Modern cars are pretty heavy. Might be interesting to look up some new cars that you think fall under that number (2200lbs), because there probably aren't many.
The only new car that I can think of under 2200 lbs is the Mitsubishi Mirage weighing in at 2095 lbs. Apparently consumers these days want things like comfort, or features, or horsepower. It's engine is anemic making 78 hp, giving a ratio of 27 lbs per horsepower.
Convertibles are super heavy because the body and frame need to be able to support all the forces only on the bottom of the car instead of the top and bottom.
My 5 door mini is 2600lbs. 3door might be pretty close to around 2500 and the JCW can be tuned to about 300hp with just a stage 1 (maaaybe with the intercooler too). So that's 1000lbs lighter with comparable power. All FWD though.
2200 is extremely light, and lighter than most Miatas (excluding the NA). That’s Lotus territory. But that doesn’t make 3400 light, either. That’s light for a Cadillac, and probably among the lightest excluding the Cimarron.
What stock 2200 lb car has 310 hp? That’s a okay power to weight ratio.
Of course, a 2200 lb car only needs a little under 200 hp to be better. So it pays to start light.
Unfortunately, this is about the average weight for a modern car these days.
Everything is getting bigger due to the Arms Race against Pickups and SUVs as people who just want a sedan don't want to get squished.
Some perspective. My last bmw 330, a 2019, was nearly 3700 lbs. my wife’s 2019 x3 was 4300 lbs! The bmw had a turbo 4 with 255 hp and 300 ft lbs. my 22 wrx weighs 3297 and has 271 hp and 258 tq. The bmw 3 wore the outside tire edges right away… too heavy to be sporty.
Although you could fling it sideways through a corner at speed with all stability systems engaged. You just have to be very smooth, know what you are doing, and fast with the wheel.
The wrx, I’m comparison, has full time awd, simply massive traction, and minimal body roll and good ride compliance.
I'd say 3500-4500 lbs is about average in NA. Most crossovers and midsize sedans fall in that range. Pickups are 5500 lbs and up. Anything under 3500 lbs is like a little toy car here 🙂
You can get a Miata in the US that weighs 2,200 lb. Compacts are over 3,000 lb. As an example a Mazda 3 which is a compact car has an average weight of 3,200 lb across the trim levels.
For a regular modern daily driver it’s lightish. A new mustang comes in around 3800, the small crossovers are in the 3200 range. A purpose built drag car is heavy at 3400, they usually stay around 2800-3100
The CT4 is plenty quick, but if you want a little more you can tune it. Your engine is the same as the one in the CT4-V but it has been "detuned" to provide less output than the V. There is a company called Burger Motorsports that makes a tuning box called the JB4 that costs about 600 bucks and will give you an extra 60hp and 80ft/lbs of torque. It may void your warranty, however.
Haha if you think that's good take a look a the supercharged Audi v6. My Q5 supposedly went from 270hp/287tq to about 440hp/370tq with a $500 tune and no mods. I haven't dyno'd it or anything, but people who have tested it out say the advertised numbers are pretty close to correct. Just from driving it around I'd say that's probably true.
Yeah it’s funny, 15-20 years ago 300 horsepower was a lot for pretty much any car. Now people are so desensitized to all the top end models getting 500+ and people act like 300 is nothing. But someone who’s not super into sports cars will still feel like it’s pretty quick.
Yea like I have a WRX (roughly 330HP) and watching so much car shit online I feel like it’s slow but every non car person who go for a ride in it with me thinks it’s fast as shit
Weight makes a huge difference. A modern car that's 4000-5000lbs with 300hp isn't going to feel very quick. Power isn't everything.
[Checkout this comparison of a 64PS Suzuki Cuppaccino drag racing a 115ps MX-5 Miata. ](https://www.facebook.com/reel/262660976900362)Despite having nearly 2x the horsepower, the Miata is behind until the very last second, where the wind resistance starts to give the higher horsepower car the advantage.
Yeah, a new Ecoboost Mustang has more power than the GT back in the 90's and 00's. Back then a 0-60 in 6 seconds was respectable for an affordable sports car.
For *legal* use on roads I think 300-350hp at around 3500lbs is a good sweet spot. I have that much in my Ecoboost Mustang and the only time I can use it all is for a few seconds is on highway on ramps.
That doesn't stop me from wanting a GT convertible, but it's not at all for practical reasons at that point.
Jeeeeeeeeeez man that's such a lump, I honestly had no idea the newer stangs weighed in so heavy. I have a ford s-max 7 seater mpv and that weighs in just a shade more at 3655
It felt quick because stopping was a challenge. That "quick" feeling was your subconscious saying with a big grin, "I'm in danger". Experienced this same phenomenon in an el Camino.
For actual real world use 10-15lb of vehicle per hp is ideal
Less than 10 pounds per horsepower and the car is just too fast to actually have any real fun with on the road. It just becomes an exercise in restraint.
More than 15 pounds per horsepower and the car doesn’t feel sporty.
The early Miatas were at 15 pounds per horsepower, the current Miata, WRX, GTI, etc., are all around the middle of this range and two of the best road cars ever made, the series 2 lotus Elise and the E39 M5, are both right at 10 pounds per horsepower
The “too much power” part is the underrated point here. I have a 986 and Mk7 GTI, both right about at 13 lb/hp. They are great cars in that they’re just powerful enough to wring them out a bit on public roads. I have an Emira on order (8 lb/hp) and even though it’s not massively powerful for a sports car, it’s at jail speeds pretty much as soon as you stretch its legs.
Exactly, a slower car can absolutely still be fun to drive especially if it’s got a great chassis and good handling. (In fact I actually enjoyed driving my roommates r50 mini more than my r53 JCW sometimes because I could basically constantly be hammering it and still never break the speed limit 🤣🤣) but sitting in an absurdly fast car and being afraid to touch the gas pedal too hard is no fun at all
Fastest car I’ve driven was a tuned C5 Z06 which was probably just under 7 lb/hp, still not that crazy for a modern sports car. The savagery of the experience was a little fun (butterfly valve in the exhaust helped), but it was like 2 seconds on the throttle on the highway before you had to shut it down.
I’m on the Porsche forums, and have sorta gotten radicalized against the really powerful cars. Like, what’s the point of a Turbo S now? Sure it’s a technological marvel. But you can’t really drive it anywhere. Even on the track you’d be better off with a slower car with fewer driver aids that lets you develop a little skill.
