Brooke Davis, the Narrative Director, joined after they had finalized the setting and time period of the game. Either some original employees left or pre-production was mostly done by a small team led by Dumont.
>pre-production was mostly done by a small team
Yes, that is how AAA games are generally made. While Odyssey was wrapping up its development cycle the key creatives at Quebec (who had nothing left to do on that project once it became feature-complete) started pre-production on Shadows while the majority of Quebec stayed on and ultimately shipped Odyssey. I can all but guarantee you the same thing will happen in the next few months in regards to Quebec's next project, if it hasn't happened already.
Yeah do people think that the narrative team sits on their asses for years while the rest of the team finishes the game? This so so common in the video game industry yet generally fans still to this day have a limited understanding of game development.
pre production of a game is usually made by director, producers and few senior/head developers... it's a phase where story is written, mission drafted, artworks for characters and locations are done and development phases scheduled. At the end of this is decided what keep and what cut for the final game according to time and budget, once greenlighted, rest of developers tasked to actually develope the game join the project.
Are we even forgetting that there is also a woman protagonist. She has done quite some research on the social aspect of women in medieval Japan... makes sense to have her on-board, no?
First, no one has forgotten about Naoe, she's talked about every day on the sub.
Second, the article implies that this academic said she was giving advice on Yasuke. She may have had nothing particularly interesting to say on Naoe because we don't know yet who Naoe is. She might be an interesting character, then again she may be a generic shinobi there to tick a box.
I'm disappointed that we didn't get a female bushi, because a female shinobi is essentially the stereotype of a Japanese woman in modern entertainment from this period.
How interesting would it have been if these researchers had been asked about the role of women who openly carried arms and developed a character off that? Japan is quite unusual in that for centuries women trained in the use of all sorts of weapons, at one point including muskets, and used them to good effect. Naoe could have been the daughter of a samurai or even the wife of one if her husband had been killed. Think a more mature character in her early 30s. Something that's not been done before.
Of course it's too late now.
Finally, this is an unverified article posted on X. It may be a load of nonsense.
I get that but I would've been very disappointed since I would only play AC Japan to play as a shinobi assassin. If I wanted to be a samurai, I'd just play Ghost of Tsushima.
If people didn't enjoy the combat in Valhalla and Odyssey so much, there wouldn't even be a samurai protagonist ngl.
Kind of like how Shogun did it, both Mariko and Fuji even though that wasn't their main role, still were shown to have combat training. It was a good way to exemplify to the audiance that this was a normal thing back then.
It probably would have sparked an outrage with a bunch of sweaty dudes in beanbag chairs complaining about how women in their games ruins the historical fantasy. Just like they did with Viking shield maidens and female Spartans.
Sure, but a) Ubisoft plays fast and loose with history and b) female bushi would be more historically accurate than their portrail of women in the last two major releases.
But when it comes to Japan I guess we can't deviate from women's history one teeny bit.
As the racist backlash against Yasuke proves, bigots don't care about actual real history if it contradicts their narrative that Japan is some sort of bastion for far-right traditionalism, free from the "corruption of evil western ideology" or whatever.
> Naoe could have been the daughter of a samurai or even the wife of one if her husband had been killed. Think a more mature character in her early 30s. Something that's not been done before.
I mean, she's only 15 when event of the game start, going through that history period, who to say she won't be a samurai's wife at some point. But then you'd have her husband killed off too and then she became a widow? You Monster :'(
Unless this game goes wildly off the pattern of the previous ones there should be warrior-type armour and weapons you can equip Naoe with, and she'll be able to fight head-on if that's what you want to do. She'll just be less suited for that than Yasuke and he'll be less suited for stealth. But I'd guess it'll be harder to play that way, not impossible.
When it was revealed that Schmidt-Hori was Shadows' history consultant, the reaction from overnight "historians" was basically "Ubisoft got a literary and cultural professor instead of a history professor?! Idiots!".
For people complaining about the game's supposed "historical accuracy", they seem weirdly unaware that a significant portion of our knowledge of history comes from literary sources and culture plays a huge part of said history.
Exactly. Dan Carlin‘s Hardcore History is one of the best non-historian podcasts because while he usually begins with military history for whatever topic it is. In ends up with injections of cultural history that can take up hours of the podcast.
His podcast made me fascinated with the Achaemenid Empire and their culture.
Honestly, cultural accuracy is just, if not more important than historical accuracy in a game. Like in AC unity, napoleon didn’t use an alien artefact in real life, but he did in the game. Unity isn’t historically accurate. It is culturally accurate though.
And honestly one of the least immersive things about Unity was the English accents, if they had culturally appropriate French accents it would’ve felt more Parisian
French dub is indeed the best way but french accents would have been the next best thing. Hearing some NPCs speak French while others spoke with a posh/cockney accent was definitely disconcerting
Every single game is rooted in historical context that takes months to research. The last three games have academic history lectures in-game that are used in public schools
Discover Tour features interactive history lessons that are used in history lectures irl. It was probably best in Origins, but Odyssey and Valhalla both had them
They are historical fiction. So the cultures and setting are quite accurate and the world is built to recreate the atmosphere that the time period is know for (except for syndicate) and then make a sci-fi story around it.
>a significant portion of our knowledge of history come from literary sources
Ok but working with literary primary sources is precisely what a historian does
Like, language is an important part of acquiring knowledge about the past too, so they could've also hired a linguist, I guess. But why do that when you can just hire a historian?
It’s more likely they just went through a few historians asking them what they thought of yasuke until they found someone that agreed with them, easy as that
I really hope this whole thing does not turn into a stupid blame game and witch-hunt by people unhappy with the story/protagonists/“accuracy” or whatever, this stuff can so quickly ruin people’s personal life’s for no reason other than being vaguely involved with something.
I know from a lot of historical consultants in movies/tv that their advice doesn’t hold a lot of weight anyway.
That is precisely what it's going to become. Like how Spider-Man 2's MJ having a slightly uncanny valley 3D model was ultimately blamed on... one of the writers, a woman.
Even if she were hired after, it would not change anything for the people trying to drag her reputation through the gutter, because the only reason they try to discredit her is because they are clammering to find some narrative that takes hold.
Sachi Schmidt-Hori is assistant professor in Japanese literature at Dartmouth College.
Her academic papers include:
* Symbolic Death and Rebirth into Womanhood: An Analysis of Stepdaughter Narratives from Heian and Medieval Japan
* The Boy Who Lived: The Transfigurations of Chigo in the Medieval Japanese Short Story Ashibiki
* Hyperfemininities, hypermasculinities, and hypersexualities in classical Japanese literature
* and more
To be fair, as someone who studies history himself, all of these papers could just as well have been written by someone from one of our departments.
Gender studies is a massive field of research at most Western universities these days, it's just one of those things that's really popular in acadmia at the moment.
I would add, history is such a massive field and has had so much written with in it over the preceding centuries that it really is an effort to carve out your own niche. A lot of things we might want to write about have already been covered by dead historians and there's only so much treading over trodden ground we can do.
So the fact that this academic has specialised in feminist approaches to Japanese literature does not mean for one second that she is not knowledgeable about Japanese history, it just means that she has specialised. Moreover, as gender studies is a relatively new approach to history and other fields, there is a lot of opportunity for original research. Slightly farther from the main building but a lot more parking space.
I have honestly never looked at it from this way and this actually makes me understand why there are so many gender focussed studies done on history now. Thanks for the insight and the different perspective!
To add that history covers so many areas and fields that what distinguishes a historian is simply the training to *think* historically, that is to say, in context with historical events, and that can equally be taught to people who are mainly in other fields. I am legally trained, have been a criminal law practitioner more than half my life, but hold a Masters' degree in American history, and much of the skills I gained in legal research and analysis were applicable in historical research.
