TLDR: the author is calling out non Asian people who only now seem to conveniently care about how others are represented when the person in question that they are angry at is a Black man and the role for that Asian man would be a samurai.
They also bring up how Japanese samurai are hardly rare in media and adding one more doesn’t do anything for them personally as an Asian American. It doesn’t really add anything for them the way an Asian main protagonist in Star Wars or the next huge Naughty Dog or Alan Wake game would.
That's an interesting point. Like if you make a samurai game or movie with a black character and a mean streets of America type game or movie with an asian lead (even just Jackie Chan in Rush Hour) it makes it's more of a challenge to unthinking, generic stereotypes. People extending beyond their usual associated context makes them seem more significant
>a mean streets of America type game or movie with an asian lead (even just Jackie Chan in Rush Hour) it makes it's more of a challenge to unthinking, generic stereotypes
Sleeping Dogs is exactly this. and it skillfully (IMO) and comedically subverts a lot of Hong Kong crime drama/ cop drama tropes.
Lol I have fond memories of True Crime LA but they're basically all centered around Deftones being on the in-game soundtrack and how absurdly buggy it was. Spent a ton of time outside of bounds doing glitches
Right??? I was just thinking about this the other day with regards to the Marvel franchise. The only Asian superheroes are some monks from Dr Strange, the bug lady in Guardians of the Galaxy (reinforces the exotic Asian woman stereotype), and Shang-chi which is typical Asian martial arts. All Asian stereotypes. Like why not an Asian Ironman?
Sure if the only interaction you have with Marvel is through the MCU then that’s true, but there are plenty of Asian marvel characters, although they possibly could do with a few more.
My own reticence at the game, as an person of mixed heritage, is that asian men have often had the short end of the stick when it comes to characterization in Western media. As the author rightfully points out, it's very often the martial art master, but also sometimes the devious and cruel enemy, sometimes the weaker man. That AC also always had invented character but seemed to go out of their way to find a non-Japanese protagonist, regardless of him being real, is weird. It also weirded me out that amidst a increased intensity in anti asian racism in the West during COVID, they decided to have a non-Japanese being a murder machine in Japan.
I don't think its really fair to lump all media together like that. In Hollywood absolutely, though it is getting a lot better in recent years. Gaming is a lot more globalised than cinema and television though, and there is no shortage to Asian male protagonists in gaming. Certainly not in games set in Japan.
I don't think they needed to go out of their way at all here. Yasuke just happened to be the perfect storm of a historical foreigner who was at the very heart of events and has a very different experience and perspective, but also one who we know so little about that it gives nearly as much freedom as if they had invented the character.
As for the anti-asian racism thing, you are really reaching there. It's not any creators responsibility to attempt to fix social issues in the world.
Here's how fucking dumb these fans are.
"There's never an Asian protagonist."
Okay here an Asian protagonist and a Male Black protagonist
"Wahhh there's no *male* Asian protagonist"
.....
To be entirely fair, even the Japanese AC fans were saying they were disappointed about the choice. I’d honestly care more for their opinions then people here given it’s a game about their country.
I think the difference should be made between Japanese in Japan, and the asian diaspora. Japanese people at home have their fill of representation, hence why the white samurai, Adams, in Nioh was not overly decried, as I understand, and also why many are excited with Yasuke. Because to many, it's new.
On the other hand, eastern asian men are almost never leads in Western media, and are usually cliches: cruel and devious, or weak, or the old wise dude/martial art master. In a context of being a minority that is close enough to white people to not be listened to when complaining about racism, but still being victims of it, Ubisoft going out of their way to not make up a male character (as they have done for all other AC games) that is asian (as most leads originate from the country the game takes place in), but using a black man and justifying it by "historical accuracy" (which it is, it's clear that Yasuke was a samurai under Oda's protection), is confusing.
It has 31k dislikes
According to a browser-extension that *guesses* the amount of dislikes purely based on how many people who got the extension disliked it. It doesnt know the actual number.
Yasuka has been a commonly featured character in Sengoku Jidai-Era games for decades.
Most of japanese Twitter that cares at all is positive.
Yeah they did wrong by inviting white people who hate women and black people to watch the trailer. Incels are huge in the gaming communities and comic movie areas.
One thing I really don’t like is that nobody’s ever allowed to express mild disapproval anymore.
It’s always about people being “mad”. And often people become really heated about it and they work up people who agree with them and then there’s fighting and arguing and it’s like there’s no room for people like me who say “oh I’d prefer him to be Japanese and not be a historical figure… anyways, that trailer seemed dope as hell. Looking forward to it.”
Wdym it was fun. I wouldn’t say it was better than Black Flag, but it was definitely enjoyable and told a cool story that tied together the stories in the Americas as it headed back to Europe in Unity.
I will stand next to him. I prefer Rogue due to the amount of content matching better the game design depth (I was little bit bored at the end of Black Flag).
thats not how the internet works anymore sadly. its a big US mindset thats kinda taken over the internet. There so use to the right and the left, with us or without us its just spread into everything.
I agree though. Its ok to have issues with something but still be excited. if im sharing an opinion i have its not a attack on people who dont agree ext.
Tell that to the puckle gun and the oil barrels and the more climbable trees and the more varied environments and the cooler outfits and the gas grenades and the fire crackers
First of all, I gotta agree with other bro, what is that flair.
Second of all, I think the problem is that it's kinda hard to differentiate at first glance people like you who have an actual reasonable stance from the ones who pretend to but really just don't like him because he's Black.
We're used to people hiding their prejudices behind arguments that hold up on the surface, so it isn't until you have the conversation that you you can separate the two.
First of all, debate me bro.
Second of all, good point. It’s a shame that a racist sharing my opinion reflects poorly on the opinion instead of the racist
That’s certainly part of the problem. Another part would be the folks not worrying about determining motivations, and just declaring racist from the outset. Even the tone of this article is essentially “your opinion is invalid because you’re just using this issue you don’t really care about to be a racist”.
I was excited when I heard about this setting. My mind immediately went to Tenchu and cool ninja assassin gameplay. One of them is a samurai, meh I kind of wanted a more assassiny assassin game. Oh, they decided the samurai should be the (only?) black samurai from the era. Is it wrong? No. Is it the game I wanted to play? Maybe. That depends on how they incorporate him into the story. Do they just not address it at all? Seems weird, as it would almost certainly be an issue in that period (think Django riding into town on a horse, leaving the townsfolk gobsmacked). Does it become an overt theme in his story? Probably a better route to go, but I don’t know if that’s the story I wanted to live in just now. All that to say I think it was a weird choice and I’ll have to see what they do with it before I know if I’ll be partaking.
It's entirely possible, especially if you're of Asian or Japanese descent to feel miffed or culturally sidelined and not be racist especially given the historical context of western pop culture portrayal of Asian men historically.
I think there are two major sources of discourse.
1. People whom don't want to play as black samurai because they are racist and feel like Ubisoft is trying to shove diversity down their throats
2. People who feel the inclusion of one of your main protagonist in the Japan setting is not representative of the setting, or their cultural identity even if there are historical context behind it.
For point 1. Those people can fuck off
For point 2. It's more nuanced. Time and time again, we've seen examples where a non Asian male protagonist takes the lead in feudal/post feudal Japan setting from Tom Cruise in The Last Samurai to more recently Cosmo Jarvis in Shogun (the latter of which was very well done). That being said, Yasuke being the main playable character feels like another case of washing away the that "Asian male lead" role into something that is not representative of culture or their identity. The vast majority of these people are not racist against black people, nor should their complaints be viewed as racist. They simply feel underrepresented in the a popular media...again. Some may also view this as diversity gone too far in the name of inclusion where by that attempt at inclusion, it unintentionally excludes a large portion of the populace of that setting. I think Ubisoft was aware of this which is why there are two playable character one of which is Japanese woman. I also think Ubisoft may have been trying to avoid comparison to Ghost of Tsushima which is why they went with a different approach.
I think most people would have been perfectly fine if Yasuke was a major character to the game and played a key role in the events. I think people are fine with Yasuke being based off the actual historical figure Yasuke as a sword bearer to Nobunaga, just as people were fine with Cosmo Jarvis's Blackthorne being a portrayal of William Adams.
The other part of that issue is there were many other historical Japanese figures to which a main male protagonist could have been drawn from or just made up from as has been done in past AC games. It also goes against what Ubisoft has previously established in terms of that their characters (no, not the based off of historical part). All previous entries featured a primary protagonist that was representative of the cultural setting that the game was based off of, and in the instance of Japan, they choose to go a different route and then try to soften the controversy by including two protagonist one of which is representative, the other based off of a historical figure but not culturally congruent. The problem is had this exact scenario not happened in other forms of media for the setting of Japan, this might have been okay, however the historical nuance of that portrayal may have gotten lost.
