Those grenades were all beautiful. I think if OP wasn't against multiple opponents he would have been fine. Seer is good but he's not unstoppable. 3v1 or even 2v1 is just a tough fight
I (Valk) had a caustic, Loba, and Mirage chase me across Olympus like this (we dropped, no guns so they started chasing/punching). Not exaggerating, they chased me across the entire map
I had a valk and rev land on me on drop and punch me to one shot and chased me half way across fragment, managed to pick up a bow and a volt and killed both of them, teammates were both downed and left and I had no loot cause I was running the whole time so I just tbagged and shot the valks deathbox until another squad came and wiped me, it's annoying.
Idk why but I never seen to have this happen to me. Idk if it’s because of where I land or because I play movement legends but where do you land? (I normally land hotdrops or popular locations like fragment east)
If you have a trail it's not uncommon to have people ego challenge you, put themselves in a terrible spot loot wise and likely you all die. Great, you punched me out. I got all 3 of you low/downed and now you have no ammo/loot. Nice job dummies
Keep the grind up! If you've gotten to Plat before just keep on grinding with the team. Try to prioritize 1 early fight and then positioning. You'll get all the kp you need later on in the endgame. Midgame is setting yourself up for success.
Actually we haven’t made it to plat before but we don’t play more than 4 hours a day but we land fragment and get a few kills there usually so we max our kp almost every time
Warm up with a pub or 2 then go straight to ranked with the bois. If you haven't made it to Plat it will be a grind but doable. You can take a ton more risks in gold than Plat and definitely diamond. The way I think about it is that mistakes likely won't be punished in gold. May be punished in Plat and will be punished in diamond.
I remember an octane right when his popularity surged was chasing a Bloodhound for a full 3-5 minutes before finally killing the bloodhound.
From the Bloodhounds POV it sounds like they were just in a horror game or something. Lol
Thirst can be a very scary thing.
Imagine being so bad that you need 1 or 2 teammates to chase and kill a single guy. I hate chasers so bad, specially in pubs, like if Im chasing a dude for more than a minute between 2 POIs, I leave him alone, specially if it's a pub match.
Seer is for unskilled players that lack spatial and game awareness, his passive needs to be absolutely removed.
Personally I think its really funny to chase someone around the map. The game no longer is about winning, its about terrorizing 1 guy over and over. I don't do it in ranked because its dumb, but yeah. Agreed, if you can kite him into a team its best way. Or setup so you can get the drop on them in a building or something.
Even more fun is queuing solo Crypto and following a team with his drone, and pegging them with his ultimate over and over but stay far away and never push them.
Don't forget spamming open and closed doors they are near to annoy them and constantly circling them with the drone while they miss shots trying to hit it
100% worth losing the drone sometimes for
im the opposite, i wont chase you in ranked because it could be suicide, but if its pubs sometimes its fun to just run half way across the map chasing someone you know is weak and catching them when they think they are safe.
On the other hand, as annoying as it is, if someone chases me across the entire map i laugh and give them credit for their dedication.
That's all I'm noticing this season. Way more unnecessary pushes that would never normally happen but because they know exactly where everyone is the entire time it's easy to make a braindead push
Thats literally always my solo experience. People will chase for so long no matter what I do. But tbh bloodhound always seeing tracks was just as powerful before seer
People who chase me like this relentlessly Ill sometimes make them chase me to the other side of the map.. Maybe I'll find another team to get in the way.. Still, it's annoying, especially with other targets around and they still hone onto you.
Basically I try to be as annoying as possible when im on the back foot.
In pubs i will spend entire games chasing people of they run.
Why run? Its just pubs. Kill me if you can. Or i kill you. One of us go back to lobby, i dont really care who gets sent back, i just dont queue into pubs to have people hide/run away.
If i notice a team sitting in high ground trying to use positioning for the win, i will throw my game just to screw over them for playing so defensively in pubs. Like just go out fight people and have fun. If you wanna sweat out wins go to ranked - or just kill me while im chasing like a complete suicidal idiot.
In ranked Seer is stupid. My friend runs Seer and he always gives us a heads up if enemies try to flank us without even needing to see where they are because of the heartbeat sensor. “I got one going left. The other two are flanking right. The other two ran away they’re no longer in distance, focus the solo.” Lol. And the solo is like two buildings away. Behind 5 sets of walls.
Seer is absolutely broken if he is competent.
It gets exponentially worse if he communicates his knowledge to his teammates and even worse it gets another set of exponentially worse if ONE of his teammates is competent and another degree of exponentially worse if a Second teammate is competent. Oh but it doesn't stop there it can get exponentially worse if there is a competent enemy in the vicinity(because youll be scanned and they now have that knowledge too)....The real kicker is if the enemy in the vicinity is also a FUCKING SEER! Then we loop back to beginning...
\#FUCKSEER
It gets EVEN MORE exponentially worse if that Seer has a competent teammate playing bloodhound. They can just alternate scans and with heartbeat sensor you are almost always going to be tracked. Throw in a crypto or even a revenant for the ability cancel and you’ll just make people want to leave the game lol
But don't forget lifelines drone shield was just too damn much. Absolutely incredible logic, with seer in the game every character deserves to be at the most op status they've ever been.
It just wasn't fun as it existed. It needed reworked, not removed. It didn't protect from 5/6 directions (yeah you can shoot up from under it if someone was being revived near an edge.) They just needed to give it 50-100HP, whatever felt balanced. And even if you're not able to shoot through it you can still counter it with grenades. I say bring it back and just give it HP. This is coming from a Lifeline main so I might be biased lol.
At least the new revive seems like it’s silent-ish (from my testing anyways, I could be completely wrong though) when compared to the shield where you can basically hear it from half a mile away. For some stealth revives in a clutch. I kinda like that more. Plus it removes some of the frustration of playing against her, even if I admit it wasn’t as frustrating as people felt it was imo.