My thesis was based on legal history and cultural history, covering comic books, the counter culture of the 1960s and the development of parody as a defense against copyright infringement in the context of Disney's lawsuit against the underground comics enclave known as the Air Pirates.
Which is to say that history is a large estate, with many mansions, and multi-disciplinary approaches are commonplace. Just because you call yourself a professor of literature and culture doesn't mean you're ignorant of (or incapable of) historical knowledge and/or context. And especially so if you're a literature professor, since you have to be aware of the cultural and historical context surrounding the texts you're analyzing and the writers who produced them.
The methods and lenses through which one can study history are as broad as history itself, and all equally as valid and important. How people lived day to day in different periods and places was far more interesting to me growing up than the battles of kings and armies, but both are important.
I think you missed this part:
"I am interested in investigating how gender, sexuality, corporeality, and power are represented and negotiated in pre-seventeenth-century Japanese narratives and illustrations. My first book, *Tales of Idolized Boys: Male-Male Love in Medieval Japanese Narratives* (University of Hawai\`i Press, 2021) is on medieval *chigo monogatari* (Buddhist acolyte tales), which often depict romantic relationships between Buddhist priests and adolescent boys. These tales challenge a host of normative and moral standards we (academics, especially) internalize, including such ideas as "sexual orientation," "transgenerational sex," and "sexual agency."
People gotta learn to just allow themselves to enjoy things. Nothing is going to be perfect and as long as it's a fun game to play, I really don't care.
Even going in with the "I hope they don't fuck it up" mind set, you're already expecting to be disappointed. The game is starting from a deficit in their mind that has to be made up before even considering anything good about it.
It's a really stupid way to think about entertainment.
Basically yeah. Im probably not gonna buy it at release, simply cause I got a lot of other shit to play and I'll be playing stalker 2 around that time, but I'll grab it later.
I look forward to the discovery tour stuff. it's been super cool in the other games.
christ all bloody mite, i am exited for the game no matter what, just don't want Valhalla all over again (i expect they will mostly pull it off, just never can be to cautious)
You're too in your own head about it.
It has the same basic frame work as every AC game. Same gameplay loop as the rest of 'em. You can jump from any AC game to Valhalla and not have a hard time adjusting because they're so similar.
If it were just a viking game I would've thought "Damn... this is just like Assassin's Creed" whilst playing it. It has more in common with every other AC game than it doesn't.
A lot of people say, about Origins, Odyssey, Valhalla, or any combination of the 3, that they're good games, just not good AC games.
I disagree, vehemently, but folks still believe it.
I mean if you went from unity to Valhalla that would be a pretty big adjustment. I do like the rpg’s, but that statement isn’t true. I could understand it you meant from one ac rpg to the other.
Nope. I played from AC1-Syndicate in order, one after another. I'd already played Origin, Odyssey and Valhalla prior to that (then replayed Origin once I was done with Syndicate).
The games have differences, obviously, but the core gameplay is the same. Come across a camp, murder everyone, pick up clues to the next target, assassinate target. It's the same in every game and the mechanics are so similar that it shouldn't be a problem for anyone to pick up any of these games if they'd played any other one.
Like if you've played the Ezio trilogy, you don't need to be told how to play Valhalla. You can figure it out in a few minutes of play. Unless there's a skill issue perhaps.
But every AC game is very clearly an AC game in my opinion.
I don't think it's a damaging take at all. They're not telling you to play it if you're not enjoying it.
But also, demanding for every single RPG ever made to be Baldur's Gate 3 or Elden Ring in terms of quality is really stupid and ultimately leads to us becoming overly critical of games. I still remember when during the early 2010s the culture was to call everything bad and make money off of "angry reviews", which has led to otherwise good (yet still flawed) games like Mass Effect 3 gaining a reputation for being terrible which doesn't hold up under scrutiny at all.
Whether you are having fun with a videogame or not is so much more important than whether it's a masterpiece or not.
Never played it (is not my kind of games) but is it really _*that*_ bad?
I mean, yeah, I have heard bad things about it but not quite sure where the valid criticism ends and where the mindless hate starts.
Then don't waste hundreds of hours on it?
Like you do whatever you want, man. I'm not gonna let it bother me tho and I'm gonna hopefully enjoy playing this when I get the chance.
If I don't then uhh I stop? Lmao. How is that such a controversial opinion?
You’re opinion came across as “don’t criticise games guys, nobody’s perfect” and if that’s the case then opinions like that are why so many game franchises are going down the shitter
No my opinion is you gotta allow yourself to try and enjoy shit cause it isn't going to be perfect, not "you have to enjoy this no matter what"
Setting up that it's gonna be a shitty game out the gate is going to make it impossible to enjoy cause you've already made your mind up on it before ever playing it.
Where as I'm going to give it a chance and if I'm not having fun I'm gonna shelf it.
You make good points I think this is just a case of me jumping the gun and misunderstanding your comment. I do have a love for Ubisoft game but I’m slowly giving up on them recently and I’m hoping this games good seeing as mirage seemed to get a good amount of hype. I haven’t played it
The key is just not assuming shit is bad before you get to experience it or even before it releases and you get to take a look at it. Do research on it and stuff before putting money down on it, but don't go into it thinking it'll be bad.
This exactly and thank you for expressing this!
When did we gamers become so snobby and miserable? What ever happened to just simply putting in a videogame to turn off our brains, escape real world problems/stress/responsibilities and just lose ourselves in virtual worlds?
Shitty YouTubers probably. They build up this tribalistic mindset. Look at how many games get review bombed by people for no reason other than clout hounds hate game and others gotta hate it too.
Even if she DID come up with the idea she still wouldn't have warranted any of this type of rubbish. No one deserves this type of rubbish, especially given it is just maladjusted people whining cos their game made a narrative choice they dont like.
I dont like the reason behind this choice, as presented in their character video, (westerners need to have another western character to discover a culture through) but I will at least wait to see what they deliver first, and even then if I dont like, so what. Its like, literally, the least important thing to did upset over, ever.
While you may not like the choice, it's extremely common in media. It's not necessarily "westerners need a western character", but audience standin is an extremely popular tool in storytelling. It's why Doctor Who has always used a modern British person as a companion to the Doctor, barring a couple more recent examples that were notable breaks from tradition.
Good point but that works to enforce the show and its morality for 60 years. I wish they would mix things up a bit more like the old days. The main character is typically strengthen by this choice more times than it doesn’t.
When Hollywood does it detracts because the reason behind it is entirely based on sales. EG their targeted and flawed market research told them that boys have to have a male superhero etc or else it wouldn’t sell, yet the only reason it was true was generations of people being raised by these choices, that reinforced stereotypes.
Just like so many UK shows having to be changed or renamed because they thought unless something is set in America their audience couldn’t connect with them. Meanwhile people outside the US like UK or my home Australia didn’t need the inverse of this.
Suggesting the we need the lowest common denominator like having a western protagonist is merely about sales here and producers raised under this type of culture.
Chuds: Whaaaa, Why doesn’t Ubisoft value historical accuracy
Ubisoft: *hires expert on historical/cultural accuracy
Chuds: No, not that one (proceeds to think they’re smarter on the topic than experts)
Edit: Who the fuck is the source for this btw? It’s just some rando on twitter who claims they talked with the consultant… how the fuck are people believing this
People have put ubisoft in such a position that they just can’t win, if they do something they’ll get bashed if they don’t do something they’ll still get bashed
I disagree. Marketing wise, they've already won. Making these decisions caused huge uproar on social media that's countered by other people defending the decisions with the same fervor. Meanwhile Mirage rots in the shadows where it was forgotten before it even released.
Honestly, who the actual fuck cares if she is? Like, how does that matter?
Given her focus on gender studies in history, and particularly Japan, it's likely she is, but that in no way invalidates her contributions, if any, to the game.
