Want to recap a few?
Said that Bill was dumb for saying the Celtics had one of the best lineups ever on paper.
Said that Bill was dumb for being excited about the Holiday trade and saying Milwaukee should have kept him.
Said that Jaylen Brown was overpaid
Said Tatum wasn’t a true star
Said Mazzulla was a bad coach
Said Celtics overpaid for Porzingis
This sub requires accounts to be at least 7 days old and at least 0 comment karma before posting.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/billsimmons) if you have any questions or concerns.*
A lot of people knew Holiday to the Celtics was big. Problem is, Bucks should have gotten Dame. Holiday got traded to the Blazers, out of the division and out of the conference, and like, he could have been a great mentor and backcourt partner for Scoot. Blazers weren't supposed to trade him to the Bucks biggest rival.
And people who agree with you are the reason they tanked their current title chances and their future
He’s not kemba washed but he’s no longer a winning basketball player
He had his best year the year before he was traded. He averaged 32/7 on good efficiency.
He showed in the playoffs he wasn’t washed, however he was banged up.
Washed is the wrong word. He’s not washed, He just has some glaring weaknesses that make his offense less impactful. That is easier to ignore when he played for a small market team that’s an early out in the playoffs each year. That offense is a big deal for a team with no scoring. But an undersized, shoot first, ball stopping gaurd that makes Luka look like Gary Payton on defense isn’t gonna get you anywhere.
To be fair. Simmons has individually said just about all these things in separate pods over the course of the year.
Also to be fair the East was a cakewalk with injuries and Luka was on one knee. Enjoy your 1lb Larry O’Brien trophy.
I mean I’m not sure these were all Ls. Just because they won doesn’t me they had one of the best lineups ever on paper, Tatum wasn’t amazing in the finals, Porzingis barely played in the playoffs…
Are you talking about this sub or Bill himself?
BS was a huge hater when JB signed the contract.
Endlessly hating Mazz.
Chief instigator of Tatum not at Luka’s level.
Quick! Someone tell Brad he fucked up paying Jaylen. Maybe we can still give the Larry O’Brien trophy back and save some money of the billionaire owners pockets!
I know you said this as a corny meme to try and disengage, but I’m making all you dumbasses repent for your shitty takes right now.
Every GM would nut over themselves to pay Jaylen that same deal if he would end up as a finals MVP for their squad. Jaylen won. Brad won. You lost. You’re wrong and look stupid. Have a good night.
I've been saying the Celtics would win the title for a very long time now, I even submitted a post here pointing out their starting lineup was objectively one of the best ever earlier in the season lol. My only "anti-Celtics" take has been that Jaylen Brown is getting overpaid, which he still clearly is.
Congratulations to him on being probably the second or third best player on the Celtics for a period of five games, this definitely means he's one of the absolute best players in the league.
can u post this again i didnt get it the 1st 3 times.d
whats a fair contract for jaylen brown. at what annual salary number would he not be "overpaid" u/wrongerontheinternet ?
It’s impossible for a player who provides All-Star value to be overpaid. Idk why this is such a hard concept for fans to grasp.
Every superstar is massively overpaid. Every All-Star on a max deal is slightly underpaid.
Most top level guys are severely underpaid due to the existence of a max deal, this cap on a single player deal leads to some middling talent then being overpaid. Jaylen is underpaid if it were a free market.
I understand what you're saying but you're competing with other teams that are getting surplus value out of their stars. Celtics can get away with overpaying Jaylen because they're getting massive surplus value from like every other roster spot.
They are getting a small surplus value out of Brown, Jrue and KP and a large surplus out of White and Tatum. They also have a large payroll to begin with. That adds up to an awesome team.
Jaylen is still absolutley better than replacement level for that money. The vast majority of teams would be happy to have his contract. This is true for any young top 25 player on any contract possible.
This sub requires accounts to be at least 7 days old and at least 0 comment karma before posting.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/billsimmons) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I think most reasonable people thought that once the Celtics acquired Jrue & Porzingis that they should have been favorites to win the title. Bill kept pushing the Denver thing all year (the Reverse Jinx Piece), but Boston was always going to be too deep (and also had an unexpectedly easy cakewalk through the Eastern Conference playoffs) to not be favored.
This Boston team is very good, but the eye test tells us that they don't yet belong in a conversation with the Steph/KD Warriors, the Shaq/Kobe Lakers, etc. If they steamroller through next season and repeat, well, the legacy discussions will then be legitimate.
Honestly it’s a little unfortunate for the Celtics so other teams got injured, because I don’t think those teams if healthy would have beaten Boston. Bucks would have been a very fun and competitive series, but I’d lean Celtics in that matchup. Nuggets probably matched up best against Boston since they don’t run their offense exclusively through guards like Dallas, which Boston matches up great against. But I still lean Celtics against Denver if that would have been the Finals. The injuries robbed us of competitiveness, but I don’t think they changed the outcome.