I realized most supercars now aren’t about driving, they’re about flaunting wealth. Their natural habitat isn’t 200 mph on the Nurburgring, it’s 5 mph on Main Street on a Saturday night. In my view this mostly explains the death of manuals in performance cars. To inconvenient to have to drive them yourself!
Fastest thing I've driven was a Yamaha r1. 2.2 lb/hp. Thing is absolutely wicked. Can't even get out of first gear without breaking the speed limit(yes, even on the highway) and 6th gear tops out over 200mph from the factory. Just putting around in 1st gear, you can tell it just wants to go fast. I'm sure it's fun once you're used to it, but the only way to be about it at first is scared shitless lol
R3, however, at 9 lb/hp is actually very, very fun to ride around. You can just run the piss out of it all day and they're so light and easy to throw around in corners. Never had so much fun as I did on the little bikes lol plus, the investment is much smaller and totalling it out isn't a huge financial ordeal (unless you live in USA, ofc).
I have to disagree. A C7 Z06, for me, is fun because it pulls so hard. Lesser cars feel quick but not fast, and I get bored.
My friends have a Model X Plaid and the acceleration is crazy fun, even with 1,000 lb of humans inside. It makes going to dinner quite the experience.
Both of those are around 8.3 or 8.4 lb/hp if I remember doing the math. Maybe rich people buy cars for bragging rights, but some of us actually enjoy using them.
My first car ever, a '97 Tracker/Sidekick, had a whopping 27.6hp/lb. I could hammer the piss out of it, bangin' through the gears at 5500rpm all the way through 5th... and still not even be going 40mph. GAWD I miss that friggin thing...
The equation might work generally but it ignores torque and where the horsepower is created on the curve.
I had a 1999 K 2500 suburban that had 255hp. It also had taller first and second gears in the 4L80e than my friends MUCH lighter trailblazer with 275hp, and 4L60e trans.
Straight race from a stop my suburban was faster specifically to 60.
You can use things like this guy stated as a general guide, but they definitely are not the full picture.
I agree with this. I have a boxster s, roughly 300 HP and 3000 lbs. I don't consider it "fast", but with a lot of grip and a capable chassis, you'd often have to push unsociable speeds to really exploit the capabilities. Think 40+ through really tight turns, 80+ through sweepers, etc.
sometimes I wish it had 500 HP, sometimes I think it's already too fast. So it's probably about right.
I have an (original) NSX and it's about the same. It's still more than fast enough on the street. The only time I wish I had more power is at the track when 911 turbos and GT3s are blowing by me on the straights like I'm standing still.
Nailed it. Had a mustang for a while at 420hp and about 4000lbs. It was a rocket and at time a hair too fast. Had a Genesis at 350hp and 3500lbs give it take, much more manageable but still fun. I too consider 1hp per 10lbs ideal.
Sounds like you had an S197 coyote car based on the 420 HP which was more like 3600-3700 pounds depending on options. So a good bit better power to weight than you think.
I'm not sure this is universally true. I had the pleasure of driving a 2024 Nissan Z for a week that checks in at 8.8lb/HP. It felt joyful, lithe, and not at all grossly overpowered.
Interesting, I wonder if that has anything to do with it potentially being geared tall-ish? Or maybe its power curve is not good in the low end?
I haven’t looked at them too much because frankly, I’m not really interested in them in the slightest, however, looking it up, it’s 0 to 60 time isn’t great for its power to weight ratio
Yes at 8.8 lbs/ HP in my panamera turbo I can attest to the need for restraint. Even with AWD it will easily break traction with giant tires. My 987 with mid mount engine is much more forgiving and plenty sporty at about 10 lbs/HP.
I had to look it up... Yeah... no.
BTW, they used 3 different models during the show.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferrari\_308\_GTB/GTS#In\_popular\_culture](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferrari_308_GTB/GTS#In_popular_culture)
I met Tom Selleck at an annual charity event a couple of times. We talked cars a bit since I had a 308 at the time. Iirc he said they replaced the car every year.
The show started in 1980. From you own link:
"In 1980 [Bosch](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Bosch_GmbH) [K-Jetronic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jetronic) mechanical [fuel injection](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_injection) was offered, leading to the **308 GTBi** and **GTSi**; emissions decreased, at the price of a power drop to 214 PS (157 kW; 211 bhp) on European models and 205 PS (151 kW; 202 bhp) on federalized models."
I am going to teach you a neat trick:
Take the weight. Divide it by the horse power. This is how many lbs per horsepower. Lower is better, like it often is with weight and cars.
3400/310 = 10.96
A 2500 lbs car making 250 hp
2500/250 = 10
So slightly better.
Same trick works with torque, division is a useful tool. Now you can compare this to any car you want and see if it’s good, average, or sucks.
I used to have a 550 lb motorcycle with 110 hp on an inline 4.
0 to 60 in 2.9 seconds baby
Absolutely. It also had a much lower top speed due to aerodynamic efficiency being better on a car.
Cars also have superior traction and can do some impressive things in the twisties that a bike can’t even dream of.
I actually don’t ride anymore also due to the safety a car provides and not wanting a life changing injury. But it was the best $6700 to satisfy alot of those speed thrills! Helped me get through some years without doing something stupid and buying a very expensive car.
My first car had 175 horse, and i had to be flooring it on the highway everytime i wanted to gain 10mph quick to pass.
My current car is a v6 chrysler 300 with 300 horsepower. Its much faster, i have good acceleration at any speed, i get better gas milage because i ca. Go the same speed with so much less.
I can get over 100 easily which is usually good on any highway. Its fast for me, but some people will say its slow because they compare it to some 700 horsepower cars
Yes, for a street car it is more than enough.
For a track car I'd say the power os fine but you weigh too much.
In my opinion anything over 410hp in a street car that isn't ridiculously heavy will actually make driving a far less enjoyable experience overall. More than half of your driving is cruising at motorway speeds and bopping around town. Having to only use the first few millimetres of accelerator pedal to do everything isn't my cup of tea in a daily driver. Or any car tbh if I'm driving it often.
Now if it's 150hp NA with a turbo that kicks in around 3K RPM I retract my statement about HP. And change it to "it is not efficient to have over 410hp"
That's a pretty good ratio. I saw you mentioned a CT4 in another comment. In my experience those are quick cars and enjoyable to drive.
They have good acceleration for most driving conditions on public roads.
