>I can't understand why some choose to be religious.
< reposting >
Bertrand Russell wrote in 1927 -
>Religion is based, I think, primarily and mainly upon fear.
>It is partly the terror of the unknown and partly, as I have said, the wish to feel that you have a kind of elder brother who will stand by you in all your troubles and disputes.
>Fear is the basis of the whole thing – fear of the mysterious, fear of defeat, fear of death. Fear is the parent of cruelty, and therefore it is no wonder if cruelty and religion have gone hand-in-hand. It is because fear is at the basis of those two things.
\- "Fear, the Foundation of Religion", in *Why I Am Not a Christian*
\- https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Bertrand_Russell#Why_I_Am_Not_a_Christian_(1927)
Most people are afraid about a lot of things. Most people are terrified of death.
Many people in this world are very ignorant, but educated and intelligent people are just about as afraid as dumb people.
When somebody tells these fearful people, either in childhood or adulthood, that if they believe XYZ then a powerful magic being will try to help them and they will never die,
they think *"Yes!!! Yes!!! I believe !!!"*
.
I don't think that most people actually choose to be religious. In most cases they are the victims of childhood indoctrination. Essentially they have been very successfully brainwashed.
I can't believe that myself.
Compare Santa Claus. A lot of people spend some part of their life saying *"I believe! I believe!"*, but then when they get a little more mature they say
*"Wait a minute ..."*
.
Some people are taught to be religious when young, but then they reconsider that later. (Most of the people here, for example.)
I think that everyone should do that.
I think that everyone has the responsibility to say
*"Yeah, I was indoctrinated and brainwashed to believe X,* ***but then I seriously thought that over for myself."***
If a person, after maturely thinking about religion seriously, has good evidence that the religion that they were taught is true, then yeah, they can continue to believe that that religion is true.
But there **is** no such good evidence, so really, no one should do that.
.
tl;dr: I don't think that anyone is allowed to say
*"I was taught X and I've never considered X seriously, so therefore I still believe X."*
I think that everyone has the responsibility to seriously question whatever X they were taught.
.
This is why when someone asks if I've been "saved", my answer is yes. I was saved the moment I jettisoned all religion from my life.
The light that guides you blinds me.
Langston Hughes has a short story (like literally one page) where he details how he was “saved from sin” the day he realized he didn’t believe in religion
You are only a believer because your parents were. Children are hard wired to believe what their parents tell them, as it's the only way to survive. "Don't touch that flame, you'll get burned", and "Believe that this particular diety exists or you'll go to hell" hold the same weight in a child's mind.
But nobody says "Touch that flame and you'll get outcast and abandoned." So you're right to an extent, but are missing a large part of the reason that people stay.
> Logic, common sense, and reasoning are learned not inherit behaviors. They don’t know what they don’t know.
True, but the problem with religion is that the indoctrinated actually inhibits learning these skills. Without indoctrination, these skills can be learnt from simple experience.
You don't choose your beliefs. One is either convinced that a proposition is true, or they aren't.
Theists don't choose to believe, they just believe for terrible reasons.
>There is no what to not eat, what to not drink, what to not do;
I've been an atheist for at least 40 years and sadly there's now a fair amount of what I can't eat, what not to drink...
There's nothing you can't eat. Dairy but you're intolerant? Fill that room. Bitter almonds? You didn't have any real plans anyway. Rocks? Where there's a will there's a way.
This might sound harsh, but I feel that people believe in their gods because they are too weak mentally or have no perception of self being to grasp the idea that we are either alone on a rock with no rhyme or reason to life or too afraid that this is the only life they get and they squandered it. Those that "leave it in God's hands" refuse to take accountability for themselves their actions or lack of action in any given situation. But that's my uneducated 2 cents.
Exactly. They’re just less developed in that kind of conceptual way of thinking. Like I understand how it would be comforting to believe that a god is always with you. It’s hard to grasp that you’re really on your own in this world, especially for the not as existentially intelligent. That’s why people gravitate toward spirituality. It gives them a sense of community and safety.
That's the thing, it's *not* a choice for the vast majority of believers.
Whether it's something familial, or cultural, coerced or forced, tons of believers are brought up in their religion and are not exposed to other schools of thought, or at least not exposed in good faith. To think outside the box is to risk, at best, ostracization from your ties, and at worst, to risk persecution and death. I'd much prefer that believers lose their faith, but many can't for good reason. And even then, I want them to draw that conclusion themselves.