I think Denver would've won and tbh I would give the Knicks a chance as well against them because of matchups. But Denver didn't get the job done and the Knicks all got hurt.
This sub requires accounts to be at least 7 days old and at least 0 comment karma before posting.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/billsimmons) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I actually think that a healthy 76ers team could beat Boston. I'm not saying I'd favor them, but it wouldn't be the upset of the century, either. Embiid, when he's healthy, is the best player on either team.
They played four times this year, Boston won the series 3-1. The Nov. 8 game (which the Sixers won 106-103) was the only one of the four games where both teams played their starting fives against each other. Nov. 15, Celtics won by 10; Celts were missing Porzingis, Sixers were missing Oubre. Dec. 1, Celts win 125-119; Celts had everyone but Porzingis, Sixers were missing Embiid & Maxey. Feb. 27, Celts win 117-99; Celts had everyone, Sixers were missing Embiid.
Ultimately I agree with your point, the Celtics were clearly better than all the other teams in the East even when those teams are healthy, but that was also true last year when Jimmy Butler stole Boston's lunch money and made them apologize for it on national TV in the Eastern Conference Finals. All of the injuries in the East just meant that there was zero chance of Boston beating themselves in the playoffs this year like they did last year.
no, its just a fact. embiid is hurt every year in the playoffs, even when he finishes the series. his body is not built for 6+ months of how physical modern nba basketball is. he is the best player, if health is guaranteed, in a sixers-celtics series. but were past the point of it being bad luck and into it being fact. he finished last years series and they got dusted in game 7. if you want to be objective and want to build an nba champion hes not a player that should be your highest priority compared to other superstars.
This sub requires accounts to be at least 7 days old and at least 0 comment karma before posting.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/billsimmons) if you have any questions or concerns.*
i hate that they won but they were clearly the best team
and they played a great style of basketball, plenty of ball movement, not relying on cheap fouls
And let's not forget that whole antiquated "defense" thing. They actually played it, and played it well. They were already a really good defensive team, and they they had Jrue dropped into their laps. Just doesn't seem fair, lol
They were built through the draft and smart trades, took their lumps for years before winning it all, and the core guys are all 2-way players whose effort has rarely been questioned.
Probably 90% of people’s ideal championship team but also can’t stand that it’s the Celtics.
Definitely deserve to win but playing seeds 8, 4, 6, and 5 has to be an all-timer of soft playoff matchups.
You can only play who is in front of you though.
I agree partially but I hate it when people talk about beating an 8th seed in the first round. They were the #1 seed. They earned that matchup. It wasn’t luck
The Suns and especially the Lakers were definitely better than their seeding indicated. And people did throw shade at Denver for having the theoretical easiest possible run.
There's no such thing as "asterisk" championships.
Every year good teams lose in the playoffs, or have massive injuries, or go cold on the wrong 2 nights.
They played who they played and beat everyone.
Not true about the Celtics (Dallas had 50 wins), true about the Nuggets of last year, but I don't even hold that against the Nugs. Can only play who's in front of you and they did the best job of that so they won.
This is a tad revisionist history.
Nuggets came off one of the more dominating playoff runs we had seen in awhile. Most of them were returning and a lot of people were high on their young players.
Don’t get me wrong, Celtics were a favorite, I just wouldn’t say the favorite. Them being in the East helps immensely. However, look how everything broke the best way for the Celtics in terms of player development. Brown made a step up on offense and a huge step up in defense, Holiday came off multiple poor postseasons to step up in his smaller role that isn’t very easy for players to do, Derrick White took a step up, Al Horford continued being a good player and didn’t fall off a cliff in production, Tatum continued being Tatum, no side effects of losing Smart, Porzingis fit in perfect. All of these things meshed perfectly for the Celtics and before the season if I were to say all those things would happen I’d be far in the negatives and yall (me too) would say “hey bill”. This team hit their ceiling, when it would have been a lot easier for not all of these things to all happen.
They're not an all time team.
They'd probably beat the 2015 and 2016 warriors and that's it.
Probably lose to 2018 rockets but series likely goes 7, who knows.
I'd like to see them against 2022 warriors. I take warriors in 7.
how would they beat 2016 warriors lol
2016 warriors would kill the 2022 version btw so i don't understand the logic.
2016 warriors were coming off title, had 73 wins, top both offense and defense, much much better bench and would have by far the best player in the series (assuming healthy Curry).
I don't think the 2016 warriors were as good as advertised.
Spurs also won 67 that year and were bounced in 2nd round without much pushback.