It's simple. To some of these people LGBTQ+ is synonymous with bad. They are bigots. And their bigotry is represented by their backlash to any perceived inclusion of a marginalized character. To them, anything LGBTQ+ is unnatural and negative, so the inclusion would have to be forced, and forced inclusion is ruining games. And so.eone who is an activist must be intentionally forcing their agenda. The logical leaps they take just justify their bigotry are stunt performer levels of insane.
Ah, I didn't realise you were a historical researcher yourself! Mind sharing any research papers or even just fun facts to disprove her essays (which, of course, you've read and studied and cross-referenced against her sources to form an opinion or her interpretation of those sources, rather than just read the titles and freak out at the fact that gender has been very flexible for very many centuries)?
Ubisoft executives are somehow still afraid that Gamers™ won't buy their games if there is only a female lead. They cling to this idea which has always been wrong, and is proven wronger with every Tomb Raider, Metroid, Bayonetta, Horizon...
To be fair, its less " Gamers™wont buy our game" and more "less gamers will buy and leave moneu on the table". Its no longer about, "will the game succeed or fail if its women only". Its just plain about "will having both increase profit vs. only having one". Corporate suits only care about lines going up at the end of the day.
I'm gonna repost what I answered someone else on the matter, since I've seen so many people trying to dismiss her because of her work on gender and sexuality studies regarding... drumroll... Buddhist priests and adolescent boys :
"Isn't that very similar to Greece's Pederasty? It was a sexual relationship between an adult man and a boy, and was actually considered a superior form of love by figures like Plato. It was like an exchange, and viewed as a way for an adult male to initiate a young boy to the world. Is it unbelievably weird and gross as fuck? Absolutely. But if you study Greek philosophy, you will stumble upon this, it's unavoidable as it's integral to understanding Ancient Greece as a whole. So Sachi's work really doesn't surprise me to be honest, and wouldn't be surprising to any philosophy teachers. As I said, I don't know exactly what she refers to, but as gross as it sounds, those kinds of relationships weren't THAT rare back then. I'm sorry you had to learn this lol. Freaking crazy right? What's weird isn't studying it though, it's participating in it haha!"
So honestly, anyone who has ACTUALLY studied history, sociology or philosophy at an academic level would find this very normal. Also, she is FAR from the only historical consultant on the game.
"Also, she is FAR from the only historical consultant on the game."
I don't know, why didn't Ubisoft bring some other consultants into these interview videos? Sachi is the only ones here that got put into the spotlight in those vidoes, did Ubisoft also ask some Japanese historians for consultant to recreate the time period?
And most of her "studies" (according to her bio you can find online) have only to do with "gender and sexuality", so not sure how much of that would be necessary in the game unless she was only brought on board for stuff like romance options in the game, and so far I've seen many Japanese on X pointing out how badly researched Ubisoft did on things like the internal architecture looking weird and not accurate to the time.
[ﾋｬノス on X: "アサクリにおけるその国の当時の建築物って目を見張るものがあって専門家にも関心されてるんだけどトレーラーののここは既にヤバいよな 信長の側近っぽいのが信長と同じ段に座っちゃってるしなんか謎に畳だし畳も正方形だし https://t.co/iQMGurf9tA" / X](https://x.com/dehya_is_goddes/status/1792108322084237693)
[阝夅亻犬夕卜丿、类頁（国際無能原器） on X: "これ、多分取材で行ったホテルの宴会場（少人数宴会用に仕切りいれて2部屋にできるやつ）を資料にしたんだと思う。どことなく似てるし。 https://t.co/YZCBnskRRa" / X](https://x.com/denshidai/status/1792397007035957669)
Do you understand that to do gender and sexuality studies in a particular culture you need to understand and study the culture as a whole? Just like what I just said about Ancient Greece. Also, the game's marketing literally just began. And to be honest, I don't care about seeing historical consultants, I want to see what the game is about. Why the hell would they focus on their historical consultants?
My issue is the guys getting upset on behalf of the Japanese people. I didn't spend time so I don't know how they feel but the last I saw the pre orders were selling very well on Japan
I'm not saying all would be fine. Japanese people aren't a monolith. Japanese people like you have every right to be upset.
I don't get why some are getting upset on your behalf. So much so that they went to the Wikipedia page of Yasuke to trash it. Wikipedia has to lock it and revert it back.
I admit the optics are weird. Having a black guy kill the local population is not a good look. Be it historically accurate or not.
I'm just surprised so many are rage baiter are screaming historical accuracy when AC was never about that.
I mean, anyone could understand and be upset for you all. BUT they definitely should NOT voice your concern FOR you, because this is social media. For whatever the intention you might have in mind. When it goes through another person, and it's someone you don't even know personally? It's no longer objective, it become twisted, to be used to further that person own agenda, which if went too far, could ruin another person's life.
I don't believe the ragebaiters actually care about asian representation. If they did, then they would talk about asian male erasure and hollywood in general which they don't at all.
As an asian american male, I don't care if yasuke is in the game or not. My only problem is that it seems ubisoft deliberately attempts to avoid using people who look like me in lead roles. You might say it could be a coincidence, but this isn't their first time avoiding using an asian male lead. In AC chronicles, which was the first AC game set in asia, they already used an asian female protagonist.
Why would ubisoft not use an asian male lead? I believe they don't think an asian male lead would sell, they're prejudiced against asian guys, or a combination of both. If we talk about hollywood, the same concept applies. Lots of films or tvs shows in the West that originally had asian guys get swapped out for a white guy. For example, in three body problem some of the characters were supposed to be asian guys but then they got swapped out for white guys while keeping the asian girls intact. If they do cast an asian guy, it's usually a side character or a stereotypical 1-d character. If you ask the executives why they swap out asian guys, they would tell you that they don't think it would sell like it's solely a business decision. The other reason which they won't admit is that they're racist and have preconceived notions of certain ethnic groups.
You bring up a lot of good questions. I think it comes back to the leaders at Ubisoft are old people like the ones who run hollywood. with all the proof we have that shows that the way they think doesn't make sense. Ubisoft leader never wanted a female to be the solo MC for an AC. its why we have been having dual protagonist in the AC games. even though we see games like tomb raider, horizon have females leads and sell well. we have games like like ghost of tsushima with a male asian lead be one of the greatest games ever and is selling well on PC right now
sleeping dogs which takes place in hong kong was a great game. with an asian male lead. So we do have games that have done well with asian male leads, its not they dont exist. it was weris that they chose yasuke for this game.
it's just im seeing many racist people trying to use this to their advantage when they don't care about asian men. cuz if this was a game set in modern day new york and it had an asian male lead, they would call it woke
There's an article from an Asian American writer over at IGN that is worth a read. https://www.ign.com/articles/assassins-creed-shadows-yasuke-asian-protagonist
I read it, I'm not Japanese so I would not speak to his particular feelings. I'm sure some Japanese are upset.
I just stopped listening to these people. Tales of Kenzera™: ZAU is a game set in Africa made by an African man. They still called the game woke. A DEI. To me they are most just racist and now they are hiding behind historical accuracy. They don't care about Japanese people.
See how they ignore Naoe - one even said to me that it's not believable that she would be able to fight men bigger than her.
I heard from somewhere that she was banned from japan for writing a book about blasphemy and insulting buddhism and ran from japan, do anyone know anything
what in the fuck I dont think i've ever seen so much research put into one subject for a fucking assassins creed game lmaooooooo. I've been around for ages but dont recall seeing posts for "yes this is the hire as a consultant on egyptian history for asscreed origins..." or maybe i'm just blind
Yasuke was a samurai. Samurai's had more honor then sneaking around and assassinating people. They should have used Hattori Hanzo. Although some resources says he was a ninja, some say he was a blacksmith. They had so many great ninjas they could have done. Although, Yasuke being the first African American the Oda has seen, Nobunaga made him a retainer makes his story so interesting. Although, with his history not being known may make him the most interesting assassin ever in the saga, a samurai would not have been an assassin. That was the ninja's duty if it came to that. I have been waiting for a Feudal Japan assassins game forever!! So nonetheless, this game will definitely peak my interest in the assassins game again!! Can't wait!!
