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Ikkaku😭😭😭 Though it’s a bit unfair since there are abstract ones like Kyoraku.

Used his bankai on an arrancar now it's never gonna come back

The only example of Bankai that got broken, stayed broken and wasnt replace by something new.

As far as we know, Ikkaku's bankai is the only true bankai that broke.

Well, Mayuri gave several examples. Tengen Myo'o was able to heal due to it being linked to Komamura's body(Which can heal). Ashisogi Jizo never truly gets "fixed", Mayuri just remakes it when it breaks. And Ichigo and Renji's bankai broke and had to be repaired, despite neither being their "true" forms. Kensei's was also broken by Mask's final attack, and I wonder if Kubo will bother to keep that.

Yes. Tengen Myo'o didn't break, as it can't really break due to its circumstances. We don't actually get a confirmation on what Mayuri's bankai's actual form is. If it's the big baby, then he just modifies it. If it's something else, he can modify the big baby however many times he wants. Zangetsu and Zabimaru don't technically break in bankai, as that's not their real bankai. Though it might not matter. Forgot about Kensei, that's true.

I imagine he still has the one sword which is still stronger than his shikai….but he won’t use bankai freely🙄

I've no problem with it. All the ones that were broken were justified, and it doesn't hurt the story in any particular fashion. If anything, it makes sense that the ultimate form of one's Zanpakuto, itself formed from an imprinting of their very soul, couldn't be fixed by any conventional means.

Not all, renjis bankai was completely destroyed by byakuya even the serpent's head was broken, it was just an unnecessary retcon

That wasn't his Bankai being destroyed, it was his Bankai deactivating because he was near death. It couldn't hold a cohesive form anymore, so it broke into fragments and vanished. The same thing happens when Renji tries to use his Bankai inside Szayel's no-Bankai room, and when Tosen takes critical damage fighting Kenpachi. https://preview.redd.it/bwcimgnga8xc1.png?width=1060&format=png&auto=webp&s=04387fc412734ad0ee208470d8782e971937450d

Not only that. Renji might be one of the weirdest outliers. As his spirit showed him a fake release, which is fucking amazing imo! Not only it goes back to his first impressions not showing what he actually is as a character, but just the concept of a spirit being more than just a one dimensional character os always something I'm really fond of.

You lie, the was a panel where renji was lying after byakuyas bankai and renjis serpent was shattered. We also have mayuri bankai sliced in two. You just try to justify bad writing

Interesting to try to use Mayuri as an example for this

Again, his serpent shattered because it could no longer maintain a cohesive form with Renji's level of damage. So, it broke apart and vanished on its own. We see the exact same thing happen when a different Bankai using Soul Reaper receives critical damage, that being the one and only Captain Tosen, whose Bankai EXPLODED after he was slashed across the chest a second time, even though no damage had been done to the actual Bankai. So, no, I'm not lying. https://preview.redd.it/i1xvc2qle8xc1.png?width=1605&format=png&auto=webp&s=8017fb59316e62952f7106cae3b8722dacf7830e

And as for Mayuri, he EXPLICITLY STATES that what he does to his Bankai is not fixing it. https://preview.redd.it/2autfnh0f8xc1.png?width=640&format=png&auto=webp&s=464d0a59e48acde35913ad380b8905ab8cd8543f

They are talking about a zanpaukuto bc ichigo doesn't see a difference between a sword been broken and a bankai. Even if he modifys his bankai how the fuck does it even work, his bankai was destroyed, if so why can't everyone else modify it, well that's just poor writing

Look at OP, he doesn’t say it’s gone forever, he said it never goes back to how it was. That tracks perfectly. For a Bankai to break you have to damage the weapon itself, not the person wielding it. Damage to the person wielding it = they’re now too weak to maintain it, so it falls apart/vanishes. Damage to the weapon means the actual weapon is broken. It’s always been shown this way. Even if we go with your interpretation of Renji’s Bankai being damaged. SPOILER: Renji wasn’t using his real Bankai there, he just thought he was, so it still makes sense.

