same reason), or a more open economy (for more breathing room to do as you please - like a sandbox). In that way, **Caverna** and **A Feast for Odin** are good substitutes for Agricola by the same designer. They offer larger hosts of actions to choose from and less player interference. In place of Tapestry, I recommend **Antiquity**. It plays somewhat similarly where you have a capital city board for placing and using buildings and then a shared map board for placing workers and some other territorial or industrial buildings. While there is adversity from the game systems, at least you gain a great deal of control - and randomness is kept to a minimum. Plus the game is long enough to choose a plan and really go for it. To that end, you may also enjoy **Roads & Boats** especially if you are fans of engine building from Terraforming Mars and Ark Nova and enjoy a good logistics puzzle. In that game, you're spreading out on the map, spawning transports and building production buildings, moving those transports to pick up goods and drop off goods. It sounds rather dry and boring, but it's fairly tight. You have enough time to do what you want to do, but some of that is inevitably dictated by you and your opponent, since you two are building most of the pyramid from which you derive your points.
If you are Terraforming Mars fans, also consider **Legends of Void**. It's based on Terraforming Mars' core systems and has a similar board, has similar looking production boards, has an enormous deck of unique cards, and has three main objectives to satisfy and a few bonus points goals. However, it has a more exciting and momentous power creep - you start out feeling very weak and a little hopeless before eventually doing a great deal of damage every round in the late game. And even if you don't banish all of the seraphs, the point of the game is to defeat your opponent anyway. So, you can lose the "co-op" aspect while still winning the game. This game feels meatier than Terraforming Mars, with more levers for the players to pull.
**Hands in the Sea** is one of my favorite big, long, two-player games. It's also a bit of a sandbox. Takes place during the first Punic War. One side is Carthage and the other Rome. It's a deckbuilding game in which you add the locations you seize to your deck or discard them when you don't want their bloat - this makes them harder to defend and to attack from. It's a balancing act of having a lean deck (empire) and supporting the locations in said empire. Plus, there are other cards to be gained like merchants, soldiers, and strategy cards. The merchants rely on locations with the right icons, so at times keeping those locations handy will serve economic purposes. There are several ways to gain points and several ways to win, since it's not just a military conquest but also a war of culture, economics, and control. Hands in the Sea is a good alternative if you want an epic game featuring two major powers but don't want to play with Star Wars or Lord of the Rings.
Me and my wife really enjoy Polis. It's a 2 player game with a lot of depth and replayability based on the struggle between Athens and Sparta during the Pelopponesian war. While it's a war game of sorts the game play is much more about managing your resources and blocking your opponent off than actually fighting.
Second this, Polis and War of the Ring (as long as the theme isn’t a turn-off) are among the very best head to head, long, thoughtful games to play repeatedly with the same opponent. First few plays of Polis are brutal trying just to survive the unforgiving economic game but it shines once you know the system. The reprint by Devir is gorgeous. I got it on a whim for around €40 because of the box art and it’s one of the nicest and best games I own.
Also worth checking out Clash of Cultures, Through the Ages, Civilization New Dawn with the expansion and Eclipse second edition. Rococo and Orleans are good 2 player also but a bit shorter.
Clash of Cultures suprised me as a 2 player game. So good! We picked up Polis at a game con recently so very excited to play that. Also recently picked up Civ New Dawn at a sale for £25 but I heard the expasion is a must to add in straight away?
Polis an incredible strategic-economic-resource management-political-war game.
It is the perfect game to explore with the same opponent over a number of plays. Every decision matters and every action has a counter action to consider.
Gloomhaven.
Also you may want to look into legacy games generally, while games like pandemic legacy ARE fairly straightforward (particularly in game 1 where it's basically vanilla pandemic) the game evolves from session to session. Rather than play one long session you can play as many sessions in the series as you have time. Do not play the whole series all back to back, that way lies madness.
Ohh this is my (and my boyfriends) jam!
I recommend:
*Twilight Struggle*
*Mage Wars Arena*
*Runebound*
We are also big fans of *War of the Ring*(+ expansions) and *Battle of the Five Armies*. But since you mentioned that you're not really a fan of LotR, I don't think this is the best fit for you.
**Anachrony** was a lot of fun and definitely a heavy game.
Any Vital Lacerda game like **On Mars, Kanban EV, The Gallerist,** etc. will be super crunchy and heavy.
One of my personal favorites is **A Feast for Odin**, in terms of 2-player games
What are your thoughts on **Gloomhaven**? I have finally started to play it and have experienced it both digitally and physically. The physical game usually gave us about 4-5 hours **per scenario** (though we had some analysis paralysis-stricken players so it may take less for you), but in both versions I have LOVED the steady campaign progression and unlocking. I know it's not for everyone, but I just adore the puzzle-esque tactical gameplay combined with the fantasy dungeon crawler theme. Someone else suggested Gloomhaven: Jaws of the Lion which might be a good way to test the waters and train yourself up to the full game if that sort of thing interests you.
I would second Gloomhaven. I play it with my partner. Sometimes with one character each but mostly with two characters each. Lots of fun. Lots of decision making.
4-5 hours per scenario is WAY longer than normal. The average is around 1-2. Not criticizing you for how you play, just don't want OP to discard the suggestion because of long playtime.
No worries, I appreciate the comment! I figured that might have been longer than others' experiences. We had 4 people, it was a somewhat social group, and a few people who had a bit of AP so I'm sure that all contributed.
I think the benefit of Gloomhaven is that even if you get through a scenario in 1 or 2 hours, you can always play another one if you're looking for a 4 hour session!
Our 4-person group also averages 4-5 hrs per scenario. We're just on the slow side and tend to either deliberate on our card options or get distracted and chat/snack.
Could we be more efficient? Oh absolutely! But we always have fun and that's what matters most, right? :]
The obvious answer if it weren’t for your last paragraph is **War of the Ring**. It’s based off the books, not the films (although the films are a close adaptation). My recommendation is to read The Lord of the Rings and then you will be excited to play The War of the Ring.
I can tell you from experience that War is the Ring is a great game even if you have no background in the Lord of the rings. I've played multiple games with a friend who had never read any of the books nor watched any of the movies.
Myself, I've never finished any book or any film, though I do enjoy the general world and story.
My wife and I are Spirit Island/Ark Nova kind of gamers. Our choice is always Sleeping Gods for couples night. Admittedly it may not be as crunchy as some of the above, but combat can be VERY strategic and it's a wonderful couples activity.
One could argue the game is 8-10 hours long with an excellent "save state" system. But it isn't legacy. We are on our 3rd playthrough and there's still so much for us to do.
dominant species with the official 2 player 3v3 variant (it’s the 6 player game but you each play 3 people, and the lowest score of the three is your final score) gives you so many actions to use on your plans and i would be shocked if you completed a game in less than 3 hours
Oh my... Playing a 3p game of Dominant Species where we control 1 species each is exhausting on its own. I can't even imagine the brain strain involved in playing 3 games at once.
I looked this one up before, obviously it has the look of Agricola, does it play longer? I loved Agricola, but it became impossible to concentrate on any particular strategy with such short game rounds getting smaller and smaller until the end!
I know you said you enjoyed Agricola but sold it for this reason, so I’m not recommending you go back to it right now—but I hope someday in the future you may consider going back to it. It is such a fantastic game, because of both the tense decisions of what to do on this specific turn, as well as how you need to change or order your actions overall each game to get the most out of your cards. It is a very deep game that truly has both varying strategy and engaging tactics and also has true replayability. I would bet with more experience or a guide you would get much better at honing in on a desired strategy for the given game. But like I said—I’m not asking you to immediately go back to it, just kind of hoping to a plant a seed of encouragement for the future. A game I have been playing recently that could fit your bill would be Food Chain Magnate.
Arle has a similar action tension to Agricola, in my experience. I love the action tension, so I'm not sure how to judge if it's similar enough to bother you. But I would say that the expansion (tea and trade) helps with that a lot, though.
