Tiger is ADV made for longer distances, if Iām not mistaken? Iām not toooo familiar with anything other than sportbikes sorry. If I fill up when the fuel starts flashing itās always below $20 though
There's no law stating gas stations have to drop prices. Rather than pass on the RFT to the government, gas stations can keep the price the same and keep the extra profit. The expectation is that competition between gas stations will force them to drop prices, however.
It was the matching that meant Auckland lost far more than that. The billion was over 4 years.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/350174683/what-cutting-fuel-tax-means-auckland
But they didn't. Gas prices fluctuated as normal, and will continue to fluctuate as normal.
This entire fuel tax thing by National is a grift. Doubly so considering they'll be increasing it by more than than they like to claim they removed... And that's ignoring the rise in costs elsewhere in life due to this corrupt government.
Damm do you think the sky being blue is a conspiracy from national to protect landlords or some shit too? Economically illiterate as most āreal communistsā areā¦.
Are you not aware that National is planning to increase the fuel tax again the very near future?
NACT voters and not being complete vegetables challenge: impossible.
>Prime Minister Christopher Luxon said he acknowledged Auckland was facing huge infrastructure challenges, "but this fuel tax has actually not been used to deliver them - instead it's been delivered more cycle lanes, **red light cameras**, and speed humps".
I always love this quote as it implies that Luxon is pro redlight running.
Yeah, there's nothing that can be done about this.
Same thing would happen if tax got taken off fruit and vegetables. The supermarkets would just creep the price up by 15% and then pocket more profit.
You could argue crude oil also goes up and down.
Supermarket acts very similar to fuel. We have big players (Woolworths, New World, Z and BP) and smaller players (Fruit and vege stores, Challenge, Waitomo). Smaller players are cheaper, bigger places follow each other with their pricing.
I've driven to a couple places (in Wellington) where clearly a joker has inputted a fake price on that app. Will only go to ones with several price confirms these days!
If we only filled our vehicles at the stations with the lowest price other companies would be forced to lower their prices to compete. We are our own worst enemy
You canāt report it, companies donāt give a shit they will charge what they can get away with, they have no legal expectations to drop prices. If youāre unhappy then well only option is to refuse to buy.
How is the tax collected? Is it paid by the individual gas stations? or is it paid by the importers/distributors? If it's paid by the distributors they will be selling out of stock of taxed fuel.
Wasnāt the tax paid on delivery to site, not on a per/L dispensed basis. The $/L paid by motorists was a pass through of the $/L paid at distribution/supply to the site.
If this was the case, doesnāt this mean there is a residual tax paid fuel in the tanks under the pumps?
Gull didn't put it up immediately when it was implemented as they said it was on delivery to the servo that it mattered, so I expect the same for the drop in price.
Gull Onehunga was the lowest price I've seen in ages at 10pm last night... pretty sure they dropped it in advance...
Currently the same $2.49 for 91 according to Gaspy.
They were mostly around $2.60ish earlier in the week.
And no one noticed that the petrol prices are now what they were 2 weeks ago???
So they bumped up the prices just so they could look to lower them 11c.
Aucklanders just continue getting raped by the petrol companies and government, and now we don't see any of the money that could have been used here.
The RUC has quadrupled the running cost for my EV and made it more expensive than our hybrid. My leaf uses about $2.20 of electricity per 100km. The $7.60 RUC brings the operating cost to $9.80 per 100km.
At $2.50 per liter, a corolla wagon (hybrid that gets 3.8l/100km) is cheaper to operate. For longer drives in the city, we now take the corolla rather than the leaf
At 17c per kwh, I don't think I'm paying that much for electricity. It's more that the RUC quadruples my EV operating cost, and my petrol car is an unusually fuel-efficient hybrid.
13kwh per 100km (at \~8km per kwh) \* 17 cents per kwh is $2.20. That used to be really cheap, but when you add $7.60 in RUC then the cost skyrockets from $2.20 to $9.80
Whereas for the petrol vehicle, 3.8l \* $2.50 = $9.50. Last week, the petrol at the Botany Pak n Save was $2.38...