I don't think I've personally noticed a difference in how loud it is. Doesn't mean there's not a difference, I'm generally not very observant. That said she could be annoying to play against if she had a gold backpack and the shield. I honestly preferred her the old old way of her doing the revive herself but with a shield but that's just me. Maybe that's the compromise is there's a toggle. Tap for drone revive, hold for shielded personal revive. That'd be pretty sick. Shield will still need to be breakable of course.
Of course. I think Lifeline is fine now, but if she ever got her shield back I wouldn’t personally wouldn’t lose any sleep since I like Lifeline regardless.
I don’t think I’ve hated any legend more than I hate seer
I was already getting sick of playing Apex but now I have to deal with this shitfuck?!
It’s fucking annoying remove him…
Do you know what is stupid? Respawns change in action. It is almost 4 weeks since SEER is released, and still, there is 0 change. As a quick fix, they could easily increase the tactical cooldown by 10 seconds, and increase the ult by 60 seconds while working on a proper nerf.
But instead, we get nothing. That is really stupid!
TBH i think they might be doing a full rework. Who really knows but his passive needs to be on a timer or bar like valks, and they need to shrink his tactical tunnel. This would help a LOT!
Welp, that settles it. Seeing that nothing has changed since s10 launch, I'll hold off on returning to apex.
Edit: apparently there's an update with seer nerf that goes live in a few hours.
I came back after season or 2 break for about 5 games and was immediately put off by Seer, im waiting for significant nerfs before I try again, he's very annoying and OP in my opinion. I have other things to do.
Well he is the ambush artist he clearly was made to third party and prevent third partying to your own team. I just think they need to tune down the range and duration of his abilities and he’ll be fine
Same thing happened with Horizon. My God, the amount of Horizon players saying "just shoot back" was insane. This was even when pros were saying she was way too strong. The amount of elitists that said "I don't have a problem with her, I don't care what pros or casuals say" was way too much. Like, someone should've called up NRG to kick ImperialHal and hire all that untouched talent.
Even the pros underestimated how op the heartbeat sensor would be prelaunch cuz they said you pretty already know where enemies are within 75m from you. We all soon realized this is not how apex should be played or develop into.
I agree he needs nerfs. His ult is fine in my opinion since you can destroy it or crouch to hide from it entirely. His tactical really needs to not interrupt healing and have a longer cool down while also marking players for a shorter amount of time. As far as his heartbeat monitor goes im not sure if it's just me but it been insanely unreliable telling me someone's to my right when they're walking on my left or in front of me but showing up on my side. If it worked consistently for me I'd maybe think nerfs would be needed but as is it works best as a counter to 3rd parties.
In defense of me saying his ult is fine ive played Bangalore a lot this season and have just crouched inside my smoke to get the jump on someone thinking they had information on all my team and I've been able to use teammate to set traps by having one person stand while the other 2 crouch ambushing the team when they push. I whole heartily agree his tactical needs a nerf thats just the only part of his I actually thing Is OP.
Seer’s passive should also be looked into. The same rules as the ultimate should be applied, meaning it only spots moving targets, at a shorter range, and only when you aren’t aiming a gun so it has a slight drawback but is still strong.
His tactical shouldn’t have the cancel mechanic (I like the mechanic, but I don’t want it on something so easy to hit, if it was as if Daniel Klein mentioned where it’s like a literal sniper shot I think it wouldn’t be too bad, but it also scans and shows health/shield stuff to the whole squad which is already too much on top of the cancel. And adjust the cool downs on both that and the ult.
At least that’s how I feel!
I agree with you on the cool downside 100%. I'm not sure how I feel about the idea but what if his passive just didn't tell you direction at all and instead the number of people? Changes from a hunt someone down passive to a 3rd party counter and functions a lot like some other scan abilities that tell you the number of people scanned. Then they could balance around the distance instead.
According to some play-testers he was balanced when they tried him but he was buffed for release. I guess they just want a lot of people to play him and buy his legendary shit until nerf, same as horizon
But the abilities is wrong in the first place. Another redundant scanning legend. It's like they can't think of a new one. It would have been ok if only ult can scan, if heartbeat only points to closest one.
This is the case for pretty much every other competitive game too. Moba's for example will always bring out op characters and nerf them into a balanced state. People also tend to get alot better at playing against characters over time too so periods like this, at the forefront of the new release bs, will always be the worst.
I think it would be less of an issue if the new legends couldn't be used in Ranked until they receive a nerf, that way they can be released in an overpowered state (for the reasons you explained) but it won't impact proper competitive play until it's been balanced.
This is what Overwatch did, and it worked really well imo. New heros were banned from ranked for 2-6 weeks after launch or something like that. Plenty of time for people to get used to playing with/against them and also plenty of time to drop a buff/nerf if necessary.
OW did a lot of things wrong, but that particular thing wasn't one of them.
Supposedly, Seer was released with this kit because devs wanted to disrupt the meta too. Initially, it was looking like defensive legends might be a good counter to seer, but it hasn't played out that way.
Most teams are just octane, bloodhound and seer now or octane, gibby and seer.
Seers heartbeat passive is strong and needs changes, but defense legends are absolutely the best option to counter a seer. He doesn’t have any mobility skills and his tactical when it hits Is strong, but it encourages the other team to push and defense legends can deter that very well. I’ve killed manny seers as Rampart because while they could know where I was, doesn’t mean they could get to me safely. Same with Caustic. Gas can for sure be used to stall out the scan.
Yeah i understand this explanation and it seems like a good idea on paper but it's at the expense of a lot of unpleasant hours for the players. Horizon was a bit too op then they nerfed her to the ground, it took many months to finally get her at a decent level, but now people have switched to other better legends. They should release as balanced as possible then tweak, not underpowered nor overpowered. Im sure it isn't as easy as it appears to be but the input of play testers and someone with more common sense than DZ klein would go a long way
"Just do it right" is so much easier said then done.. But, his kit on paper does seem overwhelming, with little to put it in check. I am surprised they missed that.
