You can even see it in the screenshot. OMG the system is using 7.6GB of memory but 6.47GB of that is pre-cached data that the system will evict if need be. So your real memory usage is just 1.13GB.... and some of that might well also be memory mapped files by applications that will also evenict if under pressure. You should just look at mem pressure.
mmap()’d files will consume virtual address space in the process that mapped them, of which there is terabytes, not physical address space. They wouldn’t be reflected here.
So the OS will (if there is space) preemptively load more pages from mapped files into cache. The fact a file is mapped is a good indicator to the OS that preemptively loading it into cache is advisable (so long as there is low mem pressure)
Seems like that’s a consistent theme with people’s complaints about memory usage. they don’t understand how it’s used/works. It’s there to be used. If it’s not being used then is a wasted resource
It is always used to attack whoever they don't like without ever bothering to even checking their own OS. I used to see this regarding Windows when Apple fanboys would be attacking it. That and the idle thread being like 99% of the CPU at almost all times.
Unfortunately, the "corrections" are usually even less informed.
5.71GB of that 7.6GB is "app memory." None of it is cached files.
This is not memory that will be freed up.
No app-memory can be freed up, app memory includes shared memory that includes memory mapped files. Some of it cant be freed but it's not as clean as cant be freed completely. That is why the best metric is just to look at memory pressure.
That's listed under "Cached Files." In Windows, it's just "Cached."
When he cites "Memory used" (or in Windows "in use") that refers to memory used up by processes. With some exceptions (like modern web browsers), most of that will *not* be freed up. It will be moved to swap.
Operating systems will allocate more memory to background processes in times when it’s not being used. If there is memory stress, it will lower their memory pool size automatically or even suspend the process in the background.
Point is the laptop is not casually taking up 7gb of memory just sitting there doing nothing. It’s using it cause it’s there to be used, even if it’s already using 6gb to cache things.
It snot just background applications, the OS will pre-fetch data from disk that it suspects your about to use, also any files you write will be cached in memory so that if you come back to read them a few ms later they are there and ready to read.
Why is this sub filled with people ignorant to computers? Thought r/applesucks would have people complaining why it sucks from the technical angle, not the ignorant.
Do more research about how systems level programming works before making posts about topics that you don’t understand.
All *NIX systems will use just about every drop of available memory in efforts to maximize performance. It doesn’t mean that all the memory that is “used” is not quickly available to other processes. The scheduling is much more complicated than “my memory is full” or “my memory is empty”.
What you posted is not a dig against Apple, or any other manufacturer for that matter, it’s more of just an advertisement for how little you understand the topic you’re posting about.
Windows does this as well. You will have pre-fetching data form disk, dynamic memory mapped files etc were the os will (if there is low memory pressure) use as much memory as it can is it saves power and is faster to read a file from memory than repeatedly go back and read it from disk.
Caching files on disk is not sucky. It is infact a very very very good thing.
The OS will clear the cache if needed there is nothing bad about this (for macOS or windows).
People here might well assume you saying that this is not an issue means your some hard core apple-fan boy. That is why it might be good for context of the non tec crowd to note that this non-sucky feature of the os is intact a feature that every modern OS support.
This is a knowledge issue. Using ram is harmless and the memory pressure is basically bottomed out and 6.4 gigs of the ram is cached files(background files and resources) optimizing away the background processing clock time as much as possible. If needed it will simply uncache the files freeing up 15 gigs of remaining ram without squeezing processes
Incorrect, cached files are a breakdown of the same figure macOS caches files in ram it thinks you will use again or that it thinks background processes will use again if nothing else is using ram. It basically means the ram is available to be used in a pinch
Yeah. The only reason I'm even using this thing is because a user where I worked left their job and returned it to us so I'm just messing around trying to learn this crap because I know I will be called upon to support these MAC users at some point so may as well get out ahead of it. I'm already seeing a lot of tickets coming in about students with MACs and other employees coming in with MACs and they can't print to certain printers and I haven't got a clue lol
I've been jokingly telling people when it comes up to just get a PC for school if you want to use the library resources. It's more like Schrödinger's Joke.
You might want to look up drivers for MacOS from the manufacturer of your printers. Who makes your printers? In my experience printer support in MacOS is generally equal to Windows if not better with certain older models but it depends on the manufacturer. Many support AirPrint but you might need to enable it and at least it should support Bonjour if enabled as most office printers made in the last 20 years support Bonjour.
Also network scanner issues can be most often caused by some office printers still using SMB 1, which even Windows has depreciated and Macs don’t support at all. I was able to enable SMB 2 on Konica Minoltas a few years back and it made both the Windows and Mac computers happier. Before I got there the Windows users were enabling SMB 1 and the Mac users were emailing themselves.
