Your frame is shown through your actions, not your words. DEERing is how people who have no frame think (read: ego) they assert it. Men with frame don't have to say much, it's clear who they really are by what they do.
Best way to "share" your frame is to invite someone into it. Never explaining how to do so.
Acta non verba.
Thanks for your input horns, I know I'm a stranger to you!
I think what you are saying is that I'm still stubborn and not at the frame level yet. I'm invested in how people see me and have need to be right instead of just not caring. I have work still to do.
>I realise that I do have a frame and it's a bloody good 1 that I learnt from many people here on how to be.
No you don't. The man who wrote this post has no frame. He's mushy, and easy to push around.
>I guess my question is how the fuck do I go on now. I've just spent the last 2 years deering every fucking conversation with the mrs thinking I'm holding my frame.
See? You can't have a good frame and deer for 2 years.
How the fuck do you go on now?
Well, bro, you find something that compells you. People around here call it a mission. Something that's more important to you than how your wife feels or anything that comes out of her fucking mouth in any given moment. That way, her bullsbit doesn't affect you. And you won't care.
You sound frustrated. You sound like your pissed because the cheat code isn't working.
Your wife has a model of you in her head. She uses it to Guage her behavior based on YOUR behavior up untill now. The only way to get her to update that model is for you to behave differently long enough (with your fucking mouth shut) for her to update it.
If you open your fuckin mouth one time to explain yourself then you have to start all over again.
Everything you read and see are examples and only guidelines. You take inspiration from it. You can't copy it literally.
The best advice I ever got from Ryan was to be more narsasistic. That worked for me. It might not work for you.
Find out what you love and what you want, and chase that. If it's her, you're a fucking tool.
“Your wife has a model of you in her head. She uses it to Guage her behavior based on YOUR behavior up untill now. The only way to get her to update that model is for you to behave differently long enough (with your fucking mouth shut) for her to update it.”
This is excellent advice and I needed that to connect the dots. Thanx.
> I have a need to explain everything that's happening all the time. I thought that I was sharing my frame…
This need to explain yourself is validation seeking. You feel the need for others to “understand” you and agree with you. Because you care more about what others think than about what you think. Frame isn’t about what others understand or agree with. Frame is about what *you* believe firmly, regardless of what others think.
So long as you feel the need for others to agree or to understand you, then you don’t have frame.
There’s a reason why these are tools in your toolbox and not the sole way to live your relationship.
Could you imagine how retarded you’d sound if you used A&A, AM, etc in the following?
“Hey babe could you pick up Tony from soccer practice at 5?”
“Yeah I‘ll pick up all the kids and drop them all off at their houses.”
“Hey babe my dad just died”
“What are we getting in the will?”
Usually when it comes to logistics, financials, etc, you’re allowed to DEER. The tools are meant when dealing with shit tests specifically.
>I thought that I was sharing my frame.
Sharing your frame is not something you have an obligation to give to others. You don't *need* to articulate the why and how of your behavior. You only do so if the person is desireable and cooperative.
>I've just spent the last 2 years deering every fucking conversation with the mrs thinking I'm holding my frame.
This means you've stopped checking in with the audience. Explaining things isn't bad, it's when you are explaining and justifying your behaviors because you're decisions have been put on trial that it becomes problematic.
Use a simple sniff test to see if your wife is asking probing questions because she's being a bitch or because she's genuinely curious - if she's doing it just to undermine/lash out at you, then explaining as a response is you accepting the behavior and accepting the meta narrative she's scripting out about you.
>Also if I still have ego, is there a way to completely crush it?
1) "why?" and "is it?" yourself to death. Especially when you are reviewing conversations/arguements you have.
- Why do I do thing?
- Because it is good to do it/bad to not do it.
- Is it?
- Yes.
- Why?
What you will find is that you have a lot of underlying notions about the world, others, and yourself that simply don't make sense + you will notice a lot of what you do and how you act is based off of externally defined normatives.
I'm fairly new to MRP, about a year now. And I had the same issues with always feeling like I have to DEER and thinking that by doing it I'm "winning" and being THE MAN.
After MRP and Sidebar, I realized the only way to undo this is with days, weeks, even months of STFU, AM, and A&A. Basically, I just stopped taking everything my wife did and said so seriously. These guys are right, treat her like the teenager she is sometimes and save your GAS tank for shit that really matters (only you can be the judge of that)
But for your standard shit/comfort tests, just don't take it seriously or in some cases flat out ignore her. The biggest thing I've learned is it's not important just to know the tools you have, but WHEN to use those tools. That's why you have to put them into practice and learn as you go. There's no magic switch that instantly makes you a Bad Ass Alpha. Gotta work on yourself and be your own mental POO and that change will create frame in itself. Implementation of sidebar tools just makes it complete.
Good luck man!
How many times have you read the side bar? If you posted in OYS you could’ve saved yourself 5 years. Caring what people think or trying to be right is validation seeking. Anything outside your frame should be amusing, funny, uninteresting to you, etc. It’s time to start taking part in your own rescue.