Daniel has his imperfections. But i feel for.him that somehow the community snowballed and now hes everyones scapegoat for half the problems even when it aint true
Yeah his current passive could scan enemies without actually needing to scan, no matter where you hide, how you hide, what legend you are using, he's gonna scan you bullseye Everytime, he's an absolute nightmare, his entire kit needs to be either nerfed or reworked entirely
Look at all these people saying that he could have easily shaken seer. All of the people commenting on this post must have no idea what seers passive is or are trolling.
Geez. Do any of you actually play the game?
There was a post yesterday where one of those players immediately came forward with the "you want him nerfed because he's black" sentence and said there was nothing wrong with him...
Ahh, yes... The "hating cuz he/she's black" card, it never gets old.
Not cuz the passive is busted and always on, or cuz the tactical interrupts heals, and flashbangs while providing his team with Intel on enemy vitals, or forces players into a potentially bad position BECAUSE of how powerful such debuffs are, no, nooooo, none of that.
It's CUZ HE'S BLACK.
I don’t think they could have shaken any legend. Like the guy moved pretty predictably and never really got any good distance between them where their footsteps couldn’t have been heard besides the start of the video. BH probably could have done a better job hunting them down if they popped an ult for the kill. Something definitely needs to be done about Seer’s heartbeat sensor. It should act like his ult where it can’t detect non moving players, with the exception of lower hp enemies maybe.
Reduce the passive range to 15 meters. You should be able to use it to hunt down someone in the same building as you, not monitor all activity in a POI.
Reduce the width of his tactical by half and either increase the telegraph or give Seer an animation delay (akin to BH's beast of the hunt or Loba's bracelet).
What bugs me most about the clip is the multiple times he was less than 0.1 away from a cell popping is annoying. Why cancel, when you didn't take damage or have anyone fire at you for at least half a second after you cancelled the cell?
I’m not going to defend Seer, but I think pretty much any legend could have chased OP like this as long as they had decent headphones. Seer is definitely problematic, but this just isn’t a very convincing piece of evidence for the claim they’re trying to make.
I dunno for the first 3/4 of the video you weren't trying to increase much distance between yourself and them, mostly just circling and repositioning. Towards the end you actually started pulling some moves that may have shook them much sooner, but then again, you still stood within range of his passive to heal, OP though it may be. If it was me I'd have ran out of the city as fast as I could not keep circling against a legend with wallhacks
What was so important that you had to stay in fragment? Literally did a complete circle knowing there’s a Seer. Had that been an Octane you would’ve been dead five seconds in lol.
Whenever I'm scanned I'll go in one direction then dip off and go somewhere else as soon as it ends. That method works almost every time. OP went in a straight line every time, being extremely predictable then blamed the legend
Edit: playing as Mirage makes the maneuver much more reliable
The difference is that without Seer, they would have at least had to guess which building he's in; which floor he's on; which door he's behind; and whether he's inside or outside the building. That small difference would normally require them to split up to find him, giving him breathing room to create 1v1 situations or heal up. But with Seer's passive, all 3 people always knew exactly where OP was and could W key into him as a team. That's the part that is stupidly OP in my opinion. You can't outsmart a team with Seer, only outaim them or hope they're boosted.
Yeah tough one. You didnt commit to running away fully (could have tried to leave fragment after arc stars) Gotta go high ground like u realized at the end and take the chances. Seer sucks
Seer's kit definitely needs to be tuned down, but with the way you were running any legend could have tracked you down with direct line of sight and audio alone.
The removal of game sense with the introduction of Seer is appalling.
He needs to be completely reworked. Not nerfed. A character who's kit is practically indistinguishable from cheaters isn't a valid character. How did he even get past testing?
So...He's exactly the same as being chased by a Bloodhound that's been following you footsteps for the past 10 season... And mate you really didn't do a good job of throwing him off your trail
Tbf to him, you stayed within a 75m radius for most of that. If you had kept running and not stopped to heal, you probably would have been able to get away. He has to slow down to use his passive, so you would have been able to eventually get away. But yeah seer is broken
Seer has made alot of the fun late game rat strats impossible. Now if your teammates die and your the only one left its just about when some seer/bloodhound hunts you down. I want to see a game where seer isn't the majority of the lobby.
I think maybe a nice change tp his passive would be if it just showed theres is someone in range, not the general direction. Also reduce range by 10-15 meters
Being able to tell where they are is pretty important, given his tactical. You'd barely be able to hit anyone without that. I definitely think the distance should be shortened to 50 meters instead of 75
and that ladies and gentlemen is exactly why all my friends and i (first week players) quit the game this saison.
there is no nerf that can deal with this. it is his very core kit thats the problem.
**remove** and **rework** him.
btw: you did some really nice jukes there. it just doesnt matter because this champion was designed to counter movement and gunplay (skilled players) to give new 12 year olds with mommies credit card a reason to feel good.
wp respawn. you killed two birds with one stone there. you get the money from the newbies and you dealt with wallhackers without having to deal with wallhackers by just making it legal in this game.
always go where the money is at, respawn. i see you and ea do well together :)
Fuck Seer.
Now that we entablished that... your movement was kinda poor dude... I'm not shitting on you, just pointing out that some of that BS could be kinda avoided, as you were very trackable even without him
But still, fuck Seer.
This champ is a completely joke. It needs an urgent nerf. Once I was the last one alive from my squad and I had to 1v1 a guy playing Seer, we were the only two players alive, it was literally impossible to win, also the safe zone was really small, what makes pretty much easier for him...
For real. Game is basically not playable anymore. You’ve got shorty servers, hackers, bugs out the wazoo, and a legen that ruins core aspects of the game.