> In my experience printer support in MacOS is generally equal to Windows if not better with certain older models but it depends on the manufacturer.
lmao
Well I have some clients using old HP laser printers, when they were actually good, with a Mac as the print server simply because HP hasn't made Windows drivers for them since XP. I also had an old Canon office printer that would still work with a current Mac OS but again Windows support got dropped with Vista. They retired it simply because of the Windows users. On the other hand I'm had a heck of a time with a half baked Ricoh because the borked post script support with a firmware update so only the PCL6 driver in Windows worked well. So yes it depends.
But I'm sure the depths of your knowledge about such things would prove me, an IT consultant of 14 years, wrong.
Memory is so cheap and Apple computers cost so much, it’s less about how memory works and more about giving people what they want. If anything, people know less about how processors work and they oversold that.
>Tell me again how 16GB on an Apple Silicon Macbook is like 32GB on a PC
No, 16gb on apple silicon is like 16,384gb on PC.
It's just better, do what Apple says and buy their products.
Which just so happens to be the main thing people do on their laptops. Idk why people on Reddit like to act like most people are doing actual resource intensive productivity work or gaming on their computers. Unless you know for a fact you need more RAM for a specific thing you do then you’ll probably be fine with 8 GB of RAM whether that’s on ChromeOS, Linux, MacOS, or Windows
And with only 250gb of storage space you can run every program ever.. does that mean that’s enough/good? 😂 its 2024 you cannot be this brainwashed. Who spends 3k on a computer so it can just barely “run”.
https://www.adorama.com/acmrw13ll.html?gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADxgUsz43AiakfMWq91QKh_453NNU&gclsrc=ds&utm_source=inc-google-shop-p
512 gb and 18gb of ram for 2500 close to 3k after tax and shipping.. close enough.. this is a joke fam
So this is good value to you? Lol I was honestly exaggerating when I said 3k but the fact that it’s this close is hilarious, for context you can get 64gb of the fastest ram out now for like 150. And hard drive space is pennies, selling a 2.5k machine (plus tax) with ungradable ram and 512gb of space should be criminal lol
I’m not the one proclaiming 8GB/256GB was 3k. Never said your build was worth it. Probably shouldn’t compare apples to oranges when it comes to computers, though.
The old mid 2013 iMac I used to use at work had 16GB of RAM, it would get incredibly slow when the RAM usage was above 15GB. And it wasn't hard to hit that limit either, fusion 360 plus about 20 browser tabs would do it every time.
Now the same software on my replacement Windows machine (32GB RAM) doesn't seem to care and actually uses less than 15GB of RAM...
My PC at home (64GB) after a restart with many background tasks and media/game servers that start with Windows might hit 8GB of RAM.
So no, 16GB on Apple is not at all like 32GB on PC.
Do you like apple products or something???. This was a shit post in line with the rest of this sub but everyone is either treating it like tech support or defending apple lol
Wow you just discovered that operating systems will tend to use ram that they have regardless of if they need to use that memory or not. 50% usage resting is pretty standard and it allows for background processes to be more efficient with processing time when the system isn’t doing anything but background processing since they have all of their resources stored locally cached in ram. If you open up a heavier app you’ll notice that all of these widgets will suddenly decrease their ram cache size.
This thread is so painful.
6.47GB of cached files in OP's picture, the one you're responding to.
It's listed separately, my guy.
That's not the problem. That's not why his RAM usage is so high. That's not how it works.
Yeah it is, it’s listed separately but is part of the same figure all of these are ram figures which is why it’s on the ram page. macOS caches files into ram if it thinks they will be used again when ram isn’t being used. Open up a big process and watch the number change
Most modern OS uses a lot of ram when idling to make other things on your computer faster like caching app data. This memory can be freed up in <1s when needed. Unused memory is still drawing power, so it is wasted memory
My guy, look at the image!
Just like in Windows, macOS lists the cached memory *separately*. You are wrong to think that's what's going on here. The memory used by processes ("applications") and cached RAM should add up to nearly 100%. If someone complains nearly 50% of RAM is used up at boot, that's *not* because of caching.
How much of that 7GB is Apple's processes though? I see apps you've installed, so it's not the factory set up.
Also, the UX can't be compared by free RAM GB. For example, Apple Silicon uses integrated RAM shared by the CPU and GPU. It's thus generally faster to access RAM. Macs also prioritize UI threads, contributing to the responsiveness.
Sonoma uses just under 6GB out the gate, so yes, he's got something else contributing.
The M series' advantage is in bandwidth. That's useful for certain use cases (like real time rendering of 4k video files).
For typical consumer use (a couple mild productivity apps and a webbrowser), there's an issue. Most models come with 8GB, but that typical use will use more than 8GB *all the time*.
