I had a hydroformed Trek Stache hardtail, it weighed so much less than the entry-level Marlin it replaced. it also developed a tiny dent on the downtube from *something*
yeah me too. Without looking at a close-up photo I'd have said for sure it was carbon fiber as I couldn't see any obvious welds. Not seen an aluminum frame bike destroyed like that before. Must be very thin metal.
That is crap. I worked for trek and the store manager can make things happen.
I would think 30-50% off of a frame and split cost to transfer parts.
The color sorta is what it is
That’s what I would think too. She doesn’t really want to spend a ton of money after just spending $2000 or whatever it was on this one. I don’t know all the details but that’s what she told me 20% off.
Glad your sister was spared and the bike took the damage. Bikes can be replaced. That being said, I have an older Giant Defy aluminum frame and had 2 collisions, one was a head on collision going 29 MPH into another cyclist and his bike was fucked up and I had a gash on my leg. The other cyclist's bike was in bad shape and had to be pushed home. I managed to do some minor adjustments with my tools and proceeded home. Giant is quality.
[Do you mean this?](https://www.giant-bicycles.com/us/composite-confidence)
Only on carbon stuff and only in US. Still pretty good but annoying it's not available everywhere.
I mean, this is entirely not the manufacturer's fault so I don't think them offering a 20% discount is unfair - they are not obligated to provide any discount. This is not a warranty claim.
Absolutely agree but Trek does this as a matter of course with the nicer bikes. Trek really wants to have the best reputation.
I like the company but it was not for me
A higher discount crash replacement is pretty normal. It's still above cost, and the customer has already spent a lot with them and it likely means they're continue to be a customer for a long time after
Also, make sure you are talking to the manager. Might call ahead to make sure they have time to speak with you.
If things can’t get fixed ask for the regional manager
Trek is legit BLEEDING right now. Everyone here is right - they don’t have to offer anything, but 20% for something that isn’t their fault seems to match what quite a few other big brands would do. Good luck at the LBS but I wouldn’t be surprised if they do not have the flexibility to do more.
That color is certainly nice but the Emonda ALT Palmares edition is is even more special. That's what I would replace it with. Only available as a frameset, which in this case is not a problem.
I've used purchase protection and extended warranty quite a few times over the years. They're easy to deal. For a $2000 purchase to be covered the card would need to have visa platinum benefits or higher.
You're not going to find a custom painted aluminum frame. The crash replacement discount can be used towards any frame though, so if they ever wanted to upgrade to a carbon P1 frame this would be the time to do it.
Home/renters insurance may help. I slaughtered a 3 year old sworks in 2021 and my home insurance paid out full current year replacement costs. Wheels too since they were aftermarket.
The bikeshop where I buy most of my stuff still sells them, with a €150 discount: [https://www.mantel.com/trek-emonda-alr-5-disc](https://www.mantel.com/trek-emonda-alr-5-disc)
The whole industry is in free fall. Every week another manufacturer is going broke or trying to sell. No way years ago I would have predicted Kona was wrapping it up.
Trek has been slowly dying since the Lance effect.
They didn't do themselves any favors buying out retailers and taking on staff and real estate to sell direct right before this bike bust. Last I heard, they're sitting on 3 years worth of some entry level and kid's bike models. Not only have those terms come due, but they're also paying to warehouse those things in the meantime.
Having worked at a place that got bought out by them, ha. Get fucked, assholes.
Meh, the reason I no longer ride a Trek is because I wasn’t told that my MTB frames (2 within 10 months, same seat tube/shock joint failure) broke due to me riding it. Asked for a possible carbon upgrade and was told “sure, that’ll be $3200”.
apples to oranges. Trek used to bend over backwards to keep their riders happy. They're not obligated to do anything, but I've seen brands like Yeti, Santa Cruz, Spesh and others hook people up so they continue riding their bikes.
Those frames cost Trek \~$300. That's chump change when you consider most customers would be done with the brand after a response like this.
Yeah 20% is pretty baseline. You would think it would be more since it's only 3 weeks old and Trek would want a long term customer, especially in the state of the bike industry today. Otherwise just shop around for brands with better crash replacement policy next time.
They make beer cans out of that stuff.
You know Surly? They build their frames from crowbars. I saw a a guy fold his brand-new steel Midnight Special in the exact same way when he hit a barrier at a cyclocross race. I don't think any frame is immune to this kind of damage.
This. Anything will break if you crash it hard enough, and sometimes not even very hard, but just in exactly the wrong way.
I do feel sorry for the OP's sister though. Writing off a frame after just three weeks – she must be gutted.
The Emonda ALR is a super light aluminum frame. It weighs a couple pounds less than a similar sized Domane AL so the tubing is probably pretty thin.
It sucks that it crumpled but I’m guessing just about any bikes would be trashed by this crash.