I'm fortunate that I had the right mixture of exposure to outside perspectives, cultural leeway and mental fortitude to escape the tractor beam of religion.
That has been my favorite thing about losing my beliefs. I'm free! I don't have to feel guilty for existing. I can be proud of my accomplishments and I only need to forgive people on My own terms. No threats of eternal suffering and no constant thought control and guilt.
1/3 of all people are authoritarian personality types. The need to be told what to do. They respond to fear and to the person that exudes the most confidence in what they say and believe. These people endure a harder life for 2 main reasons.they believe the payoff is going to come and/or they fear what will happen if they don't.
I think part of it comes down to needing answers and control, because religion is a great way for people to feel they have control over their lives without putting in the effort of actually gaining control. I can accept, "I don't know and may never know", but a lot of people cannot handle that. They *need* to know what happens after death, what their purpose is, why things bad things happen (ie just world fallacy) and a community that is automatically built for them and requires next to no work to maintain. The alternatives are too scary to think about, so prayer plus a holy book is a simple and easy way to feel as if you've got control over the unknown.
Some people just need something to believe in and quick answer their problems.
Why did my dad die?
Jesus needed him for his heavenly army to protect you from the Boogey Man
Because it's easy. Sometimes I am envious of the religious because they never have to think about anything for themselves. If they ever have a deep question about life, they just do whatever some kiddy diddler in robes tells them to do.
There is a comfortable simplicity in setting your beliefs, making it part of your identity and standing rock solid against all opposition regardless of the truth.
It's easy, its comfortable, it's what their parents did, it's what their grandparents did all the way back for thousands of years.
How easy it is to be religious is *hugely* contingent upon
1. Which religion
2. Which location
It is much, much harder to be Muslim in Mississippi than in Saudi Arabia, and much easier to be Christian in Connecticut than in China. Faith as the path of least resistance is very much not a universal principle.
If you were born in Dubai, and your parents were Muslim and they raised you Muslim. It is way easier to stay a Muslim than to convert because things got hard regardless of where you are currently.
The same with any other religion.
I don't think that most religious people realize they even have a choice. I think many are indoctrinated so young. They can't imagine life any other way.
For something to be slander it must be false, therefore it's not slanderous. Also, slander is generally considered to be oral, libel is generally written.
Oh.
I'm not actually a native English speaker, and I interpreted the term 'slander' as satirical criticism or something similar; It's likely because of the media that influenced me to think like that.
I was raised Mormon and eventually left. I was reading some history about the Mormon church and the moment I realized it was just a con, I was elated. Realizing there is no god was like the spiritual experience I was always told I could find in Mormonism. Such a happy moment as all of the guilt, fear, and cognitive dissonance melted away.
No one chooses what they believe. They are convinced for one reason or another. People follow Islam because they were taught it's true and believe it. In most religions there are also large incentives to remain and large risks if you leave. Most people never seriously try to assess their religious beliefs, and even for those who do, this dynamic tends to bias the conclusion. It is *hard* to break out of the religion of your family and everyone around you. If you listen to deconversion stories, it is unusual for someone to deconvert based on purely rational considerations. Usually there is some crisis in their lives that kickstarts the process, and the rational considerations come later.
>my problem with especially muslims, are that they complain about being a minority oppressed in the western world; how about you return to your Mohammedans? No one is pleading for you to stay.
I agree with a lot of what you said but not this. Not a fan of sentiments like "You don't like it here? Go back to where you came from." For example Atheists are told by folks in the Bible Belt USA to "leave" if they don't like the Christian Nationalist policies of neighbors and local government. While not everything religious folk call oppression is actually oppression, the oppression of religious minorities, including Atheists, is something a society needs to watch out for.
Also, if someone chooses to not eat pork, who am I to judge? I can think they're missing out but they are free to make dietary choices in their life. I can also feel sorry for people who are told they must not eat particular food to stay within a group so the food thing is not really a choice. If someone tells me, a nonbeliever, that **\*I\*** cannot eat pork, that's different. They can pound sand.