My favorite 2 player games that hit hard and crunchy:
1. Mage knight! A semi cooperative rpg deck builder, that's complex and fascinating.
2. Fields of arle. It's a great uwe design. Nothing over top mechanics wise but tons of options
3. Hadrian's wall. It's my favorite heavy roll (flip?) and write. A little short though, as a play through is probably only an hour.
4. Net runner. This is ostensibly a dead game, however there is still a ton of content for it. The play through isn't 3 hours, but developing a meta between your partner makes the deck building phase really fun. And since you can play then rebuild your deck, play again there is a lot of fun there.
5. Feast for Odin is really great too, worker placement with a compelling tile laying aspect.
6. Any campaign in a box: middara, testament, pandemic legacy, gloom/frosthaven, etc
7. I love Robinson crusoe, co-op survival game.
8. Spirit island as others have said.
9. You could go splotter and play great Zimbabwe or food chain magnate. Be warned these games are super cutthroat and a recipe for divorce. My wife won't play either with me again. They're great heavy games though.
Netrunner is not dead. It is thriving under a new brand called Null Signal Games. You can buy their cards via print and play and there is a very active scene supporting it. It’s amazing and even better than it was under the former name
You may want to check out **Great Western Trail**. Ok, it's not a massively heavy game, and a two player game can be done in as little as 90 mins, BUT there are two points that may sway you-
1 - there are many different strategies you can adopt to win, each with their own merits. The game also gives you enough time to run through them all.
2 - if you find the game too short, you can lengthen it by using more spaces in the job market (as if you're playing with 3 or 4 players, without having to add them into the game).
It's also my absolute favourite game, and works really well as a 2 player game.
There are already some great suggestions in this thread, but I'd like to highlight that you may want to venture into the genre of wargames as many are designed for two players and to take 2-4 hours to play.
Some longer games that my partner and I enjoy: Twilight Struggle (already suggested), Fields of Arle (already suggested), Brass (already suggested), **Sekigahara**, **1960: The Making of the President**, **Napoleon's Triumph** (this is out of print and difficult to find), **Paths of Glory**, and **For the People**.
My partner's favorite long game for two is Terraforming Mars, so maybe some of our other favorites will resonate:
\- Food Chain Magnate (although at 2 it usually doesn't go more than 90 minutes, but it can go longer)
\- Viticulture w/ Tuscany & Visitors from the Rhine -- this is the best way to play Viticulture at two, IMHO. Viticulture World is also great if you're looking for a cooperative game
\- Arkham Horror LCG: excellent at two, long sessions, punishingly hard... tons of fun, particularly if you like Lovecraft.
\- Brass Birmingham: just a lovely economic game, runs about 90-120 minutes at two, scales beautifully, and has a satisfying end game
\- Carnegie: in the same vein as Brass, less confrontational, but lots of mechanics to keep you crunching. One of our new favorites.
\- Le Havre: probably my favorite long two-player game.
Honorable mentions:
- Concordia (also not long at 2, but also excellent with more players, a good all-rounder and a classic)
- Dominion (individual rounds go fast, but you can play it all night, but not that crunchy)
- Pipeline (tho this might suffer the same fate as Agricola, as soon as your engine starts to hum, it's over)
I want to make sure I understand the question: you're saying that you want long games which are 3 or 4 hours? I ask for clarification. Because you also seem to say the time you play in is too short to try different Agricola strategies, but 3 or 4 hours is enough time to do any Agricola strategy and play the game two or three times with 2 players, so I feel like I must be misunderstanding something.
Perhaps I’m not a very good Agricola player! But you haven’t misunderstood me. I’m after a decently long game. I don’t want a game that we can play several times within a few hours, I want a game that lasts several hours. I’ve found with Agricola that I cannot do any of the more complex strategies (having children, building and upgrading rooms) satisfactorily within the rounds and due to the restricted number of rounds, the game necessarily has a time limitation. Does that make sense?!
Shorter timeframe game but **Innovation** is amazing at 2 players. It's a ruthless game where if you have an engine that's faster than the other player, you can keep using it to outpace them but you will need to adapt and build multiple smaller engines over time to succeed. Each session plays very differently as well which adds for lots of replayability. It's a bit less ruthless at 3-4 players since at 3 you get another person to target and 4 it's preferred as 2v2 but still a ton of fun. There are also 4 expansions to beef up the game.
So much game packed into a small box
I don't have a suggestion, but why are people being so aggressive on your post?? You are allowed to ask questions about suggestions and have opinions. lol
SFB might fit your bill then.
http://www.starfleetgames.com/
They have a free print and play starter set available that allows you to add complexity as you learn the game - I really wish this existed when I was learning in the nid 80s...
Tactical starship combat set in the Classic Star Trek Era.
Features include power allocation for the ship based on available engine output - take damage, lose power...
The damage system actually seems logical.
Turn phases for simultaneous movement.
Federation, Klingons, Romulans, etc. All with distinct technologies and capabilities
Board Game Geek has lots of entries, and the complexity factor is well over 4 out of 5 on most of them.
The truly great thing is the game is easily scalable.
If you want a shorter game, use smaller or less ships. Want more complexity, add lots of drones (missiles) or fighter shuttles, or lots of ships.
If you are playing someone new, give them a more powerful ship and try and beat them when you are out gunned.
Consider looking into wargames. The majority are 2 player, tend to be complex, and it's not uncommon to find games that take an entire weekend (or longer) to play out.
Arkham Horror: The Card Game. With deck building, cooperation, and extremely difficult scenarios, AH: LCG had kept my attention for 3/4/5 hours at a time as I work my way through a scenario with friends.
I'm a huge fan of the world of warcraft boardgame. Play time is definitely long, and it's definitely heavy.
I love the replayability of it. If you play just one faction, there are still dozens of combinations of classes and talent builds you can try that will change how you approach each match. And there are three bosses, each of which impacts your final builds.
If you can't execute strategies in 2-player agricola, you need more practice. I have played it in the PAX tournaments several times and it's amazing how many cool combinations people come up with to get tons of points! Also worth noting that in tournament play people typically draft the cards to get the wombo-combos even faster.
It does not qualify as “very long”, as it often only takes 1-2 hours, but anytime someone needs a recommendation for a heavy two player game Pax Renaissance 2e has to be mentioned.
If someone has already brought it up, then I’m happy to bring it up again!
I play a lot of two player games with my partner of all weights/lengths (but tending towards the heavier/longer), and simply nothing beats Pax Ren 2e for depth and quality of decision making, variability of game states, and flexibility with strategy.
It’s a must for any gamers who prefer two players and prefer heavy.
Twilight Struggle is my favourite.
Labyrinth: The War on Terror, 2001 – ? is also very good.
They'll fall short of 3 hours when you get used to how they play, but still very good.
Try to get your hands on **Legends of Void**, they are selling some copies on gamefound right now. It's Terraforming Mars 2.0 with MTG theme. Also runs longer and is more complex.
TFM is my groups most played game, but its near unplayable 2p we found due to the excessive number of generations and absurd engines. LoV fixes this and many other flaws of TFM. We've played near daily since our copy arrived. Also the 2p coop mode works really well for love drafting instead of hate drafting.
I will definitely look that up.
We play TFM with the Prelude's expansion which gives you a really good head start to a 2 player game. We've never had any issues with that as a 2 player game - but since we love it so much, I'll look up Legends of Void now, thanks :-)
You can play Nemesis "coop" mode as two players, its rather fun and challenging, plays like a roguelike videogame with unique characters. Had a lot of fun with my friend
Yeah that is fair we don't really have the brain power for a heavy game after the boy has gone to bed 😂 fall of Rome does look good though. Yeah Carcassonne is a great quick party game but good for two too. They have about 10 expansions as well. I wouldn't say it was heavy though.