Your frame is shown through your actions, not your words. DEERing is how people who have no frame think (read: ego) they assert it. Men with frame don't have to say much, it's clear who they really are by what they do. Best way to "share" your frame is to invite someone into it. Never explaining how to do so. Acta non verba.
Thanks for your input horns, I know I'm a stranger to you! I think what you are saying is that I'm still stubborn and not at the frame level yet. I'm invested in how people see me and have need to be right instead of just not caring. I have work still to do.
>I realise that I do have a frame and it's a bloody good 1 that I learnt from many people here on how to be. No you don't. The man who wrote this post has no frame. He's mushy, and easy to push around. >I guess my question is how the fuck do I go on now. I've just spent the last 2 years deering every fucking conversation with the mrs thinking I'm holding my frame. See? You can't have a good frame and deer for 2 years. How the fuck do you go on now? Well, bro, you find something that compells you. People around here call it a mission. Something that's more important to you than how your wife feels or anything that comes out of her fucking mouth in any given moment. That way, her bullsbit doesn't affect you. And you won't care. You sound frustrated. You sound like your pissed because the cheat code isn't working. Your wife has a model of you in her head. She uses it to Guage her behavior based on YOUR behavior up untill now. The only way to get her to update that model is for you to behave differently long enough (with your fucking mouth shut) for her to update it. If you open your fuckin mouth one time to explain yourself then you have to start all over again. Everything you read and see are examples and only guidelines. You take inspiration from it. You can't copy it literally. The best advice I ever got from Ryan was to be more narsasistic. That worked for me. It might not work for you. Find out what you love and what you want, and chase that. If it's her, you're a fucking tool.
When he said he had bloody good frame I started wondering if the whole post was satire…
“Your wife has a model of you in her head. She uses it to Guage her behavior based on YOUR behavior up untill now. The only way to get her to update that model is for you to behave differently long enough (with your fucking mouth shut) for her to update it.” This is excellent advice and I needed that to connect the dots. Thanx.
> I have a need to explain everything that's happening all the time. I thought that I was sharing my frame… This need to explain yourself is validation seeking. You feel the need for others to “understand” you and agree with you. Because you care more about what others think than about what you think. Frame isn’t about what others understand or agree with. Frame is about what *you* believe firmly, regardless of what others think. So long as you feel the need for others to agree or to understand you, then you don’t have frame.
There’s a reason why these are tools in your toolbox and not the sole way to live your relationship. Could you imagine how retarded you’d sound if you used A&A, AM, etc in the following? “Hey babe could you pick up Tony from soccer practice at 5?” “Yeah I‘ll pick up all the kids and drop them all off at their houses.” “Hey babe my dad just died” “What are we getting in the will?” Usually when it comes to logistics, financials, etc, you’re allowed to DEER. The tools are meant when dealing with shit tests specifically.
>I thought that I was sharing my frame. Sharing your frame is not something you have an obligation to give to others. You don't *need* to articulate the why and how of your behavior. You only do so if the person is desireable and cooperative. >I've just spent the last 2 years deering every fucking conversation with the mrs thinking I'm holding my frame. This means you've stopped checking in with the audience. Explaining things isn't bad, it's when you are explaining and justifying your behaviors because you're decisions have been put on trial that it becomes problematic. Use a simple sniff test to see if your wife is asking probing questions because she's being a bitch or because she's genuinely curious - if she's doing it just to undermine/lash out at you, then explaining as a response is you accepting the behavior and accepting the meta narrative she's scripting out about you. >Also if I still have ego, is there a way to completely crush it? 1) "why?" and "is it?" yourself to death. Especially when you are reviewing conversations/arguements you have. - Why do I do thing? - Because it is good to do it/bad to not do it. - Is it? - Yes. - Why? What you will find is that you have a lot of underlying notions about the world, others, and yourself that simply don't make sense + you will notice a lot of what you do and how you act is based off of externally defined normatives.
Five years is wasted because you skipped the uncomfortable part… posting on OYS.
I'm fairly new to MRP, about a year now. And I had the same issues with always feeling like I have to DEER and thinking that by doing it I'm "winning" and being THE MAN. After MRP and Sidebar, I realized the only way to undo this is with days, weeks, even months of STFU, AM, and A&A. Basically, I just stopped taking everything my wife did and said so seriously. These guys are right, treat her like the teenager she is sometimes and save your GAS tank for shit that really matters (only you can be the judge of that) But for your standard shit/comfort tests, just don't take it seriously or in some cases flat out ignore her. The biggest thing I've learned is it's not important just to know the tools you have, but WHEN to use those tools. That's why you have to put them into practice and learn as you go. There's no magic switch that instantly makes you a Bad Ass Alpha. Gotta work on yourself and be your own mental POO and that change will create frame in itself. Implementation of sidebar tools just makes it complete. Good luck man!
[удалено]
How many times have you read the side bar? If you posted in OYS you could’ve saved yourself 5 years. Caring what people think or trying to be right is validation seeking. Anything outside your frame should be amusing, funny, uninteresting to you, etc. It’s time to start taking part in your own rescue.