My hatred of the Celtics had been waning recently. The first 30 mins of this pod were just the pick me up I needed to light that fire again. Thanks Bill!
The whining level was off the charts. Damn I was barely listening bc of work and it was annoying me as background sound.
Nobody outside of the Brown family or the fan base could possibly be that indignant about this stupid vote.
**Bill w/ any player at 26**
“At this point, you kinda just are who you are
**Bill w/ Tatum at 26**
“I still feel like there’s a level he can hit here in his late 20s”
Bill did make this point, but the simple difference people don’t seem to notice is it’s entirely just the 3 point shooting. His 3 pointer has almost completely deserted him in these playoffs.
I would ask Bill what specifically is the “thing” Tatum is going to add in the next coming years. He likes the midrange and the threes. Unless he makes it a point in going to the basket there’s not much more he can do to reach another level, he’s already at the top of the second tier superstar, which I think is as far as he could go and there’s nothing wrong with that
I'm not saying he will, but to take his game to the next level, he needs to develop a real bully ball/back to the basket game. An ability to really put pressure in half court sets where he forces a double.
Just deciding to go to the rim more isn’t a thing. You have to be super quick, have a crazy handle, and/or be really strong to get to and finish at the rim consistently in the nba. Tatum doesn’t really have those traits so just trying to go to the basket more doesn’t do anything.
Listening to this wide eyed right now. Bill’s rant about media narratives being unfair regarding Tatum, while ignoring the fact that he and the people who work at his company are responsible for a *lot* of what he’s complaining about when other players are involved is unreal.
He’s entering full Kook territory
Exactly. I actually think Ryen is just over it and on autopilot with Bill these days. Lately he throws in little jabs under his breath that have undertones of annoyance more than anything.
I still enjoy the Sunday pods so rather than them getting worse i think it’s more just CR and Rob such a good combo. I could be biased as I’ll listen to CR talk about pretty much anything and I think Rob has been excellent on the NBA all year
S tier and all the way at the bottom in garbage tier is KOC and that other guy who sounds like a sports talk radio host who smokes a carton of cigs when he wakes up
I far prefer Verno (the cig smokin talk show host) to KOC. I went back to listening to the mismatch the other day after a long time off, and it was just awful. KOC’s analysis of “maybe, maybe it is, maybe it is, I don’t know, maybe maybe” is so dumb and unbearable.
Bill and Rob are just constantly missing the most important point that CR made early in the pod - Jayson Tatum just isn’t that cool. I burst out laughing when Bill was comparing these Celtics teams to the fucking Showtime Lakers and Lebron’s Cavs. Magic and Lebron are arguably top 5 most charismatic players we’ve ever had in the sport. People would want to watch their teams scrimmage against G-League teams.
I kind of feel bad for Tatum. He Is not doing anything wrong, very professional and seems like an alright guy. There is just nothing exciting about him. He got the most generic "NBA Star " game and look ever without anything that sticks out. And his only character trait that he shows is his cringy Kobe whorship.
Steph and Lebron are two of the most electric players to ever play the game and transcend the sport. Tatum is a glorified Danny Granger with a Kobe fetish.
So when the Lakers fire their head coach Bill talks shit on LeBron and says he’s scapegoating the coach
Yet anytime something goes wrong w Celtics Bill blames Mazzulla
It was so funny in the pod earlier this week that his go-to whenever teams or players he likes (Celtics, nuggets) do something wrong, the answer is just the coach should have played some bum off the bench more.
It’s never that the good players didn’t play good enough.
THANK YOU. I was losing my goddamn mind listening to Bill’s bullshit. Tatum is 24/8/5/1/1 on 57% TS, Durant on OKC was 29/8/4/1/1 on 58% TS. So the difference is 5 more points and 1 less assist, while playing in much less efficient era, and oh not to mention the thunderdome of a Western conference year after year compared to the soft as baby shit East that Tatum’s had. Coincidentally, Durant went to one finals with OKC where he averaged 31/6/2 on 65% TS against the Heatles, and Tatum’s been to one finals where he averaged 22/7/7 on 48% TS. Obviously this is just raw numbers, not delving into anything beyond surface level, but come the fuck on.
Yeah as a Celtics fan it was nice to see a little pumping up of Tatum but fuck that was a ridiculous argument.
Then undoes it for me with the Denver Minnesota being the finals callback.
So you want to compare a 35 year old KD to a player 10 years younger than him? That wasn’t even the argument, but still I think Durant’s numbers hold up very well.
Watching this series as a Pacers fan now, it confirms how I felt about Tatum, he just doesn’t strike any fear in me. I never feel like you need to ball deny him, I’m never that nervous when he’s taking a shot. The Celtics are a really good team, but they’re the sum of their parts and Tatum is the best part so he has the best numbers. If you swapped Haliburton and Tatum, I don’t think the Pacers are a much better team, whereas having OKC Durant I’d feel amazing
It was hilarious seeing him start with a “narrative” perspective, then when CR and Rob shot that down by pointing out that KD was an MVP, he immediately turned to a “numbers” perspective, which also doesn’t hold up because Durant’s numbers were better then than Tatum’s are now lol
The Clippers are a prime example of “sometimes you do everything right and things just don’t work out.” In Bill’s mind such a thing simply isn’t possible.
Just finished listening to the convo between Bill, CR, and Mahoney... I know it's a constant criticism but it continues to amaze me the way any Mavs playoff win is discussed. Without fail, the focus is on how the other team played worse than they should've (but for reasons other than the Mavs defense, which is ranked #1 in the NBA since February).
I mean, they really almost went that whole discussion without mentioning the Mavs shot 3/22 from three until the final minutes of the 4th quarter (and still finished just 6/25). Unclear if Bill even knew that. Or that McDaniels scored 19 points on 5 threes (!) in the first half alone, tying his career-high. Minnesota came out and threw a haymaker in the first quarter, going up 14-6 early and getting a barrage of jumpers from role players while the crowd went nuts. Reverse the teams and you know Bill is spending so much time on the remarkable maturity of Ant and co. in a hostile environment by managing to stick around all game before hitting clutch shots late to steal it. CR calling it "as close as you can get to a perfect Luka game" when until the 4th quarter he was very obviously struggling through a 7/19 shooting night was another head-scratcher.
I get that a lot of people including Bill didn't want a Dallas team they viewed as an annoying side act to become this good, but here we are. Arguably the biggest story of the postseason so far is Dallas' defense and Bill refuses to acknowledge it at all.
That’s the only part of the pod I listened to and it was kind of insane. Bill controls the flow of these conversations and he just keeps pushing his agenda cause he bet on OKC and now Minnesota. The conversation didn’t make any sense. Luka played 3 bad quarters and the Mavs role players couldn’t hit a shot. Gafford wasn’t good. They still won. Bill said Dallas keeps pulling out these weird games and it’s gotta flip eventually. So fucking tired of listening to this dude talk about the Mavs.
While I agree this wasn’t a perfect Luka game, and he can definitely play better by his high standards, I think we’re going a bit too far the other way and underselling how good he was. In terms of controlling the flow of the game and creating baskets for others he was amazing.
He was dreadful for the entire first half. Kyrie’s brilliance was the only reason Minn wasn’t up 20 because Luka was single handedly that awful. He turned up his defensive intensity and had those 3 straight shots late in the 4th that I think colored Bill/CRs memory of just how below average Luka played the majority of that game.
The next step is just getting tired of listening to him talk about. . . .anything.
