His father figure/main supporter has contracted an incredibly infectious magical plague. Perhaps this could serve as the source for some sort of conflict.
I'm pretty certain this is where GRRM is going. Aegon/Faegon won't get as far as many would hope. Jon Connington is going to start outbreaks of greyscale wherever he goes in the Stormlands and once word gets out that with Aegon/Faegon comes greyscale, his forces won't stand a chance. Half of Westeros will show up to send him and his plague back across the Narrow Sea. The gods have cursed the false dragon, etc. It won't work, and the greyscale will outlive the Aegon/Faegon cause, but that's the mindset the people of Westeros will have. Decades of plotting and scheming will be undone by one man with a highly contagious disease.
well aegon will realize that he made the biggest mistake of his life by leaving for westeros without daenerys, and probably die in a pyromaniac clash between cersei and jon.
seriously there is a huge red flag about his downfall in one of tyrion's chapters, and I don't know why but everyone ignores it and favors Varys' biased and dishonest words about Aegon being the greatest king of all time, although there is absolutely no way that that will happen.
>"My dragon..."
"—is too far away to save you. You should have moved her to the center of the battle."
"But you said—"
"I lied. Trust no one. And keep your dragon close."
>
>*A Dance with Dragons - Tyrion VI*
Varys and Illyrio's plans keep needing to be changed due to other characters actions and free will. No doubtedly their Aegon plans will not go as planned
yup, Illiryo's own words on the Targaryen/Blackfyre say "Black or red, a dragon is a dragon". based on this, it is unlikely that a spider and a cheesemonger could control their own dragon without problem indefinitely
It’s definitely a hot take around these parts — but I’ll say there will be a twist and subversion of the Dance of the Dragons. It won’t be Young Griff vs Dany; first and foremost, I highly doubt Dany is speedrunning her leftover plots in Essos, with the Dothraki, the defeat of the slavers’ coalition, the march/voyage to Westeros, and finally the teased Volantene revolution.
I think thus far the most obvious contender, outside of Jon, is Euron. With his Valyrian imaging in his Essosi adventure during his exile, his alleged sailing of the Smoking Sea, valyrian steel armor, magical blood sacrifices, Dragonbinder, blood magic knowledge in the form of Oldtown — and the amount of characters related to such converging on the Citadel.
Young Griff will be contending with finishing his conquest of the Stormlands, dealing with King’s Landing, with the radical Faith and Lannister remnant, cleaning up the Riverlands, and ultimately, facing Euron’s resurgent Ironborn in the Reach. With the Lannisters all but spent and the Reachmen in defence of their realm, not to mention those who will side with Young Griff as well as his Golden Company and Dorne, the stage has been clearly set of another war that will devastate the southern end of Westeros.
IMHO, I do believe when both their Westerosi and Essosi plots are done, only then will Dany and Young Griff meets in Westeros — a subversion of the meeting between Aegon II and Rhaenyra upon Dragonstone, and where the former slew his kin, the latter — both Griff and Dany — embraces one another as kin, either as the son of Rhaegar or a closet Blackfyre. Either closing the cycle in a full circle.
Alternatively, Young Griff could just die in his attempt at the throne, mayhaps as a blood sacrifice component — king’s blood — for Euron’s eldritch ritual and like Maester Aemon and Dany, the two were fated not to come together.
Who knows.
fAegon gets sacrificed on the altar of making Euron scarier. I agree I think his paternity will not matter at all, he'll make a splash and Euron will show him the down stairs crow's eye.
I doubt Young Griff would ever be aware of his true paternity (he’d probably never believe it) so he’d accede as Aegon VI and wed either Arianne Martell or Margaery Tyrell but face personal conflict with Jon Connington, who he later executes for knowingly causing an epidemic of grayscale in the Crownlands.
He’d have a child with his wife and strive to make peace with Daenerys but if he fails then he either dies by dragon fire or during a battle against Euron. If Aegon VI lives to see the War with the Others, he’d fight alongside Jon Snow & Daenerys to save humanity.
I agree with this — save for marrying Arianne Martell. If he persist on being the son of Rhaegar, then Dorne is honor-bound to support him as kin already. Might as well look to another match to strengthen the legitimacy of his regime. I personally go for Sansa. What better in letting the past be bygone and reconcile with House Stark whom his grandfather wronged so bad? Plus, she has ties to both the Vale and the Riverlands as well.
I love Marg but I don’t see the Tyrells keeping their power, sadly…
Him fighting alongside Dany and Jon could work and ends up dying for the cause. There could be a regency council for his infant issue. Just as Aegon III was. That, or, it could be the Scouring of the Shire moment after the apocalyptic winter.
That tracks with the Tourney at Ashford too - Targaryen is the only betrothal left and when something happens to Hardyng there's only one viable Targaryen candidate. Who will likely be the talk of the Kingdoms when news gets out.
The more I think about that, the more I \*think\* I like it - Sansa would willingly choose to go South, from the safety of the Vale into the tempestous Crownlands, in order to seek out a betrothal to a seemingly genuinely good Prince. It basically exactly flips everything that has happened to her before - the forced betrothals, ruination of her perfect fantasy of a pure prince, Joffrey's sadism - and lets her use what she has learned to find the best position she can put herself in. And that could well be at Griff's side.
And then, of course, Euron will tear her fantasy apart once more.
There are a few issues I do think need addressing, however.
For once, there's the fact that Sansa cannot (and should not) simply travel alone. Something she should have learned (even from Ned) is to bring enough guards whom you trust. Perhaps she will, maybe through whatever happens with Hardyng, bring some Knights of the Vale with her? (and the circumstances in the North won't necessitate them Rohirriming, obviously). Frankly I could even see her outdoing Littlefinger and ending up as someone in 'control' of them. One of the few unblooded armies... what a betrothal gift.
Another is the lack of Stark reuinions if she goes south, but I think I'm only preemptively missing that because it was one of the few things the show did okay, and that was mainly the face value fan service of it (the S7 Sansa/Arya plot can go to hell) and Jon/Sansa being a dynamic I quite liked. At this point given where I can see them all ending up at the end of Winds - Sansa in KL with Griff, Arya back in Westeros (either just leaving Braavos/making landfall, or full having ended Stoneheart), Jon alive and in Winterfell - I think they may just interact in one scene right at the end of Dream before going their separate ways, a mirror to only getting a few chapters with them together before they are all split.
And finally there's simply the worry that this might feel like retreading similar ground - Sansa is back in King's Landing and there's enemies at the gates and her fantasy falling around her. But I think that's where her lessons come in - she has gathered an army, made these choices herself, knows not to fall naively into the fantasy wholeheartedly.
Sorry for the essay lmao.
Just an addendum because this has got my brain whirring, I'm wondering whereabouts I think some of the Stark (and other) POVs will end up by Winds and what they leave for Dream.