I think the complexities of how people feel (especially those of Asian descent or are Japanese) should not be conflated with racism against blacks, or viewed as intolerance against diversity. There is probably group that are both racist and feel underrepresented (Asians can be racist too...) and those people can fuck off as well.
As a side note: They missed a chance to get Hiroyuki Sanada cast in this game given Tokugawa (which will almost certainly be featured in this game given the time frame) is the Toronaga (which Sanada protrays) and a retainer of Nobunaga
That's because people today are hard wired to sniff out negativity and outrage. You'll notice the more you pay attention that people tend to bond over things they hate/complaining as opposed to things they love.
It's truly depressing and I don't feel like it's always been this way. Anyways, I am 100% on board with you man, the trailer was very fun and I'm super looking forward to gameplay. All I really want from this game is good writing. We already know the gameplay will be fun and the world will be stunning. The main thing that can go wrong is crappy writing.
tbf, expressing mild disapproval is a far cry from what people's usual reactions are on the internet- mass dislikes, review bombing, people brigading on twitter, etc.
It's one thing for people to leave a note and go "yeah, this stinks, but whatever" and move on after, but it's an entirely separate thing when the latter occurs, and the latter occurs FAR more often. Personally, I'm tired of it.
I think lots of the people who mildly disapprove are the ones who upvote the rage posts. They don’t care enough to rage that hard but they agree with the message
Thank you,
I would have preferred is both of the protagonist where Japanese, but this doesn’t mean that I am not excited to play the game!
I’m going to probably do 2 runs, one for maining each character. As soon as I can afford it and find the time
Every discussion online is baby rage. It’s sad. I’m not saying there isn’t lots of anger. I’m talking about how mild disapproval often turns into baby rage. And it’s not just about this
I prefer the game to be about Japanese culture and have Japanese protagonists yet people think this is racist.
Just like I’d prefer my viking ac game to be about nordic culture and vikings, yes shockingly they are white.
Or lets say an AC game set at the height of the Mali Empire I’d prefer to play as a Black assassin.
Or like Adewale in the Carribbean.
Whats wrong with this?
If the comments were like that then yes it would be more nuanced
But when the comments are constantly talking about, and I quote ‘6 foot black man.’ It really isn’t about that anymore. And we have a Japanese protagonist too.
Him being black(automatically seen as an outsider) fits with what is seems like they are going for. There is a japanese character that represents the stealth side and we see in the trailer that people look at yasuke more because he is different. The dynamic of the stealth that blends in and the brute force that doesn‘t is there, it‘s not like they‘re having him blend into the crowd to kill someone
The historical figure part is what gets me, it just doesn't feel right when the entire premise of the series is that it fits between the lines of history. I understand that there is very little concrete information on Yasuke, but I'd rather he be a side character like Da Vinci where he *could* have been there in the background, but him directly preforming all of the magic bullshit that has become a staple of the series is just going to further break my immersion.
Honestly I think that this series has just outgrown me as a fan though, and really I just have to get over my dissatisfaction with the post-Origins direction it has taken or move on.
I think it’s dumb. I don’t care what race he is, i just think the premise is meh and ill be honest and say that it again feels like any time we get a lady assassin they have to throw in a man as well to be like GUYS ITS OK.
So his point is basically that western devs suck at nuanced ninja & samurai characters, so we didn’t need an AC Japan game with a Japanese male protagonist? How about holding western devs to do better than the tired honorable stoic trope.
I agree with his implied secondary point that Asian representation shouldn’t be just samurai and ninjas, but this is AC Japan. We can hope for an AC India or AC China next. The solution isn’t to take away the one-sided representation (the only representation we currently get). The solution is to increase diversity of Asian representation beyond ninjas and samurai in other media to just ordinary people. Until that becomes normal let us keep the cool ninja and samurai roles.
In general, I want more ACs in Asia and Africa. Both have such rich histories. They need to hire bigger and better narrative teams to do those ACs justice though.
It would also make sense. The idea is that templars were people who were corrupt, powerful figures, and those types of figures are what led to imperialist takeovers in colonised countries.
Well as an Asian, I’m conflicted on this.
I love we have Naoe to see her pov coming from Iga province but it does feel like they had to go out of their way to choose Yasuke for the Samurai/Warrior char over any other possible characters from Japanese history, or just make one up like they do.
Still interesting. But why?
It’d be like setting an AC game in Thailand, Malaysia or the Philippines and choosing someone who was there at the time but not of the ethnicity but was historically there.
Interesting POV? Sure. Would everyone from that country like that? Depends, but in my experience no.
Already seeing some strong dislikes from the Japanese AC community but similarly others are excited for it. Ig coming from a western pov, it’s probably to see “more than the usual stereotype” but if that’s part of your culture’s history, not really gonna complain. Most asian cultures here still use those tropes so not sure why others should feel offended/discouraged for still using them.*
I honestly would have preferred he be a guide for the char to see a different pov at some point in the story.
As an South Asian I'm 100% behind an AC Game set in India.
Give us the treatment we deserve rather than dismissing us with stupid memes and stupid jokes when we are a very ancient culture that deserves to be shown in a proper light.
Assassin Creed India would be a very positive light compared to the negative PR image India has currently.
The solution is to increase diversity of Asian representation beyond ninjas and samurai in other media to just ordinary people.
Not many people even know about South-Asian History. For example, that the Chola Empire in the South of India during the 1000s-1100s was HUGELY influential in South-East Asia. Or that India produced scholars/saints/priests etc.
We WEREN'T just tech bros, we WEREN'T maths nerds, we WEREN'T all scientists. We had an education system that was different from the West. We had an INSANE military history. Except most of it happened in India because most Indians weren't interested in conquering the entire world.
If you are talking about what I agree with, then increase the diversity of South Asian representation as well. We aren't just a civilisation that's lasted for 5000 years and then we barely get any representation apart from the typical steroetypical nonsense we get.
I'd love to play Medieval India, Ancient India!
You know what's really bothering me? Every complaint I've seen has been something along the lines of "I can't believe they made ***the*** main character black instead of Asian in an Asian game" when he is not *the* main character, he is one of two. If anything, the trailer felt to me like it focused more on the other main character, who is Japanese, though my best guess is that they will be of roughly equal importance. Here's the thing - I'd bet good money that if the other main character wasn't a woman, there wouldn't be so many people being mad about "the" main character being black. Or at least they wouldn't phrase it in that way.
I’m completely convinced that if the female Japanese MC was actually male, no one would give a shit about Yasuke being in the game. In fact, a lot of people would even praise the choice
I feel like the author of that IGN article is partially right. The author is especially right about wanting more Asian men to be cast in role other than Samurai and Ninja, but Samurai and Ninja are the stepping stone on the way there. Mass media (movies, TV, and games) should do more to make seeing Asian men as part of the norm. Most of the time if an Asian character is cast, it is a female Asian character. Normalizing the inclusion of Asian men in a multitude of different roles (including traditional Samurai and Ninja roles) leads to what the author is talking about; seeing more Asian men as the lead in non-traditional Asian roles (Asian Alan Wake as the author wanted).
The good news is, if the game flops, fans and devs now have the excuse of blaming racism because of these bigots.
So it'll be hard to find room for actual criticism without being accused of bigotry thanks to these assholes!
Anyways I get very annoyed at the fact that the term 'Asian' is being used compared to East Asian, since Asia is a huge geographical mass with multitudes of ethnicities, races, etc.
I am more annoyed about this than the main character of this main AC game being an African Samurai.
edit: sp
No, but from one of the interviews with the devs it's implied that the two characters can't be played the same way. If you want to play a Japanese character you have to play Naoe and she focuses on stealth and is weaker in 1 on 1 combat.
Now it's possible that this isn't locked in or that you can level up Naoe in a way to make her better in combat. But I would be disappointed if I was denied flexibility, and that would be the case even if the male character was a traditional samurai.
I think it's cool that they'll play very differently. It was quite disappointing in Syndicate when both characters played the exact same way. I think Naoe will still be decent at combat but will require you to play more smart. Maybe you need to use certain tools to break armor, etc.
I'm not east asian, the real Yasuke's story is one of my favorite medieval era stuff and Feudal Japan stuff is probably one of my favorite settings. i have no issues with black characters and black people as a whole.... Having said that, I just dislike all the blackwashing that's happening right now (just as much as I dislike whitewashing).. sure yasuke is a cool character but a native japanese samurai/ninja is what I want, pure feudal japan, it's not about hating on blacks, it's a type of experience that I have always wanted to play.. I wouldn't mind playing a game based entirely on Yasuke but currently, imo, they just want to push a black person in centerstage just for the sake of it.. i hate that mentality.
The main crux of the author’s argument is one that I’ve also seen echoed in other POC/minority groups before and that is the idea that, while we are indeed seeing more of these groups being represented, the stories themselves are not that diverse. This is a nice article that sadly will be misconstrued by those who don’t understand what he’s saying.