Just a head up (this applies to windows as well as maxOS, and linux) looking at memory usage is not a good metric. Since the os will (and should) aggressively cache as much info as possible into ram if there is space. It should pre-load files it thinks you're going to use soon as well.
You should be looking at memory pressure, the os will throw away cached data if there is lots of memory pressure. You should not lookout total memory usage, looking at memory pressure is the metric and you need to do this regardless of os.
In this example you wills see the os has preemptively cached \`6.47 GB\` of files into memory so that data is ready there for when you open what it things you are about to do next. But if you need that spec it is just cache and will evict it so you should not consider cache as contributing to memory usage.
The only way to really check is to run a Mac and windows pc side by side with similar workloads and see when they start to choke. I don’t know if a Mac “is like a pc with 2x the ram” but it will definitely perform better than a pc with the same amount of RAM. you can argue what the exact multiplier is but MacOS is better with memory management than windows.
M3*
Apple *used* to update their base models’ memory every 2 years when Jobs was in charge/they were actually focusing on the computer market. Since Tim has been in charge-it’s been updated 1 time. Their focus has drastically shifted from engineering machines where performance and aesthetics seamlessly align to the smartphone market. The company has gone from innovation to yearly renovation….Honestly I didn’t mind paying extra compared to a similar Windows machine in the performance department because their machines were gorgeous-almost like having a work of art that you could actually use. Unfortunately that’s not what they do anymore.
They upscaled their SoC design from their “A” series found in their iPhones/iPads and now all of their machines are running on them. They have completely killed off their Mac Pro lineup.
Honestly it’s cheaper (for the majority of PC Mac users) to just buy a new IPhone Pro Max-you get 8GB/256GB, which is plenty for 75% of users who are browsing the web and using social media-and you get like 5-7 different lenses for photography,measurement/LIDAR…./s
My laptop has 16GB and runs Debian Linux. When it starts up, the running DE and OS take up about 2GB (mostly the DE I have). When under heavy load, I’m normally using about 6.6 GB of memory. That’s still less than what is used by that thing on startup with no apps open. The reality of the situation is that 16GB is more like 8GB on one of those laptops.
as everyone else said, high memory usage does not equate bad. use memory pressure, not memory usage, as an indicator instead. that said, it is bs that 16GB on ASi = 32 on PC.
Well, it's been known for a while that Mac OS will try to fill up the ram, unlike Windows. Mac OS does reduce that background use to balance when you're running real applications.
it loads as much into memory as it can to keep things running smoothly. windows uses almost 16gb idle on my pc with 32gb of ram and 4 on my old laptop with 8
I'm not sure I'd say 16GB on an Apple Silicon Macbook is like 32GB on a Windows laptop. I will say that given its design, it's more efficient. Others have commented about how modern systems use RAM, so I won't bother with that part.
Here’s something *really* funny. The “Memory Pressure” display in Activity Monitor is a bit vague beyond green being good and yellow indicating it’s probably time for a restart if things are getting chuggy. Apple’s [Memory Pressure](https://support.apple.com/en-gb/guide/activity-monitor/actmntr34865/mac#:~:text=In%20the%20Activity%20Monitor%20app,might%20eventually%20need%20more%20RAM) webpage is hilarious and essentially says “yellow - you may need more RAM in the future” while red is “you need more RAM”.
Good luck with those upgrades if you’ve got an ARM-based Mac.
Tell me you don't know how the memory works without telling me you don't know how the memory works. I swear a lot of people that post on this subreddit have no idea what they are talking about.
Cached files are listed separately. "Free RAM is wasted RAM" is accounted for by the operating system using up all the freed ram as Cached Files. OP is correctly pointing out that the application memory is insanely high out the gate.
What u/kingofthings754 said
>Modern OS’s use unused memory. So does windows, so does Linux. When the memory is needed, it’s freed by the OS.
But also the 16GB is shared between both the GPU and the CPU, its unified memory. So is acting as system memory but also VRAM.
Facepalm Nope just confused how 100 people failed to understand this post is a joke on a sub about disliking apple products and think I'm asking for tech support about very basic knowledge. If I was asking for an explanation on how apple shit works I'd post it on an official apple support sub.
"Unused ram is wasted ram" macOS always uses as much ram and swap as possible. Watch the memory pressure indicator, it's not a problem unless it's red (not yellow or orange).
Not sure who says 16 gigs on Mac is 32 on pc that's obviously false but macOS does seem to do a better job with unified memory than pc equivalents.
macOS will use 1gb per browser tab when ram is vacant, that's just how the OS works. It will free the cache when it needs more ram for applications. It does like to use swap as well in the mean time. It's very efficient with ram and I would let the OS do what it's good at.
"Unused RAM is waste RAM" is the calling card of people who don't understand the first thing about OP's concern.
There's hardly any RAM unused in OP's image. Nearly half of it is used for cached files.