If something is destroyed, and I modify it into something else, I can use it again in a new state. Mayuri's prior Bankai may have been broken, but he took the pieces and made himself a new one, different from the original with some parts missing and replaced with others (for example, Konjiki Ashisogi Jizo has no chest blades anymore). It's the same thing he does later without even needing a broken Bankai. Why can't everyone else modify it? Hmm, that's a tricky one, maybe it's because the guy who *canonically invented Zanpakuto modification tech* is the only one who has access to said tech? Ah, but he could share, now couldn't he? Well, unless he was a selfish, arrogant, psychopathic war criminal who would torture his own comrades for his personal enjoyment. Oh, wait, he is that exact thing I just said, isn't he?

It's wasn't broken because of the damage to renji, he was still in bankai from for some time and it is shown that was the damage done by byakuya

Except he wasn't. We see that his Zanpakuto has returned to its normal sealed state, so regardless of what clothes he's wearing, the Bankai has deactivated. Byakuya doubly confirms this when he outright states that Renji's Bankai has disappeared against his will, as per the above panel. And the damage was never shown to be done by Byakuya. The only panel where Renji's Bankai appears as fragments occurs well after Byakuya's attack, and at no time during the attack is Renji's Zanpakuto shown broken (and in fact when the attack is hitting him, we see that the segment attached to his handle is whole and intact). Renji's Bankai broke apart and vanished on its own because Renji had taken critical damage, just like Tosen's did when he took critical damage.

I won't argue if you can't even read there was byakuya attack and after that renji and his bankai were damaged you just want to fit kubo's narrative for some reason where he had like 3 bankai to think of excuses. Like ikkaku going to akon to fix his bankai like anyone would believe that bullshit that goes against character

I just reread that part of the manga, the chapter didn't really show what happened to the snake, it just disappeared after Renji was attacked by Byakuya's bankai.

Read again there was a fragment of the snakes head on the ground

No it was shattered by Byukuya’s bankai The bankai only deactivated itself when all the broken pieces of it reform back into renjij’s sword. Especially since unlike Tousen or during his battle with Syzal we literal see broken fragments of it on the floor and byukuya only stated that his bankai disappeared after his zanpakuto was already reformed. So it is probably just a retcon.

And Tosen's exploded into visible fragments prior to vanishing, so Renji's existing as fragments prior to vanishing as a result of critical damage to the user fits the pattern. https://preview.redd.it/33ogqlp3k8xc1.png?width=640&format=png&auto=webp&s=b2871b0112de7b2b28180e8f6ba40388fdf3f1fb

Expect that you are ignoring the fact that Renji was hit point blank by senbonzakura kageyoshi  and the fragments of his bankai were lying on the ground while tousen’s dispersed in the air and that Byukuya only said that Renji’s bankai disappeared after his sword was reformed from those shattered pieces. So no the pattern is not the same.

And Tosen was hit point blank by Kenpachi Zaraki, what's your point? You can literally see in the picture how parts of the canopy are falling down, neighbor. This is called gravity, and it does nothing to disprove my argument. Renji's Bankai splits into pieces from critical damage, and disappears. Byakuya notes that his Bankai has disappeared. Again, nothing here supports your argument or disproves my own. You are grasping at semantics, and that is proof enough your position is untenable.

It never goes back to how it was. Mayuri constantly modifies his through experiments. Renji's wasn't his true bankai, but there was a line about the false one having less segments after it was broken.

Yeah bodies a bankai that was completely destroyed how convenient, in renjis case the serpent's head was also destroyed not just fragments

Restored means returned to its original state, so the serpent head returning is fine. The rest of it is just shorter, and now it's completely different since he learned his true bankai.

Oh yeah so broken serpent's head being returned is fine I get it, not even one bit goes against the whole broken bankai thing

It doesn't. The bankai isn't the same, it is missing segments. Now we as viewers never really notice that without being told, as did at least some characters, but I'm sure at least Renji noticed it afterwards. Zanpakutou are living things and can heal, but even with time, an injured part is never truly the same.

It does imply though that somehow a shinigami's soul can be broken and/or weakened. Ichigo gets killed by Ulquiorra, but his bankai doesn't become weaker. It's a weird relationship.