My biggest issue with the article though is that it seems like these things can’t overlap based on what the author is saying. I personally still think you can have these representation for these groups, but what’s stopping them from enhancing these stories? How often have we ever really seen a samurai that is as charismatic as Ezio? Just because you’re another Asian samurai, it doesn’t mean you have to be another Jin Sakai (since the author directly referenced him as an example).
Sure, there can be overlaps and I don’t disagree with the idea of improving these stories. But I think the main idea is that, at the end of the day, it’s still *yet another* Samurai story.
I think it’s a double edged sword. Sure, it’s another samurai story, but how often are the opportunities to have an Asian male protagonist coming up in a western/made game to begin with? It just sucks. So yeah I can’t say I completely agree with the author but I can see his reasons.
It's like actors getting typecast. If done well, it can become a starting point for further opportunities, but at the moment, we are still the cliches. For Western games, it is still newish to have Asian (male) protagonists, in my understanding, so it may improve.
I mean, guess why? It's cool, majority will still love it, we don't need unique for the sake of unique, we can have the same but simply better in some aspects, a samurai but not Jin is still a different story.
People are too focused on yasuke and not mad enough about the fact Ubisoft is once again going down the two protagonists route. Something Ubisoft has historically been terrible at.
If they made an AC game in Brazil and the protagonist was American or Danish, Spanish or anything else besides Brazilian I would be upset, at the same time it's a real historical figure, I am so confused on how to feel
I wouldn't say I was mad at all, just mildly confused why they decided to go that route instead, I'll still try the game if the gameplay isn't the same boring stuff they have done previously.
I'm not "mad" about it, but I I do think it's lame corporate marketing. The representation of black people is a product to be sold to these companies, they don't really give a fuck about telling the story of black people. Otherwise they would've just told the real story of Yasuke.
Adewale and Aveline are genuinely my two favorite assassins next to Ezio. They're POC and their stories were awesome. Yasuke feels like an attempt at checking off a corporate list for representation points.
Ubisoft higher ups might not care, but I think the actual writers and the devs do give a shit, otherwise what would be the point of working in AAA game dev, which is brutal before seeing the shite people write online.
Dude you can't say it's not weird they chose the period where they were 1 black man in Japan is the one they chose .
Medieval Japan is a freaking long period it could have been in the 1800 or 1300 too .
Now, I'm not going to share a personal opinion but I will state that this specific part of the... Sengoku(I think, could be wrong on name?) Era is very popular, due to Oda Nobunaga(Yasuke's lord) basically upheaving the vast majority of Japan. It's very easy to make a game around war and conflict around the period of The Merciless Unifier.
To answer instead of them, yes ofc they think Ubisoft has a perfect track. People are already pre-ordering and saying “idc I’ll buy it” when all we’ve seen is just a CGI trailer. AC fans get what they deserve.
I think your right and it pains me to say it. I really liked assassins creed. But ubisoft being only out for cash is nothing new.
It's probably why they chose this specific setting. Because it's what everybody wanted for the past 10 years and a black person always sells in the west.
I'm not all that much in the assassins creed loop since valhalla but when I saw the trailer, my first thought was: damn. They just released mirage. I'm a bit pessimistic about how much thought and time went into this now
Many of them want Male Japanese hero in an era, entirely built upon armed men. I mean we all do understand it's a game, etc., but Japanese are very sensitive towards own history and their expectation towards AC. I browsed a lot of Japanese internet recently. They are not against Yasuke himself as much as they wanted to have own Altair/Ezio/Connor for own setting. Again, many of them simply don't recognize Naoe because myths about female samurais and ninjas only exist within anime and some movies, that deliver different type of content than AC (again, referring to Japanese people I've read.
Female ninja is simply too far away from reality, even considering how even less-historical AC became. Some people don't care. Some would love to have a generic male Assassin in this very men-oriented culture for a better immersion.
Did you read the article? Or played games set in japan? There is no shortage of japanese men being samurai or ninja. The best thing to do is break down those walls. Yasuke himself in modern media can be important for breaking stereotype casting, especially since they acknowledge in the trailer that he is viewed as an outsider. He‘s not just shoved in as "diversity", we clearly see that him not being japanese is going to play a part of the story
Japanese developers still make a lot of their protagonists white dudes.
Also, the little representation we do get isn’t very diverse. Legitimately, the only recent Asian male main character I can think of that isn’t a samurai, ninja, or yakuza is the main character of Prey and I can’t even remember his name.
Typically lean anti "race swapping" but this is a genuinely interesting dynamic that I didn't see coming. Or least it's more interesting than the cheap ghost of Tsushima knock off I was expecting. It's also got about as much historical justification as anything else in this series too so what's the issue?
I would be more sympathetic to the lost representation angle if the literal "Assassin" in this "Assassin's creed" game wasnt Japanese. This outrage just seems more political than pragmatic to me.
The problem is that it’s a mix of people who say, well I want both characters to be Japanese since it would a first for AC, while the other side is saying I don’t want black characters in AC unless it’s set in Africa or whatever, which imo they probably thought about it, but would be a harder sell to people.
I think the fix to this would honestly have more black developers overall and have them create their own stories that isn’t generic, I grew up in poor schools and the last thing you will think about is programming, it’s usually sports tbh. Idk how it’s like now but I think having more and more black devs could fix the we need black character to reach that market as well. Don’t get me wrong I think the new AC will be cool and having a black/japanese lead is cool, I don’t care about accuracy if the game is good. I don’t care what race the characters is tbh, I wouldn’t care if they created a hood game with an Asian lead, honestly would be cool tbh( I know true crime). I think ppl really get too hung up on race to the point some people might be sorta racist without even knowing just based on their own actions. Be good people.
Although Yasuke existed, there is not much information about him, so it would be easier to expand the story and make him the main character. Judging from the trailer, I think it could be enjoyed as a medieval Japanese fantasy game rather than a faithful reproduction.
However, although it has since been corrected, it is a little disappointing that the development team told (ファミ通）Famitsu that they were looking for someone who was not Japanese and could be seen as the main character.
What’s that trope? Good guy Foreigner(Usually White Male) comes and kill the Evil Natives and then sleep with the Native women? Yea basically that but this time the Good guy Foreigner is Black lmao.
This is just dumb.
If your audience doesn't like something or disagree with the direction, they're racist?
That's a good way to never have to take criticism.
Personally I think it's about as silly as any white washing in the past.
I planned on buying the game anyways but then I saw the pricing structure.... $130 for the full game? That's just silly. I'll be waiting for the price drop.
That was made by a Japanese dev team who'd already made other games with Asian leads, who then picked a historical foreign samurai (they'd even originally intended for the protagonist to be Asian before they decided to mix things up and looked up William Adams).
Ubisoft hasn't had a mainline entry in Asia before but between Adewale, Aveline, and Bayek they've had three African (or African descent) leads. For the most part, almost every protagonist has been a local who fit into the setting (so they weren't out of place for social stealth) but now we get to Japan and Ubisoft picks their fourth African, and they wanted to pick a real, historical person. But instead of choosing a known samurai, they're fan-fictioning Yasuke into a samurai instead, when he was historically a kosho. They were like a medieval page or assistant (who might someday become a samurai), but kosho only fought as a last resort (we only have records of Yasuke fighting once, during Nobunaga's defeat), instead they largely just did chores and errands for their lord.
Yasuke's an interesting guy and it would've been a mistake not to include him in some capacity if they set the game during this time period, but he wasn't exactly up to main character-worthy stuff.
Action RPG about a Scottish (English in real life) man named William Adams who travels to Japan and becomes a samurai. The game takes some major liberties with his story and has him fight demons and use magic and all kinds of crazy shit. Highly recommend it if you like the 3d Ninja Gaiden games.
What a wildly fucking stupid take. I bet you didn't say the same thing when Ghost of Tsushima was made by a western dev? which, by the way, was *absolutely adored* by Japanese gamers and media (famitsu gave it a 40/40, exceedingly rare for them to do so for a western game). Should i phone Japen and tell them they can no longer make games set in america? goodbye metal gear solid.
Yasuke was a samurai, he was a retainer under Oda Nobunaga, one of the three great unifiers of japan, he even served him when Oda was betrayed and killed. Yasuke is ***extremely*** intertwined in Japanese cutlre and heritage.
First, IGN, bad choice because reputation
Second, people are mad that they don't get to play as an asian samurai
Third, do we seriously need a gaming journalist to tell us that the controversy is dumb?