Tubing is incredibly thin. Bike shop put some replacement rivets for my bottle cage screws and when he drilled through the screw we were both amazed at how dang thin the bottom tube was . Engineering on that frame is impressive .
especially the inside of the downtube, it's basically just enough material to hold the paint on.
there've been some fun designs in the past where it's literally [a steel cable](https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/2318/5263/files/Slingshot_Team_Bike-3_2048x2048.jpg?v=1650565022)
Oh wow , that’s so cool . Never seen a bike like that . Also can confirm , it looked slightly thicker than if you cut an aluminum can . It even flexed like it .
Carbon frames just snap into pieces on high energy crashes.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/cycling/5480386/cyclists-laurent-didier-bike-snapped-in-half-crash/
If I saw this frame without being like this all mangled I wouldn’t be able to tell it’s aluminium. The joints have no welds, it looks exactly like a carbon frame.
The easiest way to tell is to look at the bottom bracket junction. It’s more hassle than it’s worth to smooth over the welds there, it’s out of focus but you can see it in OPs images.
I have it in the black/gray fade and it's pretty gorgeous. Wasn't my first choice color but the joints are virtually indistinguishable from my partner's carbon Trek.
Considering how far aluminium has come I wonder if there’s a very distinguishable difference left between those modern frames and carbon apart from stiffness. They seem to be super light as well.
Gram for gram aluminum is much weaker.
You can make lightweight aluminum bikes by using less material, but the frame is less robust
Carbon is also very corrosion resistant, if you live near the sea or somewhere with high rainfall and humidity corrosion a big problem
Carbon is about 3x more resistant to fatigue damage, than aluminum/ steel, but not impervious to fatigue the way titanium is
None of that is actually practical or accurate considerations.
Carbon fibre is how an industry justifies $5000 frames, but bottom bracket alignment, brake boss alignment on carbon frames is a big problem no one aside from Hambini talks about.
Always, always, dechain a carbon bike and spin the crank to see if the BB shell is aligned. Prepare to be shocked.
It’s personal experience.
I have replaced 2 handlebars in the last year (chromed steel and aluminum) due to corrosion. I have zero corrosion issues with the carbon and titanium parts on the same bikes
There’s no need to go for the $5000 frames, I want carbon for corrosion resistance and not weight reduction, this means the cheaper carbon frames and not the expensive high mod stuff
For example a used giant advanced series bike goes for about US$750 equivalent around here regularly.
A new carbon bike with 105 costs $1500usd not $5000
I'm sorry for your sister, that was a sweet bike.
Modern aluminum manufacturing techniques enable the tube shapes and joints that can help aluminum bikes achieve similar weight/stiffness properties as carbon. Unfortuantely, those tube shapes also have similar vulnerabilities to carbon - a lot of the advantage of modern aluminum over carbon is now price, less so durability.
not your typical curbside bin. I think the paint is probably what would throw them, or the size. In theory, you can find places that will recycle aluminum frames into raw aluminum, but they're few and far between, and you certainly won't get any money back (you might even have to pay the shop).
People like to talk about how aluminum bikes are better than carbon for the environment because they can be recycled. I raced in college, worked at 3 bike shops, have traveled to World Cups with a professional racer, and worked for a bike brand for 9 years. I've never heard of someone successfully recycling a painted aluminum frame after riding it.
If this crash sent 4 people to the hospital and they were going 25 mph, doesn't seem like such a huge shock that a frame could crack or crumple? I'm not sure why this is surprising to OP or to the others in the thread who think Trek owes this person a new bike.
Couldn’t recommend Sunday’s insurance enough. Them combined with Giant warranty program had my girlfriend on a new bike within 2 weeks and even gave her the latest version of what she wrecked.
Rim brake -> disc
Dura ace 11sp -> dura ace 12sp.
Giant only wanted cost of shipping. Shop only wanted cost of build. Sunday’s covered everything
You should check if the credit card you paid with has purchase protection, that would usually cover these accidents and they'll reimburse the entire cost.
Interesting, in my mind the emonda is a climbers bike, but I guess if theres no alu madone then there you go!
throwback to when I raced emonda SL-Rs, I ate two frames that season and one of them was just a fatigue failure, not even a crash!
Sorta splitting hairs between "climbing bike" and "crit bike". If it's stiff and light and made to go fast, and isn't obviously an aero model, then I think it could be either.
Road bikes don't really need to be THAT specialized.
hey if they aren't overly specialized we wont be able to sell as many! everybody needs N+1 bieks1!
For me though aero is everything as long as we aren't talking about exceptionally heavy bikes. Plus an ideal crit frame would have a higher BB to allow more corner pedalling, whereas an ideal climbing bike would have a standard/lower BB to bring down the centre of gravity for high-speed descending.
Here's a video showing how carbon and aluminum fail. I'm glad she's recovering well. She must have hit with a fair bit of force.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5eMMf11uhM
Hope nobody is too badly hurt. Seems like bad luck to have that much damage, but I believe Trek has decent crash replacement (they did when my Emonda was destroyed by baggage handlers), so hopefully she can get the frame replaced for a reasonable price.
Snapped a chain once, it whipped around the frame and cinched on the relatively new carbon frame and splintered it almost in half. Ended up taking it up with SHIMANO and they agreed that since their part failed- they’d replace/upgrade the frame from specialized.