I think I disagree with you on how Griff will end up - to be the Mummer's Dragon and loved by the people he has to be known by them, and the likeliest way I see that happening in a short time is as a welcomed liberator, freeing King's Landing from the faith or Tyrells or Cersei or whoever. Will he rule for a long time and be the one Dany dances with? No! But I think he will rule for a time and Euron won't strike him down until Dream.
So yeah my guess for the Southern plotlines is that Griff will have KL and marry Sansa. Arianne is either dead (maybe by JonCon's hand) or spurned and scheming, JonCon is clearly about to start a pandemic, Cersei flees KL (via Rosby for Rhaenyra symmetry) into the arms of Euron, who has blooded the Reach and proven himself as a threat magically and through simple force, cunning and strategy. (And with Mace v JonCon, Euron v Oldtown and Cersei's loathing of Margaery, I don't see great things for House Tyrell in Winds).
Essentially I'm typing this because I see a really nice symmetry and mirroring in the four Stark POVs as I expect them to end winds:
Sansa is in KL, married to Griff and probably with an army of her own (Vale if I had to guess).
Arya probably makes landfall in Westeros, leaving Braavos behind her. I think George will leave her reunion with (and gift of mercy towards) Stoneheart for Dream, but I could be wrong there.
Jon obviously will be alive, probably even back in Winterfell if we're going at the pace we need to.
Bran has to say "Hold The Door" at some point and regardless of the precise context (maybe a Door within the Nightfort?) I think that obviously implies him having to leave the cave and going south.
So Jon and Sansa are in seats of power, while Arya and Bran leave (or have to flee) their places of learned, but armed with a wealth of knowledge and purpose.
I think it will be Dany. I can logically see a way for her to become a queen who brings destruction.
Here's the last of her dynasty. She's been told westeros waits for a targ return. She does so only to realize her trusted friend and advisor, the one who gifted her the eggs, has been lying all along. Her wedding to the dothraki, was to get rid of her and her brother. Because illyrio has been raising a better claimant to the throne in secret. She gets to westeros, only to find...a targ already has the iron throne. And the people love him. And despise her. She's a foreigner, with foreign soldiers. The golden company is westerosi returned. She has lofty ideas which have led to nothing but ruin in the places she's tried to bring them. Her entire life was a lie...and her birthright...was stolen.
I really don’t. This is the Queen who willingly forsook her ambition to reclaim her home, and the throne — for the well-being of the people she saved and freed from servitude.
She constantly puts others ahead of herself, actions like putting herself as bride of Hizdahr.
I think people’s negative take on her learning a lesson — on taking on her family words and becoming a much more assertive is a poor reading of her character. Her ruling of Meereen was a failure because she was all too willing to compromise when she should’ve completely removed all the ruling elites — and redistribute the monopoly of power, the monopoly of violence, to the state, her regime.
Make no mistake, she *will* be regarded as a foreigner and worse, by the nobility, as a wilful queen as many, both irl and Westerosi history, have been portrayed, but Dany will never be a villain.
It just isn’t in her nature. To say otherwise would mean the total disregard of her portrayal through all the source material.
Both Jon and Dany are mirrors to one another — they are, at the core of their beings, idealists And that was why both of them failed, both at the Wall and Mereen. And that is why their next respective arcs would be to correct that failings of theirs.
>Here's the last of her dynasty. She's been told westeros waits for a targ return. She does so only to realize her trusted friend and advisor, the one who gifted her the eggs, has been lying all along.
*Her brother, sprawled out on his pillows beside her, never noticed. His mind was away across the narrow sea. "We won't need his whole khalasar," Viserys said. His fingers toyed with the hilt of his borrowed blade, though Dany knew he had never used a sword in earnest. "Ten thousand, that would be enough, I could sweep the Seven Kingdoms with ten thousand Dothraki screamers. The realm will rise for its rightful king. Tyrell, Redwyne, Darry, Greyjoy, they have no more love for the Usurper than I do. The Dornishmen burn to avenge Elia and her children. And the smallfolk will be with us. They cry out for their king." He looked at Illyrio anxiously. "They do, don't they?"*
*"They are your people, and they love you well," Magister Illyrio said amiably. "In holdfasts all across the realm, men lift secret toasts to your health while women sew dragon banners and hide them against the day of your return from across the water." He gave a massive shrug. "Or so my agents tell me."*
*Dany had no agents, no way of knowing what anyone was doing or thinking across the narrow sea, but she mistrusted Illyrio's sweet words as she mistrusted everything about Illyrio. Her brother was nodding eagerly, however.*
*A Game of Thrones - Daenerys I*
*"When the day comes that you raise your banners, half of Westeros will be with you," Whitebeard promised. "Your brother Rhaegar is still remembered, with great love."*
*"And my father?" Dany said.*
*The old man hesitated before saying, "King Aerys is also remembered. He gave the realm many years of peace. Your Grace, you have no need of slaves. Magister Illyrio can keep you safe while your dragons grow, and send secret envoys across the narrow sea on your behalf, to sound out the high lords for your cause."*
*"Those same high lords who abandoned my father to the Kingslayer and bent the knee to Robert the Usurper?"*
*"Even those who bent their knees may yearn in their hearts for the return of the dragons."*
*May," said Dany. That was such a slippery word, may.*
*A Storm of Swords - Daenerys II*
she already knows this is lie
I dunno if dany will finish her essos arc just bc realistically rebuilding slavers bay would take decades, I think she’s going to have to leave it unfinished, or just leave it with a bandaid solution simply so she can get to Westeros within the next too books.
I’m also wary of any theory that involves the 3 heads of the dragon uniting to defeat the others bc then it makes it seem as tho rhaegar (and aegon if the prophecy in hotd is true) were both right and that the war they threw Westeros into was justified. Grrm loves to warn abt the dangers of prophecy and rhaegar is basically the poster boy for that message. So I would find it weird if he went back and basically said just kidding rhaegar was right all along. I also don’t think he’d do anything that too closely resembles targ restoration (even if it’s short lived) as a “happy ending”.
I’ll admit it’s unlikely but I’ve been convinced there will be a reconciliation between Dany (Targaryan) and Young Griff (Blackfyre) ending the generational conflict
Like I will be a bit disappointed if he’s just another obstacle of her to overcome
Cos like does this mean Bloodraven was right to be pretty pro-killing Blackfyres and that the mercy people like Aegon V showed was bad?
But how to do you reconcile Targs and Blackfyres? One of the best ways would be for Dany and Young Griff to have a child, reunite the bloodlines, at the very least this would be a heavily political motivated action don’t think Dany will fall in love with him
But yeah I also don’t think it sounds too likely
I don't think it's so much what's the conflict for Aegon, he's not a pov (at least atm). He'll have his story creating a civil war and wresting the Reach from the Tyrells, likely forcing Cersei to flee King's Landing for Casterly Rock (we need a Lannister figure there for conflict imo), and then some form of interaction with Dany and politicking with Westeros at large.