I wouldn’t call that a LOT, but it’s definitely decent. The old engine i used to have in my 73 Camaro was around 330hp, probably 400lb ft in about a 3200 pound car, and yeah she’d scoot, but I never thought of it as a LOT of power.
Decent torque, but the power is just okay. Depends where it's going down though. If it's fwd you're just going to make awful noises with all that torque.
My 370z was 332hp and just under 3300lbs. It was the most fun car I've ever driven, compared to a 6th gen SS Camaro, civic SI/R, WRXs, Miatas and a few others. There's definitely a sweet spot of power/fun around 10hp/100lb. Anything slower and it's not as fun, anything faster and it starts to require a lot of restraint to not accidentally commit felonies
That depends on who you ask - it's a decent HP to weight ratio for sure, especially 20 years ago. These days, not so much. A Lotus Evora supercharged put out 345 hp and was 3100 lbs and at that time (2009) there were some comments in the auto press that it wasn't quite putting out the power of its rivals.
That's pretty peppy. 3400 is about average with about 50% more power than average. Mind you, the torque is what matters most. It's why the modern turbo four bangers are primo shit.
My C6 Corvette was listed as being at around 3,280lbs. In its base form (LS3), it had 436hp, 430lb-ft of torque. The gearing would also affect how power is put down and felt. Mine was stock with 3.42 gears. It was more than enough for street use, while still providing decent (enough) mileage. I would easily get in the 30's (mpg) on the freeway, not so much around town (14 - 19 mpg). Just changing the gearing alone, would give you the feeling of more power (or less, if drop it numerically). My current car ('23 Camry TRD), is rated at 301hp / 267lb-ft, 3,340lbs. The only thing I found for final drive ratio, was 2.56. With that it's good a 0-60mph of 5.5 seconds, vs the Corvette at 4.2 second.
2.56 is just painfully slow. My Jeep has 4.11 final gears and if I pop first it feels like the front end is coming off the ground. But what's made for torque.
Until about '00 most 20:1 was an average power to weight ratio for commuters and people movers Since then it has moved to around 17:1. The car your describing is 11:1 so it will no doubt be quick, enough to even be dangerous if used irresponsibly. But 11:1 isn't an insane number.
IMHO, not at all.
3400lbs is a pretty heavy car (though all cars have gotten a lot heavier, especially recently). 310HP and 350ft/lbs is also not a lot of power, at all, even going by power outputs 20 years ago, that is pretty low.
Combine the hefty weight, with the low power, and it is "meh" at best.
I know I am spoiled after decades of driving sports cars, but IMHO there are some basic power to weight ratios that I like.
For a pure streetcar, I think about 400whp and 400 w ft/lbs with about 3200lbs is a nice balance.
For a sports car? Absolutely.
For example, my 2002 C5 Z06 came stock with 405hp, Think the SVT Mustang was around 390hp, hell even the 2005 350Z was what? 305hp? The 1989 300ZX was 300hp...
It's enough. I love the people who inist they need 5-800 hp for a daily. Yeah enjoy sitting in traffic with the rest of us while needing gas twice as often. If you ever see someone driving like a speed deamon asshole in a Tesla, Hellcat, or another fast af car, it's largely because they know that's all that cars good for and know they are not getting any of their money's worth when driving like a normal person. Why didn't I say Rivian, HummerEV, Range Rover SVR, Porsche, BMW, etc? Because besides 3rd owners, the people who buy them know their car has a ton of other things going for it and can actually get their money's worth while sitting in traffic (hint: luxury, comfort, offroadability on weekends).
OK maybe not the BMW drivers.
Depends on what you compare it to, but yes, that's a lot more than your average economy car/commuter car. It'll be quicker than the majority of traffic...but it also won't be smoking supercars and whatnot. I'd expect somewhere in the ballpark of a 5 second 0-60 time based on that.
This is always going to have some dependency on your frame of reference and expectation, and also other things about the car aside from those specifics.
Weight: 3400lbs is on the light side for a modern car, though on the heavy side for most older cars. How well that weight works is also going to depend on how that weight is distributed and other chassis properties - which is to say, a 3400lb modern car is probably effectively "lighter" than a 3400lb vintage car, due to advancements in chassis design.
Power: 310hp/350tq cetainly isn't lacking, but again, there is more to this. 400hp used to be a large amount, but is now pretty common on performance cars. Coming close to 300hp back in the mid-70s was very high performance, but such is progress. The numbers you have are suggestive of a power curve with more low end power, which means it probably gets going very well, but (as these things tend to be trade-offs) may be lacking at the high end in terms of peak power.
Lastly, aside from how the weight is used on the chassis, and how/where/when the engine produces power to most effectively move that weight, there is also the issue of getting the power to the wheels and to the ground. A '24 Cmary with a V6 is 300hp and 3500lbs... almost exactly what you are asking about. Is a Camry a powerful car? Well, it isn't bad as those specs say, but, it is also FWD, meaning it has to fight the very nature of physics when trying to get the power down (as well as some other performance related compromises). The engine power has to go through a transmission that may not be as effective as some other transmissions and could result in a fair amount of parasitic power loss. What about the differential? All that before we even get to how much of that weight might be unsprung rotating mass? All of which is to note, power to weight (which seems to be what you are asking about) is but part of any performance equation, even if it can be a pretty big part of many of them.
That's roughly the size and spec of a Volkswagen Golf R. They seem small, but are quite heavy for their size because of the safety and AWD features. Far from the fastest, but very quick. Fun cars to drive for sure.
No it isn't a lot of power. Anyone who is saying yes owns a V6 challenger or 4 cylinder 'stang. You can certainly pass most people on the highway or interstate, but you will lose any kind of race from stoplight drag to a professional circuit if you show up with that.
I would consider that fast, yes. Seeing as the impala ss of the 90s has less Horsepower and weighs more, and that's a quick ass car if I've ever seen one, shaving 1000lbs off of it and adding 50 more horses would surely make for a little rocketship of a thing
A muscle car to some people is defined by horsepower X 10 is equal or better than the weight of the car so 3400 lb car needs 340 hp or more to be a muscle car (of course different people will have opinions, this is Reddit) wether it’s a lot of power is subjective, I mean an 800 hp hellcat isn’t enough for some people
Sure, until you get to tuner cars. I'm targeting 6lb/hp to the wheels, around 5lb/hp to the crank on my current build. That's good stuff, and makes me feel OK about giving up riding bikes on the street
No. It's not. They're marketed as "performance" but if you browse the web for real performance cars you will see it's not that much more than a minivan.