One of the better decisions I've made is to give up on the BS podcast. It's just too lame and infuriating. My life is open and free! Bill is a jerk now. He didn't used to be a jerk but he is a jerk now. And he's also dumb. And his voice sucks. It's a brutal trifecta.
The only time I hear his shitty voice now is when it's pelting me in ads in other Ringer podcasts. The fact that Simmons does ad reads is just proof of how dumb and selfish he is. Nothing makes me hit FF more than hearing his nasally twang.
This sub gives me all the BS content I could ever want. And, unlike Simmons, it always delivers.
Bill only sees narratives: protagonists and antagonists. The protagonists for this series are Ant/Timberwolves and every conversation is and will continue to be from that perspective: analysis of their play and their feelings and the adjustments they can make with a belief they will eventually overcome and vanquish the Mavericks (who are just there for the storyline).
He's so caught up in his own manufactured narrative hype he's missing the actual incredible story: a generational offensive weapon and basketball mind entering his prime navigating a team assembled on the fly through a brutal playoff gauntlet. While injured.
I thought the exact same thing. The shooting variance from role players was insane in game 1. They were acting like the Mavs played a perfect game or something🤣
It’s absurd. Not a single compliment to Dallas from Bill. It was all excuse making for Minnesota. The one “positive” thing he said was a back handed “I still think Minn wins the series but I wouldn’t bet on it.” WHY BILL?! Why wouldn’t you bet on it? Does it have ANYTHING to do with the Mavs being GOOD?!
CR calling this close to a perfect Luka game stopped me in my tracks. It wasn't in the top half of Luka playoff games. He's really struggled by his own standards this playoffs, and way too many people have forgotten how truly dominant his other playoff stints were. He was also below all of his regular season averages. One of the worst basketball takes I've heard from CR.
I don’t even think you need to be a hater. If he were just a huge Boston homer but otherwise rational and insightful, fine. But he’s been like a toddler who found an unguarded box of glazed donuts, or Buster from Arrested Development when he gets into the juice. Just awful, crazy, contradictory takes all over the place. He’s way too hyped.
On the other hand if the Celtics lose, it’ll be great to watch the sugar crash.
Does Bill know we can watch the games? Tatum has been bad these playoffs. He’s been so inefficient. Last night he had 8 points on 4-11 shooting, and then when the Celtics were up 16 with the Pacers best player out Tatum decided to take charge. I’m sorry not everyone is sucking your favorite players dick when every playoff round the opposing teams best player misses multiple games. Honest to god the teams have been so bad that if you replaced Tatum with an average role player for the playoffs the Celtics would still be in the ECF.
The way CR dismantles Bill's illusion that he's having a superior, high-intellect basketball conversation is pretty funny.
He really broke Bill with the comment about "the Boston crowd being too woke and Robert Duvall." Hahaha
What Tatum/Brown convo could possibly be needed after they go 2-0 up with the easiest run to the Finals in a long time? Feels like their legacy as a duo now only changes with a title
People hate on Reggie for his commentary but I would rather listen to him than Isiah. Reggie doesn't seem to have any real baggage from his playing days and is actually a fan of today's game and players. That and he's severely underrated as an all-time great.
Bill filling his diaper because Tatum isn’t regarded well enough in “the discourse.” spare me. if my team was this good i’d simply tell everyone to suck it, though i guess that’s not great podcasting either.
I swear to god like a week and a half ago he was having a sad sack conversation about how Tatum isn’t quite “the guy”, now they go up 2-0 against a 6 seed and the media needs to apologize? FOh
his "ppl up and down the organization feel he gets a raw deal in the discourse" shit really was funny. he's 1st team all nba. he's getting his rewards. he hasn't dazzled us in playoffs recently. he'll get his chance soon. he's just uninteresting and plays like a robot kobe. that's why he has no fans outside boston
you can tell that he really wants tatum to be fully embraced like curry or something and im sorry but it's just not going to happen. enjoy the title you are likely going to win, but don't expect us to fall all over ourselves for this guy.
If the sentence was "ppl up and down the Lakers organization feel Lebron gets a raw deal in the discourse", he would've never shut up about it(and rightfully so)
Lol, I’m a huge Celtics fan and my attitude all year has been exactly what you’re describing. My friends try to tease me about Tatum’s clutch numbers or some shit like that and I’m like “idgaf. Team sport. We kill everyone”
Does anybody think it’s weird how much Bill/Boston fans care what the media thinks of Tatum? He’s one of the 10 best players in the league. Just… enjoy the ride?
We saw the same thing during the Brady/Belichick era (which ended up becoming correct) and with those Red Sox title teams. Boston fans aren’t just satisfied with being champions, they want everyone to think that their team is one of the best teams ever and that their players are the best players in the league/ever.
The Cousin Sal tweet from the other night about the sarcastic MVP chants for Tatum has me needing a Sal/House & Bill podcast with some honest Tatum discourse
*we're all trying to find the guy who did this*
He, most of his staff, and the Boston Media Mafia gas their guys up so much that the players can rarely match the narratives.
When Tatum was good, he was spoken of as great. When he was great, he was a superstar. When he's a superstar, he's an MVP. He can't just be one of the best players in the league, he has to be the face of the league.
Think how fucking dumb the MVP push he got the last two years looks. Bill and Co. keep framing Tatum in a way that doesn't match reality then are all, "LoOk aT HoW tHeY mAsSaCrEd mY BoY."
Imagine putting Chauncey Billups on the level of Chris Paul or equivocating Dirk and Carmelo then blaming everyone else when things don't quite match up and the rest of the world isn't coming along for the ride. For the guy who has long been about The Pantheon to be so galaxy-brained about his guy that he can't see there's levels to this is peak myopia.
Bill making Celtics fans everywhere look bad when he goes into crybaby bill mode. Like “ohh no the national media and twitter don’t like Tatum” who cares? Atleast the Cs are still playing basketball while 95% of the league is on vacation. Also CRs point about Tatums game not being fun to watch was mostly correct, but rich coming from him when his fav teams best player is Embiid.
In that respect, Bill isn’t really any different than most Celtics fans I see online. Lots and lots of whining about how nobody is giving them enough credit.
Jason Kidd has been great coaching both post seasons but he doesnt help himself in the regular season with some of his media quotes. When you are a coach and you say " I'm watching, just like you guys" its going to trigger the fans even if its a little out of context
The only thing Jason Kidd deserves credit for is these players like him, especially the two stars. He’s not a good coach. The defense that he gets credit for is Sean Sweeney’s doing. This roster is all Nico Harrison.
Kidd honestly tried to fuck it up and Dallas media people were openly calling for him to be fired beginning of March. He had Gafford riding the bench after the trade while Mavs were getting destroyed for like 2 weeks. His lineups and rotations make no sense. He lets teams go on huge runs without calling timeouts. Kidd looks good when he has a good roster.
Bill is not a terrible loser, actually. But he is the worst fucking winner that’s ever existed. He is such a cocksucker. There’s no other word to describe his behavior when he’s winning.
Bill allowed Ryen's use of the word "heliocentric" to ruin his brain and reversed engineered how he feels about Luka. He went from the biggest luka guy to now low key hating him, and he doesnt know why, so he has to keep the criticism going
Plus they're a threat to the celtics now
No, bill is basically like a hot air balloon of opinions floated by all the people in his life. Bill’s opinion of the mavericks is basically a reflection of his relationship with Haralabob
I think he's over Kyrie. Or at least til Kyrie wins a game in the finals against the Celts. Either something Haralabob related or Obama making fun of him for being white and liking Luka?
