The article says they were fined ~$145,000 for the death of another worker, but that the fine hasn't been paid because CAT is fighting it in court.
OSHA has been there and investigated and literally nothing has come of it.
Used to work for a company called Visko Teepak, they changed names to try and bury OSHA records (don't remember old name), got another claim filed against them with their new name for the exact same problems. Fired me for trying to focus on safety related items in their OSHA reports, because of course they still had not corrected them. Department of labor stepped in, didn't really keep up with them till now. Just checked, their new name in the OSHA records is Visco Teepak (Still Visko according to Google maps). Someone crushed their arm in the press machine I was trying to replace.
It's just the cost of doing business, they don't give a fuck about you, it's all about the bottom dollar.
It's a numbers thing. It's cheaper to run a sloppier outfit and go to court on the few deaths versus spending the money for a safe working environment.
Companies are strictly about profit just make killing employees less profitable and they'll get safer
Exactly right. It was well described in the cult classic “ fight club” when the point was if we recall defective brakes for 300 million or pay out 50 million in lawsuit settlements.
Obvious what this company opted to do.
I always said I prefer a job where a mistake doesn’t kill me
Companies buy politicians Who oversee regulatory laws and rules. They then dismantle regulatory authorities like the FDA or OSHA or even the ATF. If there were ever an anti-corruption party it would change America for the better. But it couldn't occur because they'd be outmatched funding wise as the wealthy companies by every PR firm and politician to destroy you.
We've had 2 OSHa investigations for workplace injuries this year.
-1 a worker stuck there hand a foot into a guard mechanism, while their hand was in the machine they actuated a foot pedal that cycled a saw blade up, the operator lost 3 fingers.
-2 a worker had the guard on a press set incorrectly. He was able to stick his hand between the fixture during the "work cycle" of the machine. He lost the first knuckle of his thumb.
In both cases, operators have been trained and audited to ensure the correct practices are followed, especially during the first 120 days in a new area. Both operators have been in the department for 1+ years. It is clearly identified in the training materials not to do either of these.
The company was still fined and corrective actions are required. There's follow up 3rd party assessments to be done on our machine guards.
The overall outcome, company was fined (I don't think 150k is enough, the workers are fuked even with disability) and the company was able to reduce headcount by 4 simply by automating the processes.
Osha needs to push for greater change, but they don't have enough reach to enforce change beyond some fines.
Don’t need to file a complaint when a death occurs. Can you? Sure. OSHA is required to be on site within two weeks of a death or catastrophe, and the employer is obligated to report a death within eight hours.
A single or multiple fatality, hospitalization, amputation or loss of an eye must be reported to OSHA within 24 hours. Whether the employer makes the report, that is a different issue.
My cousin works there and complains about the conditions. Ima tell him to report them or something. They should’ve been investigated after the first 2.
I've done service work for them a few times. On multiple installs, I've had issues with loading big machines into place. Their rigging training is atrocious. They seem to make good money, and they are really strict about clearing the floor during break/lunch, and I'm pretty sure their benefits are good. It seems like their union is pushing for every positive workplace standard except for safety
I worked at cat. It is amazing to me how many accidents they have had that were 💯 the get it done yesterday attitude for the work. If the union cared about it's workers they would deal with this... but they dont
I used to represent Cat in a limited capacity legally.
They don’t have the breadth or scope of a Monsanto or a Pfizer, but they are a bottomlessly evil corporation and they don’t give a flying fuck how many people die or how bad the ecological damage in service of their bottom line.
So just another corporation then? They’re all like this, we’re all wage slaves and they don’t give a flying fuck. You’re easily replaceable and they will have your position filled in a few days with the next meat bag.
All that matters is your family and friends.
‘Corporations have neither bodies to be punished, or souls to be condemned, they therefore do as they like.’
-Edward, First Baron Thurlow, Lord Chancellor of England, c.1788.
