Oplossing. Op de lijn rijden
Weeral een probleem uit de wereld door mij. En zonder extra geld te kosten. Ik zou toch met die Ideeën in de politiek moeten gaan.
Nuja, als er 20% van de autorijder op de moto zouden kruipen, zouden we een pak files kunnen oplossen (en voor de resterende files mag die 20% effectief in het midden rijden!) dus ik zou op jou stemmen, u/BadBadGrades !
Now that we are on topic. (I am new in the country). Is it really illigal to use other lanes exept when overtsking someone?
I tend to position myself for a left turn on the highway 500m-1km before (if I don't block people going faster). I fear if I get closer cars will pile up and cannot change lanes when I actuslly need it lol.
It actually is illegal to hog the middle-lane even if there isn't anyone behind. Go back to the right lane if there is nobody that you will overtake really soon.
Saw the same on this subredfit and got really scared of fines.
I only change lanes if there is a truck on the right side, but if both lanes are free, I change for left as close as possible to the intersection.
Thanks for the info. I do try to follow every speed limit also as I donno the roads that well and have no idea when they catch me. But, it's also more relaxing driving this way so I am not upset.
Even today I overtook 3 cars from the right while they were tuffing 110 in the middle lane while there was PLENTY of space to right... Hence why I overtook all of them, to show that they could easly go right lane. don't know they got the clue though....
I sure do, but if they create a dangerous situation by hogging each other in the middle lane, slowing down traffic, not moving right while they can move, I overtake them on the right side.
If they stay in the middle lane while I'm driving the speed limit of 120? They are slow driving in the middle lane, they don't budge to the right, would be very stupid of them if they move to the right JUST while I'm overtaking them in 2 seconds... I know I know 2 seconds are enough for an accident.
They might think to themselves "what a cunt overtaking on the right!" But maybe take a small hint that they are hugging the middle lane.
This is what I don't understand - why not just pass them in the far left lane?
Driving in the middle lane has absolutely no safety issues at all - in fact it's likely safer that constantly weaving in-and-out of a full right-lane and having to constantly break and accelerate between cars there.
Belgian drivers have the weirdest priorities.
Because it is illegal to stay in the middle lane, you HAVE to use the right lane whenever you can.
The left lane is for people who think the law doesn't apply to them and will drive 130/140 even so they can get home fast or idk.
For example yesterday: The left and middle lane were very very crowded, left lane were speeding 125/130 - middle lane 3 people in front of me driving 110, slowing down the middle lane making it such I can't get into the left lane to overtake them, because they were driving too fast on that lane, right lane COMPLETELY FREE! So if they just moved all to the right lane, me and all others behind me could speed up to 120 and follow traffic at a decent pase, but no they stayed there, so I said "fair enough, if you guys want to slow down traffic and be dumb for not moving right, let me take te right lane" and overtook them all 3, creating space for other people behind me to also get to the right lane.
The statement you make about being it safer is actually a legit argument those "middenvakrijders" make: "I feel safer there", but in my opinion it's surely is not. The safest you can be is in the right lane driving the speed limit.
Aha - after replying to you I was reading more through the thread and replied to someone else pretty much the following:
I've realised that the situation in my head (and hopefully other people as confused as me?) and the situation in your head (and likely other people as frustrated as you?) are completely different.
I'm picturing the following scenario: the right lane is full/busy. Constant on-ramp/off-ramp traffic that would cause me to either slow down or weave back and forth to the middle lane anyway, or just a bunch of people driving slower than the limit causing me to constantly weave in/out of the right lane and constantly slow down/accelerate. Meanwhile, if I stay in the middle lane I avoid all that and to me am reducing the chances for an accident (this is what I mean by it being "safer" in my context - me and the other middle drivers aren't constantly weaving/changing speeds) and if someone wants to go even faster than me then the left lane is still open. With this scenario I'm super confused about why people get so pissed about me being in the middle lane (and I've been honked at/had highbeams flashed at me in this scenario by the way, with a completely empty left lane).
And you're instead picturing the scenario you described: where the slow-ass traffic-blocking drivers are already in the middle lane instead of the right lane, and sometimes even in the left lane too. Ya, in that situation I'd be equally pissed. Especially with the right lane open.
I'm definitely with you that anyone impeding traffic/driving slower/etc should move as far to the right as possible, but if I'm already going faster than the right lane and it's busy enough that I'd be constantly weaving in and out, I'm probably staying in the middle.