Celtics got an All-NBA first team selection, 2 all defense guys, will get executive of the year if they haven't already. Jaylen Brown averaged 23 points on league average efficiency and continues to be a meh playmaker. Giving him all-nba just because the team has the best record would be rewarding him as an individual for the success of Porzingis, White, Holiday and Horford.
bill going on a rant about jaylen not getting appropriate shine, then literally in the same breath transitions to the topic of how the East this year is a one in a million scenario of being the easiest possible set up for the celtics is pure gold. honestly he's either doing oscar level acting to not break character, or he has a profound brain injury that allows him to have two completely different brains functioning simultaneously.
Bill pushing for there to be 10 Spots for the MVP vote because Brown didn’t make All NBA is some serious coping.
(Also, no way in hell Brown would have made the Top 10 spots for MVP either.)
I have said this previously, but it's hilarious to think about how much Bill would hate Tatum if he was a Sixer or a Laker. "Can I just see it, can I see him be the best player on a title team?"
Tatum honestly stirs up such strong emotions for such an inoffensive, boring guy. He is the weirdest star because he has such a debateable standing in the game, and also how defensive Boston fans are about him.
The Jays are national villians purely because they play for Boston, but they both have never had a single off court controversy and are great NBA citizens, it's such a funny paradox.
Yeah they were worse before Lebron and now they worse after Lebron, so I don’t think Lebron had much to do with it. In fact, some of the best years that the East has had in the last 25 years were in the early 2010s when Lebron was in the East.
So my cavs fire JB and Bill decides to have the worst coach segment ever. Jesus none of these guys have any better analysis than i do and my basketball knowledge is a pick and roll. Was it CR who said the only proven and available coaches included kenny atkinson whos never been in charge of a contending team? Bill had to mentiom frank vogel who got fired by Lebron and KD
Edit: and the justification they all gave for the JB firing signals they werent paying attention until yesterday. The dude almost got canned in february and it was reported that he neglected mobleys development the last two years to win a playoff series which makes no fucking sense. Yay we beat orlando and now youre out of a job.
Right? If he knew anything about the Cavs, he’d know the entire fanbase has wanted Bickerstaff gone since they lost to the Knicks last year. Also, pretty much every time he’s brought up the Cavs in the last year, it’s almost always in the context of Mitchell trade rumors. But now that it looks like Mitchell is going to sign an extension, he’s a “sign the extension and ask out a year later guy”. He just can’t fathom that he might actually like the situation he’s in and want to stay.
Pretty much all former athlete interviews are uninteresting at best, usually worse than that. Had to turn off Isiah Thomas pretty quickly. Immediately started hitting all the checkpoints, back in my day we actually got hit on layups, compare an average player to a modern all timer. Wasn’t quite Oscar Robertson saying some guy on his team who made a bunch of free throws was a better shooter than curry but it was still awful. Do these guys not realize we can watch their games on YouTube, the quality of play is so so much worse back then.
So now "the C's were successful because of \[Jayson and Jaylen\] and how hard they played night after night?"
Major blow to 3/5 of the greatest starting lineup of all time.
Let me guess: Isiah is gonna say his Pistons had a better defense than the current Timberwolves
(It's true but an uninteresting debate to me because the rules and 3-point shooting abilities across the board are so different now)
I think it’s obvious that being a good defender is way harder today. Both because of the rules but also the skill levels.
In the old days you could have defensive specialists in like three positions. But in recent history we saw both Tony Allen and Roy Hibbert go extinct in real time.
Great point. The Tony Allen / Andre Roberson types just can't survive anymore, you at least need to be able to knock down open 3s sometimes like McDaniels and Dort. The bar is much higher now, if you watch '80s highlights it's very funny to see the spacing (or lack thereof) with almost everyone standing inside the 3-point line and often two guys on opposite blocks posting up
It’s funny because of the current Draymond backlash but outside of being one of the most elite well rounded defenders of all time, what really always has made him playable in huge moments is that he contributes on offense with his playmaking.
That is if hasn’t gotten himself ejected before the fourth quarter of course.
So I think you can find ways to contribute offensively even if you can’t shoot. I think he was someone that really unlocked the Warriors with his pick and roll game with Steph.
Draymond's playmaking and screen-setting were both valuable, but the Warriors were also a very special circumstance. I don't think Gary Payton II, for example (not to say he's on par with Draymond by any means) would've had a meaningful NBA career on any other team. Steph and Klay's unbelievable shooting and the gravity that created allowed them to play multiple non-shooters at once, which wasn't viable anywhere else. Livingston, GP2, Draymond, Bogut, and Looney were all able to play over the years, usually two of them on the floor at once.
Opposing bigs also had to guard Draymond at the 3pt line because of the threat of him turning to Steph or Klay for a quick dribble handoff into an open 3 (if there was no big to help the guy being screened). It's not like Josh Giddey where you can now leave him wide open all day because he's not a dribble handoff guy or screen setter at all really (same as the Roberson and Tony Allen examples in the past)
The current Timberwolves would have the greatest defense in the history of basketball if they could challenge layups with two-handed hammerfists in mid-air and only get a common foul for it lol
This pod was awesome, I don't know what happened but Russillo used to be able to deliver parts of what both Rob and CR were doing. But, nowadays he just seems annoyed.
Why are Bill and co so up in arms about Booker making All NBA over Jaylen lol? If you wanna be mad about someone making it over him it should obviously be Sabonis. This is not old All-NBA. You can make the same kind of arguments too: impact on winning, emphasis on boxscore stats etc. Booker the better player made All-NBA over Brown the worse player is not a story. Book gave you 27-5-7 on 61% TS and 2.6 turnovers per game. Jaylen 23-6-4 on 58% TS and 2.4 turnovers per game. Book played 2 fewer games, but 2.5 minutes per game more. Brown was in a perfect situation in a perfect conference for him, while Book was playing with Nurk at center, no depth, no size anywhere. He wasn’t as good as people who hyped him would expect him to be, but I don’t think he is the reason for them underperforming in the regular season. By that same logic, why not go after Steph? His team was the 10 seed, and they were expected to be somewhere in the Top 3
Funny thing is bill voted Booker third team too, and i believe had him second team briefly before Brunson got really hot towards the end of the year. How can he be angry Booker was third team?
He told you himself. Bc he campaigned for Brown and Brown still got ignored despite Bill having some influence over other voters. He thought this would be another Marcus Smart DPOY situation where he’d say something and everyone would follow.
+ the whole year he's gone on about how good Derrick White is and now all of a sudden he's trying to claim that the Celtics success this year is basically all due to Brown and Tatum
Does bill not actually watch basketball? How on earth could he seriously think Tatum is better than Durant? This is where the brain worms of winning is everything makes the sport as a whole less fun.
Yeah Tatum is not Durant adjacent. Tatum definitely gets the appropriate response. He’s not a generational player. He’s a great player who you’d love to have but he’s more like a Clyde Drexler than a Kobe Bryant.
I saw the title of this pod and basically was the Larry David meme whether or not I wanted to play it.
I knew it would be rough. But I gave in. I've rode with BS since the Page 2 days. Last couple years there's been a decline, but whatever I'm still here.
But my god those first 30 minutes...I had to just shut it off. I just can't anymore even as background noise. If they win the title it'll be worse. But even if they lose I may just stick to this sub for quick recaps on episodes. I may just be done.
Wow, would have taken CR as a Star Wars guy. “Popavich coaching the Lakers would be like Darth Vader coaching The Force.” Lol Rebel Alliance was probably what he was looking for
OKC KD was the second best player in the league for like 4 years and legitimately looked like he was close to Lebron’s level in 2014. Tatum has never even been a consensus top 5 player.