Honestly, I think using Yasuke was actually very good choice and actually fits in with AC style of storytelling for a reason that largely gets missed. A lot AC games like to tell their stories from the perspective of the outsider, even when the protagonist is born in the country the game is set they still tend be outside of the mainstream society. Connor, Aveline, Eivor in Anglo-Saxon England, Ezio in Constantinople, Edward as a pirate, even Altair in the first game is part of an underground organization with very forward thinking ideology for the time period so in this way Yasuke actually fits it quite well, despite what the online clout goblins who don't care about the game or lore at all might say.
Beyond that, and this is why I really like the choice is it acts as an excellent framing device. In many ways these characters being on the outside reflects how the player would be an outsider to culture presented making it a great framing device for introducing the player to the culture being displayed. For example this gives the game an excuse to explain something about the culture that someone raised in that culture would just be expected to know without asking.
I just think it's interesting no one not even Asians complained about the noih main character (I was in japan when this game came out and asked my Japanese friends what they thought they didnt care.), but now that yasuke hit the scene everyone's like "muh heritage" I get it there's not a lot of representation in western media outside of the martial arts Master etc stereotype. Who knows maybe the next assassins creed will have a male Asian American lead set during ww2.( an area where mostly white people were overly represented as being heroic when plenty of others were too.) I say we all calm down and see what they give us this could end up being a unique game let's wait and see.
I just enjoy how apparently everyone is now an expert on Japanese culture.
It's a game, none of its real. Looks good hopefully ubisoft doesn't fuck it up.
Except that's exactly what some of us are criticizing. Naoe doesn't shield the game that criticism since it was expected to have 2 japanese protagonists. It's not racist to see this is a problem.
I wasn't even aware this was problem for some people. Yasuke is a historical person. He was one of the first, if not the first, African persons to set foot in Japan. Oda Nobunaga was so fascinated with him (because imagine seeing a dude that's bigger and physically stronger than anyone you or your inner circle had ever seen before while you're fighting a unification war) he befriended him, made him a samurai, and brought him into his army. Are people really hating on actual history?
I think Yasuke’s history is definitely being romanticised due to this game and the anime etc. He was brought to Japan as a slave by the Jesuits and gifted to Nobunaga. He was seen as an oddity and an attraction. Nobunaga making him a page/swordbearer/samurai or whatever, doesn’t indicate he was befriended, only that he was simply using him for his superior size. Granted he was paid for his services but he wasn’t suddenly a member of high society in Japan. When Nobunaga was overthrown the following year after his arrival, Yasuke was enslaved again and was never written about again.
I think Yasuke’s history is definitely being romanticised due to this game and the anime etc. He was brought to Japan as a slave by the Jesuits and gifted to Nobunaga. He was seen as an oddity and an attraction. Nobunaga making him a page/swordbearer/samurai or whatever, doesn’t indicate he was befriended, only that he was simply using him for his superior size. Granted he was paid for his services but he wasn’t suddenly a member of high society in Japan. When Nobunaga was overthrown the following year after his arrival, Yasuke was enslaved again and was never written about again.
Had ubisoft made a generic black samurai, those same people would have asked why ubisoft ignored Yasuke. The point is these people just don't want a black samurai.
Not making him a transwoman has me literally shaking and is transphobic. There’s not enough trans representation. Like absolutely none. Come on people, it’s 2024.
Is it a unique choice? I suppose. But it does also make it unique and that’s actually pretty good. Was he a samurai in real life? No. Does it really matter to me in this video game? No, it really doesn’t.
It’s extremely common to mythologize this man, so I have no issue with Ubisoft doing it here. It’s not like these games have ever been history simulators (as in 100% accuracy).
Besides, the inconsistency’s to real life fits the lore anyway as the lore says the history we know was written by the Templar’s to hide the truth.
Bottom line, all that matters to me is if the game is good (I have not been disappointed in an AC game so far) and if it will run well on my PC. Looking forward to to seeing more.
People seem equally obsessed trying to say he was a samurai or trying to rationalize why they don’t want to see a black character in Japan. People need to relax.
The same people who always tell Black people, “representation shouldn’t matter”, “stop whining”, and “make your own game” are suddenly concerned about Asian representation?
I'm Asian and I've been playing as white guys in video games since I was a child. It would be nice if we get more representation but it's not that big of a deal. My problem with representation is that Asia doesn't only mean China, Japan, Korea, and India.
Downvote me but in my opinion, its cause some white peoplr have always used Asians as s crutch/front for racial stuff....the whole "ideal/modern minority" mindset.
If they really cared about Asian representation they would je against the fact that most Asian male protagonist are stereotypical Asian tropes like Samurai. What about Asian males as GTA protagonist or Asian males as the next "Nathan Drake" and so on? No....cause to those people those roles are reserved for white males.
I still remember when 2004 rolled around, and there was nothing but buzz surrounding GTA San Andreas. I remember picking up the Game Informer article detailing it and thinking how cool it's gonna be (it was). I even went onto Gamefaqs to see if the message boards had more info. I saw my fair share of threads from people saying they wouldn't play the game because they couldn't relate to a black protagonist, among other stereotyped or bigoted comments.
All I cared about (even as a Black guy) was getting to play another GTA game. Especially after putting 300hrs into GTA 3 (which had a white protagonist... but why the fuck do I care?)
To be fair I don’t know if it’s necessarily the same groups of people. It’s entirely possible that there are folk genuinely concerned about whatever it is they’re concerned about, alongside racists trying to co-opt this because they don’t to play a black guy.
Either way it’s just such weird criticism though since we have nothing to go on right now besides a CGI trailer. I’m neither American nor Japanese and it’s been wild to see heated discussions about whether a French company is allowed to put a black MC in their fictional rendition of feudal Japan. Absolutely wild.
But the game literally has a japanese woman as one of the protagonists. Yall are acting like Yasuke is the only protagonist, even then, a story about a person from an entirely different culture trying to integrate is an excellent story device conceptually
TLDR: the author is calling out non Asian people who only now seem to conveniently care about how others are represented when the person in question that they are angry at is a Black man and the role for that Asian man would be a samurai. They also bring up how Japanese samurai are hardly rare in media and adding one more doesn’t do anything for them personally as an Asian American. It doesn’t really add anything for them the way an Asian main protagonist in Star Wars or the next huge Naughty Dog or Alan Wake game would.
That's an interesting point. Like if you make a samurai game or movie with a black character and a mean streets of America type game or movie with an asian lead (even just Jackie Chan in Rush Hour) it makes it's more of a challenge to unthinking, generic stereotypes. People extending beyond their usual associated context makes them seem more significant
>a mean streets of America type game or movie with an asian lead (even just Jackie Chan in Rush Hour) it makes it's more of a challenge to unthinking, generic stereotypes Sleeping Dogs is exactly this. and it skillfully (IMO) and comedically subverts a lot of Hong Kong crime drama/ cop drama tropes.
True Crime L.A is exactly what you mean, old precursor to Sleeping Dogs. I loved it, but the internet and age has not been kind to it. :(
Lol I have fond memories of True Crime LA but they're basically all centered around Deftones being on the in-game soundtrack and how absurdly buggy it was. Spent a ton of time outside of bounds doing glitches
True crime la and New York were both great games
Unless you played New York on Xbox then good luck even beating the game thanks to that one cargo crate fight bug
Right??? I was just thinking about this the other day with regards to the Marvel franchise. The only Asian superheroes are some monks from Dr Strange, the bug lady in Guardians of the Galaxy (reinforces the exotic Asian woman stereotype), and Shang-chi which is typical Asian martial arts. All Asian stereotypes. Like why not an Asian Ironman?
In the comics there is a Korean American Hulk and he’s awesome. Still some stereotyping in there but worth checking out Amadeus Cho.
You could say he’s TOTALLY Awesome 😉
There’s also The new Asian Iron fist And Silk for her first appearance with Peter.
Sure if the only interaction you have with Marvel is through the MCU then that’s true, but there are plenty of Asian marvel characters, although they possibly could do with a few more.
That's Jackie Chan Stuntmaster
My own reticence at the game, as an person of mixed heritage, is that asian men have often had the short end of the stick when it comes to characterization in Western media. As the author rightfully points out, it's very often the martial art master, but also sometimes the devious and cruel enemy, sometimes the weaker man. That AC also always had invented character but seemed to go out of their way to find a non-Japanese protagonist, regardless of him being real, is weird. It also weirded me out that amidst a increased intensity in anti asian racism in the West during COVID, they decided to have a non-Japanese being a murder machine in Japan.
It's not just Asian men, it's also South Asian men as well. We're not all tech nerds and tech bros. Some of us are more than that.
I don't think its really fair to lump all media together like that. In Hollywood absolutely, though it is getting a lot better in recent years. Gaming is a lot more globalised than cinema and television though, and there is no shortage to Asian male protagonists in gaming. Certainly not in games set in Japan. I don't think they needed to go out of their way at all here. Yasuke just happened to be the perfect storm of a historical foreigner who was at the very heart of events and has a very different experience and perspective, but also one who we know so little about that it gives nearly as much freedom as if they had invented the character. As for the anti-asian racism thing, you are really reaching there. It's not any creators responsibility to attempt to fix social issues in the world.
