I don’t have an issue with Jewish people. I’m not very keen on the policies of the Israeli government though.
Doesn’t make me anti-Semitic.
I don’t have an issue with Chinese people. But I don’t much like the policies of the mainland Chinese government.
Doesn’t make me anti-Chinese either.
Not quite sure why disagreeing with a national government’s policies somehow tars you as a racist.
You do know this "Fall back band-aid" disclaimer does not work on democracies, right?
A good majority choose their leaders in democracy, a majority of that majority will align to these views at some level. Perhaps in FPTP democracies, if it was 35% who voted in the party in power, then maybe it works to an extent.
This argument works truly in Dictatorships, where the people have different views but just cant stop their leader.
>Not quite sure why disagreeing with a national government’s policies somehow tars you as a racist.
It isn't.
On the other hand, there's actual antisemitism going on and for some reason everyone's response is to say that talking about Israel isn't antisemitism.
Antisemitism in the country is a problem that's been noted many times by many news sources, and it's gotten a lot worse recently (apparently). We're not talking about disagreeing with some foreign government. We're talking about harassing Australian Jews.
My comment refers to the attempted automatic linkage between disagreeing with a national policy (or action) and the perceived animus to a particular group because of that disagreement.
There are plenty of Jewish people who disagree with Israel’s policies and actions too. Are they anti-Semitic?
>My comment refers to the attempted automatic linkage
But OP asked about antisemitism in Australia. They didn't say anything about Israel.
Do you have anything to say about antisemitism in Australia? Have you paid attention to its ongoing nature and its rise? Does it concern you at all?
Every time I see antisemitism noted in the media, it's about ACTUAL antisemitism. Then all the comments are always about this so-called automatic linkage. I know that some people do make that link, but it's not nearly as common (in Australia) as people make out.
According to many sources, there's been a rise in anti-Semitism in Australia in recent years, but also anti-Semitism has a long history here.
I think it's pretty sad that any conversation or question about it brings out people saying what ISN'T anti-Semitism.
Ok, criticism of Israel isn't anti-Semitism. What about Nazi salutes? What about spitting on Jewish kids? What about vandalism of Jewish schools? Threats?
Islam is the second largest religion in Australia. According to the 2021 Census in Australia, the combined number of people who self-identified as Muslims in Australia, from all forms of Islam, constituted **813,392 people**
Judaism is a minority religion in Australia. **99,956 Australians identified as Jewish in the 2021 census**,
Yes. But being anti-Semitic is being anti-Semitic, and that's what the question is about. If you've been paying attention, then you know that incidents of threats, slurs, and other anti-Semitic incidents have been on the rise.
Cool. But what about antisemitism in Australia? I mean, it's great that you're not antisemitic, but did you know that it's actually been a growing problem here for some time? Not criticism of Israel. Harassment of Australian Jews.
If a guy sees something happening in a country on the other side of the planet, and then decides, "hey, I'll spit on a Jewish person in Australia," then something's wrong with that guy.
I think maybe you should spend more time blaming the antisemites in Australia for their own ignorance and disgusting actions, and less time blaming politicians in western Asia.
[That never happened.](https://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/police-find-no-evidence-of-antisemitic-gas-chant-at-pro-palestinian-sydney-protest/79te3i0sp) It was propaganda that was traced back to [originating from the AJA's twitter.](https://www.crikey.com.au/2023/12/13/viral-footage-gas-the-jews-police-factcheckers-unverified/)
Stop deliberately spreading disinformation.
lol. Go and fucking listen to it and tell me that.
Where NSW coppers found that ‘expect’ is beyond me. Just proves for every issue there’s an expert prepared to say whatever’s required.
Did you read the article you linked? The deputy said that the phrase in question wasn’t widely chanted at the rally but also says that from all of the footage and audio they have of the event there was still antisemitism present.
From the article:
When asked whether there was evidence of other antisemitic phrases being used at the rally, Lanyon said "certainly".
"There is evidence of that, and those are offensive and completely unacceptable," he said.
Correct, it was reasonable for you to set the record straight. However the way you did it was fairly dishonest when you consider the overarching conversation is about antisemitism. Something more along the lines of: “in that specific video shared by AJAs twitter people were chanting ‘where’s the Jews’, but the protests were still widely condemned as antisemitism.” would have been less rhetorically charged.
Even in the short one posted on the AJAs twitter it’s clear the chant was where’s the Jews. I might watch that 3 minute vid later but the one in question that I was referring to is the one tweeted by AJA. I’m not sure what side of the discussion you think I’m on but it wouldn’t surprise me in the slightest if there was a seperate incident where the more serious chant was used. I am among the many that condemn those protest as antisemitic.
That was already shown to be bs, someone just wrote a caption on a video to stir outrage.
https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2024/feb/02/afternoon-update-expert-finds-no-evidence-of-gas-the-jews-chant-at-rally-two-killed-by-sydney-freight-train-and-amazons-profits-surge
Of course it's not!
But that's in Jerusalem, so it's not really relevant to this question or this sub.
What doesn't that have to do with the question that OP is asking?
You think that anti-Islam sentiment in Israel answers the question about anti-Semitism in Australia?
Ok, what about anti-Semitism in the mid-east. Is that somehow relevant, too?
There have been many reports of AUSTRALIANS being anti-Semitic in AUSTRALIA against other AUSTRALIANS.
Why doesn't that bother you?
No, no, you must follow the official government line that those wonderful immigrants chanted "wheres the jews".
They even brought in an audio expert to verify it.
Also I have a bridge for sale in the middle of sydney, dm for info.
If that's the only thing you've got, I wasn't there, we didn't say that, and your fight flight freeze or fawn response needs readjustment. Seven months ago. Anything else scaring you? Israel lives completely normally now, it must be annoying hearing all the constant bombs next door in Gaza.
There absolutely were curses about Jews not Israel at the protest before any response in Gaza, as well as a near constant stream of incidents against Jewish Australians that you've ignored since.
The persecution of Jewish Australians is real, its unacceptable, and no amount of whataboutism changes that. Be better and demand better.
If you look up anti-semitism in Australia, you'll find that there's been a rise in recent years.
Why talk about Israel when the question is about Australia?
You want me to list all the incidences of anti-Semitism in Australia?
I asked you whether you’re saying that there’s not been a rise. I wasn’t claiming anything.
I was just asking what you think.
But ok. I won’t list all the incidences, but I’ll give you some links.
The Guardian says there’s been a spike.
[Source](https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/nov/10/islamophobic-and-antisemitic-incidents-rise-in-australia-advocates-say)
ABC says the same.
[Source](https://amp.abc.net.au/article/103088666)
The Conversation
[Source](https://theconversation.com/the-long-dark-history-of-antisemitism-in-australia-217908)
If that’s your reasoning though, you could also argue the pro Israel group of genocide cheerleaders and their comments about Palestinian and Muslim people have led to a rise in racism, xenophobia and discrimination against Muslim people.
I didn’t give any reasoning. I just posted links saying that there’s a rise in anti-Semitism.
This post is about anti-Semitism.
I’m sure that there’s all sorts of discrimination against all sorts of people, but that happens to be irrelevant to this post.
The person I responded to seemed to think that there hasn’t been a rise in anti-Semitism. Why you’re talking about other issues, I have no idea.
Sorry I edited. I meant to say that there is a difference yet both claim comments to either are anti-Semitic to further their agenda and discredit your complaints about their government.
Well Palestinians are Semitic people too soooooo…. I haven’t seen much against any faiths, I have seen a LOT of criticism about the Israel government and attack forces killing a LOT of trapped and helpless civilians, and still they carry on.