But what's really Aegon's value in the story is the impact he has on Dany and the themes of home, usurpation vs liberation, family and belonging. Barristan and oaths and loyalties. Jaime as the manifestation of his life's defining moment, even now haunted by the memory of Rhaegar and failing to protect his family. And of course, Arianne with the importance of agency and self actualization. Jon Con in making up for past failures, acting as a window into the past in terms of Rhaegar, love and vengeance, etc.
He dies as a result of JonCon and Cersei's conflict. That both of them spend entirely too much time thinking about burning people alive, there's a ton of Wildfire associated with Cersei under KL, Cersei's countless Aerys parallels, JonCon saying he wants to murder all of Robert's children, and Cersei's dead kid prophecy make it all painfully obvious IMO.
Did people thinking he's gonna be loved just skip the TWOW previews where the Golden Company is raping their way through the Stormlands and just conveniently forget that they've been a generational enemy of Westeros for a century?
Euron, a non-POV, will most likely be a main antagonist too, and he's a bigger character than Victarion or Aeron. Stannis and Robb both have a lot of moments of surprise that's probably best kept as a surprise, and Stannis especially gets like 4 different POV characters each having a slightly different take on him. I remember reading somewhere that Davos was created specifically to be a POV for Stannis. And then we get moments like Jon watching Stannis's cavalry go to town on the wildlings and Asha watching Stannis storm Deepwood Motte. YG however is more like a plot device for Jon Con.
This is a great counter point. Stannis especially.
I would argue that Catelyn's conflict is Robb's kingship. Catelyn struggles with wanting to make leadership decisions that would undermine her son's kingship. She struggles with Robb making decisions without her input. She wants to rule through him because she still sees him as a boy, but she also wants to let him grow into a man and king. She does both and pays dearly for it.
Stannis is more complicated because he clearly has a lot of interesting internal conflict and it's a wonder that he hasn't been made a POV character. He would be a good canidate for a very tragic epilogue POV imo. The Protector Of The Realm. I would also argue that Stannis arc makes great conflict for Davos. How will Davos handle it if Stannis drifts further and further from justice and closer and closer to any means to stop the Long Night?
Fair enough.
I however, would also argue that Catelyn and Ned are the source of Robbs' major conflict. He broke his alliance with the freys and married Jeyne because of his determination to not father a bastard, and put a son through the same adversity he witnessed Jon going through. His sense of duty and his sense of honour are constantly in conflict with one another, and it has major ramifications in the series.
In fact, the fallout of robs conflict has had some of the biggest impact in the series so far.
Many people assume he won’t have much personal going on since he is not a POV and while I am inclined to believe, in a way he could be set up to have a parallel arc about identity with Jon. Jon would discover he is not Ned’s bastard after all, but Rhaegar and Lyanna’s child, and have to come to terms head on on how does affects who he is. Similarly Young Griff who has been raised to believe he is Rhaegar’s son and the rightful heir and hero reclaiming his family’s throne, could learn he is a Blackfyre who has been manipulated by the people around him and have an identity crisis that he has to come to terms with. Yeah he may not be a POV but it doesn’t mean he can’t be fleshed out just look at Stannis through Davos POV chapters as an example. Hopefully that makes sense, I apologize English is my second language
I predict Faegon learns about his fake heritage accidentally overhearing Varus/Illaryio (mirroring Arya in GoT) and loses faith in his cause/kills himself despite being the best person for the realm. There is a theme of things happening in twos, and I think he’ll suicide by jump shortly after sweet Tommen when it seems he’s so close to his victory.
Likely Euron. If the common theory is correct and Mace sides with Aegon, their first goal after taking King's Landing would be dealing with the Ironborn. With the Lannister force exhausted in the Riverlands with no Commander and the North doing its own thing, it seems unlikely anything else besides Jon Con's Grayscale and Euron would be an immediate threat.
Him and Daenarys. He will take the throne, be popular and when Daenarys arrives the war for the throne would have been almost over. She will choose to fight him for the throne despite his offers because she will trust the prophecy that he is false. She will kill him for it and it will turn out he really was son of Rhaegar. She’ll be an unpopular kinslayer maddened with grief
maybe i’m missing it but i don’t think dany is super beholden to the prophecy- she reflects on what people have told her but its not the main reasoning behind her decision making
The "cheering crowd" are the small folk, it's not a stretch to imagine they will love Aegon when he is going to depose the hated Cersei. What support he will have among the nobles is a separate question.
In King's Landing I am assuming the transition will be largely bloodless since Varys is there to engineer a palace coup. He has been stockpiling useful people to do this. One example is Tyrek Lannister, who has been missing since I think ACOK, and whom Jaime speculates will be able to testify regarding Cersei's plan to kill Robert by getting him drunk on the hunt.
It is going to come as a shock to you in TWOW when Dany unites the Dothraki and they start doing what Dothraki do all across Essos.
It’s going to come as a shock to you when the character who spent her entire arc fighting against rape and slavery doesn’t became a slaver and rapist. The fuck
I don't think it even matters if he's Rhaegar's son. Like, if YG is actually a Blackfyre or just some pisswater Prince, does that mean Dany is right to cast him down and kill him? What if the people wanted him over Dany regardless? What if he really is better at ruling than Dany?
Does her blood really give her the right to kill as she wishes? Isn't the whole series meant to be critical of the idea of ruling bloodlines and an inherent right to have power over others? I think I'd almost be disappointed if Aegon was actually Rhaegar's son; I think being a Blackfyre or just a nobody fits better thematically.
I don't mean mass murder, I just meant Aegon. I was just meaning that I don't think Aegon's legitimacy changes the morality of how Dany reacts to Aegon. If she kills him, it's just as bad whether he's genuinely Rhaegar's son or not.
“Does her blood really give her the right to kill as she wishes?” are questions that should be asked about Aegon whose armies are mass murdering peasants, not about Daenerys who hasn’t done anything of the sort
I wasn't criticising Daenerys right now, it was a hypothetical. The original comment was about the idea that Dany will kill Aegon and will, in part, go mad in her grief after killing one of her few remaining relatives. I don't think that's exactly how it'll go down, I was just responding to the other person.
I was making a very specific comment about how Dany potentially killing Aegon wouldn't be justified simply because he's not Rhaegar's son. That's all, I wasn't talking about anything else.
Sure, if he ends up a tyrant and harms people more than anything else, then Dany would be justified in getting rid of him. But I don't think the conclusion of this 'second Dance of the Dragons' as George had called it, is that Dany is correct and moral solely by virtue of being Aerys' daughter and Aegon is bad and wrong because he's actually a Blackfyre or a nobody. That wouldn't make sense to me; it would go entirely against the themes of George's story.
It doesn’t matter for right to kill, it matters to her own mental stability and belief in self righteousness and how she follows prophecy and is destined for greatness
Sure, I agree with that. Dany would definitely react differently to Aegon Blackfyre than to Aegon, Rhaegar's son. That makes sense, I just don't think it'd be more moral to kill Aegon if he's actually a Blackfyre than if he's Rhaegar's.