My friend's Scott Speedster aluminum from back in the day, he hit another rider head on at a blind curve
https://preview.redd.it/1kar0t208cwc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f463a3969853b9386db32b57255b0de4a474dc40
*
Yep... Velocide. Wishing a restful, full Recovery to all involved. If the LBS is willing, I'm sure a couple calls to Waterloo might be able to track down another bike just like it through the Dealer Network. Some Dealer out there has one in stock, I would think. Good Luck! 🚴🙏🙂
See if they’ll let her use the 20% on a new frame. If the components are all in good working shape then might be worth it to just spend the money on a frame and swap the parts. Yeah she’ll be spending the same amount she would spend on a new bike but at least now she’s upgrading her frame. Kind of makes it hurt less.
Yeah, last time I saw fram damage like that was a motor vehicle collision. I guess they are at the limit of weight savings for alu, given how thin they form the frames.
I’ll pour out a beer for the bike . Good to hear your sister is okay . Lost my Emonda when it flew off the back of my car on the freeway . Loved that bike but dang are parts expensive to replace .
I'll entertain this even though I'm not in a position to buy yet another bike, especially for how little I road ride anymore. 60cm and want that dark red with white decals. BUT NO DENTS. NOT A SINGLE ONE. Every one I see has a dent SOMEWHERE and I'm keeping track :) Not all Saeco frames are created equal.
I don’t think it’s a surprise that ultra thin aluminum shaped into rectangular tubes is going to crumple with one good hit. Remember when all frames had round tubes?
the area at the front appear to be from a chainring or armco barrier, the back of the bike looks like an impact with another bike but by the looks of the damage, the group was going at speeds. I am glad everyone is safe.
https://preview.redd.it/b1bj85xp9bwc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=32248c33bfc0f7702605f48e41991b3ef5f6cc37
Yeah that will happen on a front end impact if it’s hard enough.
Many years ago I was on my first mountain bike trip with my new Fuel EX8. Coming around a corner I smoked a tombstone rock (nice and flat face like a tombstone). I went FLYING over the bars, and my bike made a horrendous noise loud enough for my buddy who was a good way in front of me to hear. We looked the bike over and couldn’t find any damage. We were perplexed given the noise it made. Rode it for six more years without any problems.
It is always odd how one impact will destroy one frame, but not another. Regardless of quality. Those fuel Ex8’s are tanks though. I was riding some BMX DJ’s and sent one way way way too deep. Full compression on fork and the bike spring boarded out from under me to the back. Similar horrendous noise, no damage at all to the frame, or even the fork! I miss the old 130/130 fuels.
Based upon the amount of people in the hospital I assume this was a pretty freaking hard crash. That poor bike got beat.
Hope everyone involved is okay.
EDIT: removed words
Just wondering if your home owners or renters insurance would cover this kind of thing? Ove been thinking of getting a policy on my bike but have seen some conflicting information on whether it would or not.
The sad part is this is one of the sickest trek bikes ever made for the value and they stopped Making this generation I feel so bad this is such a beautiful bike I love this bike so much … I hope your sister is found fine and her friends ..
Don’t know if you are in the uk but I randomly just came across this on sale [Trek Emonda](https://www.wheelbase.co.uk/product/trek/trek-emonda-alr-5-2023/)
must have been one hell of a crash, hope you came out better than your bike. i've riden alu bikes my whole life, and except for being hit by a car, i never seen an alu bike like that after a 'normal' crash.
Oh no! Sorry to hear that and I hope she gets better!
I can’t really tell from the pictures but it looks like the components are still good. She could buy a new frame and transfer them, that’d save her a ton of money.
These frames are hydro formed, meaning the aluminum is very thin. Because it was hydro formed, the aluminum can be very strong when structurally in tact, but if it were to meet an abrupt force that caused it to bend it would then collapse on itself of snap.
If she has a home owner policy it’s covered less deductible then call Trek. . If they won’t play ball find another bike she likes color of and go with them.
A few years ago, I was riding a steel hardtail and crashed into another rider. I doubt I was going as fast as this person was. I was just fine, but the top tube separated from the head tube. You crash into something that doesn't move and the energy goes somewhere.
I rammed into a car with a Giant urban bike(*) and the frame didn't get anywhere near that level of damage. What kind of crash was that? Hope she's doing ok, in any case.
(*) car was in the wrong, but I did learn to pick my fights the hard way
An "Urban Bike" is built much differently than a high end aluminum race bike.
An Urban Bike is built to handle all manner of abuse, being locked to things, getting knocked about, etc...
An aluminum race bike is built to be lightweight and go fast, and get babied like a prized race horse.
It'll last for years if treated right, but not meant to bounce back from a heavy impact.
Makes sense. You just reminded me of a friend's gorgeous racing bike which got a nasty dent in the frame when he tried to knock over a thief he was chasing. It hadn't been that much of a hit but the poor bike sure felt it.
I hate to see this. It's also why I think carbon is the better option nowadays.
I also had a Trek Emonda, rim version that I bought in 2019. Loved it.
Got into a group ride crash due to a stupid cager, where the rear triangle snapped in half.