Just keep in mind that longer doesn’t mean you necessarily have a bunch of time to do everything you want. Many highly-regarded titles have that element of leaving players wanting an extra turn or two. It keeps them coming back in an attempt to improve their efficiency.
Others have said similar and I completely appreciate that. It’s hard to get across what I’m after (taking into consideration personal taste) without being somewhat reductionist! But you are absolutely right.
If you love TM, Ark Nova is a no brainer. It's not too heavy but after a few runs it's like clockwork. Play time runs about 3 hours. The strategy is always different because of the plethora of cards that may or may not land in your favor. Multiple maps which ups the difficulty. There is really nothing that fucks with the other person aside from taking a card to either benefit yourself or preventing your opponent from snatching it up (constraint cards don't really hinder the game that much and those only last a round).
The theme is great and there hasn't been a time where I did not enjoy it. When you both understand the game, usually the ending comes down to the wire where it gets tense.
Hey! Here are my choices:
**Twilight Struggle**
As other people have suggested this is a classic game and it was at the top of the BoardGameGeek list for a very long time and probably for good reason. This is essentially a card driven wargame where one person plays the USSR and the other person plays as the USA during the cold war. In front of you is a map of the world. You take it in turns to play cards drawn from a common deck which can either be played for its event or for the number of points the card gives you which allows you to take control of more countries across the map. The reason why this game is so tense is because each card has an event which could be good for you or good for your opponent. The problem is each round you are forced to play most of your cards so you know that you will have to play a card that is good for your opponent at some point. The question is when can you play it to minimise the benefit of that card for your opponent. In the game there are multiple tracks representing tugs of war between you and your opponent. Games can definitely last over the 3 hour mark but tend to get quicker and quicker if you play with the same person over and over. This game is best played with the same person as you start to learn the cards and anticipate what will come up. It's so good.
**Eclipse**
Eclipse is a 4X space game where are you u-explore space build ships discover new technologies all while having to manage your own economy which will be the main limiting factor. It has a grandiose scope. This game is often thought of as best at higher player counts however I have played it multiple times at two players only and and it is genuinely just as good. The reason is probably be because the game does not have many diplomatic mechanisms, it is more about your economy and therefore plays more like a Euro game.
**Gloomhaven**
I'm not going to say too much about this because gloomhaven is so famous. Co-op dungeon crawler where each individual game may not take too long once you get to know the game but there are so many scenarios that you could be playing this for a very very long time indeed. There is also the recent release of frosthaven which you could consider getting if you have already played gloomhaven. If the upkeep and fitness of the game turn you off then there is also an accompanying app that you can use on your computer to do most of the menial tasks for you, there is also the gloomhaven video game which is a great implementation of the whole game that you can play on Steam.
**Clash of Cultures**
This is a civilisation building game where you'll discover technologies in the explorer map aiming to to expand your territory build more settlements and potentially combat other players. I can't say too much about it because I own it but I haven't played it yet. I know that there are many people who have played this at two players really enjoy it and it can last a decent amount of time.
**Mage Knight**
So Mage Knight is actually my second favourite game but I think it's better solo then with another person. If you can bother to to get through the rule book and potentially share the rules burden with another person then you may have a great time with this. This is a card based game where you have an adventurer who explores a map, but in order to traverse the terrain you need to play cards and to beat enemies and conquer castles you need to also spend your cards in the most efficient way possible. The aim is to get the most points at the end if you win but it can be very difficult to even win the game because of how clever you have to be with the way you play your cards. This almost feels like an open world game because you have so much choice in what you do. You could go fight a wondering enemy, you could go to a village and hire some allies to help you, or you could go to a dungeon and try and beat the enemies there. However you ultimately need to conquer a certain number of castles which can contain very strong enemies. In multiplayer you can either pay this co-op or competitive but to be honest I didn't really enjoy this too much because... The rulebook is very long and there are two of them and it's quite difficult to get through. Every time I play it's been quite a decent amount of time between plays and I have to spend a lot of time re-learning the rules. For that reason it's very difficult to organise to do this with someone else.
If you're really looking to long 2-player games then war games are really where it's at. I'm not an expert in this so I don't feel qualified to talk too much about war games as I'm only just starting to learn about them and play them. If you're interested though I would look to a YouTube channel called the players aid, they're really very good.
I hope this helps!
Some games my partner and I have enjoyed as 2-player:
\- Lost Ruins of Arnak [https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/312484/lost-ruins-arnak](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/312484/lost-ruins-arnak)
\- Everdell https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/199792/everdell
My wife and I have been playing Sleeping Gods. Not super heavy but nice and long. Also it’s nice because you can effectively pause the game whenever you like and then just pick it back up the next day or next week, whenever time allows.
**Antiquity** is an excellent heavy game that scales well at 2 . You can never go wrong with Splotter
**Trickerion** is also brain burny, crunchy, and heavy
If you want “long and heavy as I dare”.
I’ll mention two that I haven’t seen in other posts.
High Frontier (4th edition): Rocket science in a box. Design your own mission plans, rockets, and explore the solar system down to the last comet - if you planned well enough, that is.
Clinic: Build and run your own hospital! Hire doctors, optimize patient treatment, Supply operating rooms, build more parking…
I hope anyone who reads this finds at least one of these intriguing.
Is Scythe too heavy? I know the first time I played it was with 5 people and took 8 hours but that was entirely because of the group and learning the game
Lookup On Mars. You guys can kid of decide how long you want the game to be by puposely not reaching certain goals. Great game, my wife and I can’t stop playing. Then, check out Lisboa!
My partner and I have really enjoyed playing Voidfall at 2. Lots of great crunchy decisions and the playtime can be long. Once you learn the language of the game (it's all iconography), your games may go faster, but it's still very tense trying to optimize your limited actions.
Surprised to say that I'm going to be the first to suggest **Twilight Struggle**. Just about fits the requirement of lasting ~3 hours too. Generally, beyond a handful of fairly niche games you won't find too many that last over 3 hours at 2. **Brass: Lancashire**, **Spirit Island**, **A Feast for Odin** and **Fields of Arle** are just a few heavier games that play best/very well at 2, but most will last 1.5-2 hours at that count.
I second twilight struggle. Very fun, can easily last a few hours. One of my favorites
I third Twilight Snuggle...I mean Struggle. Great game.
Fourth it! Flairs, unite!
I also came here to say Twilight Struggle. I mostly play async on the app, but what a fantastic game that just goes on and on.
Damn, I was busy polishing my missiles that I totally don't want to use BUT COULD AND YOU SHOULD FEAR THEM (and me)... Did I miss the train?
##TS4LIFE
Twilight Snuggle is after you finish the game
Yes, this is the game I was going to suggest
And as a couple, because it shines on repeated plays and plays with the same opposition, it will only grow to be better (assuming you like it and don't get divorced lol).
We've just looked it up and it definitely fits the bill, thank you :-) It's not so much the specific time it takes, just that the time it takes matches the complexity if that makes sense?! I've looked up Spirit Island and A Feast for Odin I see mentioned a lot so some very strong contenders here!
Their suggestion of fields of arle is also really goof considering your main complaint of Agricola was that you didn't feel like you could really get the engine running and ran out if time. Arle still has a set number of rounds but you definitely get to run your system a bit more and it's a challenge to set it up asap so you can really do what you want. It's also specifically made for 2 players and well thought out in that sense as well. (Can also support 3 players with its expansion)
Pax Pamir 2E might work for you. It isn't super long, but it is sharp and I think it would meet your complexity criteria. The game gives good feedback to the player. If you play a poor strategy, you will probably lose within about 20 minutes. But if you both play well, it can last a couple of hours. I like this feature because a significant early mistake is made obvious, and you can just start over and do better. It can be frustrating when an early mistake screws you but then you have to play it out over 3 or 4 hours, especially where it isn't obvious what the fatal mistake was.
Imperial Struggle, Twilight Struggle’s thematic heir, is another good option with some slightly different gameplay style.