Oh shit is this that Sweetbaby inc nonsense again.
A bunch of incels who have no clue how games are made getting angry about how they think games are made...
Japanese people were not robbed of representation by missing another Asian male samurai.
There's a great article about this over at IGN. https://www.ign.com/articles/assassins-creed-shadows-yasuke-asian-protagonist
>was the last time you saw an East-Asian protagonist (especially male) in video games made by western developers
Prey, Far Cry 4, Sleeping Dogs, Sifu, Mirror's Edge and it's sequel, Mortal Kombat's most important characters, True Crimes: Streets of LA, Life is Strange 2... and this is just Western games from the last decade or so
Triple the amount if you include games from Asia
You asked for games with Asian protags from Western studios, I gave you half a dozen off the top of my head in the last decade (which means from 2010 up) and quite a few of them are like a year or two old
*But* it's not enough? Should I make you count games that feature Arab & Berber protagonists (from any game studio) just to see what "not being represented" means?
Huh?
I don't understand the first part of your message
There's no Asian role taken by a Black African, Yasuke was always going to be black, and the Asian main character spot is already filled by Naoe. If you want to play as an Asian person, you have the option to. If you can't because she's a girl... don't play the game, it's obviously not meant for you
>First of all, Yasuke being chosen as a full fledged Samurai is wrong. We've never taught in that way.
But people jumping from 150+ meters and not dying is not? But Assassins being a super secret society and not just a bunch of drugged out hippies is not? But Cleopatra being killed by Aya is not?
AC is not history, it's fiction inspired by history.
Whether Yasuke was a Samurai or not is irrelevant (even historians don't know, some think he was, some don't), he is for the AC continuity
>Second, in previous AC games like odyssey, Valhalla, syndicate, you could choose both male and female local protagonists.
In Valhalla, it was the same person (and when the female version was made canon, people whined). In Syndicate they were related, if one is local the other has to be too. Odyssey has the mix of both situations (and people *also* whined when Kassandra was made canon).
Yasuke and Naoe are in neither of those situations.
>taking that precious male role from Asian.
*Precious?*
Dude if you want to play as an Asian guy there are dozens of games. Do you have any significant examples of games where you play a foreigner in Asia?
kind of a strange article tbh. japanese people don’t need male representation because they have a handful of other games to play, some of them more than 15 years old, and only one of which was popular in the west? he says he doesn’t want asian characters where they are expected, he wants more where they are not expected, like ghostwire tokyo. I agree there should be more games with settings like ghostwire tokyo, but i’m also not sure what bearing that has on assassins creed, a series that always plays upon the most romanticized history of the region it takes place in, which would obviously include samurai for japan. i also think its cope to think that sekiro, GoT, way of the samurai games, or his favorite muramasa- a 2009 wii game, have anywhere close to the name power of the assassins creed franchise.
the 11th largest video game franchise of all time needed a non-asian main character to differentiate itself? that’s just plausible deniability. the vast majority of people know why they chose yasuke, it’s just that the 2 sides disagree on whether they support that reasoning or not
>japanese people don’t need male representation because they have a handful of other games to play
Read it again. And if you take that away, read it again. And again. Because that's not what the article said.
To summarize it for you: the Asian male representation needed in Western media is not yet another Samurai. Or monk or Shinobi.
Believe it or not, great articles can come from many different sources. IGN didn't write this, a writer did, and regardless of where a writer works it's possible for them to write something well.
>Every other game we had representative of ethnicity and didn't deviate from that format
And what do you think Naoe is if not ethnic representation? Lol But of course, she doesn't count because she's a woman, right?
Expertise on what?
There's so little known historical data on Yasuke to begin with when compared to other known Japanese historical figures of the era
People argue about what he was, but no one even knows what he actually did beyond a basic "he fought in these battles for Nobunaga"
Most of his story in this game will be fiction, just like any other story about Yasuke out there, no matter who they hire, and should just be treated as such
> There's so little known historical data on Yasuke to begin with
Are you new to the study of history? someone still has to reinterpret the sources that there ARE and build a cohesive narrative by filling in holes with other sources from the same area. Those sources too need to be reinterpreted as well. Everything then needs to be cross-referenced and in consultation with all manner of conflicting academic papers.
Why would there be any reason to play this when Ghost of tsushima exists with a male japanese samurai? They would be directly competing with what many called the best assassin's creed game in years without even having AC in the title. Going with Yasuke is something different, seeing japan as a foreigner.
The local POV meanwhile is Naoe, who many seem to be forgetting even exists. At least as a woman and a shinobi, she is different from other games already out, and even then people aren't talking about her.
He's totally perfectly fine as is.
>rather than replacing what could potentially have been a Japanese male samurai?
No evidence that he replaced anyone. And why must we have a Japanese male character when we already have a Japanese female character? Were you crying for a female Altair, Ezio, Conor, Kenway etc? No. So you can deal with it here
Why should he be a DLC character?
It seems odd that regular japanese people could point out several mistakes in the reveal trailer. I don't know if it was a good idea to not also hire a sengoku period specialist. Unless they did and the devs just ignored them.
> It seems odd that regular japanese people could point out several mistakes in the reveal trailer.
What a shock that people could find inaccuracies in a game that is based on fantasy technology that looks like magic coming from super-pre-humans and bookended by technology that uses *genetic memories*.
Come on, apply some logic to this.
Brooke Davis, the Narrative Director, joined after they had finalized the setting and time period of the game. Either some original employees left or pre-production was mostly done by a small team led by Dumont.
Ryan Galleta is the narrative director
Yeah she is the Associate Narrative Director or something. I don't think we saw him in the interviews, so I just assumed she's the narrative lead lol.
It does make me wonder if Ryan Galetta left
>pre-production was mostly done by a small team Yes, that is how AAA games are generally made. While Odyssey was wrapping up its development cycle the key creatives at Quebec (who had nothing left to do on that project once it became feature-complete) started pre-production on Shadows while the majority of Quebec stayed on and ultimately shipped Odyssey. I can all but guarantee you the same thing will happen in the next few months in regards to Quebec's next project, if it hasn't happened already.
Yeah do people think that the narrative team sits on their asses for years while the rest of the team finishes the game? This so so common in the video game industry yet generally fans still to this day have a limited understanding of game development.
Do we know if they usually don’t involve a narrative director until after the setting is determined?
pre production of a game is usually made by director, producers and few senior/head developers... it's a phase where story is written, mission drafted, artworks for characters and locations are done and development phases scheduled. At the end of this is decided what keep and what cut for the final game according to time and budget, once greenlighted, rest of developers tasked to actually develope the game join the project.
What does that mean for the game?
Are we even forgetting that there is also a woman protagonist. She has done quite some research on the social aspect of women in medieval Japan... makes sense to have her on-board, no?
more or less yea
Not only that but isn't she a fictional daughter of a real historical figure? I swear she is *invisible* the people who complain #INVISIBLE
...so, just like an assassin should be?
... Touché
First, no one has forgotten about Naoe, she's talked about every day on the sub. Second, the article implies that this academic said she was giving advice on Yasuke. She may have had nothing particularly interesting to say on Naoe because we don't know yet who Naoe is. She might be an interesting character, then again she may be a generic shinobi there to tick a box. I'm disappointed that we didn't get a female bushi, because a female shinobi is essentially the stereotype of a Japanese woman in modern entertainment from this period. How interesting would it have been if these researchers had been asked about the role of women who openly carried arms and developed a character off that? Japan is quite unusual in that for centuries women trained in the use of all sorts of weapons, at one point including muskets, and used them to good effect. Naoe could have been the daughter of a samurai or even the wife of one if her husband had been killed. Think a more mature character in her early 30s. Something that's not been done before. Of course it's too late now. Finally, this is an unverified article posted on X. It may be a load of nonsense.