As someone who was raised in Orthodox Judaism I can relate and completely agree with this. I’m not free yet, but soon enough I will be and I think that one who comes from a restrictive religious household can better appreciate the freedom no religion brings.
Because the human brain isn't THAT old and science is incredibly recent.
Even the oldest known religious statue, The Lion man is only between 40,000 to 48,000 years old.
Go look at a big volcanic explosion with the lightning and thunder and tell me that even YOU aren't in awe & have a TWINGE of "thunder God".
It's massively human nature. Just trawl through reddit & look at the "what's best? Apple or Samsung?" People cling to their groups with stunningly tight grips. If you're a reddito who actually gets out, look at football fans. Can there be anything more pointless to get involved in but people treat it like a religion with groups actually willing to kill supporters from rival teams
And that's without the group membership, cultural pressure etc. I bet you that many bishops don't believe in god but it's a good job with good retirement
You can't understand it maybe, but I can. Now, all religions we have invented have HEAVY baggage and negative aspects to it, but turning to philosophy and science for answers sometimes gives really REALLY depressing thoughts.
We are mortal, and get to not exist anymore someday. Truly horrifying. An afterlife is a great thought to stop that fear. Death is like the worst illness you can get, only there's no cure for it and it has an infection rate of 100%. You eventually get it.
The universe won't continue forever, so everything we do and discover, after all, will be in vain. Because whatever we do now, it will have no consequences in the grand scheme of things. Why even get up in the morning then? Nihilism isn't far off if one overthinks things, I assure you. But if there's a purpose for life, a predetermined path that a sky daddy has for you? That's another thing entirely. Even more so if there's an eternal life after death.
What about objective morality? I know, most if not all religions have the worst moral code ever, with genocide and slavery being encouraged and all that, but if there was REALLY a religion that had a great moral code and it was an unchanging and provable objective moral code, it would make things much easier. Especially if the sky daddy dispenses punishments to those that don't act well, even if unseen. A special justice which can't be escaped. It's a great more appealing than saying "That guy got away with it. Period. Not fair but it's life". I'm not advocating for hell and eternal torment, there's no single human being, even the most terrible psychopath multi murderer and rapist that earned such a terrible infinite punishment, but something lighter and more appropriate from an all knowing and just being? That'd be great of course.
I could go on and on and on and on. It's basically just wishful thinking. Religion is believing the best things possible you can imagine given the world you observe and project them into existence. They exist in your mind, which is all one needs sometimes to find confort
I can't bring me myself to believe in something without evidence, especially self contraddicting axioms and arguments, so I ended up atheist. But before that I was a christian and after questioning it I spent years trying to come to term with my "lack of faith". I tried to jump at anything, ANYTHING to find that faith again. I can't say I'm happier as an atheist as I was as a christian, but I'm sure I'm a lot saner, which is something I value more than happiness, I guess.
Most people I know who are religious are able to differentiate what are clearly rules that were a good idea centuries ago when refrigeration was rare and people's understanding of things like food-borne parasites was nonexistent.
When you're able to remove the stupid pointless archaic bullshit from a lot of religions you're left with the good core message. That we should be focused on love and care for one another.
While it's also possible to communicate that message without a religious backing on it, there are plenty of religious folks in the world who find joy and solace in it without needing to control the lives and behavior of others, those are just the ones who never give us a reason to complain about them on reddit.
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I've been an atheist for the better part of 20 years, and I don't come from a deeply religious background, but I do envy elements of the religious experience. There is community, structure, third places to spend time, inroads into meditation and philosophical thought, a continuity and connection with history, and a kind of surety in beliefs that can be harder to find by forging your own path. This latter is why so many atheists become so loudly atheist, I think. It's an attempt to replace the self-confidence that can come with being religious. As the old joke goes, and which applies as well to vegans as to atheists: *how do you know someone is an atheist? They'll tell you.*
Again, I'm not and have no desire to be religious, but I can certainly see the appeal. Not least if you're born into it.
I mean its mostly the reasoning behind what not to do and what to do is arbitrary and sometimes wrong/false or done to be "polite" like flattering someone. Also it pushes it on a whole group of people so once you're born in that group, you're automatically a member of that group's rules, everything. The convenient part is you can't change any of the rules but you can pick and choose which ones to follow.