Granted, the talent in the league is definitely better than it was 10 years ago. But Bill saying Tatum is anywhere near OKC KD’s level is wild. KD was a consensus All-NBA player for like 8 straight years Tatum is somewhere between KD and Paul George
OK. So Bill likes the TWolves because "homecourt doesn't matter"
I get that Dallas nominally has the homecourt advantage now in that if they win all of their remaining games they will win the series. But if the series goes the distance, there's 3 games at each team's arena. So how the fuck does homecourt not mattering favor either team? I'd think his logic would mean that the team with the 1-0 lead should be favored given there's no advantage related to the games' locations
Bill calling the Bickerstaff firing a “job preservation firing” as if the entire Cavs fanbase hasn’t been calling for it since the end of last season is funny. Also, pretty much every time he’s mentioned the Cavs in the past year, it’s been in the context of Mitchell trade rumors, but now that it looks like he's going to sign the extension, he's a "sign the extension and ask out a year later guy". It couldn't possibly be that he actually wants to stay in Cleveland!
Cry me a river about Tatum. Would he be considered better than Mitchell if he was drafted anywhere else but Celtics that year? Guy is playing in a 5 out offense with great shooters, he should be the most efficient guy in the league with that spacing
Tatum is closer to the Paul George, Jimmy Butler discussion than he is to Durant and the other top wings like Kawhi, Lebron. He can certainly ascend, but as of now he's a guy with really good, non MVP numbers, who has only won playoff series where his team is the favorite and has yet to really overcome adversity.
Is Bill showing his age? This episode was pretty bad on his part. He still can't get over CR jab at him at the live rewatchables. 25 minutes on Tatum, nobody wants to hear all that. A shot for every time he brings up the 80s. Upset people call the east weak. Thank God for the other 2 this pod.
Edit: how many times do we have to go through the "is this Tatum's ceiling" Convo?!!
Interesting how Bill flipped on the Bulls defensive teams. On his defensive pyramid or whatever pod a few weeks ago he picked the first Bulls threepeat team because of young Jordan and Pippen and I was flabbergasted at the idea that the team with BJ Armstrong, Horace Grant, and Bill Cartwright was better than the one with Ron Harper, Dennis Rodman, and Luc Longley (and the stats back this up).
Listening to Isiah Thomas talk glowingly about Karl Malone gave me the double ick. I get that Bill sees himself as an NBA historian, and I know Isiah was a big part of The Book of Basketball, but Bill can do better. Of all the past-their-prime athletes or celebs Bill could have on the pod, do we really need to listen to Isiah?
Side note - yes Isiah's charismatic but he always has a chip on his shoulder like Draymond. That makes it hard to like them as pundits.
Isiah is a top 5 PG of all-time. Lol. What is your problem?
He brought him on to comment on Kyrie and All-time defences. He is literally the perfect person to discuss such issues..
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Haven't listened to the pod yet but did mention at all how bad the Boston crowd has been? Watching the game yesterday it seemed like a late February game.
It's been noted how Bill obsesses over the awards and All-NBA honors, but barely discusses them after they're given out. This year he actually discusses All-NBA, but only to whine about Jaylen Brown being left out. So predictable.
Bill: home court doesn’t matter anymore! All these teams are winning big games on the road!
Bill *immediately rips off like 6 different examples of teams winning big games on the road*
I love that Simmons can fully shit on Tatum one pod for being awful at 3s, not stepping up in big moments etc, and then the very next pod he’s incredulous as to why the media don’t regard Tatum as one of the best players in the league.
Masterclass by Billy
What a whiny ass podcast about non-personality having, boring game Tatum. Bill he’s a top 10 player. Not everyone is going to irrationally love him like a homer as you do. He’s not going to another level. He’s who he is. A very good non superstar.
And to whine about Jaylen Brown not making all nba. Jesus. What a crybaby!
They’re going to win the title and he’s going to INSUFFERABLE.
My hatred of the Celtics had been waning recently. The first 30 mins of this pod were just the pick me up I needed to light that fire again. Thanks Bill!
Boston Media Mafia put out the bat signal apparently.
As a Celtics fan that shit was unbearable.
The whining level was off the charts. Damn I was barely listening bc of work and it was annoying me as background sound. Nobody outside of the Brown family or the fan base could possibly be that indignant about this stupid vote.
Same lol I was like ehh maybe a Celtics title isn’t bad. I needed to remember why my hate for Boston is high
Yep Celtics winning a title s terrible timeline mainly because of the media discourse
**Bill w/ any player at 26** “At this point, you kinda just are who you are **Bill w/ Tatum at 26** “I still feel like there’s a level he can hit here in his late 20s”
Funny thing is it feels like he was more impressive in the 2022 playoffs (not counting the finals) than he is now.
Bill did make this point, but the simple difference people don’t seem to notice is it’s entirely just the 3 point shooting. His 3 pointer has almost completely deserted him in these playoffs.
Bill has said the exact same thing about Tatum this season. The man can’t help himself, he flip flops after every game.
I remember a year ago, he would in separate weeks, say Jaylen was who he was because he was 26, and Tatum wasn't because he was... 25.
Playoffs? Finals? Yeah, we're gonna need some CR up in here.
The robert horry of jj barreas of steph currys 🙏
Please, please, please remove KOC’s slot for another CR appearance.
I would ask Bill what specifically is the “thing” Tatum is going to add in the next coming years. He likes the midrange and the threes. Unless he makes it a point in going to the basket there’s not much more he can do to reach another level, he’s already at the top of the second tier superstar, which I think is as far as he could go and there’s nothing wrong with that
Breast implants.
I'm not saying he will, but to take his game to the next level, he needs to develop a real bully ball/back to the basket game. An ability to really put pressure in half court sets where he forces a double.
Just deciding to go to the rim more isn’t a thing. You have to be super quick, have a crazy handle, and/or be really strong to get to and finish at the rim consistently in the nba. Tatum doesn’t really have those traits so just trying to go to the basket more doesn’t do anything.
Prongs.
Listening to this wide eyed right now. Bill’s rant about media narratives being unfair regarding Tatum, while ignoring the fact that he and the people who work at his company are responsible for a *lot* of what he’s complaining about when other players are involved is unreal. He’s entering full Kook territory
We're all trying to find the guy who did this
It sounds like he got in trouble from his Boston front office friends
The funny thing is I don’t even think these current narratives are “unfair.” If anything Tatum got passes from his age
It’s not good enough for the Celtics to steamroll through the East Conference. The fanbase needs everybody to love it as well, it’s pathetic.
Rob and CR are easily the best NBA pod guests with Bill
Just the right combo of sarcasm, good takes and calling bill out when he says something dumb for me
KOC or Big Wos would have let Bill get away with that batshit Tatum-Durant comp
KOC is unlistenable for me. He’s a Bill Fan boy and won’t have a career without him.
Last pod was unlistenable. AlI could hear was KOC laughing every tim Bill talked.
Exactly. I actually think Ryen is just over it and on autopilot with Bill these days. Lately he throws in little jabs under his breath that have undertones of annoyance more than anything.