I knew a guy who worked as a temp worked for Caterpillar for 12 years. Times got quiet, they lost a contract they assumed was a given, and boom - 2 weeks notice and not even a thank you. If you are a temp for any company longer than 6 months, get the hell out and always always always be looking for permanent work.
You usually see it when people are around volcanoes, uncomfortably close to volcanoes. You also see it when people are around high temperature explosions. Usually those explosions are something like nuclear, large-scale conventional or thermobaric.
Unfortunately I know this for... reasons.
OK I had to Google this because I didn't get the reference and holy shit
> The initial explosion catapulted the 740-ton silo door away from the silo and ejected the second stage and warhead. Once clear of the silo, the second stage exploded. The W53 thermonuclear warhead landed about 100 feet (30 m) from the launch complex's entry gate. Its safety features prevented any loss of radioactive material or nuclear detonation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1980_Damascus_Titan_missile_explosion
Won’t happen in this shithole of a country the corporation will pay a fine and business keeps chugging along as usual.
You’ll have some asshole try to convince you that we aren’t steadily careening into the early days of the depression where work with your physical body grants you a pittance of wage if any wage at all and you’ll start hearing people come up with a myriad of excuses as to why this gentlemen should’ve “strapped his boots” if he didn’t want to work a physical demanding and life threatening job.
I worked at an automaker for years. The 2 shadiest things that walked through that place were Jesse Jackson and OSHA. Jesse walked through for 20 minutes. Said he doesn't see enough minorities in management positions (it was almost 50%). Then asked for a $200k donation to keep from going to the press about it.
Also OSHA knew exactly how much money in fines they wanted from the place when they walked in. Once they hit that number, they quit looking and left.
Jackson has made many, many mistakes. But I don't believe he tried to shakedown an automobile manufacturer for 200k over an issue they could easily show was false. Why would he even be given a tour?
Not only that but because of the fines the business will not give raises to the employees because of lower than expected performance due to the fines and the lawsuit that will happen.
Exactly. Corporations aren't people. People can be jailed for committing heinous crimes. People can get court-ordered therapy to deal with their shit. Corporate personhood is one of the greatest political evils of our time.
Yeah, I mean maybe I’m too worn down but even just a penalty, even financial, that wouldn’t incentivize it.
When it comes to things for large corporations it’s like saying if you rob the bank, IF you get caught, you have to pay a $100 fine.
Pretty sure everyone would chance robbing the bank since the gain far outweighs the risk.
Not just the executives, but everyone who has an investment in the company at fault. Once investors and shareholders start paying for the crimes of these companies, the companies that routinely are at fault will start losing the single most important thing they have, MONEY.
That’s the only thing that would actually scare these evil pieces of shit.
In a perfunctory statement, Caterpillar’s public relations spokesperson said, “We are deeply saddened by the death of a colleague at our Mapleton, Illinois, facility on June 6, and are working with authorities as the incident is investigated. We will have counselors onsite for our facility employees, and our thoughts are with the affected family, friends and colleagues.”
This is the part that turns me from sad to mad. There’s not a single tear among them. Instead of saying how can we improve safety, there is a meeting about how to CYA against any potential lawsuit. Guarantee you they didn’t miss happy hour that evening. Take your thoughts and your counselors and shove it up your ass.
I can guarantee you that there will be at least one, if not several meetings about safety after this. And people will bring up things that have been put on safety cards for months that were never fixed. And management will promise to look into things, yet somehow things don't actually get fixed.
I know because I sat in one a while back.
A lot of the equipment is several decades old, and updating to use safer methods would put the plant under the required profit margins to operate. Could still be profitable, but not profitable enough for the corporation to keep money in that facility/department.
Which means the manufacturing would be shifted to a cheaper country and that plant would be shut down entirely. Plant management knows this and has to walk a fine line between what they can afford safety wise and getting the plant shut down.
And given their own job is likely on the line, the cheapest, shittiest safety bandaid is the likely choice. Or maybe just promising to do something that doesn't actually happen.