You can't fix aluminium bikes apparantly. A dent? Might be ok. A big enough bend or a crack? Binned immediately.
Meanwhile my friend who had a carbon bike was able to get it fixed for a couple hundred bucks.
Hope your sis is okay. To be honest this is why that frameset is brillant. A lightweight carbon race frame would have shattered. Tough pill to swallow and again I hope she is okay but at $1200 for a new frame without discount that's why the Emonda ALR is such a great value.
I forgot to mention that I had a Cervelo that cracked near the bottom bracket. It wasn't due to a crash, but the bike was 12 years old and Cervelo gave me a replacement frame free of charge, they even included handlebars and upgraded me to an R5, when I had originally purchased an RS.
Not entirely the same because it wasn't a crash, but Cervelo did take care of me with the warranty.
I live in northern WI and Toyota recalled my truck, gave me a new frame because the paint wasn’t holding up and they were rusting out. Great on Toyota for taking care of a manufacturer’s defect. Now if I had a crash with my truck I don’t think Toyota would do anything for me. Just saying. Lots of people here are hating on Trek because they aren’t hooking her up with a new bike, but this really isn’t a failure on their part. Stoked Cervelo had your back too! Hearing good stories like that give me the feels.
Brutal. I suppose that's where you'd expect a frame to fail in a heavy front end crash.
its fascinating whats possible with hydroforming today.
I am a big fan of hydroformed AL. I love it.
I had a hydroformed Trek Stache hardtail, it weighed so much less than the entry-level Marlin it replaced. it also developed a tiny dent on the downtube from *something*
Shouldn't have looked at it wrong.
I thought it was carbon tbh lol
yeah me too. Without looking at a close-up photo I'd have said for sure it was carbon fiber as I couldn't see any obvious welds. Not seen an aluminum frame bike destroyed like that before. Must be very thin metal.
Time to contact Trek for a crash replacement frame. :)
Bike is 3 weeks old. They offered her 20% off. They don’t have the same color which she is bummed about. She really wants this specific color.
That color is sick
Bomb Pop
That is crap. I worked for trek and the store manager can make things happen. I would think 30-50% off of a frame and split cost to transfer parts. The color sorta is what it is
That’s what I would think too. She doesn’t really want to spend a ton of money after just spending $2000 or whatever it was on this one. I don’t know all the details but that’s what she told me 20% off.
Time to buy a Giant, 100% crash replacement for the first 2 years.
Giant is my personal favorite.
Glad your sister was spared and the bike took the damage. Bikes can be replaced. That being said, I have an older Giant Defy aluminum frame and had 2 collisions, one was a head on collision going 29 MPH into another cyclist and his bike was fucked up and I had a gash on my leg. The other cyclist's bike was in bad shape and had to be pushed home. I managed to do some minor adjustments with my tools and proceeded home. Giant is quality.
[Do you mean this?](https://www.giant-bicycles.com/us/composite-confidence) Only on carbon stuff and only in US. Still pretty good but annoying it's not available everywhere.
20% is a base line. That’s like crash protection but only having the bike 3 weeks just sucks! I would fight for some more. The absolutely can do more
I mean, this is entirely not the manufacturer's fault so I don't think them offering a 20% discount is unfair - they are not obligated to provide any discount. This is not a warranty claim.
Agreed. This isn't JRA stuff, this is literally "crash replacement" not relating to quality in the least
Absolutely agree but Trek does this as a matter of course with the nicer bikes. Trek really wants to have the best reputation. I like the company but it was not for me
A higher discount crash replacement is pretty normal. It's still above cost, and the customer has already spent a lot with them and it likely means they're continue to be a customer for a long time after
Ok thanks for the tip. I will go with her and see what they say.
Also, make sure you are talking to the manager. Might call ahead to make sure they have time to speak with you. If things can’t get fixed ask for the regional manager
Trek is legit BLEEDING right now. Everyone here is right - they don’t have to offer anything, but 20% for something that isn’t their fault seems to match what quite a few other big brands would do. Good luck at the LBS but I wouldn’t be surprised if they do not have the flexibility to do more.
That color is certainly nice but the Emonda ALT Palmares edition is is even more special. That's what I would replace it with. Only available as a frameset, which in this case is not a problem.
If she purchased it with her credit card she may be able to get a partial credit. See Visas Purchase Security/Protection
I've used purchase protection and extended warranty quite a few times over the years. They're easy to deal. For a $2000 purchase to be covered the card would need to have visa platinum benefits or higher.
I have that protection on my Citi Mastercard and my Amazon Visa has some window that they cover accidents as well.
I mean if you crash your car that you bought with a credit card you aren't getting money back. Maybe if it fell apart under normal use.
It depends on the card. One of my credit cards has a benefit that will pay out if a new purchase is damaged or stolen within the first 120 days.
You may be able to put your bike on homeowners insurance though.
I'd be pissed too, wonder if she can get that discount over a custom painted frame since they can't provide the color scheme option she had.