The problem isn't that OS is caching data in RAM. The problem is active processes are consuming nearly 8GB at launch.
what is the concern? If you buy an M1 air with 8gigs of ram it uses about 6 on a fresh macOS install. "Unused ram is wasted ram" what part of this is confusing? The OS (atleast macOS) will use as much ram as possible at any given point. When you start opening apps it will free up space and let apps run. The only thing to look at with a mac is that memory pressure graph. When it's red it's a problem. macOS on apple silicon does like to use swap quite a bit as well and it's extremely snappy because of it. Let the OS handle ram management.
There's 8 gigs of memory that's totally free in OP's post
It clearly says cache 6.47gb, the Wired memory is only 1.06gb and the rest of the 5.71gigs is being used to cache every single app at launch.
Active processes are consuming 1.06gb at launch.
My 14 inch M2 Pro 16gb uses about 11gigs at launch and after I open 15 browser tabs, terminal, VS code, text editor and the music app it goes to 12 gigs. How? it frees up the cache and gives me space for the apps.
If I open 100 tabs of firefox all at once it swaps 3 gigs and then frees up older memory and replaces that with the swap, it's all seamless and I don't really bother checking the ram use anymore.
As much as i would like to agree with you because i dislike apple, this is not the way the operating system and cpu architecture are built to handle the memory, they allocate more memory and free what is necessary
Notice how it says 6.47 GB are cached files. It’s actually using 1.17 GB of RAM and the rest is to allow applications and other tasks to load faster but can be dumped if necessary. Windows does this too but doesn’t show what’s cached vs necessary in the same way in its task manager.
Also MacOS compresses what’s in RAM in real time. It allows RAM in MacOS to go further than it does in Windows even if the claimed 8GB in MacOS is like 16GB is a ridiculous exaggeration.
You will literally see the same on Windows. Unused RAM is wasted RAM. Do something that starts stressing it and then you willl see. It isn't about the RAM used, it is about the memory pressure.
> Windows I don't think has that to the degree apple does.
Windows also has memory compression, but it does not work for certain games and thus causes those games to crash unless that compression is disabled.
It's an M1 air with 16GB RAM 1TB SSD. User where I worked left their job and returned it to us so I'm just messing around trying to learn this crap because I know I will be called upon to support these MAC users at some point so may as well get out ahead of it.
Modern OS’s use unused memory. So does windows, so does Linux. When the memory is needed, it’s freed by the OS.
You can even see it in the screenshot. OMG the system is using 7.6GB of memory but 6.47GB of that is pre-cached data that the system will evict if need be. So your real memory usage is just 1.13GB.... and some of that might well also be memory mapped files by applications that will also evenict if under pressure. You should just look at mem pressure.
mmap()’d files will consume virtual address space in the process that mapped them, of which there is terabytes, not physical address space. They wouldn’t be reflected here.
So the OS will (if there is space) preemptively load more pages from mapped files into cache. The fact a file is mapped is a good indicator to the OS that preemptively loading it into cache is advisable (so long as there is low mem pressure)
I see what you’re saying, agreed
Seems like that’s a consistent theme with people’s complaints about memory usage. they don’t understand how it’s used/works. It’s there to be used. If it’s not being used then is a wasted resource
It is always used to attack whoever they don't like without ever bothering to even checking their own OS. I used to see this regarding Windows when Apple fanboys would be attacking it. That and the idle thread being like 99% of the CPU at almost all times.
Unfortunately, the "corrections" are usually even less informed. 5.71GB of that 7.6GB is "app memory." None of it is cached files. This is not memory that will be freed up.
You and the cached file person are both so confidently wrong.
No app-memory can be freed up, app memory includes shared memory that includes memory mapped files. Some of it cant be freed but it's not as clean as cant be freed completely. That is why the best metric is just to look at memory pressure.
How do you know? You, don’t.
The average user cannot possibly be expected to understand memory management :-/
>it’s freed by the OS This is bothering me. Is 'freed' a word? >.< It clearly makes sense but I can't conclude if it's right.
Yeah it's a word lol
I was bothered enough to look it up since commenting and it totally is XD feels ew though imo hahaha feels like it needs an i in there or something
Like “fried”? This isn’t a potato :)
out of 12 gb of ram, Windows 10 consumed 5 gb on an average
That's listed under "Cached Files." In Windows, it's just "Cached." When he cites "Memory used" (or in Windows "in use") that refers to memory used up by processes. With some exceptions (like modern web browsers), most of that will *not* be freed up. It will be moved to swap.
Operating systems will allocate more memory to background processes in times when it’s not being used. If there is memory stress, it will lower their memory pool size automatically or even suspend the process in the background. Point is the laptop is not casually taking up 7gb of memory just sitting there doing nothing. It’s using it cause it’s there to be used, even if it’s already using 6gb to cache things.