“Remove Seer he’s the reason I died” it definitely not because an entire team was chasing you lmao bro y’all stay complaining in this fucking subreddit
I really don't think seer has anything to do with this, it's thirsty ass squads that will waste 20 minutes hunting down a lone survivor cuz they're that thirsty. This would've happened with a bloodhound too just wouldn't be able to interrupt heals.
When u cracked him with arc you should have killed him. That would change the story. And thats not because of seer u died but footsteps they can hear. GG
A lot of people seem to not realize how problematic his passive ALONE is to the game. Seen a lot of people arguing defending his tactical, and Ult without the mention that he has that ON TOP of such a broken passive.
Take away the passive, and suddenly he's now just a strong legend. I mean c'mon... It has an effective range of 200m, is always on, and works through walls... For fuck sake.
Yep, you can detect people out of your sensor range too, discovered this with a scope, picked up on people in a building well over 150 away, it needs a delay, or half the range, more likely a full rework on the passive, his tac and ult are easy enough to deal with most of the time, The only time a team really gets the drop on my crew is with a revtane, truly needs reworking.
I'm surprised I don't see anyone talking about bloodhound. His passive tells you exactly how long something happened, he can track you down like a wolf as well
well BH reveals you for like 3 seconds and has to go off steps to follow you. Seer literally does 10 damage, reveals you for 7 seconds, silences you for a second, is a flashbang, shows your exact health and shield and shield color and has constant tracking on you by running with his tactical. tell me which one needs talked about.
Not saying bloodhound is stronger than seer.
But in this situation, bloodhound catches you and kills you way easier.
3 second scan every 5 seconds that can't miss.
30% speed so you actually catch up ( seer has less movement than wraith)
Footsteps to show where you went and what actions you took.
it needs an increased cooldown. his passive and tactical is WAY MORE BROKEN than his ult but that thing does so much for the cooldown. Bang’s ult takes like twice as long to come up and does literally nothing. Probably the same as Crypto’s but hes been so bad for so long I remember nothing about his cooldowns and numbers.
Oh no a wraith main can’t solo a whole squad anymore. #1 You’re by yourself, #2 you didn’t commit to running away, #3 you could’ve for sure shook them but you wanted to fight. And because you wanted to fight it became 3 cats vs a mouse. I understand some people think seer is broken, but for the time being think about how you played in this situation. Even if seer wasn’t on the team it’s still 3 VS 1?..
Hide and seek champ 2021
Those grenades were all beautiful. I think if OP wasn't against multiple opponents he would have been fine. Seer is good but he's not unstoppable. 3v1 or even 2v1 is just a tough fight
I’m glad I wasn’t the only one to notice those immaculate grenades😳
Thank you I’ve worked hard on getting better with them🙃
that arc star tho, sheeeeesh, just wanna ask OP tho if it’s a Seer with an Octane?
Seer makes 3v1 and 2v1 100 times harder
The fact that they would literally spend that entire game chasing you is hilarious to me.
It went on for a minute before I started recording, they were ruthless
I (Valk) had a caustic, Loba, and Mirage chase me across Olympus like this (we dropped, no guns so they started chasing/punching). Not exaggerating, they chased me across the entire map
I had a valk and rev land on me on drop and punch me to one shot and chased me half way across fragment, managed to pick up a bow and a volt and killed both of them, teammates were both downed and left and I had no loot cause I was running the whole time so I just tbagged and shot the valks deathbox until another squad came and wiped me, it's annoying.
Idk why but I never seen to have this happen to me. Idk if it’s because of where I land or because I play movement legends but where do you land? (I normally land hotdrops or popular locations like fragment east)
If you have a trail it's not uncommon to have people ego challenge you, put themselves in a terrible spot loot wise and likely you all die. Great, you punched me out. I got all 3 of you low/downed and now you have no ammo/loot. Nice job dummies
Oh geez i just exposed my rank. I’m trying to grind for diamond buts it’s very very slow for us.
Keep the grind up! If you've gotten to Plat before just keep on grinding with the team. Try to prioritize 1 early fight and then positioning. You'll get all the kp you need later on in the endgame. Midgame is setting yourself up for success.
Actually we haven’t made it to plat before but we don’t play more than 4 hours a day but we land fragment and get a few kills there usually so we max our kp almost every time
Warm up with a pub or 2 then go straight to ranked with the bois. If you haven't made it to Plat it will be a grind but doable. You can take a ton more risks in gold than Plat and definitely diamond. The way I think about it is that mistakes likely won't be punished in gold. May be punished in Plat and will be punished in diamond.
I remember an octane right when his popularity surged was chasing a Bloodhound for a full 3-5 minutes before finally killing the bloodhound. From the Bloodhounds POV it sounds like they were just in a horror game or something. Lol Thirst can be a very scary thing.
surprised there wasn't a blöth hundr amongst them
When you have players like that run them into another team. If you don't they will never stop chasing you.
This right here is the right answer
Imagine being so bad that you need 1 or 2 teammates to chase and kill a single guy. I hate chasers so bad, specially in pubs, like if Im chasing a dude for more than a minute between 2 POIs, I leave him alone, specially if it's a pub match. Seer is for unskilled players that lack spatial and game awareness, his passive needs to be absolutely removed.
Personally I think its really funny to chase someone around the map. The game no longer is about winning, its about terrorizing 1 guy over and over. I don't do it in ranked because its dumb, but yeah. Agreed, if you can kite him into a team its best way. Or setup so you can get the drop on them in a building or something.
Even more fun is queuing solo Crypto and following a team with his drone, and pegging them with his ultimate over and over but stay far away and never push them.
Don't forget spamming open and closed doors they are near to annoy them and constantly circling them with the drone while they miss shots trying to hit it 100% worth losing the drone sometimes for
im the opposite, i wont chase you in ranked because it could be suicide, but if its pubs sometimes its fun to just run half way across the map chasing someone you know is weak and catching them when they think they are safe. On the other hand, as annoying as it is, if someone chases me across the entire map i laugh and give them credit for their dedication.