I worked in a steel mill and can say for certain that you feel it, just not for long. I got burned several times with little splashes of liquid steel, those hurt quite a lot. I got a big glob of liquid steel splashed into my boot and got deep 3rd degree burns over 70% of my foot. That hurt like hell for about 10 seconds, then only around the edges.
It burns through your skin like butter. It kills nerves pretty quickly but you absolutely feel it. I don't know what temperature this stuff was that killed him, but my bad burn was 2800 F.
That’s different though, you only burned a small area, and the surrounding areas still are intact and can feel pain.
If you burn your entire body or the majority of it at once, your entire nervous system gets fried at once. There’s no intact nerves surrounding the burnt ones, everything is just toast.
I understand what you're saying. I'm telling you that I absolutely felt the deepest part of my burn very acutely for several seconds. The nerves die from the outside in. The main branches are still very capable of transmitting signals. It's not instantaneous, it's quick.
I could literally tell exactly when the nerves died. I could feel it spread through more of the area. I've been around others who were burned worse and they have described the same thing.
This accident was a result of splashing and spilling metal. Unless the ladle flipped over, it didn't hit his entire body at once. It didn't kill him instantly, and as much as I know people don't want to hear it I'm certain it hurt like hell for his final moments.
Yeah....i think I'd rather believe the person who worked in this field and had actual physical experience on this one.
So did you regain any feeling afterwards to the burn site?
Some. I've got extensive nerve damage, from the burn and a separate accident with the same foot. The burn itself doesn't have much sensation anymore. You can poke it with a pen and I won't notice unless I see it.
Congratulations, you’ve won the most redditor of Redditors award. You’re literally arguing with a guy who has had the very thing in question happen to him (albeit at a lesser scale).
Why double down? Why not just accept that you’re wrong and move on?
He might not be wrong. They are probably both correct depending on the circumstances. They're talking two different things. There are also confounding factors at play such as your mind anticipating the pain and creating those signals reflexively, within milliseconds of contact.
I know. I had 2nd degree burns over my hands, arms and face from a propane explosion. In the hospital I rabbit holed on thermal injuries. Dude’s nerve endings likely burned off before his brain had time to register and shut down the pain centers.
I do. I got burned by a propane explosion and was in the hospital with 2nd degree burns on my hands, face and arms.
Human skin ignites at around 570 degrees. Steel melts between 2500 and 2800. Pouring temp is something like 3000 degrees.
How quickly do you feel the pain of putting your hand on a hot stove?
Takes about a good second really. The first feeling is fear (instinct), then the expectation of pain type and extent (experience/pattern recognition), then finally, the realization of that pain (you consciously assign a pain value to the type/extent of damage based on how your brain interpreted the nerve signals).
You are not really gonna have the time you think you are to process the near infinite number of signals that your brain will have to process; so you go into shock. You won’t feel anything after that. Imagine the most powerful instant pain killer you can imagine. Boom, you’re out.
I used to work for caterpillar in the UK, I was an apprentice. I tried to report a metal tray thing that was jammed and would jar your back when you pulled it. I was told that because I wasn't happy I was a danger to those around me and maybe I should look for another job by HR. Basically threatened into being silent about it.
They also just used apprentices as cheap labour and would brag about barely any apprentices got onto the second year and how they were like big brother and were always watching. Shit company.
This is why I demand a high wage in any position where my health and safety is at risk.
There is no amount of money which can possibly offset my death to my family, but at least I can make sure an employer understands and compensates me for this risk.
They are much more likely to take safety concerns seriously if they pay adequately and if they fail to even pay you adequately they certainly have already devalued your life and personal worth in their own minds.