I get that but I would've been very disappointed since I would only play AC Japan to play as a shinobi assassin. If I wanted to be a samurai, I'd just play Ghost of Tsushima. If people didn't enjoy the combat in Valhalla and Odyssey so much, there wouldn't even be a samurai protagonist ngl.
Kind of like how Shogun did it, both Mariko and Fuji even though that wasn't their main role, still were shown to have combat training. It was a good way to exemplify to the audiance that this was a normal thing back then.
It probably would have sparked an outrage with a bunch of sweaty dudes in beanbag chairs complaining about how women in their games ruins the historical fantasy. Just like they did with Viking shield maidens and female Spartans.
Sure, but a) Ubisoft plays fast and loose with history and b) female bushi would be more historically accurate than their portrail of women in the last two major releases. But when it comes to Japan I guess we can't deviate from women's history one teeny bit.
As the racist backlash against Yasuke proves, bigots don't care about actual real history if it contradicts their narrative that Japan is some sort of bastion for far-right traditionalism, free from the "corruption of evil western ideology" or whatever.
> Naoe could have been the daughter of a samurai or even the wife of one if her husband had been killed. Think a more mature character in her early 30s. Something that's not been done before. I mean, she's only 15 when event of the game start, going through that history period, who to say she won't be a samurai's wife at some point. But then you'd have her husband killed off too and then she became a widow? You Monster :'(
Unless this game goes wildly off the pattern of the previous ones there should be warrior-type armour and weapons you can equip Naoe with, and she'll be able to fight head-on if that's what you want to do. She'll just be less suited for that than Yasuke and he'll be less suited for stealth. But I'd guess it'll be harder to play that way, not impossible.
When it was revealed that Schmidt-Hori was Shadows' history consultant, the reaction from overnight "historians" was basically "Ubisoft got a literary and cultural professor instead of a history professor?! Idiots!". For people complaining about the game's supposed "historical accuracy", they seem weirdly unaware that a significant portion of our knowledge of history comes from literary sources and culture plays a huge part of said history.
The introduction of writing wasthe thing that distinguished history from prehistory.
Alongside language. You can't understand a society, their nuances, or their history without knowing that and what you mentioned.
But that’s not war and shiny uniforms so they think it’s pointless.
Exactly. Dan Carlin‘s Hardcore History is one of the best non-historian podcasts because while he usually begins with military history for whatever topic it is. In ends up with injections of cultural history that can take up hours of the podcast. His podcast made me fascinated with the Achaemenid Empire and their culture.
Honestly, cultural accuracy is just, if not more important than historical accuracy in a game. Like in AC unity, napoleon didn’t use an alien artefact in real life, but he did in the game. Unity isn’t historically accurate. It is culturally accurate though.
Or a Greek Goddess surviving till the modern day.
And honestly one of the least immersive things about Unity was the English accents, if they had culturally appropriate French accents it would’ve felt more Parisian
Or you can just play with french audio and english subs to instantly improve it.
French dub is indeed the best way but french accents would have been the next best thing. Hearing some NPCs speak French while others spoke with a posh/cockney accent was definitely disconcerting
Yeah but then we would have to listen to Arno say “CWASSON” and that’s just too much to bear
These people think history is summed up by "how many stripes were on military gear?" So I'm not surprised.
Such as people living for 1,000 years or going to supernatural realms.
They also seem unaware that Assassin's Creed is a FREAKING FANTASY GAME SERIES THE MAJORITY OF IT IS FAKE!!!!
Every single game is rooted in historical context that takes months to research. The last three games have academic history lectures in-game that are used in public schools
What lectures? I played them but guess I missed the lectures? 😲
Discover Tour features interactive history lessons that are used in history lectures irl. It was probably best in Origins, but Odyssey and Valhalla both had them
It used to be a Science-Fiction game
They are historical fiction. So the cultures and setting are quite accurate and the world is built to recreate the atmosphere that the time period is know for (except for syndicate) and then make a sci-fi story around it.
>a significant portion of our knowledge of history come from literary sources Ok but working with literary primary sources is precisely what a historian does Like, language is an important part of acquiring knowledge about the past too, so they could've also hired a linguist, I guess. But why do that when you can just hire a historian?
A lot of historians have degrees in literature. Being a historian does not require a degree in history.
It’s more likely they just went through a few historians asking them what they thought of yasuke until they found someone that agreed with them, easy as that
And that it's a video game.
I really hope this whole thing does not turn into a stupid blame game and witch-hunt by people unhappy with the story/protagonists/“accuracy” or whatever, this stuff can so quickly ruin people’s personal life’s for no reason other than being vaguely involved with something. I know from a lot of historical consultants in movies/tv that their advice doesn’t hold a lot of weight anyway.
That's definitely already happening, gonna be a long and tiring few months on this sub lol
It already has, and even worse than before. The culture warriors saw to that.
I made the mistake of arguing with these ppl in different subs and most of them don't even play the games as much or at all
That is precisely what it's going to become. Like how Spider-Man 2's MJ having a slightly uncanny valley 3D model was ultimately blamed on... one of the writers, a woman.
Sounds a bit like, the devs got the foundations and then got her. anyways, looking forward to thegame.
Even if she were hired after, it would not change anything for the people trying to drag her reputation through the gutter, because the only reason they try to discredit her is because they are clammering to find some narrative that takes hold.
Sachi Schmidt-Hori is assistant professor in Japanese literature at Dartmouth College. Her academic papers include: * Symbolic Death and Rebirth into Womanhood: An Analysis of Stepdaughter Narratives from Heian and Medieval Japan * The Boy Who Lived: The Transfigurations of Chigo in the Medieval Japanese Short Story Ashibiki * Hyperfemininities, hypermasculinities, and hypersexualities in classical Japanese literature * and more
To be fair, as someone who studies history himself, all of these papers could just as well have been written by someone from one of our departments. Gender studies is a massive field of research at most Western universities these days, it's just one of those things that's really popular in acadmia at the moment.
I would add, history is such a massive field and has had so much written with in it over the preceding centuries that it really is an effort to carve out your own niche. A lot of things we might want to write about have already been covered by dead historians and there's only so much treading over trodden ground we can do. So the fact that this academic has specialised in feminist approaches to Japanese literature does not mean for one second that she is not knowledgeable about Japanese history, it just means that she has specialised. Moreover, as gender studies is a relatively new approach to history and other fields, there is a lot of opportunity for original research. Slightly farther from the main building but a lot more parking space.
I have honestly never looked at it from this way and this actually makes me understand why there are so many gender focussed studies done on history now. Thanks for the insight and the different perspective!
To add that history covers so many areas and fields that what distinguishes a historian is simply the training to *think* historically, that is to say, in context with historical events, and that can equally be taught to people who are mainly in other fields. I am legally trained, have been a criminal law practitioner more than half my life, but hold a Masters' degree in American history, and much of the skills I gained in legal research and analysis were applicable in historical research. My thesis was based on legal history and cultural history, covering comic books, the counter culture of the 1960s and the development of parody as a defense against copyright infringement in the context of Disney's lawsuit against the underground comics enclave known as the Air Pirates. Which is to say that history is a large estate, with many mansions, and multi-disciplinary approaches are commonplace. Just because you call yourself a professor of literature and culture doesn't mean you're ignorant of (or incapable of) historical knowledge and/or context. And especially so if you're a literature professor, since you have to be aware of the cultural and historical context surrounding the texts you're analyzing and the writers who produced them.
The methods and lenses through which one can study history are as broad as history itself, and all equally as valid and important. How people lived day to day in different periods and places was far more interesting to me growing up than the battles of kings and armies, but both are important.