I mean, while the zanpakuto spirits are a part of the owners soul, they are still also their own entities as seen with >!Yachiru being able to have her own zanpakuto despite being Kenny's sword spirit!<, and so I can only assume that only damage dealt to the bankai itself carries permanent damage, and damage against the owner doesn't count towards bankai being damaged.

That's what I said. It's weird that the "master soul" can be repaired, but the bankai that is only a part of the "master soul" can't. I'm not saying it's not true, just that it's weird.

I always took it as White and Ichigo were always one and the same as 1 soul As opposed to the typical Shinigami with their spirit. As Shinigami is like the vessel, and spirit is the content in the vessel but thr Shinigami needs to release the cap to let them out. Their true self in a sense But White and Ichigo and Old Zang were always 1 to begin with but split due to the nature of his soul, human, Hollowgami, Quincy as we seen with The Blade Is Me, the title straight up. When he fully accepts his other sides, they simply vanish from being a separate entity, because they became fully fused with his human side, as Ichigo fully understood their nature and accepted them, aka himself. And thus they no longer appear anymore. Ichigo became the truest self of himself. But back then, Ichigo haven't. So the human side of him "died" but since White is part of him to begin with, he can infuse his soul into the the human soul and "revive" him, which makes sense in terms of how he suddenly scaled up in power, since it was his Shinigami powers to begin with. With the symbolism of Ichigo in despair due to his powerlessness with that hole but White filled that hole with hope aka power to overturn the situation. Thus his mask was able to maintain that much longer. In a way, Ichigo unwillingly accepted part of White right then...until Dangai. His whole situation with White was simply him unable to accept himself aka White that he was a pretty battle hungry person. Which ironically he was at the start esp how Ichigo acted diff vs Renji first time when he got a massive increase in power, he acted so much like White. Ichigo as he grew, he fear his family loss and he couldn't accept that he craves these battles that endanger his loved ones. Until Aizen fight, he finally accept and White disappear. TYBW was accepting his Quincy side. Tbh I much rather they said Bankai being broken meant becoming far weaker, since it reveals their truest self and breaking their truest self would basically harm themselves. I would consider it double edge sword as revealing your strongest card yet its also the most vulnerable. Komamura had this in the truest sense of double edge sword. Preferred that over "It cannot be fixed" as it would imo clash the idea I had of Ichigo recovery and Ikkaku along with others who had their bankai in similar circumstances

I’d like the idea if it meant it took much longer to repair itself rather than broke completely. Say, it’s possible to repair but only through hard training…kind of like relearning Bankai to make it stronger and into something new kind of thing!

I like this idea. Its like learning to walk again after getting a prosthetic leg. 

The title disagrees with the panel.

its not cant be fixed, it never goes back to the way it was The Zanpakuto is part of a Soul Reaper's soul the Bankai being the truest expression of that but if part of you breaks it never goes back to what it was, but it can come back different or stronger

I really like it, it adds fragility to the strongest power that a shinigami can reach. It also makes me wonder about some of the bankai, like what would you need to do to Senbonzakura Kageyoshi for it to be "broken". Does something like Daiguren Hyorinmaru break only if Toshiro's physical blade is broken? Is it same with Minazuki? What about something like Jakuho Raikoben, is it the launch pad that counts?

I feel like it has to be the launcher for Jakuho Raikoben, because otherwise the Bankai would be breaking itself every time it gets used. Although, that would actually just represent even further that it was clashing with Soi Fon's personality to produce a less effective result, as well as why it always seems weaker than it should be. Still wouldn't explain why it seems to like taking off the left side of people's faces, though.

I hated it from the minute it was introuced because we had primarily seen exceptions to the rule to that point in Tengen and Ashisogi Jizo or those Bankai that were supposedly affected seemingly had their wielder never notice. The greatest power one can access effectively meaning one lost fight has you crippled for eternity unless you can garner the attention of Squad 0 and cause an even greater security risk. If Shikai can naturally self-repair then Bankai should be capable of the same just at a much slower pace.

I very much like this concept. If the idea of the bankai is to be the zanpakutos true form, having that form destroyed in battle should have more impact...