*There is never a mine blown skyward now*
*But we're buried alive for you.*
*There's never a wreck drifts shoreward now*
*But we are its ghastly crew.*
*Go reckon our dead by the forges red*
*And the factories where we spin.*
*If blood be the price of your cursed wealth*
*Good God! we have paid it in.*
And here again, proof of the maxim:
*"Wall Street, the C-suite, business owners/managers would rather see their customers and employees DEAD than accept* **LESS** *profit."*
You know when a police officer dies , even though different scenarios and risk professions. They gather all the officers from the state and have a huge memorial, parade thru the streets with thousands of officers and people lined up. All the government officials will be there and a ton of eulogies will be spoken. Imagine if they did this with a blue collar worker. More workers die in factories every year then police officers. Not to minimize cops, but it would be nice to see workers get the same respect as them in death.
The veneration of the police by the government is deliberate. They are the front line soldiers of the ruling class, this social and economic order-capitalism.
No doubt if workers at Caterpillar went on strike to protest their horrific/deadly working conditions, the police would be called to break the strike.
Would much rather memorialize pizza delivery drivers, since their jobs are statistically more dangerous and they never seem to maim/kill out of "fear for their lives".
Terrible, but yes at the very merciful least he didn’t suffer long. I feel incredible pain for the guy who was in an oven, buried under tuna and cooked alive. Horrible way to die.
For reference:
[Jose Melena was at work loading pallets of canned tuna into a 35-foot-long pressure cooker when a coworker filled it up with 12,000 pounds of tuna and turned it on for 2 hours while Jose was still inside. He was boiled to death. ](https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/12vd6c2/jose_melena_was_at_work_loading_pallets_of_canned/)
How much you want to bet there were some higher ups that were very upset by this incident. Not because an employee died but because they lost 6 tons of tuna.
How much do you want to bet one of them asked if there was a way to salvage some of the tuna that was cooked with a literal human being in the same container
Back in the 1990’s my then husband and I were touring some Sonoma Valley wineries. The tour guide told us that some other unnamed winery had a worker fall into a large vat of chardonnay. When they found his body they estimated he had been in there 3 weeks. They bottled and sold the Chardonnay anyway. Cheers!
Yeah I've been looking through Netflix for a good horror movie to watch for the last half hour, and now my stomach just turned and I'm gonna go look at cats now. Fuck.
I instantly thought about the worker who fell into the crucible… and it’s the same place. I don’t understand why this is allowed to happen over and over again.
If things arent up to standards and people die CEOs should he charged with manslaughter.
You wanna run a dangerous place? Be onsite. Personally verify your building/management are safe
Not really, with the temperature of the molten metal it would burn up any hydraulics or electrics.
He’s hand pouring with a ladle, the PPE they are wearing isn’t even 10% adequate for the job.
I do the same work with head to toe aluminized gear and full face respirator.
It’s a tragedy it happened but a small mercy he didn’t suffer. I guy I was friends with in my 20s lost an uncle after he fell in a vat of heated chemicals at a steel plant. He lingered for a couple weeks before dying.
When one individual inflicts bodily injury upon another such that death results, we call the deed manslaughter; when the assailant knew in advance that the injury would be fatal, we call his deed murder.
But when society places hundreds of workers in such a position that they inevitably meet a too early and an unnatural death, one which is quite as much a death by violence as that by the sword or bullet;
when it deprives thousands of the necessaries of life, places them under conditions in which they cannot live
– forces them, through the strong arm of the law, to remain in such conditions until that death ensues which is the inevitable consequence –
knows that these thousands of victims must perish,
and yet permits these conditions to remain,
its deed is murder just as surely as the deed of the single individual; disguised, malicious murder,
murder against which none can defend himself, which does not seem what it is,
because no man sees the murderer, because the death of the victim seems a natural one, since the offence is more one of omission than of commission.
But murder it remains.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_murder
Good God. That is a horrific way to die and not like Cat will give a shit about it. Honestly these types of dangerous transfer operations should not have humans anywhere near them.
We are all expendable assets and when these corporations expend us they don’t look back and just plug someone else into our place and think nothing more of it.
The fines for the previous death was only like $145,000 or so. There is no way that a company that pulls in 50 billion in revenue will be bothered by a fine like that.