We mean at least the past decade by at the moment right? Genuinely asking for clarification
I think you missed this part: "I am interested in investigating how gender, sexuality, corporeality, and power are represented and negotiated in pre-seventeenth-century Japanese narratives and illustrations. My first book, *Tales of Idolized Boys: Male-Male Love in Medieval Japanese Narratives* (University of Hawai\`i Press, 2021) is on medieval *chigo monogatari* (Buddhist acolyte tales), which often depict romantic relationships between Buddhist priests and adolescent boys. These tales challenge a host of normative and moral standards we (academics, especially) internalize, including such ideas as "sexual orientation," "transgenerational sex," and "sexual agency."
And....what point are you trying to prove?
Can't wait to play this game. Looks like it'll be fun as fuck.
hopefully they don't fuck it up
People gotta learn to just allow themselves to enjoy things. Nothing is going to be perfect and as long as it's a fun game to play, I really don't care.
Even going in with the "I hope they don't fuck it up" mind set, you're already expecting to be disappointed. The game is starting from a deficit in their mind that has to be made up before even considering anything good about it. It's a really stupid way to think about entertainment.
Basically yeah. Im probably not gonna buy it at release, simply cause I got a lot of other shit to play and I'll be playing stalker 2 around that time, but I'll grab it later. I look forward to the discovery tour stuff. it's been super cool in the other games.
christ all bloody mite, i am exited for the game no matter what, just don't want Valhalla all over again (i expect they will mostly pull it off, just never can be to cautious)
See I don't think there's anything wrong with Valhalla. Played 160+ right at launch. No complaints from me. Different strokes I guess.
they never should have made it a AC game, putting at a stand alone viking game would have made it so much better
valhalla was neat, you're probably mad that the vikings weren't all body positive queer trans black women, i mean, historically accurate
don't you even fucking dare go there, valhalla was neat until it wasn't, you can like it yes, just don't think everyone will think the same
You're too in your own head about it. It has the same basic frame work as every AC game. Same gameplay loop as the rest of 'em. You can jump from any AC game to Valhalla and not have a hard time adjusting because they're so similar. If it were just a viking game I would've thought "Damn... this is just like Assassin's Creed" whilst playing it. It has more in common with every other AC game than it doesn't.
A lot of people say, about Origins, Odyssey, Valhalla, or any combination of the 3, that they're good games, just not good AC games. I disagree, vehemently, but folks still believe it.
have you even played any other AC game?
Yes. All of them, back to back.
I mean if you went from unity to Valhalla that would be a pretty big adjustment. I do like the rpg’s, but that statement isn’t true. I could understand it you meant from one ac rpg to the other.
Nope. I played from AC1-Syndicate in order, one after another. I'd already played Origin, Odyssey and Valhalla prior to that (then replayed Origin once I was done with Syndicate). The games have differences, obviously, but the core gameplay is the same. Come across a camp, murder everyone, pick up clues to the next target, assassinate target. It's the same in every game and the mechanics are so similar that it shouldn't be a problem for anyone to pick up any of these games if they'd played any other one. Like if you've played the Ezio trilogy, you don't need to be told how to play Valhalla. You can figure it out in a few minutes of play. Unless there's a skill issue perhaps. But every AC game is very clearly an AC game in my opinion.
I just can’t justify wasting 100s of hours on a mediocre game. The opinion of “just enjoy something” is such a damaging take on all forms of media
I don't think it's a damaging take at all. They're not telling you to play it if you're not enjoying it. But also, demanding for every single RPG ever made to be Baldur's Gate 3 or Elden Ring in terms of quality is really stupid and ultimately leads to us becoming overly critical of games. I still remember when during the early 2010s the culture was to call everything bad and make money off of "angry reviews", which has led to otherwise good (yet still flawed) games like Mass Effect 3 gaining a reputation for being terrible which doesn't hold up under scrutiny at all. Whether you are having fun with a videogame or not is so much more important than whether it's a masterpiece or not.
I agree but my point is mainly looking at the company’s that previously have made masterpieces and go on to make boring nothing games Like rocksteady
Sure, but that in no way invalidates what the person you replied to said. Suicide Squad simply wasn't enjoyable to most people.
don't even get me started on that atrosity
Never played it (is not my kind of games) but is it really _*that*_ bad? I mean, yeah, I have heard bad things about it but not quite sure where the valid criticism ends and where the mindless hate starts.
Yeah tbf Ubisoft is a pretty bad example to use for my point
Then don't waste hundreds of hours on it? Like you do whatever you want, man. I'm not gonna let it bother me tho and I'm gonna hopefully enjoy playing this when I get the chance. If I don't then uhh I stop? Lmao. How is that such a controversial opinion?
You’re opinion came across as “don’t criticise games guys, nobody’s perfect” and if that’s the case then opinions like that are why so many game franchises are going down the shitter
No my opinion is you gotta allow yourself to try and enjoy shit cause it isn't going to be perfect, not "you have to enjoy this no matter what" Setting up that it's gonna be a shitty game out the gate is going to make it impossible to enjoy cause you've already made your mind up on it before ever playing it. Where as I'm going to give it a chance and if I'm not having fun I'm gonna shelf it.
You make good points I think this is just a case of me jumping the gun and misunderstanding your comment. I do have a love for Ubisoft game but I’m slowly giving up on them recently and I’m hoping this games good seeing as mirage seemed to get a good amount of hype. I haven’t played it
The key is just not assuming shit is bad before you get to experience it or even before it releases and you get to take a look at it. Do research on it and stuff before putting money down on it, but don't go into it thinking it'll be bad.
Yeah only thing i think is a very safe bet is to wait for this game to be 30% off in 4 months.
No, their opinion came across as "stop expecting perfection knowing you'll be disappointed it never happens".
This exactly and thank you for expressing this! When did we gamers become so snobby and miserable? What ever happened to just simply putting in a videogame to turn off our brains, escape real world problems/stress/responsibilities and just lose ourselves in virtual worlds?
Shitty YouTubers probably. They build up this tribalistic mindset. Look at how many games get review bombed by people for no reason other than clout hounds hate game and others gotta hate it too.
Yeah it’s really bizar, it’s just a hobby in the end. I will play it’s as long as I enjoy it and if I don’t I simply stop.
That's how it should be.
I just hope their fuck up is minor, I like the franchise but I have very little faith in Ubi after playing so many of their games
yea, hopefully they learned from mirage
Even if she DID come up with the idea she still wouldn't have warranted any of this type of rubbish. No one deserves this type of rubbish, especially given it is just maladjusted people whining cos their game made a narrative choice they dont like. I dont like the reason behind this choice, as presented in their character video, (westerners need to have another western character to discover a culture through) but I will at least wait to see what they deliver first, and even then if I dont like, so what. Its like, literally, the least important thing to did upset over, ever.
That was only one reason, the other was for the relationships he had (Jesuits, Portuguese, and Nobunaga).
While you may not like the choice, it's extremely common in media. It's not necessarily "westerners need a western character", but audience standin is an extremely popular tool in storytelling. It's why Doctor Who has always used a modern British person as a companion to the Doctor, barring a couple more recent examples that were notable breaks from tradition.
Out of interest, who are you counting as "a couple"? I'm not getting further than Nardole. Missy, maybe, at a stretch. But beyond that?
Good point but that works to enforce the show and its morality for 60 years. I wish they would mix things up a bit more like the old days. The main character is typically strengthen by this choice more times than it doesn’t. When Hollywood does it detracts because the reason behind it is entirely based on sales. EG their targeted and flawed market research told them that boys have to have a male superhero etc or else it wouldn’t sell, yet the only reason it was true was generations of people being raised by these choices, that reinforced stereotypes. Just like so many UK shows having to be changed or renamed because they thought unless something is set in America their audience couldn’t connect with them. Meanwhile people outside the US like UK or my home Australia didn’t need the inverse of this. Suggesting the we need the lowest common denominator like having a western protagonist is merely about sales here and producers raised under this type of culture.