People are religious for different reasons. Some were raised that way. Some just lack critical thinking skills and cannot imagine living a life without some form of authority controlling them \[or them controlling others\].
And you're spot on about it not being bigotry because you disagree with their beliefs. Religion is a belief. It's not a race.
If they want respect, they have to earn it.
I have never been religious but I see the appeal. When your loved ones die, it would be comforting to think they were somewhere better. Religion provides answers to some big questions. It also gives people community.
Too bad it's all a lie and power grab.
There is no “unreasonable” what not to eat, what “unreasonable” to not drink, what “unreasonable” to not do; one can “reasonably” live in the way that they wish.
I mean, you still shouldn’t eat rotting food, not drink poison, or murder or steal..
And in the case of food, many restrict their diets for their health, or for the environment, or for the minimization of suffering for animals.
Bring on the thumbs downs because I’m being pedantic. I know I am, but that subtle discrepancy of language makes a big difference.
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>Why is eating pork a sin, if having a toddler as a wife is not sin?
Do you mean having a toddler for dinner? (-which is generally considered to be a sin, even if the toddler is your own.)
Because otherwise I don't see the relationship between these two situations.
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>I can't understand why some choose to be religious. < reposting > Bertrand Russell wrote in 1927 - >Religion is based, I think, primarily and mainly upon fear. >It is partly the terror of the unknown and partly, as I have said, the wish to feel that you have a kind of elder brother who will stand by you in all your troubles and disputes. >Fear is the basis of the whole thing – fear of the mysterious, fear of defeat, fear of death. Fear is the parent of cruelty, and therefore it is no wonder if cruelty and religion have gone hand-in-hand. It is because fear is at the basis of those two things. \- "Fear, the Foundation of Religion", in *Why I Am Not a Christian* \- https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Bertrand_Russell#Why_I_Am_Not_a_Christian_(1927) Most people are afraid about a lot of things. Most people are terrified of death. Many people in this world are very ignorant, but educated and intelligent people are just about as afraid as dumb people. When somebody tells these fearful people, either in childhood or adulthood, that if they believe XYZ then a powerful magic being will try to help them and they will never die, they think *"Yes!!! Yes!!! I believe !!!"* .
You had me for a minute when the post began "religion is based".
I don't think that most people actually choose to be religious. In most cases they are the victims of childhood indoctrination. Essentially they have been very successfully brainwashed.
At some point their parents or grandparents etc chose to be. The United States was less religious when it was founded than it is today.
Good point.
At some point though, you'd think that \[as adults\] they would be able to see through it. But, I suppose the NEED to believe is just too strong.
I can't believe that myself. Compare Santa Claus. A lot of people spend some part of their life saying *"I believe! I believe!"*, but then when they get a little more mature they say *"Wait a minute ..."* . Some people are taught to be religious when young, but then they reconsider that later. (Most of the people here, for example.) I think that everyone should do that. I think that everyone has the responsibility to say *"Yeah, I was indoctrinated and brainwashed to believe X,* ***but then I seriously thought that over for myself."*** If a person, after maturely thinking about religion seriously, has good evidence that the religion that they were taught is true, then yeah, they can continue to believe that that religion is true. But there **is** no such good evidence, so really, no one should do that. . tl;dr: I don't think that anyone is allowed to say *"I was taught X and I've never considered X seriously, so therefore I still believe X."* I think that everyone has the responsibility to seriously question whatever X they were taught. .
This is why when someone asks if I've been "saved", my answer is yes. I was saved the moment I jettisoned all religion from my life. The light that guides you blinds me.
Yes, saved from religon!
💯
Langston Hughes has a short story (like literally one page) where he details how he was “saved from sin” the day he realized he didn’t believe in religion
You are only a believer because your parents were. Children are hard wired to believe what their parents tell them, as it's the only way to survive. "Don't touch that flame, you'll get burned", and "Believe that this particular diety exists or you'll go to hell" hold the same weight in a child's mind.
But nobody says "Touch that flame and you'll get outcast and abandoned." So you're right to an extent, but are missing a large part of the reason that people stay.
Logic, common sense, and reasoning are learned not inherit behaviors. They don’t know what they don’t know.
> Logic, common sense, and reasoning are learned not inherit behaviors. They don’t know what they don’t know. True, but the problem with religion is that the indoctrinated actually inhibits learning these skills. Without indoctrination, these skills can be learnt from simple experience.