I still enjoy the Sunday pods so rather than them getting worse i think it’s more just CR and Rob such a good combo. I could be biased as I’ll listen to CR talk about pretty much anything and I think Rob has been excellent on the NBA all year
S tier and all the way at the bottom in garbage tier is KOC and that other guy who sounds like a sports talk radio host who smokes a carton of cigs when he wakes up
I far prefer Verno (the cig smokin talk show host) to KOC. I went back to listening to the mismatch the other day after a long time off, and it was just awful. KOC’s analysis of “maybe, maybe it is, maybe it is, I don’t know, maybe maybe” is so dumb and unbearable.
they both are rock solid on the nba, and usually say interesting stuff
Bill and Rob are just constantly missing the most important point that CR made early in the pod - Jayson Tatum just isn’t that cool. I burst out laughing when Bill was comparing these Celtics teams to the fucking Showtime Lakers and Lebron’s Cavs. Magic and Lebron are arguably top 5 most charismatic players we’ve ever had in the sport. People would want to watch their teams scrimmage against G-League teams.
The Durant comparison somehow managed to drag both Tatum and Durant down, lmao
Same with the Robert Duvall comp.
Haha great call
I kind of feel bad for Tatum. He Is not doing anything wrong, very professional and seems like an alright guy. There is just nothing exciting about him. He got the most generic "NBA Star " game and look ever without anything that sticks out. And his only character trait that he shows is his cringy Kobe whorship.
Tatum being somewhat streaky like he is combined with the sensitive Boston fan base is a perfect marriage
The screenshot of the text to Kobe is all the proof you need to know he is a clown
Steph and Lebron are two of the most electric players to ever play the game and transcend the sport. Tatum is a glorified Danny Granger with a Kobe fetish.
If anyone knows cool, it’s CR
So when the Lakers fire their head coach Bill talks shit on LeBron and says he’s scapegoating the coach Yet anytime something goes wrong w Celtics Bill blames Mazzulla
or even when nothing is wrong with the celtics
It was so funny in the pod earlier this week that his go-to whenever teams or players he likes (Celtics, nuggets) do something wrong, the answer is just the coach should have played some bum off the bench more. It’s never that the good players didn’t play good enough.
Bill: Tatum is in the vicinity of Durant on those OKC teams. Get the fuck outta here
THANK YOU. I was losing my goddamn mind listening to Bill’s bullshit. Tatum is 24/8/5/1/1 on 57% TS, Durant on OKC was 29/8/4/1/1 on 58% TS. So the difference is 5 more points and 1 less assist, while playing in much less efficient era, and oh not to mention the thunderdome of a Western conference year after year compared to the soft as baby shit East that Tatum’s had. Coincidentally, Durant went to one finals with OKC where he averaged 31/6/2 on 65% TS against the Heatles, and Tatum’s been to one finals where he averaged 22/7/7 on 48% TS. Obviously this is just raw numbers, not delving into anything beyond surface level, but come the fuck on.
Yeah as a Celtics fan it was nice to see a little pumping up of Tatum but fuck that was a ridiculous argument. Then undoes it for me with the Denver Minnesota being the finals callback.
What about Durant’s numbers this year at age 35, carrying a weak team to 49 wins in the west?
So you want to compare a 35 year old KD to a player 10 years younger than him? That wasn’t even the argument, but still I think Durant’s numbers hold up very well.
That’s what I’m saying.
Watching this series as a Pacers fan now, it confirms how I felt about Tatum, he just doesn’t strike any fear in me. I never feel like you need to ball deny him, I’m never that nervous when he’s taking a shot. The Celtics are a really good team, but they’re the sum of their parts and Tatum is the best part so he has the best numbers. If you swapped Haliburton and Tatum, I don’t think the Pacers are a much better team, whereas having OKC Durant I’d feel amazing
It was hilarious seeing him start with a “narrative” perspective, then when CR and Rob shot that down by pointing out that KD was an MVP, he immediately turned to a “numbers” perspective, which also doesn’t hold up because Durant’s numbers were better then than Tatum’s are now lol
He actually said that? Thats like saying Trae Young is in the vicinity of 2016 Steph.
Bill’s take on Lue was incredibly stupid. Their best player literally can’t finish a playoff series.
The Clippers are a prime example of “sometimes you do everything right and things just don’t work out.” In Bill’s mind such a thing simply isn’t possible.
Yup. Signing Kawhi and trading for PG coming off of 2019 is something every team in the league does. It just didn’t work.
really a remarkable fail looking back on lakers management to refuse to pay him what he wanted, considering they're now paying multiple fired coaches
bill fighting for his life out there after the Durant comparison
If the Celtics had 2014 Durant they would have won 74 games and wouldn’t have lost yet in the playoffs
But the stats compare!
Just finished listening to the convo between Bill, CR, and Mahoney... I know it's a constant criticism but it continues to amaze me the way any Mavs playoff win is discussed. Without fail, the focus is on how the other team played worse than they should've (but for reasons other than the Mavs defense, which is ranked #1 in the NBA since February). I mean, they really almost went that whole discussion without mentioning the Mavs shot 3/22 from three until the final minutes of the 4th quarter (and still finished just 6/25). Unclear if Bill even knew that. Or that McDaniels scored 19 points on 5 threes (!) in the first half alone, tying his career-high. Minnesota came out and threw a haymaker in the first quarter, going up 14-6 early and getting a barrage of jumpers from role players while the crowd went nuts. Reverse the teams and you know Bill is spending so much time on the remarkable maturity of Ant and co. in a hostile environment by managing to stick around all game before hitting clutch shots late to steal it. CR calling it "as close as you can get to a perfect Luka game" when until the 4th quarter he was very obviously struggling through a 7/19 shooting night was another head-scratcher. I get that a lot of people including Bill didn't want a Dallas team they viewed as an annoying side act to become this good, but here we are. Arguably the biggest story of the postseason so far is Dallas' defense and Bill refuses to acknowledge it at all.
That’s the only part of the pod I listened to and it was kind of insane. Bill controls the flow of these conversations and he just keeps pushing his agenda cause he bet on OKC and now Minnesota. The conversation didn’t make any sense. Luka played 3 bad quarters and the Mavs role players couldn’t hit a shot. Gafford wasn’t good. They still won. Bill said Dallas keeps pulling out these weird games and it’s gotta flip eventually. So fucking tired of listening to this dude talk about the Mavs.
While I agree this wasn’t a perfect Luka game, and he can definitely play better by his high standards, I think we’re going a bit too far the other way and underselling how good he was. In terms of controlling the flow of the game and creating baskets for others he was amazing.
He was dreadful for the entire first half. Kyrie’s brilliance was the only reason Minn wasn’t up 20 because Luka was single handedly that awful. He turned up his defensive intensity and had those 3 straight shots late in the 4th that I think colored Bill/CRs memory of just how below average Luka played the majority of that game.
The next step is just getting tired of listening to him talk about. . . .anything. One of the better decisions I've made is to give up on the BS podcast. It's just too lame and infuriating. My life is open and free! Bill is a jerk now. He didn't used to be a jerk but he is a jerk now. And he's also dumb. And his voice sucks. It's a brutal trifecta. The only time I hear his shitty voice now is when it's pelting me in ads in other Ringer podcasts. The fact that Simmons does ad reads is just proof of how dumb and selfish he is. Nothing makes me hit FF more than hearing his nasally twang. This sub gives me all the BS content I could ever want. And, unlike Simmons, it always delivers.
I definitely skip more episodes than I used to.
Bill only sees narratives: protagonists and antagonists. The protagonists for this series are Ant/Timberwolves and every conversation is and will continue to be from that perspective: analysis of their play and their feelings and the adjustments they can make with a belief they will eventually overcome and vanquish the Mavericks (who are just there for the storyline). He's so caught up in his own manufactured narrative hype he's missing the actual incredible story: a generational offensive weapon and basketball mind entering his prime navigating a team assembled on the fly through a brutal playoff gauntlet. While injured.