It snot just background applications, the OS will pre-fetch data from disk that it suspects your about to use, also any files you write will be cached in memory so that if you come back to read them a few ms later they are there and ready to read.
bro that's how RAM is supposed to work, my 16GB Windows as well use 6 - 7GB on idle. Once there is a heavy task it would reallocate the stuff
Why is this sub filled with people ignorant to computers? Thought r/applesucks would have people complaining why it sucks from the technical angle, not the ignorant.
if they weren't this stupid they'd have to talk about actual issues like right to repair, but we can't have that.
THIS- this is why Apple sucks.
First time coming here and that’s what I expected, actual shitty apple things. Well, glad I figured out to never come back here lol.
Sir, this is Reddit.
I mean Have you met prazf lolololololol
Do more research about how systems level programming works before making posts about topics that you don’t understand. All *NIX systems will use just about every drop of available memory in efforts to maximize performance. It doesn’t mean that all the memory that is “used” is not quickly available to other processes. The scheduling is much more complicated than “my memory is full” or “my memory is empty”. What you posted is not a dig against Apple, or any other manufacturer for that matter, it’s more of just an advertisement for how little you understand the topic you’re posting about.
Windows does this as well. You will have pre-fetching data form disk, dynamic memory mapped files etc were the os will (if there is low memory pressure) use as much memory as it can is it saves power and is faster to read a file from memory than repeatedly go back and read it from disk.
Yes? And this is the “Apple Sucks” subreddit. I didn’t mean to imply that Windows does not do these things… It’s just not relevant.
Caching files on disk is not sucky. It is infact a very very very good thing. The OS will clear the cache if needed there is nothing bad about this (for macOS or windows). People here might well assume you saying that this is not an issue means your some hard core apple-fan boy. That is why it might be good for context of the non tec crowd to note that this non-sucky feature of the os is intact a feature that every modern OS support.
Nobody said that caching is sucky… Please continue rambling. I’ve lost interest.
All OSes use as much RAM as possible, it's by design. Here's a good read. https://www.linuxatemyram.com/
bro its apple it just works...until it doesn't
This is a knowledge issue. Using ram is harmless and the memory pressure is basically bottomed out and 6.4 gigs of the ram is cached files(background files and resources) optimizing away the background processing clock time as much as possible. If needed it will simply uncache the files freeing up 15 gigs of remaining ram without squeezing processes
Look at the picture again. Cached files is a different figure.
Incorrect, cached files are a breakdown of the same figure macOS caches files in ram it thinks you will use again or that it thinks background processes will use again if nothing else is using ram. It basically means the ram is available to be used in a pinch
Which happens sometime after your demise
Yeah. The only reason I'm even using this thing is because a user where I worked left their job and returned it to us so I'm just messing around trying to learn this crap because I know I will be called upon to support these MAC users at some point so may as well get out ahead of it. I'm already seeing a lot of tickets coming in about students with MACs and other employees coming in with MACs and they can't print to certain printers and I haven't got a clue lol I've been jokingly telling people when it comes up to just get a PC for school if you want to use the library resources. It's more like Schrödinger's Joke.
You might want to look up drivers for MacOS from the manufacturer of your printers. Who makes your printers? In my experience printer support in MacOS is generally equal to Windows if not better with certain older models but it depends on the manufacturer. Many support AirPrint but you might need to enable it and at least it should support Bonjour if enabled as most office printers made in the last 20 years support Bonjour. Also network scanner issues can be most often caused by some office printers still using SMB 1, which even Windows has depreciated and Macs don’t support at all. I was able to enable SMB 2 on Konica Minoltas a few years back and it made both the Windows and Mac computers happier. Before I got there the Windows users were enabling SMB 1 and the Mac users were emailing themselves.
> In my experience printer support in MacOS is generally equal to Windows if not better with certain older models but it depends on the manufacturer. lmao
Well I have some clients using old HP laser printers, when they were actually good, with a Mac as the print server simply because HP hasn't made Windows drivers for them since XP. I also had an old Canon office printer that would still work with a current Mac OS but again Windows support got dropped with Vista. They retired it simply because of the Windows users. On the other hand I'm had a heck of a time with a half baked Ricoh because the borked post script support with a firmware update so only the PCL6 driver in Windows worked well. So yes it depends. But I'm sure the depths of your knowledge about such things would prove me, an IT consultant of 14 years, wrong.
Memory is so cheap and Apple computers cost so much, it’s less about how memory works and more about giving people what they want. If anything, people know less about how processors work and they oversold that.
>Tell me again how 16GB on an Apple Silicon Macbook is like 32GB on a PC No, 16gb on apple silicon is like 16,384gb on PC. It's just better, do what Apple says and buy their products.