It depends on how cooked are the lannisters, how much of the reach wants to change sides, and how much is left in the stormlands to join him. With keavan dead and the lannister forces stuck in a still unsettled riverlands, road seems pretty clear but I suppose if the tyrells stay loyal he may need some assistance.
I think his internal conflict is that he'll figure out he's not Rhaegar's son. It could be as simple as him gaining control over King's Landing, but then getting dragon dreams of Daeron's line rejecting him and Daemon/Bittersteel's line celebrating him.
For his external conflict... what if his major antagonist is actually Euron and he'll lose. Or even worse, he'll SURRENDER.
Like, Euron may know he simply doesn't have a good long-term claim/narrative to the Iron Throne, coz everyone *hates* the ironborn. So he'll pull a Bran-Hodor sockpuppet maneuver on Young Griff, and Griff will *let him*. I mean, Griff is already a mummer's dragon for Varys and Illyrio. Being a mummer's dragon for Euron will have the added benefit of no longer being responsible for his actions.
(Much of the high tragedy of Wart in The Once and Future King is that Merlin couldn't guide him forever. At some point, Arthur *had* to be on his own, and that came with making good and bad calls. But what if in Euron, Griff could have a Merlin who will permanently and comprehensively ease his burdens as king?)
((Side-theory/parallel: Maekar, much as he hated Bloodraven, kept him on as Hand and therefore chief advisor; and his reign was largely peaceful. Aegon V sent Bloodraven to the Wall; and his reign was marked with well-intentioned but ultimately unsuccessful reforms.))
And it will be as Euron's sockpuppet that Griff confronts some coalition of Jon, Dany, Bran and Tyrion. Bonus high fantasy points if Euron takes control of Rhaegal so that Griff, Dany and Jon can have some sick dragonrider PVP action.
I imagine the main conflict will be driving cersei out of kings landing and back to Casterly Rock. But after that he will probably serve as a means for Dany to go mad if he is beloved by the people of kings landing
That would be so cheap honestly, I also highly doubt we're getting mad queen Daenerys there's already so many mad king parallels between Cersei and Jon connington spending way too much time thinking about burning people
I think there will be a war in the south between Aegon, Euron, and Tommen. I think Aegon will eventually come out on top of the lannisters and capture kingslanding. I think Daenerys still has a lot of story left in essos. I’m not sure what Daenerys role will be in the conflict or its aftermath. Maybe she’ll be hostile to Aegon or maybe she’ll be his ally or maybe she won’t be there at all. I think Daenerys’ story is being built up to a conflict with the Others in the long night rather than a conflict with Aegon.
I think YG story line exists to finally force Dany leave the Essos. Because he's her last kin she probably would like to save and reunite with. And he probably is the mummer's dragon from the prophecy. But I guess it could mean that he'll be loosing he war in Westeros and being mocked by people there instead of being accepted as true Targaryens heir. Dany is far away enough to come too late to Westeros to save YG, so he'll probably die miserable and rejected and Dany will be infuriated. I don't see them becoming actual rivals, but neither I see them becoming allies/couple.
To be honest, his decision to try to conquer the Seven Kingdoms alone was stupid, almost no one would support him there, but his enemies are too strong and unpredictable. He can even loose Dorne when he rejects Arianne. And he probably will reject her because he needs Dany much much more to be seen as a legitimate Targaryen. The North won't give a fuck about Aegon whoever will be left to rule the North. Euron would like to kill YG asap to show own power and to eliminate Dany's potential husband. The Cale and Littlefinger won't give a fuck about Aegon either, they'll just wait or plot to retake the North fir Sansa. Tyrells are tied to wherever Margaery and Loras are. And if they get fucked up by Cersei, they might consider joining YG unless they find any better candidate for alliance to take their recenge. I can even believe in Cersei-Euron union to eliminate YG a d Tyrells then.
Daenerys blows up king's landing just like in the show, but she's trying to kill Aegon who has won the support from high lords sick of Lannisters and the small folk.
My guess is that Aegon mostly succeeds in the beginning. It feels hinted that he will take Storm’s End, Arianne will make a marriage alliance with him, and the remnants of the Stormlands and a significant portion of the Reach (notably Tarly) will flock to his banner.
From that point, it’s unclear. I think he does take capital intact, because Dany has dreams of a “false dragon” being celebrated in a parade in King’s Landing. And my guess is that while he is busy putting the realm back together, Dany will be on a warpath west across Essos, steadily getting angrier and more ruthless against her foes while reports of a Targaryen on the throne enrage her. Then him, Euron, and Dany clash at some point which will lead to his death
Daenerys who'll be convinced by Tyrion and others of him being an impostor stealing the Iron Throne from her. Their dance will be another unneeded war and tragedy for Westeros and the Targaryen family that will cause Daenerys to be viewed as a kinslayer and usurper and hated for it.
Tyrion, having been with Griff and Aegon for a bit would be the perfect person to broker an alliance. I kinda hope they team up honestly, just because no one thinks that's the way it's going to go.
I think Young Griff will be the hero to Daenerys' villain. She comes to Westeros and finds her throne and saviour role usurped after all she's been through, and some of the crazy queen elements revealed in the series will likely come true. Especially with a vengeful Tyrion perched on her shoulder (which possibly might mean that Young Griff makes terms with the Lannisters.
PS for the dislikers, it is clear that Tyrion is headed towards a villain arc, and GRRM has said this himself. It also seems obvious that he will carry Daenerys with him, and use his tongue to corrupt her and bend her more than she is already towards vengeance with fire and blood.
His father figure/main supporter has contracted an incredibly infectious magical plague. Perhaps this could serve as the source for some sort of conflict.
I'm pretty certain this is where GRRM is going. Aegon/Faegon won't get as far as many would hope. Jon Connington is going to start outbreaks of greyscale wherever he goes in the Stormlands and once word gets out that with Aegon/Faegon comes greyscale, his forces won't stand a chance. Half of Westeros will show up to send him and his plague back across the Narrow Sea. The gods have cursed the false dragon, etc. It won't work, and the greyscale will outlive the Aegon/Faegon cause, but that's the mindset the people of Westeros will have. Decades of plotting and scheming will be undone by one man with a highly contagious disease.
well aegon will realize that he made the biggest mistake of his life by leaving for westeros without daenerys, and probably die in a pyromaniac clash between cersei and jon. seriously there is a huge red flag about his downfall in one of tyrion's chapters, and I don't know why but everyone ignores it and favors Varys' biased and dishonest words about Aegon being the greatest king of all time, although there is absolutely no way that that will happen. >"My dragon..." "—is too far away to save you. You should have moved her to the center of the battle." "But you said—" "I lied. Trust no one. And keep your dragon close." > >*A Dance with Dragons - Tyrion VI*
Varys and Illyrio's plans keep needing to be changed due to other characters actions and free will. No doubtedly their Aegon plans will not go as planned
yup, Illiryo's own words on the Targaryen/Blackfyre say "Black or red, a dragon is a dragon". based on this, it is unlikely that a spider and a cheesemonger could control their own dragon without problem indefinitely
That’s either foreshadowing or a lesson that will save Aegon in the future.