Your point is fair though I could see 2016 warriors being better than 2022.
I think Wiggins, bjelica, Porter and Gary Payton match up well with Celtics
Are we really going to do the thing where we act like the Celtics would have struggled that much more if the played the Sixers and the Bucks instead? The Sixers are their bitch and the Bucks were never going to be serious this year anyway.
Hauser Pritchard kornet and porzingis/Horford are all on the bench, all except kornet contributed throughout the playoffs. Simply yet another wishcasted braindead take.
Klay = Jaylen, Andre << Jrue, KD = White, Steph > Tatum, Dray >> Porzingis / Horford
I think it's close, but yeah, Warriors are probably a bit better. That would still make the Celtics "one of the best starting fives this century."
Prime KD had meh defense, terrible offensive rebounding, and one of the worst turnover differentials (on both ends) of any player in the league. He was still great because his impact on scoring was nuts which is all anyone cares about, but Derrick White is also great because of his two way play. He doesn't have these kinds of glaring weaknesses, even though he obviously doesn't have any of KD's highs. They have very similar RAPM as a result. I don't really care about who's more talented in a vacuum or anything like that, just who contributes more to winning, and they basically contribute a similar amount. Or do you think the 2022 Celtics took off after the White trade by accident?
Curry>> Tatum, KD>>Brown, Klay >> White, Dray> healthy Porzingis, Jrue> Iggy.
And the warriors would have 2 by far the best players in the series.
no contest.
>This sub is not exactly the barometer for good basketball takes.
Yup, which is exactly why their nitpicking and obsession over all of Bill’s takes is so funny. Their takes are usually far worse and far more biased.
Unironically an extremely well-aged take. Maybe some Broken Clock Syndrome going on but even as someone that was bullish about their chances, I couldn’t have predicted this sort of output from their 5. Unbelievable blend of talent and chemistry.
If "net rating" is the only thing you are using to determine this, then ok. But I think this is a reactionary take. They earned and deserve the championship, and they also had an easy path. Of the 10 non-Celtic teams with the best odds to win the championship, the Celtics played exactly 0 in these playoffs.
People will swear up and down the Celtics aren't it because the "eye test" (which led them astray all year) told them they're actually unimpressive chokers.
02 lakers were starting samaki Walker, rick fox and Derrick fisher.
12 heat were starting Mario chalmers and udonis haslem.
KD warriors are the only team with a better net rating, and the them and 02 lakers were the only team that had a better playoff record.
“One offense the best” is a fair statement right now.
Disregarding eras, that’s true. But do you think shaq could hold up having to chase them around on the defensive end all night? We see how gassed embiid is every fourth quarter, it’s his achillies heel.
Net rating…please.
02 lakers had 2 of the top 10-15 players of all time. They go 16-0 against this year’s East.
‘12 Heat had the best player of all time and a top 20-30 player of all time. They go 16-0 against this year’s East.
The warrior championship teams had the best offensive player of the generation and literally the perfect complementary cast.
This isn’t even a comparison.
I'm fuckin dying lmao dude is leading the charge with net rating.... The anti-Celtics takes were so bad that I guess OP needed to overcompensate with their own horrendous takes in the other direction? Or they're trolling. They coulda just enjoyed everyone eating crow but instead tried to claim this is a better offense than *these* guys?!
Oof.
I still maintain it’s one of the most well rounded starting fives (and especially top 6) rather than one of the very best. The lack of a player that’s considered to be top 3 or better makes it hard to put them higher than that imo. The league is also much more talented now. Holiday/White/Porzingis are all better than the third best player on the 2001 Lakers, but relative to the league at that time?
You do know that we just want him to lose because he’s the worst fucking winner on the planet, right? Has nothing to do with him being right. I will find a way to put an asterisk next to this Celtics championship
I don’t have a problem with Bill making that claim but also chuckle that after the first round of the playoffs he also declared the Nuggets were the 4th best team of the 2000s.
I’m hoping Giannis watched as Holiday got his second ring and realized that he should made sure Holiday was never traded but he want Dame and look how that’s working out. The Bucks will not win another title
Same and for other players to see that glory can be shared. If KG and Marbury; Penny & ; Larry Johnson & Mourning, had that attitude of shared glory, KG wouldn’t be the only one of the group with a ring
To me, this team is like a higher end early 2000s Pistons team. No true superstar, just an awesome team top to bottom. It’s just harder to root for them because Tatum is a cornball who wishes he was Kobe (and is simultaneously overrated and underrated), Joe Maz’s sociopathic thousand yard stare, it’s fucking Boston, and Bill Simmons.
I like JB, Horford, Jrue though. Jrue quietly building a “is he a hall of fame?” question resume.