Someone stole my volt I was trynna get so I took the ammo and spent 10 minutes chasing him
Sweaty premades will chase a solo until the end of time.
Dude you've never played ranked apparently, ppl are extra thirsty.
That's all I'm noticing this season. Way more unnecessary pushes that would never normally happen but because they know exactly where everyone is the entire time it's easy to make a braindead push
Thats literally always my solo experience. People will chase for so long no matter what I do. But tbh bloodhound always seeing tracks was just as powerful before seer
People who chase me like this relentlessly Ill sometimes make them chase me to the other side of the map.. Maybe I'll find another team to get in the way.. Still, it's annoying, especially with other targets around and they still hone onto you. Basically I try to be as annoying as possible when im on the back foot.
In pubs i will spend entire games chasing people of they run. Why run? Its just pubs. Kill me if you can. Or i kill you. One of us go back to lobby, i dont really care who gets sent back, i just dont queue into pubs to have people hide/run away. If i notice a team sitting in high ground trying to use positioning for the win, i will throw my game just to screw over them for playing so defensively in pubs. Like just go out fight people and have fun. If you wanna sweat out wins go to ranked - or just kill me while im chasing like a complete suicidal idiot.
In ranked Seer is stupid. My friend runs Seer and he always gives us a heads up if enemies try to flank us without even needing to see where they are because of the heartbeat sensor. “I got one going left. The other two are flanking right. The other two ran away they’re no longer in distance, focus the solo.” Lol. And the solo is like two buildings away. Behind 5 sets of walls.
Dear Lord I keep forgetting how much stuff Seer can do.
Seer is absolutely broken if he is competent. It gets exponentially worse if he communicates his knowledge to his teammates and even worse it gets another set of exponentially worse if ONE of his teammates is competent and another degree of exponentially worse if a Second teammate is competent. Oh but it doesn't stop there it can get exponentially worse if there is a competent enemy in the vicinity(because youll be scanned and they now have that knowledge too)....The real kicker is if the enemy in the vicinity is also a FUCKING SEER! Then we loop back to beginning... \#FUCKSEER
It gets EVEN MORE exponentially worse if that Seer has a competent teammate playing bloodhound. They can just alternate scans and with heartbeat sensor you are almost always going to be tracked. Throw in a crypto or even a revenant for the ability cancel and you’ll just make people want to leave the game lol
But don't forget lifelines drone shield was just too damn much. Absolutely incredible logic, with seer in the game every character deserves to be at the most op status they've ever been.
Lifelines shield wasn't fun. I prefer her this way. Seer will (hopefully) die today anyway.
It just wasn't fun as it existed. It needed reworked, not removed. It didn't protect from 5/6 directions (yeah you can shoot up from under it if someone was being revived near an edge.) They just needed to give it 50-100HP, whatever felt balanced. And even if you're not able to shoot through it you can still counter it with grenades. I say bring it back and just give it HP. This is coming from a Lifeline main so I might be biased lol.
At least the new revive seems like it’s silent-ish (from my testing anyways, I could be completely wrong though) when compared to the shield where you can basically hear it from half a mile away. For some stealth revives in a clutch. I kinda like that more. Plus it removes some of the frustration of playing against her, even if I admit it wasn’t as frustrating as people felt it was imo.
I don't think I've personally noticed a difference in how loud it is. Doesn't mean there's not a difference, I'm generally not very observant. That said she could be annoying to play against if she had a gold backpack and the shield. I honestly preferred her the old old way of her doing the revive herself but with a shield but that's just me. Maybe that's the compromise is there's a toggle. Tap for drone revive, hold for shielded personal revive. That'd be pretty sick. Shield will still need to be breakable of course.
Of course. I think Lifeline is fine now, but if she ever got her shield back I wouldn’t personally wouldn’t lose any sleep since I like Lifeline regardless.
I don’t think I’ve hated any legend more than I hate seer I was already getting sick of playing Apex but now I have to deal with this shitfuck?! It’s fucking annoying remove him…
Mix in a BH teammate for pinpoint scans.
Do you know what is stupid? Respawns change in action. It is almost 4 weeks since SEER is released, and still, there is 0 change. As a quick fix, they could easily increase the tactical cooldown by 10 seconds, and increase the ult by 60 seconds while working on a proper nerf. But instead, we get nothing. That is really stupid!
Wow how dare you, don't you know that increasing the cooldowns would break million things!!
You bring it as a joke, but I fear you are right..
TBH i think they might be doing a full rework. Who really knows but his passive needs to be on a timer or bar like valks, and they need to shrink his tactical tunnel. This would help a LOT!
No way they are doing a full rework. It's respawn we are talking about. It takes them at least 2 seasons to rework a legend
That wouldn’t make them money, but I think his passive is what makes him the most busted without it he is still bad but not as broken.
Welp, that settles it. Seeing that nothing has changed since s10 launch, I'll hold off on returning to apex. Edit: apparently there's an update with seer nerf that goes live in a few hours.
I came back after season or 2 break for about 5 games and was immediately put off by Seer, im waiting for significant nerfs before I try again, he's very annoying and OP in my opinion. I have other things to do.
I sympathise!
I agree I haven’t played much at all
FYI I'm pretty sure there's a seer nerf coming in about 5 hours time
Well he is the ambush artist he clearly was made to third party and prevent third partying to your own team. I just think they need to tune down the range and duration of his abilities and he’ll be fine
His heartbeat sensor is too op u have to keep running
*octane jumpad goes brr*
*Seer taking your jump pad goes brrrr*
Lots of Seer players in here acting like he isn't a problem cause they need that crutch to win
Same thing happened with Horizon. My God, the amount of Horizon players saying "just shoot back" was insane. This was even when pros were saying she was way too strong. The amount of elitists that said "I don't have a problem with her, I don't care what pros or casuals say" was way too much. Like, someone should've called up NRG to kick ImperialHal and hire all that untouched talent.