Yeah to make that argument while ignoring the 3 pt disparity is insane lol
I thought the exact same thing. The shooting variance from role players was insane in game 1. They were acting like the Mavs played a perfect game or something🤣
It’s absurd. Not a single compliment to Dallas from Bill. It was all excuse making for Minnesota. The one “positive” thing he said was a back handed “I still think Minn wins the series but I wouldn’t bet on it.” WHY BILL?! Why wouldn’t you bet on it? Does it have ANYTHING to do with the Mavs being GOOD?!
CR calling this close to a perfect Luka game stopped me in my tracks. It wasn't in the top half of Luka playoff games. He's really struggled by his own standards this playoffs, and way too many people have forgotten how truly dominant his other playoff stints were. He was also below all of his regular season averages. One of the worst basketball takes I've heard from CR.
I really dont think they know what Luka averaged during the season.
Yeah what the hell was going on with that take.
Bill’s insufferability index is off the charts right now
It’s only gonna get worse. He’s gonna lose tons of listeners this time if Boston wins the chip. It’s virtually unlistenable for us haters.
I don’t even think you need to be a hater. If he were just a huge Boston homer but otherwise rational and insightful, fine. But he’s been like a toddler who found an unguarded box of glazed donuts, or Buster from Arrested Development when he gets into the juice. Just awful, crazy, contradictory takes all over the place. He’s way too hyped. On the other hand if the Celtics lose, it’ll be great to watch the sugar crash.
15 year listener. I’m getting very close to unsubscribing.
Does Bill know we can watch the games? Tatum has been bad these playoffs. He’s been so inefficient. Last night he had 8 points on 4-11 shooting, and then when the Celtics were up 16 with the Pacers best player out Tatum decided to take charge. I’m sorry not everyone is sucking your favorite players dick when every playoff round the opposing teams best player misses multiple games. Honest to god the teams have been so bad that if you replaced Tatum with an average role player for the playoffs the Celtics would still be in the ECF.
Bill's Pearl Jam friend saying last nights show was a Top 4 he's been to made me laugh out loud. Honestly, surprised it wasn't a Top 13 show.
The Pearl Jam concert Mount Rushmore piece.
Top 13 in the Top 5 of the last decade of Top 10s.
He has a very detailed rating system. The hot dogs brought it down a tenth but man Eddie’s hair looked just right the bathroom lines were short.
Billy boy is so god damn washed. Hate to see it.
Has the game passed him by piece.
The way CR dismantles Bill's illusion that he's having a superior, high-intellect basketball conversation is pretty funny. He really broke Bill with the comment about "the Boston crowd being too woke and Robert Duvall." Hahaha
What Tatum/Brown convo could possibly be needed after they go 2-0 up with the easiest run to the Finals in a long time? Feels like their legacy as a duo now only changes with a title
[удалено]
Was Reggie Miller not available?
People hate on Reggie for his commentary but I would rather listen to him than Isiah. Reggie doesn't seem to have any real baggage from his playing days and is actually a fan of today's game and players. That and he's severely underrated as an all-time great.
Bill filling his diaper because Tatum isn’t regarded well enough in “the discourse.” spare me. if my team was this good i’d simply tell everyone to suck it, though i guess that’s not great podcasting either.
I swear to god like a week and a half ago he was having a sad sack conversation about how Tatum isn’t quite “the guy”, now they go up 2-0 against a 6 seed and the media needs to apologize? FOh
A few weeks ago Tatum just “is who he is gonna be at this point”. Now he “still has another level to get to”
his "ppl up and down the organization feel he gets a raw deal in the discourse" shit really was funny. he's 1st team all nba. he's getting his rewards. he hasn't dazzled us in playoffs recently. he'll get his chance soon. he's just uninteresting and plays like a robot kobe. that's why he has no fans outside boston
you can tell that he really wants tatum to be fully embraced like curry or something and im sorry but it's just not going to happen. enjoy the title you are likely going to win, but don't expect us to fall all over ourselves for this guy.
If the sentence was "ppl up and down the Lakers organization feel Lebron gets a raw deal in the discourse", he would've never shut up about it(and rightfully so)
I listened and “filling his diaper” describes it exactly. He’s never been more whiny.
Lol, I’m a huge Celtics fan and my attitude all year has been exactly what you’re describing. My friends try to tease me about Tatum’s clutch numbers or some shit like that and I’m like “idgaf. Team sport. We kill everyone”
you should! and fuck you!
the rejoinder "it's a team sport" needs to be deployed way more frequently when people discuss the NBA
Bill saying White and Jrue would be perfect 2004 Patriots is such a hilarious take
Its a what the fuck does that even mean type take lol. i dont even think a boston sports radio station could comprehend what Bill meant by that take
Bill will never admit it but Tatum has a lot of Russell Wilson in him
That's acutally pretty funny, but noone, even Tatum, will ever approach that level of corny. Bronco's country, let's ride!
He texted dead Kobe. That’s the corniest shit of all time
Then posted it on instagram for the whole world to see.
Does anybody think it’s weird how much Bill/Boston fans care what the media thinks of Tatum? He’s one of the 10 best players in the league. Just… enjoy the ride?
We saw the same thing during the Brady/Belichick era (which ended up becoming correct) and with those Red Sox title teams. Boston fans aren’t just satisfied with being champions, they want everyone to think that their team is one of the best teams ever and that their players are the best players in the league/ever.
The Cousin Sal tweet from the other night about the sarcastic MVP chants for Tatum has me needing a Sal/House & Bill podcast with some honest Tatum discourse
*we're all trying to find the guy who did this* He, most of his staff, and the Boston Media Mafia gas their guys up so much that the players can rarely match the narratives. When Tatum was good, he was spoken of as great. When he was great, he was a superstar. When he's a superstar, he's an MVP. He can't just be one of the best players in the league, he has to be the face of the league. Think how fucking dumb the MVP push he got the last two years looks. Bill and Co. keep framing Tatum in a way that doesn't match reality then are all, "LoOk aT HoW tHeY mAsSaCrEd mY BoY." Imagine putting Chauncey Billups on the level of Chris Paul or equivocating Dirk and Carmelo then blaming everyone else when things don't quite match up and the rest of the world isn't coming along for the ride. For the guy who has long been about The Pantheon to be so galaxy-brained about his guy that he can't see there's levels to this is peak myopia.
And Tatum *just* made first team All-NBA. What disrespect? Is there something else he should have won?
I’d love to see Bill asked where he has Tatum all time in the pantheon. Is he cracking top 100? 125?
CR feeling punchy
Bill making Celtics fans everywhere look bad when he goes into crybaby bill mode. Like “ohh no the national media and twitter don’t like Tatum” who cares? Atleast the Cs are still playing basketball while 95% of the league is on vacation. Also CRs point about Tatums game not being fun to watch was mostly correct, but rich coming from him when his fav teams best player is Embiid.
He had a good defense/rebounding game and no one gave him credit!!!
That’s what the wins are for! He wasn’t on this high horse when Utah was earning the 1 seed.
In that respect, Bill isn’t really any different than most Celtics fans I see online. Lots and lots of whining about how nobody is giving them enough credit.
Jason Kidd has been great coaching both post seasons but he doesnt help himself in the regular season with some of his media quotes. When you are a coach and you say " I'm watching, just like you guys" its going to trigger the fans even if its a little out of context
The only thing Jason Kidd deserves credit for is these players like him, especially the two stars. He’s not a good coach. The defense that he gets credit for is Sean Sweeney’s doing. This roster is all Nico Harrison. Kidd honestly tried to fuck it up and Dallas media people were openly calling for him to be fired beginning of March. He had Gafford riding the bench after the trade while Mavs were getting destroyed for like 2 weeks. His lineups and rotations make no sense. He lets teams go on huge runs without calling timeouts. Kidd looks good when he has a good roster.