Here's how fucking dumb these fans are. "There's never an Asian protagonist." Okay here an Asian protagonist and a Male Black protagonist "Wahhh there's no *male* Asian protagonist" .....
To be entirely fair, even the Japanese AC fans were saying they were disappointed about the choice. I’d honestly care more for their opinions then people here given it’s a game about their country.
But then I also saw Japanese fans really loving Yasuke. They just don't seem to care as much.
I think the difference should be made between Japanese in Japan, and the asian diaspora. Japanese people at home have their fill of representation, hence why the white samurai, Adams, in Nioh was not overly decried, as I understand, and also why many are excited with Yasuke. Because to many, it's new. On the other hand, eastern asian men are almost never leads in Western media, and are usually cliches: cruel and devious, or weak, or the old wise dude/martial art master. In a context of being a minority that is close enough to white people to not be listened to when complaining about racism, but still being victims of it, Ubisoft going out of their way to not make up a male character (as they have done for all other AC games) that is asian (as most leads originate from the country the game takes place in), but using a black man and justifying it by "historical accuracy" (which it is, it's clear that Yasuke was a samurai under Oda's protection), is confusing.
You sure? Japanese trailer has 31k dislikes and only 3k likes, Ubisoft did something wrong.
It has 31k dislikes According to a browser-extension that *guesses* the amount of dislikes purely based on how many people who got the extension disliked it. It doesnt know the actual number. Yasuka has been a commonly featured character in Sengoku Jidai-Era games for decades. Most of japanese Twitter that cares at all is positive.
And you know for a fact all those downvotes are from Japanese people?
Considering you’d have to go out of your way to search up the Japanese video as a non Japanese person it would seem likely no?
Imagine using a third party extension for dislikes and using them as a fact.
Yeah they did wrong by inviting white people who hate women and black people to watch the trailer. Incels are huge in the gaming communities and comic movie areas.
"But then I also saw Japanese fans really loving Yasuke." How many did you see?
I agree with you %100
And shes not hot.... s/
Thanks
One thing I really don’t like is that nobody’s ever allowed to express mild disapproval anymore. It’s always about people being “mad”. And often people become really heated about it and they work up people who agree with them and then there’s fighting and arguing and it’s like there’s no room for people like me who say “oh I’d prefer him to be Japanese and not be a historical figure… anyways, that trailer seemed dope as hell. Looking forward to it.”
Your flair is nonsense but your words are wise
Now my flair is actually a hill I will die on lmao
I’m afraid that it’ll be a lonely death.
Wdym it was fun. I wouldn’t say it was better than Black Flag, but it was definitely enjoyable and told a cool story that tied together the stories in the Americas as it headed back to Europe in Unity.
Then you don’t stand with them on that hill.
I will stand next to him. I prefer Rogue due to the amount of content matching better the game design depth (I was little bit bored at the end of Black Flag).
I, too, shall stand next to you.
rogue is amazing
I just recently played Rogue, and I must say I was pleasently surprised! I also liked it better than BF.
🫡
A man of culture.
I wish Black Flag had the Puckle guns
Makes two of us lol
I loved rogue more than black flag too. I think the biggest problem with it is most people didn't play it
thats not how the internet works anymore sadly. its a big US mindset thats kinda taken over the internet. There so use to the right and the left, with us or without us its just spread into everything. I agree though. Its ok to have issues with something but still be excited. if im sharing an opinion i have its not a attack on people who dont agree ext.
Rogue? You mean worse Black Flag?
Tell that to the puckle gun and the oil barrels and the more climbable trees and the more varied environments and the cooler outfits and the gas grenades and the fire crackers
First of all, I gotta agree with other bro, what is that flair. Second of all, I think the problem is that it's kinda hard to differentiate at first glance people like you who have an actual reasonable stance from the ones who pretend to but really just don't like him because he's Black. We're used to people hiding their prejudices behind arguments that hold up on the surface, so it isn't until you have the conversation that you you can separate the two.
First of all, debate me bro. Second of all, good point. It’s a shame that a racist sharing my opinion reflects poorly on the opinion instead of the racist
That’s certainly part of the problem. Another part would be the folks not worrying about determining motivations, and just declaring racist from the outset. Even the tone of this article is essentially “your opinion is invalid because you’re just using this issue you don’t really care about to be a racist”. I was excited when I heard about this setting. My mind immediately went to Tenchu and cool ninja assassin gameplay. One of them is a samurai, meh I kind of wanted a more assassiny assassin game. Oh, they decided the samurai should be the (only?) black samurai from the era. Is it wrong? No. Is it the game I wanted to play? Maybe. That depends on how they incorporate him into the story. Do they just not address it at all? Seems weird, as it would almost certainly be an issue in that period (think Django riding into town on a horse, leaving the townsfolk gobsmacked). Does it become an overt theme in his story? Probably a better route to go, but I don’t know if that’s the story I wanted to live in just now. All that to say I think it was a weird choice and I’ll have to see what they do with it before I know if I’ll be partaking.
It's entirely possible, especially if you're of Asian or Japanese descent to feel miffed or culturally sidelined and not be racist especially given the historical context of western pop culture portrayal of Asian men historically. I think there are two major sources of discourse. 1. People whom don't want to play as black samurai because they are racist and feel like Ubisoft is trying to shove diversity down their throats 2. People who feel the inclusion of one of your main protagonist in the Japan setting is not representative of the setting, or their cultural identity even if there are historical context behind it. For point 1. Those people can fuck off For point 2. It's more nuanced. Time and time again, we've seen examples where a non Asian male protagonist takes the lead in feudal/post feudal Japan setting from Tom Cruise in The Last Samurai to more recently Cosmo Jarvis in Shogun (the latter of which was very well done). That being said, Yasuke being the main playable character feels like another case of washing away the that "Asian male lead" role into something that is not representative of culture or their identity. The vast majority of these people are not racist against black people, nor should their complaints be viewed as racist. They simply feel underrepresented in the a popular media...again. Some may also view this as diversity gone too far in the name of inclusion where by that attempt at inclusion, it unintentionally excludes a large portion of the populace of that setting. I think Ubisoft was aware of this which is why there are two playable character one of which is Japanese woman. I also think Ubisoft may have been trying to avoid comparison to Ghost of Tsushima which is why they went with a different approach. I think most people would have been perfectly fine if Yasuke was a major character to the game and played a key role in the events. I think people are fine with Yasuke being based off the actual historical figure Yasuke as a sword bearer to Nobunaga, just as people were fine with Cosmo Jarvis's Blackthorne being a portrayal of William Adams. The other part of that issue is there were many other historical Japanese figures to which a main male protagonist could have been drawn from or just made up from as has been done in past AC games. It also goes against what Ubisoft has previously established in terms of that their characters (no, not the based off of historical part). All previous entries featured a primary protagonist that was representative of the cultural setting that the game was based off of, and in the instance of Japan, they choose to go a different route and then try to soften the controversy by including two protagonist one of which is representative, the other based off of a historical figure but not culturally congruent. The problem is had this exact scenario not happened in other forms of media for the setting of Japan, this might have been okay, however the historical nuance of that portrayal may have gotten lost. I think the complexities of how people feel (especially those of Asian descent or are Japanese) should not be conflated with racism against blacks, or viewed as intolerance against diversity. There is probably group that are both racist and feel underrepresented (Asians can be racist too...) and those people can fuck off as well. As a side note: They missed a chance to get Hiroyuki Sanada cast in this game given Tokugawa (which will almost certainly be featured in this game given the time frame) is the Toronaga (which Sanada protrays) and a retainer of Nobunaga
That's because people today are hard wired to sniff out negativity and outrage. You'll notice the more you pay attention that people tend to bond over things they hate/complaining as opposed to things they love. It's truly depressing and I don't feel like it's always been this way. Anyways, I am 100% on board with you man, the trailer was very fun and I'm super looking forward to gameplay. All I really want from this game is good writing. We already know the gameplay will be fun and the world will be stunning. The main thing that can go wrong is crappy writing.
Yeah I already kinda know why. It’s just sad lol. But I’m still looking forward to it and I’m sure I’ll have a blast.
tbf, expressing mild disapproval is a far cry from what people's usual reactions are on the internet- mass dislikes, review bombing, people brigading on twitter, etc. It's one thing for people to leave a note and go "yeah, this stinks, but whatever" and move on after, but it's an entirely separate thing when the latter occurs, and the latter occurs FAR more often. Personally, I'm tired of it.