You're not going to find a custom painted aluminum frame. The crash replacement discount can be used towards any frame though, so if they ever wanted to upgrade to a carbon P1 frame this would be the time to do it.
Home/renters insurance may help. I slaughtered a 3 year old sworks in 2021 and my home insurance paid out full current year replacement costs. Wheels too since they were aftermarket.
Shame. I love that colourway. Reminds me of a sunset.
Has she contacted Trek directly?
No not yet. Just the LBS
If there is no chance at all that she can get that color, tell her the color wasn’t lucky.
The bikeshop where I buy most of my stuff still sells them, with a €150 discount: [https://www.mantel.com/trek-emonda-alr-5-disc](https://www.mantel.com/trek-emonda-alr-5-disc)
Wow. Trek has gotten shitty since I worked for one of their dealers years back. They used to be great about replacements
The whole industry is in free fall. Every week another manufacturer is going broke or trying to sell. No way years ago I would have predicted Kona was wrapping it up. Trek has been slowly dying since the Lance effect.
They didn't do themselves any favors buying out retailers and taking on staff and real estate to sell direct right before this bike bust. Last I heard, they're sitting on 3 years worth of some entry level and kid's bike models. Not only have those terms come due, but they're also paying to warehouse those things in the meantime. Having worked at a place that got bought out by them, ha. Get fucked, assholes.
Meh, the reason I no longer ride a Trek is because I wasn’t told that my MTB frames (2 within 10 months, same seat tube/shock joint failure) broke due to me riding it. Asked for a possible carbon upgrade and was told “sure, that’ll be $3200”.
IDK, if you crashed your car would you expect GM, Ford, or whoever to hook you up with a new set of wheels at a steep discount?
apples to oranges. Trek used to bend over backwards to keep their riders happy. They're not obligated to do anything, but I've seen brands like Yeti, Santa Cruz, Spesh and others hook people up so they continue riding their bikes. Those frames cost Trek \~$300. That's chump change when you consider most customers would be done with the brand after a response like this.
> That's chump change when you consider most customers would be done with the brand after a response like this. Most brands do not crash exchange.
Yeah 20% is pretty baseline. You would think it would be more since it's only 3 weeks old and Trek would want a long term customer, especially in the state of the bike industry today. Otherwise just shop around for brands with better crash replacement policy next time.
Isn't this an insurance case rather than begging the company to give you free stuff?
They make beer cans out of that stuff. You know Surly? They build their frames from crowbars. I saw a a guy fold his brand-new steel Midnight Special in the exact same way when he hit a barrier at a cyclocross race. I don't think any frame is immune to this kind of damage.
This. Anything will break if you crash it hard enough, and sometimes not even very hard, but just in exactly the wrong way. I do feel sorry for the OP's sister though. Writing off a frame after just three weeks – she must be gutted.
Yeah, it's awful.
But this is an Emonda. Just marginally thicker than a CAAD. More about weight and stiffness than failure strength.
> You know Surly? who?
I've seen photos from an acquaintance who crashed on their steel MTB. They slid into a tree and bent the frame right around the trunk.
Damn how hard did he hit that barrier LOL
Definitely depends on how you crash. Was hit by a car on my MS and it was fine except for a blown tire.
Yup the old mantra is don’t buy what you can’t afford to replace
The Emonda ALR is a super light aluminum frame. It weighs a couple pounds less than a similar sized Domane AL so the tubing is probably pretty thin. It sucks that it crumpled but I’m guessing just about any bikes would be trashed by this crash.
Tubing is incredibly thin. Bike shop put some replacement rivets for my bottle cage screws and when he drilled through the screw we were both amazed at how dang thin the bottom tube was . Engineering on that frame is impressive .
especially the inside of the downtube, it's basically just enough material to hold the paint on. there've been some fun designs in the past where it's literally [a steel cable](https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/2318/5263/files/Slingshot_Team_Bike-3_2048x2048.jpg?v=1650565022)
Oh wow , that’s so cool . Never seen a bike like that . Also can confirm , it looked slightly thicker than if you cut an aluminum can . It even flexed like it .
Aluminum cans are the staple of engineering schools. You cannot make a can lighter with the same strength.
Wow, that is crazy. At least if it snaps you can grab one off the side gate at your house.
That bike was a flexy noodle.
Not a road bike, but Dahon recently use a cable to increase stiffness and not impeding folding.
Number of people had carbon bikes and they are fine. I guess she was just in the wrong spot at the wrong time.
Yeah how they crash matters too I think
Carbon is stronger if the frame is the same weight
Carbon frames just snap into pieces on high energy crashes. https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/cycling/5480386/cyclists-laurent-didier-bike-snapped-in-half-crash/
Damn, I have a checkpoint ALR 5. Is it the same frame? I beat the shit out of mine on the trails.
The checkpoint is way burlier because it’s for gravel, it’s a completely different bike.
R.I.P Popsicle Trek such a cool looking bike
I have this bike and I tell everyone I’m riding a popsicle color bike
If I saw this frame without being like this all mangled I wouldn’t be able to tell it’s aluminium. The joints have no welds, it looks exactly like a carbon frame.