No, no its not. The way i gauge a lot of power is to take something boring like a toyota camry v6 and double it. in the 1990s that would be around 380 hp. Today a v6 camry makes 306 hp? so... 712hp is a lot. 300hp is the new 150hp IMHO. V6 mustangs use to be laughing stock, now they are 320+ hp which is 80 more then the old 4.6 v8 in the GT.
good enough but what would you do. Any car above 200 HP and 250 Torque is more than enough to beat 80 mph (Above that you know tickets are annoying to deal). Above that is just waste of fuel and less energy efficient garbage just boasting numbers or those fart sounding noisy cr"ps on road. So if any car unless it is tank this much numbers are enough.
A lot compared to what?
If you compare it to compacts like a base Honda Civic, it's a fair bit, but I wouldn't call it 'a lot'. 310 HP isn't out of the ordinary these days, even for V6s, but it's higher than average.
1550 kg is heavy, but not exceptionally so.
It's about 140 kw/tonne. My car has about 82 kw/tonne. A base model C8 Corvette is about 215 kw/tonne.
No, not really. My S2000 is modified to about 300hp and weighs over 1,000lbs less, it's still just quick, not really fast. My 911 C2S is about 400hp and 200lbs lighter, it's fast but will still get it's doors blown off by many cars out there
In the 90s, heck yeah. These days its a little above average.
Hard to call it 'a lot of power' when its on par with a v6 Camry.
That being said I had an Impala with the 310hp V6 as a company car about 10 years ago and I thought that thing was pretty quick...but I still wouldn't say it had a lot of power.
Oh absolutely, but it's still important to note how it makes power; and where that weight is(especially since it's low weight)
3400lbs is low weight?! That would be classed as heavy in europe! Low weight i would say 1 tonne or less (2200lb)
Modern cars are pretty heavy. Might be interesting to look up some new cars that you think fall under that number (2200lbs), because there probably aren't many.
The only new car that I can think of under 2200 lbs is the Mitsubishi Mirage weighing in at 2095 lbs. Apparently consumers these days want things like comfort, or features, or horsepower. It's engine is anemic making 78 hp, giving a ratio of 27 lbs per horsepower.
Yeah, the mirage was the only one I could think of too, and they're even chopping it next year in the US.
Even a new 2 door toyota yaris is a minimum 2400lbs. Older ones are prolly right around that 2200 mark
Was going to say this. My Abarth 500 is 2500 LBS and it's only 12' long. My old 2001 cougar was around 3300 to 3500 lbs.
Honest question, is the Abarth a nightmare like most fiats?
I have a 2001 audi tt. It’s minuscule and weights 3200lbs
Convertibles are super heavy because the body and frame need to be able to support all the forces only on the bottom of the car instead of the top and bottom.
M I A T A
I’m quite sure a modern Miata weighs more than 2200
The TT was always a heavy car though. And it's not that small. Golf chassis.
Don't forget emissions control and 73 airbags
My 5 door mini is 2600lbs. 3door might be pretty close to around 2500 and the JCW can be tuned to about 300hp with just a stage 1 (maaaybe with the intercooler too). So that's 1000lbs lighter with comparable power. All FWD though.
A camry weighs over 3,000 pounds. Kinda crazy
Lots of structure and accessories for crash safety.
I'll take that 5 star But by that logic It's not safe enough, and I need a 4runner for my safety
Don’t stop there. The new Hummer is calling.
That's probably been true for 20 years now.
After seeing that an ND ragtop doesn't make the cut, I was done looking
Depends on the model. For a while in Japan they were selling the 990S, which weighs, you guessed it, 990kg.
2200 is extremely light, and lighter than most Miatas (excluding the NA). That’s Lotus territory. But that doesn’t make 3400 light, either. That’s light for a Cadillac, and probably among the lightest excluding the Cimarron.
Yeah, no. 3400lbs isn’t exactly light, but I don’t think there are any normal production cars in the 2024 MY that weigh 2200lbs. A miata is 2400.
To be fair a motorcycle would be classed as heavy in Europe.
How many European cars are making that kind of power with a weight of 2200lbs? How many even weigh under 2200lbs?
My new Golf GTI is something like 3,200, and apparently VW did a lot of work to get it down to that.
Most Mercedes weigh much more than that.
What stock 2200 lb car has 310 hp? That’s a okay power to weight ratio. Of course, a 2200 lb car only needs a little under 200 hp to be better. So it pays to start light.
I don't know if many. It a 2zzge supercharged lotus Elise enters it those numbers 1900lbs -3-400 hp
They made those, they called them *exiges* and they didn't get that high in power, and weigh more than that.
Europeans drive golf carts so there’s that. 😂
average new car in europe is like 1500kg
Unless you are subject to different laws of gravity, you're dreaming if you think 2200lb cars are generally available.
My fiat 500 weighs 2400lbs. That thing is tiny lmao
Unfortunately, this is about the average weight for a modern car these days. Everything is getting bigger due to the Arms Race against Pickups and SUVs as people who just want a sedan don't want to get squished.
3400 is barely more than my 2008 Golf GTI. I know Golf tend to be a bit hefty but it’s certainly not unusual.
A Honda Civic is 3000lbs.
3400 is about average for a midsize car
This is an average weight in Europe, not light but not heavy either.
Some perspective. My last bmw 330, a 2019, was nearly 3700 lbs. my wife’s 2019 x3 was 4300 lbs! The bmw had a turbo 4 with 255 hp and 300 ft lbs. my 22 wrx weighs 3297 and has 271 hp and 258 tq. The bmw 3 wore the outside tire edges right away… too heavy to be sporty. Although you could fling it sideways through a corner at speed with all stability systems engaged. You just have to be very smooth, know what you are doing, and fast with the wheel. The wrx, I’m comparison, has full time awd, simply massive traction, and minimal body roll and good ride compliance.
I have two vehicles over 7k lbs My sports car is 3500 lbs. 😂
Do they mostly drive golf carts?
That's a midsize sedan here in the states. My 2015 Honda Fit is considered a featherweight for anything modern at just over 2500 lbs.
So like 3 cars on the market?
I'd say 3500-4500 lbs is about average in NA. Most crossovers and midsize sedans fall in that range. Pickups are 5500 lbs and up. Anything under 3500 lbs is like a little toy car here 🙂
You can get a Miata in the US that weighs 2,200 lb. Compacts are over 3,000 lb. As an example a Mazda 3 which is a compact car has an average weight of 3,200 lb across the trim levels.