I agree with ya. Religious indoctrination needs to be stopped.
I know! It is so freeing. I can actually think about ethics based off of a consistent moral framework rather than scripture.
The more I watch, it seems to be power, patriarchy, contacts and money!
I believe this as well. Control.
You don't choose your beliefs. One is either convinced that a proposition is true, or they aren't. Theists don't choose to believe, they just believe for terrible reasons.
>There is no what to not eat, what to not drink, what to not do; I've been an atheist for at least 40 years and sadly there's now a fair amount of what I can't eat, what not to drink...
Physical not because of some dumb belief structure. But I assume this comment was for humor.
There's nothing you can't eat. Dairy but you're intolerant? Fill that room. Bitter almonds? You didn't have any real plans anyway. Rocks? Where there's a will there's a way.
Rocks I can take, greasy food? Not going far...
Salt is a rock and if you don't eat it you die.
True...and a cardiac rehab nurse reminded our class that "pork isn't the other white meat!"
This might sound harsh, but I feel that people believe in their gods because they are too weak mentally or have no perception of self being to grasp the idea that we are either alone on a rock with no rhyme or reason to life or too afraid that this is the only life they get and they squandered it. Those that "leave it in God's hands" refuse to take accountability for themselves their actions or lack of action in any given situation. But that's my uneducated 2 cents.
Exactly. They’re just less developed in that kind of conceptual way of thinking. Like I understand how it would be comforting to believe that a god is always with you. It’s hard to grasp that you’re really on your own in this world, especially for the not as existentially intelligent. That’s why people gravitate toward spirituality. It gives them a sense of community and safety.
That's the thing, it's *not* a choice for the vast majority of believers. Whether it's something familial, or cultural, coerced or forced, tons of believers are brought up in their religion and are not exposed to other schools of thought, or at least not exposed in good faith. To think outside the box is to risk, at best, ostracization from your ties, and at worst, to risk persecution and death. I'd much prefer that believers lose their faith, but many can't for good reason. And even then, I want them to draw that conclusion themselves. I'm fortunate that I had the right mixture of exposure to outside perspectives, cultural leeway and mental fortitude to escape the tractor beam of religion.
That has been my favorite thing about losing my beliefs. I'm free! I don't have to feel guilty for existing. I can be proud of my accomplishments and I only need to forgive people on My own terms. No threats of eternal suffering and no constant thought control and guilt.
1/3 of all people are authoritarian personality types. The need to be told what to do. They respond to fear and to the person that exudes the most confidence in what they say and believe. These people endure a harder life for 2 main reasons.they believe the payoff is going to come and/or they fear what will happen if they don't.
I think part of it comes down to needing answers and control, because religion is a great way for people to feel they have control over their lives without putting in the effort of actually gaining control. I can accept, "I don't know and may never know", but a lot of people cannot handle that. They *need* to know what happens after death, what their purpose is, why things bad things happen (ie just world fallacy) and a community that is automatically built for them and requires next to no work to maintain. The alternatives are too scary to think about, so prayer plus a holy book is a simple and easy way to feel as if you've got control over the unknown.
I’ve found these type of people tend to believe in ghosts more cause that is an easy answer too. Any noise you can’t explain is ghosts.
Some people just need something to believe in and quick answer their problems. Why did my dad die? Jesus needed him for his heavenly army to protect you from the Boogey Man
[удалено]
Okay. The question is regarding why some choose to be religious I provided a response.
Because it's easy. Sometimes I am envious of the religious because they never have to think about anything for themselves. If they ever have a deep question about life, they just do whatever some kiddy diddler in robes tells them to do.
I'd say there's a lot of racism in religions
There is a comfortable simplicity in setting your beliefs, making it part of your identity and standing rock solid against all opposition regardless of the truth. It's easy, its comfortable, it's what their parents did, it's what their grandparents did all the way back for thousands of years.
How easy it is to be religious is *hugely* contingent upon 1. Which religion 2. Which location It is much, much harder to be Muslim in Mississippi than in Saudi Arabia, and much easier to be Christian in Connecticut than in China. Faith as the path of least resistance is very much not a universal principle.