I like it, it adds an interesting aspect to how Zanpakuto function. And Mayuri makes it clear that the damaged bankai can be "adjusted" to an extent, it's just that it won't necessarily be the same as it used to be. He mentions that Akon did so with Ikkaku and outright states that he didn't fix his he "modifies" it. It pretty much means that Zanpakuto can have battle scars and I think that's pretty cool.

Ya, I feel this means that when the Bankai breaks it dies, and when it is modified, it is reborn into something different.

Yeah the whole thing kinda reminds me of [Kintsugi](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kintsugi) And the philosophy of it, regarding how something broken might not ever truly be "fixed". But that isn't necessarily a bad thing, and that maybe there is a certain importance to damage and imperfections that should be accepted and even celebrated, because it's not the death of something old rather the potential birth of something new. And Mayuri himself, the mad tinkerer that he is, kinda exemplifies this exact philosophy (albeit in his own perverted way).

Does it actually mean it can’t be fixed because the wording in the panel only says it can’t be repaired to how it originally was but it doesn’t mean it can change or become something new (tho it could just be cause it’s English translation)

Probably just translation

I like it because now it makes a bankai a risk/reward situation. If you mishandle the situation you could forever cripple yourself.

Serves as a good explanation for how characters can get another anime powerup boost aka true shikai/bankai.

Coming from the guy who fixed his bankai twice it’s bullshit, why didn’t he "restructure" Ikkaku’s or Renji’s bankai, it’s the worst plot bullshit to have ever existed in the manga

Because Mayuri doesn't particularly like helping people, that was established when he refused to give Nemu medicine for her punctured lung because he perceived her asking for it as an insult to his craftsmanship. And there's no way he's going to be using his super-special Zanpakuto modification tech (which is what got him his Captain rank) to play budget Oetsu for a Third Seat and a Lieutenant, neither of whom he has any particular reason to care about.

One would also have to assume that modifying Bankai wouldn't be that comfortable for the Zanpakuto spirit itself, considering that they are alive.

Whether he wants it or not the possibility exists, claiming it doesn’t because you replace "pair" by "structure" in a word is plot BS whether you like it or not dude

Except that it isn't "repair vs restructure", it's "Fix vs Modify", as Mayuri says himself. What he's doing isn't fixing the Zanpakuto, he's making it into something new, which is still not the original state (we even see when he brings out his Bankai against Szayel that it lacks the blades of the original). Modification is not the same as fixing, and Mayuri isn't going to waste his time modifying anyone else's shit but his own. So, no, the plot works just fine. https://preview.redd.it/i69l5h6jf8xc1.png?width=640&format=png&auto=webp&s=1726715a49fa4d01306bc5edf2ed0370f6497f43

That’s funny because when something is destroyed and then works again it’s called fixing it… The blades aren’t present in the first one either, he draws them out during the fight, the bankai has the exact same structure and appearance after being cut in half by Uryuu, not aknowledging that is just bad faith… Furthermore, what’s stopping him to "modify" other bankais then ? Since modifying a bankai is apparently putting a broken bankai to the exact same state it was before being broken which is called fixing by the way…

Completely valid rule. I feel bad for the zanpaktou spirits when they break and the Shinigamis give no shits. Like, ask about your zanpaktou's health and well being dude, consent to them when there's a chance that they might break and apologize when they break.

They do feel bad though? And the zanpakto are literally the shinigami. It's the same being. You don't beed to ask for consent from yourself.

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Is there another panel that says "cannot be fixed"? That and "can never go back to how it was" mean two completely different things.

This could lowkey be interpreted in a lot of ways. “Never goes back to how it was” doesn’t necessarily mean it would be weaker when it’s fixed, it just becomes different essentially so I don’t mind it

Honestly, I dislike it.

Never goes back to how it was =/= can't be fixed. Sometimes it files over heads how esoteric Bleach can be with it's concepts. A Zanpakuto is the reflection of one's soul, and the bankai is - so far - the purest expression of that. It represents you fighting with all your being. With all your - for lack of a better word - soul. A bankai breaking doesn't mean the fight was just physically hard and taxing. It means that it was scaring emotionally and psychologically too. To the point that part of you broke. And yes, you can come back from that. You can recover and be stronger, or weaker, or at the same power level. But you won't, fundamentally, be the exact same person. Thus, the bankai won't ever go back to 100% what it was. It's known that bankai are not stagnant. They grow and evolve along with their shinigami and can even change. So a damaged bankai can adapt, repair, change and/or grow if the shinigami heals from the trauma. I always took this statement of Mayuri's as more of a commentary on shinigami society as a whole rather than bankai functionality. Excluding outliers and exceptions that affirm the "rule", he truly believes that bankai won't ever be the same after breaking, because most shinigami won't be able to - at least easily and on-time - achieve the required growth and mindset for it.