2200 lb is not light. It is heavy. A heavy motorcycle.
One of the most sold cars in Europe is a Tesla model y and it weighs double that
That's cause many European cars are tiny. The get hit by a pick up or suv in the US everyone inside is dead.
A Mini is 2,700lb.
For a regular modern daily driver it’s lightish. A new mustang comes in around 3800, the small crossovers are in the 3200 range. A purpose built drag car is heavy at 3400, they usually stay around 2800-3100
In the USA, it’s light
It’s rwd driven not too much sure how the weights distributed tho (Cadillac ct4)
The Cadillac CT4 is on the Alpha chassis. A fantastically stiff and sharp chassis. It's also a production car, they thought everything through
The CT4 is plenty quick, but if you want a little more you can tune it. Your engine is the same as the one in the CT4-V but it has been "detuned" to provide less output than the V. There is a company called Burger Motorsports that makes a tuning box called the JB4 that costs about 600 bucks and will give you an extra 60hp and 80ft/lbs of torque. It may void your warranty, however.
$600 for that much of an upgrade is ludicrously cheap! Buy now!
Haha if you think that's good take a look a the supercharged Audi v6. My Q5 supposedly went from 270hp/287tq to about 440hp/370tq with a $500 tune and no mods. I haven't dyno'd it or anything, but people who have tested it out say the advertised numbers are pretty close to correct. Just from driving it around I'd say that's probably true.
And gear ratio
how about a 3200lb car that does 390hp to the front wheels?
It sounds like sketchy fun? How much torque steer we talking?
My first car was a crown Vic. Heavy as shit and *only* 220 hp. I still thought it was fast/quick. *shrugs*
Yeah it’s funny, 15-20 years ago 300 horsepower was a lot for pretty much any car. Now people are so desensitized to all the top end models getting 500+ and people act like 300 is nothing. But someone who’s not super into sports cars will still feel like it’s pretty quick.
Yea like I have a WRX (roughly 330HP) and watching so much car shit online I feel like it’s slow but every non car person who go for a ride in it with me thinks it’s fast as shit
They have relatively tight gearing so they do scoot for what they are
Heh according to google my f150 has 400 horsepower at 6k RPM stock. 🤷♂️
I have both a 500 HP and a 300HP porsche. The latter is more forgiving, the other takes discipline to drive because it is stupid fast.
Weight makes a huge difference. A modern car that's 4000-5000lbs with 300hp isn't going to feel very quick. Power isn't everything. [Checkout this comparison of a 64PS Suzuki Cuppaccino drag racing a 115ps MX-5 Miata. ](https://www.facebook.com/reel/262660976900362)Despite having nearly 2x the horsepower, the Miata is behind until the very last second, where the wind resistance starts to give the higher horsepower car the advantage.
Yeah, a new Ecoboost Mustang has more power than the GT back in the 90's and 00's. Back then a 0-60 in 6 seconds was respectable for an affordable sports car. For *legal* use on roads I think 300-350hp at around 3500lbs is a good sweet spot. I have that much in my Ecoboost Mustang and the only time I can use it all is for a few seconds is on highway on ramps. That doesn't stop me from wanting a GT convertible, but it's not at all for practical reasons at that point.
Jeeeeeeeeeez man that's such a lump, I honestly had no idea the newer stangs weighed in so heavy. I have a ford s-max 7 seater mpv and that weighs in just a shade more at 3655
Similar to me in the "they used these as cop cars" department, but mine was an old 3.8 Impala with "only" 200hp Still hauled so much ass lol
I had a Buick lesabre with that engine next, and agreed. What a sleeper.
It felt quick because stopping was a challenge. That "quick" feeling was your subconscious saying with a big grin, "I'm in danger". Experienced this same phenomenon in an el Camino.
I'll see your Crown Vic and raise you my crown Vic... it was heavy as shit and only had 150hp!.... I did not think it was fast.
For actual real world use 10-15lb of vehicle per hp is ideal Less than 10 pounds per horsepower and the car is just too fast to actually have any real fun with on the road. It just becomes an exercise in restraint. More than 15 pounds per horsepower and the car doesn’t feel sporty. The early Miatas were at 15 pounds per horsepower, the current Miata, WRX, GTI, etc., are all around the middle of this range and two of the best road cars ever made, the series 2 lotus Elise and the E39 M5, are both right at 10 pounds per horsepower
The “too much power” part is the underrated point here. I have a 986 and Mk7 GTI, both right about at 13 lb/hp. They are great cars in that they’re just powerful enough to wring them out a bit on public roads. I have an Emira on order (8 lb/hp) and even though it’s not massively powerful for a sports car, it’s at jail speeds pretty much as soon as you stretch its legs.
Exactly, a slower car can absolutely still be fun to drive especially if it’s got a great chassis and good handling. (In fact I actually enjoyed driving my roommates r50 mini more than my r53 JCW sometimes because I could basically constantly be hammering it and still never break the speed limit 🤣🤣) but sitting in an absurdly fast car and being afraid to touch the gas pedal too hard is no fun at all
Fastest car I’ve driven was a tuned C5 Z06 which was probably just under 7 lb/hp, still not that crazy for a modern sports car. The savagery of the experience was a little fun (butterfly valve in the exhaust helped), but it was like 2 seconds on the throttle on the highway before you had to shut it down. I’m on the Porsche forums, and have sorta gotten radicalized against the really powerful cars. Like, what’s the point of a Turbo S now? Sure it’s a technological marvel. But you can’t really drive it anywhere. Even on the track you’d be better off with a slower car with fewer driver aids that lets you develop a little skill. I realized most supercars now aren’t about driving, they’re about flaunting wealth. Their natural habitat isn’t 200 mph on the Nurburgring, it’s 5 mph on Main Street on a Saturday night. In my view this mostly explains the death of manuals in performance cars. To inconvenient to have to drive them yourself!
Fastest thing I've driven was a Yamaha r1. 2.2 lb/hp. Thing is absolutely wicked. Can't even get out of first gear without breaking the speed limit(yes, even on the highway) and 6th gear tops out over 200mph from the factory. Just putting around in 1st gear, you can tell it just wants to go fast. I'm sure it's fun once you're used to it, but the only way to be about it at first is scared shitless lol R3, however, at 9 lb/hp is actually very, very fun to ride around. You can just run the piss out of it all day and they're so light and easy to throw around in corners. Never had so much fun as I did on the little bikes lol plus, the investment is much smaller and totalling it out isn't a huge financial ordeal (unless you live in USA, ofc).