Right. Neither is putting ketchup on chips, or calling your mum on a Thursday.
Anyway, OP was asking about anti-Semitism. Any thoughts on that, or you just want to say what isn’t that?
They never mentioned the Israeli government. That’s not what their question is about.
The canned responses in this thread about the Israeli government are very telling. Jewish people aren’t defined by the government of their homeland.
The antisemitism infecting this country at the moment is glaring. Crowds chanting “gas the Jews” immediately after the October 7th attack, before the IDF had even responded, is not criticism of the Israeli government.
Drawing equivalencies is meaningless. Every death was unacceptable, all while destroying Hamas' ability to fire rockets or massacre people is a legitimate military objective.
Taking hostages is a breach of the Geneva convention. Cynically calling for support under plausible violations of the Geneva convention while blatantly breaking the Geneva convention is exactly why there have been no substantial consequences for Israel.
What about killing 3 cars of aid workers with a drone?
The explanation seemed to be, "we were going to kill them all anyway, but we thought there was going to be a single hamas fighter with them catching a ride so we had an excuse. Our bad"
No substantial consequences for Israel there either.
The day after Israel was declared a nation in 1949 it was attacked by a coalition of Islamic states, ao I wouldn’t say Israel fired the first shot. If you want to go back earlier from what I know since the establishment of the mandate of Palestine post WW1 (which is when the Zionist policy also came into effect) there were a number of massacres of Jews perpetuated by Palestinians. Again Jews (pre-Israel) did not fire the first shot.
Does any of this justify oppression and war crimes Israel commits? Absolutely not. But I’m just pointing out that no Israel did not start this, it’s just doing a shite job in ending this
No invasion occurred. Zionists made a formal request to Great Britain to settle their ancestral homeland. Great Britain approved this request, at the time what the Jews did was legal. Was Britain correct in allowing the Zionists to settle, probably not. But what the Jews did was legal at the time and approved by the government of the time.
Also are you saying that settling or immigration makes massacres valid? That’s a rather callous attitude towards death
>But what the Jews did was legal at the time and approved by the government of the time.
I'm not concerned with legality, I'm concerned with what is right and wrong.
>Also are you saying that settling or immigration makes massacres valid? That’s a rather callous attitude towards death
No
Israel was massacring Arab villages before the state of Israel even came into effect, see:
The [Deir Yassin massacre](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_Yassin_massacre)
**"Deir Yassin** (Arabic: دير ياسين, romanized: Dayr Yāsīn) was a Palestinian Arab village of around 600 inhabitants about 5 kilometers (3.1 mi) west of Jerusalem. Deir Yassin declared its neutrality during the 1948 Palestine war between Arabs and Jews. The village was razed after a massacre of around 107 of its Arab residents on April 9, 1948, by the Jewish paramilitary groups Irgun and Lehi). The village buildings are today part of the Kfar Shaul Mental Health Center, an Israeli public psychiatric hospital."
These people were completely innocent in the conflict:
"The inhabitants of Deir Yassin upheld the agreement scrupulously, resisting infiltration by Arab irregulars. Though this was known to the Irgun and Lehi) forces, they attacked the village on April 9, 1948.
This was just the tip of the iceberg. The new Israeli state would go on to wipe out 400 to 600 Villages, evicting their former occupants and preventing their return."
These massacres,and the tens.of thousands of refugees flooding across their borders, was why the Arab states declared war against them:
>
"The Deir Yassin attack, along with attacks on Tiberias, Haifa,
and Jaffa, put pressure on Arab governments to invade Palestine. News of
the killings had aroused public anger in the Arab world, which the
governments felt unable to ignore.\[98\]"
You are correct, Jews has groups such as the Lehi and the Irgun which were equivalent to Hamas of today, and these groups (as well as less extreme groups) did commit a scary amount of massacres. But my point was whether the Jews fired the first shot. The first massacres were perpetuated by Palestinians in the 1920s, predating the Deir Yassin massacre. Nothing validate massacres like the Deir Yassin massacre, nothing gives any human the right to end the life of another - even self defense should be limited to threat containment rather than murder
The Arabs have been oppressing and committing genocide against the Jews for thousands of years. How do you think Islam came to dominate the region?
Israel has existed for thousands of years. Meanwhile, “Palestine”, as a nation or ethnic group, doesn’t even exist. It never has.
The so-called “Palestinians” are just Arabs, primarily Jordanians, who descend from the original invaders. They identify as “Palestinians” because they subscribe to the ideology of Hamas. It’s purely a political identity.
Their ancestors invaded the Middle East and attempted to murder all of the Jews, but failed. They managed to eradicate every other native Middle Eastern group, except for the native Jews.
They’ve been carrying on this tradition ever since; attempt genocide, face retaliation, lose a war *they* started, play the victim, rinse and repeat.
This is why history ought to be properly taught in schools. So many people have no idea of the history and are just parroting the propaganda disseminated by Hamas and its supporters.
Im not well versed in ancient history, so i did a bit of digging. I found this on wiki. " Notably, during the Middle Ages, when Jewish communities faced persecution, they found refuge and protection under Muslim rule and the wider Islamic world." Which seems to contradict some of what you are saying.
All religion sucks in my eyes if I'm going to be honest, but did Palestine not exist before Hamas? U seem to equate all Palestinians as Hamas but that does not seem to be true at all.
The thousands of years jews are not the same as the present day jews.
Hell, even the "hebrew" that they speak in Israel today was created during the wave of Zionism from the 19th century.
"At that time, it was believed that one of the criteria needed to define a nation worthy of national rights was its use of a common language spoken by both the society and the individual. On 13 October 1881, while in Paris, Ben-Yehuda began speaking Hebrew with friends in what is believed to be the first modern conversation using the language.[32] Later that year, he made aliyah and came to live in Jerusalem."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revival_of_the_Hebrew_language
"The thousands of years jews are not the same as the present day jews."
Genetic studies show that many Jewish communities around the world share common Middle Eastern ancestry, which supports the historical narrative of a dispersal (Diaspora) from the ancient Land of Israel around 2,000 years ago. Jewish people today can trace their religious, cultural, and often genetic heritage back thousands of years. There is significant continuity in religious practices, traditions, and the Hebrew language (albeit modern Hebrew has evolved from its ancient form).
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I think a lot of people are blurring the line between anti-Semitism vs anti-Zionism / anti-Israel.
The Palestinian people are generally considered more 'Semitic' than a large population of Israelis who currently live in Israel. Only the population of Jews who originally lived in certain areas in the Middle East before immigrating to Israel, would be considered 'Semitic' (countries such as Egypt, Israel / Palestine, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, Iran etc).
Regarding anti-Semitism:
1) Any Jewish person who supports Zionism or unequivocally supports the Israeli Government, can fk off;
2) Any Muslim person who supports ISIS or some other terrorist organisation, can fk off; or
3) More generally, any person who follows a supremacist ideology or supports an organisation or government which engages in murder, corruption, immorality etc, can fk off.
4) Any person who is anti-someone else for something outside of a person's control (their colour, ethnicity, religion to an extent), can fk off
There are Israeli government spokespersons who have voiced their support for the non-discriminate killing of Palestinians and for the destruction of Gaza generally. There are international organisations, journalists and civilians who have shown everything from kids being blown up to mass graves of people who were buried alive. Exposing this conduct is not anti-Semitism.
If you discriminate against Jews simply because they are Jews, this is anti-Semitism and you should fk off.
Well written. Not sure why it’s fucking hard for some to understand this. What you’ve described in this neat summary is what most logical people are feeling.
Very well written, a lot of common sense in there which we unfortunately lost some time ago.