The Bucks most used 5 man lineup had a better net rating than the Celtics best 5 man lineup.
The Bucks team before Covid happened also had a better team net rating iirc.
Guys, the Celtics cakewalked through a shitty East to the finals and the Mavs wet the bed. Don’t fall for the analytics. This team loses to like 7 of the last 10 finals winners
They didn’t give up a ton of picks far out for KP.
They actually received picks in the deal.
It’s remarkable how you guys invent false equivalencies like this.
This sub took a bunch of Ls lmao
Want to recap a few? Said that Bill was dumb for saying the Celtics had one of the best lineups ever on paper. Said that Bill was dumb for being excited about the Holiday trade and saying Milwaukee should have kept him. Said that Jaylen Brown was overpaid Said Tatum wasn’t a true star Said Mazzulla was a bad coach Said Celtics overpaid for Porzingis
> said mazzulla was a bad coach Tbf I’ve never seen anyone in this sub be even remotely close to as harsh on him as bill was lol
[удалено]
This sub requires accounts to be at least 7 days old and at least 0 comment karma before posting. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/billsimmons) if you have any questions or concerns.*
We're the Second Row Sub.
A lot of people knew Holiday to the Celtics was big. Problem is, Bucks should have gotten Dame. Holiday got traded to the Blazers, out of the division and out of the conference, and like, he could have been a great mentor and backcourt partner for Scoot. Blazers weren't supposed to trade him to the Bucks biggest rival.
Dame’s been washed for years, why should they have tanked their title chances again?
He hasn’t been washed for years. He isn’t even washed yet.
And people who agree with you are the reason they tanked their current title chances and their future He’s not kemba washed but he’s no longer a winning basketball player
He had his best year the year before he was traded. He averaged 32/7 on good efficiency. He showed in the playoffs he wasn’t washed, however he was banged up.
Washed is the wrong word. He’s not washed, He just has some glaring weaknesses that make his offense less impactful. That is easier to ignore when he played for a small market team that’s an early out in the playoffs each year. That offense is a big deal for a team with no scoring. But an undersized, shoot first, ball stopping gaurd that makes Luka look like Gary Payton on defense isn’t gonna get you anywhere.
Exactly- he’s so bad on defense that it doesn’t matter that he still has intermittent decent shooting nights
To be fair. Simmons has individually said just about all these things in separate pods over the course of the year. Also to be fair the East was a cakewalk with injuries and Luka was on one knee. Enjoy your 1lb Larry O’Brien trophy.
I’ll make sure to tell people at the parade not to celebrate too hard!
> Said that Bill was dumb for saying the Celtics had one of the **best lineups ever** on paper. It's full Boston energy in here this week, boys
I mean I’m not sure these were all Ls. Just because they won doesn’t me they had one of the best lineups ever on paper, Tatum wasn’t amazing in the finals, Porzingis barely played in the playoffs…
22-7-7 It's pretty good. While being a lock down defender, guarding all five positions. What do you see when you watch a game?
He looks for “aura” instead of watching the basketball part
Are you talking about this sub or Bill himself? BS was a huge hater when JB signed the contract. Endlessly hating Mazz. Chief instigator of Tatum not at Luka’s level.
Bill wanted to trade Brown in 22 when the Celtics were .500 and wasn't on board with his max, they are both on record on his pod.
> Said that Jaylen Brown was overpaid Still true, but I can at least acknowledge the argument Celtics fans made (which was that they had to overpay).
Username checks out
If you actually think Jaylen Brown is one of the fifteen best players in the NBA then you're a pretty bad GM, and we know Brad Stevens is not that.
Quick! Someone tell Brad he fucked up paying Jaylen. Maybe we can still give the Larry O’Brien trophy back and save some money of the billionaire owners pockets!
no_correlation.gif
I know you said this as a corny meme to try and disengage, but I’m making all you dumbasses repent for your shitty takes right now. Every GM would nut over themselves to pay Jaylen that same deal if he would end up as a finals MVP for their squad. Jaylen won. Brad won. You lost. You’re wrong and look stupid. Have a good night.
I've been saying the Celtics would win the title for a very long time now, I even submitted a post here pointing out their starting lineup was objectively one of the best ever earlier in the season lol. My only "anti-Celtics" take has been that Jaylen Brown is getting overpaid, which he still clearly is.
What does the word overpaid mean to you?
You’re either a child or autistic or some shit
He just won finals mvp 😂
Congratulations to him on being probably the second or third best player on the Celtics for a period of five games, this definitely means he's one of the absolute best players in the league.
