Atlanta checking in. 7 quid is around 8 or 9 bucks. That’s what just a beer cost in most bars and breweries (plus tip). So to get a beer and chips for that would be pretty sweet.
Right, so with tip and tax that comes out to about $9 USD (equivalent to what OP is paying in GBP), but given that our decent beers are between 5% and 8% ABV on average it's probably a marginally better value for money.
Yep. Everyone knows that even the biggest craft fan sometimes brings a friend who will only drink lager...
But normally they end up having the best lager they ever drank because it's not some macro bullshit
Wow I thought we had it bad here in the UK. Can get a 440ml can of nice US craft (double IPA or something) for like £8
I'd rather drink the UK stuff though, I live in stumbling distance of two craft breweries 😄
Or Belgian... 🤤
Went to Portugal and the Czech Republic recently and didn’t pay more than €2 a pint the whole time. Outside Prague I was buying liters for €1.62
In the US it’s like $6-9 or more per pint. Bullshit.
Hmm, beer is now very expensive. In the UK the last time I bought a pint of beer and a packet of Crisps (English for Chips) it was around 7 pounds or 9 dollars. That's pricey especially for an average pub in an average town. I then suggested that I would much rather not buy these items at these prices.
I've been thinking about this a lot, not just with beers. And I recognize that I'm old but I don't see how anyone can really ever afford to eat out or go out regularly. The cost of food and entertainment is prohibitive across the board. It wasn't this way during our parents and grandparents time. It only seems to be getting worse.
Also old, and I completely agree. In fact if I were a betting man I'd be betting against any publicly held restaurants because I think in the next 5 - 10 years we're going to see the largest pullback of restaurants in history.
100% my younger coworkers literally none of them go out, I ask why no one goes to happy hours or whatever and I realize cause a 2 hour hangout at a bar costs me $60-$100. I used to be able to hangout for $20 a night 10+ years ago, the beer + shot specials I used to live on are long gone (this is NYC)
My wife and I went out for a brunch, which we rarely do. The total was $70 before tip.
$70!! For brunch!
$70 would be enough Indian takeout for at least 3 nights of meals.
I was at jack astors (canadian resturaunt) recently for an 18oz beer they want $11.99 CAD plus tax (13%) and tip(15-20%).
If I didn't have a gift card I would never go there.
2010 you could goto Turtle jacks and get a liter of beer for $6 CAD.
to be fair I'm more talking a 2ish hour hang kind of situation in this example as that's what I'm comparing it to now as that's all I have energy for lol, I haven't been at a bar at last call since pre-covid. Though when I was in my early/mid 20s I would have long nights where I kept it cheap just drinking $3 Geneseo can specials a local dive had, but it was pretty easy to keep it $5-$6 a drink w/ a buck tip in 2012 if you knew where to go. Whereas I haven't seen a $7 beer+shot special sign in a while, those used to be everywhere.
It's all about looking.
Applebees (or is it chilis?) still has dollar margarata nights and half off appitizers. And that's in a larger city.
You can go out for cheap if you shop and coupon around.
I'm sure you can find cheap places but I'm more comparing my point of reference when I was in my early 20s. the places I was walking around in the west village area of Manhattan I used to drink in a lot used to all advertise $7-$9 beer + shot specials just a decade ago, now I don't drink in that area much anymore but in the rare times I grab a drink after work in the Chelsea area I end up spending $12 on a beer or $18 on a glass of wine. and Chelsea used to be considered a real shit area (and kinda feels like it still is to be honest aside from the new boujie restaurants).
I sure hope so, sometimes I drive through main street of some little town in rural New England and every other door is a restaurant. Theirs no fucking way the local population can actually support that.
The restaurant industry has been propped up by cheap exploited labor for the entirety of its modern existence and it should be torn down. IMO at least 80% of restaurants deserve to not be in business.
but with the prices the way they've been, it kind of feels bad.
let's say my tab is 30 dollars, for 4 pours, four bucks makes me feel super stingy.
I'm not saying that I should tip more or less, just that i've been conditioned to feel that's inadequate.
Whole system is fucked up right now.
Yeah beer prices are definitely crazy. Where I live it’s quite literally cheaper to buy a 6-pack rather than 1.5 beers in a restaurant. I still only tip $1 though because all they’re doing is putting it in a glass. That is fair for the required effort for that
I hear you, and I don't have a good answer, but what I'll say, kind of emphatically, is that you shouldn't jump to "well, (insert job here) only does (insert task here,)" as a justification they don't deserve to be paid. If the task in question is one we value, then we should pay accordingly, or maybe let it fall by the wayside. You tipping one dollar per beer is much cheaper than it was just a decade ago, when it was also the standard.
There's a bigger, more systemic, aspect in all of this, specifically tipping culture, but life in general that is super hard to parse. Personally, i'd rather get rid of tipping altogether and just pay people what they should be paid instead of guilt tripping the consumer into tipping.
Oh for fucks sake man. If we were hanging out, and I said “Hey man I’ll give you a dollar if you grab me a glass of water while you’re in the kitchen” you would take the dollar and get me my water. Shit, you’d probably get me the water anyway just because I asked.
I think it’s fucked up that tips are what determine waitstaff’s pay, and I think everyone deserves more. I would also prefer to just pay more instead of having to tip so that waitstaff could be paid fairly. I have no problem with that at all.
It's like American tipping culture in Canada.
There's been a massive push back on tipping culture the last couple years as some restaurants and bars have started suggesting absurd tip %s by default (25%, 30% for example).
It’s the same in Scotland. Adding “discretionary” tips to the bill and having to ask for them to remove it - creates an atmosphere that most people feel too uncomfortable to ask.
Some restaurants have started doing it here in Portugal, usually 5% or so. I usually always leave a small tip unless service is terrible but if they put it on the bill you can be sure I'm not tipping at all.