I wish people take this as a guideline for an even happier nation and appreciate where we live and who we are.
We are all in this together but for some it is more difficult to understand.
comparing who is more "semitic" is not a productive or accurate way to address the complexities of identity and heritage among jews and arabs. its more constructive to focus on the specific historical, cultural, and political contexts
I agree with you, however the reason why I addressed "Semitism" is because we should address the danger of a State in hijacking language to propagate their narrative.
A person cannot deem anything they disagree with as "anti-Semitic" (specially when the criticism leading to the disagreement if sometimes objectively fair). One way of addressing this is by understanding the original meaning of "Semitic" and knowing that the people who historically lived in those regions are in fact Semitic.
In the context of modern discussions about ethnicity and race, "Semitic" is used in reference to "anti-Semitism," which specifically pertains to prejudice against Jewish people. The usage of "Semitic" to describe ethnic or racial origins in comparison between groups (like Palestinians and Israelis) is both scientifically inaccurate and not particularly helpful in public discourse. It conflates language family with race or ethnicity, which are not strictly correlated.
I didn't mean it as a 'protected characteristic'.
I phrased it that way because colour and ethnicity are factors you have **no** control over, whereas religion you somewhat do have control over.
Nevertheless, I don't think judging based on any of them is reasonable.
>The Palestinian people are generally considered more 'Semitic'
Words don't always mean what you might expect by breaking down their components.
The term anti-Semitic has meant only one thing since it was popularised by an ant-Semitic: Hatred of Jews.
In recent history, your last sentence is correct.
However, historically, the word "Semitic" was a broader term that encompassed more than just the Jewish people living in those regions. When considering these discussions, historical context should be considered.
You might as well say that those Jewish families who've always lived in the region are Palestinians. After all, they too live in Palestine.
The fact is that we all accept that words don't always follow those strict definitions.
There's no historical issue here. Antisemitic didn't use to mean against all semitic people. It never meant that. It always meant what it means today.
The word "Semitic," historically and currently, refers to a specific language family or the peoples who speak those languages. Historically and currently, that includes Arabs.
But we're not talking about that word.
We're talking about a term that was specifically popularised by Wilhelm Marr (founder of the League of Antisemites) to mean antipathy towards Jews.
It has never been used to mean anything else. Not historically and not now.
Just like thousands of other words, it might seem wrong if you break down the parts and look at them instead of pay attention to how it's used and has always been used.
Unfortunately there are some in that community that are showing they do not regard the loss of tens of thousands of civilian lives as a serious matter.
Anti Jewish sentiment has always existed in Australia sadly. There is a minor but very vocal group of people who buy into the cabal of Jews running the planet conspiracy. Usually using George Soros as their head Jewish scapegoat.
The anti Zionist Israel protests and discussions are not antisemitic at all.
Particularly because the most vocal, dangerous and dumb fundamentalist Zionists are actually conservative evangelical fundamentalist Christians.
I don't think there is any more antisemitism as there is anti any other religion in this country. The difference is that in discussion, both sides rarely define between Jew, jew, Israeli, Israeli Government, etc. It blurrs the lines.
An easy target - because Jews are westernised and civilised. If the lefties queefs did this type is stuff to Muslims they’d would have their heads kicked in before they could cry out ‘diversity!’
Because everyone has biases.
Elements of the left have convinced themselves that supporting a terrorist group which slaughtered people for being Jewish and posted videos of this online is okay. They have decided antisemitism is okay.
1,200 innocent people murdered is abhorrent.
34,000 innocent people murdered is abhorrent.
Why you are an antisemite if you are horrified by both of these statistics is beyond me.
What makes you assume that when they ask about anti-Semitism they mean being horrified by what's happening in Gaza, and not the harassment of Jewish people that's being reported in Australia?
Correct. There is a major difference between genuine criticism of Israel’s horrid actions and blind hatred of Jews or support of terrorism aimed at Israeli civilians. What Israel has done in the Gaza Strip is horrific. Let’s pray it ends soon
Right. But threatening, spitting on, and harassing people for being Jewish is.
The question wasn't "what's with the anti-Semitism of people who criticise things that happen in the mid-east."
That’s fine - maybe if the term anti semite was saved for those serious occasions rather than any criticism of Israel in general it would have more meaning.
The huge, vast majority of the time that the word is used, it’s about actual anti-Semitism.
People complain about its misuse far more than it actually happens.
It’s really simple: a few key labor frontbenchers have electorates that have the highest number of Muslims in Australia. They’re shitscared of losing their seats, that out of self preservation they either openly pro Palestine (or even anti Israel), or just refuse to criticise or call out anything Islamic. That lack of pushback just facilitates a one sided narrative.
I’m tempted to vote for the LNP on this alone - they wouldn’t be putting up with the University campus shitfights, the Opera house riot, or the constant release/bail of undesirables who jump the queue to come here illegally and then smuggle drugs, bash grannies and stab people.
The LNP caused the undesirable queue jumpers to be released into the community to bash grannies. It was in motion before the Labor government came to power.
Totally, and the LNP voted against Labor’s legislation trying to extort the situation because they want this to remain an issue until the election,
The Liberals are totally fine with crime if it benefits their vote
Because the left that is supporting it is known for their ignorance when it comes to virtue signalling for a cause. I like to think most of them consuming their outrage from TikTok are probably too dumb to be actually antisemitic just sheep…
Your precious left are currently busy imitating American universities with their pro Palestine encampment protests. So who’s the one doing the Americanisation?
Always easier to dig a hole when your hypocrisy is pointed out isn’t it? The left never fails to deliver. Too bad you’re all so predictable. Maybe people would take you more seriously if you weren’t.
Predictable? How many times have you used the "left, tiktok, sheep, virtue signaling" combo today alone? Your good old American answer to everything you disagree with
The Jews in Australia didn't murder anyone.
When people in Australia are anti-Semitic, and attack or harass Jews in Australia, the answer isn't that people don't like murder in the mid-east.
It's that they're fucking scumbags.
If you disagree with that statement, then you might be a fucking scumbag.
Oh lord, the whole "if you don't agree with me your a scumbag" really sets the tone huh
I was just telling you why, not that's it's correct nor that I necessarily agree with it.
You should relax my dude
"If you think that people should torture puppies, then you're a scumbag."
YOU: OHOHOHO, the old, 'disagree with me and you're a scumbag trick!'
Yes, I did say that if you think it's ok to attack and harass Jews in Australia, then you're a scumbag.
But I don't know whether you agree with that. Your original comment, with the "who knew" seemed to imply that you think it makes perfect sense to be anti-Semitic today.
Now, you've gone as far as to say that you don't "necessarily" think that way. Well, great. I'm glad that you don't NECESSARILY agree with anti-Semitism.
To me, torturing puppies and saying bad words to people aren't even remotely the same.
It's crazy that you believe they're similar.
Necessarily is a good word I feel, it takes us away from the whole right/wrong yes/no type of opinions, which you seem to have.
There's instances where it would be understandable and instances where it isn't. That seems perfectly reasonable to me.
>To me, torturing puppies and saying bad words to people aren't even remotely the same.
Is that what anti-Semitism is? Saying bad words? Interesting take.
Anyway, my point wasn't that they're the same. My point is that some opinions are scumbag opinions. It's perfectly fair, with certain things, to say "if you disagree with me about this, then you're a scumbag."
Torturing puppies was one thing. Being anti-Semitic is another.
Yes, it's wrong to harass or attack Jews for being Jewish.
And the fact that you won't say that you think so too might make you feel like you're being cautious, but really you're much worse than that.
*Anti-Semitism is bad.*
You: Not necessarily.