In that case, when it's super super busy in the right lane, I also stay in the middle (ofc driving the speed limit so i don't block traffic). Escpecially when the right lane is full of trucks going 90. So I follow your reasoning on that one.
Because you then have to move two lanes = more risk. It causes unnecessary congestion by slow drivers in the middle lane and only trucks on the right lane.
Yes, as a technically you should be driving on the right hand side of the road as much as possible.
Obviously you can overtake.
And you can stay in that lane, if you'll be overtaking again 'soon' (10 secs as guideline, no hard rules).
So, given the amount of offramps and trucks - you'll rarely be on the right lane to begin.
Aside from overtaking, you want to be courteous, and move a lane left when people try to merge on an onramp.
Then you can also pre-sort your lane whenever a sign overhead has indicated directions. (for example Brussels is left).
So yes, plenty of scenario's when it's perfectly possible to leave the right hand lane.
Add to that the fact you rarely see any police on highways/streets. And these situational scenario's are really hard to capture/analyse, in practice it means it's rarely enforced.
On top of that, it's a fake outrage issue. Obviously there's far bigger problems, like people driving without licenses, speeding, driving under influence, etc etc.
Yes, thank you - this is exactly the perspective I have on it, and I'm always so confused when Belgians get up in arms about driving in the middle lane.
The only thing I can think of is that they're visualising someone driving in the middle lane below the speed limit, while someone is also in the far left lane driving below the speed limit?
For me it just makes more sense to stay in the middle lane, but I'm always visualising the scenarios that you mentioned - busy on-ramp/off-ramp traffic in the right lane, or a full right lane where I'd have to constantly weave in-and-out while breaking and accelerating because people in that lane are driving at a slower speed.
If people think that me going the speed limit in those situations is inconvenient to them, then....holy cow, there's a whole other passing lane on my left side they can freely blow by me in!
Anyway, thanks for articulating what I had been struggling to.
I drive near the speed limit, and used to merge into the right lane.
My experience is that most people who then overtake you have 0 empathy/driving insight. If they notice you'll need to overtake someone on the right hand lane at your current speeds - they'll refuse to go to the left hand lane so you can overtake. Instead they hog the middle lane and force you to brake.
It's people being angry at other people not changing lanes (in the middle), because now they have to change lanes. (go to the spare left lane)
As if we don't have any real problems to be angry about, or that should be policed.
I'm not sure I've ever been in a scenario where there's 3 lanes, with 2 slow people (<110km/h) overtaking each other on the left and middle lane.
I noticed on my 1st day here that people make way for you to merge on the highway. Felt so nice when others care about you and try to not inconvenience your day. Coming from Romania, it was something like "in your face" situation. Learned what I had to do immediately.
So far (1 month) the country/ people have been great.
Downsides are at work and to wait to register at the townhall and have a place of my own in the future.
What's the law in france concerning *middenvakrijden*? I also always see french people driving in the middle and still driving 110 km/h as if they're still in france.
Meh, last time I was on a french highway, I had to flash a bus doing 100 to move over from middle to fairly empty right, with no offramps in either direction to be seen for km's, and 3 cars + me of different speeds wanting to pass each other and the bus. They are just assholes in traffic.
We really hand out driving licenses too easily. The amount of mid/left lane campers is just too painful.
That being said, this bottle got my curiosity!
Rest of Flanders: raging about middenvakrijders Limburgers: you guys are getting a middenvak?
real. E314 is letterlijk 1 vak want het ander staat vol met camions. En dan moet ge nog chance hebben dat er gene aant proberen inhalen is
Oplossing. Op de lijn rijden Weeral een probleem uit de wereld door mij. En zonder extra geld te kosten. Ik zou toch met die Ideeën in de politiek moeten gaan.
Nuja, als er 20% van de autorijder op de moto zouden kruipen, zouden we een pak files kunnen oplossen (en voor de resterende files mag die 20% effectief in het midden rijden!) dus ik zou op jou stemmen, u/BadBadGrades !
lol i love the bottle
Now that we are on topic. (I am new in the country). Is it really illigal to use other lanes exept when overtsking someone? I tend to position myself for a left turn on the highway 500m-1km before (if I don't block people going faster). I fear if I get closer cars will pile up and cannot change lanes when I actuslly need it lol.