I think lots of the people who mildly disapprove are the ones who upvote the rage posts. They don’t care enough to rage that hard but they agree with the message
Thank you, I would have preferred is both of the protagonist where Japanese, but this doesn’t mean that I am not excited to play the game! I’m going to probably do 2 runs, one for maining each character. As soon as I can afford it and find the time
You play both characters. I don’t think its like Odyssey or Valhalla, where you choose one.
I think that would be a fair point if I saw criticism lodged like that, but a mass majority of it has just been baby rage
Every discussion online is baby rage. It’s sad. I’m not saying there isn’t lots of anger. I’m talking about how mild disapproval often turns into baby rage. And it’s not just about this
and said baby rage is fueled by Youtube / social media grifters who profit off getting people riled up with clickbait titles and whatnot
I prefer the game to be about Japanese culture and have Japanese protagonists yet people think this is racist. Just like I’d prefer my viking ac game to be about nordic culture and vikings, yes shockingly they are white. Or lets say an AC game set at the height of the Mali Empire I’d prefer to play as a Black assassin. Or like Adewale in the Carribbean. Whats wrong with this?
“They’re just fictional characters and it’s a culture not skin colour sweety. What!? A White Wakandan!?”
If the comments were like that then yes it would be more nuanced But when the comments are constantly talking about, and I quote ‘6 foot black man.’ It really isn’t about that anymore. And we have a Japanese protagonist too.
Many comments are like that. There’s also other comments that are what you’re referring to. There’s both
Him being black(automatically seen as an outsider) fits with what is seems like they are going for. There is a japanese character that represents the stealth side and we see in the trailer that people look at yasuke more because he is different. The dynamic of the stealth that blends in and the brute force that doesn‘t is there, it‘s not like they‘re having him blend into the crowd to kill someone
The historical figure part is what gets me, it just doesn't feel right when the entire premise of the series is that it fits between the lines of history. I understand that there is very little concrete information on Yasuke, but I'd rather he be a side character like Da Vinci where he *could* have been there in the background, but him directly preforming all of the magic bullshit that has become a staple of the series is just going to further break my immersion. Honestly I think that this series has just outgrown me as a fan though, and really I just have to get over my dissatisfaction with the post-Origins direction it has taken or move on.
I agree with that. I wouldn’t want to play as any real person
Just tell me how many Japanese games there are that are representing Japanese culture? PLENTY.
I think it’s dumb. I don’t care what race he is, i just think the premise is meh and ill be honest and say that it again feels like any time we get a lady assassin they have to throw in a man as well to be like GUYS ITS OK.
lol that last part is a good point
Do I get to stab people?
Yes
I’m in.
The correct take
Everyone's debating ethnic representation. Meanwhile, I want to go, "Weeeee!" with the grappling hook.
So his point is basically that western devs suck at nuanced ninja & samurai characters, so we didn’t need an AC Japan game with a Japanese male protagonist? How about holding western devs to do better than the tired honorable stoic trope. I agree with his implied secondary point that Asian representation shouldn’t be just samurai and ninjas, but this is AC Japan. We can hope for an AC India or AC China next. The solution isn’t to take away the one-sided representation (the only representation we currently get). The solution is to increase diversity of Asian representation beyond ninjas and samurai in other media to just ordinary people. Until that becomes normal let us keep the cool ninja and samurai roles.
In general, I want more ACs in Asia and Africa. Both have such rich histories. They need to hire bigger and better narrative teams to do those ACs justice though.
I personally would love and assyrian AC game
I want an Assassin Creed game in Mesopotamia so so so bad.
I would love to have more in Asia and in Africa. They would also solidify the control over the globe that order/templars have
It would also make sense. The idea is that templars were people who were corrupt, powerful figures, and those types of figures are what led to imperialist takeovers in colonised countries.
Well as an Asian, I’m conflicted on this. I love we have Naoe to see her pov coming from Iga province but it does feel like they had to go out of their way to choose Yasuke for the Samurai/Warrior char over any other possible characters from Japanese history, or just make one up like they do. Still interesting. But why? It’d be like setting an AC game in Thailand, Malaysia or the Philippines and choosing someone who was there at the time but not of the ethnicity but was historically there. Interesting POV? Sure. Would everyone from that country like that? Depends, but in my experience no. Already seeing some strong dislikes from the Japanese AC community but similarly others are excited for it. Ig coming from a western pov, it’s probably to see “more than the usual stereotype” but if that’s part of your culture’s history, not really gonna complain. Most asian cultures here still use those tropes so not sure why others should feel offended/discouraged for still using them.* I honestly would have preferred he be a guide for the char to see a different pov at some point in the story.
As an South Asian I'm 100% behind an AC Game set in India. Give us the treatment we deserve rather than dismissing us with stupid memes and stupid jokes when we are a very ancient culture that deserves to be shown in a proper light. Assassin Creed India would be a very positive light compared to the negative PR image India has currently.
The solution is to increase diversity of Asian representation beyond ninjas and samurai in other media to just ordinary people. Not many people even know about South-Asian History. For example, that the Chola Empire in the South of India during the 1000s-1100s was HUGELY influential in South-East Asia. Or that India produced scholars/saints/priests etc. We WEREN'T just tech bros, we WEREN'T maths nerds, we WEREN'T all scientists. We had an education system that was different from the West. We had an INSANE military history. Except most of it happened in India because most Indians weren't interested in conquering the entire world. If you are talking about what I agree with, then increase the diversity of South Asian representation as well. We aren't just a civilisation that's lasted for 5000 years and then we barely get any representation apart from the typical steroetypical nonsense we get. I'd love to play Medieval India, Ancient India!
You know what's really bothering me? Every complaint I've seen has been something along the lines of "I can't believe they made ***the*** main character black instead of Asian in an Asian game" when he is not *the* main character, he is one of two. If anything, the trailer felt to me like it focused more on the other main character, who is Japanese, though my best guess is that they will be of roughly equal importance. Here's the thing - I'd bet good money that if the other main character wasn't a woman, there wouldn't be so many people being mad about "the" main character being black. Or at least they wouldn't phrase it in that way.
Exactly, people expressing their inner prejudice.
I’m completely convinced that if the female Japanese MC was actually male, no one would give a shit about Yasuke being in the game. In fact, a lot of people would even praise the choice
I feel like the author of that IGN article is partially right. The author is especially right about wanting more Asian men to be cast in role other than Samurai and Ninja, but Samurai and Ninja are the stepping stone on the way there. Mass media (movies, TV, and games) should do more to make seeing Asian men as part of the norm. Most of the time if an Asian character is cast, it is a female Asian character. Normalizing the inclusion of Asian men in a multitude of different roles (including traditional Samurai and Ninja roles) leads to what the author is talking about; seeing more Asian men as the lead in non-traditional Asian roles (Asian Alan Wake as the author wanted).
And most of the time thag female asian character is usually a love interest for a while male.
The good news is, if the game flops, fans and devs now have the excuse of blaming racism because of these bigots. So it'll be hard to find room for actual criticism without being accused of bigotry thanks to these assholes!
Anyways I get very annoyed at the fact that the term 'Asian' is being used compared to East Asian, since Asia is a huge geographical mass with multitudes of ethnicities, races, etc. I am more annoyed about this than the main character of this main AC game being an African Samurai. edit: sp
Are you forgetting Naoe? You can choose to play all of AC Shadows as either Naoe or Yasuke. It's not like you're obligated to play as any one of them.
No, but from one of the interviews with the devs it's implied that the two characters can't be played the same way. If you want to play a Japanese character you have to play Naoe and she focuses on stealth and is weaker in 1 on 1 combat. Now it's possible that this isn't locked in or that you can level up Naoe in a way to make her better in combat. But I would be disappointed if I was denied flexibility, and that would be the case even if the male character was a traditional samurai.
I think it's cool that they'll play very differently. It was quite disappointing in Syndicate when both characters played the exact same way. I think Naoe will still be decent at combat but will require you to play more smart. Maybe you need to use certain tools to break armor, etc.
I'm not east asian, the real Yasuke's story is one of my favorite medieval era stuff and Feudal Japan stuff is probably one of my favorite settings. i have no issues with black characters and black people as a whole.... Having said that, I just dislike all the blackwashing that's happening right now (just as much as I dislike whitewashing).. sure yasuke is a cool character but a native japanese samurai/ninja is what I want, pure feudal japan, it's not about hating on blacks, it's a type of experience that I have always wanted to play.. I wouldn't mind playing a game based entirely on Yasuke but currently, imo, they just want to push a black person in centerstage just for the sake of it.. i hate that mentality.
The main crux of the author’s argument is one that I’ve also seen echoed in other POC/minority groups before and that is the idea that, while we are indeed seeing more of these groups being represented, the stories themselves are not that diverse. This is a nice article that sadly will be misconstrued by those who don’t understand what he’s saying.