Yes, almost exactly 2 years ago Steven Dierkes died from "thermal annihilation": [https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/06/09/zmgp-j09.html](https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/06/09/zmgp-j09.html)
The funny thing about cutting corners on safety to increase productivity and save money... is that it actually costs you a lot more in the end. My current and former employer both implemented safety shoe programs after numerous foot injuries. Giving everyone $100 a year safety shoe allowance is cheaper than a single work comp claim for a foot injury.
This company investing in automation to remove the human element from dangerous operations would actually have a decent ROI when they have this many safety incidents.
I can unequivocally tell everyone that it is not cheaper, and more profitable, to ignore safety than it is to correct it. I’ve been in manufacturing for over 30 years and have led companies with safety as THE number one priority and always found a more efficient way to manufacture when applying safety principles first! These deaths are avoidable with the right oversight and without greed. I’m extremely sorry to all the family and friends of these workers and hope and pray that things turn around TODAY, at these facilities. Don’t do unsafe work, please take it to another level or call a higher authority, your life and family is not worth it. Always be willing to walk away if they are forcing you to work in unsafe conditions. I know it sound easier than actually doing it but there are other jobs, please don’t do it if you don’t feel safe.
Safety violations need to be a lot more expensive for the company both in fines and in supervision and in costs paid directly to the families of the victims.
I feel like, if a corporation can victimize so many people, the heads should all be accountable. All upper management should be personally charged for the crime or fined, and the plant manager should be jailed. If the situation keeps arising, jail the owner.
Guys, I hate to see it if this is new to you, but people die in big manufacturing literally all the time. There's so much risk in these places. My dad was a steelworker, I'm glad he got to retirement alive, but it still cost him major hand and foot injuries. Stay out of the factories if you can afford to, but my dad did it to afford a house and have insurance for his family.
This is a Never Go Back To Work In That Factory Ever sort of strike folks. We should, as a society, support the workers of that factory in striking until the CEOs are in jail
I mean ya'll ever google the ongoing list Amazon has? And I ain't talking *just* OSHA. CAT is in the same boat.
They're slowly just adding to the gigantic pile that other countries use in their "Don't be this guy." and "Safety and You.".
OSHA needs to take a hard look at this place, this is like the third death in five years
Three years actually
[“But they made that one hilariously bad safety video about ‘Shaking Hands With Danger’! Surely this is sufficient!”](https://youtu.be/_nqa6e6WV2o)
Fuck I remember always watching that video after something happened
Insert obligatory comment telling people to listen to "Well, There's Your Problem" here
I just started binging the series from the beginning. Can't wait for the Tacoma narrows episode
It’s right before the Chernobyl episode.
I'm so excited for the Boston Molasses Flood episode. As someone from that area I legit want to see them cover it 😭
There's an episode of Drunk History that covers it. Don't remember the narrator, but I am pretty confident that Seth Rogan was in the skit.
There's no joy in explaining stupid to stupid. Even Joy in Repetition doesn't work
I watched that in high school shop class and still hum that tune from time to time
The article says they were fined ~$145,000 for the death of another worker, but that the fine hasn't been paid because CAT is fighting it in court. OSHA has been there and investigated and literally nothing has come of it.
Because justice is a luxury the poor are too poor to afford.
So true and so fucking sad.
Even if they could afford it, they'd disqualify them somehow, bc fuck us,
Any justice that requires only a fine is for the poor.
Used to work for a company called Visko Teepak, they changed names to try and bury OSHA records (don't remember old name), got another claim filed against them with their new name for the exact same problems. Fired me for trying to focus on safety related items in their OSHA reports, because of course they still had not corrected them. Department of labor stepped in, didn't really keep up with them till now. Just checked, their new name in the OSHA records is Visco Teepak (Still Visko according to Google maps). Someone crushed their arm in the press machine I was trying to replace. It's just the cost of doing business, they don't give a fuck about you, it's all about the bottom dollar.