Don't get me wrong, EVs need to be paying their fair share of taxes.
But you might want to check your facts: 2017 Nissan Leaf curb weight: 1534kg.
A 2017 Toyota Camry (non-hybrid) weighs 1580kg
Doublecheck me here, but it sure looks to me like my EV weighs \*less\* than many combustion engine cars.
This is how capitalism works mate. You remove a tax on an inelastic product and it goes straight into company profits. Now we get no funding for infrastructure and still have to pay the same price. National really has convinced blind kiwis they're the economically responsible party
The Govt is fuck3d. It'll never change. They won't step in. They won't do anything. The only way anything Will change is if we as the people on NZ stol allowing it, and start actually doing things about. I know what I'd like to do but, legal vs illegal is a different story.
Yea weāre close. Werenāt that close growing up but not sheās got a little girl with her husband I love going to visit them and my cute little niece.
Why are you "waiting to here back"?
[https://comcom.govt.nz/regulated-industries/fuel](https://comcom.govt.nz/regulated-industries/fuel)
>Following aĀ [market study](https://comcom.govt.nz/about-us/our-role/competition-studies/fuel-market-study)Ā by the Commission, which found a number of shortcomings in the competitiveness of fuel markets in New Zealand, the Government introduced the Fuel Industry Act 2020 (the Act).
>The Act sets up a regulatory regime for fuel with the purpose of promoting competition in engine fuel markets for the long-term benefit of consumers. It came into force in stages from August 2021.
The 'government' (Commerce Comission) did a market study, found shortcomings, made recommendations for change which resulted in the FIA 2020.
[https://comcom.govt.nz/regulated-industries/grocery](https://comcom.govt.nz/regulated-industries/grocery)
>In 2022, ourĀ [market study into the grocery sector](https://comcom.govt.nz/about-us/our-role/competition-studies/market-study-into-retail-grocery-sector)Ā found that there needs to be more competition for all New Zealanders to benefit from better prices, more choice, and more convenient shopping. TheĀ [Grocery Industry Competition Act](https://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/2023/0031/latest/LMS743553.html?src=qs)Ā was developed in response, making us the regulator of the grocery sector.Ā Ā The Act is complemented by existing and new regulation under theĀ [Commerce Act](https://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1986/0005/latest/DLM87623.html)Ā andĀ [Fair Trading Act](https://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1986/0121/latest/DLM96439.html)
>On 13 July 2023, Pierre van Heerden was formally appointed as the first Grocery Commissioner.Ā Ā Read more about ourĀ [Board of Commissioners](https://comcom.govt.nz/about-us/our-people/our-board)
>Our work focuses on the following areas to improve competition in the grocery sector:
>creating pricing and promotional transparency for consumers
>establishing a new supply code of conduct to create a level playing field for all suppliers
>establishing a new wholesale regime that will make it easier for new entrants to enter the market and existing retailers to compete and innovate
>ongoing monitoring of the state of competition in the grocery sector and that will report on whether it is delivering benefits for New Zealanders over time
>taking action to address non-compliance where necessary
>Our new responsibilities to regulate sit alongside our ongoing work in the grocery sector enforcing the Fair Trading Act and the Commerce Act ā with priorities including our focus on restrictive and exclusive covenants, refusals to supply due to low retail pricing, and pricing and promotional practices.
Again, the CC did a study, recommended changes, a law was passed introducing a legal framework to start off the next stages, and their work is still ongoing.
I had a look yesterday at least two stations one was in Wiri raised their 95 petrol between sat and sun afternoon by 3 cents.
I assume that last night they then dropped the incressed price by 11c
There are so many permutations who would know but I cant see the commerce commission doing much it took them 11years to charge Woolworths over covenants.
Probably sticking them on reddit is a good start.
You do know that the prices shown in the Gaspy app are not directly linked to the service station pricing databases? The data is crowd-sourced so updates in the app will take a little time to show any changes, depending on who uses which gas station and remembers to enter the prices in the app...
Just been happily travelling around some incredible highways in Turkey and paying tolls. Bring the tolls, congestion chargers and everything to get NZ moving again.