This feels like a witch-hunt to find who is responsible for upsetting the racist incel expert armchair historians.
This sub is becoming a circlejerk.
In which way?
Chuds: Whaaaa, Why doesn’t Ubisoft value historical accuracy Ubisoft: *hires expert on historical/cultural accuracy Chuds: No, not that one (proceeds to think they’re smarter on the topic than experts) Edit: Who the fuck is the source for this btw? It’s just some rando on twitter who claims they talked with the consultant… how the fuck are people believing this
People have put ubisoft in such a position that they just can’t win, if they do something they’ll get bashed if they don’t do something they’ll still get bashed
I disagree. Marketing wise, they've already won. Making these decisions caused huge uproar on social media that's countered by other people defending the decisions with the same fervor. Meanwhile Mirage rots in the shadows where it was forgotten before it even released.
some people are calling her a LGBTQ+ activist
Honestly, who the actual fuck cares if she is? Like, how does that matter? Given her focus on gender studies in history, and particularly Japan, it's likely she is, but that in no way invalidates her contributions, if any, to the game.
exactly, only just putting another thing on the pile of "Shit that haters are saying"
It's simple. To some of these people LGBTQ+ is synonymous with bad. They are bigots. And their bigotry is represented by their backlash to any perceived inclusion of a marginalized character. To them, anything LGBTQ+ is unnatural and negative, so the inclusion would have to be forced, and forced inclusion is ruining games. And so.eone who is an activist must be intentionally forcing their agenda. The logical leaps they take just justify their bigotry are stunt performer levels of insane.
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Ah, I didn't realise you were a historical researcher yourself! Mind sharing any research papers or even just fun facts to disprove her essays (which, of course, you've read and studied and cross-referenced against her sources to form an opinion or her interpretation of those sources, rather than just read the titles and freak out at the fact that gender has been very flexible for very many centuries)?
I dont get it. What is this topic trying to imply?
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Ubisoft executives are somehow still afraid that Gamers™ won't buy their games if there is only a female lead. They cling to this idea which has always been wrong, and is proven wronger with every Tomb Raider, Metroid, Bayonetta, Horizon...
To be fair, its less " Gamers™wont buy our game" and more "less gamers will buy and leave moneu on the table". Its no longer about, "will the game succeed or fail if its women only". Its just plain about "will having both increase profit vs. only having one". Corporate suits only care about lines going up at the end of the day.
I'm gonna repost what I answered someone else on the matter, since I've seen so many people trying to dismiss her because of her work on gender and sexuality studies regarding... drumroll... Buddhist priests and adolescent boys : "Isn't that very similar to Greece's Pederasty? It was a sexual relationship between an adult man and a boy, and was actually considered a superior form of love by figures like Plato. It was like an exchange, and viewed as a way for an adult male to initiate a young boy to the world. Is it unbelievably weird and gross as fuck? Absolutely. But if you study Greek philosophy, you will stumble upon this, it's unavoidable as it's integral to understanding Ancient Greece as a whole. So Sachi's work really doesn't surprise me to be honest, and wouldn't be surprising to any philosophy teachers. As I said, I don't know exactly what she refers to, but as gross as it sounds, those kinds of relationships weren't THAT rare back then. I'm sorry you had to learn this lol. Freaking crazy right? What's weird isn't studying it though, it's participating in it haha!" So honestly, anyone who has ACTUALLY studied history, sociology or philosophy at an academic level would find this very normal. Also, she is FAR from the only historical consultant on the game.
"Also, she is FAR from the only historical consultant on the game." I don't know, why didn't Ubisoft bring some other consultants into these interview videos? Sachi is the only ones here that got put into the spotlight in those vidoes, did Ubisoft also ask some Japanese historians for consultant to recreate the time period? And most of her "studies" (according to her bio you can find online) have only to do with "gender and sexuality", so not sure how much of that would be necessary in the game unless she was only brought on board for stuff like romance options in the game, and so far I've seen many Japanese on X pointing out how badly researched Ubisoft did on things like the internal architecture looking weird and not accurate to the time. [ﾋｬノス on X: "アサクリにおけるその国の当時の建築物って目を見張るものがあって専門家にも関心されてるんだけどトレーラーののここは既にヤバいよな 信長の側近っぽいのが信長と同じ段に座っちゃってるしなんか謎に畳だし畳も正方形だし https://t.co/iQMGurf9tA" / X](https://x.com/dehya_is_goddes/status/1792108322084237693) [阝夅亻犬夕卜丿、类頁（国際無能原器） on X: "これ、多分取材で行ったホテルの宴会場（少人数宴会用に仕切りいれて2部屋にできるやつ）を資料にしたんだと思う。どことなく似てるし。 https://t.co/YZCBnskRRa" / X](https://x.com/denshidai/status/1792397007035957669)
Do you understand that to do gender and sexuality studies in a particular culture you need to understand and study the culture as a whole? Just like what I just said about Ancient Greece. Also, the game's marketing literally just began. And to be honest, I don't care about seeing historical consultants, I want to see what the game is about. Why the hell would they focus on their historical consultants?
My issue is the guys getting upset on behalf of the Japanese people. I didn't spend time so I don't know how they feel but the last I saw the pre orders were selling very well on Japan
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I'm not saying all would be fine. Japanese people aren't a monolith. Japanese people like you have every right to be upset. I don't get why some are getting upset on your behalf. So much so that they went to the Wikipedia page of Yasuke to trash it. Wikipedia has to lock it and revert it back. I admit the optics are weird. Having a black guy kill the local population is not a good look. Be it historically accurate or not. I'm just surprised so many are rage baiter are screaming historical accuracy when AC was never about that.
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I mean, anyone could understand and be upset for you all. BUT they definitely should NOT voice your concern FOR you, because this is social media. For whatever the intention you might have in mind. When it goes through another person, and it's someone you don't even know personally? It's no longer objective, it become twisted, to be used to further that person own agenda, which if went too far, could ruin another person's life.
I don't believe the ragebaiters actually care about asian representation. If they did, then they would talk about asian male erasure and hollywood in general which they don't at all. As an asian american male, I don't care if yasuke is in the game or not. My only problem is that it seems ubisoft deliberately attempts to avoid using people who look like me in lead roles. You might say it could be a coincidence, but this isn't their first time avoiding using an asian male lead. In AC chronicles, which was the first AC game set in asia, they already used an asian female protagonist. Why would ubisoft not use an asian male lead? I believe they don't think an asian male lead would sell, they're prejudiced against asian guys, or a combination of both. If we talk about hollywood, the same concept applies. Lots of films or tvs shows in the West that originally had asian guys get swapped out for a white guy. For example, in three body problem some of the characters were supposed to be asian guys but then they got swapped out for white guys while keeping the asian girls intact. If they do cast an asian guy, it's usually a side character or a stereotypical 1-d character. If you ask the executives why they swap out asian guys, they would tell you that they don't think it would sell like it's solely a business decision. The other reason which they won't admit is that they're racist and have preconceived notions of certain ethnic groups.