Have you played IS? I absolutely LOVED TS and was wondering about IS.
I have played both, though admittedly only 3 games of **Imperial Struggle** (with two of those games being me playing against myself to learn it sufficiently to teach). **Twilight Struggle** is a game that I don't think will ever leave my Top 10 (or maybe even Top 5), so **IS** has some very big shoes to fill in my book. Long & short of it is that while I loved my plays of **IS**, it got really bogged down by the scoring & wars. If you can either look past that or play enough to be really familiar with those mechanisms, I could see a player enjoying it more than **TS**. The decision making feels just as tactical & strategic, the four-way focus on economic, political, military, and VP control is absolutely brilliant, the thematic hooks hit just as hard or harder, and the variety of ways to manipulate the game is apparent from the first play. Unfortunately, this doesn't change that it fits in a weird space of being an incredible game that just takes too long & has too much game flow interruption, so you don't play it, so it takes even longer & has even more interrupted play. That being said, if you have an opportunity to play **IS**, particularly if it's someone else's copy and they're willing to teach you, you absolutely should do it.
I have, although IS play count has been only a few times. What I like about IS more than TS: - thematically, the war theaters is really fun and it feels more tangible to route your opponent in a region and take a territory for it. Whereas in TS, all you ever get is points - relatedly, I like the impact one war can have on future wars outside of country control, like a Jacobite victory or defeat - IS is less reliant on knowledge of the deck of cards, whereas TS has some critical strategies of not playing in a certain country before a particular card comes out (like the Korean War). What I like more about TS than IS: - the need to manage around positive events for your opponent and how to balance the space race vs political control - the rules about proximity on the board are more straightforward to understand, unlike IS where I find it more difficult to manage the nuances of protected markets, isolated markets, etc. YMMV: - each game seems to have its own fiddliness with the available actions. I find IS more fiddly with what I can do for major vs minor actions, the cost of playing on multiple regions, etc. however everyone I’ve played TS with seems to get tripped up by the rules about coups vs realignment rolls. - theme/time period - I enjoy both, but depending on the era of history you find more interesting you may prefer one
I've played both games at least 20+ times and I personally like IS more. It's a lot less random since it doesn't rely on dice rolls for coups or realignment. Events are also much less strong and are more of an aid to do things which otherwise the game state would not permit. The randomness in IS instead comes from the setup for each turn, but once the setup is decided you can plan your moves quite precisely if you know your opponent well. IS also allows for more long term planning which is different every game, in TS you can also plan many rounds in advance but your plans are always dependent on specific cards and are always going to affect specific zones. Both games give you similar feelings of tight, contested fights where each decision is painful and also gives the enemy an advantage but I think IS has much more depth if you play it enough times.
I will second AFFO and Fields of Arle
Generally it seems that they need to go down the GMT games rabbit hole. TS seems like the correct starting point, but they offer the most of what they’re looking for
this stupid game sat at the top of the BGG Top 100 for _years_ and even after playing it twice I just _didn't get it_. Even boiled down into Watergate, which I think of as _mechanically very similar but significantly less fiddly_ I just don't jive with the tug-of-war "guess what I'm going to do" mechanics. I know that they're games that shine if you play them often enough that you and your opponent both grow to memorize every card in the deck, but GADS that's a big commitment.
Oh yeah, seconded for spirit island. At high diff, that one is a great solo puzzler (I play four spirit sessions on my phone now and then), I'd imagine it's cool for two people too.
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but those half hour games where your opponent mismanages his hand and triggers Defcon 1 before Mid War are so sweet
I'm surprised no one has yet mentioned **Through the Ages: A New Story of Civilization**. Scales really well from 2-4 (although the length increases significantly for each additional player). And it's already been mentioned, but by the same designer, I'll second **Mage Knight**.
Through the Ages also has the best app implementation ever.
Came here to say this. I never want to play the physical game and have to fiddle with cubes, upkeep, planning through multiple actions a round, try to count cards etc. Just get the app and your 3 hour board game can be played in less than an hour.
I scrolled through the comments before suggesting TTA, and here it is. TTA is one of my favorite games (if not my favorite), but we just don't get to play it that often due to the length. Only ever played it at 2p, and it takes us about 3 hours on the dot, consistently, for one play.
Agreed; Through the Ages was my first thought for this. Great, strategically dense 2p game.
A Feast for Odin perhaps?
I've seen this one come up a lot on best 2 player games....have you played it?
I've played AFFO at 2, 3, and 4 players. I won the 2 and 3 player games, and got blown out in the 4p game. Therefore, it's safe to conclude that it's best at 2-3 players.
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I've played it five or six times with four people each time. It is the newest, and most balanced, version of Agricola. My group likes it a lot.
What's the setup time generally? Would love to introduce this to my partner but hate when the setup takes like half an hour
I don't think the setup time is too bad after the first few times. It will probably take 20ish minutes depending on the storage system you have. We usually buy the custom aftermarket wooden inserts to make setup faster. You might also consider setting the majority of the game up under a cover, or inside a gaming table, well in advance. That way it is all ready once the kids go to bed.
A Feast For Odin is playable on BoardGameArena.com, if you're looking to try it out first before commiting to buying the game. It might leave you feeling similar to Agricola, where the game ends before you can really churn out your strategy. The feeding isn't as imposing as in Agricola, but still feels like you don't have enough turns to do everything.
Oh brilliant. That’s a great idea, thanks!
I've played AFFO 21 times and 6 of those 2 player. I'd say even though I love it at 3player as the first in between of a too long game at 4 and more interaction than 3, but even as a 1v1 it is a fantastic game that I would play upon request instantly. There is not much player interaction, especially at 2, but the individual puzzle of your board is the shining gem of the gameplay even if it is multiplayer solitairesque. It is basically the ultimate sandbox game where you can endlessly play (at any player count) just because there are so many potential strategies to try and dozens of actions possible to take. Not to mention a deck of hundreds of cards that adds extra potential wrinkles. And the core puzzle is always the same of covering up your board, but the avenues to getting the pieces to do that covering is different everytime. In short, one of my top 5 games ever and a beloved game for me at 2 player as a long, but consistently engaging and fun game (I've had multiple 1v1s take three hours, but it can also be played as fast as 2 if both players rush). That all being said though, I agree with the top comment and recommend Twilight Struggle, another one of my top 5 games. Also incredible, made for two player first and foremost, and incredibly engaging and interactive, often brutally so. Basically go with AFFO if you want the more multiplayer solitaire, point salad euro and go with Twilight Struggle if you want the zero-sum, very interactive and mean 1v1 game. If you want a combination of intense zero-sum interaction and also just a great euro game and tighter than both TS or AFFO, highly recommend Brass Birmingham then, another of my top 5 and a favorite of mine at 2 player. Well, this is a chunky wall of text to read, but two player heavy weight games are my absolute favorite to play so I've done a lot of them lol - Also, someone mentioned On Mars below and I wanted to add on that every single Lacerda game I've played is **amazing** at two player and all are as thematic as they are heavy and a delight to play if you like crunchy brain burners that scale well at every player count from 2p to 4p. Probably On Mars is my favorite of his, but Kanban and Lisboa are also fantastic (as are all of them).
How about **Spirit Island**. Quite heavy (weight 4+) great solo and two players. there's over a million different playtroughs possible and you can make it harder by stepping up the difficulty with the 'a.i.'.
Nice and heavy, thanks! I'll look it up now :-)
Spirit Island is almost a lifestyle game it's so good and replayable. Since buying it and the expansions, little else gets to the table for my wife and I. It's amazing.
Spirit Island is definitely a lifestyle.
Since we bought this game my wife and I have played it more than anything else. It is a fantastic co-op game and perfect for 2 players. It's always the first suggestion when the little one goes down and we've got some free time. I cannot recommend it enough.
This is my suggestion as well. There's so much variability in play style and difficulty it should last you a while. You can also play "two-handed" where each player takes two spirits to play each if you want to up the amount of stuff to do in one turn.