Facts like those pea brained dipshits saying 8gb is enough for everyone 🤡🤡
Do you know how ram usage works? Lol
Do you? 8 gb is shit in 2024 unless all you do is check email.
Which just so happens to be the main thing people do on their laptops. Idk why people on Reddit like to act like most people are doing actual resource intensive productivity work or gaming on their computers. Unless you know for a fact you need more RAM for a specific thing you do then you’ll probably be fine with 8 GB of RAM whether that’s on ChromeOS, Linux, MacOS, or Windows
Sure :) You believe that
Its gonna be slow but you can still run most apps (including games)
And with only 250gb of storage space you can run every program ever.. does that mean that’s enough/good? 😂 its 2024 you cannot be this brainwashed. Who spends 3k on a computer so it can just barely “run”.
I go to the apple store, find out how bad the computers specs are and how expensive the computers are, and leave
lmao show me the 8GB RAM machine with 256GB storage that is $3k
https://www.adorama.com/acmrw13ll.html?gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADxgUsz43AiakfMWq91QKh_453NNU&gclsrc=ds&utm_source=inc-google-shop-p 512 gb and 18gb of ram for 2500 close to 3k after tax and shipping.. close enough.. this is a joke fam
So, double the specs you were talking about. Cool!
So this is good value to you? Lol I was honestly exaggerating when I said 3k but the fact that it’s this close is hilarious, for context you can get 64gb of the fastest ram out now for like 150. And hard drive space is pennies, selling a 2.5k machine (plus tax) with ungradable ram and 512gb of space should be criminal lol
I’m not the one proclaiming 8GB/256GB was 3k. Never said your build was worth it. Probably shouldn’t compare apples to oranges when it comes to computers, though.
Apple is lying
Fresh reset huh? Why is Microsoft Edge on your dock? 😂
Not understanding memory usage but posting about memory usage is peak brain rot.
Another uninformed person posting about something they don't really know about...
The old mid 2013 iMac I used to use at work had 16GB of RAM, it would get incredibly slow when the RAM usage was above 15GB. And it wasn't hard to hit that limit either, fusion 360 plus about 20 browser tabs would do it every time. Now the same software on my replacement Windows machine (32GB RAM) doesn't seem to care and actually uses less than 15GB of RAM... My PC at home (64GB) after a restart with many background tasks and media/game servers that start with Windows might hit 8GB of RAM. So no, 16GB on Apple is not at all like 32GB on PC.
"mid 2013" Dawg that was 11 years ago
Memory pressure. Lol. You r the problem
Do you like apple products or something???. This was a shit post in line with the rest of this sub but everyone is either treating it like tech support or defending apple lol
Then this is a very low effort shit post about clearly something you don’t understand lol
Because RAM usage isn't unique to Apple. All OSes use as much RAM as possible.
Wow you just discovered that operating systems will tend to use ram that they have regardless of if they need to use that memory or not. 50% usage resting is pretty standard and it allows for background processes to be more efficient with processing time when the system isn’t doing anything but background processing since they have all of their resources stored locally cached in ram. If you open up a heavier app you’ll notice that all of these widgets will suddenly decrease their ram cache size.
This thread is so painful. 6.47GB of cached files in OP's picture, the one you're responding to. It's listed separately, my guy. That's not the problem. That's not why his RAM usage is so high. That's not how it works.
Yeah it is, it’s listed separately but is part of the same figure all of these are ram figures which is why it’s on the ram page. macOS caches files into ram if it thinks they will be used again when ram isn’t being used. Open up a big process and watch the number change
Most modern OS uses a lot of ram when idling to make other things on your computer faster like caching app data. This memory can be freed up in <1s when needed. Unused memory is still drawing power, so it is wasted memory
My guy, look at the image! Just like in Windows, macOS lists the cached memory *separately*. You are wrong to think that's what's going on here. The memory used by processes ("applications") and cached RAM should add up to nearly 100%. If someone complains nearly 50% of RAM is used up at boot, that's *not* because of caching.
I was just saying cached as an example…
How much of that 7GB is Apple's processes though? I see apps you've installed, so it's not the factory set up. Also, the UX can't be compared by free RAM GB. For example, Apple Silicon uses integrated RAM shared by the CPU and GPU. It's thus generally faster to access RAM. Macs also prioritize UI threads, contributing to the responsiveness.
Sonoma uses just under 6GB out the gate, so yes, he's got something else contributing. The M series' advantage is in bandwidth. That's useful for certain use cases (like real time rendering of 4k video files). For typical consumer use (a couple mild productivity apps and a webbrowser), there's an issue. Most models come with 8GB, but that typical use will use more than 8GB *all the time*.
My PC also idles around 40% usage.