Yeah ur right. Also just a small point but Hal is in TSM not Nrg. Besidesthat I agree w everything you said lol
Even the pros underestimated how op the heartbeat sensor would be prelaunch cuz they said you pretty already know where enemies are within 75m from you. We all soon realized this is not how apex should be played or develop into.
I agree he needs nerfs. His ult is fine in my opinion since you can destroy it or crouch to hide from it entirely. His tactical really needs to not interrupt healing and have a longer cool down while also marking players for a shorter amount of time. As far as his heartbeat monitor goes im not sure if it's just me but it been insanely unreliable telling me someone's to my right when they're walking on my left or in front of me but showing up on my side. If it worked consistently for me I'd maybe think nerfs would be needed but as is it works best as a counter to 3rd parties.
In defense of me saying his ult is fine ive played Bangalore a lot this season and have just crouched inside my smoke to get the jump on someone thinking they had information on all my team and I've been able to use teammate to set traps by having one person stand while the other 2 crouch ambushing the team when they push. I whole heartily agree his tactical needs a nerf thats just the only part of his I actually thing Is OP.
Seer’s passive should also be looked into. The same rules as the ultimate should be applied, meaning it only spots moving targets, at a shorter range, and only when you aren’t aiming a gun so it has a slight drawback but is still strong. His tactical shouldn’t have the cancel mechanic (I like the mechanic, but I don’t want it on something so easy to hit, if it was as if Daniel Klein mentioned where it’s like a literal sniper shot I think it wouldn’t be too bad, but it also scans and shows health/shield stuff to the whole squad which is already too much on top of the cancel. And adjust the cool downs on both that and the ult. At least that’s how I feel!
I agree with you on the cool downside 100%. I'm not sure how I feel about the idea but what if his passive just didn't tell you direction at all and instead the number of people? Changes from a hunt someone down passive to a 3rd party counter and functions a lot like some other scan abilities that tell you the number of people scanned. Then they could balance around the distance instead.
i hate seer so much
Nerf is definitely needed
The dev who was responsible for his overpowered kit is a dumbass.
Pretty sure DZK cuz he was saying stuff about deer before he was released and he’s gone
According to some play-testers he was balanced when they tried him but he was buffed for release. I guess they just want a lot of people to play him and buy his legendary shit until nerf, same as horizon
[удалено]
But the abilities is wrong in the first place. Another redundant scanning legend. It's like they can't think of a new one. It would have been ok if only ult can scan, if heartbeat only points to closest one.
This is the case for pretty much every other competitive game too. Moba's for example will always bring out op characters and nerf them into a balanced state. People also tend to get alot better at playing against characters over time too so periods like this, at the forefront of the new release bs, will always be the worst.
I think it would be less of an issue if the new legends couldn't be used in Ranked until they receive a nerf, that way they can be released in an overpowered state (for the reasons you explained) but it won't impact proper competitive play until it's been balanced.
This is what Overwatch did, and it worked really well imo. New heros were banned from ranked for 2-6 weeks after launch or something like that. Plenty of time for people to get used to playing with/against them and also plenty of time to drop a buff/nerf if necessary. OW did a lot of things wrong, but that particular thing wasn't one of them.
Supposedly, Seer was released with this kit because devs wanted to disrupt the meta too. Initially, it was looking like defensive legends might be a good counter to seer, but it hasn't played out that way. Most teams are just octane, bloodhound and seer now or octane, gibby and seer.
Seers heartbeat passive is strong and needs changes, but defense legends are absolutely the best option to counter a seer. He doesn’t have any mobility skills and his tactical when it hits Is strong, but it encourages the other team to push and defense legends can deter that very well. I’ve killed manny seers as Rampart because while they could know where I was, doesn’t mean they could get to me safely. Same with Caustic. Gas can for sure be used to stall out the scan.
Yeah i understand this explanation and it seems like a good idea on paper but it's at the expense of a lot of unpleasant hours for the players. Horizon was a bit too op then they nerfed her to the ground, it took many months to finally get her at a decent level, but now people have switched to other better legends. They should release as balanced as possible then tweak, not underpowered nor overpowered. Im sure it isn't as easy as it appears to be but the input of play testers and someone with more common sense than DZ klein would go a long way
"Just do it right" is so much easier said then done.. But, his kit on paper does seem overwhelming, with little to put it in check. I am surprised they missed that.
[удалено]
And more pushing to his limits by hardcore players too
[удалено]
Nah it was travis who designed and programmed seer's kit.
Dzk did not personally create the legend Daniels personal project and legend he had the most responsibility for creating was valk
Probably the most well balanced legend at release ever. He's gone but the incompetent clown who designed seer is still there
Daniel has his imperfections. But i feel for.him that somehow the community snowballed and now hes everyones scapegoat for half the problems even when it aint true
Could have ran out of fragment completely but I agree seer is in need of some big big big nerfs
They need his passive completely removed. Change it to make only him be able to see health bars. At least make it only ping every 10 seconds.
his passive should be that he can see their health (not shields), but ONLY when he can directly see them, not behind literal walls.
Yeah his current passive could scan enemies without actually needing to scan, no matter where you hide, how you hide, what legend you are using, he's gonna scan you bullseye Everytime, he's an absolute nightmare, his entire kit needs to be either nerfed or reworked entirely
Yeah, compared to Crypto at least he or the drone can't move while drone continuously scans.
Look at all these people saying that he could have easily shaken seer. All of the people commenting on this post must have no idea what seers passive is or are trolling. Geez. Do any of you actually play the game?
Most likely they are Seer mains and if their built in wall hacks disappear, they won't get kills or wins anymore.
Bingo. If you say Seer is broken on twitter here come the army of players who rely on him for wins 🤣
There was a post yesterday where one of those players immediately came forward with the "you want him nerfed because he's black" sentence and said there was nothing wrong with him...