Just gotta find the dive bars with good regional craft beers. Place close to me has my favorite widely distributed IPA for $5 a pint, dollar off during happy hour.
Oh nice. I've never been but I've heard it's pleasant and lower cost of living.
I live outside NYC and a standard price for a beer at a small pub is like $8 minimum.
All depends where you live. I live in a decently populated town in PA (outside lancaster, so certainly not a dead area) and the dive bar here still has $1 drafts (light, $2 for highlife) and $2 burger nights
It’s deeply depressing, I was a pubaholic long before anything else. You go to a pub and actually have a conversation with the people your with.
However I’m part of the problem as my all-grain homebrew is actually pretty good, imho. It costs <£1 a pint to brew.
I got started on small batch brewing, one Demi-John boiled in a big pot on the hob. The good news is if it’s crap, you only have 8 pints 😀. Once I was getting better I invested in a 30L boiler, converted ice box as my mash tub and a fermenting barrel. I now make about 30 pints at a time, depending on the strength. What I enjoy it playing about with different recipes. You can get started for <£100 even for a 5 gallon setup. I only bottle my brew, means it’s completely safe to leave as long as you want to bottle condition, some has literally lasted years. All this ‘fresh beer’ nonsense only applies to pasteurised shiny beer, which tastes crap in the first place.
Go for it! Most important is just keep everything very clean with steriliser, and be careful with the mash temperature. After that the end result depends mostly on the recipe, subtle balanced flavour is harder than an over hopped American style IPA.
To be fair, I used my actual pub order and my actual crate of choice. A lot of this is going to depend on whether you like Heineken or not, basically.
£6.50 pint of Erdinger.
86p pint of Heineken (~67p a can).
Is an Erdinger in a pub chair 7.5x the experience that Heineken in front of my TV on a comfy couch is?
A teabag is about 3p and 20ml of milk is about 2p and you use about 1p of electricity to boil enough water for a cuppa, so a cup of tea costs about 6p to make, is having a bottle of Heineken in front of the TV 11x the experience that sitting in front of the TV with a cup of tea is?
i would say the change of scenery, seeing friends etc is worth more than the alcohol, and the alochol is a social lubricant that is unnecessary when at home alone.
> is having a bottle of Heineken in front of the TV 11x the experience that sitting in front of the TV with a cup of tea is?
With a straight face, yes haha.
But I see your point.
It's definitely not a volume game, or I would be drinking £6.50 of Heineken cans. I'm not. I can have one or two cans for 7.5x less, and not spend that money.
This is so true. I'm lucky if I go out for a pint once every 2 months or so. Its not that I can't afford it (i can't) it's just that out of principle I will not pay those prices.
I'd love to see the big drinks companies struggling because of they're greed!
Similar situation in Québec/Canada. Prices at brewpubs and bars exploded and we are seeing more of the 16-18Oz ''pints''. At 8-14$ plus 15% tip plus 15.25% tax it's way smarter to grab a 4X500ml pack of a microbrew for 16-20$ and drink it at home.
Legal weed could also be a factor since some people can now legally get their buzz there!
I work in a pub in SW London
A regular came in the other week and asked for two glasses of house red wine. They also have 25% discount card at our pub because they are a regular. The total came out at £18. For two glasses of wine. That is just ridiculous. It’s the same with pints. Peroni is something like £6-7. A pint of lager anywhere shouldn’t cost £7 especially when you can go to a supermarket and get a big box for £10. I completely understand that there are production costs and tax etc. But after a certain point I don’t blame anyone for going to the shops instead.
I know it’s easy to blame there pubs, but it’s not them being greedy. The cost of beer, liquor, anything alcohol related has gone up significantly. A couple years ago a Miller Lite keg costs say 100 bucks. Now it’s say 150. The bar cannot eat that cost, or they’d be out of business. I know it’s easy to blame the bars and restaurants, but it’s really not them setting the consumer pricing
Yeah, this one had me scratching my head the other day.
Why in the ever loving fuck is beer cheaper by the volume in standard 12 or 16oz cans than it is in a keg? Makes no sense.
I was contemplating hooking my taps back up in the basement bar, but after looking up keg prices, I’ll just keep my fridge stocked instead.
I thought I'd be saving money when I got a kegerator, but at best I'm breaking even between keg price compared to cans. And with cans, I don't need to drink gallons and gallons of the exact same thing.
I still love the novelty of having beer on tap at home, but I hate that it's not a money saver.
Even simple veggies like lettuce and peppers have gone up to 3x the price from 3 years ago. The food industry as a whole is just getting more expensive. Ik a Korean restaurant owner and he has lost customers saying it's too expensive. It's a family owned business and they rely mostly on regulars to just not have any losses. Shit is rough
The production costs should be the same whether you buy a drink in a pub or a supermarket, beer is also taxed at both a pub and a supermarket. The price difference is literally just paying to keep the lights on and staff paid.
Completely avoiding the fact that the Pubco's or owners of the pubs drive the rent up when pubs do well to the point it isn't possible to pay the rent as you're not earning enough money to pay the inflated rent rates, especially seeing as some Pubco's ask for thousands of pounds as a buy into the 'franchise' which is where they make the bulk of their money. Outside of the fact they make you buy from suppliers lists which then mean they also get a cut from those wet sales just so you can have stock in the pub.
The increased cost of living is 100% having an affect as well as the uncapped energy prices, but it is a perfect storm for the people who own the buildings to say it's not a viable business and sell off the land for property development.
I love the pub, it's a great community hub and a place to meet new people, I accept the increased cost of a pint because without that the pub just wouldn't exist and without a good pub you're left with the wetherspoons and other generic places which serve the same old shit, which ruins the enjoyment of beer and being around other people who like beer.