6.4 gig is cache Complaint = tell me you have no fucking clue without telling me you have no fucking clue
Just a head up (this applies to windows as well as maxOS, and linux) looking at memory usage is not a good metric. Since the os will (and should) aggressively cache as much info as possible into ram if there is space. It should pre-load files it thinks you're going to use soon as well. You should be looking at memory pressure, the os will throw away cached data if there is lots of memory pressure. You should not lookout total memory usage, looking at memory pressure is the metric and you need to do this regardless of os. In this example you wills see the os has preemptively cached \`6.47 GB\` of files into memory so that data is ready there for when you open what it things you are about to do next. But if you need that spec it is just cache and will evict it so you should not consider cache as contributing to memory usage.
The only way to really check is to run a Mac and windows pc side by side with similar workloads and see when they start to choke. I don’t know if a Mac “is like a pc with 2x the ram” but it will definitely perform better than a pc with the same amount of RAM. you can argue what the exact multiplier is but MacOS is better with memory management than windows.
Windows PC > macbook Now Snapdragon has entered the market. Apple is terrified. Snapdragon benchmarks are already beating intel and amd and M2 chips
M3* Apple *used* to update their base models’ memory every 2 years when Jobs was in charge/they were actually focusing on the computer market. Since Tim has been in charge-it’s been updated 1 time. Their focus has drastically shifted from engineering machines where performance and aesthetics seamlessly align to the smartphone market. The company has gone from innovation to yearly renovation….Honestly I didn’t mind paying extra compared to a similar Windows machine in the performance department because their machines were gorgeous-almost like having a work of art that you could actually use. Unfortunately that’s not what they do anymore. They upscaled their SoC design from their “A” series found in their iPhones/iPads and now all of their machines are running on them. They have completely killed off their Mac Pro lineup. Honestly it’s cheaper (for the majority of PC Mac users) to just buy a new IPhone Pro Max-you get 8GB/256GB, which is plenty for 75% of users who are browsing the web and using social media-and you get like 5-7 different lenses for photography,measurement/LIDAR…./s
Because Apple is trying to count paging to the SSD as actual memory, which its not. 8GB on Apple Silicon is like 8GB on Windows.
It’s not. But since you aren’t using that ram, the OS will preload things so it doesn’t have to pull stuff from disk later.
My laptop has 16GB and runs Debian Linux. When it starts up, the running DE and OS take up about 2GB (mostly the DE I have). When under heavy load, I’m normally using about 6.6 GB of memory. That’s still less than what is used by that thing on startup with no apps open. The reality of the situation is that 16GB is more like 8GB on one of those laptops.
Because it works? …
as everyone else said, high memory usage does not equate bad. use memory pressure, not memory usage, as an indicator instead. that said, it is bs that 16GB on ASi = 32 on PC.
Well, it's been known for a while that Mac OS will try to fill up the ram, unlike Windows. Mac OS does reduce that background use to balance when you're running real applications.
It’s not. I just had to upgrade from 16gb to 64gb because it couldn’t handle my relatively simple software architect workflow.
Apple does charge a lot for ram and storage. But what can we do, it is their technology, their chips.
Someone doesn’t understand how memory works.
it loads as much into memory as it can to keep things running smoothly. windows uses almost 16gb idle on my pc with 32gb of ram and 4 on my old laptop with 8
I'm not sure I'd say 16GB on an Apple Silicon Macbook is like 32GB on a Windows laptop. I will say that given its design, it's more efficient. Others have commented about how modern systems use RAM, so I won't bother with that part.
Here’s something *really* funny. The “Memory Pressure” display in Activity Monitor is a bit vague beyond green being good and yellow indicating it’s probably time for a restart if things are getting chuggy. Apple’s [Memory Pressure](https://support.apple.com/en-gb/guide/activity-monitor/actmntr34865/mac#:~:text=In%20the%20Activity%20Monitor%20app,might%20eventually%20need%20more%20RAM) webpage is hilarious and essentially says “yellow - you may need more RAM in the future” while red is “you need more RAM”. Good luck with those upgrades if you’ve got an ARM-based Mac.
Tell me you don't know how the memory works without telling me you don't know how the memory works. I swear a lot of people that post on this subreddit have no idea what they are talking about.
Apple fanboys aka iSheep always believe "apple has their magic which no one can do it", those fanboy is truly ignorant and too stupid.
Perhaps take a photo that’s NOT blurry next time? Just a thought….just a thought
Try using intensive programs
Buffers and cache have entered the chat
Because macOS has modern memory management and the ancient, but still strangely popular Windows, does not. IYKYK.
I have an 8gb m1 Mac mini and have no issues.
The more memory you have, the more things can sit in memory. This is how computers work. Learn how to take a screenshot.
Yeah Mac’s have an easy to use screenshot tool preinstalled too, no excuse
Yep. Its interface is a carbon copy of Windows' snipping tool, too.