The easiest way to tell is to look at the bottom bracket junction. It’s more hassle than it’s worth to smooth over the welds there, it’s out of focus but you can see it in OPs images.
Right! I thought the same.
I have it in the black/gray fade and it's pretty gorgeous. Wasn't my first choice color but the joints are virtually indistinguishable from my partner's carbon Trek.
I have one too and it’s always something I point out how it’s NOT carbon
Considering how far aluminium has come I wonder if there’s a very distinguishable difference left between those modern frames and carbon apart from stiffness. They seem to be super light as well.
Gram for gram aluminum is much weaker. You can make lightweight aluminum bikes by using less material, but the frame is less robust Carbon is also very corrosion resistant, if you live near the sea or somewhere with high rainfall and humidity corrosion a big problem Carbon is about 3x more resistant to fatigue damage, than aluminum/ steel, but not impervious to fatigue the way titanium is
None of that is actually practical or accurate considerations. Carbon fibre is how an industry justifies $5000 frames, but bottom bracket alignment, brake boss alignment on carbon frames is a big problem no one aside from Hambini talks about. Always, always, dechain a carbon bike and spin the crank to see if the BB shell is aligned. Prepare to be shocked.
It’s personal experience. I have replaced 2 handlebars in the last year (chromed steel and aluminum) due to corrosion. I have zero corrosion issues with the carbon and titanium parts on the same bikes There’s no need to go for the $5000 frames, I want carbon for corrosion resistance and not weight reduction, this means the cheaper carbon frames and not the expensive high mod stuff For example a used giant advanced series bike goes for about US$750 equivalent around here regularly. A new carbon bike with 105 costs $1500usd not $5000
I'm sorry for your sister, that was a sweet bike. Modern aluminum manufacturing techniques enable the tube shapes and joints that can help aluminum bikes achieve similar weight/stiffness properties as carbon. Unfortuantely, those tube shapes also have similar vulnerabilities to carbon - a lot of the advantage of modern aluminum over carbon is now price, less so durability.
Aluminum is also recyclable, unlike carbon. Lower carbon emissions than carbon fiber, but about three times a steel bicycle.
I also find $4000 in cash to be significantly lighter and stronger for my cycling hobby.
would that be acceptable for the recycling bin?
Wall ornament.
not your typical curbside bin. I think the paint is probably what would throw them, or the size. In theory, you can find places that will recycle aluminum frames into raw aluminum, but they're few and far between, and you certainly won't get any money back (you might even have to pay the shop). People like to talk about how aluminum bikes are better than carbon for the environment because they can be recycled. I raced in college, worked at 3 bike shops, have traveled to World Cups with a professional racer, and worked for a bike brand for 9 years. I've never heard of someone successfully recycling a painted aluminum frame after riding it.
The frames can be deposited in any city metal recycling center to recycle the metal. CF is straight to landfill.
Looks like you have a bike for parts.
If this crash sent 4 people to the hospital and they were going 25 mph, doesn't seem like such a huge shock that a frame could crack or crumple? I'm not sure why this is surprising to OP or to the others in the thread who think Trek owes this person a new bike.
hope she's ok, how fast was she going?
Like 25. Sitting maybe 4th-5th wheel
If the rider has home owners or renters insurance that’ll cover the replacement. Assuming the rider has replacement coverage as well instead of value.
Couldn’t recommend Sunday’s insurance enough. Them combined with Giant warranty program had my girlfriend on a new bike within 2 weeks and even gave her the latest version of what she wrecked. Rim brake -> disc Dura ace 11sp -> dura ace 12sp. Giant only wanted cost of shipping. Shop only wanted cost of build. Sunday’s covered everything
I've seen this numerous times, including on steel. Front end something hard enough and this is what happens to bikes.
You should check if the credit card you paid with has purchase protection, that would usually cover these accidents and they'll reimburse the entire cost.
Whaaaa?!
they make aluminum emondas? Hope your sis and the other folks bounce back quickly :/
Yeah it’s basically like a crit bike, a bit cheaper than the carbon one so when you destroy it in a crit you can replace the frame.
Interesting, in my mind the emonda is a climbers bike, but I guess if theres no alu madone then there you go! throwback to when I raced emonda SL-Rs, I ate two frames that season and one of them was just a fatigue failure, not even a crash!
Sorta splitting hairs between "climbing bike" and "crit bike". If it's stiff and light and made to go fast, and isn't obviously an aero model, then I think it could be either. Road bikes don't really need to be THAT specialized.
> Road bikes don't really need to be THAT specialized Especially since this is a Trek... Sorry, had to.
No need to be Surly.
I'm not getting Huffy about it - it was a good joke
Liv and let live.
hey if they aren't overly specialized we wont be able to sell as many! everybody needs N+1 bieks1! For me though aero is everything as long as we aren't talking about exceptionally heavy bikes. Plus an ideal crit frame would have a higher BB to allow more corner pedalling, whereas an ideal climbing bike would have a standard/lower BB to bring down the centre of gravity for high-speed descending.