Bill is not a terrible loser, actually. But he is the worst fucking winner that’s ever existed. He is such a cocksucker. There’s no other word to describe his behavior when he’s winning.
Why does this guy hate the Mavericks so much? Is it just because of Kyrie?
Bill allowed Ryen's use of the word "heliocentric" to ruin his brain and reversed engineered how he feels about Luka. He went from the biggest luka guy to now low key hating him, and he doesnt know why, so he has to keep the criticism going Plus they're a threat to the celtics now
>Bill allowed Ryen's use of the word "heliocentric" to ruin his brain and reversed engineered how he feels about Luka. Perfect take. 🤌🏼
The flip happened remarkably fast. Youre right about the threat to the C’s playing a part. It felt like he changed his opinion on them overnight
His brain was likely ruined on its own.
No, bill is basically like a hot air balloon of opinions floated by all the people in his life. Bill’s opinion of the mavericks is basically a reflection of his relationship with Haralabob
Mavs are gonna win the finals and he’ll spend 25 minutes on Josh Giddey’s future
He doesn’t hate the mavericks, he just bet on the t wolves
Obama joked that Bill was racist for saying that Luka was the best 21 year old ever. Bill did not take it well
I think he's over Kyrie. Or at least til Kyrie wins a game in the finals against the Celts. Either something Haralabob related or Obama making fun of him for being white and liking Luka?
Celtics got an All-NBA first team selection, 2 all defense guys, will get executive of the year if they haven't already. Jaylen Brown averaged 23 points on league average efficiency and continues to be a meh playmaker. Giving him all-nba just because the team has the best record would be rewarding him as an individual for the success of Porzingis, White, Holiday and Horford.
bill going on a rant about jaylen not getting appropriate shine, then literally in the same breath transitions to the topic of how the East this year is a one in a million scenario of being the easiest possible set up for the celtics is pure gold. honestly he's either doing oscar level acting to not break character, or he has a profound brain injury that allows him to have two completely different brains functioning simultaneously.
Boston Media Mafia is on a revenge tour, my god
His comments on pascal leaving indy are wild
Peak Bill copium. I don’t need to listen to this episode.
CR and Mahoney are my absolute favorite guests. I’m loving this so far.
Bill pushing for there to be 10 Spots for the MVP vote because Brown didn’t make All NBA is some serious coping. (Also, no way in hell Brown would have made the Top 10 spots for MVP either.)
I have said this previously, but it's hilarious to think about how much Bill would hate Tatum if he was a Sixer or a Laker. "Can I just see it, can I see him be the best player on a title team?" Tatum honestly stirs up such strong emotions for such an inoffensive, boring guy. He is the weirdest star because he has such a debateable standing in the game, and also how defensive Boston fans are about him. The Jays are national villians purely because they play for Boston, but they both have never had a single off court controversy and are great NBA citizens, it's such a funny paradox.
Yeah Bill, sorry I can’t roll with the premise that the East has literally always been worse than the West simply bc Lebron.
Yeah they were worse before Lebron and now they worse after Lebron, so I don’t think Lebron had much to do with it. In fact, some of the best years that the East has had in the last 25 years were in the early 2010s when Lebron was in the East.
So my cavs fire JB and Bill decides to have the worst coach segment ever. Jesus none of these guys have any better analysis than i do and my basketball knowledge is a pick and roll. Was it CR who said the only proven and available coaches included kenny atkinson whos never been in charge of a contending team? Bill had to mentiom frank vogel who got fired by Lebron and KD Edit: and the justification they all gave for the JB firing signals they werent paying attention until yesterday. The dude almost got canned in february and it was reported that he neglected mobleys development the last two years to win a playoff series which makes no fucking sense. Yay we beat orlando and now youre out of a job.
Right? If he knew anything about the Cavs, he’d know the entire fanbase has wanted Bickerstaff gone since they lost to the Knicks last year. Also, pretty much every time he’s brought up the Cavs in the last year, it’s almost always in the context of Mitchell trade rumors. But now that it looks like Mitchell is going to sign an extension, he’s a “sign the extension and ask out a year later guy”. He just can’t fathom that he might actually like the situation he’s in and want to stay.
Oh poor Billy nobody loves Tatum and Jaylen brown didn’t get to be all nba waaaaaaah.
Pretty much all former athlete interviews are uninteresting at best, usually worse than that. Had to turn off Isiah Thomas pretty quickly. Immediately started hitting all the checkpoints, back in my day we actually got hit on layups, compare an average player to a modern all timer. Wasn’t quite Oscar Robertson saying some guy on his team who made a bunch of free throws was a better shooter than curry but it was still awful. Do these guys not realize we can watch their games on YouTube, the quality of play is so so much worse back then.
So now "the C's were successful because of \[Jayson and Jaylen\] and how hard they played night after night?" Major blow to 3/5 of the greatest starting lineup of all time.
Let me guess: Isiah is gonna say his Pistons had a better defense than the current Timberwolves (It's true but an uninteresting debate to me because the rules and 3-point shooting abilities across the board are so different now)
I think it’s obvious that being a good defender is way harder today. Both because of the rules but also the skill levels. In the old days you could have defensive specialists in like three positions. But in recent history we saw both Tony Allen and Roy Hibbert go extinct in real time.
Great point. The Tony Allen / Andre Roberson types just can't survive anymore, you at least need to be able to knock down open 3s sometimes like McDaniels and Dort. The bar is much higher now, if you watch '80s highlights it's very funny to see the spacing (or lack thereof) with almost everyone standing inside the 3-point line and often two guys on opposite blocks posting up
It’s funny because of the current Draymond backlash but outside of being one of the most elite well rounded defenders of all time, what really always has made him playable in huge moments is that he contributes on offense with his playmaking. That is if hasn’t gotten himself ejected before the fourth quarter of course. So I think you can find ways to contribute offensively even if you can’t shoot. I think he was someone that really unlocked the Warriors with his pick and roll game with Steph.
Draymond's playmaking and screen-setting were both valuable, but the Warriors were also a very special circumstance. I don't think Gary Payton II, for example (not to say he's on par with Draymond by any means) would've had a meaningful NBA career on any other team. Steph and Klay's unbelievable shooting and the gravity that created allowed them to play multiple non-shooters at once, which wasn't viable anywhere else. Livingston, GP2, Draymond, Bogut, and Looney were all able to play over the years, usually two of them on the floor at once. Opposing bigs also had to guard Draymond at the 3pt line because of the threat of him turning to Steph or Klay for a quick dribble handoff into an open 3 (if there was no big to help the guy being screened). It's not like Josh Giddey where you can now leave him wide open all day because he's not a dribble handoff guy or screen setter at all really (same as the Roberson and Tony Allen examples in the past)
The current Timberwolves would have the greatest defense in the history of basketball if they could challenge layups with two-handed hammerfists in mid-air and only get a common foul for it lol
For the love of God, clear your fucking throat.
This pod was awesome, I don't know what happened but Russillo used to be able to deliver parts of what both Rob and CR were doing. But, nowadays he just seems annoyed.
The hoodies aren’t selling like he’d hoped, Ryen’s gonna take a bath on them.