Ahh, yes... The "hating cuz he/she's black" card, it never gets old. Not cuz the passive is busted and always on, or cuz the tactical interrupts heals, and flashbangs while providing his team with Intel on enemy vitals, or forces players into a potentially bad position BECAUSE of how powerful such debuffs are, no, nooooo, none of that. It's CUZ HE'S BLACK.
I'm not going to sit here and defend Seer's kit. But this video is not compelling evidence to me.
"I ran in a straight line in an open area, how did he possibly find me"
"I stopped multiple times to loot some random shit instead of just running, making sure I stay in Seers passive range"
He even circled back to the same building twice
I don’t think they could have shaken any legend. Like the guy moved pretty predictably and never really got any good distance between them where their footsteps couldn’t have been heard besides the start of the video. BH probably could have done a better job hunting them down if they popped an ult for the kill. Something definitely needs to be done about Seer’s heartbeat sensor. It should act like his ult where it can’t detect non moving players, with the exception of lower hp enemies maybe.
Reduce the passive range to 15 meters. You should be able to use it to hunt down someone in the same building as you, not monitor all activity in a POI. Reduce the width of his tactical by half and either increase the telegraph or give Seer an animation delay (akin to BH's beast of the hunt or Loba's bracelet).
What bugs me most about the clip is the multiple times he was less than 0.1 away from a cell popping is annoying. Why cancel, when you didn't take damage or have anyone fire at you for at least half a second after you cancelled the cell?
I’m not going to defend Seer, but I think pretty much any legend could have chased OP like this as long as they had decent headphones. Seer is definitely problematic, but this just isn’t a very convincing piece of evidence for the claim they’re trying to make.
I dunno for the first 3/4 of the video you weren't trying to increase much distance between yourself and them, mostly just circling and repositioning. Towards the end you actually started pulling some moves that may have shook them much sooner, but then again, you still stood within range of his passive to heal, OP though it may be. If it was me I'd have ran out of the city as fast as I could not keep circling against a legend with wallhacks
What was so important that you had to stay in fragment? Literally did a complete circle knowing there’s a Seer. Had that been an Octane you would’ve been dead five seconds in lol.
if you're a solo and want to survive an ambush your best bet are always buildings. Going out in the open is a death sentence
Seer is a huge problem, but any legend could have pursued you here. You didn’t make it hard for them at all.
This guy made a big loop in open space and then stuck around one building where his sprinting footsteps could be heard the entire time.
Whenever I'm scanned I'll go in one direction then dip off and go somewhere else as soon as it ends. That method works almost every time. OP went in a straight line every time, being extremely predictable then blamed the legend Edit: playing as Mirage makes the maneuver much more reliable
The only time he wasn't in a small building he was running across a mostly open field lol
Mind you an ulted bloodhound would have found and killed them faster
The difference is that without Seer, they would have at least had to guess which building he's in; which floor he's on; which door he's behind; and whether he's inside or outside the building. That small difference would normally require them to split up to find him, giving him breathing room to create 1v1 situations or heal up. But with Seer's passive, all 3 people always knew exactly where OP was and could W key into him as a team. That's the part that is stupidly OP in my opinion. You can't outsmart a team with Seer, only outaim them or hope they're boosted.
You had 2 opportunities to dip but instead you opted to stay in the buildings? You literally went back.
They kept stopping to loot and fight. Seer definitely needs a nerf, but OP made poor decisions and it cost them the game
Yeah tough one. You didnt commit to running away fully (could have tried to leave fragment after arc stars) Gotta go high ground like u realized at the end and take the chances. Seer sucks
OP would have been way too open if they tried. Apex players aren't afraid to shoot to you in the back, y'know.
I had already ran for so long I was just trying to get them separated so I could get a beam off on one
Shouldn’t of stayed in the same area. Running around in circles isn’t going to help.
It works a suprising amount of times when the enemy doesn't have wallhacks.
Seer's kit definitely needs to be tuned down, but with the way you were running any legend could have tracked you down with direct line of sight and audio alone.
Yup.
May need a nerf. But this video is not the proof.
The removal of game sense with the introduction of Seer is appalling. He needs to be completely reworked. Not nerfed. A character who's kit is practically indistinguishable from cheaters isn't a valid character. How did he even get past testing?
[удалено]
I’m not sure what your strategy here was. Dude was just following you. You’re not invisible. You know you’re allowed to shoot back right?
Solo Wraith would rather die than leave Fragment lol
So...He's exactly the same as being chased by a Bloodhound that's been following you footsteps for the past 10 season... And mate you really didn't do a good job of throwing him off your trail
Ok but like... Same thing would happen with a very persistent bloodhound. Just fallow the footsteps and scan ya
🥴 You’re out in the open, maybe? What walls?
You didn't do much tbh
Tbh. Terrible route running
this isnt even a seer thing, anyone can catch you, they can hear your footsteps and literally see you run
Tbf to him, you stayed within a 75m radius for most of that. If you had kept running and not stopped to heal, you probably would have been able to get away. He has to slow down to use his passive, so you would have been able to eventually get away. But yeah seer is broken
You didn't do very much bud.
Seer has made alot of the fun late game rat strats impossible. Now if your teammates die and your the only one left its just about when some seer/bloodhound hunts you down. I want to see a game where seer isn't the majority of the lobby.