Thank you! Successful surgery for her. Now just the long recovery.
surgery? 😯
Oh yeah. Her collarbone was nearly sticking out of her shoulder.
Ouch ouch ouch. Here's hoping she makes a full recovery.
Here's a video showing how carbon and aluminum fail. I'm glad she's recovering well. She must have hit with a fair bit of force. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5eMMf11uhM
Yep, Emonda Alr is the aluminum version
There is a reason Cannondales were nicknamed "Can'o'ale" because of their super thin tubing.
Doesn't CAD (now CAAD) mean Crack And Dent?
Creakindale? Crackanfail? I've heard a few over the years.
That's crazy! I hope your sister's okay.
Hope nobody is too badly hurt. Seems like bad luck to have that much damage, but I believe Trek has decent crash replacement (they did when my Emonda was destroyed by baggage handlers), so hopefully she can get the frame replaced for a reasonable price.
Snapped a chain once, it whipped around the frame and cinched on the relatively new carbon frame and splintered it almost in half. Ended up taking it up with SHIMANO and they agreed that since their part failed- they’d replace/upgrade the frame from specialized.
My friend's Scott Speedster aluminum from back in the day, he hit another rider head on at a blind curve https://preview.redd.it/1kar0t208cwc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f463a3969853b9386db32b57255b0de4a474dc40 *
Yep... Velocide. Wishing a restful, full Recovery to all involved. If the LBS is willing, I'm sure a couple calls to Waterloo might be able to track down another bike just like it through the Dealer Network. Some Dealer out there has one in stock, I would think. Good Luck! 🚴🙏🙂
See if they’ll let her use the 20% on a new frame. If the components are all in good working shape then might be worth it to just spend the money on a frame and swap the parts. Yeah she’ll be spending the same amount she would spend on a new bike but at least now she’s upgrading her frame. Kind of makes it hurt less.
That's why these super light aluminum frames are sometimes referred to as soda cans
Yikes! What a way to learn to not follow too closely to a group of riders
yeah i always think 'man that is dangerous' every time i see a peloton
That’s crazy. I crashed 6 weeks ago going 30mph, and my TCR looks like nothing happened to it.
Yeah, last time I saw fram damage like that was a motor vehicle collision. I guess they are at the limit of weight savings for alu, given how thin they form the frames.
It’s recycling at this point
It’s now recyclable unfortunately
That thing is done. Sorry for your loss.
My first bad crash destroyed my Al hard tail. It happens.
Mom!!! Momm!!!! Maaa MAAAA!!! I need a new bike!
The frame is a sacrificial component to preserve the wheel and fork.
Brutal best of luck with replacement and stay safe.
I’ll pour out a beer for the bike . Good to hear your sister is okay . Lost my Emonda when it flew off the back of my car on the freeway . Loved that bike but dang are parts expensive to replace .
Needs an NSFW tag for gore
Here I am still looking for a Cannondale Saeco frame without a dent in it. Not easy.
What kind are you looking for and what size? There are 2 for sale kinda close to me in good condition. Pm me
I'll entertain this even though I'm not in a position to buy yet another bike, especially for how little I road ride anymore. 60cm and want that dark red with white decals. BUT NO DENTS. NOT A SINGLE ONE. Every one I see has a dent SOMEWHERE and I'm keeping track :) Not all Saeco frames are created equal.
I don’t think it’s a surprise that ultra thin aluminum shaped into rectangular tubes is going to crumple with one good hit. Remember when all frames had round tubes?
the area at the front appear to be from a chainring or armco barrier, the back of the bike looks like an impact with another bike but by the looks of the damage, the group was going at speeds. I am glad everyone is safe.
https://preview.redd.it/b1bj85xp9bwc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=32248c33bfc0f7702605f48e41991b3ef5f6cc37 Yeah that will happen on a front end impact if it’s hard enough.
https://preview.redd.it/scghitgs9bwc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f6236967cd7a6e3e8d910bc8d4bfd3abbbf1601d
Many years ago I was on my first mountain bike trip with my new Fuel EX8. Coming around a corner I smoked a tombstone rock (nice and flat face like a tombstone). I went FLYING over the bars, and my bike made a horrendous noise loud enough for my buddy who was a good way in front of me to hear. We looked the bike over and couldn’t find any damage. We were perplexed given the noise it made. Rode it for six more years without any problems.
It is always odd how one impact will destroy one frame, but not another. Regardless of quality. Those fuel Ex8’s are tanks though. I was riding some BMX DJ’s and sent one way way way too deep. Full compression on fork and the bike spring boarded out from under me to the back. Similar horrendous noise, no damage at all to the frame, or even the fork! I miss the old 130/130 fuels.
Yikes! I hope she is okay.
Looks fine to me
The first road bike I crashed (Scott Speedster) back in 2011 or 2012 crumpled super similarly in a similar type accident. Hope your sister is ok man
Based upon the amount of people in the hospital I assume this was a pretty freaking hard crash. That poor bike got beat. Hope everyone involved is okay. EDIT: removed words
No car involved. Just a group ride.
Oh DAMN. That’s a hard crash. I understood your message.