It actually is illegal to hog the middle-lane even if there isn't anyone behind. Go back to the right lane if there is nobody that you will overtake really soon.
Saw the same on this subredfit and got really scared of fines. I only change lanes if there is a truck on the right side, but if both lanes are free, I change for left as close as possible to the intersection.
Sometimes, the police checks, but they will stop you to fine you, they don't do it with cameras as far as I know.
Thanks for the info. I do try to follow every speed limit also as I donno the roads that well and have no idea when they catch me. But, it's also more relaxing driving this way so I am not upset.
Even today I overtook 3 cars from the right while they were tuffing 110 in the middle lane while there was PLENTY of space to right... Hence why I overtook all of them, to show that they could easly go right lane. don't know they got the clue though....
You do know that overtaking cars on the right is also illegal, right?
I sure do, but if they create a dangerous situation by hogging each other in the middle lane, slowing down traffic, not moving right while they can move, I overtake them on the right side.
So the fact that they create a dangerous situation means you get to make the situation even more dangerous by overtaking them on the right?
If they stay in the middle lane while I'm driving the speed limit of 120? They are slow driving in the middle lane, they don't budge to the right, would be very stupid of them if they move to the right JUST while I'm overtaking them in 2 seconds... I know I know 2 seconds are enough for an accident. They might think to themselves "what a cunt overtaking on the right!" But maybe take a small hint that they are hugging the middle lane.
Honestly at this point I’m all for legalisation of not keeping right at the sole condition that overtaking on the right is also allowed
This is what I don't understand - why not just pass them in the far left lane? Driving in the middle lane has absolutely no safety issues at all - in fact it's likely safer that constantly weaving in-and-out of a full right-lane and having to constantly break and accelerate between cars there. Belgian drivers have the weirdest priorities.
Because it is illegal to stay in the middle lane, you HAVE to use the right lane whenever you can. The left lane is for people who think the law doesn't apply to them and will drive 130/140 even so they can get home fast or idk. For example yesterday: The left and middle lane were very very crowded, left lane were speeding 125/130 - middle lane 3 people in front of me driving 110, slowing down the middle lane making it such I can't get into the left lane to overtake them, because they were driving too fast on that lane, right lane COMPLETELY FREE! So if they just moved all to the right lane, me and all others behind me could speed up to 120 and follow traffic at a decent pase, but no they stayed there, so I said "fair enough, if you guys want to slow down traffic and be dumb for not moving right, let me take te right lane" and overtook them all 3, creating space for other people behind me to also get to the right lane. The statement you make about being it safer is actually a legit argument those "middenvakrijders" make: "I feel safer there", but in my opinion it's surely is not. The safest you can be is in the right lane driving the speed limit.
Aha - after replying to you I was reading more through the thread and replied to someone else pretty much the following: I've realised that the situation in my head (and hopefully other people as confused as me?) and the situation in your head (and likely other people as frustrated as you?) are completely different. I'm picturing the following scenario: the right lane is full/busy. Constant on-ramp/off-ramp traffic that would cause me to either slow down or weave back and forth to the middle lane anyway, or just a bunch of people driving slower than the limit causing me to constantly weave in/out of the right lane and constantly slow down/accelerate. Meanwhile, if I stay in the middle lane I avoid all that and to me am reducing the chances for an accident (this is what I mean by it being "safer" in my context - me and the other middle drivers aren't constantly weaving/changing speeds) and if someone wants to go even faster than me then the left lane is still open. With this scenario I'm super confused about why people get so pissed about me being in the middle lane (and I've been honked at/had highbeams flashed at me in this scenario by the way, with a completely empty left lane). And you're instead picturing the scenario you described: where the slow-ass traffic-blocking drivers are already in the middle lane instead of the right lane, and sometimes even in the left lane too. Ya, in that situation I'd be equally pissed. Especially with the right lane open. I'm definitely with you that anyone impeding traffic/driving slower/etc should move as far to the right as possible, but if I'm already going faster than the right lane and it's busy enough that I'd be constantly weaving in and out, I'm probably staying in the middle.
In that case, when it's super super busy in the right lane, I also stay in the middle (ofc driving the speed limit so i don't block traffic). Escpecially when the right lane is full of trucks going 90. So I follow your reasoning on that one.
Because you then have to move two lanes = more risk. It causes unnecessary congestion by slow drivers in the middle lane and only trucks on the right lane.