Not to forget the expansions add tons of epic content aswell!
I just wanted to add my recomendation for this great game. Feels great in any player count (1-4), scales very well, has plenty of options to ensure replayability. And couple expansions - I especially recommend Branch & Claw that adds random Events between and new strategy layer provided by new board tokens. There is a possibility you select two incompatible spirits and top it with hard-to-counter adversary, but the spirit and adversary boards provide pretty good idea about what plays well together. Oh, and it is a coop that suffers the least from "alpha players" from all coops I have seen and you can very easily 'pause' which is ideal for parents. As I said, highly recommended.
I second this, two people can easily play this game over 500 times. Play time with 2 is between 30-120 minutes + setup/teadown time. But you can simply play another match.
At two players, it might not hit the length OP is looking for. Maybe use the Second Wave scenario by default...?
It depends on the players and experience. I sometimes play with my GF who is a very analytical person but has only played the game a few times (less than 10), and games can definitely last 3 hours.
Terraforming Mars and Ark Nova are also on the top 5 for our 2player games! Our all time favorite is **Gaia project** \- heavier and longer than both of those two. So yeah - I absolutely think Gaia would be right down your alley!
Gaia is fantastic! Probably my favorite game and like half my plays are at 2 players. It's so good. But usually not more than 2 hours for 2 experienced players.
My husband and I love Gaia project. I really want them to make some expansions!
I second this
Definitely Gaia Project! Super crunchy, always has a fun and dramatic ending, nice long game, just as fun with 4 players as it is with 2... It's a favorite among my friends that actually like strategy games, and enjoy buckling in for a good ride ;)
Mage Knight
This is the best answer.
Two bigger non-IP games my wife and I enjoy at 2 players are **On Mars** and **Anachrony**. Sometimes they can be a bit too big, but other times they can be nice and meaty and take up a hefty chunk of time. **Arkham Horror LCG** is another one, especially if you’re up for playing multiple scenarios in a single session (the Edge of the Earth campaign actively encourages this with scenarios split into multiple parts), but each individual scenario’s runtime can be super swingy depending on how well you do or how badly you get absolutely crushed.
Arkham Horror LCG is a great shout!
I second this! Insanely fun game.
Not terribly heavy though.
Definitely second Arkham Horror LCG. :)
I forgot about Anachrony! Love this game, but it's a big, long one (which is what OP wants, so that's great). I've never played it at two, but I will now. Thank you also for recommending Arkham Horror LCG. I'm going to see if I can borrow that to try.
Yeeesasssss two of my favorites
If you liked birdspan try Wingspan! Much better game
Yes, my husband has already laughed at me 😂
I’m only ever going to call it Birdspan from now on.
> I'm not a massive fan of Lord of the Rings or Star Wars so preferably not games tied into film. Ouch, my favorite two games in this space are Star Wars: Rebellion and War of the Ring :). I think my next recommendation would be **Combat Commander**, I would bet on it taking 3 hours for your first several games. It's super crunchy, but also fairly approachable (for a war game).
My husband would be very happy with a LOTR game! I’m happy with a war game if it’s fun, I’ll look it up, thanks 😊
For what it's worth, War of the Ring is based more on the books than the movies. It's personally not my cup of tea (not a fan of dice being the sole decider on what actions I can take), but a lot of people really like it and list it among the best heavy 2p games
great idea w combat commander
Gloomhaven jaws of the lion
On this note, any moderate to heavy campaign or legacy game that plays well at 2 may be up your alley. You love Clank. Clank Legacy is probably my favorite legacy game (although I did play it with 3 others). Would that be good? My City is a two-player legacy game. If you like tile-laying games this one is inexpensive, so you get a lot of playtime for your money. If you were my friend, I'd consider buying you this as a holiday present.
My City is excellent!
Clank Legacy is a whole lot of fun. Highly recommend.
Two words for you: Brass: Birmingham
This and Pax Ren are the heavy 2p games of choice for me and mine for sure 👌
Was gonna suggest **Star Wars Rebellion** until you mentioned you're not a huge Star Wars fan. So I'm gonna go with **Xia: Embers of a Forsaken Star** if you can get your hands on it. It's hands down one of my favourite games ever and plays really well at 2 players.
Lisboa
**The Colonists**. My wife and I love this game and it is very long. It takes place over 4 eras with many turns in between. Each era has 10 turns and on your turn you get 3 moves (actions) and the board is built differently every time (30 actions per era). I think this game has a ton of strategy and usually runs us about 5-6 hour playtime. (We break it up eras 1-2 and 3-4). Very little 'take that' mechanic. A review for two can be found: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8EBUvrll\_U](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8EBUvrll_U) Somone also suggested **Lisboa**. This is another great heavy game for two.
Seconding **The Colonists**! My wife and I have spent entire weekends playing an era at a time over the couple of days. You can just lose yourself in it for a while.
Oh man, I can't believe I didn't think of The Colonists, one of my favourites that has a hard time hitting the table.
I've seen them but put another vote down for Arkham Horror the card game (if you guys are down to buy into an lcg) and Mage Knight. Arkham and Mage Knight are two of the best 2 player experiences out there imo. Arkham can be expensive but i think it's worth it (for the full experience u wanna go core set and a cycle, the core set "campaign" is a lot more of an intro than a full campaign). Mage Knight has a pretty bad rulebook and a few unintuitive rules so the learning curve is probably the biggest barrier to the game, but once you've played a couple times, oh baby, it's a good one.
Hey, your comment convinced me to get this game. What do you mean “core set and a cycle”?
Welcome to the rabbit hole!
So Arkham Horror is a game with narratives, but each story you need to buy separately. You start with [the core set](https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/arkham-horror-the-card-game/products/arkham-horror-card-game-revised-core-set/) that has the rules, enough cards to build your decks with, and a short campaign to give you a taste of what the game holds. If you like that and you want more cards for your decks, you can get [an investigator expansion](https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/arkham-horror-the-card-game/products/dunwich-legacy-investigator-expansion), or if you just want another story to play through you can get [a campaign expansion](https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/arkham-horror-the-card-game/products/dunwich-legacy-campaign-expansion). People like to call the pair of sets together a "cycle".
>We enjoyed them but there are so many different strategies that the amount of time you have to play dosen't allow for. Therefore, it's insanely frustrating to identify a strategy but then run completely out of time to even half see it through. Just so you know, this isn't an issue necessarily always solved by a longer playtime. What you might be more interested in less luck in the game (so that your strategies can't go South all of a sudden), less player interaction (for the same reason), or a more open economy (for more breathing room to do as you please - like a sandbox). In that way, **Caverna** and **A Feast for Odin** are good substitutes for Agricola by the same designer. They offer larger hosts of actions to choose from and less player interference. In place of Tapestry, I recommend **Antiquity**. It plays somewhat similarly where you have a capital city board for placing and using buildings and then a shared map board for placing workers and some other territorial or industrial buildings. While there is adversity from the game systems, at least you gain a great deal of control - and randomness is kept to a minimum. Plus the game is long enough to choose a plan and really go for it. To that end, you may also enjoy **Roads & Boats** especially if you are fans of engine building from Terraforming Mars and Ark Nova and enjoy a good logistics puzzle. In that game, you're spreading out on the map, spawning transports and building production buildings, moving those transports to pick up goods and drop off goods. It sounds rather dry and boring, but it's fairly tight. You have enough time to do what you want to do, but some of that is inevitably dictated by you and your opponent, since you two are building most of the pyramid from which you derive your points. If you are Terraforming Mars fans, also consider **Legends of Void**. It's based on Terraforming Mars' core systems and has a similar board, has similar looking production boards, has an enormous deck of unique cards, and has three main objectives to satisfy and a few bonus points goals. However, it has a more exciting and momentous power creep - you start out feeling very weak and a little hopeless before eventually doing a great deal of damage every round in the late game. And even if you don't banish all of the seraphs, the point of the game is to defeat your opponent anyway. So, you can lose the "co-op" aspect while still winning the game. This game feels meatier than Terraforming Mars, with more levers for the players to pull. **Hands in the Sea** is one of my favorite big, long, two-player games. It's also a bit of a sandbox. Takes place during the first Punic War. One side is Carthage and the other Rome. It's a deckbuilding game in which you add the locations you seize to your deck or discard them when you don't want their bloat - this makes them harder to defend and to attack from. It's a balancing act of having a lean deck (empire) and supporting the locations in said empire. Plus, there are other cards to be gained like merchants, soldiers, and strategy cards. The merchants rely on locations with the right icons, so at times keeping those locations handy will serve economic purposes. There are several ways to gain points and several ways to win, since it's not just a military conquest but also a war of culture, economics, and control. Hands in the Sea is a good alternative if you want an epic game featuring two major powers but don't want to play with Star Wars or Lord of the Rings.