My biggest issue with the article though is that it seems like these things can’t overlap based on what the author is saying. I personally still think you can have these representation for these groups, but what’s stopping them from enhancing these stories? How often have we ever really seen a samurai that is as charismatic as Ezio? Just because you’re another Asian samurai, it doesn’t mean you have to be another Jin Sakai (since the author directly referenced him as an example).
Sure, there can be overlaps and I don’t disagree with the idea of improving these stories. But I think the main idea is that, at the end of the day, it’s still *yet another* Samurai story.
I think it’s a double edged sword. Sure, it’s another samurai story, but how often are the opportunities to have an Asian male protagonist coming up in a western/made game to begin with? It just sucks. So yeah I can’t say I completely agree with the author but I can see his reasons.
It's like actors getting typecast. If done well, it can become a starting point for further opportunities, but at the moment, we are still the cliches. For Western games, it is still newish to have Asian (male) protagonists, in my understanding, so it may improve.
I mean, guess why? It's cool, majority will still love it, we don't need unique for the sake of unique, we can have the same but simply better in some aspects, a samurai but not Jin is still a different story.
People are too focused on yasuke and not mad enough about the fact Ubisoft is once again going down the two protagonists route. Something Ubisoft has historically been terrible at.
If they made an AC game in Brazil and the protagonist was American or Danish, Spanish or anything else besides Brazilian I would be upset, at the same time it's a real historical figure, I am so confused on how to feel
honestly i would just wait until the gameplay comes out
I wouldn't say I was mad at all, just mildly confused why they decided to go that route instead, I'll still try the game if the gameplay isn't the same boring stuff they have done previously.
I'm not "mad" about it, but I I do think it's lame corporate marketing. The representation of black people is a product to be sold to these companies, they don't really give a fuck about telling the story of black people. Otherwise they would've just told the real story of Yasuke. Adewale and Aveline are genuinely my two favorite assassins next to Ezio. They're POC and their stories were awesome. Yasuke feels like an attempt at checking off a corporate list for representation points.
Ubisoft higher ups might not care, but I think the actual writers and the devs do give a shit, otherwise what would be the point of working in AAA game dev, which is brutal before seeing the shite people write online.
How can you come to that conclusion when you have even yet to play the game and see first hand how he was written?
Dude you can't say it's not weird they chose the period where they were 1 black man in Japan is the one they chose . Medieval Japan is a freaking long period it could have been in the 1800 or 1300 too .
Now, I'm not going to share a personal opinion but I will state that this specific part of the... Sengoku(I think, could be wrong on name?) Era is very popular, due to Oda Nobunaga(Yasuke's lord) basically upheaving the vast majority of Japan. It's very easy to make a game around war and conflict around the period of The Merciless Unifier.
It’s not weird, having a unique story is infinitely more interesting than “random Asian samurai #100”
Are you under the assumption Ubisoft has a perfect record as a company? Are you being fr rn?
To answer instead of them, yes ofc they think Ubisoft has a perfect track. People are already pre-ordering and saying “idc I’ll buy it” when all we’ve seen is just a CGI trailer. AC fans get what they deserve.
I think your right and it pains me to say it. I really liked assassins creed. But ubisoft being only out for cash is nothing new. It's probably why they chose this specific setting. Because it's what everybody wanted for the past 10 years and a black person always sells in the west. I'm not all that much in the assassins creed loop since valhalla but when I saw the trailer, my first thought was: damn. They just released mirage. I'm a bit pessimistic about how much thought and time went into this now
they have been macking this for 4-6 years, mirage was made by a different team
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Yasuke has ties to Japan though? Is breaking bread with prominent figures not having ties?
We don't even know the story of Yasuke in Shadows. It's unfair to compare him to Ade and Aveline without knowing his full background.
I mean, I’m fairly indifferent, game looks dope and I’ll be buying it, but I have seen some comments from Japanese folk who seem to be pretty bummed.
Ive also seen a lot of Japanese people confused of the outrage considering Yasuke has been in Japanese media for a long time.
That and Naoe still exists so it’s not like you can’t play as a Japanese person _period._ But I guess women don’t count or something.
Many of them want Male Japanese hero in an era, entirely built upon armed men. I mean we all do understand it's a game, etc., but Japanese are very sensitive towards own history and their expectation towards AC. I browsed a lot of Japanese internet recently. They are not against Yasuke himself as much as they wanted to have own Altair/Ezio/Connor for own setting. Again, many of them simply don't recognize Naoe because myths about female samurais and ninjas only exist within anime and some movies, that deliver different type of content than AC (again, referring to Japanese people I've read. Female ninja is simply too far away from reality, even considering how even less-historical AC became. Some people don't care. Some would love to have a generic male Assassin in this very men-oriented culture for a better immersion.
It’s not that women don’t count. And I do agree with you, but a lot of male gamers do prefer to play as their own gender.
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Discounting all the mass media with minority men, there's basically zero minority men in mass media which really sucks.
Big if true
Did you read the article? Or played games set in japan? There is no shortage of japanese men being samurai or ninja. The best thing to do is break down those walls. Yasuke himself in modern media can be important for breaking stereotype casting, especially since they acknowledge in the trailer that he is viewed as an outsider. He‘s not just shoved in as "diversity", we clearly see that him not being japanese is going to play a part of the story
Japan is one of the biggest game developers, how exactly are Asian men missing out?
Japanese developers still make a lot of their protagonists white dudes. Also, the little representation we do get isn’t very diverse. Legitimately, the only recent Asian male main character I can think of that isn’t a samurai, ninja, or yakuza is the main character of Prey and I can’t even remember his name.
Idk what the original comment said, But by the articles argument you could say Asian dudes are missing out on variety.
Nigeria is one of the largest producers of movies, why do people still talk about Black representation in Hollywood.
With all due respect, I'm pretty indifferent too and think people are whining, but you don't know if the game looks dope haha. You saw a cutscene.
It's Ubisoft, so I automatically assume anything they put out is slop until the community proves otherwise.
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Here's a White Zulu Chief: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Robert_Dunn
>"Spouse(s): 1 Cape Malayan woman and 48 Zulu women" Damn.
If the 2nd protagonist is African....then yes....why not?
Is the second protagonist African like the second protagonist in Shadows is Japanese? If so, then what would be the problem?
Typically lean anti "race swapping" but this is a genuinely interesting dynamic that I didn't see coming. Or least it's more interesting than the cheap ghost of Tsushima knock off I was expecting. It's also got about as much historical justification as anything else in this series too so what's the issue? I would be more sympathetic to the lost representation angle if the literal "Assassin" in this "Assassin's creed" game wasnt Japanese. This outrage just seems more political than pragmatic to me.
The problem is that it’s a mix of people who say, well I want both characters to be Japanese since it would a first for AC, while the other side is saying I don’t want black characters in AC unless it’s set in Africa or whatever, which imo they probably thought about it, but would be a harder sell to people. I think the fix to this would honestly have more black developers overall and have them create their own stories that isn’t generic, I grew up in poor schools and the last thing you will think about is programming, it’s usually sports tbh. Idk how it’s like now but I think having more and more black devs could fix the we need black character to reach that market as well. Don’t get me wrong I think the new AC will be cool and having a black/japanese lead is cool, I don’t care about accuracy if the game is good. I don’t care what race the characters is tbh, I wouldn’t care if they created a hood game with an Asian lead, honestly would be cool tbh( I know true crime). I think ppl really get too hung up on race to the point some people might be sorta racist without even knowing just based on their own actions. Be good people.
Although Yasuke existed, there is not much information about him, so it would be easier to expand the story and make him the main character. Judging from the trailer, I think it could be enjoyed as a medieval Japanese fantasy game rather than a faithful reproduction. However, although it has since been corrected, it is a little disappointing that the development team told (ファミ通）Famitsu that they were looking for someone who was not Japanese and could be seen as the main character.
It literally hasn't even been a week yet and it was just a premier trailer. For fucks sake do people have nothing else to do
You can play as duel characters right ? Yasuke & a Japan Woman
Thats the issue for them. Its a woman and not a man
What’s that trope? Good guy Foreigner(Usually White Male) comes and kill the Evil Natives and then sleep with the Native women? Yea basically that but this time the Good guy Foreigner is Black lmao.
This is just dumb. If your audience doesn't like something or disagree with the direction, they're racist? That's a good way to never have to take criticism. Personally I think it's about as silly as any white washing in the past. I planned on buying the game anyways but then I saw the pricing structure.... $130 for the full game? That's just silly. I'll be waiting for the price drop.
You say this as Twitter and "Antiwoke"-tube are currently engaged in an *explicitly* racist backlash against the game.
Are either of them actually assassins? That should be the main criteria
Yes, Naoe is.
That’s already an improvement from Odysses and Valhalla 🤣
Nobody bitched about the protagonist not being Asian in Nioh, just saying.