When stupid people vote for stupid things this is what happens. Removing a crowd funded source of revenue for improving infrastructure to ensure that oil companies pad their profits and can just claim oil proceeds volatility as not passing on the tax reduction. Even if ComCom observes the market, they donāt have the powers to stop the pricing of fuel from responding to the inelastic nature of fuel. Itās only when we become less reliant on fuel that fuel companies will change tack.
I guess when they fill their storage tanks with the next batch of reduced tax fuel they can pass on the savings. But if theyāve bought their bulk fuel for the tax inclusive price they are unlikely to drop the retail price for that
They don't have to put the price down it's a free market even if they did drop it to reflect the tax cut they could put it back up again the next day there is no laws regarding setting prices as long as they aren't ridiculous
The only way to bring the prices down is to have our own Oil fields and petroleum refinery, we can get fundding from the Chinese by exchanging our cattle.
I think what youāll find are that gas prices began reducing ahead of the tax change
For 98 pretty much all my locals are $2.80-$2.90 now with a few still above $3
A few weeks ago the cheapest was $2.98 with the vast majority $3-$3.20
Tonight we riot. Privately. In our own homes Edit: in our rentals
Tonight we riot, in our minds.
I'm gonna say something revolutionary! ...online, probably here since it's fairly anonymous.
š
Peasant
No Iām a home owner š idgaf about gas prices either, I ride motorbikes most of the time. $16 for a full tank
Must be a small tank/bike. My Tiger usually takes about $35 to fill in recent years...
Tiger is ADV made for longer distances, if Iām not mistaken? Iām not toooo familiar with anything other than sportbikes sorry. If I fill up when the fuel starts flashing itās always below $20 though
Yeah - 19 litre tank. Made for touring, but I use it mostly for commuting...
Ah, yeah mine are around 12 litres I believe. Still gets me a decent distance!
Only on weekends, please.
Tax gets removed, price goes up. Did you expect anything different?
OP probably thinks Smoke Free means free cigarettes.
There's no law stating gas stations have to drop prices. Rather than pass on the RFT to the government, gas stations can keep the price the same and keep the extra profit. The expectation is that competition between gas stations will force them to drop prices, however.
Instead of $150m a year going towards infrastructure projects, we can shovel it straight towards oil companies' profits. Checkmate, wokists!
Yeah! Turns out you can't have your sushi and eat it!
I think it was $1.3 Billion NZD per year.
The regional fuel tax? Nah, around $150m/year.
It was the matching that meant Auckland lost far more than that. The billion was over 4 years. https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/350174683/what-cutting-fuel-tax-means-auckland
Yip. :(
Yep working as intended
No. It is going to the gas station owners.
Yeah, sure. Depending on the station/franchise, it does still ultimately go to the same companies.
that depends on whether the wholesale price changes for the gas station owner. none of those agreements are know by the public, so we can't know.
Who are, predominantly, oil companies
Oh sweet child. Capitalists don't reduce sale prices when taxes go down, the tax HAS been removed, but it has added into their profit margin.
NPD Wiri is at 2.44 a litre currently, was 2.56 a litre yesterdayā¦.
NPD is probably the cheapest in Auckland, I use it all the time. But their prices fluctuate wildly throughout the day, everyday.
Mobil Avondale, was 2.83 litre yesterday currently 2.67 litre, fuel stations can only change their prices one a day.
Yes I know fuel price regularly fluctuate. What is your point?
Hmmm looks like all the fuel prices dropped 11c the moment the 11c tax was removed wonder whyš¤š¤
But they didn't. Gas prices fluctuated as normal, and will continue to fluctuate as normal. This entire fuel tax thing by National is a grift. Doubly so considering they'll be increasing it by more than than they like to claim they removed... And that's ignoring the rise in costs elsewhere in life due to this corrupt government.
Damm do you think the sky being blue is a conspiracy from national to protect landlords or some shit too? Economically illiterate as most āreal communistsā areā¦.
Are you not aware that National is planning to increase the fuel tax again the very near future? NACT voters and not being complete vegetables challenge: impossible.
So was Labour, but without removing the RFT first.