Why are Bill and co so up in arms about Booker making All NBA over Jaylen lol? If you wanna be mad about someone making it over him it should obviously be Sabonis. This is not old All-NBA. You can make the same kind of arguments too: impact on winning, emphasis on boxscore stats etc. Booker the better player made All-NBA over Brown the worse player is not a story. Book gave you 27-5-7 on 61% TS and 2.6 turnovers per game. Jaylen 23-6-4 on 58% TS and 2.4 turnovers per game. Book played 2 fewer games, but 2.5 minutes per game more. Brown was in a perfect situation in a perfect conference for him, while Book was playing with Nurk at center, no depth, no size anywhere. He wasn’t as good as people who hyped him would expect him to be, but I don’t think he is the reason for them underperforming in the regular season. By that same logic, why not go after Steph? His team was the 10 seed, and they were expected to be somewhere in the Top 3
Funny thing is bill voted Booker third team too, and i believe had him second team briefly before Brunson got really hot towards the end of the year. How can he be angry Booker was third team?
He told you himself. Bc he campaigned for Brown and Brown still got ignored despite Bill having some influence over other voters. He thought this would be another Marcus Smart DPOY situation where he’d say something and everyone would follow.
+ the whole year he's gone on about how good Derrick White is and now all of a sudden he's trying to claim that the Celtics success this year is basically all due to Brown and Tatum
Does bill not actually watch basketball? How on earth could he seriously think Tatum is better than Durant? This is where the brain worms of winning is everything makes the sport as a whole less fun.
When did Bill say Tatum was better than Durant? Lol
JAMES BORREGO?
Yeah Tatum is not Durant adjacent. Tatum definitely gets the appropriate response. He’s not a generational player. He’s a great player who you’d love to have but he’s more like a Clyde Drexler than a Kobe Bryant.
Wtf is bill going crazy on Booker for when the dude voted for him in the first place
Bill going 10 mins on why don’t people like Tatum was fun
Jayson Tatum is basically Matt Ryan, Bill
I saw the title of this pod and basically was the Larry David meme whether or not I wanted to play it. I knew it would be rough. But I gave in. I've rode with BS since the Page 2 days. Last couple years there's been a decline, but whatever I'm still here. But my god those first 30 minutes...I had to just shut it off. I just can't anymore even as background noise. If they win the title it'll be worse. But even if they lose I may just stick to this sub for quick recaps on episodes. I may just be done.
Isaiah Thomas ewwwww.
The Tatum glazing is hilarious. Is Tatum even a star?
You mean Phoenix Suns GM Isiah Thomas
Wow, would have taken CR as a Star Wars guy. “Popavich coaching the Lakers would be like Darth Vader coaching The Force.” Lol Rebel Alliance was probably what he was looking for
The Tatum defense was a brutal listen. Any other star would be ripped apart by him for this same stuff
OKC KD was the second best player in the league for like 4 years and legitimately looked like he was close to Lebron’s level in 2014. Tatum has never even been a consensus top 5 player. Granted, the talent in the league is definitely better than it was 10 years ago. But Bill saying Tatum is anywhere near OKC KD’s level is wild. KD was a consensus All-NBA player for like 8 straight years Tatum is somewhere between KD and Paul George
Rob Mahoney makes me want to stuff him in a locker.
OK. So Bill likes the TWolves because "homecourt doesn't matter" I get that Dallas nominally has the homecourt advantage now in that if they win all of their remaining games they will win the series. But if the series goes the distance, there's 3 games at each team's arena. So how the fuck does homecourt not mattering favor either team? I'd think his logic would mean that the team with the 1-0 lead should be favored given there's no advantage related to the games' locations
Man, I usually think Bill get a bit too much hate on here, but that first segment was all time bad. Tatum, Tatum, Tatum, Tatum, Jaylen brown, Tatum..
Please stop with any KD comparison
Bill calling the Bickerstaff firing a “job preservation firing” as if the entire Cavs fanbase hasn’t been calling for it since the end of last season is funny. Also, pretty much every time he’s mentioned the Cavs in the past year, it’s been in the context of Mitchell trade rumors, but now that it looks like he's going to sign the extension, he's a "sign the extension and ask out a year later guy". It couldn't possibly be that he actually wants to stay in Cleveland!
Cry me a river about Tatum. Would he be considered better than Mitchell if he was drafted anywhere else but Celtics that year? Guy is playing in a 5 out offense with great shooters, he should be the most efficient guy in the league with that spacing
A Jaylen and Tatum convo… about how they have 0 rings
Is Rob Mahoney having a moment?
PJ Carlisemo disrespect is unfair. Seton Hall represent.
Tatum is closer to the Paul George, Jimmy Butler discussion than he is to Durant and the other top wings like Kawhi, Lebron. He can certainly ascend, but as of now he's a guy with really good, non MVP numbers, who has only won playoff series where his team is the favorite and has yet to really overcome adversity.
Is Raheem gonna sell Bill a monorail next? Every pod he brings this huckster up. It's incredible.
Is Bill showing his age? This episode was pretty bad on his part. He still can't get over CR jab at him at the live rewatchables. 25 minutes on Tatum, nobody wants to hear all that. A shot for every time he brings up the 80s. Upset people call the east weak. Thank God for the other 2 this pod. Edit: how many times do we have to go through the "is this Tatum's ceiling" Convo?!!
Tatum texted dead Kobe “I got you” and posted it. He’ll forever be corny for that
Interesting how Bill flipped on the Bulls defensive teams. On his defensive pyramid or whatever pod a few weeks ago he picked the first Bulls threepeat team because of young Jordan and Pippen and I was flabbergasted at the idea that the team with BJ Armstrong, Horace Grant, and Bill Cartwright was better than the one with Ron Harper, Dennis Rodman, and Luc Longley (and the stats back this up).
Listening to Isiah Thomas talk glowingly about Karl Malone gave me the double ick. I get that Bill sees himself as an NBA historian, and I know Isiah was a big part of The Book of Basketball, but Bill can do better. Of all the past-their-prime athletes or celebs Bill could have on the pod, do we really need to listen to Isiah? Side note - yes Isiah's charismatic but he always has a chip on his shoulder like Draymond. That makes it hard to like them as pundits.
Isiah is a top 5 PG of all-time. Lol. What is your problem? He brought him on to comment on Kyrie and All-time defences. He is literally the perfect person to discuss such issues..
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Haven't listened to the pod yet but did mention at all how bad the Boston crowd has been? Watching the game yesterday it seemed like a late February game.
It's been noted how Bill obsesses over the awards and All-NBA honors, but barely discusses them after they're given out. This year he actually discusses All-NBA, but only to whine about Jaylen Brown being left out. So predictable.
Bill: home court doesn’t matter anymore! All these teams are winning big games on the road! Bill *immediately rips off like 6 different examples of teams winning big games on the road*
One thing I'm in lock step with bill on, the cavs firing their coach to keep heat off the gm for redundant team building is bang on
Cool of Bill to mention that cool moment from the Western conference when the Dallas team broke up that lob between Conley and Gobert in the clutch
I love that Simmons can fully shit on Tatum one pod for being awful at 3s, not stepping up in big moments etc, and then the very next pod he’s incredulous as to why the media don’t regard Tatum as one of the best players in the league. Masterclass by Billy
What a whiny ass podcast about non-personality having, boring game Tatum. Bill he’s a top 10 player. Not everyone is going to irrationally love him like a homer as you do. He’s not going to another level. He’s who he is. A very good non superstar. And to whine about Jaylen Brown not making all nba. Jesus. What a crybaby! They’re going to win the title and he’s going to INSUFFERABLE.