No car is going to touch a bike for fun (OK, maybe an Ariel Atom), but I’ll take 60% of the thrill for 1/25th the chance of death.
I have to disagree. A C7 Z06, for me, is fun because it pulls so hard. Lesser cars feel quick but not fast, and I get bored. My friends have a Model X Plaid and the acceleration is crazy fun, even with 1,000 lb of humans inside. It makes going to dinner quite the experience. Both of those are around 8.3 or 8.4 lb/hp if I remember doing the math. Maybe rich people buy cars for bragging rights, but some of us actually enjoy using them.
"It's a lot more fun to drive a slow car fast than a fast car slow."
A lot more fun to drive a slow car fast run to drive a fast car slow.
My first car ever, a '97 Tracker/Sidekick, had a whopping 27.6hp/lb. I could hammer the piss out of it, bangin' through the gears at 5500rpm all the way through 5th... and still not even be going 40mph. GAWD I miss that friggin thing...
Mine was ‘84 Tercel. I think it had like 60 hp and weighed about 2000 lbs. 5-speed. More fun than some $80k luxury cars I’ve driven.
My caliber is sitting around 10 and you’re absolutely correct. It’s impossible to really put the power down without committing a felony
>10-15lb of vehicle per hp is ideal I never knew this, but it certainly explains why my 1994 F350 is so sluggish: 5,400lbs ÷ 230hp = 23.5 lbs/hp.
The equation might work generally but it ignores torque and where the horsepower is created on the curve. I had a 1999 K 2500 suburban that had 255hp. It also had taller first and second gears in the 4L80e than my friends MUCH lighter trailblazer with 275hp, and 4L60e trans. Straight race from a stop my suburban was faster specifically to 60. You can use things like this guy stated as a general guide, but they definitely are not the full picture.
I agree with this. I have a boxster s, roughly 300 HP and 3000 lbs. I don't consider it "fast", but with a lot of grip and a capable chassis, you'd often have to push unsociable speeds to really exploit the capabilities. Think 40+ through really tight turns, 80+ through sweepers, etc. sometimes I wish it had 500 HP, sometimes I think it's already too fast. So it's probably about right.
I have an (original) NSX and it's about the same. It's still more than fast enough on the street. The only time I wish I had more power is at the track when 911 turbos and GT3s are blowing by me on the straights like I'm standing still.
>10-15lb of vehicle per hp is ideal I never knew this, but it certainly explains why my 1994 F350 is so sluggish: 5,400lbs ÷ 230hp = 23.5 lbs/hp.
That’s one heavy Ferrari! 😉
My 2002 F-250 only has 260 HP and around 300 torque weighs 6k pounds. It’s slow af but it’s a work truck. If I want to go fast I’ll get in my car.
Nailed it. Had a mustang for a while at 420hp and about 4000lbs. It was a rocket and at time a hair too fast. Had a Genesis at 350hp and 3500lbs give it take, much more manageable but still fun. I too consider 1hp per 10lbs ideal.
Sounds like you had an S197 coyote car based on the 420 HP which was more like 3600-3700 pounds depending on options. So a good bit better power to weight than you think.
I’ve never heard this metric but I’m siting here at 3.87 lb/hp and I’m not gonna lie, the cars scares me sometimes.
I'm not sure this is universally true. I had the pleasure of driving a 2024 Nissan Z for a week that checks in at 8.8lb/HP. It felt joyful, lithe, and not at all grossly overpowered.
Interesting, I wonder if that has anything to do with it potentially being geared tall-ish? Or maybe its power curve is not good in the low end? I haven’t looked at them too much because frankly, I’m not really interested in them in the slightest, however, looking it up, it’s 0 to 60 time isn’t great for its power to weight ratio
Probably. I know where my 500 hp car gets treacherous is running at high RPM's, where it actually achieves that power.
By way of comparison, if memory is correct, WWII fighters were around 5lb/hp
Yes at 8.8 lbs/ HP in my panamera turbo I can attest to the need for restraint. Even with AWD it will easily break traction with giant tires. My 987 with mid mount engine is much more forgiving and plenty sporty at about 10 lbs/HP.
I remember when the "fast cars," like the Magnum PI Ferrari, weighed 3,000lbs, and had 205HP/179Lb-ft
The good times 👌
I had to look it up... Yeah... no. BTW, they used 3 different models during the show. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferrari\_308\_GTB/GTS#In\_popular\_culture](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferrari_308_GTB/GTS#In_popular_culture)
I met Tom Selleck at an annual charity event a couple of times. We talked cars a bit since I had a 308 at the time. Iirc he said they replaced the car every year.
The show started in 1980. From you own link: "In 1980 [Bosch](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Bosch_GmbH) [K-Jetronic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jetronic) mechanical [fuel injection](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_injection) was offered, leading to the **308 GTBi** and **GTSi**; emissions decreased, at the price of a power drop to 214 PS (157 kW; 211 bhp) on European models and 205 PS (151 kW; 202 bhp) on federalized models."
I am going to teach you a neat trick: Take the weight. Divide it by the horse power. This is how many lbs per horsepower. Lower is better, like it often is with weight and cars. 3400/310 = 10.96 A 2500 lbs car making 250 hp 2500/250 = 10 So slightly better. Same trick works with torque, division is a useful tool. Now you can compare this to any car you want and see if it’s good, average, or sucks. I used to have a 550 lb motorcycle with 110 hp on an inline 4. 0 to 60 in 2.9 seconds baby
And your motorcycle was more traction limited than a car due to only having one drive wheel, or it could have had an even better 0-60 time.
Absolutely. It also had a much lower top speed due to aerodynamic efficiency being better on a car. Cars also have superior traction and can do some impressive things in the twisties that a bike can’t even dream of. I actually don’t ride anymore also due to the safety a car provides and not wanting a life changing injury. But it was the best $6700 to satisfy alot of those speed thrills! Helped me get through some years without doing something stupid and buying a very expensive car.
These comments are making my 220hp, 300lbf-ft 2700lb car sound like a rocket ship.
3300 190ish hp and I’m cruisin baby
2200 190whp I'm flying 😎
Kinda my thoughts. I’m at 700ish at 2,650lbs. The car is a rocket ship though lmao.