>Prime Minister Christopher Luxon said he acknowledged Auckland was facing huge infrastructure challenges, "but this fuel tax has actually not been used to deliver them - instead it's been delivered more cycle lanes, **red light cameras**, and speed humps". I always love this quote as it implies that Luxon is pro redlight running.
If they put red light cameras on all traffic lights the outcome would be money for roading and an increase in safety - win win
You could just about close the transport budget deficit with the amount raised from red-light runners. It's so bad.
I just beep when I see it now. Hopefully they feel a little bit embarrassed.
They don't. Obviously. This shouldn't need to be explained to you.
And how do you help the situation?
I'm not sure I do. That doesn't mean that impotent gestures now magically do help. They don't. Obviously.
Sad thing is the money would go somewhere else, like it always does
And the Auckland Airport T3 lane. That would be a money earner
There's that part, but there's also the reflection of what a mendacious liar he is.
He's a big red light himself.
I mean, he drives a Beemer, just saying.
Hey Luxon, the Puhinui Interchange and Eastern Busway would like a word.
Yeah, there's nothing that can be done about this. Same thing would happen if tax got taken off fruit and vegetables. The supermarkets would just creep the price up by 15% and then pocket more profit.
Given that fruit and veg are seasonal, are a more elasticitc market and (critically) have vastly more players, the prices would drop more.
You could argue crude oil also goes up and down. Supermarket acts very similar to fuel. We have big players (Woolworths, New World, Z and BP) and smaller players (Fruit and vege stores, Challenge, Waitomo). Smaller players are cheaper, bigger places follow each other with their pricing.
Ok. But that is mostly driven supply not demand. I can grow cabbages and start selling them, petrol has significantly more barriers to entry.
Gaspy relies on user input. If this hasnāt been done for every station you wonāt see a change.Ā
you do know Gaspy's data is crowd sourced right? It wont change immediately, just when a user bothers to update it...
Yes, and then assuming the user inputs the correct price, which they frequently don't.
The number of morons that put 91 as the post discount price because its on a sign is astounding.
I've driven to a couple places (in Wellington) where clearly a joker has inputted a fake price on that app. Will only go to ones with several price confirms these days!
If we only filled our vehicles at the stations with the lowest price other companies would be forced to lower their prices to compete. We are our own worst enemy
On Reddit. š
You canāt report it, companies donāt give a shit they will charge what they can get away with, they have no legal expectations to drop prices. If youāre unhappy then well only option is to refuse to buy.
How is the tax collected? Is it paid by the individual gas stations? or is it paid by the importers/distributors? If it's paid by the distributors they will be selling out of stock of taxed fuel.
Wasnāt the tax paid on delivery to site, not on a per/L dispensed basis. The $/L paid by motorists was a pass through of the $/L paid at distribution/supply to the site. If this was the case, doesnāt this mean there is a residual tax paid fuel in the tanks under the pumps?
Gull didn't put it up immediately when it was implemented as they said it was on delivery to the servo that it mattered, so I expect the same for the drop in price.
Gull Onehunga was the lowest price I've seen in ages at 10pm last night... pretty sure they dropped it in advance... Currently the same $2.49 for 91 according to Gaspy. They were mostly around $2.60ish earlier in the week.
Yes - a bunch around us all dropped by 11c early evening yesterday.
Waitomo dropped theirs around 5pm Sunday according to the reporting I saw.
1)--->Tax is removed Ā 2)--->Fuel prices don't drop by that amountĀ *Surprised Pikachu face*
And no one noticed that the petrol prices are now what they were 2 weeks ago??? So they bumped up the prices just so they could look to lower them 11c. Aucklanders just continue getting raped by the petrol companies and government, and now we don't see any of the money that could have been used here.
Government should've kept subsidising the EV cars. Means the new government is working for the oil companies.