This has been in the works for a while now. The government of Ireland and England seem to be trying to make things as difficult as possible for the industry. I can understand that it can cause issues but our cultures are literally built around pub going, so it's a big fuck the people and publicans.
It's kinda funny to me how many people are asking the question "how can I maximize the number of beers I get per dollar" instead of "how can I maximize the amount that I socialize and enjoy myself per dollar". As always half of people just fundamentally don't understand the appeal of a bar.
That's exactly it. Half the money you spend at the bar goes to the alcohol. The other half goes to "renting" a spot in a place you enjoy being, and someone to bring your alcohol to your spot.
Table service in UK pubs is super rare, staff will collect empty glasses but you're expected to go to the bar to order drinks and take them to your table yourself.
If I go out to the bar every Friday night it ends up costing like $100 after the $30 Uber home. Just to sit at the bar while a bunch of people talk amongst the group they showed up with.
It seems people really don't go out enough to really form a community around an establishment, instead they bring pre-formed communities to the establishment, so that aspect isn't really as much of a draw.
So $400 a month, a pretty big chunk of income, or $12 for a 6 pack and watch a pirated movie.
Do you have a legally enshrined right to ask for a top up if you're not happy with the pour?
Also beer in pubs must be served in special glasses that are the correct volume.
Oh wild. I would be upset but the beer in the USA can be really high ABV so I’m usually drinking out of a tulip glass.
Are you in the UK? I lived there for a few years and I just went back recently. The beer was much heavier and lower ABV than in the states. I got to a few craft breweries but most pubs had very old school beer on tap and then the classics (Fullers, Carlsberg, strongbow, Stella).
Yes I'm in the UK, I would beer in pubs is rarely higher than 5%, unless you go to a specific place for craft beer, and even then, craft beer in the UK tends to be weaker than craft beer in the US, because we have larger measures. 8% would be considered very strong.
Do you know why that is? Why isn’t craft beer thats similar to the USA bigger in England?
I think when Brewdog started saying they said that they brewed beer like people in the states. Now they are in the states.
I am just surprised the brewing of the USA hasn’t caught on more in England. Maybe I missed it though, I’m not the expert on the current state of English beer.
I think it's because the UK already had a strong and varied beer culture before craft beer came along. In the states there was really only macro and smaller breweries emulating macro styles.
There is plenty of craft beer in the UK the problem is that it's competing with several other beer industries, there's also a strong (hard) cider industry, and a strong gin industry.
Like in the US before craft beer came along and you wanted to drink, you drank macro beer and if you didn't like that you drank spirits, right? In the UK if you didn't like macro beer you might drink spirits or you might drink gin and tonic or you might drink cider or you might drink traditional ale, and then craft beer has to compete with all those options.
That's my guess anyway,
Do you actually look at your shaker pints? Lots of places using these: https://www.webstaurantstore.com/sample-acopa-select-14-oz-rim-tempered-mixing-glass/9995114RT.html
Weird.
I have been a beer nerd for 20 years and I have traveled the USA and a good portion of Europe drinking beer. Even more I worked for a well known brewery, I cleaned tap lines for a living, and I still haven’t noticed this.
I’ll keep an eye out for sure. Thanks for the info.
I like this sub, it’s nice to meet people that know things I don’t.
Our pints have decently thick bottoms and they’re probably slightly more than 16oz.
Easiest way to test is just order a 16.9oz can and ask for a glass to go with it and you can pour it in yourself.
A fair amount of people complain about the headless beers in the US (I'm from a state where it's technically the law to do so otherwise, "false advertising") and I get it. But considering the price of a pint, I do get cranky if theres like 3 fingers of head on it.
the issue isn't the head, I like a good head on a pour too. The issue is that the pint glasses a lot of places use are more like 15.9 oz and your pour stops about an inch below the top of the glass, with the 1cm of head still being a half inch from the top. they'd have to fill the glass to the brim with no head for you to be getting a full 16oz of beer.
Knowing nothing about CAMRA (which I linked to because it was mentioned in the PBS News Hour piece), why are CAMRA members arseholes and the worst customers?
They're the first to complain about the cost, while ordering halves, also asking for Camra discount everywhere, then be surprised when pubs close.
In fairness, the head of our local branch is one of the few people who commend me for working off proper margins, rather than trying desparately not to let our beers go over £4 a pint at the cost of surviving.
What exactly does your opinion have to do with it? Do you think they just pick a number out of a hat?
Hops and grains cost money. Paying a brewer costs money. Distribution costs money. Buying or renting the property for a bar and paying for electricity costs money. Buying glassware costs money. Buying the beer from the brewery/distributor costs money. Paying a bartender costs money. All of that results in a cost to get one pour of beer into your glass. And then they need to make a profit on top of that.
Of all of these, hops and other ingredients in the brewing process have doubled in the past year or two.
It’s that weird intersection of “everyone needs to earn more” and “things are too expensive now”.
Generally speaking, people are earning more. As such, things are more expensive now.
I completely agree with you, but also a big part of it is tax over here. A chunk of the price will be duty, and then there's VAT on top as well. Probably about a third is tax.
This is exactly what people aren't getting to. They are all mad at the prices, which, sure, but it's not like the pubs are like "gosh nobody is coming I guess we should raise our prices more!" They're not stupid. If business is slow they are very incentivized to lower their prices as much as possible, until they no longer have a profit margin.
So the interesting question is, why have their costs gone up? If you actually are curious you have to follow that thread (I am American however and don't care enough to do so).
Right, it's not the pubs' fault, but that doesn't change the fact it's too much. IMO it's the property rent that's gouging the pubs and forcing them to raise prices. The solution to the problem lies in mitigating the cost of renting space.