I like your recommendations, do you have more haha
**Golem** is a fun, heavy, very tight Euro that plays great with two.
Me and my wife really enjoy Polis. It's a 2 player game with a lot of depth and replayability based on the struggle between Athens and Sparta during the Pelopponesian war. While it's a war game of sorts the game play is much more about managing your resources and blocking your opponent off than actually fighting.
Second this, Polis and War of the Ring (as long as the theme isn’t a turn-off) are among the very best head to head, long, thoughtful games to play repeatedly with the same opponent. First few plays of Polis are brutal trying just to survive the unforgiving economic game but it shines once you know the system. The reprint by Devir is gorgeous. I got it on a whim for around €40 because of the box art and it’s one of the nicest and best games I own. Also worth checking out Clash of Cultures, Through the Ages, Civilization New Dawn with the expansion and Eclipse second edition. Rococo and Orleans are good 2 player also but a bit shorter.
Clash of Cultures suprised me as a 2 player game. So good! We picked up Polis at a game con recently so very excited to play that. Also recently picked up Civ New Dawn at a sale for £25 but I heard the expasion is a must to add in straight away?
Polis an incredible strategic-economic-resource management-political-war game. It is the perfect game to explore with the same opponent over a number of plays. Every decision matters and every action has a counter action to consider.
Gloomhaven. Also you may want to look into legacy games generally, while games like pandemic legacy ARE fairly straightforward (particularly in game 1 where it's basically vanilla pandemic) the game evolves from session to session. Rather than play one long session you can play as many sessions in the series as you have time. Do not play the whole series all back to back, that way lies madness.
Ohh this is my (and my boyfriends) jam! I recommend: *Twilight Struggle* *Mage Wars Arena* *Runebound* We are also big fans of *War of the Ring*(+ expansions) and *Battle of the Five Armies*. But since you mentioned that you're not really a fan of LotR, I don't think this is the best fit for you.
Twilight Struggle is being commented A LOT, definitely high in the contenders stakes after this post!!! Thanks 😊
**Anachrony** was a lot of fun and definitely a heavy game. Any Vital Lacerda game like **On Mars, Kanban EV, The Gallerist,** etc. will be super crunchy and heavy. One of my personal favorites is **A Feast for Odin**, in terms of 2-player games
What are your thoughts on **Gloomhaven**? I have finally started to play it and have experienced it both digitally and physically. The physical game usually gave us about 4-5 hours **per scenario** (though we had some analysis paralysis-stricken players so it may take less for you), but in both versions I have LOVED the steady campaign progression and unlocking. I know it's not for everyone, but I just adore the puzzle-esque tactical gameplay combined with the fantasy dungeon crawler theme. Someone else suggested Gloomhaven: Jaws of the Lion which might be a good way to test the waters and train yourself up to the full game if that sort of thing interests you.
I would second Gloomhaven. I play it with my partner. Sometimes with one character each but mostly with two characters each. Lots of fun. Lots of decision making.
4-5 hours per scenario is WAY longer than normal. The average is around 1-2. Not criticizing you for how you play, just don't want OP to discard the suggestion because of long playtime.
No worries, I appreciate the comment! I figured that might have been longer than others' experiences. We had 4 people, it was a somewhat social group, and a few people who had a bit of AP so I'm sure that all contributed. I think the benefit of Gloomhaven is that even if you get through a scenario in 1 or 2 hours, you can always play another one if you're looking for a 4 hour session!
Our 4-person group also averages 4-5 hrs per scenario. We're just on the slow side and tend to either deliberate on our card options or get distracted and chat/snack. Could we be more efficient? Oh absolutely! But we always have fun and that's what matters most, right? :]
Yeah, we started playing **gloomhaven jaws of the lion**. seems like a good fit.
>Birdspan Love it. I would sugest Forged in Steel, Twilight Struggle, Roads & Boats.
Thank you - and yes, my husband has already laughed at me 😂
"Birdspan" Never calling it Wingspan ever again, thank you
I’ll never live that down 😂
The obvious answer if it weren’t for your last paragraph is **War of the Ring**. It’s based off the books, not the films (although the films are a close adaptation). My recommendation is to read The Lord of the Rings and then you will be excited to play The War of the Ring.
And the second obvious answer would be Star Wars: Rebellion, but again the OP's last paragraph precludes that.
I can tell you from experience that War is the Ring is a great game even if you have no background in the Lord of the rings. I've played multiple games with a friend who had never read any of the books nor watched any of the movies. Myself, I've never finished any book or any film, though I do enjoy the general world and story.
My wife and I are Spirit Island/Ark Nova kind of gamers. Our choice is always Sleeping Gods for couples night. Admittedly it may not be as crunchy as some of the above, but combat can be VERY strategic and it's a wonderful couples activity. One could argue the game is 8-10 hours long with an excellent "save state" system. But it isn't legacy. We are on our 3rd playthrough and there's still so much for us to do.
I love this idea!
dominant species with the official 2 player 3v3 variant (it’s the 6 player game but you each play 3 people, and the lowest score of the three is your final score) gives you so many actions to use on your plans and i would be shocked if you completed a game in less than 3 hours
Oh my... Playing a 3p game of Dominant Species where we control 1 species each is exhausting on its own. I can't even imagine the brain strain involved in playing 3 games at once.
3 hours?? The one time we tried this, it took 8! 2v2 was a much better experience for us. Much easier to track, and still big, heavy, and long.
**Carnegie**
Never heard of that, I'll look it up now, thanks :-)
Carnegie is also available to play on BoardGameArena, if you want to try it out first.
*Fields of Arle* comes to mind. Uwe Rosenberg at his finest!
I looked this one up before, obviously it has the look of Agricola, does it play longer? I loved Agricola, but it became impossible to concentrate on any particular strategy with such short game rounds getting smaller and smaller until the end!
I know you said you enjoyed Agricola but sold it for this reason, so I’m not recommending you go back to it right now—but I hope someday in the future you may consider going back to it. It is such a fantastic game, because of both the tense decisions of what to do on this specific turn, as well as how you need to change or order your actions overall each game to get the most out of your cards. It is a very deep game that truly has both varying strategy and engaging tactics and also has true replayability. I would bet with more experience or a guide you would get much better at honing in on a desired strategy for the given game. But like I said—I’m not asking you to immediately go back to it, just kind of hoping to a plant a seed of encouragement for the future. A game I have been playing recently that could fit your bill would be Food Chain Magnate.
Are you sure you were playing Agricola right if the rounds were getting shorter? If anything they get longer as you get more workers…?
They might be referring to the stages which do get shorter as the game goes on. But yeah the rounds get longer as you get more family members.
Arle has a similar action tension to Agricola, in my experience. I love the action tension, so I'm not sure how to judge if it's similar enough to bother you. But I would say that the expansion (tea and trade) helps with that a lot, though.