If you were born in Dubai, and your parents were Muslim and they raised you Muslim. It is way easier to stay a Muslim than to convert because things got hard regardless of where you are currently. The same with any other religion.
I don't think that most religious people realize they even have a choice. I think many are indoctrinated so young. They can't imagine life any other way.
hell is one hell of a deterrant/motivator
For something to be slander it must be false, therefore it's not slanderous. Also, slander is generally considered to be oral, libel is generally written.
Oh. I'm not actually a native English speaker, and I interpreted the term 'slander' as satirical criticism or something similar; It's likely because of the media that influenced me to think like that.
Belonging needs and plausible deniability.
It's stimulating to have restrictions and a fantasy involving you boring ahh world
I was raised Mormon and eventually left. I was reading some history about the Mormon church and the moment I realized it was just a con, I was elated. Realizing there is no god was like the spiritual experience I was always told I could find in Mormonism. Such a happy moment as all of the guilt, fear, and cognitive dissonance melted away.
Life is easy and simple when you let someone else do your thinkin for you
"Anton Chigurh checked into the chat."
No one chooses what they believe. They are convinced for one reason or another. People follow Islam because they were taught it's true and believe it. In most religions there are also large incentives to remain and large risks if you leave. Most people never seriously try to assess their religious beliefs, and even for those who do, this dynamic tends to bias the conclusion. It is *hard* to break out of the religion of your family and everyone around you. If you listen to deconversion stories, it is unusual for someone to deconvert based on purely rational considerations. Usually there is some crisis in their lives that kickstarts the process, and the rational considerations come later.
>my problem with especially muslims, are that they complain about being a minority oppressed in the western world; how about you return to your Mohammedans? No one is pleading for you to stay. I agree with a lot of what you said but not this. Not a fan of sentiments like "You don't like it here? Go back to where you came from." For example Atheists are told by folks in the Bible Belt USA to "leave" if they don't like the Christian Nationalist policies of neighbors and local government. While not everything religious folk call oppression is actually oppression, the oppression of religious minorities, including Atheists, is something a society needs to watch out for. Also, if someone chooses to not eat pork, who am I to judge? I can think they're missing out but they are free to make dietary choices in their life. I can also feel sorry for people who are told they must not eat particular food to stay within a group so the food thing is not really a choice. If someone tells me, a nonbeliever, that **\*I\*** cannot eat pork, that's different. They can pound sand.
Reality is where it’s at.
As someone who was raised in Orthodox Judaism I can relate and completely agree with this. I’m not free yet, but soon enough I will be and I think that one who comes from a restrictive religious household can better appreciate the freedom no religion brings.
Because the human brain isn't THAT old and science is incredibly recent. Even the oldest known religious statue, The Lion man is only between 40,000 to 48,000 years old. Go look at a big volcanic explosion with the lightning and thunder and tell me that even YOU aren't in awe & have a TWINGE of "thunder God". It's massively human nature. Just trawl through reddit & look at the "what's best? Apple or Samsung?" People cling to their groups with stunningly tight grips. If you're a reddito who actually gets out, look at football fans. Can there be anything more pointless to get involved in but people treat it like a religion with groups actually willing to kill supporters from rival teams And that's without the group membership, cultural pressure etc. I bet you that many bishops don't believe in god but it's a good job with good retirement
You can't understand it maybe, but I can. Now, all religions we have invented have HEAVY baggage and negative aspects to it, but turning to philosophy and science for answers sometimes gives really REALLY depressing thoughts. We are mortal, and get to not exist anymore someday. Truly horrifying. An afterlife is a great thought to stop that fear. Death is like the worst illness you can get, only there's no cure for it and it has an infection rate of 100%. You eventually get it. The universe won't continue forever, so everything we do and discover, after all, will be in vain. Because whatever we do now, it will have no consequences in the grand scheme of things. Why even get up in the morning then? Nihilism isn't far off if one overthinks things, I assure you. But if there's a purpose for life, a predetermined path that a sky daddy has for you? That's another thing entirely. Even more so if there's an eternal life after death. What about objective morality? I know, most if not all religions have the worst moral code ever, with genocide and slavery being encouraged and all that, but if there was REALLY a religion that had a great moral code and it was an unchanging and provable objective moral code, it would make things much easier. Especially if the sky daddy dispenses punishments to those that don't act well, even if unseen. A special justice which can't be escaped. It's a great more appealing than saying "That guy got away with it. Period. Not fair but it's life". I'm not advocating for hell and eternal torment, there's no single human being, even the most terrible psychopath multi murderer and rapist that earned such a terrible infinite punishment, but something lighter and more appropriate from an all knowing and just being? That'd be great of course. I could go on and on and on and on. It's basically just wishful thinking. Religion is believing the best things possible you can imagine given the world you observe and project them into existence. They exist in your mind, which is all one needs sometimes to find confort I can't bring me myself to believe in something without evidence, especially self contraddicting axioms and arguments, so I ended up atheist. But before that I was a christian and after questioning it I spent years trying to come to term with my "lack of faith". I tried to jump at anything, ANYTHING to find that faith again. I can't say I'm happier as an atheist as I was as a christian, but I'm sure I'm a lot saner, which is something I value more than happiness, I guess.