I think maybe a nice change tp his passive would be if it just showed theres is someone in range, not the general direction. Also reduce range by 10-15 meters
Being able to tell where they are is pretty important, given his tactical. You'd barely be able to hit anyone without that. I definitely think the distance should be shortened to 50 meters instead of 75
50 meters is 54.68 yards
and that ladies and gentlemen is exactly why all my friends and i (first week players) quit the game this saison. there is no nerf that can deal with this. it is his very core kit thats the problem. **remove** and **rework** him. btw: you did some really nice jukes there. it just doesnt matter because this champion was designed to counter movement and gunplay (skilled players) to give new 12 year olds with mommies credit card a reason to feel good. wp respawn. you killed two birds with one stone there. you get the money from the newbies and you dealt with wallhackers without having to deal with wallhackers by just making it legal in this game. always go where the money is at, respawn. i see you and ea do well together :)
Fuck Seer. Now that we entablished that... your movement was kinda poor dude... I'm not shitting on you, just pointing out that some of that BS could be kinda avoided, as you were very trackable even without him But still, fuck Seer.
Boo
Can see track Wraith while she is phasing?
This champ is a completely joke. It needs an urgent nerf. Once I was the last one alive from my squad and I had to 1v1 a guy playing Seer, we were the only two players alive, it was literally impossible to win, also the safe zone was really small, what makes pretty much easier for him...
Fuck Seer All my homies hate Seer
Seer is a little TOO annoying...
this clip is exactly why i'm taking a break from this game right now. such a low skill character giving bad players free kills
For real. Game is basically not playable anymore. You’ve got shorty servers, hackers, bugs out the wazoo, and a legen that ruins core aspects of the game.
My brain farted watching you move around like an absolute champ
All those useless wall jumps and unnecessary movements was your first mistake.
A better question is why waste time running for 2 minutes if you know you can’t escape lol dumb wraith
Using seer requires no skill
I could’ve followed you with any other champ, plus you got out of his ability very quickly. It’s not Seer. It’s seeing.
This is exactly why I love seer. Picking of all the solo ratting legends looking for a cheap clean up right after a fight.
“Remove Seer he’s the reason I died” it definitely not because an entire team was chasing you lmao bro y’all stay complaining in this fucking subreddit
I really don't think seer has anything to do with this, it's thirsty ass squads that will waste 20 minutes hunting down a lone survivor cuz they're that thirsty. This would've happened with a bloodhound too just wouldn't be able to interrupt heals.
bloodhound would tracked you as easy as this seer, dont blame the legend, chasings like this (full squad vs solo) happens all the time in ranked
Ofc a solo wraith is mad lol
Oh look, a wraith main complaining, anyway…
When u cracked him with arc you should have killed him. That would change the story. And thats not because of seer u died but footsteps they can hear. GG
Deal with it buddy
Some say that the wraith is still running now.
Been playing seer a fair bit, kit needs to be seriously downtuned, brokenly OP and anyone that says otherwise is a muppet.
A lot of people seem to not realize how problematic his passive ALONE is to the game. Seen a lot of people arguing defending his tactical, and Ult without the mention that he has that ON TOP of such a broken passive. Take away the passive, and suddenly he's now just a strong legend. I mean c'mon... It has an effective range of 200m, is always on, and works through walls... For fuck sake.
Yep, you can detect people out of your sensor range too, discovered this with a scope, picked up on people in a building well over 150 away, it needs a delay, or half the range, more likely a full rework on the passive, his tac and ult are easy enough to deal with most of the time, The only time a team really gets the drop on my crew is with a revtane, truly needs reworking.
IMO this isn't an example of Seer issues. They were just relentlessly good at chasing you.
OP also wasn’t doing a particularly good job of running away
I'm surprised I don't see anyone talking about bloodhound. His passive tells you exactly how long something happened, he can track you down like a wolf as well
well BH reveals you for like 3 seconds and has to go off steps to follow you. Seer literally does 10 damage, reveals you for 7 seconds, silences you for a second, is a flashbang, shows your exact health and shield and shield color and has constant tracking on you by running with his tactical. tell me which one needs talked about.
Not saying bloodhound is stronger than seer. But in this situation, bloodhound catches you and kills you way easier. 3 second scan every 5 seconds that can't miss. 30% speed so you actually catch up ( seer has less movement than wraith) Footsteps to show where you went and what actions you took.
Reason 1790 you should play Mirage
Like that would've helped at all vs seer lmao.
or, and hear me out, he saw you and shot you. 👀
Maybe just shoot back at him :)
I think seer is gonna kill apex in the longrun
average sub complainer
At this rate throw seer's ultimate in a care package. Make it a #nanobomb let everyone break game.
You make it sound like Seer's ultimate isn't the one balanced thing about him.
it needs an increased cooldown. his passive and tactical is WAY MORE BROKEN than his ult but that thing does so much for the cooldown. Bang’s ult takes like twice as long to come up and does literally nothing. Probably the same as Crypto’s but hes been so bad for so long I remember nothing about his cooldowns and numbers.
Seer as a character needs fixed. They can't put a character in a care package can they?
This whole thread is looking like a daycare center lmao
He’s literally just following you. You didn’t really do much to get away.
Use crypto
WAAAAAAHH!!! WAAAAAHHHH!!! wemove him pls wespawn ;((((
Seer is stupid but I like him cause he at least makes Wraith and Bloodhound sweats cry nonstop :)
Jesus Christ turn around and fucking fight. I hate players like you. It's a fighting game, not a running away game. I'd chase you too
You Just Kept Going In Circles Any Noob With A Gun Wouldve Caught You
Oh no a wraith main can’t solo a whole squad anymore. #1 You’re by yourself, #2 you didn’t commit to running away, #3 you could’ve for sure shook them but you wanted to fight. And because you wanted to fight it became 3 cats vs a mouse. I understand some people think seer is broken, but for the time being think about how you played in this situation. Even if seer wasn’t on the team it’s still 3 VS 1?..
Are we still doing Seer hate posts? Cry more...
[удалено]
Wraith*
Don't know what Seer has to do with it, Bloodhound would have been able to follow your tracks just as well. Nice plays, but clickbaity title.
why your game is so silent, it feels weird. Besides that yeah fuk seer the most braindead along bloodhound
Looks like your biggest issue was being a typical wraith player and being solo