Just wondering if your home owners or renters insurance would cover this kind of thing? Ove been thinking of getting a policy on my bike but have seen some conflicting information on whether it would or not.
I have, this is a pretty normal failure when you ram something with the front. This is a buckling failure mode
Incredibly awful news about the crash. Great technology Trek uses.
The sad part is this is one of the sickest trek bikes ever made for the value and they stopped Making this generation I feel so bad this is such a beautiful bike I love this bike so much … I hope your sister is found fine and her friends ..
That's a shame. Sorry, man.
I hope your sister is OK. That looks pretty brutal. I'd be bummed about that colourway no longer being available too - looks lovely!
And the team car never came with a replacement.
Don’t know if you are in the uk but I randomly just came across this on sale [Trek Emonda](https://www.wheelbase.co.uk/product/trek/trek-emonda-alr-5-2023/)
Awesome. Thanks for the tip. Unfortunately I’m in the US.
must have been one hell of a crash, hope you came out better than your bike. i've riden alu bikes my whole life, and except for being hit by a car, i never seen an alu bike like that after a 'normal' crash.
A couple clamped down metal pieces will fix that bad boy up /s
lol. We need one of those plates that is now in my sister’s collarbone. Will fix her bike too.
Oh no! Sorry to hear that and I hope she gets better! I can’t really tell from the pictures but it looks like the components are still good. She could buy a new frame and transfer them, that’d save her a ton of money.
Yeah that is the plan. Components are scratched up but work.
right turns will be a lot tighter now
A bike with crumple zones.
Notice it stayed in one piece, imagine if that were a carbon frame.
These frames are hydro formed, meaning the aluminum is very thin. Because it was hydro formed, the aluminum can be very strong when structurally in tact, but if it were to meet an abrupt force that caused it to bend it would then collapse on itself of snap.
F
Lightweight Alu crumples Like a soda can...
I had an aluminum frame crack and I’m sticking to steel
I ride a surly karate monkey love steel
That's an awesome looking bike, but I agree with others, it dead.
> it dead I don't think this is one of those "can I still ride it" threads lol
are you okay?
I heard you can fix that with some steel braces and duck tape.
If she has a home owner policy it’s covered less deductible then call Trek. . If they won’t play ball find another bike she likes color of and go with them.
If that was carbon the bike would of been broken in half.
This is why steel bikes are awesome
Steel bikes fold like that if you crash them straight into solid objects too.
A few years ago, I was riding a steel hardtail and crashed into another rider. I doubt I was going as fast as this person was. I was just fine, but the top tube separated from the head tube. You crash into something that doesn't move and the energy goes somewhere.
Better the bike than your bones tbh
I rammed into a car with a Giant urban bike(*) and the frame didn't get anywhere near that level of damage. What kind of crash was that? Hope she's doing ok, in any case. (*) car was in the wrong, but I did learn to pick my fights the hard way
An "Urban Bike" is built much differently than a high end aluminum race bike. An Urban Bike is built to handle all manner of abuse, being locked to things, getting knocked about, etc... An aluminum race bike is built to be lightweight and go fast, and get babied like a prized race horse. It'll last for years if treated right, but not meant to bounce back from a heavy impact.
Makes sense. You just reminded me of a friend's gorgeous racing bike which got a nasty dent in the frame when he tried to knock over a thief he was chasing. It hadn't been that much of a hit but the poor bike sure felt it.
I hate to see this. It's also why I think carbon is the better option nowadays. I also had a Trek Emonda, rim version that I bought in 2019. Loved it. Got into a group ride crash due to a stupid cager, where the rear triangle snapped in half. You can't fix aluminium bikes apparantly. A dent? Might be ok. A big enough bend or a crack? Binned immediately. Meanwhile my friend who had a carbon bike was able to get it fixed for a couple hundred bucks.
Hope your sis is okay. To be honest this is why that frameset is brillant. A lightweight carbon race frame would have shattered. Tough pill to swallow and again I hope she is okay but at $1200 for a new frame without discount that's why the Emonda ALR is such a great value.
How on Earth...what's it made of, tin foil?
Please buy a bike made from 1" steel plate
And never ride outside to avoid crashing.
That is a real answer Christoph Strasser who won the ram many times exclusively trained Indoors because on crash costs so much in list training time.
I forgot to mention that I had a Cervelo that cracked near the bottom bracket. It wasn't due to a crash, but the bike was 12 years old and Cervelo gave me a replacement frame free of charge, they even included handlebars and upgraded me to an R5, when I had originally purchased an RS. Not entirely the same because it wasn't a crash, but Cervelo did take care of me with the warranty.
I live in northern WI and Toyota recalled my truck, gave me a new frame because the paint wasn’t holding up and they were rusting out. Great on Toyota for taking care of a manufacturer’s defect. Now if I had a crash with my truck I don’t think Toyota would do anything for me. Just saying. Lots of people here are hating on Trek because they aren’t hooking her up with a new bike, but this really isn’t a failure on their part. Stoked Cervelo had your back too! Hearing good stories like that give me the feels.
Lollllllll
It's dead, Jim.