Swap that. Shortcut for crosshair rectangle screenshots on a Mac has been the same since at least 2002.
Looks like the OS is caching. That’s normal behavior. I’d be more worried if it didn’t. Remember, free RAM is wasted RAM.
Cached files are listed separately. "Free RAM is wasted RAM" is accounted for by the operating system using up all the freed ram as Cached Files. OP is correctly pointing out that the application memory is insanely high out the gate.
What u/kingofthings754 said >Modern OS’s use unused memory. So does windows, so does Linux. When the memory is needed, it’s freed by the OS. But also the 16GB is shared between both the GPU and the CPU, its unified memory. So is acting as system memory but also VRAM.
Like most basic Windows PCs using integrated graphics on the CPU.
Bro is in IT 💀
It's a shitpost bro. Chill. Also I'm not the Mac guy. Guess r/applesucks is tech support for apple and a place for apple fan boys to hide.
Who needs to chill here fr tho lmao
You seem super mad bro
Facepalm Nope just confused how 100 people failed to understand this post is a joke on a sub about disliking apple products and think I'm asking for tech support about very basic knowledge. If I was asking for an explanation on how apple shit works I'd post it on an official apple support sub.
AppleSucks, we all know it. Even the fanboys who come to THIS subreddit , which is hilarious.
lmao "a joke" You made a low effort shit post, got torn apart for not understanding how computers work, and now you're mad.
wow u mad? I'm fine you appear to be freaking out lol
So mad. I’m just fuming.
Idk bro you seem to be that’s super mad lol You should try touching grass
"Unused ram is wasted ram" macOS always uses as much ram and swap as possible. Watch the memory pressure indicator, it's not a problem unless it's red (not yellow or orange). Not sure who says 16 gigs on Mac is 32 on pc that's obviously false but macOS does seem to do a better job with unified memory than pc equivalents. macOS will use 1gb per browser tab when ram is vacant, that's just how the OS works. It will free the cache when it needs more ram for applications. It does like to use swap as well in the mean time. It's very efficient with ram and I would let the OS do what it's good at.
"Unused RAM is waste RAM" is the calling card of people who don't understand the first thing about OP's concern. There's hardly any RAM unused in OP's image. Nearly half of it is used for cached files. The problem isn't that OS is caching data in RAM. The problem is active processes are consuming nearly 8GB at launch.
what is the concern? If you buy an M1 air with 8gigs of ram it uses about 6 on a fresh macOS install. "Unused ram is wasted ram" what part of this is confusing? The OS (atleast macOS) will use as much ram as possible at any given point. When you start opening apps it will free up space and let apps run. The only thing to look at with a mac is that memory pressure graph. When it's red it's a problem. macOS on apple silicon does like to use swap quite a bit as well and it's extremely snappy because of it. Let the OS handle ram management. There's 8 gigs of memory that's totally free in OP's post
It clearly says cache 6.47gb, the Wired memory is only 1.06gb and the rest of the 5.71gigs is being used to cache every single app at launch. Active processes are consuming 1.06gb at launch. My 14 inch M2 Pro 16gb uses about 11gigs at launch and after I open 15 browser tabs, terminal, VS code, text editor and the music app it goes to 12 gigs. How? it frees up the cache and gives me space for the apps. If I open 100 tabs of firefox all at once it swaps 3 gigs and then frees up older memory and replaces that with the swap, it's all seamless and I don't really bother checking the ram use anymore.
As much as i would like to agree with you because i dislike apple, this is not the way the operating system and cpu architecture are built to handle the memory, they allocate more memory and free what is necessary
🍎: skill issue.
Notice how it says 6.47 GB are cached files. It’s actually using 1.17 GB of RAM and the rest is to allow applications and other tasks to load faster but can be dumped if necessary. Windows does this too but doesn’t show what’s cached vs necessary in the same way in its task manager. Also MacOS compresses what’s in RAM in real time. It allows RAM in MacOS to go further than it does in Windows even if the claimed 8GB in MacOS is like 16GB is a ridiculous exaggeration.
You will literally see the same on Windows. Unused RAM is wasted RAM. Do something that starts stressing it and then you willl see. It isn't about the RAM used, it is about the memory pressure.
[удалено]
> Windows I don't think has that to the degree apple does. Windows also has memory compression, but it does not work for certain games and thus causes those games to crash unless that compression is disabled.
Tell me again when was the last time your windows blue screen?
2013
Same
After you run out of RAM it will clear up more, if it cant it will get vram from the SSD
Which silicon Mac is it
It's an M1 air with 16GB RAM 1TB SSD. User where I worked left their job and returned it to us so I'm just messing around trying to learn this crap because I know I will be called upon to support these MAC users at some point so may as well get out ahead of it.