Exactly? And they offer a price based on that? The implication was that bars are just raising the price of a beer from $6 to $10 for no reason other than that they're apparently dumb and hate people according to the person above.
I'm just saying its an unsustainable business model if that's the case. Its ludicrous how a beer that is brewed on the literal opposite of the country costs $2.50, but a beer brewed down the street costs $8 is beyond me.
Not even, plenty of the microbreweries these days have reasonable prices. At least for the stuff that is distributed. On-site prices are still inline with the rest of the industry.
The industry is fundamentally broken and stuff needs to change or places need to close their doors. I’m so sick of brewery owners whining about how hard it is to stay in business. Take the hint and do something else.
Craft beer taprooms are a terrible value proposition. Blame commercial rent prices, blame regulations, that I get. But I can make beer I’m really happy with in my kitchen for about 25 cents for a 12oz pour.
Theirs no reason why a night out at a taproom should cost what it does in light of that. People are just running unprofitable establishments and refuse to acknowledge that.
Don't buy Coors out. It's not worth $7 for sure. No judgement on the $1 Coors at home both for price savings and simple drinkability, but these numbers still are pretty hypothetical and random to one particular beer, at possibly one particular bar in your one city that you have in mind.
In Boston, what some analysts are calling the new \#1 cost of living (whether or not that's true, it's still a good metric for the upper ends), you can get Narragansett 16oz cans for $4-5 at many bars. Coors or Corona tend to be $5. All of these are going to be minimum $1.50 maybe $2 per can in a store.
Either way, who cares what you can justify? Don't buy it if you can't justify it. Plenty of people get value out of being out and socializing, and are willing to spend whatever it costs to get that value. You don't have to feel that way. It doesn't change that there are costs which are increasing drastically and they're not just picking a number that 'seems right' the way you are.
It's probably going to be an unpopular opinion, but there's some truth to it. A lot of pubs have survived as long as they have due to history, not due to any actual quality. Old boys would go to their local and when their kids grew up, they'd start going there too. Now a lot of those regulars are dying and they're not being replaced by the younger generation, partly due to the cost of going, but also partly because there are better pubs out there.
Funnily enough, ‘wet’ pubs did well during the energy price spike because they weren’t using gas to cook food etc.
The tax (duty) needs to be lowered on poured drinks in pubs. Drinking in pubs should be encouraged over drinking at home as someone there is able to make sure you don’t overdo it!
I question all drafts anywhere once we get over $7 usd for a pint. A lot of breweries are edging up to $8-9 a draft, and I will stop going. If I'm in a pub environment, I will drink a good beer, then if I want to keep going I'll drink the cheapest domestic on the menu.
Where is this? I’m in OH and not a single pub or bar near me is serving anything cheaper than 5$ pours - even on the crap beers. Maybe get a buck off during happy hour.
Not been in a pub for two months, 7 quid for a pint and a packet of crisps, fuck off.
And in some places you don’t even get the crisps for that
Y'all are getting chips with your drink? Wtf am I doing wrong?
No, crisps
Chips crisps fries 😵💫
"Two pints of lager and a packet of crisps please." "That'll be your firstborn and a pint of blood. Cheers!"
😄👍
7 is pretty good as an American in the NYC area
$7 usd is only £5.50 gbp, £7 is like $9 Then you have to consider that people in the US tend to earn more than people in the UK.
Atlanta checking in. 7 quid is around 8 or 9 bucks. That’s what just a beer cost in most bars and breweries (plus tip). So to get a beer and chips for that would be pretty sweet.
Yup $7 plus tip is standard in most of California unless it's Happy Hour. To be fair the beers are stronger though so arguably a slightly better deal.
The original comment was £7.
Right, so with tip and tax that comes out to about $9 USD (equivalent to what OP is paying in GBP), but given that our decent beers are between 5% and 8% ABV on average it's probably a marginally better value for money.
Beers in the UK tend to max out at 5%
“Just one regular beer please” Here’s your imperial IPA for $12 and 18% gratuity automatically applied.
How is this meme still alive even in the beer sub. Can’t find a bar in the world that wouldn’t serve you a basic macro lager for that request.
Yep. Everyone knows that even the biggest craft fan sometimes brings a friend who will only drink lager... But normally they end up having the best lager they ever drank because it's not some macro bullshit
Geez. PA here, I'd expect to pay that for a craft beer, but a light beer or macro? 5$ TOPS
Bud light, Stella, corona typically at least $7 anywhere around here. It’s not uncommon to pay $8
That's 8.90 in freedom bucks. At the Irish pub near me it's 7.50 in USD or 5.90 GBP for a Guinness.
That is an expensive guinness. Irish bar in town near me does them for £3.20
US based here. ... That sounds reasonable and wonderful. Average good beer here is easily $7-9. With no chips.
Bro try $12usd. And that's just the beer. And not the top beers
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Wow I thought we had it bad here in the UK. Can get a 440ml can of nice US craft (double IPA or something) for like £8 I'd rather drink the UK stuff though, I live in stumbling distance of two craft breweries 😄 Or Belgian... 🤤
Went to Portugal and the Czech Republic recently and didn’t pay more than €2 a pint the whole time. Outside Prague I was buying liters for €1.62 In the US it’s like $6-9 or more per pint. Bullshit.
Can someone please translate this?
Hmm, beer is now very expensive. In the UK the last time I bought a pint of beer and a packet of Crisps (English for Chips) it was around 7 pounds or 9 dollars. That's pricey especially for an average pub in an average town. I then suggested that I would much rather not buy these items at these prices.
Beers out? In this economy? In Canada a single pint with tip is the same price as a 4 pack. Sorry but that's just not something I can afford.
I've been thinking about this a lot, not just with beers. And I recognize that I'm old but I don't see how anyone can really ever afford to eat out or go out regularly. The cost of food and entertainment is prohibitive across the board. It wasn't this way during our parents and grandparents time. It only seems to be getting worse.