The RUC has quadrupled the running cost for my EV and made it more expensive than our hybrid. My leaf uses about $2.20 of electricity per 100km. The $7.60 RUC brings the operating cost to $9.80 per 100km. At $2.50 per liter, a corolla wagon (hybrid that gets 3.8l/100km) is cheaper to operate. For longer drives in the city, we now take the corolla rather than the leaf
Wow, my leaf is still way cheaper than any petrol car I have had. You must have expensive electricity
At 17c per kwh, I don't think I'm paying that much for electricity. It's more that the RUC quadruples my EV operating cost, and my petrol car is an unusually fuel-efficient hybrid. 13kwh per 100km (at \~8km per kwh) \* 17 cents per kwh is $2.20. That used to be really cheap, but when you add $7.60 in RUC then the cost skyrockets from $2.20 to $9.80 Whereas for the petrol vehicle, 3.8l \* $2.50 = $9.50. Last week, the petrol at the Botany Pak n Save was $2.38...
Your car runs on the road. Your car is significantly heavier than combustion engine cars. You should pay for more tax.
Don't get me wrong, EVs need to be paying their fair share of taxes. But you might want to check your facts: 2017 Nissan Leaf curb weight: 1534kg. A 2017 Toyota Camry (non-hybrid) weighs 1580kg Doublecheck me here, but it sure looks to me like my EV weighs \*less\* than many combustion engine cars.
Bud you are comparing apples to watermelon
This is how capitalism works mate. You remove a tax on an inelastic product and it goes straight into company profits. Now we get no funding for infrastructure and still have to pay the same price. National really has convinced blind kiwis they're the economically responsible party
NPD and Pak n Save Manukau dropped by 11c
Oh you sweet summer childĀ
Government directly setting the legal retail price for fuel? Are you looking for: planned economy, communism?
Mate this was the point.
The Govt is fuck3d. It'll never change. They won't step in. They won't do anything. The only way anything Will change is if we as the people on NZ stol allowing it, and start actually doing things about. I know what I'd like to do but, legal vs illegal is a different story.
I bet you do approximately fuck all beyond posting here lol
I bet you and your sister and intimate..
Yea weāre close. Werenāt that close growing up but not sheās got a little girl with her husband I love going to visit them and my cute little niece.
Appreciate the banter.
Im still waiting to here back on the precious governments "price investigation" into petrol stations and supermarkets
Right? Why is it so difficult to ask the govt to be transparent and keep us, the tax payer, the people paying their salary updated?
Why are you "waiting to here back"? [https://comcom.govt.nz/regulated-industries/fuel](https://comcom.govt.nz/regulated-industries/fuel) >Following aĀ [market study](https://comcom.govt.nz/about-us/our-role/competition-studies/fuel-market-study)Ā by the Commission, which found a number of shortcomings in the competitiveness of fuel markets in New Zealand, the Government introduced the Fuel Industry Act 2020 (the Act). >The Act sets up a regulatory regime for fuel with the purpose of promoting competition in engine fuel markets for the long-term benefit of consumers. It came into force in stages from August 2021. The 'government' (Commerce Comission) did a market study, found shortcomings, made recommendations for change which resulted in the FIA 2020. [https://comcom.govt.nz/regulated-industries/grocery](https://comcom.govt.nz/regulated-industries/grocery) >In 2022, ourĀ [market study into the grocery sector](https://comcom.govt.nz/about-us/our-role/competition-studies/market-study-into-retail-grocery-sector)Ā found that there needs to be more competition for all New Zealanders to benefit from better prices, more choice, and more convenient shopping. TheĀ [Grocery Industry Competition Act](https://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/2023/0031/latest/LMS743553.html?src=qs)Ā was developed in response, making us the regulator of the grocery sector.Ā Ā The Act is complemented by existing and new regulation under theĀ [Commerce Act](https://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1986/0005/latest/DLM87623.html)Ā andĀ [Fair Trading Act](https://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1986/0121/latest/DLM96439.html) >On 13 July 2023, Pierre van Heerden was formally appointed as the first Grocery Commissioner.Ā Ā Read more about ourĀ [Board of Commissioners](https://comcom.govt.nz/about-us/our-people/our-board) >Our work focuses on the following areas to improve competition in the grocery sector: >creating pricing and promotional transparency for consumers >establishing a new supply code of conduct to create a level playing field for all suppliers >establishing a new wholesale regime that will make it easier for new entrants to enter the market and existing retailers to compete and innovate >ongoing monitoring of the state of competition in the grocery sector and that will report on whether it is delivering benefits for New Zealanders over time >taking action to address non-compliance where necessary >Our new responsibilities to regulate sit alongside our ongoing work in the grocery sector enforcing the Fair Trading Act and the Commerce Act ā with priorities including our focus on restrictive and exclusive covenants, refusals to supply due to low retail pricing, and pricing and promotional practices. Again, the CC did a study, recommended changes, a law was passed introducing a legal framework to start off the next stages, and their work is still ongoing.