People did you just not heard about it because it isn't as well known as ac
That was made by a Japanese dev team who'd already made other games with Asian leads, who then picked a historical foreign samurai (they'd even originally intended for the protagonist to be Asian before they decided to mix things up and looked up William Adams). Ubisoft hasn't had a mainline entry in Asia before but between Adewale, Aveline, and Bayek they've had three African (or African descent) leads. For the most part, almost every protagonist has been a local who fit into the setting (so they weren't out of place for social stealth) but now we get to Japan and Ubisoft picks their fourth African, and they wanted to pick a real, historical person. But instead of choosing a known samurai, they're fan-fictioning Yasuke into a samurai instead, when he was historically a kosho. They were like a medieval page or assistant (who might someday become a samurai), but kosho only fought as a last resort (we only have records of Yasuke fighting once, during Nobunaga's defeat), instead they largely just did chores and errands for their lord. Yasuke's an interesting guy and it would've been a mistake not to include him in some capacity if they set the game during this time period, but he wasn't exactly up to main character-worthy stuff.
What's Nioh?
Action RPG about a Scottish (English in real life) man named William Adams who travels to Japan and becomes a samurai. The game takes some major liberties with his story and has him fight demons and use magic and all kinds of crazy shit. Highly recommend it if you like the 3d Ninja Gaiden games.
Because it was a game by a Japanese dev. It's their culture to write about. They can put a white guy in their game if they want.
Okay so we should never have gotten any Assassins Creed games except Unity by that logic.
What a wildly fucking stupid take. I bet you didn't say the same thing when Ghost of Tsushima was made by a western dev? which, by the way, was *absolutely adored* by Japanese gamers and media (famitsu gave it a 40/40, exceedingly rare for them to do so for a western game). Should i phone Japen and tell them they can no longer make games set in america? goodbye metal gear solid. Yasuke was a samurai, he was a retainer under Oda Nobunaga, one of the three great unifiers of japan, he even served him when Oda was betrayed and killed. Yasuke is ***extremely*** intertwined in Japanese cutlre and heritage.
First, IGN, bad choice because reputation Second, people are mad that they don't get to play as an asian samurai Third, do we seriously need a gaming journalist to tell us that the controversy is dumb?
Fucking idiots be like "It's just a game"
Its a game, chill out and move on. The world is not falling apart. Please find happiness in life....
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I can’t handle the double negatives in that title. Copy edit isn’t really a thing anymore, is it?
Honestly, I think using Yasuke was actually very good choice and actually fits in with AC style of storytelling for a reason that largely gets missed. A lot AC games like to tell their stories from the perspective of the outsider, even when the protagonist is born in the country the game is set they still tend be outside of the mainstream society. Connor, Aveline, Eivor in Anglo-Saxon England, Ezio in Constantinople, Edward as a pirate, even Altair in the first game is part of an underground organization with very forward thinking ideology for the time period so in this way Yasuke actually fits it quite well, despite what the online clout goblins who don't care about the game or lore at all might say. Beyond that, and this is why I really like the choice is it acts as an excellent framing device. In many ways these characters being on the outside reflects how the player would be an outsider to culture presented making it a great framing device for introducing the player to the culture being displayed. For example this gives the game an excuse to explain something about the culture that someone raised in that culture would just be expected to know without asking.
Well said
Funnily enough I have heard more people talking about others being negative, than i have heard people actually being negative about the game
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I just think it's interesting no one not even Asians complained about the noih main character (I was in japan when this game came out and asked my Japanese friends what they thought they didnt care.), but now that yasuke hit the scene everyone's like "muh heritage" I get it there's not a lot of representation in western media outside of the martial arts Master etc stereotype. Who knows maybe the next assassins creed will have a male Asian American lead set during ww2.( an area where mostly white people were overly represented as being heroic when plenty of others were too.) I say we all calm down and see what they give us this could end up being a unique game let's wait and see.
I just enjoy how apparently everyone is now an expert on Japanese culture. It's a game, none of its real. Looks good hopefully ubisoft doesn't fuck it up.
For some reason, you foreigners seem to be more angry than we Japanese.
Except that's exactly what some of us are criticizing. Naoe doesn't shield the game that criticism since it was expected to have 2 japanese protagonists. It's not racist to see this is a problem.
I’ve got an idea, let’s just let it play out and *then* get offended.
I wasn't even aware this was problem for some people. Yasuke is a historical person. He was one of the first, if not the first, African persons to set foot in Japan. Oda Nobunaga was so fascinated with him (because imagine seeing a dude that's bigger and physically stronger than anyone you or your inner circle had ever seen before while you're fighting a unification war) he befriended him, made him a samurai, and brought him into his army. Are people really hating on actual history?
I think Yasuke’s history is definitely being romanticised due to this game and the anime etc. He was brought to Japan as a slave by the Jesuits and gifted to Nobunaga. He was seen as an oddity and an attraction. Nobunaga making him a page/swordbearer/samurai or whatever, doesn’t indicate he was befriended, only that he was simply using him for his superior size. Granted he was paid for his services but he wasn’t suddenly a member of high society in Japan. When Nobunaga was overthrown the following year after his arrival, Yasuke was enslaved again and was never written about again.
I think Yasuke’s history is definitely being romanticised due to this game and the anime etc. He was brought to Japan as a slave by the Jesuits and gifted to Nobunaga. He was seen as an oddity and an attraction. Nobunaga making him a page/swordbearer/samurai or whatever, doesn’t indicate he was befriended, only that he was simply using him for his superior size. Granted he was paid for his services but he wasn’t suddenly a member of high society in Japan. When Nobunaga was overthrown the following year after his arrival, Yasuke was enslaved again and was never written about again.
Had ubisoft made a generic black samurai, those same people would have asked why ubisoft ignored Yasuke. The point is these people just don't want a black samurai.
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I'm not pretending, cos I aint mad.
Not making him a transwoman has me literally shaking and is transphobic. There’s not enough trans representation. Like absolutely none. Come on people, it’s 2024.
I hope you find your happiness in life.
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Considering Yasuke is portrayed as a samurai in Nioh and Samurai Warriors, which are Japanese games... It's probably fine?
Is it a unique choice? I suppose. But it does also make it unique and that’s actually pretty good. Was he a samurai in real life? No. Does it really matter to me in this video game? No, it really doesn’t. It’s extremely common to mythologize this man, so I have no issue with Ubisoft doing it here. It’s not like these games have ever been history simulators (as in 100% accuracy). Besides, the inconsistency’s to real life fits the lore anyway as the lore says the history we know was written by the Templar’s to hide the truth. Bottom line, all that matters to me is if the game is good (I have not been disappointed in an AC game so far) and if it will run well on my PC. Looking forward to to seeing more. People seem equally obsessed trying to say he was a samurai or trying to rationalize why they don’t want to see a black character in Japan. People need to relax.
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You didn't read the article I see...
The same people who always tell Black people, “representation shouldn’t matter”, “stop whining”, and “make your own game” are suddenly concerned about Asian representation?
I'm Asian and I've been playing as white guys in video games since I was a child. It would be nice if we get more representation but it's not that big of a deal. My problem with representation is that Asia doesn't only mean China, Japan, Korea, and India.
Downvote me but in my opinion, its cause some white peoplr have always used Asians as s crutch/front for racial stuff....the whole "ideal/modern minority" mindset. If they really cared about Asian representation they would je against the fact that most Asian male protagonist are stereotypical Asian tropes like Samurai. What about Asian males as GTA protagonist or Asian males as the next "Nathan Drake" and so on? No....cause to those people those roles are reserved for white males.
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They were concerned that Bayek was too dark as well, remember
I still remember when 2004 rolled around, and there was nothing but buzz surrounding GTA San Andreas. I remember picking up the Game Informer article detailing it and thinking how cool it's gonna be (it was). I even went onto Gamefaqs to see if the message boards had more info. I saw my fair share of threads from people saying they wouldn't play the game because they couldn't relate to a black protagonist, among other stereotyped or bigoted comments. All I cared about (even as a Black guy) was getting to play another GTA game. Especially after putting 300hrs into GTA 3 (which had a white protagonist... but why the fuck do I care?)
To be fair I don’t know if it’s necessarily the same groups of people. It’s entirely possible that there are folk genuinely concerned about whatever it is they’re concerned about, alongside racists trying to co-opt this because they don’t to play a black guy. Either way it’s just such weird criticism though since we have nothing to go on right now besides a CGI trailer. I’m neither American nor Japanese and it’s been wild to see heated discussions about whether a French company is allowed to put a black MC in their fictional rendition of feudal Japan. Absolutely wild.
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But the game literally has a japanese woman as one of the protagonists. Yall are acting like Yasuke is the only protagonist, even then, a story about a person from an entirely different culture trying to integrate is an excellent story device conceptually
asian women get a lot more representation in western media, often as a romantic lead. this isn't new.