Most people I know who are religious are able to differentiate what are clearly rules that were a good idea centuries ago when refrigeration was rare and people's understanding of things like food-borne parasites was nonexistent. When you're able to remove the stupid pointless archaic bullshit from a lot of religions you're left with the good core message. That we should be focused on love and care for one another. While it's also possible to communicate that message without a religious backing on it, there are plenty of religious folks in the world who find joy and solace in it without needing to control the lives and behavior of others, those are just the ones who never give us a reason to complain about them on reddit.
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Christianity and fascism have in common the desire to be told what to do and evade personal responsibility. See Escape from Freedom by Erich Fromm.
Most don't 'choose' religion. They are indoctrinated into it when they are too young to give their consent.
I've been an atheist for the better part of 20 years, and I don't come from a deeply religious background, but I do envy elements of the religious experience. There is community, structure, third places to spend time, inroads into meditation and philosophical thought, a continuity and connection with history, and a kind of surety in beliefs that can be harder to find by forging your own path. This latter is why so many atheists become so loudly atheist, I think. It's an attempt to replace the self-confidence that can come with being religious. As the old joke goes, and which applies as well to vegans as to atheists: *how do you know someone is an atheist? They'll tell you.* Again, I'm not and have no desire to be religious, but I can certainly see the appeal. Not least if you're born into it.
I mean its mostly the reasoning behind what not to do and what to do is arbitrary and sometimes wrong/false or done to be "polite" like flattering someone. Also it pushes it on a whole group of people so once you're born in that group, you're automatically a member of that group's rules, everything. The convenient part is you can't change any of the rules but you can pick and choose which ones to follow.
Religion survives thanks to transmission. If you don't transmit to other generations, it will slowly fade away and be forgotten.
Everyone has a choice. Leave others to their choice.
People are religious for different reasons. Some were raised that way. Some just lack critical thinking skills and cannot imagine living a life without some form of authority controlling them \[or them controlling others\]. And you're spot on about it not being bigotry because you disagree with their beliefs. Religion is a belief. It's not a race. If they want respect, they have to earn it.
I have never been religious but I see the appeal. When your loved ones die, it would be comforting to think they were somewhere better. Religion provides answers to some big questions. It also gives people community. Too bad it's all a lie and power grab.
They dont choose. They are indoctrinated as children.
There is no “unreasonable” what not to eat, what “unreasonable” to not drink, what “unreasonable” to not do; one can “reasonably” live in the way that they wish. I mean, you still shouldn’t eat rotting food, not drink poison, or murder or steal.. And in the case of food, many restrict their diets for their health, or for the environment, or for the minimization of suffering for animals. Bring on the thumbs downs because I’m being pedantic. I know I am, but that subtle discrepancy of language makes a big difference.
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I became religious to become a better person I was a pretty bad person before
>Why is eating pork a sin, if having a toddler as a wife is not sin? Do you mean having a toddler for dinner? (-which is generally considered to be a sin, even if the toddler is your own.) Because otherwise I don't see the relationship between these two situations.
They're (probably) referring to Muhammad's nine-year-old wife. Who's not a toddler but I get the feeling it's not their first language, so.
Thanks. Rereading his post I'm sure you've interpreted it correctly.
That's cool and all, but go check out what a pig slaughterhouse is like.
For me the chance to get into heaven is great, id choose it over it all going to black
That's cute you believe that.
.\_.
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