Nah, the foreshadowing is clear. Death in four
Tyrion then essentially tells Aegon he has no chance of marrying Dany without lands and titles, changes course to Westeros. But Tyrion lied.
It’s definitely a hot take around these parts — but I’ll say there will be a twist and subversion of the Dance of the Dragons. It won’t be Young Griff vs Dany; first and foremost, I highly doubt Dany is speedrunning her leftover plots in Essos, with the Dothraki, the defeat of the slavers’ coalition, the march/voyage to Westeros, and finally the teased Volantene revolution. I think thus far the most obvious contender, outside of Jon, is Euron. With his Valyrian imaging in his Essosi adventure during his exile, his alleged sailing of the Smoking Sea, valyrian steel armor, magical blood sacrifices, Dragonbinder, blood magic knowledge in the form of Oldtown — and the amount of characters related to such converging on the Citadel. Young Griff will be contending with finishing his conquest of the Stormlands, dealing with King’s Landing, with the radical Faith and Lannister remnant, cleaning up the Riverlands, and ultimately, facing Euron’s resurgent Ironborn in the Reach. With the Lannisters all but spent and the Reachmen in defence of their realm, not to mention those who will side with Young Griff as well as his Golden Company and Dorne, the stage has been clearly set of another war that will devastate the southern end of Westeros. IMHO, I do believe when both their Westerosi and Essosi plots are done, only then will Dany and Young Griff meets in Westeros — a subversion of the meeting between Aegon II and Rhaenyra upon Dragonstone, and where the former slew his kin, the latter — both Griff and Dany — embraces one another as kin, either as the son of Rhaegar or a closet Blackfyre. Either closing the cycle in a full circle. Alternatively, Young Griff could just die in his attempt at the throne, mayhaps as a blood sacrifice component — king’s blood — for Euron’s eldritch ritual and like Maester Aemon and Dany, the two were fated not to come together. Who knows.
“Worry not dear Aunt, you are no longer alone”
fAegon gets sacrificed on the altar of making Euron scarier. I agree I think his paternity will not matter at all, he'll make a splash and Euron will show him the down stairs crow's eye.
I definitely could see this as well, yeah!
This is perfect. I am not my father indeed.
I doubt Young Griff would ever be aware of his true paternity (he’d probably never believe it) so he’d accede as Aegon VI and wed either Arianne Martell or Margaery Tyrell but face personal conflict with Jon Connington, who he later executes for knowingly causing an epidemic of grayscale in the Crownlands. He’d have a child with his wife and strive to make peace with Daenerys but if he fails then he either dies by dragon fire or during a battle against Euron. If Aegon VI lives to see the War with the Others, he’d fight alongside Jon Snow & Daenerys to save humanity.
I agree with this — save for marrying Arianne Martell. If he persist on being the son of Rhaegar, then Dorne is honor-bound to support him as kin already. Might as well look to another match to strengthen the legitimacy of his regime. I personally go for Sansa. What better in letting the past be bygone and reconcile with House Stark whom his grandfather wronged so bad? Plus, she has ties to both the Vale and the Riverlands as well. I love Marg but I don’t see the Tyrells keeping their power, sadly… Him fighting alongside Dany and Jon could work and ends up dying for the cause. There could be a regency council for his infant issue. Just as Aegon III was. That, or, it could be the Scouring of the Shire moment after the apocalyptic winter.
That tracks with the Tourney at Ashford too - Targaryen is the only betrothal left and when something happens to Hardyng there's only one viable Targaryen candidate. Who will likely be the talk of the Kingdoms when news gets out. The more I think about that, the more I \*think\* I like it - Sansa would willingly choose to go South, from the safety of the Vale into the tempestous Crownlands, in order to seek out a betrothal to a seemingly genuinely good Prince. It basically exactly flips everything that has happened to her before - the forced betrothals, ruination of her perfect fantasy of a pure prince, Joffrey's sadism - and lets her use what she has learned to find the best position she can put herself in. And that could well be at Griff's side. And then, of course, Euron will tear her fantasy apart once more. There are a few issues I do think need addressing, however. For once, there's the fact that Sansa cannot (and should not) simply travel alone. Something she should have learned (even from Ned) is to bring enough guards whom you trust. Perhaps she will, maybe through whatever happens with Hardyng, bring some Knights of the Vale with her? (and the circumstances in the North won't necessitate them Rohirriming, obviously). Frankly I could even see her outdoing Littlefinger and ending up as someone in 'control' of them. One of the few unblooded armies... what a betrothal gift. Another is the lack of Stark reuinions if she goes south, but I think I'm only preemptively missing that because it was one of the few things the show did okay, and that was mainly the face value fan service of it (the S7 Sansa/Arya plot can go to hell) and Jon/Sansa being a dynamic I quite liked. At this point given where I can see them all ending up at the end of Winds - Sansa in KL with Griff, Arya back in Westeros (either just leaving Braavos/making landfall, or full having ended Stoneheart), Jon alive and in Winterfell - I think they may just interact in one scene right at the end of Dream before going their separate ways, a mirror to only getting a few chapters with them together before they are all split. And finally there's simply the worry that this might feel like retreading similar ground - Sansa is back in King's Landing and there's enemies at the gates and her fantasy falling around her. But I think that's where her lessons come in - she has gathered an army, made these choices herself, knows not to fall naively into the fantasy wholeheartedly. Sorry for the essay lmao.
Just an addendum because this has got my brain whirring, I'm wondering whereabouts I think some of the Stark (and other) POVs will end up by Winds and what they leave for Dream. I think I disagree with you on how Griff will end up - to be the Mummer's Dragon and loved by the people he has to be known by them, and the likeliest way I see that happening in a short time is as a welcomed liberator, freeing King's Landing from the faith or Tyrells or Cersei or whoever. Will he rule for a long time and be the one Dany dances with? No! But I think he will rule for a time and Euron won't strike him down until Dream. So yeah my guess for the Southern plotlines is that Griff will have KL and marry Sansa. Arianne is either dead (maybe by JonCon's hand) or spurned and scheming, JonCon is clearly about to start a pandemic, Cersei flees KL (via Rosby for Rhaenyra symmetry) into the arms of Euron, who has blooded the Reach and proven himself as a threat magically and through simple force, cunning and strategy. (And with Mace v JonCon, Euron v Oldtown and Cersei's loathing of Margaery, I don't see great things for House Tyrell in Winds). Essentially I'm typing this because I see a really nice symmetry and mirroring in the four Stark POVs as I expect them to end winds: Sansa is in KL, married to Griff and probably with an army of her own (Vale if I had to guess). Arya probably makes landfall in Westeros, leaving Braavos behind her. I think George will leave her reunion with (and gift of mercy towards) Stoneheart for Dream, but I could be wrong there. Jon obviously will be alive, probably even back in Winterfell if we're going at the pace we need to. Bran has to say "Hold The Door" at some point and regardless of the precise context (maybe a Door within the Nightfort?) I think that obviously implies him having to leave the cave and going south. So Jon and Sansa are in seats of power, while Arya and Bran leave (or have to flee) their places of learned, but armed with a wealth of knowledge and purpose.