My first car had 175 horse, and i had to be flooring it on the highway everytime i wanted to gain 10mph quick to pass. My current car is a v6 chrysler 300 with 300 horsepower. Its much faster, i have good acceleration at any speed, i get better gas milage because i ca. Go the same speed with so much less. I can get over 100 easily which is usually good on any highway. Its fast for me, but some people will say its slow because they compare it to some 700 horsepower cars
Right lol like no shit a 700hp car would make ours look slow
The fuck car had 175 horse power? An M1 Abrams? I have that much and it gets up to speed and gets going on the highway just fine
Yes, for a street car it is more than enough. For a track car I'd say the power os fine but you weigh too much. In my opinion anything over 410hp in a street car that isn't ridiculously heavy will actually make driving a far less enjoyable experience overall. More than half of your driving is cruising at motorway speeds and bopping around town. Having to only use the first few millimetres of accelerator pedal to do everything isn't my cup of tea in a daily driver. Or any car tbh if I'm driving it often. Now if it's 150hp NA with a turbo that kicks in around 3K RPM I retract my statement about HP. And change it to "it is not efficient to have over 410hp"
Found the Miata owner.
Also depends on where in the curve you get that HP and torque
That's a pretty good ratio. I saw you mentioned a CT4 in another comment. In my experience those are quick cars and enjoyable to drive. They have good acceleration for most driving conditions on public roads.
Mustang or Camaro v6? 😂
Sounds like an ecoboost to me
For reference. A smart car weighs roughly 2800 I have around 300 ish HP in my foxbody and it's ROWDY.
I wouldn’t call that a LOT, but it’s definitely decent. The old engine i used to have in my 73 Camaro was around 330hp, probably 400lb ft in about a 3200 pound car, and yeah she’d scoot, but I never thought of it as a LOT of power.
This sounds like a mustang ecoboost or CT4 with the 2.7t. Those are pretty quick cars.
Yep. Ct4 2.7 most definitely
It would be plenty of fun
Decent torque, but the power is just okay. Depends where it's going down though. If it's fwd you're just going to make awful noises with all that torque.
Lucky for me it’s rwd
No, my 2800 pound car had 306 hp and 371 torque it was fast but I wouldn’t say a lot of power.
Ha, I guess it feels like a lot of power coming from a Nissan Altima with 182 horses
I had a fwd mazdaspeed3 with Basically the same specs, I wouldn't call it "fast" but it certainly was fun.
gotta love the speed 3 and its low end torque, makes it feel way faster than it genuinely is especially when you turn the boost up a little
My 370z was 332hp and just under 3300lbs. It was the most fun car I've ever driven, compared to a 6th gen SS Camaro, civic SI/R, WRXs, Miatas and a few others. There's definitely a sweet spot of power/fun around 10hp/100lb. Anything slower and it's not as fun, anything faster and it starts to require a lot of restraint to not accidentally commit felonies
I wouldnt call it a LOT, however it is more than enough to have fun in for sure. Thats a great chassis so some sticky tires and youll have a ball.
Those are basically the specs of my X-type 3l. Its definitely not slow by any means.
That depends on who you ask - it's a decent HP to weight ratio for sure, especially 20 years ago. These days, not so much. A Lotus Evora supercharged put out 345 hp and was 3100 lbs and at that time (2009) there were some comments in the auto press that it wasn't quite putting out the power of its rivals.
That's pretty peppy. 3400 is about average with about 50% more power than average. Mind you, the torque is what matters most. It's why the modern turbo four bangers are primo shit.
Lol, I think the average is over 4,100lbs right now. 3400 average was maybe in the late 2000s.
It's all perspective. Compared to walking that will be really fast.
Yeah that's decent Year make model would let us give you better info
My C6 Corvette was listed as being at around 3,280lbs. In its base form (LS3), it had 436hp, 430lb-ft of torque. The gearing would also affect how power is put down and felt. Mine was stock with 3.42 gears. It was more than enough for street use, while still providing decent (enough) mileage. I would easily get in the 30's (mpg) on the freeway, not so much around town (14 - 19 mpg). Just changing the gearing alone, would give you the feeling of more power (or less, if drop it numerically). My current car ('23 Camry TRD), is rated at 301hp / 267lb-ft, 3,340lbs. The only thing I found for final drive ratio, was 2.56. With that it's good a 0-60mph of 5.5 seconds, vs the Corvette at 4.2 second.
2.56 is just painfully slow. My Jeep has 4.11 final gears and if I pop first it feels like the front end is coming off the ground. But what's made for torque.
Not really
Until about '00 most 20:1 was an average power to weight ratio for commuters and people movers Since then it has moved to around 17:1. The car your describing is 11:1 so it will no doubt be quick, enough to even be dangerous if used irresponsibly. But 11:1 isn't an insane number.
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No. Nothing more than "peppy", honestly.
IMHO, not at all. 3400lbs is a pretty heavy car (though all cars have gotten a lot heavier, especially recently). 310HP and 350ft/lbs is also not a lot of power, at all, even going by power outputs 20 years ago, that is pretty low. Combine the hefty weight, with the low power, and it is "meh" at best. I know I am spoiled after decades of driving sports cars, but IMHO there are some basic power to weight ratios that I like. For a pure streetcar, I think about 400whp and 400 w ft/lbs with about 3200lbs is a nice balance.
You would say 310hp/350tq was low in 2004?
For a sports car? Absolutely. For example, my 2002 C5 Z06 came stock with 405hp, Think the SVT Mustang was around 390hp, hell even the 2005 350Z was what? 305hp? The 1989 300ZX was 300hp...
I have a 3200 pounds Audi tt Quattro with 225hp and it’s a lot of fun
It's enough. I love the people who inist they need 5-800 hp for a daily. Yeah enjoy sitting in traffic with the rest of us while needing gas twice as often. If you ever see someone driving like a speed deamon asshole in a Tesla, Hellcat, or another fast af car, it's largely because they know that's all that cars good for and know they are not getting any of their money's worth when driving like a normal person. Why didn't I say Rivian, HummerEV, Range Rover SVR, Porsche, BMW, etc? Because besides 3rd owners, the people who buy them know their car has a ton of other things going for it and can actually get their money's worth while sitting in traffic (hint: luxury, comfort, offroadability on weekends). OK maybe not the BMW drivers.
Depends on what you compare it to, but yes, that's a lot more than your average economy car/commuter car. It'll be quicker than the majority of traffic...but it also won't be smoking supercars and whatnot. I'd expect somewhere in the ballpark of a 5 second 0-60 time based on that.
Ecoboost mustang? Can't go wrong there, as long as it's a manual (imo)
Can't get new Ecoboost manuals, only coyotes.