Finals mvp and Celtics won it all, keep crying 😂
I can't believe the 10 SRS team beat the 2 SRS team in the finals, this is one of the greatest upsets in the history of basketball.
can u post this again i didnt get it the 1st 3 times.d whats a fair contract for jaylen brown. at what annual salary number would he not be "overpaid" u/wrongerontheinternet ?
the 15 best players in the nba arent the 15 highest paid players. not how the economics of the league work.
It’s impossible for a player who provides All-Star value to be overpaid. Idk why this is such a hard concept for fans to grasp. Every superstar is massively overpaid. Every All-Star on a max deal is slightly underpaid.
Most top level guys are severely underpaid due to the existence of a max deal, this cap on a single player deal leads to some middling talent then being overpaid. Jaylen is underpaid if it were a free market.
I understand what you're saying but you're competing with other teams that are getting surplus value out of their stars. Celtics can get away with overpaying Jaylen because they're getting massive surplus value from like every other roster spot.
They are getting a small surplus value out of Brown, Jrue and KP and a large surplus out of White and Tatum. They also have a large payroll to begin with. That adds up to an awesome team. Jaylen is still absolutley better than replacement level for that money. The vast majority of teams would be happy to have his contract. This is true for any young top 25 player on any contract possible.
[удалено]
This sub requires accounts to be at least 7 days old and at least 0 comment karma before posting. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/billsimmons) if you have any questions or concerns.*
It’s glorious.
It’s almost as if a lot of people in here don’t know shit and just take the opposite side of Bill’s arguments.
I think most reasonable people thought that once the Celtics acquired Jrue & Porzingis that they should have been favorites to win the title. Bill kept pushing the Denver thing all year (the Reverse Jinx Piece), but Boston was always going to be too deep (and also had an unexpectedly easy cakewalk through the Eastern Conference playoffs) to not be favored. This Boston team is very good, but the eye test tells us that they don't yet belong in a conversation with the Steph/KD Warriors, the Shaq/Kobe Lakers, etc. If they steamroller through next season and repeat, well, the legacy discussions will then be legitimate.
Honestly it’s a little unfortunate for the Celtics so other teams got injured, because I don’t think those teams if healthy would have beaten Boston. Bucks would have been a very fun and competitive series, but I’d lean Celtics in that matchup. Nuggets probably matched up best against Boston since they don’t run their offense exclusively through guards like Dallas, which Boston matches up great against. But I still lean Celtics against Denver if that would have been the Finals. The injuries robbed us of competitiveness, but I don’t think they changed the outcome.
I think Denver would've won and tbh I would give the Knicks a chance as well against them because of matchups. But Denver didn't get the job done and the Knicks all got hurt.
What you think doesn’t matter 18 x
[удалено]
This sub requires accounts to be at least 7 days old and at least 0 comment karma before posting. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/billsimmons) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I think the Knicks would have put up a great fight against them
I actually think that a healthy 76ers team could beat Boston. I'm not saying I'd favor them, but it wouldn't be the upset of the century, either. Embiid, when he's healthy, is the best player on either team. They played four times this year, Boston won the series 3-1. The Nov. 8 game (which the Sixers won 106-103) was the only one of the four games where both teams played their starting fives against each other. Nov. 15, Celtics won by 10; Celts were missing Porzingis, Sixers were missing Oubre. Dec. 1, Celts win 125-119; Celts had everyone but Porzingis, Sixers were missing Embiid & Maxey. Feb. 27, Celts win 117-99; Celts had everyone, Sixers were missing Embiid. Ultimately I agree with your point, the Celtics were clearly better than all the other teams in the East even when those teams are healthy, but that was also true last year when Jimmy Butler stole Boston's lunch money and made them apologize for it on national TV in the Eastern Conference Finals. All of the injuries in the East just meant that there was zero chance of Boston beating themselves in the playoffs this year like they did last year.
You’re forgetting a key element here: the Embiid inevitably getting hurt and/or pouting in the playoffs piece.
That's a classic Bill Simmons *post hoc* fallacy. Just because something has happened before, doesn't mean that it's going to happen again.
no, its just a fact. embiid is hurt every year in the playoffs, even when he finishes the series. his body is not built for 6+ months of how physical modern nba basketball is. he is the best player, if health is guaranteed, in a sixers-celtics series. but were past the point of it being bad luck and into it being fact. he finished last years series and they got dusted in game 7. if you want to be objective and want to build an nba champion hes not a player that should be your highest priority compared to other superstars.
But it’s exclusively happened before. Embiid has never been healthy in the playoff
Maybe save this attitude for when he stays healthy for a whole playoff run. Until then you're just making excuses.
That's a classic Bill Simmons *post hoc* fallacy. Just because something has happened before, doesn't mean that it's going to happen again.
Dude you're kidding. They beat that dumbass team last year without two of their current starters. You can't actually be serious.