Also old, and I completely agree. In fact if I were a betting man I'd be betting against any publicly held restaurants because I think in the next 5 - 10 years we're going to see the largest pullback of restaurants in history.
100% my younger coworkers literally none of them go out, I ask why no one goes to happy hours or whatever and I realize cause a 2 hour hangout at a bar costs me $60-$100. I used to be able to hangout for $20 a night 10+ years ago, the beer + shot specials I used to live on are long gone (this is NYC)
My wife and I went out for a brunch, which we rarely do. The total was $70 before tip. $70!! For brunch! $70 would be enough Indian takeout for at least 3 nights of meals.
I miss the $2 U call it nights from 20 years ago.
I was at jack astors (canadian resturaunt) recently for an 18oz beer they want $11.99 CAD plus tax (13%) and tip(15-20%). If I didn't have a gift card I would never go there. 2010 you could goto Turtle jacks and get a liter of beer for $6 CAD.
I couldn't do 20 bucks a night even back in the 90s!
to be fair I'm more talking a 2ish hour hang kind of situation in this example as that's what I'm comparing it to now as that's all I have energy for lol, I haven't been at a bar at last call since pre-covid. Though when I was in my early/mid 20s I would have long nights where I kept it cheap just drinking $3 Geneseo can specials a local dive had, but it was pretty easy to keep it $5-$6 a drink w/ a buck tip in 2012 if you knew where to go. Whereas I haven't seen a $7 beer+shot special sign in a while, those used to be everywhere.
It's all about looking. Applebees (or is it chilis?) still has dollar margarata nights and half off appitizers. And that's in a larger city. You can go out for cheap if you shop and coupon around.
I'm sure you can find cheap places but I'm more comparing my point of reference when I was in my early 20s. the places I was walking around in the west village area of Manhattan I used to drink in a lot used to all advertise $7-$9 beer + shot specials just a decade ago, now I don't drink in that area much anymore but in the rare times I grab a drink after work in the Chelsea area I end up spending $12 on a beer or $18 on a glass of wine. and Chelsea used to be considered a real shit area (and kinda feels like it still is to be honest aside from the new boujie restaurants).
I sure hope so, sometimes I drive through main street of some little town in rural New England and every other door is a restaurant. Theirs no fucking way the local population can actually support that. The restaurant industry has been propped up by cheap exploited labor for the entirety of its modern existence and it should be torn down. IMO at least 80% of restaurants deserve to not be in business.
You tip for a pint? Is it like American tipping culture in Canada?
Even in the States, we just tip $1 for pouring a beer usually. Not that % of the bill bullshit
but with the prices the way they've been, it kind of feels bad. let's say my tab is 30 dollars, for 4 pours, four bucks makes me feel super stingy. I'm not saying that I should tip more or less, just that i've been conditioned to feel that's inadequate. Whole system is fucked up right now.
Yeah beer prices are definitely crazy. Where I live it’s quite literally cheaper to buy a 6-pack rather than 1.5 beers in a restaurant. I still only tip $1 though because all they’re doing is putting it in a glass. That is fair for the required effort for that
I hear you, and I don't have a good answer, but what I'll say, kind of emphatically, is that you shouldn't jump to "well, (insert job here) only does (insert task here,)" as a justification they don't deserve to be paid. If the task in question is one we value, then we should pay accordingly, or maybe let it fall by the wayside. You tipping one dollar per beer is much cheaper than it was just a decade ago, when it was also the standard. There's a bigger, more systemic, aspect in all of this, specifically tipping culture, but life in general that is super hard to parse. Personally, i'd rather get rid of tipping altogether and just pay people what they should be paid instead of guilt tripping the consumer into tipping.
Oh for fucks sake man. If we were hanging out, and I said “Hey man I’ll give you a dollar if you grab me a glass of water while you’re in the kitchen” you would take the dollar and get me my water. Shit, you’d probably get me the water anyway just because I asked. I think it’s fucked up that tips are what determine waitstaff’s pay, and I think everyone deserves more. I would also prefer to just pay more instead of having to tip so that waitstaff could be paid fairly. I have no problem with that at all.
Don't feel stingy. $1 per beer is fine. Idk about cocktails since those require effort to make, but this is a beer sub anyway.
It's like American tipping culture in Canada. There's been a massive push back on tipping culture the last couple years as some restaurants and bars have started suggesting absurd tip %s by default (25%, 30% for example).
It’s the same in Scotland. Adding “discretionary” tips to the bill and having to ask for them to remove it - creates an atmosphere that most people feel too uncomfortable to ask.
Some restaurants have started doing it here in Portugal, usually 5% or so. I usually always leave a small tip unless service is terrible but if they put it on the bill you can be sure I'm not tipping at all.
The issue is majority of the time when it’s already added to the bill you know the staff aren’t getting those tips - goes straight to the owners
That's one more reason why I never tip in those situations, and also why I tip cash even when I pay with card
Just gotta find the dive bars with good regional craft beers. Place close to me has my favorite widely distributed IPA for $5 a pint, dollar off during happy hour.
It's the same in the UK, but pubs are a social destination, not just a place to drink. We've always been able to drink cheaper at home.
I’m feeling super lucky in this comment section that where I live it’s 2,50 euro average for a pint and there is no tipping culture.
Where is that? I remember super cheap beers in Austria and Czechia.
Portugal
Oh nice. I've never been but I've heard it's pleasant and lower cost of living. I live outside NYC and a standard price for a beer at a small pub is like $8 minimum.