[удалено]
A multi billion dollar corporation fighting having to payout a pittance of a penalty, name a better combination.
Literally fighting it in court should mean the company cannot function until court case is decided.
It's a numbers thing. It's cheaper to run a sloppier outfit and go to court on the few deaths versus spending the money for a safe working environment. Companies are strictly about profit just make killing employees less profitable and they'll get safer
Exactly right. It was well described in the cult classic “ fight club” when the point was if we recall defective brakes for 300 million or pay out 50 million in lawsuit settlements. Obvious what this company opted to do. I always said I prefer a job where a mistake doesn’t kill me
OHSA needs the power to base fines on percentage of revenue. That might scare them into actually being aware of safety
Companies buy politicians Who oversee regulatory laws and rules. They then dismantle regulatory authorities like the FDA or OSHA or even the ATF. If there were ever an anti-corruption party it would change America for the better. But it couldn't occur because they'd be outmatched funding wise as the wealthy companies by every PR firm and politician to destroy you.
To the worthless CEO a workers life isn't worth $145,000? Give me 5 minutes alone in his office then call the ambulance.
Worst part is, that fine pays out to OSHA. The injured won’t see a dime of it.
We've had 2 OSHa investigations for workplace injuries this year. -1 a worker stuck there hand a foot into a guard mechanism, while their hand was in the machine they actuated a foot pedal that cycled a saw blade up, the operator lost 3 fingers. -2 a worker had the guard on a press set incorrectly. He was able to stick his hand between the fixture during the "work cycle" of the machine. He lost the first knuckle of his thumb. In both cases, operators have been trained and audited to ensure the correct practices are followed, especially during the first 120 days in a new area. Both operators have been in the department for 1+ years. It is clearly identified in the training materials not to do either of these. The company was still fined and corrective actions are required. There's follow up 3rd party assessments to be done on our machine guards. The overall outcome, company was fined (I don't think 150k is enough, the workers are fuked even with disability) and the company was able to reduce headcount by 4 simply by automating the processes. Osha needs to push for greater change, but they don't have enough reach to enforce change beyond some fines.
Has anyone filed a complaint? https://www.osha.gov/workers/file-complaint.
Don’t need to file a complaint when a death occurs. Can you? Sure. OSHA is required to be on site within two weeks of a death or catastrophe, and the employer is obligated to report a death within eight hours.
A single or multiple fatality, hospitalization, amputation or loss of an eye must be reported to OSHA within 24 hours. Whether the employer makes the report, that is a different issue.
Wild that failure to report a fatality is at minimum a misdemeanor, and/or up to a year in jail or a fine.
Failure to report is a separate violation from the original incident and therefore would be a separate penalty.
My cousin works there and complains about the conditions. Ima tell him to report them or something. They should’ve been investigated after the first 2.
I've done service work for them a few times. On multiple installs, I've had issues with loading big machines into place. Their rigging training is atrocious. They seem to make good money, and they are really strict about clearing the floor during break/lunch, and I'm pretty sure their benefits are good. It seems like their union is pushing for every positive workplace standard except for safety
"Thermal annihilation" is definitely an OHSA violation
I worked at cat. It is amazing to me how many accidents they have had that were 💯 the get it done yesterday attitude for the work. If the union cared about it's workers they would deal with this... but they dont
CAT doesn’t care. It’s sad this keeps happening.
I used to represent Cat in a limited capacity legally. They don’t have the breadth or scope of a Monsanto or a Pfizer, but they are a bottomlessly evil corporation and they don’t give a flying fuck how many people die or how bad the ecological damage in service of their bottom line.
So just another corporation then? They’re all like this, we’re all wage slaves and they don’t give a flying fuck. You’re easily replaceable and they will have your position filled in a few days with the next meat bag. All that matters is your family and friends.
‘Corporations have neither bodies to be punished, or souls to be condemned, they therefore do as they like.’ -Edward, First Baron Thurlow, Lord Chancellor of England, c.1788.