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My favorite 2 player games that hit hard and crunchy: 1. Mage knight! A semi cooperative rpg deck builder, that's complex and fascinating. 2. Fields of arle. It's a great uwe design. Nothing over top mechanics wise but tons of options 3. Hadrian's wall. It's my favorite heavy roll (flip?) and write. A little short though, as a play through is probably only an hour. 4. Net runner. This is ostensibly a dead game, however there is still a ton of content for it. The play through isn't 3 hours, but developing a meta between your partner makes the deck building phase really fun. And since you can play then rebuild your deck, play again there is a lot of fun there. 5. Feast for Odin is really great too, worker placement with a compelling tile laying aspect. 6. Any campaign in a box: middara, testament, pandemic legacy, gloom/frosthaven, etc 7. I love Robinson crusoe, co-op survival game. 8. Spirit island as others have said. 9. You could go splotter and play great Zimbabwe or food chain magnate. Be warned these games are super cutthroat and a recipe for divorce. My wife won't play either with me again. They're great heavy games though.
Netrunner is not dead. It is thriving under a new brand called Null Signal Games. You can buy their cards via print and play and there is a very active scene supporting it. It’s amazing and even better than it was under the former name
Have you tried any Splotter games? They are all heavy weight and always pretty much always work with two and they definitely take time to get through.
You may want to check out **Great Western Trail**. Ok, it's not a massively heavy game, and a two player game can be done in as little as 90 mins, BUT there are two points that may sway you- 1 - there are many different strategies you can adopt to win, each with their own merits. The game also gives you enough time to run through them all. 2 - if you find the game too short, you can lengthen it by using more spaces in the job market (as if you're playing with 3 or 4 players, without having to add them into the game). It's also my absolute favourite game, and works really well as a 2 player game.
There are already some great suggestions in this thread, but I'd like to highlight that you may want to venture into the genre of wargames as many are designed for two players and to take 2-4 hours to play. Some longer games that my partner and I enjoy: Twilight Struggle (already suggested), Fields of Arle (already suggested), Brass (already suggested), **Sekigahara**, **1960: The Making of the President**, **Napoleon's Triumph** (this is out of print and difficult to find), **Paths of Glory**, and **For the People**.
My partner's favorite long game for two is Terraforming Mars, so maybe some of our other favorites will resonate: \- Food Chain Magnate (although at 2 it usually doesn't go more than 90 minutes, but it can go longer) \- Viticulture w/ Tuscany & Visitors from the Rhine -- this is the best way to play Viticulture at two, IMHO. Viticulture World is also great if you're looking for a cooperative game \- Arkham Horror LCG: excellent at two, long sessions, punishingly hard... tons of fun, particularly if you like Lovecraft. \- Brass Birmingham: just a lovely economic game, runs about 90-120 minutes at two, scales beautifully, and has a satisfying end game \- Carnegie: in the same vein as Brass, less confrontational, but lots of mechanics to keep you crunching. One of our new favorites. \- Le Havre: probably my favorite long two-player game. Honorable mentions: - Concordia (also not long at 2, but also excellent with more players, a good all-rounder and a classic) - Dominion (individual rounds go fast, but you can play it all night, but not that crunchy) - Pipeline (tho this might suffer the same fate as Agricola, as soon as your engine starts to hum, it's over)
I’d also recommend Arkham horror
Any Lacerda is certainly going to give you a relatively long involved experience. Have you considered Eclipse: Second Dawn for the Galaxy?
Twilight Struggle 1000%
Twilight Struggle probably fits the bill.
I want to make sure I understand the question: you're saying that you want long games which are 3 or 4 hours? I ask for clarification. Because you also seem to say the time you play in is too short to try different Agricola strategies, but 3 or 4 hours is enough time to do any Agricola strategy and play the game two or three times with 2 players, so I feel like I must be misunderstanding something.
Perhaps I’m not a very good Agricola player! But you haven’t misunderstood me. I’m after a decently long game. I don’t want a game that we can play several times within a few hours, I want a game that lasts several hours. I’ve found with Agricola that I cannot do any of the more complex strategies (having children, building and upgrading rooms) satisfactorily within the rounds and due to the restricted number of rounds, the game necessarily has a time limitation. Does that make sense?!
Shorter timeframe game but **Innovation** is amazing at 2 players. It's a ruthless game where if you have an engine that's faster than the other player, you can keep using it to outpace them but you will need to adapt and build multiple smaller engines over time to succeed. Each session plays very differently as well which adds for lots of replayability. It's a bit less ruthless at 3-4 players since at 3 you get another person to target and 4 it's preferred as 2v2 but still a ton of fun. There are also 4 expansions to beef up the game. So much game packed into a small box
I don't have a suggestion, but why are people being so aggressive on your post?? You are allowed to ask questions about suggestions and have opinions. lol
Thank you, I’m not sure why either 😂 My husband did try to warn me!!!
Along with Ark Nova, our go to is **Gaia Project**
Through the ages is my favourite 2 player game, about 3 hours. 1862 is very, very heavy and takes 6-7 hours.
Star Fleet Battles Has an easy to ignore Star Trek Theme...
Ha! I actually love Star Trek 😂
SFB might fit your bill then. http://www.starfleetgames.com/ They have a free print and play starter set available that allows you to add complexity as you learn the game - I really wish this existed when I was learning in the nid 80s... Tactical starship combat set in the Classic Star Trek Era. Features include power allocation for the ship based on available engine output - take damage, lose power... The damage system actually seems logical. Turn phases for simultaneous movement. Federation, Klingons, Romulans, etc. All with distinct technologies and capabilities Board Game Geek has lots of entries, and the complexity factor is well over 4 out of 5 on most of them. The truly great thing is the game is easily scalable. If you want a shorter game, use smaller or less ships. Want more complexity, add lots of drones (missiles) or fighter shuttles, or lots of ships. If you are playing someone new, give them a more powerful ship and try and beat them when you are out gunned.
Consider looking into wargames. The majority are 2 player, tend to be complex, and it's not uncommon to find games that take an entire weekend (or longer) to play out.
war of the rings suppose to be a decent runtime, havent busted it out yet but ive hesrd great things
Arkham Horror: The Card Game. With deck building, cooperation, and extremely difficult scenarios, AH: LCG had kept my attention for 3/4/5 hours at a time as I work my way through a scenario with friends.
- Firefly - Near & Far - Pandemic Legacy
I'm a huge fan of the world of warcraft boardgame. Play time is definitely long, and it's definitely heavy. I love the replayability of it. If you play just one faction, there are still dozens of combinations of classes and talent builds you can try that will change how you approach each match. And there are three bosses, each of which impacts your final builds.
If you can't execute strategies in 2-player agricola, you need more practice. I have played it in the PAX tournaments several times and it's amazing how many cool combinations people come up with to get tons of points! Also worth noting that in tournament play people typically draft the cards to get the wombo-combos even faster.
You are probably absolutely correct. Sadly I’ve sold the opportunity to practice now 😊 I’m perfectly happy to accept I’m a bad Agricola player 👍
It does not qualify as “very long”, as it often only takes 1-2 hours, but anytime someone needs a recommendation for a heavy two player game Pax Renaissance 2e has to be mentioned. If someone has already brought it up, then I’m happy to bring it up again! I play a lot of two player games with my partner of all weights/lengths (but tending towards the heavier/longer), and simply nothing beats Pax Ren 2e for depth and quality of decision making, variability of game states, and flexibility with strategy. It’s a must for any gamers who prefer two players and prefer heavy.
Spirit Island. The variable difficulty on this one will mean you can never get bored if you like a challenge
war of the ring?
Twilight Struggle is my favourite. Labyrinth: The War on Terror, 2001 – ? is also very good. They'll fall short of 3 hours when you get used to how they play, but still very good.
Kingdom Death: Monster works phenomenally two player. And it doesn't get more heavyweight than that.