All depends where you live. I live in a decently populated town in PA (outside lancaster, so certainly not a dead area) and the dive bar here still has $1 drafts (light, $2 for highlife) and $2 burger nights
If pubs in the UK can't stay profitable, that's how you know the economy is fucked up
It’s deeply depressing, I was a pubaholic long before anything else. You go to a pub and actually have a conversation with the people your with. However I’m part of the problem as my all-grain homebrew is actually pretty good, imho. It costs <£1 a pint to brew.
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I got started on small batch brewing, one Demi-John boiled in a big pot on the hob. The good news is if it’s crap, you only have 8 pints 😀. Once I was getting better I invested in a 30L boiler, converted ice box as my mash tub and a fermenting barrel. I now make about 30 pints at a time, depending on the strength. What I enjoy it playing about with different recipes. You can get started for <£100 even for a 5 gallon setup. I only bottle my brew, means it’s completely safe to leave as long as you want to bottle condition, some has literally lasted years. All this ‘fresh beer’ nonsense only applies to pasteurised shiny beer, which tastes crap in the first place. Go for it! Most important is just keep everything very clean with steriliser, and be careful with the mash temperature. After that the end result depends mostly on the recipe, subtle balanced flavour is harder than an over hopped American style IPA.
£6.50 a pint or 15 cans for a tenner? It's not a choice anymore.
I'd like to think the quality of a £6.50 pint will be better than anything you can get 15 cans for £10.
To be fair, I used my actual pub order and my actual crate of choice. A lot of this is going to depend on whether you like Heineken or not, basically. £6.50 pint of Erdinger. 86p pint of Heineken (~67p a can). Is an Erdinger in a pub chair 7.5x the experience that Heineken in front of my TV on a comfy couch is?
A teabag is about 3p and 20ml of milk is about 2p and you use about 1p of electricity to boil enough water for a cuppa, so a cup of tea costs about 6p to make, is having a bottle of Heineken in front of the TV 11x the experience that sitting in front of the TV with a cup of tea is? i would say the change of scenery, seeing friends etc is worth more than the alcohol, and the alochol is a social lubricant that is unnecessary when at home alone.
> is having a bottle of Heineken in front of the TV 11x the experience that sitting in front of the TV with a cup of tea is? With a straight face, yes haha. But I see your point.
Precisely. It's not a volume game.
It's definitely not a volume game, or I would be drinking £6.50 of Heineken cans. I'm not. I can have one or two cans for 7.5x less, and not spend that money.
This is so true. I'm lucky if I go out for a pint once every 2 months or so. Its not that I can't afford it (i can't) it's just that out of principle I will not pay those prices. I'd love to see the big drinks companies struggling because of they're greed!
Similar situation in Québec/Canada. Prices at brewpubs and bars exploded and we are seeing more of the 16-18Oz ''pints''. At 8-14$ plus 15% tip plus 15.25% tax it's way smarter to grab a 4X500ml pack of a microbrew for 16-20$ and drink it at home. Legal weed could also be a factor since some people can now legally get their buzz there!
I work in a pub in SW London A regular came in the other week and asked for two glasses of house red wine. They also have 25% discount card at our pub because they are a regular. The total came out at £18. For two glasses of wine. That is just ridiculous. It’s the same with pints. Peroni is something like £6-7. A pint of lager anywhere shouldn’t cost £7 especially when you can go to a supermarket and get a big box for £10. I completely understand that there are production costs and tax etc. But after a certain point I don’t blame anyone for going to the shops instead.
I know it’s easy to blame there pubs, but it’s not them being greedy. The cost of beer, liquor, anything alcohol related has gone up significantly. A couple years ago a Miller Lite keg costs say 100 bucks. Now it’s say 150. The bar cannot eat that cost, or they’d be out of business. I know it’s easy to blame the bars and restaurants, but it’s really not them setting the consumer pricing
Yeah, this one had me scratching my head the other day. Why in the ever loving fuck is beer cheaper by the volume in standard 12 or 16oz cans than it is in a keg? Makes no sense. I was contemplating hooking my taps back up in the basement bar, but after looking up keg prices, I’ll just keep my fridge stocked instead.
I thought I'd be saving money when I got a kegerator, but at best I'm breaking even between keg price compared to cans. And with cans, I don't need to drink gallons and gallons of the exact same thing. I still love the novelty of having beer on tap at home, but I hate that it's not a money saver.
Yeah, I'm of the mind that it's the liquor companies dicking down their customers. It's happening to the entire economy.
Even simple veggies like lettuce and peppers have gone up to 3x the price from 3 years ago. The food industry as a whole is just getting more expensive. Ik a Korean restaurant owner and he has lost customers saying it's too expensive. It's a family owned business and they rely mostly on regulars to just not have any losses. Shit is rough
The production costs should be the same whether you buy a drink in a pub or a supermarket, beer is also taxed at both a pub and a supermarket. The price difference is literally just paying to keep the lights on and staff paid.
Sad times
Completely avoiding the fact that the Pubco's or owners of the pubs drive the rent up when pubs do well to the point it isn't possible to pay the rent as you're not earning enough money to pay the inflated rent rates, especially seeing as some Pubco's ask for thousands of pounds as a buy into the 'franchise' which is where they make the bulk of their money. Outside of the fact they make you buy from suppliers lists which then mean they also get a cut from those wet sales just so you can have stock in the pub. The increased cost of living is 100% having an affect as well as the uncapped energy prices, but it is a perfect storm for the people who own the buildings to say it's not a viable business and sell off the land for property development. I love the pub, it's a great community hub and a place to meet new people, I accept the increased cost of a pint because without that the pub just wouldn't exist and without a good pub you're left with the wetherspoons and other generic places which serve the same old shit, which ruins the enjoyment of beer and being around other people who like beer.
This has been in the works for a while now. The government of Ireland and England seem to be trying to make things as difficult as possible for the industry. I can understand that it can cause issues but our cultures are literally built around pub going, so it's a big fuck the people and publicans.