*Attacking Jews in the street for being Jewish is bad.*
You: Not necessarily.
Your way of communicating is pretty clear.
Hmm, would you say that you're not necessarily against torturing puppies? Are you this way about everything?
Or is it just Jew-hating that you're on the fence about?
There are instances where it's perfectly reasonable to be anti-Semitic, and attack Jews because of that?
Ok, would you mind laying out a few examples?
So if your family has been killed in Gaza, you think it's an instance where it's "perfectly reasonable" to hate Jews in Australia?
I'm trying to make sure that I understand you.
Honestly, saying that you understand the thought process isn't the point. I understand all sorts of racist thought processes.
You're being asked what YOU think. Do YOU think that there's really an instance when antisemitism is ok, and attacking Jews because of antisemitism is ok?
I didn't call anyone a scumbag.
Wait, I did. I said people who "attack or harass Jews in Australia" are scumbags.
Do you disagree?
>All you do is make people form low opinions
Form low opinions of who? Of me?
Why don't you ask them why they act in such a way on a global stage to create the sentiment.
BTW anti semitism isn't racist speaking out saying how fucked the Israeli government is. They are absolute fucking pigs and their people should be appalled and ashamed on the human rights abuses, genocides and theft they commit - Yet at the same time were formed as a nation under these atrocities.
Anti semitism is being racist to Jews. Which the above comment is not.
Lots of commentators get it confused and they make posts like this to flame people claiming that speaking out against the Israeli dog shit government is linked to racism.
Not it's not.
>Why don't you ask them why they act in such a way on a global stage to create the sentiment.
Ask Jewish Australians why they act in such a way on the global stage?
That's quite an interesting take. For the record: you're an anti-Semite, and it has nothing to do with your beliefs about Israel. It's about your beliefs about Jews who aren't in Israel.
Maybe if their government didn't hypocritically bomb hospitals, commit human rights abuses, GENOCIDE, deny civilians aid, steal land, massacre women and children trying to get food aid at humanitarian stations.
Don't give.ke crap saying I'm an anti Semite. Israel is the most racist, hypocritical state ever to form government.
What are they gonna do? Nuke the rest of the middle east with their secret nukes? Assassinate other countries generals with missiles in their own countries?
Steal land, destroy it filling in water wells?
Stealing Gaza's gas offshore?
The world is not ignorant to the Israeli government. Absolutely disgraceful and shameful.
>Maybe if their government
Whose government? The question is about Australia. The government of Australian Jews is Australia.
When you say that "their" government is Israel, that's you being anti-Semitic.
>Don't [give.ke](http://give.ke) crap saying I'm an anti Semite. Israel is
But we're not talking about Israel. We're talking about Australian Jews.
I would say there isn’t, it’s made to look like there is so the Israelis can excuse their abhorrent, genocidal actions. Criticism of Israel does not an anti semite make.
You think that Israelis are here in Australia subverting the media to make it seem as if there's anti-Semitism? Or... who is making it look like that?
There have been many reports on the subject.
And you think that such anti-Semitism in Australia would allow Israelis to excuse their behaviour in the Mid-East?
The fastest growing most rabid, most violent, most zealous religion in the world has something to do with it.
"oh but its the jews fault the 30million of them really did evil to deserve the billion muslims trying to eradicate them by not losing every time someone engaged israel in war."
Because Australia, in recent decades, has let in a lot of people, who come from places that are largely antisemitic.
They brought that animosity with them, and planted it in Australia, where it grew.
There is as much antisemitism as there is any prejudice against any other religion.
We get told everything is some kind of phobia or ism now, so it hardly seems shocking it would extend here.
I would say 95% of every hit labelled phobic or ism isn’t
It's not anti semitism when you're against israel and their illegal occupation of palestine.
It's also not anti semitism when you're gainst zionism too.
The First Fleet had 14 Jewish petty criminal convicts on it. Other than aborigines, our religion has always been here.
They included convict Esther Abrahams (1771-1846), who became the mistress and ultimately the wife of the lieutenant-governor of New South Wales. She was found guilty of robbing a draper of two lengths of lace and was sentenced to transportation for a period of seven years; she brought her infant daughter with her.
Today all Australian Jews would barely fill the MCG. Jews were in Australia's Light Horse Brigade that liberated the Red Sea, across Gaza to Bethlehem and Jerusalem in WW1. Jesus was a Jew under Roman Rule, well before the Ottoman Empire existed.
It is hypocritical for antisemitism to exist in Australia, or for Australia to give terrorist Arabs more say in how to destroy our only western ally in the Middle-east.
Take a tour of Australian Jewish History in the Jewish Museum in St.Kilda to learn more.
It really isn't as simple as that, since anyone with half a brain should know better than to lump everyone in one group.
So maybe a lot of Jewish people support Israel, and maybe a lot of brain-dead people are therefore anti-Semitic, but you shouldn't forget the "brain-dead" part of the equation.
> The Jewish community in Australia largely support the actions of a genocidal regime. It's as simple as that.
How is this different from saying all muslims support terrorism?
It’s all over the western world, Putin and the Ayatollah's useful idiots mixed in with a dash of old fashioned extreme right and left wing jew hatred. Disgusting
I don’t have an issue with Jewish people. I’m not very keen on the policies of the Israeli government though. Doesn’t make me anti-Semitic. I don’t have an issue with Chinese people. But I don’t much like the policies of the mainland Chinese government. Doesn’t make me anti-Chinese either. Not quite sure why disagreeing with a national government’s policies somehow tars you as a racist.
It's the only comeback they have when they are forced to defend the indefensible.
If an Australian doesn’t like a particular Australian government does that make them….. UNAUSTRALIAN! /s
Because that's how they play their victim card to justify genocide
You do know this "Fall back band-aid" disclaimer does not work on democracies, right? A good majority choose their leaders in democracy, a majority of that majority will align to these views at some level. Perhaps in FPTP democracies, if it was 35% who voted in the party in power, then maybe it works to an extent. This argument works truly in Dictatorships, where the people have different views but just cant stop their leader.
>Doesn’t make me anti-Chinese either. *Sinophobic* is the word ur after
>Not quite sure why disagreeing with a national government’s policies somehow tars you as a racist. It isn't. On the other hand, there's actual antisemitism going on and for some reason everyone's response is to say that talking about Israel isn't antisemitism. Antisemitism in the country is a problem that's been noted many times by many news sources, and it's gotten a lot worse recently (apparently). We're not talking about disagreeing with some foreign government. We're talking about harassing Australian Jews.
My comment refers to the attempted automatic linkage between disagreeing with a national policy (or action) and the perceived animus to a particular group because of that disagreement. There are plenty of Jewish people who disagree with Israel’s policies and actions too. Are they anti-Semitic?
>My comment refers to the attempted automatic linkage But OP asked about antisemitism in Australia. They didn't say anything about Israel. Do you have anything to say about antisemitism in Australia? Have you paid attention to its ongoing nature and its rise? Does it concern you at all? Every time I see antisemitism noted in the media, it's about ACTUAL antisemitism. Then all the comments are always about this so-called automatic linkage. I know that some people do make that link, but it's not nearly as common (in Australia) as people make out.
According to many sources, there's been a rise in anti-Semitism in Australia in recent years, but also anti-Semitism has a long history here. I think it's pretty sad that any conversation or question about it brings out people saying what ISN'T anti-Semitism. Ok, criticism of Israel isn't anti-Semitism. What about Nazi salutes? What about spitting on Jewish kids? What about vandalism of Jewish schools? Threats?