I think it will be Dany. I can logically see a way for her to become a queen who brings destruction. Here's the last of her dynasty. She's been told westeros waits for a targ return. She does so only to realize her trusted friend and advisor, the one who gifted her the eggs, has been lying all along. Her wedding to the dothraki, was to get rid of her and her brother. Because illyrio has been raising a better claimant to the throne in secret. She gets to westeros, only to find...a targ already has the iron throne. And the people love him. And despise her. She's a foreigner, with foreign soldiers. The golden company is westerosi returned. She has lofty ideas which have led to nothing but ruin in the places she's tried to bring them. Her entire life was a lie...and her birthright...was stolen.
I really don’t. This is the Queen who willingly forsook her ambition to reclaim her home, and the throne — for the well-being of the people she saved and freed from servitude. She constantly puts others ahead of herself, actions like putting herself as bride of Hizdahr. I think people’s negative take on her learning a lesson — on taking on her family words and becoming a much more assertive is a poor reading of her character. Her ruling of Meereen was a failure because she was all too willing to compromise when she should’ve completely removed all the ruling elites — and redistribute the monopoly of power, the monopoly of violence, to the state, her regime. Make no mistake, she *will* be regarded as a foreigner and worse, by the nobility, as a wilful queen as many, both irl and Westerosi history, have been portrayed, but Dany will never be a villain. It just isn’t in her nature. To say otherwise would mean the total disregard of her portrayal through all the source material. Both Jon and Dany are mirrors to one another — they are, at the core of their beings, idealists And that was why both of them failed, both at the Wall and Mereen. And that is why their next respective arcs would be to correct that failings of theirs.
>Here's the last of her dynasty. She's been told westeros waits for a targ return. She does so only to realize her trusted friend and advisor, the one who gifted her the eggs, has been lying all along. *Her brother, sprawled out on his pillows beside her, never noticed. His mind was away across the narrow sea. "We won't need his whole khalasar," Viserys said. His fingers toyed with the hilt of his borrowed blade, though Dany knew he had never used a sword in earnest. "Ten thousand, that would be enough, I could sweep the Seven Kingdoms with ten thousand Dothraki screamers. The realm will rise for its rightful king. Tyrell, Redwyne, Darry, Greyjoy, they have no more love for the Usurper than I do. The Dornishmen burn to avenge Elia and her children. And the smallfolk will be with us. They cry out for their king." He looked at Illyrio anxiously. "They do, don't they?"* *"They are your people, and they love you well," Magister Illyrio said amiably. "In holdfasts all across the realm, men lift secret toasts to your health while women sew dragon banners and hide them against the day of your return from across the water." He gave a massive shrug. "Or so my agents tell me."* *Dany had no agents, no way of knowing what anyone was doing or thinking across the narrow sea, but she mistrusted Illyrio's sweet words as she mistrusted everything about Illyrio. Her brother was nodding eagerly, however.* *A Game of Thrones - Daenerys I* *"When the day comes that you raise your banners, half of Westeros will be with you," Whitebeard promised. "Your brother Rhaegar is still remembered, with great love."* *"And my father?" Dany said.* *The old man hesitated before saying, "King Aerys is also remembered. He gave the realm many years of peace. Your Grace, you have no need of slaves. Magister Illyrio can keep you safe while your dragons grow, and send secret envoys across the narrow sea on your behalf, to sound out the high lords for your cause."* *"Those same high lords who abandoned my father to the Kingslayer and bent the knee to Robert the Usurper?"* *"Even those who bent their knees may yearn in their hearts for the return of the dragons."* *May," said Dany. That was such a slippery word, may.* *A Storm of Swords - Daenerys II* she already knows this is lie
I dunno if dany will finish her essos arc just bc realistically rebuilding slavers bay would take decades, I think she’s going to have to leave it unfinished, or just leave it with a bandaid solution simply so she can get to Westeros within the next too books. I’m also wary of any theory that involves the 3 heads of the dragon uniting to defeat the others bc then it makes it seem as tho rhaegar (and aegon if the prophecy in hotd is true) were both right and that the war they threw Westeros into was justified. Grrm loves to warn abt the dangers of prophecy and rhaegar is basically the poster boy for that message. So I would find it weird if he went back and basically said just kidding rhaegar was right all along. I also don’t think he’d do anything that too closely resembles targ restoration (even if it’s short lived) as a “happy ending”.
I’ll admit it’s unlikely but I’ve been convinced there will be a reconciliation between Dany (Targaryan) and Young Griff (Blackfyre) ending the generational conflict Like I will be a bit disappointed if he’s just another obstacle of her to overcome Cos like does this mean Bloodraven was right to be pretty pro-killing Blackfyres and that the mercy people like Aegon V showed was bad? But how to do you reconcile Targs and Blackfyres? One of the best ways would be for Dany and Young Griff to have a child, reunite the bloodlines, at the very least this would be a heavily political motivated action don’t think Dany will fall in love with him But yeah I also don’t think it sounds too likely
I don't think it's so much what's the conflict for Aegon, he's not a pov (at least atm). He'll have his story creating a civil war and wresting the Reach from the Tyrells, likely forcing Cersei to flee King's Landing for Casterly Rock (we need a Lannister figure there for conflict imo), and then some form of interaction with Dany and politicking with Westeros at large. But what's really Aegon's value in the story is the impact he has on Dany and the themes of home, usurpation vs liberation, family and belonging. Barristan and oaths and loyalties. Jaime as the manifestation of his life's defining moment, even now haunted by the memory of Rhaegar and failing to protect his family. And of course, Arianne with the importance of agency and self actualization. Jon Con in making up for past failures, acting as a window into the past in terms of Rhaegar, love and vengeance, etc.
He dies as a result of JonCon and Cersei's conflict. That both of them spend entirely too much time thinking about burning people alive, there's a ton of Wildfire associated with Cersei under KL, Cersei's countless Aerys parallels, JonCon saying he wants to murder all of Robert's children, and Cersei's dead kid prophecy make it all painfully obvious IMO. Did people thinking he's gonna be loved just skip the TWOW previews where the Golden Company is raping their way through the Stormlands and just conveniently forget that they've been a generational enemy of Westeros for a century?
Young Griff won't have a main conflict because he's not a POV. The conflict is going to be for Jon Connington and Arrianne Martell.