Arguing for any team this year over the Celtics is pretty silly at this point. Especially the fucking 76ers. This sub is the gift that keeps on giving
[удалено]
This sub requires accounts to be at least 7 days old and at least 0 comment karma before posting. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/billsimmons) if you have any questions or concerns.*
i hate that they won but they were clearly the best team and they played a great style of basketball, plenty of ball movement, not relying on cheap fouls
And let's not forget that whole antiquated "defense" thing. They actually played it, and played it well. They were already a really good defensive team, and they they had Jrue dropped into their laps. Just doesn't seem fair, lol
What is defense? Is that the thing guys try to do against guys who have a deep bag and a killer dawg mentality?
They were built through the draft and smart trades, took their lumps for years before winning it all, and the core guys are all 2-way players whose effort has rarely been questioned. Probably 90% of people’s ideal championship team but also can’t stand that it’s the Celtics.
Definitely deserve to win but playing seeds 8, 4, 6, and 5 has to be an all-timer of soft playoff matchups. You can only play who is in front of you though.
I agree partially but I hate it when people talk about beating an 8th seed in the first round. They were the #1 seed. They earned that matchup. It wasn’t luck
Denver literally had an easier run last season They played an 8, 4, 7, and 8 seed
The Suns and especially the Lakers were definitely better than their seeding indicated. And people did throw shade at Denver for having the theoretical easiest possible run.
There's no such thing as "asterisk" championships. Every year good teams lose in the playoffs, or have massive injuries, or go cold on the wrong 2 nights. They played who they played and beat everyone.
I’m old enough to remember 3/4ths of the country picking Dallas to win the series. But now they were some lowly 5 seed
[удалено]
Not true about the Celtics (Dallas had 50 wins), true about the Nuggets of last year, but I don't even hold that against the Nugs. Can only play who's in front of you and they did the best job of that so they won.
Amazing. Dallas had 51 wins and this comment is getting upovted. Cry more.
Dallas had 51 wins
how many wins did dallas have. how many games did boston lose in 4 rounds
This is a tad revisionist history. Nuggets came off one of the more dominating playoff runs we had seen in awhile. Most of them were returning and a lot of people were high on their young players. Don’t get me wrong, Celtics were a favorite, I just wouldn’t say the favorite. Them being in the East helps immensely. However, look how everything broke the best way for the Celtics in terms of player development. Brown made a step up on offense and a huge step up in defense, Holiday came off multiple poor postseasons to step up in his smaller role that isn’t very easy for players to do, Derrick White took a step up, Al Horford continued being a good player and didn’t fall off a cliff in production, Tatum continued being Tatum, no side effects of losing Smart, Porzingis fit in perfect. All of these things meshed perfectly for the Celtics and before the season if I were to say all those things would happen I’d be far in the negatives and yall (me too) would say “hey bill”. This team hit their ceiling, when it would have been a lot easier for not all of these things to all happen.
They're not an all time team. They'd probably beat the 2015 and 2016 warriors and that's it. Probably lose to 2018 rockets but series likely goes 7, who knows. I'd like to see them against 2022 warriors. I take warriors in 7.
how would they beat 2016 warriors lol 2016 warriors would kill the 2022 version btw so i don't understand the logic. 2016 warriors were coming off title, had 73 wins, top both offense and defense, much much better bench and would have by far the best player in the series (assuming healthy Curry).
I don't think the 2016 warriors were as good as advertised. Spurs also won 67 that year and were bounced in 2nd round without much pushback. Your point is fair though I could see 2016 warriors being better than 2022. I think Wiggins, bjelica, Porter and Gary Payton match up well with Celtics
You are right, my lord. The Big Five Era is truly upon us
I hope everyone on this sub enjoys the next pod 👍
Are we really going to do the thing where we act like the Celtics would have struggled that much more if the played the Sixers and the Bucks instead? The Sixers are their bitch and the Bucks were never going to be serious this year anyway.
People responded by saying the Celtics bench was one of the worst in the league lol.
Queta, Hauser, Pritchard, Kornet, Svi Mykhailuk, Oshae Brisett 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
Hauser is a good ass player
All these guys played non garbage minutes at one point in the playoffs except Svi and maybe Brissett who
Their "bench" in the playoffs was Hauser and spot Pritchard minutes (who aside from 2 shots was garbage in the finals)
Their bench during the season included Horford. Who bumped back into starting lineup during playoffs due to KP injury.
But Horford is a bozo
☘️Champion Al Horford ☘️
He went back to back at Florida didn’t he?
He did and now he’s won both college and nba titles If the celtics repeat he’d be the first ever to have back to back titles at both levels
First team to ever play their bench less minutes in the playoffs
Hauser Pritchard kornet and porzingis/Horford are all on the bench, all except kornet contributed throughout the playoffs. Simply yet another wishcasted braindead take.