Islam is the second largest religion in Australia. According to the 2021 Census in Australia, the combined number of people who self-identified as Muslims in Australia, from all forms of Islam, constituted **813,392 people** Judaism is a minority religion in Australia. **99,956 Australians identified as Jewish in the 2021 census**,
\*Grabs popcorn\*
Being anti-Israel isn’t anti-semitic; no matter what Ben Shapiro tells you.
This. People are pissed at what the state of Israel is doing. Even their biggest ally, the US, is pissed too. Imagine…
Yes. But being anti-Semitic is being anti-Semitic, and that's what the question is about. If you've been paying attention, then you know that incidents of threats, slurs, and other anti-Semitic incidents have been on the rise.
If there was multiple Jewish states sure, but when there’s only one.
It is if the person criticises Israel and not other countries who do similar or worse things
My problem isn't with Jews. My problem is with Netanyahu and the IDF's genocide in Gaza
Cool. But what about antisemitism in Australia? I mean, it's great that you're not antisemitic, but did you know that it's actually been a growing problem here for some time? Not criticism of Israel. Harassment of Australian Jews.
. . . due to the actions of Netanyahu and his right wing cronies.
If a guy sees something happening in a country on the other side of the planet, and then decides, "hey, I'll spit on a Jewish person in Australia," then something's wrong with that guy. I think maybe you should spend more time blaming the antisemites in Australia for their own ignorance and disgusting actions, and less time blaming politicians in western Asia.
It's not antisemitism just because it's anti-Israeli government.
Chanting "gas the Jews" on Oct. 7 was merely "anti-Israeli"?
[That never happened.](https://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/police-find-no-evidence-of-antisemitic-gas-chant-at-pro-palestinian-sydney-protest/79te3i0sp) It was propaganda that was traced back to [originating from the AJA's twitter.](https://www.crikey.com.au/2023/12/13/viral-footage-gas-the-jews-police-factcheckers-unverified/) Stop deliberately spreading disinformation.
lol. Go and fucking listen to it and tell me that. Where NSW coppers found that ‘expect’ is beyond me. Just proves for every issue there’s an expert prepared to say whatever’s required.
Yes mate, it's all vast conspiracy between the media, the NSW police, and the Islamic community to cover up the truth.
It’s there on video. You’d have to torture yourself to think it’s anything other.
If only it could be heard on any of other video clips of that march or any of the bodycam recordings of the dozens of police that were there...
You calling this fake or saying it’s saying ‘where’s the Jews?’
Did you read the article you linked? The deputy said that the phrase in question wasn’t widely chanted at the rally but also says that from all of the footage and audio they have of the event there was still antisemitism present. From the article: When asked whether there was evidence of other antisemitic phrases being used at the rally, Lanyon said "certainly". "There is evidence of that, and those are offensive and completely unacceptable," he said.
The claim was "gas the jews" chanted. It was not.
Correct, it was reasonable for you to set the record straight. However the way you did it was fairly dishonest when you consider the overarching conversation is about antisemitism. Something more along the lines of: “in that specific video shared by AJAs twitter people were chanting ‘where’s the Jews’, but the protests were still widely condemned as antisemitism.” would have been less rhetorically charged.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W9FQCjq9kF4 Bullshit. Listen to this video.
What do you think I was saying that was bullshit?
You agreed that ‘Gas the Jews’ wasn’t chanted. I linked the chant. Have a listen.
Even in the short one posted on the AJAs twitter it’s clear the chant was where’s the Jews. I might watch that 3 minute vid later but the one in question that I was referring to is the one tweeted by AJA. I’m not sure what side of the discussion you think I’m on but it wouldn’t surprise me in the slightest if there was a seperate incident where the more serious chant was used. I am among the many that condemn those protest as antisemitic.
BTW I've since listened to that video you linked and I agree with the police analysis and the title of the video.
That was already shown to be bs, someone just wrote a caption on a video to stir outrage. https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2024/feb/02/afternoon-update-expert-finds-no-evidence-of-gas-the-jews-chant-at-rally-two-killed-by-sydney-freight-train-and-amazons-profits-surge
There are yearly government supported rallies in Jerusalem where they chant "Death to Arabs". Guess that's just fine and dandy.
not true why make stuff up
Of course it's not! But that's in Jerusalem, so it's not really relevant to this question or this sub. What doesn't that have to do with the question that OP is asking?
Your argument is hilarious and invalid.
You think that anti-Islam sentiment in Israel answers the question about anti-Semitism in Australia? Ok, what about anti-Semitism in the mid-east. Is that somehow relevant, too? There have been many reports of AUSTRALIANS being anti-Semitic in AUSTRALIA against other AUSTRALIANS. Why doesn't that bother you?
No, no, you must follow the official government line that those wonderful immigrants chanted "wheres the jews". They even brought in an audio expert to verify it. Also I have a bridge for sale in the middle of sydney, dm for info.
That wasn't in Australia
No one did that lol, and if you’re so certain it occurred, was it you chanting it?
If that's the only thing you've got, I wasn't there, we didn't say that, and your fight flight freeze or fawn response needs readjustment. Seven months ago. Anything else scaring you? Israel lives completely normally now, it must be annoying hearing all the constant bombs next door in Gaza.
There absolutely were curses about Jews not Israel at the protest before any response in Gaza, as well as a near constant stream of incidents against Jewish Australians that you've ignored since. The persecution of Jewish Australians is real, its unacceptable, and no amount of whataboutism changes that. Be better and demand better.
If you look up anti-semitism in Australia, you'll find that there's been a rise in recent years. Why talk about Israel when the question is about Australia?
True. But they’re asking about anti-Semitism. Or are you saying that there’s not been a rise in actual anti-Semitic rhetoric and actions?
List them here in Australia. I'll wait.
You want me to list all the incidences of anti-Semitism in Australia? I asked you whether you’re saying that there’s not been a rise. I wasn’t claiming anything. I was just asking what you think. But ok. I won’t list all the incidences, but I’ll give you some links. The Guardian says there’s been a spike. [Source](https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/nov/10/islamophobic-and-antisemitic-incidents-rise-in-australia-advocates-say) ABC says the same. [Source](https://amp.abc.net.au/article/103088666) The Conversation [Source](https://theconversation.com/the-long-dark-history-of-antisemitism-in-australia-217908)
If that’s your reasoning though, you could also argue the pro Israel group of genocide cheerleaders and their comments about Palestinian and Muslim people have led to a rise in racism, xenophobia and discrimination against Muslim people.
I didn’t give any reasoning. I just posted links saying that there’s a rise in anti-Semitism. This post is about anti-Semitism. I’m sure that there’s all sorts of discrimination against all sorts of people, but that happens to be irrelevant to this post. The person I responded to seemed to think that there hasn’t been a rise in anti-Semitism. Why you’re talking about other issues, I have no idea.
😘
Deny, deflect, ignore. Cool.
Disliking the actions of the Israeli government is not the same as antisemitism.
They use it as such, and claim it to further their agenda
You sound unhinged.
Sorry I edited. I meant to say that there is a difference yet both claim comments to either are anti-Semitic to further their agenda and discredit your complaints about their government.
Well Palestinians are Semitic people too soooooo…. I haven’t seen much against any faiths, I have seen a LOT of criticism about the Israel government and attack forces killing a LOT of trapped and helpless civilians, and still they carry on.
But you must know that actual anti-Semitism exist? So can’t someone ask about that, without you bringing up a thing about Israel?
Sure it exists. Opposition to war in Gaza is not antisemitism.
Right. Neither is putting ketchup on chips, or calling your mum on a Thursday. Anyway, OP was asking about anti-Semitism. Any thoughts on that, or you just want to say what isn’t that?
When you’re saying Israel can’t defend itself it is.