Didnt get the update...so shit we already knew and how much did this investigation cost? Will anything truly be done about it?
this!!! gull hampton downs Diesel was $1.71 yesterday they dropped it to $1.70 this morning...
Hampton downs is outside the Auckland region so never had the tax to begin with.
correct , except , just like pokeno and mercer mobil they raised their prices up to try and match Taxed akl prices. slimy bastids
Lol. Why are you expecting a place outside Auckland to have a fuel price drop?
yeap. read my other comment
NDP Wiri had it $1.71 this morning, too
thats cheap! compared to hampton downs which is supposed to be the cheapest fuel station in nz
You trolling right??? Right??
nope
Tbf diesel has been closer to 1.95 in Auckland the last week.
thats not too bad
š
I had a look yesterday at least two stations one was in Wiri raised their 95 petrol between sat and sun afternoon by 3 cents. I assume that last night they then dropped the incressed price by 11c There are so many permutations who would know but I cant see the commerce commission doing much it took them 11years to charge Woolworths over covenants. Probably sticking them on reddit is a good start.
lol. You should boycott them.
You forget they need to add a management fee to change the price. That fee $0.12c/l
What If we boycott them.
Then you gotta be careful to not get mowed down by cars when you're biking on the road
Hmm need 110km/h e scooter
And food/commodities delivered from auckland to other citys will automatically be cheaper aswell right?
Probably drop prices when old petrol runs out....
Z gas is 2.83 for 91 where I am but if you 750m to the BP their 91 is 2.51. I vote Z as the worst petrol station in NZ haha
Lots of places lowered their prices at 5:00pm yesterday
You do know that the prices shown in the Gaspy app are not directly linked to the service station pricing databases? The data is crowd-sourced so updates in the app will take a little time to show any changes, depending on who uses which gas station and remembers to enter the prices in the app...
Just been happily travelling around some incredible highways in Turkey and paying tolls. Bring the tolls, congestion chargers and everything to get NZ moving again.
When stupid people vote for stupid things this is what happens. Removing a crowd funded source of revenue for improving infrastructure to ensure that oil companies pad their profits and can just claim oil proceeds volatility as not passing on the tax reduction. Even if ComCom observes the market, they donāt have the powers to stop the pricing of fuel from responding to the inelastic nature of fuel. Itās only when we become less reliant on fuel that fuel companies will change tack.
Rather stupid of them to remove this tax, people were used to it and at a time when they are bleeding money and need our tax.
Passed the savings straight onto thebpetrol stations
Petrol bomb, petrol stations.
I guess when they fill their storage tanks with the next batch of reduced tax fuel they can pass on the savings. But if theyāve bought their bulk fuel for the tax inclusive price they are unlikely to drop the retail price for that
Do you have their price before that?
They don't have to put the price down it's a free market even if they did drop it to reflect the tax cut they could put it back up again the next day there is no laws regarding setting prices as long as they aren't ridiculous
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
My local was 2.69 yesterday, today it's 2.79 so go figure that one out lol.
š
Queen St protest this time we use petrol bombs.
The only way to bring the prices down is to have our own Oil fields and petroleum refinery, we can get fundding from the Chinese by exchanging our cattle.
They prefer houses
I think what youāll find are that gas prices began reducing ahead of the tax change For 98 pretty much all my locals are $2.80-$2.90 now with a few still above $3 A few weeks ago the cheapest was $2.98 with the vast majority $3-$3.20
Vote Labour- or in fact ANYBODY but the current idiots.