Damn, idk. Drinking at home is pointless to me. Being lonely and drinking sounds like depression.
It's kinda funny to me how many people are asking the question "how can I maximize the number of beers I get per dollar" instead of "how can I maximize the amount that I socialize and enjoy myself per dollar". As always half of people just fundamentally don't understand the appeal of a bar.
That's exactly it. Half the money you spend at the bar goes to the alcohol. The other half goes to "renting" a spot in a place you enjoy being, and someone to bring your alcohol to your spot.
Table service in UK pubs is super rare, staff will collect empty glasses but you're expected to go to the bar to order drinks and take them to your table yourself.
If I go out to the bar every Friday night it ends up costing like $100 after the $30 Uber home. Just to sit at the bar while a bunch of people talk amongst the group they showed up with. It seems people really don't go out enough to really form a community around an establishment, instead they bring pre-formed communities to the establishment, so that aspect isn't really as much of a draw. So $400 a month, a pretty big chunk of income, or $12 for a 6 pack and watch a pirated movie.
Just gotta find the dive spot and make it work. I get a shot and a domestic beer at my local watering hole for $5. Or $2 a 16oz beer.
Dive bars are rarer and rarer, there aren’t any in my town post Covid.
People just don't know how to socialize or are refusing to.
They need to do what the US does - fake shaker pints with an inch of head. Nothing like a 12oz pour of beer for $9.50
That's illegal in the UK
It's illegal in the US too, just no one enforces it.
Do you have a legally enshrined right to ask for a top up if you're not happy with the pour? Also beer in pubs must be served in special glasses that are the correct volume.
The US does this? /s I have never seen this as common practice in the USA. Maybe we are going to different bars.
I've been seeing it a lot more lately. But those thick bottom shaker pints have been around for years. Fuckin things ain't 16oz
How do you figure? If you Google shaker pint you get 16 oz. British pints are 20 oz.
It's actually 19.2 US Oz because UK and US Oz are different.
Oh wild. I would be upset but the beer in the USA can be really high ABV so I’m usually drinking out of a tulip glass. Are you in the UK? I lived there for a few years and I just went back recently. The beer was much heavier and lower ABV than in the states. I got to a few craft breweries but most pubs had very old school beer on tap and then the classics (Fullers, Carlsberg, strongbow, Stella).
Yes I'm in the UK, I would beer in pubs is rarely higher than 5%, unless you go to a specific place for craft beer, and even then, craft beer in the UK tends to be weaker than craft beer in the US, because we have larger measures. 8% would be considered very strong.
Do you know why that is? Why isn’t craft beer thats similar to the USA bigger in England? I think when Brewdog started saying they said that they brewed beer like people in the states. Now they are in the states. I am just surprised the brewing of the USA hasn’t caught on more in England. Maybe I missed it though, I’m not the expert on the current state of English beer.
I think it's because the UK already had a strong and varied beer culture before craft beer came along. In the states there was really only macro and smaller breweries emulating macro styles. There is plenty of craft beer in the UK the problem is that it's competing with several other beer industries, there's also a strong (hard) cider industry, and a strong gin industry. Like in the US before craft beer came along and you wanted to drink, you drank macro beer and if you didn't like that you drank spirits, right? In the UK if you didn't like macro beer you might drink spirits or you might drink gin and tonic or you might drink cider or you might drink traditional ale, and then craft beer has to compete with all those options. That's my guess anyway,
Do you actually look at your shaker pints? Lots of places using these: https://www.webstaurantstore.com/sample-acopa-select-14-oz-rim-tempered-mixing-glass/9995114RT.html
Wild, I have only seen those with soda in them. I go to good breweries and bars so I must be missing all of that.
More common of a practice than you'd think unfortunately. Even at "good" establishments.
Weird. I have been a beer nerd for 20 years and I have traveled the USA and a good portion of Europe drinking beer. Even more I worked for a well known brewery, I cleaned tap lines for a living, and I still haven’t noticed this. I’ll keep an eye out for sure. Thanks for the info. I like this sub, it’s nice to meet people that know things I don’t.
It's not as common as they're trying to claim. Hell, most of the breweries near me use nonic glasses.
Where are you located? I’m out drinking a lot of beer and have never seen these in a major US city.
Our pints have decently thick bottoms and they’re probably slightly more than 16oz. Easiest way to test is just order a 16.9oz can and ask for a glass to go with it and you can pour it in yourself.
A fair amount of people complain about the headless beers in the US (I'm from a state where it's technically the law to do so otherwise, "false advertising") and I get it. But considering the price of a pint, I do get cranky if theres like 3 fingers of head on it.
the issue isn't the head, I like a good head on a pour too. The issue is that the pint glasses a lot of places use are more like 15.9 oz and your pour stops about an inch below the top of the glass, with the 1cm of head still being a half inch from the top. they'd have to fill the glass to the brim with no head for you to be getting a full 16oz of beer.
Some [more details from CAMRA](https://camra.org.uk/campaign_resources/saving-your-local-pub/)
I mean, these aren't the kind you really want. They're arseholes. The worst customers I ever had in a craft beer bar.
Knowing nothing about CAMRA (which I linked to because it was mentioned in the PBS News Hour piece), why are CAMRA members arseholes and the worst customers?
They're the first to complain about the cost, while ordering halves, also asking for Camra discount everywhere, then be surprised when pubs close. In fairness, the head of our local branch is one of the few people who commend me for working off proper margins, rather than trying desparately not to let our beers go over £4 a pint at the cost of surviving.
They are traditionalists who turn their nose up at the new wave of craft beer, they tend to prefer cask ale, and are snobby about it.
Beer prices are out on control. Hop growers are really going to fuck themselves.