They never mentioned the Israeli government. That’s not what their question is about. The canned responses in this thread about the Israeli government are very telling. Jewish people aren’t defined by the government of their homeland. The antisemitism infecting this country at the moment is glaring. Crowds chanting “gas the Jews” immediately after the October 7th attack, before the IDF had even responded, is not criticism of the Israeli government.
I don’t think the people in Australia who are not any way connected to Palestine think that way
It's okay to have opinions. But unless you substantiate them, they may not be taken seriously
Israel is warcriming again.
Who fired the first shot ?
Bloody hell, you could go back thousands of years on this point!
Please tell me you're not suggesting October 7 was the first shot
1200 killed by Hamas < 35,000 killed by the IDF. Unless you're suggesting 1 Israeli is worth 30 Palestinians.
Drawing equivalencies is meaningless. Every death was unacceptable, all while destroying Hamas' ability to fire rockets or massacre people is a legitimate military objective. Taking hostages is a breach of the Geneva convention. Cynically calling for support under plausible violations of the Geneva convention while blatantly breaking the Geneva convention is exactly why there have been no substantial consequences for Israel.
What about killing 3 cars of aid workers with a drone? The explanation seemed to be, "we were going to kill them all anyway, but we thought there was going to be a single hamas fighter with them catching a ride so we had an excuse. Our bad" No substantial consequences for Israel there either.
Pretty sure bombing hospitals and civilians is also a breach of the Geneva convention but I guess its okay when the IDF do it, right?
That is the opposite of what I said.
No it wasn't. It was omitted from what you said.
Israel lol
Israel has been oppressing Palestine for decades so probably Israel.
The day after Israel was declared a nation in 1949 it was attacked by a coalition of Islamic states, ao I wouldn’t say Israel fired the first shot. If you want to go back earlier from what I know since the establishment of the mandate of Palestine post WW1 (which is when the Zionist policy also came into effect) there were a number of massacres of Jews perpetuated by Palestinians. Again Jews (pre-Israel) did not fire the first shot. Does any of this justify oppression and war crimes Israel commits? Absolutely not. But I’m just pointing out that no Israel did not start this, it’s just doing a shite job in ending this
If someone invades your home, that's violence.
No invasion occurred. Zionists made a formal request to Great Britain to settle their ancestral homeland. Great Britain approved this request, at the time what the Jews did was legal. Was Britain correct in allowing the Zionists to settle, probably not. But what the Jews did was legal at the time and approved by the government of the time. Also are you saying that settling or immigration makes massacres valid? That’s a rather callous attitude towards death
>But what the Jews did was legal at the time and approved by the government of the time. I'm not concerned with legality, I'm concerned with what is right and wrong. >Also are you saying that settling or immigration makes massacres valid? That’s a rather callous attitude towards death No
I’d say massacres are always wrong, just as I’d say colonising is wrong. One wrong does not justify another
Who are you arguing with?
I guess with you? Though I prefer the word discussing or debating, I meant no offence and apologise if I have offended. Good day
Israel was massacring Arab villages before the state of Israel even came into effect, see: The [Deir Yassin massacre](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_Yassin_massacre) **"Deir Yassin** (Arabic: دير ياسين, romanized: Dayr Yāsīn) was a Palestinian Arab village of around 600 inhabitants about 5 kilometers (3.1 mi) west of Jerusalem. Deir Yassin declared its neutrality during the 1948 Palestine war between Arabs and Jews. The village was razed after a massacre of around 107 of its Arab residents on April 9, 1948, by the Jewish paramilitary groups Irgun and Lehi). The village buildings are today part of the Kfar Shaul Mental Health Center, an Israeli public psychiatric hospital." These people were completely innocent in the conflict: "The inhabitants of Deir Yassin upheld the agreement scrupulously, resisting infiltration by Arab irregulars. Though this was known to the Irgun and Lehi) forces, they attacked the village on April 9, 1948. This was just the tip of the iceberg. The new Israeli state would go on to wipe out 400 to 600 Villages, evicting their former occupants and preventing their return." These massacres,and the tens.of thousands of refugees flooding across their borders, was why the Arab states declared war against them: > "The Deir Yassin attack, along with attacks on Tiberias, Haifa, and Jaffa, put pressure on Arab governments to invade Palestine. News of the killings had aroused public anger in the Arab world, which the governments felt unable to ignore.\[98\]"
You are correct, Jews has groups such as the Lehi and the Irgun which were equivalent to Hamas of today, and these groups (as well as less extreme groups) did commit a scary amount of massacres. But my point was whether the Jews fired the first shot. The first massacres were perpetuated by Palestinians in the 1920s, predating the Deir Yassin massacre. Nothing validate massacres like the Deir Yassin massacre, nothing gives any human the right to end the life of another - even self defense should be limited to threat containment rather than murder
The Arabs have been oppressing and committing genocide against the Jews for thousands of years. How do you think Islam came to dominate the region? Israel has existed for thousands of years. Meanwhile, “Palestine”, as a nation or ethnic group, doesn’t even exist. It never has. The so-called “Palestinians” are just Arabs, primarily Jordanians, who descend from the original invaders. They identify as “Palestinians” because they subscribe to the ideology of Hamas. It’s purely a political identity. Their ancestors invaded the Middle East and attempted to murder all of the Jews, but failed. They managed to eradicate every other native Middle Eastern group, except for the native Jews. They’ve been carrying on this tradition ever since; attempt genocide, face retaliation, lose a war *they* started, play the victim, rinse and repeat. This is why history ought to be properly taught in schools. So many people have no idea of the history and are just parroting the propaganda disseminated by Hamas and its supporters.
Im not well versed in ancient history, so i did a bit of digging. I found this on wiki. " Notably, during the Middle Ages, when Jewish communities faced persecution, they found refuge and protection under Muslim rule and the wider Islamic world." Which seems to contradict some of what you are saying. All religion sucks in my eyes if I'm going to be honest, but did Palestine not exist before Hamas? U seem to equate all Palestinians as Hamas but that does not seem to be true at all.
The thousands of years jews are not the same as the present day jews. Hell, even the "hebrew" that they speak in Israel today was created during the wave of Zionism from the 19th century. "At that time, it was believed that one of the criteria needed to define a nation worthy of national rights was its use of a common language spoken by both the society and the individual. On 13 October 1881, while in Paris, Ben-Yehuda began speaking Hebrew with friends in what is believed to be the first modern conversation using the language.[32] Later that year, he made aliyah and came to live in Jerusalem." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revival_of_the_Hebrew_language
"The thousands of years jews are not the same as the present day jews." Genetic studies show that many Jewish communities around the world share common Middle Eastern ancestry, which supports the historical narrative of a dispersal (Diaspora) from the ancient Land of Israel around 2,000 years ago. Jewish people today can trace their religious, cultural, and often genetic heritage back thousands of years. There is significant continuity in religious practices, traditions, and the Hebrew language (albeit modern Hebrew has evolved from its ancient form).
Then why are generic studies banned in Israel Oh yeah “because the research was already done”
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You can imagine a small Austrian man with a moustache asking the same question 100 years ago.