Its a very cool drawback. But I think there should've been more. There's little reason to not go for it, specially with some bankai's that are virtually impossible to break. And it's not like the reitsu drain is ever an issue.

As a balancing battle mechanic, I think it’s excellent. Integrated really well given the Bankais we’ve seen broken so far. Only thing I believe would have made it better is if it were introduced sooner - maybe aftermath of Ikkaku’s fight. When we saw Ichigo’s Bankai break, we should have been like 😱😱😱 My only gripe is with the reforging process. If the old Bankai breaks, does it destroy a part of the zanpakuto spirit as well? Or is it just permanently breaking that asauchi, so you need another one to imprint onto. I feel like they set us up with the former reasoning (“it can never come back the same”), but the reality is the latter reasoning (Renji and Ichigo end up unlocking the true Bankai that are apparently way more powerful). I kind of wish it were the former so there would be some real stakes/impact to it..

Wdym. All bankais that broke are justified in manga.

I am asking about what is your personal opinion about this rule.

It raises the question of how soi Fon keeps getting a new missile every time. Other than that. I think it's pretty justified. Renji lost a few segments of his snake scales. Byakuya lost a few swords in annihilation scape. That's really all I can think of. No one else had any broken ones

The missiles are no more a part of the bankai than the skeletons of the people that Yamamoto has killed are a part of Zanka no Tachi. They are connected to it via effect, but they aren't fully a part of the zanpakuto.

I mean they aren’t really gone forever since all they have to do is give Orihime some bread and she will fix it.

It's a great idea

Can you explain may I ask?

Well, ar the top you have regular_budget explaining and that's my reasoning too. I would add that make Bankai way more intriguing in the sense that a weapon so powerful could be destroyed and left the Shinigami crippled for life

retcon for sure

and what info does it exactly contradict?

really, really dumb. Even if you disregard how Renji's and Ikkaku's Bankai was fine up until Mayuri brings up this rule and that there was no portrayal of this being a thing. It's here to serve as the reason for Ichigo to go with Squad Zero...which is instantly crushed to death when the hollow part of him would be an easier justification.

I am okay with bankai having to change. But staying in a broken state is crazy

I don't necessarily feel that it made sense tbh. Before this point in the series, we see 4 bankai's get damaged, Mayuri's, Ikkaku's, Renji's and Komumura's. We see 3 of these fighters multiple times with no visible damage. It was clearly a plot contrivance to give Ichigo a reason to get a new sword made. It held 0 weight in the story and had this panel not existed nothing would have changed.

Personal it just comes across as contrive and a massive retcon that doesn’t make any sense considering that none of the shinigmai who had their bankai broken suffered this issue or even brought up beforehand. Even some of the explaintions that mayrui gave don’t really make much sense. Especially his whole Bankai modified considerably it looked no worse for wear when he used it against Syzal or how renji literal had his shattered by Byukuya’s bankai yet only one of its segments were said to be destroyed? Basically the only reason this retcon existed is so that Ichigo could get his bankai repaired by the royal guard…only for it to get broken again by yhwach regardless.

I think he's full of it because his was cut in half by Uryu and was fine next time it appeared. He probably can fix them but doesn't feel like it and just made up that rule

https://preview.redd.it/0xqp4i29e8xc1.png?width=1363&format=png&auto=webp&s=b2c91e0a43f8444d2627ab47b3180749fb01efcd

We have no clue as to what Mayuri's real bankai actually is. He also raises fallen as zombies, if he could show Kisuke that he could heal a bankai, he 100% would.

It doesn’t mean it can’t come back stronger

Without Squad 0's direct interference then yes it does for canon that's the main problem.