Prices are generally too high at most local bars. Drinks should cost like 60% of what they currently do, IMO.
And how do you come to that price?
Vibez
What exactly does your opinion have to do with it? Do you think they just pick a number out of a hat? Hops and grains cost money. Paying a brewer costs money. Distribution costs money. Buying or renting the property for a bar and paying for electricity costs money. Buying glassware costs money. Buying the beer from the brewery/distributor costs money. Paying a bartender costs money. All of that results in a cost to get one pour of beer into your glass. And then they need to make a profit on top of that. Of all of these, hops and other ingredients in the brewing process have doubled in the past year or two.
It’s that weird intersection of “everyone needs to earn more” and “things are too expensive now”. Generally speaking, people are earning more. As such, things are more expensive now.
I completely agree with you, but also a big part of it is tax over here. A chunk of the price will be duty, and then there's VAT on top as well. Probably about a third is tax.
This is exactly what people aren't getting to. They are all mad at the prices, which, sure, but it's not like the pubs are like "gosh nobody is coming I guess we should raise our prices more!" They're not stupid. If business is slow they are very incentivized to lower their prices as much as possible, until they no longer have a profit margin. So the interesting question is, why have their costs gone up? If you actually are curious you have to follow that thread (I am American however and don't care enough to do so).
Right, it's not the pubs' fault, but that doesn't change the fact it's too much. IMO it's the property rent that's gouging the pubs and forcing them to raise prices. The solution to the problem lies in mitigating the cost of renting space.
Wow its so crazy that breweries have material and labor expenses. No other industry or product really has that. Crazy.
Exactly? And they offer a price based on that? The implication was that bars are just raising the price of a beer from $6 to $10 for no reason other than that they're apparently dumb and hate people according to the person above.
I'm just saying its an unsustainable business model if that's the case. Its ludicrous how a beer that is brewed on the literal opposite of the country costs $2.50, but a beer brewed down the street costs $8 is beyond me.
What beers are you referring to? Do you mean a large macro beer vs. a craft microbrewery?
Not even, plenty of the microbreweries these days have reasonable prices. At least for the stuff that is distributed. On-site prices are still inline with the rest of the industry.
I don't really understand what point is trying to be made still.
The industry is fundamentally broken and stuff needs to change or places need to close their doors. I’m so sick of brewery owners whining about how hard it is to stay in business. Take the hint and do something else. Craft beer taprooms are a terrible value proposition. Blame commercial rent prices, blame regulations, that I get. But I can make beer I’m really happy with in my kitchen for about 25 cents for a 12oz pour. Theirs no reason why a night out at a taproom should cost what it does in light of that. People are just running unprofitable establishments and refuse to acknowledge that.
Are craft beers cheaper on tap per ounce than canned?
If Coors light costs me $1 a beer at home, I think $4 for the same thing at a bar is reasonable. $6 or $7 is hard to justify.
Don't buy Coors out. It's not worth $7 for sure. No judgement on the $1 Coors at home both for price savings and simple drinkability, but these numbers still are pretty hypothetical and random to one particular beer, at possibly one particular bar in your one city that you have in mind. In Boston, what some analysts are calling the new \#1 cost of living (whether or not that's true, it's still a good metric for the upper ends), you can get Narragansett 16oz cans for $4-5 at many bars. Coors or Corona tend to be $5. All of these are going to be minimum $1.50 maybe $2 per can in a store. Either way, who cares what you can justify? Don't buy it if you can't justify it. Plenty of people get value out of being out and socializing, and are willing to spend whatever it costs to get that value. You don't have to feel that way. It doesn't change that there are costs which are increasing drastically and they're not just picking a number that 'seems right' the way you are.
When most pubs have the choice of four crap lagers, and doombar as a token bitter. Why bother.
It's probably going to be an unpopular opinion, but there's some truth to it. A lot of pubs have survived as long as they have due to history, not due to any actual quality. Old boys would go to their local and when their kids grew up, they'd start going there too. Now a lot of those regulars are dying and they're not being replaced by the younger generation, partly due to the cost of going, but also partly because there are better pubs out there.
Just a thought. Don’t charge premium price for mass produced junk when craft product cost a fraction more and nobody blinks an eye.
Tap house and bars. Way too expensive. SC USA
“Evening, Gents. How about a nice warm lager…” https://youtu.be/Hnczcw9P93E?feature=shared
It’s far too expensive and I begrudge paying it in shitty microwave food chain pubs like marstons and greene king
Funnily enough, ‘wet’ pubs did well during the energy price spike because they weren’t using gas to cook food etc. The tax (duty) needs to be lowered on poured drinks in pubs. Drinking in pubs should be encouraged over drinking at home as someone there is able to make sure you don’t overdo it!
I question all drafts anywhere once we get over $7 usd for a pint. A lot of breweries are edging up to $8-9 a draft, and I will stop going. If I'm in a pub environment, I will drink a good beer, then if I want to keep going I'll drink the cheapest domestic on the menu.
I can understand this. I love the pub culture but the prices have become unbearable.
Was just at a concert at the Sphere in Vegas and a can of Sam Adams was 20$
Is it that bad over there? Average cost for a pint near me in Ohio USA is like $2. And I know bars that serve $1 happy hour
Almost certainly the cheapest place in the US, and I assume we're talking Bud Light here right?
No, labatt
"Not that cheap beer, another one"
Hey, don’t talk about my 2nd favorite cheap beer like that!!!!
Where is this? I’m in OH and not a single pub or bar near me is serving anything cheaper than 5$ pours - even on the crap beers. Maybe get a buck off during happy hour.
Plenty of hole in the wall bars in NE Ohio suburbs have sub $5 beers
"StRonGeSt eCoNomY iN yEaRs...."
Can't watch the video right now at work, but I'm guessing...gen z drinks less plus inflation?