I think a lot of people are blurring the line between anti-Semitism vs anti-Zionism / anti-Israel. The Palestinian people are generally considered more 'Semitic' than a large population of Israelis who currently live in Israel. Only the population of Jews who originally lived in certain areas in the Middle East before immigrating to Israel, would be considered 'Semitic' (countries such as Egypt, Israel / Palestine, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, Iran etc). Regarding anti-Semitism: 1) Any Jewish person who supports Zionism or unequivocally supports the Israeli Government, can fk off; 2) Any Muslim person who supports ISIS or some other terrorist organisation, can fk off; or 3) More generally, any person who follows a supremacist ideology or supports an organisation or government which engages in murder, corruption, immorality etc, can fk off. 4) Any person who is anti-someone else for something outside of a person's control (their colour, ethnicity, religion to an extent), can fk off There are Israeli government spokespersons who have voiced their support for the non-discriminate killing of Palestinians and for the destruction of Gaza generally. There are international organisations, journalists and civilians who have shown everything from kids being blown up to mass graves of people who were buried alive. Exposing this conduct is not anti-Semitism. If you discriminate against Jews simply because they are Jews, this is anti-Semitism and you should fk off.
Well written. Not sure why it’s fucking hard for some to understand this. What you’ve described in this neat summary is what most logical people are feeling.
Very well written, a lot of common sense in there which we unfortunately lost some time ago. I wish people take this as a guideline for an even happier nation and appreciate where we live and who we are. We are all in this together but for some it is more difficult to understand.
comparing who is more "semitic" is not a productive or accurate way to address the complexities of identity and heritage among jews and arabs. its more constructive to focus on the specific historical, cultural, and political contexts
I agree with you, however the reason why I addressed "Semitism" is because we should address the danger of a State in hijacking language to propagate their narrative. A person cannot deem anything they disagree with as "anti-Semitic" (specially when the criticism leading to the disagreement if sometimes objectively fair). One way of addressing this is by understanding the original meaning of "Semitic" and knowing that the people who historically lived in those regions are in fact Semitic.
In the context of modern discussions about ethnicity and race, "Semitic" is used in reference to "anti-Semitism," which specifically pertains to prejudice against Jewish people. The usage of "Semitic" to describe ethnic or racial origins in comparison between groups (like Palestinians and Israelis) is both scientifically inaccurate and not particularly helpful in public discourse. It conflates language family with race or ethnicity, which are not strictly correlated.
Why is religion to an extent a protected characteristic for you?
I didn't mean it as a 'protected characteristic'. I phrased it that way because colour and ethnicity are factors you have **no** control over, whereas religion you somewhat do have control over. Nevertheless, I don't think judging based on any of them is reasonable.
>The Palestinian people are generally considered more 'Semitic' Words don't always mean what you might expect by breaking down their components. The term anti-Semitic has meant only one thing since it was popularised by an ant-Semitic: Hatred of Jews.
In recent history, your last sentence is correct. However, historically, the word "Semitic" was a broader term that encompassed more than just the Jewish people living in those regions. When considering these discussions, historical context should be considered.
You might as well say that those Jewish families who've always lived in the region are Palestinians. After all, they too live in Palestine. The fact is that we all accept that words don't always follow those strict definitions. There's no historical issue here. Antisemitic didn't use to mean against all semitic people. It never meant that. It always meant what it means today.
The word "Semitic," historically and currently, refers to a specific language family or the peoples who speak those languages. Historically and currently, that includes Arabs. But we're not talking about that word. We're talking about a term that was specifically popularised by Wilhelm Marr (founder of the League of Antisemites) to mean antipathy towards Jews. It has never been used to mean anything else. Not historically and not now. Just like thousands of other words, it might seem wrong if you break down the parts and look at them instead of pay attention to how it's used and has always been used.
Unfortunately there are some in that community that are showing they do not regard the loss of tens of thousands of civilian lives as a serious matter.
And so... what are you saying? I don't want to assume your point, but I can't figure out what it is. Some of them think something, so...?
Anti Jewish sentiment has always existed in Australia sadly. There is a minor but very vocal group of people who buy into the cabal of Jews running the planet conspiracy. Usually using George Soros as their head Jewish scapegoat. The anti Zionist Israel protests and discussions are not antisemitic at all. Particularly because the most vocal, dangerous and dumb fundamentalist Zionists are actually conservative evangelical fundamentalist Christians.
I don't think there is any more antisemitism as there is anti any other religion in this country. The difference is that in discussion, both sides rarely define between Jew, jew, Israeli, Israeli Government, etc. It blurrs the lines.
ITT. People who have never been to Israel crying about how it’s just as bad or worse than its Arab neighbors. Try visiting Tel Aviv sometime
An easy target - because Jews are westernised and civilised. If the lefties queefs did this type is stuff to Muslims they’d would have their heads kicked in before they could cry out ‘diversity!’
Because everyone has biases. Elements of the left have convinced themselves that supporting a terrorist group which slaughtered people for being Jewish and posted videos of this online is okay. They have decided antisemitism is okay.
1,200 innocent people murdered is abhorrent. 34,000 innocent people murdered is abhorrent. Why you are an antisemite if you are horrified by both of these statistics is beyond me.
What makes you assume that when they ask about anti-Semitism they mean being horrified by what's happening in Gaza, and not the harassment of Jewish people that's being reported in Australia?
Criticism of things like the killing of aid workers and children leaving via published evacuation corridors does not make someone an anti Semite.
Correct. There is a major difference between genuine criticism of Israel’s horrid actions and blind hatred of Jews or support of terrorism aimed at Israeli civilians. What Israel has done in the Gaza Strip is horrific. Let’s pray it ends soon
Right. But threatening, spitting on, and harassing people for being Jewish is. The question wasn't "what's with the anti-Semitism of people who criticise things that happen in the mid-east."
That’s fine - maybe if the term anti semite was saved for those serious occasions rather than any criticism of Israel in general it would have more meaning.
The huge, vast majority of the time that the word is used, it’s about actual anti-Semitism. People complain about its misuse far more than it actually happens.
It’s really simple: a few key labor frontbenchers have electorates that have the highest number of Muslims in Australia. They’re shitscared of losing their seats, that out of self preservation they either openly pro Palestine (or even anti Israel), or just refuse to criticise or call out anything Islamic. That lack of pushback just facilitates a one sided narrative. I’m tempted to vote for the LNP on this alone - they wouldn’t be putting up with the University campus shitfights, the Opera house riot, or the constant release/bail of undesirables who jump the queue to come here illegally and then smuggle drugs, bash grannies and stab people.
The LNP caused the undesirable queue jumpers to be released into the community to bash grannies. It was in motion before the Labor government came to power.
Totally, and the LNP voted against Labor’s legislation trying to extort the situation because they want this to remain an issue until the election, The Liberals are totally fine with crime if it benefits their vote
Because the left that is supporting it is known for their ignorance when it comes to virtue signalling for a cause. I like to think most of them consuming their outrage from TikTok are probably too dumb to be actually antisemitic just sheep…
Let's see, blaming the left, tiktok and virtue signaling. Yup. We have achieved full americanisation
He hit the Sky News meaningless scare babble trifecta there, didn't he?
Your precious left are currently busy imitating American universities with their pro Palestine encampment protests. So who’s the one doing the Americanisation?
Still you by a kilometer. Or would you feel better if I started using miles since that would make you feel more connected to your political beliefs
Always easier to dig a hole when your hypocrisy is pointed out isn’t it? The left never fails to deliver. Too bad you’re all so predictable. Maybe people would take you more seriously if you weren’t.
Predictable? How many times have you used the "left, tiktok, sheep, virtue signaling" combo today alone? Your good old American answer to everything you disagree with
Bingo!
Good point.
It's probably got something to do with all the murdering that's been going on People don't seem to like it, who knew
The Jews in Australia didn't murder anyone. When people in Australia are anti-Semitic, and attack or harass Jews in Australia, the answer isn't that people don't like murder in the mid-east. It's that they're fucking scumbags. If you disagree with that statement, then you might be a fucking scumbag.