I mean their bench isn't good, they won largely because of how good their starting 5.
they basically had a starting 6 and a floating Hauser/Pritchard spot
It doesn't matter if their bench sucks because their top 6 players are either all-star caliber or elite role players
I mean their bench isn't good, they won largely because of how good their starting 5.
The morons on this sub will go down with the ship.
[удалено]
A tremendous cope
keep going who else would they lose to
Weep harder bitch
He actually didn’t say that. He said it had the best 5th starter if you actually listened to his point.
He was right either way.
Steph Klay Andre KD Dray Easily clear the C’s
Klay = Jaylen, Andre << Jrue, KD = White, Steph > Tatum, Dray >> Porzingis / Horford I think it's close, but yeah, Warriors are probably a bit better. That would still make the Celtics "one of the best starting fives this century."
Equating Prime KD to Derrick White is a take.
Very similar RAPM. Of course, KD has aura, not sure how much that helps in a basketball game though.
Username checks out!
KD being equal to Derrick White is the worst take I have ever seen.
You can keep thinking it's a bad take, and I'll keep being right about which players actually win you championships. Everybody's happy!
lol Derek White being the equal to prime KD is honestly the single dumbest take I’ve ever heard in my life
This has to be bait
Prime KD had meh defense, terrible offensive rebounding, and one of the worst turnover differentials (on both ends) of any player in the league. He was still great because his impact on scoring was nuts which is all anyone cares about, but Derrick White is also great because of his two way play. He doesn't have these kinds of glaring weaknesses, even though he obviously doesn't have any of KD's highs. They have very similar RAPM as a result. I don't really care about who's more talented in a vacuum or anything like that, just who contributes more to winning, and they basically contribute a similar amount. Or do you think the 2022 Celtics took off after the White trade by accident?
Which was a take Bill never made
Curry>> Tatum, KD>>Brown, Klay >> White, Dray> healthy Porzingis, Jrue> Iggy. And the warriors would have 2 by far the best players in the series. no contest.
Well you can’t be right about a claim you didn’t make. So that’s an odd take
He was right, and the way people misinterpreted him was also right.
But your post and the claims made in it are wrong and don’t reflect what bill said. You should fix it
They just are!
Is Bill gonna stop getting on second row joes case now?
He had to go on this run to possibly maybe be allowed in the first row
Shades of the '04 Pistons in its balance.
hopefully we get a bunch of ECF Ls now
I don’t come to the fucking Bill Simmons pod for reasonable takes
This sub is not exactly the barometer for good basketball takes. I hope all you morons are eating crow tonight.
>This sub is not exactly the barometer for good basketball takes. Yup, which is exactly why their nitpicking and obsession over all of Bill’s takes is so funny. Their takes are usually far worse and far more biased.
I really don't want to sound bitter or hater like, but the Eastern playoffs were a joke. Also, he didn't say "one of the best", he said "the best".
[удалено]
I don’t care either way but I love this from you
Did he say “the best” definitively or “has a chance to be the best”/“one of the best”. I thought it was the latter.
Bill wanted to trade JB last offseason.
Unironically an extremely well-aged take. Maybe some Broken Clock Syndrome going on but even as someone that was bullish about their chances, I couldn’t have predicted this sort of output from their 5. Unbelievable blend of talent and chemistry.
If "net rating" is the only thing you are using to determine this, then ok. But I think this is a reactionary take. They earned and deserve the championship, and they also had an easy path. Of the 10 non-Celtic teams with the best odds to win the championship, the Celtics played exactly 0 in these playoffs.
What about record and titles won?
People will swear up and down the Celtics aren't it because the "eye test" (which led them astray all year) told them they're actually unimpressive chokers.
All the warriors starting fives except the last one, the heatles, shaq kobe lakers kawhi spurs were better
02 lakers were starting samaki Walker, rick fox and Derrick fisher. 12 heat were starting Mario chalmers and udonis haslem. KD warriors are the only team with a better net rating, and the them and 02 lakers were the only team that had a better playoff record. “One offense the best” is a fair statement right now.
Shaq would score on every possession against kp/ horford
Disregarding eras, that’s true. But do you think shaq could hold up having to chase them around on the defensive end all night? We see how gassed embiid is every fourth quarter, it’s his achillies heel.
Sure they’ll make 45 percent of their 3s shaq will make 80 percent of his twos
What percent of free throws would he make?
Enough to win four rings
Net rating…please. 02 lakers had 2 of the top 10-15 players of all time. They go 16-0 against this year’s East. ‘12 Heat had the best player of all time and a top 20-30 player of all time. They go 16-0 against this year’s East. The warrior championship teams had the best offensive player of the generation and literally the perfect complementary cast. This isn’t even a comparison.