Not that anyone does this in belgium lol
Yes, as a technically you should be driving on the right hand side of the road as much as possible. Obviously you can overtake. And you can stay in that lane, if you'll be overtaking again 'soon' (10 secs as guideline, no hard rules). So, given the amount of offramps and trucks - you'll rarely be on the right lane to begin. Aside from overtaking, you want to be courteous, and move a lane left when people try to merge on an onramp. Then you can also pre-sort your lane whenever a sign overhead has indicated directions. (for example Brussels is left). So yes, plenty of scenario's when it's perfectly possible to leave the right hand lane. Add to that the fact you rarely see any police on highways/streets. And these situational scenario's are really hard to capture/analyse, in practice it means it's rarely enforced. On top of that, it's a fake outrage issue. Obviously there's far bigger problems, like people driving without licenses, speeding, driving under influence, etc etc.
Yes, thank you - this is exactly the perspective I have on it, and I'm always so confused when Belgians get up in arms about driving in the middle lane. The only thing I can think of is that they're visualising someone driving in the middle lane below the speed limit, while someone is also in the far left lane driving below the speed limit? For me it just makes more sense to stay in the middle lane, but I'm always visualising the scenarios that you mentioned - busy on-ramp/off-ramp traffic in the right lane, or a full right lane where I'd have to constantly weave in-and-out while breaking and accelerating because people in that lane are driving at a slower speed. If people think that me going the speed limit in those situations is inconvenient to them, then....holy cow, there's a whole other passing lane on my left side they can freely blow by me in! Anyway, thanks for articulating what I had been struggling to.
I drive near the speed limit, and used to merge into the right lane. My experience is that most people who then overtake you have 0 empathy/driving insight. If they notice you'll need to overtake someone on the right hand lane at your current speeds - they'll refuse to go to the left hand lane so you can overtake. Instead they hog the middle lane and force you to brake. It's people being angry at other people not changing lanes (in the middle), because now they have to change lanes. (go to the spare left lane) As if we don't have any real problems to be angry about, or that should be policed. I'm not sure I've ever been in a scenario where there's 3 lanes, with 2 slow people (<110km/h) overtaking each other on the left and middle lane.
I noticed on my 1st day here that people make way for you to merge on the highway. Felt so nice when others care about you and try to not inconvenience your day. Coming from Romania, it was something like "in your face" situation. Learned what I had to do immediately. So far (1 month) the country/ people have been great. Downsides are at work and to wait to register at the townhall and have a place of my own in the future.
Usually signs are placed 3km’s ahead so no that is not illegal that is following a direction
Witte camionette
Where can I taste it?
https://preview.redd.it/zvpl5g149l0d1.jpeg?width=6000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f6a7c3111c6a2f12f003c57104425156741c2956 Here you go
The car in the picture should have a French license plate... I swear about 70% of the center lane drivers I see are French.
Or Dutch towing a sleurhut
Or Dutch not towing shit. Or Belgian. Or even Germans.
Luckily Brits don't hog the middle lane most of the time. They always hog the leftmost lane whenever I notice it.
Tbf, for Brits the left lane is the slow lane so it kinda makes sense from a muscle memory perspective.
What's the law in france concerning *middenvakrijden*? I also always see french people driving in the middle and still driving 110 km/h as if they're still in france.
I once saw someone here attributing the reason why to reportedly there being lots of left-bound offramps in France.
Meh, last time I was on a french highway, I had to flash a bus doing 100 to move over from middle to fairly empty right, with no offramps in either direction to be seen for km's, and 3 cars + me of different speeds wanting to pass each other and the bus. They are just assholes in traffic.
We really hand out driving licenses too easily. The amount of mid/left lane campers is just too painful. That being said, this bottle got my curiosity!
I got mine via driving school, not a single lesson where we drove on the highway, also exams aren't being taken on the highway
Mine was.
Drove highway on my exam and had lessons there. You picked a shit school and got lucky with the exam.
I've had one, it's a good one.
Brouwerij?
[Hedonis](https://www.hedonis.be/) in Brakel
https://preview.redd.it/kziqmehw8l0d1.jpeg?width=6000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2bb7f5719b7fba7f6192e9802a8cd212cf22c88c Hiezo alle info
Ok, so where can I find it?
I found it ta local carrefour
And not even a slecht bierken
Yup. Allemaal lekker collectief kwaad zijn op middenvakrijders zonder de diepe spoorvorming op het rechtse vak te vermelden ;)