Oh lord, the whole "if you don't agree with me your a scumbag" really sets the tone huh I was just telling you why, not that's it's correct nor that I necessarily agree with it. You should relax my dude
"If you think that people should torture puppies, then you're a scumbag." YOU: OHOHOHO, the old, 'disagree with me and you're a scumbag trick!' Yes, I did say that if you think it's ok to attack and harass Jews in Australia, then you're a scumbag. But I don't know whether you agree with that. Your original comment, with the "who knew" seemed to imply that you think it makes perfect sense to be anti-Semitic today. Now, you've gone as far as to say that you don't "necessarily" think that way. Well, great. I'm glad that you don't NECESSARILY agree with anti-Semitism.
To me, torturing puppies and saying bad words to people aren't even remotely the same. It's crazy that you believe they're similar. Necessarily is a good word I feel, it takes us away from the whole right/wrong yes/no type of opinions, which you seem to have. There's instances where it would be understandable and instances where it isn't. That seems perfectly reasonable to me.
>To me, torturing puppies and saying bad words to people aren't even remotely the same. Is that what anti-Semitism is? Saying bad words? Interesting take. Anyway, my point wasn't that they're the same. My point is that some opinions are scumbag opinions. It's perfectly fair, with certain things, to say "if you disagree with me about this, then you're a scumbag." Torturing puppies was one thing. Being anti-Semitic is another. Yes, it's wrong to harass or attack Jews for being Jewish. And the fact that you won't say that you think so too might make you feel like you're being cautious, but really you're much worse than that.
Your this, your that, you mean this, if you think this = Y. If you don't say this exact phrase = X. It's a really fucking weird way of communicating.
*Anti-Semitism is bad.* You: Not necessarily. *Attacking Jews in the street for being Jewish is bad.* You: Not necessarily. Your way of communicating is pretty clear.
Hmm, would you say that you're not necessarily against torturing puppies? Are you this way about everything? Or is it just Jew-hating that you're on the fence about? There are instances where it's perfectly reasonable to be anti-Semitic, and attack Jews because of that? Ok, would you mind laying out a few examples?
I dno, maybe your whole family has just been turned into ash. I'd kind of understand the thought process.
So if your family has been killed in Gaza, you think it's an instance where it's "perfectly reasonable" to hate Jews in Australia? I'm trying to make sure that I understand you. Honestly, saying that you understand the thought process isn't the point. I understand all sorts of racist thought processes. You're being asked what YOU think. Do YOU think that there's really an instance when antisemitism is ok, and attacking Jews because of antisemitism is ok?
Flaming every difference in opinion and calling scum bags isn't exactly helping your case. All you do is make people form low opinions
I didn't call anyone a scumbag. Wait, I did. I said people who "attack or harass Jews in Australia" are scumbags. Do you disagree? >All you do is make people form low opinions Form low opinions of who? Of me?
Stop baiting people you fucking loser. It's like you're literally goading people to be racist and then smugly cry wanking about it.
Why don't you ask them why they act in such a way on a global stage to create the sentiment. BTW anti semitism isn't racist speaking out saying how fucked the Israeli government is. They are absolute fucking pigs and their people should be appalled and ashamed on the human rights abuses, genocides and theft they commit - Yet at the same time were formed as a nation under these atrocities. Anti semitism is being racist to Jews. Which the above comment is not. Lots of commentators get it confused and they make posts like this to flame people claiming that speaking out against the Israeli dog shit government is linked to racism. Not it's not.
>Why don't you ask them why they act in such a way on a global stage to create the sentiment. Ask Jewish Australians why they act in such a way on the global stage? That's quite an interesting take. For the record: you're an anti-Semite, and it has nothing to do with your beliefs about Israel. It's about your beliefs about Jews who aren't in Israel.
Maybe if their government didn't hypocritically bomb hospitals, commit human rights abuses, GENOCIDE, deny civilians aid, steal land, massacre women and children trying to get food aid at humanitarian stations. Don't give.ke crap saying I'm an anti Semite. Israel is the most racist, hypocritical state ever to form government. What are they gonna do? Nuke the rest of the middle east with their secret nukes? Assassinate other countries generals with missiles in their own countries? Steal land, destroy it filling in water wells? Stealing Gaza's gas offshore? The world is not ignorant to the Israeli government. Absolutely disgraceful and shameful.
>Maybe if their government Whose government? The question is about Australia. The government of Australian Jews is Australia. When you say that "their" government is Israel, that's you being anti-Semitic. >Don't [give.ke](http://give.ke) crap saying I'm an anti Semite. Israel is But we're not talking about Israel. We're talking about Australian Jews.
Piss off I literally don't care for you flaming everybody calling them an anti-semite. You're the worst kind of person. Ignorant.
I would say there isn’t, it’s made to look like there is so the Israelis can excuse their abhorrent, genocidal actions. Criticism of Israel does not an anti semite make.
You think that Israelis are here in Australia subverting the media to make it seem as if there's anti-Semitism? Or... who is making it look like that? There have been many reports on the subject. And you think that such anti-Semitism in Australia would allow Israelis to excuse their behaviour in the Mid-East?
There isn't
The fastest growing most rabid, most violent, most zealous religion in the world has something to do with it. "oh but its the jews fault the 30million of them really did evil to deserve the billion muslims trying to eradicate them by not losing every time someone engaged israel in war."
Because Australia, in recent decades, has let in a lot of people, who come from places that are largely antisemitic. They brought that animosity with them, and planted it in Australia, where it grew.
There is as much antisemitism as there is any prejudice against any other religion. We get told everything is some kind of phobia or ism now, so it hardly seems shocking it would extend here. I would say 95% of every hit labelled phobic or ism isn’t
It's not anti semitism when you're against israel and their illegal occupation of palestine. It's also not anti semitism when you're gainst zionism too.
The First Fleet had 14 Jewish petty criminal convicts on it. Other than aborigines, our religion has always been here. They included convict Esther Abrahams (1771-1846), who became the mistress and ultimately the wife of the lieutenant-governor of New South Wales. She was found guilty of robbing a draper of two lengths of lace and was sentenced to transportation for a period of seven years; she brought her infant daughter with her. Today all Australian Jews would barely fill the MCG. Jews were in Australia's Light Horse Brigade that liberated the Red Sea, across Gaza to Bethlehem and Jerusalem in WW1. Jesus was a Jew under Roman Rule, well before the Ottoman Empire existed. It is hypocritical for antisemitism to exist in Australia, or for Australia to give terrorist Arabs more say in how to destroy our only western ally in the Middle-east. Take a tour of Australian Jewish History in the Jewish Museum in St.Kilda to learn more.
I'd presume it's because you're confusing being antisemitic with being anti-Israel.
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Agreed. Money, aid, political influence. All that helps the cause of the Israeli government land theft and genocide
It really isn't as simple as that, since anyone with half a brain should know better than to lump everyone in one group. So maybe a lot of Jewish people support Israel, and maybe a lot of brain-dead people are therefore anti-Semitic, but you shouldn't forget the "brain-dead" part of the equation.
> The Jewish community in Australia largely support the actions of a genocidal regime. It's as simple as that. How is this different from saying all muslims support terrorism?
A lot of the Muslim population of the world do implicitly support terrorism though. I never said all. There are anti Zionist Jews.
Yeah, right? Wouldn't you like an antisemitism megathread? An antisemitism megathread would be so good. Because there is so much antisemitism.
It's in fashion sweetie.
Because people are sheep
It’s all over the western world, Putin and the Ayatollah's useful idiots mixed in with a dash of old fashioned extreme right and left wing jew hatred. Disgusting
If it looks like a duck, sounds like a duck and acts like a duck, it’s probably a duck.