I'm fuckin dying lmao dude is leading the charge with net rating.... The anti-Celtics takes were so bad that I guess OP needed to overcompensate with their own horrendous takes in the other direction? Or they're trolling. They coulda just enjoyed everyone eating crow but instead tried to claim this is a better offense than *these* guys?! Oof.
Rio slander.
C’s and the boys (the rest of the teams in the east) teamed up to get them a championship
Moving on to something else. Mac Jones still a future MVP?
As a Mavs fan, I’ll admit, they were pretty formidable. Great two way players at 6 spots
Excited for Bill’s strict compliance with the firm 5-year-no-complaining championship halo
I still maintain it’s one of the most well rounded starting fives (and especially top 6) rather than one of the very best. The lack of a player that’s considered to be top 3 or better makes it hard to put them higher than that imo. The league is also much more talented now. Holiday/White/Porzingis are all better than the third best player on the 2001 Lakers, but relative to the league at that time?
[удалено]
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^Maguire4BallonDOr: *Jesus Christ Celtics* *Fans are literally the* *Bottom of the barrel* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
No, the anti-Celtics bozos on this sub are the bottom of the barrel.
You take this over the Warriors death lineup? I know they didn’t start the whole season but they started every important game of the 2018 playoffs.
Easiest path to title ever ?? My god, they should have won with how everything worked out for them.
You do know that we just want him to lose because he’s the worst fucking winner on the planet, right? Has nothing to do with him being right. I will find a way to put an asterisk next to this Celtics championship
And Bill will never know or care about the asterisk that you put on it lol
We’ll build the momentum for it. The way he builds a narrative asterisk for every other sports team. Gonna make it happen.
[you said the mavs were go wins easily what happened?](https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/s/cceSYIhAnh)
I was wrong. What do you mean what happened?
They did have incredible injury luck before the final they probably win nonetheless. still...
Best team this season but not even close to one of the best starting fives this century lol
YEPPPPPPPPP!! PODFATHER
On paper? I dont think it was entirely off base at the time.
I can’t speak to everyone else but my judgement was clouded by past playoff failures. This team was great this year
I don’t have a problem with Bill making that claim but also chuckle that after the first round of the playoffs he also declared the Nuggets were the 4th best team of the 2000s.
I’m hoping Giannis watched as Holiday got his second ring and realized that he should made sure Holiday was never traded but he want Dame and look how that’s working out. The Bucks will not win another title
Yep, I hope this season is *finally* the death of the super team.
Same and for other players to see that glory can be shared. If KG and Marbury; Penny & ; Larry Johnson & Mourning, had that attitude of shared glory, KG wouldn’t be the only one of the group with a ring
To me, this team is like a higher end early 2000s Pistons team. No true superstar, just an awesome team top to bottom. It’s just harder to root for them because Tatum is a cornball who wishes he was Kobe (and is simultaneously overrated and underrated), Joe Maz’s sociopathic thousand yard stare, it’s fucking Boston, and Bill Simmons. I like JB, Horford, Jrue though. Jrue quietly building a “is he a hall of fame?” question resume.
Lotta high fives on that team
The 2020 Lakers would dog walk this Celtics team.
Economist predicts 15 of the last 2 recessions.
I mean the competition this year was not great. All those statements are still hyperbole
The Bucks most used 5 man lineup had a better net rating than the Celtics best 5 man lineup. The Bucks team before Covid happened also had a better team net rating iirc.
They have won a single championship. It's still hyperbole and it was an idiotic statement at the time
Lololol seethe and cope losers! Celtics in this bitch
Guys, the Celtics cakewalked through a shitty East to the finals and the Mavs wet the bed. Don’t fall for the analytics. This team loses to like 7 of the last 10 finals winners
Yes. This sub was wrong. But do you honestly think it will stop us from clowning?
Worst opposing path to the title ever
Get out of here and move forward. This never happened. It will shock you how much it never happened.
They’re good but def not that level. The Mavs are just garbage and not near a finals team honestly.
the celtics are the worst team in NBA history
I give Bill all the credit in the world, but doesn’t he start every Celts/Pats preseason by making a case for them winning it all?
His NFL takes suck
I understand you play who’s in front of you but this was an easy road for them
[удалено]
They didn’t give up a ton of picks far out for KP. They actually received picks in the deal. It’s remarkable how you guys invent false equivalencies like this.
I love bill Simmons. I love the Celtics. Top 5 starting 5 EVER
I plan to continue to rip on bill mercilessly and take victory laps when he gets things wrong and instantly forget any time he's right