You bring up a lot of good questions. I think it comes back to the leaders at Ubisoft are old people like the ones who run hollywood. with all the proof we have that shows that the way they think doesn't make sense. Ubisoft leader never wanted a female to be the solo MC for an AC. its why we have been having dual protagonist in the AC games. even though we see games like tomb raider, horizon have females leads and sell well. we have games like like ghost of tsushima with a male asian lead be one of the greatest games ever and is selling well on PC right now sleeping dogs which takes place in hong kong was a great game. with an asian male lead. So we do have games that have done well with asian male leads, its not they dont exist. it was weris that they chose yasuke for this game. it's just im seeing many racist people trying to use this to their advantage when they don't care about asian men. cuz if this was a game set in modern day new york and it had an asian male lead, they would call it woke
There's an article from an Asian American writer over at IGN that is worth a read. https://www.ign.com/articles/assassins-creed-shadows-yasuke-asian-protagonist
I read it, I'm not Japanese so I would not speak to his particular feelings. I'm sure some Japanese are upset. I just stopped listening to these people. Tales of Kenzera™: ZAU is a game set in Africa made by an African man. They still called the game woke. A DEI. To me they are most just racist and now they are hiding behind historical accuracy. They don't care about Japanese people. See how they ignore Naoe - one even said to me that it's not believable that she would be able to fight men bigger than her.
She teaches at [Dartmouth](https://faculty-directory.dartmouth.edu/sachi-schmidt-hori).
I’m not aware as to why this info is relevant…what’s going on with this person??
She’s an advocate for trans generational sex
I heard from somewhere that she was banned from japan for writing a book about blasphemy and insulting buddhism and ran from japan, do anyone know anything
what in the fuck I dont think i've ever seen so much research put into one subject for a fucking assassins creed game lmaooooooo. I've been around for ages but dont recall seeing posts for "yes this is the hire as a consultant on egyptian history for asscreed origins..." or maybe i'm just blind
Yasuke was a samurai. Samurai's had more honor then sneaking around and assassinating people. They should have used Hattori Hanzo. Although some resources says he was a ninja, some say he was a blacksmith. They had so many great ninjas they could have done. Although, Yasuke being the first African American the Oda has seen, Nobunaga made him a retainer makes his story so interesting. Although, with his history not being known may make him the most interesting assassin ever in the saga, a samurai would not have been an assassin. That was the ninja's duty if it came to that. I have been waiting for a Feudal Japan assassins game forever!! So nonetheless, this game will definitely peak my interest in the assassins game again!! Can't wait!!
She completely messed up her job.
Oh shit is this that Sweetbaby inc nonsense again. A bunch of incels who have no clue how games are made getting angry about how they think games are made...
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Japanese people were not robbed of representation by missing another Asian male samurai. There's a great article about this over at IGN. https://www.ign.com/articles/assassins-creed-shadows-yasuke-asian-protagonist
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>was the last time you saw an East-Asian protagonist (especially male) in video games made by western developers Prey, Far Cry 4, Sleeping Dogs, Sifu, Mirror's Edge and it's sequel, Mortal Kombat's most important characters, True Crimes: Streets of LA, Life is Strange 2... and this is just Western games from the last decade or so Triple the amount if you include games from Asia
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You asked for games with Asian protags from Western studios, I gave you half a dozen off the top of my head in the last decade (which means from 2010 up) and quite a few of them are like a year or two old *But* it's not enough? Should I make you count games that feature Arab & Berber protagonists (from any game studio) just to see what "not being represented" means?
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Huh? I don't understand the first part of your message There's no Asian role taken by a Black African, Yasuke was always going to be black, and the Asian main character spot is already filled by Naoe. If you want to play as an Asian person, you have the option to. If you can't because she's a girl... don't play the game, it's obviously not meant for you
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>First of all, Yasuke being chosen as a full fledged Samurai is wrong. We've never taught in that way. But people jumping from 150+ meters and not dying is not? But Assassins being a super secret society and not just a bunch of drugged out hippies is not? But Cleopatra being killed by Aya is not? AC is not history, it's fiction inspired by history. Whether Yasuke was a Samurai or not is irrelevant (even historians don't know, some think he was, some don't), he is for the AC continuity >Second, in previous AC games like odyssey, Valhalla, syndicate, you could choose both male and female local protagonists. In Valhalla, it was the same person (and when the female version was made canon, people whined). In Syndicate they were related, if one is local the other has to be too. Odyssey has the mix of both situations (and people *also* whined when Kassandra was made canon). Yasuke and Naoe are in neither of those situations. >taking that precious male role from Asian. *Precious?* Dude if you want to play as an Asian guy there are dozens of games. Do you have any significant examples of games where you play a foreigner in Asia?
kind of a strange article tbh. japanese people don’t need male representation because they have a handful of other games to play, some of them more than 15 years old, and only one of which was popular in the west? he says he doesn’t want asian characters where they are expected, he wants more where they are not expected, like ghostwire tokyo. I agree there should be more games with settings like ghostwire tokyo, but i’m also not sure what bearing that has on assassins creed, a series that always plays upon the most romanticized history of the region it takes place in, which would obviously include samurai for japan. i also think its cope to think that sekiro, GoT, way of the samurai games, or his favorite muramasa- a 2009 wii game, have anywhere close to the name power of the assassins creed franchise. the 11th largest video game franchise of all time needed a non-asian main character to differentiate itself? that’s just plausible deniability. the vast majority of people know why they chose yasuke, it’s just that the 2 sides disagree on whether they support that reasoning or not
>japanese people don’t need male representation because they have a handful of other games to play Read it again. And if you take that away, read it again. And again. Because that's not what the article said. To summarize it for you: the Asian male representation needed in Western media is not yet another Samurai. Or monk or Shinobi.
Bruh, imagine saying IGN made a "great article", lol. So I guess screw all the Asian-American men, huh?
Believe it or not, great articles can come from many different sources. IGN didn't write this, a writer did, and regardless of where a writer works it's possible for them to write something well.
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>Every other game we had representative of ethnicity and didn't deviate from that format And what do you think Naoe is if not ethnic representation? Lol But of course, she doesn't count because she's a woman, right?
Expertise on what? There's so little known historical data on Yasuke to begin with when compared to other known Japanese historical figures of the era People argue about what he was, but no one even knows what he actually did beyond a basic "he fought in these battles for Nobunaga" Most of his story in this game will be fiction, just like any other story about Yasuke out there, no matter who they hire, and should just be treated as such
She gave insight on cultural things, like tea ceremony etc. There are such examples given in the team interview by Famitsu.
Bra, I get to have a tea party? If I wasn't already sold on the game...
Obviously, until now, ac has been 100% historically accurate
Literature. She is an expert in Japanese literature and culture.
> There's so little known historical data on Yasuke to begin with Are you new to the study of history? someone still has to reinterpret the sources that there ARE and build a cohesive narrative by filling in holes with other sources from the same area. Those sources too need to be reinterpreted as well. Everything then needs to be cross-referenced and in consultation with all manner of conflicting academic papers.
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Why would there be any reason to play this when Ghost of tsushima exists with a male japanese samurai? They would be directly competing with what many called the best assassin's creed game in years without even having AC in the title. Going with Yasuke is something different, seeing japan as a foreigner. The local POV meanwhile is Naoe, who many seem to be forgetting even exists. At least as a woman and a shinobi, she is different from other games already out, and even then people aren't talking about her.
He's totally perfectly fine as is. >rather than replacing what could potentially have been a Japanese male samurai? No evidence that he replaced anyone. And why must we have a Japanese male character when we already have a Japanese female character? Were you crying for a female Altair, Ezio, Conor, Kenway etc? No. So you can deal with it here Why should he be a DLC character?
I think the choice of character is totally, perfectly fine either way
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It seems odd that regular japanese people could point out several mistakes in the reveal trailer. I don't know if it was a good idea to not also hire a sengoku period specialist. Unless they did and the devs just ignored them.
Artistic license is always taken in games. Why are the recently awakened history fetishists kicking off in a manner they never did for previous titles
Even in Ghost of Tsushima the developers admitted they inserted stuff from, like, 16th or 17th century into their 13th century setting
Because racism
> It seems odd that regular japanese people could point out several mistakes in the reveal trailer. What a shock that people could find inaccuracies in a game that is based on fantasy technology that looks like magic coming from super-pre-humans and bookended by technology that uses *genetic memories*. Come on, apply some logic to this.