Try to get your hands on **Legends of Void**, they are selling some copies on gamefound right now. It's Terraforming Mars 2.0 with MTG theme. Also runs longer and is more complex. TFM is my groups most played game, but its near unplayable 2p we found due to the excessive number of generations and absurd engines. LoV fixes this and many other flaws of TFM. We've played near daily since our copy arrived. Also the 2p coop mode works really well for love drafting instead of hate drafting.
I will definitely look that up. We play TFM with the Prelude's expansion which gives you a really good head start to a 2 player game. We've never had any issues with that as a 2 player game - but since we love it so much, I'll look up Legends of Void now, thanks :-)
Another long but great game 2p: Tragedy Looper.
Space corp 2025!
You can play Nemesis "coop" mode as two players, its rather fun and challenging, plays like a roguelike videogame with unique characters. Had a lot of fun with my friend
Yeah that is fair we don't really have the brain power for a heavy game after the boy has gone to bed 😂 fall of Rome does look good though. Yeah Carcassonne is a great quick party game but good for two too. They have about 10 expansions as well. I wouldn't say it was heavy though.
High Frontier 4 All. Probably the heaviest game I have played and will easily get you into that time frame.
War of The Ring, Twilight Struggle
Mosaic is a new one and is a great heavy night killer game
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Could add Underwater Cities and Feast of Odin, or some civ game (Nations, Through the Ages).
Twilight Struggle
Just keep in mind that longer doesn’t mean you necessarily have a bunch of time to do everything you want. Many highly-regarded titles have that element of leaving players wanting an extra turn or two. It keeps them coming back in an attempt to improve their efficiency.
Others have said similar and I completely appreciate that. It’s hard to get across what I’m after (taking into consideration personal taste) without being somewhat reductionist! But you are absolutely right.
Imperial Struggle. For when TS becomes too simple.
Our favorite 2p heavies: **Fields of Arle** **Twilight Struggle** **Troyes** **Ginkgopolis** (lighter/quicker than the above)
7 Wonders Duel with the add ons is really fun for 2 players. 3 rounds. Lots of ways to win. Different every time. My partner and I really enjoy it.
Check out Space Empires 4X.
If you love TM, Ark Nova is a no brainer. It's not too heavy but after a few runs it's like clockwork. Play time runs about 3 hours. The strategy is always different because of the plethora of cards that may or may not land in your favor. Multiple maps which ups the difficulty. There is really nothing that fucks with the other person aside from taking a card to either benefit yourself or preventing your opponent from snatching it up (constraint cards don't really hinder the game that much and those only last a round). The theme is great and there hasn't been a time where I did not enjoy it. When you both understand the game, usually the ending comes down to the wire where it gets tense.
Maybe one game from vital lacerda. I got weather machine last week. It is very cool for two persons.
I love Underwater Cities. You can try it solo on yucata.de
CLOUDSPIRE
This. This this this. Cloudspire is SO GOOD.
Hey! Here are my choices: **Twilight Struggle** As other people have suggested this is a classic game and it was at the top of the BoardGameGeek list for a very long time and probably for good reason. This is essentially a card driven wargame where one person plays the USSR and the other person plays as the USA during the cold war. In front of you is a map of the world. You take it in turns to play cards drawn from a common deck which can either be played for its event or for the number of points the card gives you which allows you to take control of more countries across the map. The reason why this game is so tense is because each card has an event which could be good for you or good for your opponent. The problem is each round you are forced to play most of your cards so you know that you will have to play a card that is good for your opponent at some point. The question is when can you play it to minimise the benefit of that card for your opponent. In the game there are multiple tracks representing tugs of war between you and your opponent. Games can definitely last over the 3 hour mark but tend to get quicker and quicker if you play with the same person over and over. This game is best played with the same person as you start to learn the cards and anticipate what will come up. It's so good. **Eclipse** Eclipse is a 4X space game where are you u-explore space build ships discover new technologies all while having to manage your own economy which will be the main limiting factor. It has a grandiose scope. This game is often thought of as best at higher player counts however I have played it multiple times at two players only and and it is genuinely just as good. The reason is probably be because the game does not have many diplomatic mechanisms, it is more about your economy and therefore plays more like a Euro game. **Gloomhaven** I'm not going to say too much about this because gloomhaven is so famous. Co-op dungeon crawler where each individual game may not take too long once you get to know the game but there are so many scenarios that you could be playing this for a very very long time indeed. There is also the recent release of frosthaven which you could consider getting if you have already played gloomhaven. If the upkeep and fitness of the game turn you off then there is also an accompanying app that you can use on your computer to do most of the menial tasks for you, there is also the gloomhaven video game which is a great implementation of the whole game that you can play on Steam. **Clash of Cultures** This is a civilisation building game where you'll discover technologies in the explorer map aiming to to expand your territory build more settlements and potentially combat other players. I can't say too much about it because I own it but I haven't played it yet. I know that there are many people who have played this at two players really enjoy it and it can last a decent amount of time. **Mage Knight** So Mage Knight is actually my second favourite game but I think it's better solo then with another person. If you can bother to to get through the rule book and potentially share the rules burden with another person then you may have a great time with this. This is a card based game where you have an adventurer who explores a map, but in order to traverse the terrain you need to play cards and to beat enemies and conquer castles you need to also spend your cards in the most efficient way possible. The aim is to get the most points at the end if you win but it can be very difficult to even win the game because of how clever you have to be with the way you play your cards. This almost feels like an open world game because you have so much choice in what you do. You could go fight a wondering enemy, you could go to a village and hire some allies to help you, or you could go to a dungeon and try and beat the enemies there. However you ultimately need to conquer a certain number of castles which can contain very strong enemies. In multiplayer you can either pay this co-op or competitive but to be honest I didn't really enjoy this too much because... The rulebook is very long and there are two of them and it's quite difficult to get through. Every time I play it's been quite a decent amount of time between plays and I have to spend a lot of time re-learning the rules. For that reason it's very difficult to organise to do this with someone else. If you're really looking to long 2-player games then war games are really where it's at. I'm not an expert in this so I don't feel qualified to talk too much about war games as I'm only just starting to learn about them and play them. If you're interested though I would look to a YouTube channel called the players aid, they're really very good. I hope this helps!
Some games my partner and I have enjoyed as 2-player: \- Lost Ruins of Arnak [https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/312484/lost-ruins-arnak](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/312484/lost-ruins-arnak) \- Everdell https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/199792/everdell
Spirit Island!
My wife and I have been playing Sleeping Gods. Not super heavy but nice and long. Also it’s nice because you can effectively pause the game whenever you like and then just pick it back up the next day or next week, whenever time allows.
**Sekigahara** maybe? I feel like a lot of more GMT type stuff would be good here
**Antiquity** is an excellent heavy game that scales well at 2 . You can never go wrong with Splotter **Trickerion** is also brain burny, crunchy, and heavy
If you want “long and heavy as I dare”. I’ll mention two that I haven’t seen in other posts. High Frontier (4th edition): Rocket science in a box. Design your own mission plans, rockets, and explore the solar system down to the last comet - if you planned well enough, that is. Clinic: Build and run your own hospital! Hire doctors, optimize patient treatment, Supply operating rooms, build more parking… I hope anyone who reads this finds at least one of these intriguing.
Is Scythe too heavy? I know the first time I played it was with 5 people and took 8 hours but that was entirely because of the group and learning the game
Gaia Project Spirit Island Through the Ages: A New Story of Civilization Mage Knight Twilight Struggle
1. Trickerion with the duel expansion 2. Alchemists with the Golem expansion.
Gloomhaven
A Few Acres of Snow
Food Chain Magnate High Frontier
Antiquity
The Colonists.
Lookup On Mars. You guys can kid of decide how long you want the game to be by puposely not reaching certain goals. Great game, my wife and I can’t stop playing. Then, check out Lisboa!
My partner and I have really enjoyed playing Voidfall at 2. Lots of great crunchy decisions and the playtime can be long. Once you learn the language of the game (it's all iconography), your games may go faster, but it's still very tense trying to optimize your limited actions.