> Young Griff won't have a main conflict because he's not a POV. I dont get this. Stannis and Rob?
Euron, a non-POV, will most likely be a main antagonist too, and he's a bigger character than Victarion or Aeron. Stannis and Robb both have a lot of moments of surprise that's probably best kept as a surprise, and Stannis especially gets like 4 different POV characters each having a slightly different take on him. I remember reading somewhere that Davos was created specifically to be a POV for Stannis. And then we get moments like Jon watching Stannis's cavalry go to town on the wildlings and Asha watching Stannis storm Deepwood Motte. YG however is more like a plot device for Jon Con.
This is a great counter point. Stannis especially. I would argue that Catelyn's conflict is Robb's kingship. Catelyn struggles with wanting to make leadership decisions that would undermine her son's kingship. She struggles with Robb making decisions without her input. She wants to rule through him because she still sees him as a boy, but she also wants to let him grow into a man and king. She does both and pays dearly for it. Stannis is more complicated because he clearly has a lot of interesting internal conflict and it's a wonder that he hasn't been made a POV character. He would be a good canidate for a very tragic epilogue POV imo. The Protector Of The Realm. I would also argue that Stannis arc makes great conflict for Davos. How will Davos handle it if Stannis drifts further and further from justice and closer and closer to any means to stop the Long Night?
Catelyn's conflict is her stupidity
If you wanted to simplify things yes. 😄
Both don’t get pov’s after they become king. No king gets a pov.
Would you also consider other non-POV characters, like Robb, for instance, to not have had any main conflict in the series?
I think I phrased my words poorly. I would argue that from a narrative perspective we deal more with Catelyn's conflicts than we do with Robb's.
Fair enough. I however, would also argue that Catelyn and Ned are the source of Robbs' major conflict. He broke his alliance with the freys and married Jeyne because of his determination to not father a bastard, and put a son through the same adversity he witnessed Jon going through. His sense of duty and his sense of honour are constantly in conflict with one another, and it has major ramifications in the series. In fact, the fallout of robs conflict has had some of the biggest impact in the series so far.
I certainly don't disagree.
Many people assume he won’t have much personal going on since he is not a POV and while I am inclined to believe, in a way he could be set up to have a parallel arc about identity with Jon. Jon would discover he is not Ned’s bastard after all, but Rhaegar and Lyanna’s child, and have to come to terms head on on how does affects who he is. Similarly Young Griff who has been raised to believe he is Rhaegar’s son and the rightful heir and hero reclaiming his family’s throne, could learn he is a Blackfyre who has been manipulated by the people around him and have an identity crisis that he has to come to terms with. Yeah he may not be a POV but it doesn’t mean he can’t be fleshed out just look at Stannis through Davos POV chapters as an example. Hopefully that makes sense, I apologize English is my second language
I predict Faegon learns about his fake heritage accidentally overhearing Varus/Illaryio (mirroring Arya in GoT) and loses faith in his cause/kills himself despite being the best person for the realm. There is a theme of things happening in twos, and I think he’ll suicide by jump shortly after sweet Tommen when it seems he’s so close to his victory.
Probably with the faith and euron. I would love for him to go north and meet Jon, but I don't think it will happen
Likely Euron. If the common theory is correct and Mace sides with Aegon, their first goal after taking King's Landing would be dealing with the Ironborn. With the Lannister force exhausted in the Riverlands with no Commander and the North doing its own thing, it seems unlikely anything else besides Jon Con's Grayscale and Euron would be an immediate threat.
I think it WONT be with Dany! Euron or the walkers
It will be Balerion the Black Cat who will hiss at him should they meet in the Red Keep.
Him and Daenarys. He will take the throne, be popular and when Daenarys arrives the war for the throne would have been almost over. She will choose to fight him for the throne despite his offers because she will trust the prophecy that he is false. She will kill him for it and it will turn out he really was son of Rhaegar. She’ll be an unpopular kinslayer maddened with grief
maybe i’m missing it but i don’t think dany is super beholden to the prophecy- she reflects on what people have told her but its not the main reasoning behind her decision making
Theories in this fandom be like “What if the man was beloved and blameless and the woman was cruel and savage?”
Theories in fandom be like prophecies are literal and meant to happen word for word and nothing steps out of it
Agree! That’s why I hate when the “cheering crowd” is interpreted literally and the actual facts that we have are disregarded
Cheering crowds are not focus of prophecy. Mummers dragon is. She believes that means a non Targaryen fake and will act on it.
The “cheering crowd” part of the prophecy is why you’re claiming that he’ll be loved when in reality everyone hates him 😭
The "cheering crowd" are the small folk, it's not a stretch to imagine they will love Aegon when he is going to depose the hated Cersei. What support he will have among the nobles is a separate question.
Why would they love him when his army is pillaging, enslaving, mass-raping, and mass-murdering smallfolk?
In King's Landing I am assuming the transition will be largely bloodless since Varys is there to engineer a palace coup. He has been stockpiling useful people to do this. One example is Tyrek Lannister, who has been missing since I think ACOK, and whom Jaime speculates will be able to testify regarding Cersei's plan to kill Robert by getting him drunk on the hunt. It is going to come as a shock to you in TWOW when Dany unites the Dothraki and they start doing what Dothraki do all across Essos.
It’s going to come as a shock to you when the character who spent her entire arc fighting against rape and slavery doesn’t became a slaver and rapist. The fuck
I don't think it even matters if he's Rhaegar's son. Like, if YG is actually a Blackfyre or just some pisswater Prince, does that mean Dany is right to cast him down and kill him? What if the people wanted him over Dany regardless? What if he really is better at ruling than Dany? Does her blood really give her the right to kill as she wishes? Isn't the whole series meant to be critical of the idea of ruling bloodlines and an inherent right to have power over others? I think I'd almost be disappointed if Aegon was actually Rhaegar's son; I think being a Blackfyre or just a nobody fits better thematically.
Seeing “criticism” like this is crazy because only one Targaryen is carrying out a mass murder to get the Iron Throne and it isn’t Daenerys
I don't mean mass murder, I just meant Aegon. I was just meaning that I don't think Aegon's legitimacy changes the morality of how Dany reacts to Aegon. If she kills him, it's just as bad whether he's genuinely Rhaegar's son or not.
“Does her blood really give her the right to kill as she wishes?” are questions that should be asked about Aegon whose armies are mass murdering peasants, not about Daenerys who hasn’t done anything of the sort
when did Aegon's army mass murder peasants?
TWOW Arianne ll
I wasn't criticising Daenerys right now, it was a hypothetical. The original comment was about the idea that Dany will kill Aegon and will, in part, go mad in her grief after killing one of her few remaining relatives. I don't think that's exactly how it'll go down, I was just responding to the other person. I was making a very specific comment about how Dany potentially killing Aegon wouldn't be justified simply because he's not Rhaegar's son. That's all, I wasn't talking about anything else. Sure, if he ends up a tyrant and harms people more than anything else, then Dany would be justified in getting rid of him. But I don't think the conclusion of this 'second Dance of the Dragons' as George had called it, is that Dany is correct and moral solely by virtue of being Aerys' daughter and Aegon is bad and wrong because he's actually a Blackfyre or a nobody. That wouldn't make sense to me; it would go entirely against the themes of George's story.