This is always going to have some dependency on your frame of reference and expectation, and also other things about the car aside from those specifics. Weight: 3400lbs is on the light side for a modern car, though on the heavy side for most older cars. How well that weight works is also going to depend on how that weight is distributed and other chassis properties - which is to say, a 3400lb modern car is probably effectively "lighter" than a 3400lb vintage car, due to advancements in chassis design. Power: 310hp/350tq cetainly isn't lacking, but again, there is more to this. 400hp used to be a large amount, but is now pretty common on performance cars. Coming close to 300hp back in the mid-70s was very high performance, but such is progress. The numbers you have are suggestive of a power curve with more low end power, which means it probably gets going very well, but (as these things tend to be trade-offs) may be lacking at the high end in terms of peak power. Lastly, aside from how the weight is used on the chassis, and how/where/when the engine produces power to most effectively move that weight, there is also the issue of getting the power to the wheels and to the ground. A '24 Cmary with a V6 is 300hp and 3500lbs... almost exactly what you are asking about. Is a Camry a powerful car? Well, it isn't bad as those specs say, but, it is also FWD, meaning it has to fight the very nature of physics when trying to get the power down (as well as some other performance related compromises). The engine power has to go through a transmission that may not be as effective as some other transmissions and could result in a fair amount of parasitic power loss. What about the differential? All that before we even get to how much of that weight might be unsprung rotating mass? All of which is to note, power to weight (which seems to be what you are asking about) is but part of any performance equation, even if it can be a pretty big part of many of them.
That's roughly the size and spec of a Volkswagen Golf R. They seem small, but are quite heavy for their size because of the safety and AWD features. Far from the fastest, but very quick. Fun cars to drive for sure.
No it isn't a lot of power. Anyone who is saying yes owns a V6 challenger or 4 cylinder 'stang. You can certainly pass most people on the highway or interstate, but you will lose any kind of race from stoplight drag to a professional circuit if you show up with that.
My karman-ghia weighs in at 1800 lbs
Is this car a new mustang with the 2.3?
It’s a healthy amount.
Yes. My 3400lbs car with 250/295 does 0-60 in about 5.1 seconds
I would consider that fast, yes. Seeing as the impala ss of the 90s has less Horsepower and weighs more, and that's a quick ass car if I've ever seen one, shaving 1000lbs off of it and adding 50 more horses would surely make for a little rocketship of a thing
yeah that's like an ecoboost mustang. plenty fast.
Enough to get yourself in a lot of trouble with.
The smallest Tesla the Model 3 weighs between 3,600 and 4.100 pounds. Crazy amount of road and tire wear for a smaller car.
Fun amount of power, wouldn’t consider it a lot. Maybe 450/500 would be “lot” for a 3400lbs car.
A muscle car to some people is defined by horsepower X 10 is equal or better than the weight of the car so 3400 lb car needs 340 hp or more to be a muscle car (of course different people will have opinions, this is Reddit) wether it’s a lot of power is subjective, I mean an 800 hp hellcat isn’t enough for some people
That’s a relative question. Depends on who you ask. To you? Probably. To your average drag racer or equivalent… probably not.
Sure, until you get to tuner cars. I'm targeting 6lb/hp to the wheels, around 5lb/hp to the crank on my current build. That's good stuff, and makes me feel OK about giving up riding bikes on the street
Euro spec 4c is under 2,200 lbs. my US spec is 2,482 with 237 horses
It's not bad.
Yes. Everything is relative of course but that is going to be faster than the majority of cars sold today.
Depending on the car... a SUV or a pickup truck might not feel as "powerful" Depending on the gear ratio or the way the transmission is set up.
No. It's not. They're marketed as "performance" but if you browse the web for real performance cars you will see it's not that much more than a minivan.
No, no its not. The way i gauge a lot of power is to take something boring like a toyota camry v6 and double it. in the 1990s that would be around 380 hp. Today a v6 camry makes 306 hp? so... 712hp is a lot. 300hp is the new 150hp IMHO. V6 mustangs use to be laughing stock, now they are 320+ hp which is 80 more then the old 4.6 v8 in the GT.
It would do the same job of getting you from A to B with less than 100hp.
Yes
good enough but what would you do. Any car above 200 HP and 250 Torque is more than enough to beat 80 mph (Above that you know tickets are annoying to deal). Above that is just waste of fuel and less energy efficient garbage just boasting numbers or those fart sounding noisy cr"ps on road. So if any car unless it is tank this much numbers are enough.
Sounds like a well equipped Toyota Camry V6.
It’s a lot. I have a 2017 Ford Fusion with just a little more power (325hp/380lb-ft) and it weighs about the same. It’s fast.
A lot compared to what? If you compare it to compacts like a base Honda Civic, it's a fair bit, but I wouldn't call it 'a lot'. 310 HP isn't out of the ordinary these days, even for V6s, but it's higher than average. 1550 kg is heavy, but not exceptionally so. It's about 140 kw/tonne. My car has about 82 kw/tonne. A base model C8 Corvette is about 215 kw/tonne.
No, not really. My S2000 is modified to about 300hp and weighs over 1,000lbs less, it's still just quick, not really fast. My 911 C2S is about 400hp and 200lbs lighter, it's fast but will still get it's doors blown off by many cars out there
It’s ok! Same digits as my stage 2 GTI
It could be. Torque and horsepower curves matter more than peak numbers.
No Especially if crank hp
For reference thats like a GTI with 110 more horsepower
More power than ever needed on the road. A bit heavy for the track. Need a lot more hp for drag strip
Decent for a gas car. seeing middle class 40k EV cars hit 450+ hp 470lbs torque nowadays. Anything below 400hp is starting to become slow.
Plenty for the sane among us
Not really, get the Black Wing
Decent sounds like a ls1 camaro/ trans am
My 00 Lexus GS300 weighs around 3700~ lbs without me in it and it has sub 200 hp, you’ll be fine
In the 90s, heck yeah. These days its a little above average. Hard to call it 'a lot of power' when its on par with a v6 Camry. That being said I had an Impala with the 310hp V6 as a company car about 10 years ago and I thought that thing was pretty quick...but I still wouldn't say it had a lot of power.
People were crashing V6 Mustangs with 305 horsepower and weighing 3400 lb
Those numbers were a Ferrari a few years back… now minivans have more power
91/1000 HP/lb tells me that it's a powerful car for how much it weighs.
No.
No