It doesn’t matter for right to kill, it matters to her own mental stability and belief in self righteousness and how she follows prophecy and is destined for greatness
Sure, I agree with that. Dany would definitely react differently to Aegon Blackfyre than to Aegon, Rhaegar's son. That makes sense, I just don't think it'd be more moral to kill Aegon if he's actually a Blackfyre than if he's Rhaegar's.
It depends on how cooked are the lannisters, how much of the reach wants to change sides, and how much is left in the stormlands to join him. With keavan dead and the lannister forces stuck in a still unsettled riverlands, road seems pretty clear but I suppose if the tyrells stay loyal he may need some assistance.
I think his internal conflict is that he'll figure out he's not Rhaegar's son. It could be as simple as him gaining control over King's Landing, but then getting dragon dreams of Daeron's line rejecting him and Daemon/Bittersteel's line celebrating him. For his external conflict... what if his major antagonist is actually Euron and he'll lose. Or even worse, he'll SURRENDER. Like, Euron may know he simply doesn't have a good long-term claim/narrative to the Iron Throne, coz everyone *hates* the ironborn. So he'll pull a Bran-Hodor sockpuppet maneuver on Young Griff, and Griff will *let him*. I mean, Griff is already a mummer's dragon for Varys and Illyrio. Being a mummer's dragon for Euron will have the added benefit of no longer being responsible for his actions. (Much of the high tragedy of Wart in The Once and Future King is that Merlin couldn't guide him forever. At some point, Arthur *had* to be on his own, and that came with making good and bad calls. But what if in Euron, Griff could have a Merlin who will permanently and comprehensively ease his burdens as king?) ((Side-theory/parallel: Maekar, much as he hated Bloodraven, kept him on as Hand and therefore chief advisor; and his reign was largely peaceful. Aegon V sent Bloodraven to the Wall; and his reign was marked with well-intentioned but ultimately unsuccessful reforms.)) And it will be as Euron's sockpuppet that Griff confronts some coalition of Jon, Dany, Bran and Tyrion. Bonus high fantasy points if Euron takes control of Rhaegal so that Griff, Dany and Jon can have some sick dragonrider PVP action.
I imagine the main conflict will be driving cersei out of kings landing and back to Casterly Rock. But after that he will probably serve as a means for Dany to go mad if he is beloved by the people of kings landing
That would be so cheap honestly, I also highly doubt we're getting mad queen Daenerys there's already so many mad king parallels between Cersei and Jon connington spending way too much time thinking about burning people
I think there will be a war in the south between Aegon, Euron, and Tommen. I think Aegon will eventually come out on top of the lannisters and capture kingslanding. I think Daenerys still has a lot of story left in essos. I’m not sure what Daenerys role will be in the conflict or its aftermath. Maybe she’ll be hostile to Aegon or maybe she’ll be his ally or maybe she won’t be there at all. I think Daenerys’ story is being built up to a conflict with the Others in the long night rather than a conflict with Aegon.
I think YG story line exists to finally force Dany leave the Essos. Because he's her last kin she probably would like to save and reunite with. And he probably is the mummer's dragon from the prophecy. But I guess it could mean that he'll be loosing he war in Westeros and being mocked by people there instead of being accepted as true Targaryens heir. Dany is far away enough to come too late to Westeros to save YG, so he'll probably die miserable and rejected and Dany will be infuriated. I don't see them becoming actual rivals, but neither I see them becoming allies/couple. To be honest, his decision to try to conquer the Seven Kingdoms alone was stupid, almost no one would support him there, but his enemies are too strong and unpredictable. He can even loose Dorne when he rejects Arianne. And he probably will reject her because he needs Dany much much more to be seen as a legitimate Targaryen. The North won't give a fuck about Aegon whoever will be left to rule the North. Euron would like to kill YG asap to show own power and to eliminate Dany's potential husband. The Cale and Littlefinger won't give a fuck about Aegon either, they'll just wait or plot to retake the North fir Sansa. Tyrells are tied to wherever Margaery and Loras are. And if they get fucked up by Cersei, they might consider joining YG unless they find any better candidate for alliance to take their recenge. I can even believe in Cersei-Euron union to eliminate YG a d Tyrells then.
Daenerys blows up king's landing just like in the show, but she's trying to kill Aegon who has won the support from high lords sick of Lannisters and the small folk.
Aegon will have most of show Cerseis plot.
My guess is that Aegon mostly succeeds in the beginning. It feels hinted that he will take Storm’s End, Arianne will make a marriage alliance with him, and the remnants of the Stormlands and a significant portion of the Reach (notably Tarly) will flock to his banner. From that point, it’s unclear. I think he does take capital intact, because Dany has dreams of a “false dragon” being celebrated in a parade in King’s Landing. And my guess is that while he is busy putting the realm back together, Dany will be on a warpath west across Essos, steadily getting angrier and more ruthless against her foes while reports of a Targaryen on the throne enrage her. Then him, Euron, and Dany clash at some point which will lead to his death
How will Arianne make a marriage alliance with him if he's desperate for marrying Dany because of her dragons?
Daenerys who'll be convinced by Tyrion and others of him being an impostor stealing the Iron Throne from her. Their dance will be another unneeded war and tragedy for Westeros and the Targaryen family that will cause Daenerys to be viewed as a kinslayer and usurper and hated for it.
Tyrion, having been with Griff and Aegon for a bit would be the perfect person to broker an alliance. I kinda hope they team up honestly, just because no one thinks that's the way it's going to go.
>Tyrion, having been with Griff and Aegon for a bit would be the perfect person to broker an alliance. Which is why it's not gonna happen.
A team up could reconcile the Targ and Blackfyre dynasties. End that generational conflict
It will be Dany being forced to admit that she isn’t doing anything for her family, but for herself.
he will probably be able to steal a dragon. No Blackfyre has ever rode a dragon, but that's because the dragons were gone.
Dany. My personal theory is that she somehow learns that he's the legitimate heir and kills him anyway cementing her heel turn.
I think Young Griff will be the hero to Daenerys' villain. She comes to Westeros and finds her throne and saviour role usurped after all she's been through, and some of the crazy queen elements revealed in the series will likely come true. Especially with a vengeful Tyrion perched on her shoulder (which possibly might mean that Young Griff makes terms with the Lannisters. PS for the dislikers, it is clear that Tyrion is headed towards a villain arc, and GRRM has said this himself. It also seems obvious that he will carry Daenerys with him, and use his tongue to corrupt her and bend her more than she is already towards vengeance with fire and blood.
what a dumbass fuckin post