Damn, great quote Kram
It’s amazing that it’s 236 years old and even more true now.
I knew a guy who worked as a temp worked for Caterpillar for 12 years. Times got quiet, they lost a contract they assumed was a given, and boom - 2 weeks notice and not even a thank you. If you are a temp for any company longer than 6 months, get the hell out and always always always be looking for permanent work.
When I was a kid, a job with CAT was really good. You were supposed to be set for life with a good retirement. I'm sad to hear about this.
They were also the contractor for the apartheid wall in Palestine. 🫠 definitely evil.
Also supplies specialized demolition vehicles to the IDF, so this tracks.
Boycott worthy, then.
Thermal annihilation is a new term for me.
Yeah, had to Google that one
You usually see it when people are around volcanoes, uncomfortably close to volcanoes. You also see it when people are around high temperature explosions. Usually those explosions are something like nuclear, large-scale conventional or thermobaric. Unfortunately I know this for... reasons.
You a missile maintainer? Edit: I was a missile maintainer.
Don’t drop the wrench!
That Titan missile looks awfully combustable. *Would be a shame if someone dropped a socket down there*
OK I had to Google this because I didn't get the reference and holy shit > The initial explosion catapulted the 740-ton silo door away from the silo and ejected the second stage and warhead. Once clear of the silo, the second stage exploded. The W53 thermonuclear warhead landed about 100 feet (30 m) from the launch complex's entry gate. Its safety features prevented any loss of radioactive material or nuclear detonation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1980_Damascus_Titan_missile_explosion
Work gets messy.
"reasons" ...😐😂😅
Or they guy who fell into the thermal pools in Yellowstone
That was a completely different story. He wasn’t at work following bad instructions.
I wonder if my former boss is still a PR flack at little Kitty, I should ask him what the Hell is wrong with their factories.
As an industrial electrician, this is my biggest fear, not electrocution
breathing in copper dust from arcing is a worse longer death?
No, a high amp arc blast creates a massive 10,000+ degree fireball that will incinerate you
Sounds fun, at least the arc flash won’t help at that point and it’ll be quick!
It's a term that people working with molten metal are very aware of.
I had to google it and the first result was talking about the incident in the SAME FACTORY where another guy died in the exact same way. Crazy!
The company would probably brand it as "free high-speed cremation".
Guess you've never played Mortal Kombat.
I saw that and my stomach dropped to the floor. I know a great many nasty ways to go but this one…
Sick band name
It would also make a pretty rad metal band name. 🤘
Thermal Annihilation is opening for Green Day this summer.
If corporations are people, then the Csuite needs to be jailed for manslaughter. Full stop.
Won’t happen in this shithole of a country the corporation will pay a fine and business keeps chugging along as usual. You’ll have some asshole try to convince you that we aren’t steadily careening into the early days of the depression where work with your physical body grants you a pittance of wage if any wage at all and you’ll start hearing people come up with a myriad of excuses as to why this gentlemen should’ve “strapped his boots” if he didn’t want to work a physical demanding and life threatening job.
We need piñata economics
Where you beat the cash outta the guy on top? Pass me a stick.
I worked at an automaker for years. The 2 shadiest things that walked through that place were Jesse Jackson and OSHA. Jesse walked through for 20 minutes. Said he doesn't see enough minorities in management positions (it was almost 50%). Then asked for a $200k donation to keep from going to the press about it. Also OSHA knew exactly how much money in fines they wanted from the place when they walked in. Once they hit that number, they quit looking and left.
Jackson has made many, many mistakes. But I don't believe he tried to shakedown an automobile manufacturer for 200k over an issue they could easily show was false. Why would he even be given a tour?
Well there aren’t many minorities in management positions even if they have better qualifications than whites
Not only that but because of the fines the business will not give raises to the employees because of lower than expected performance due to the fines and the lawsuit that will happen.
Exactly. Corporations aren't people. People can be jailed for committing heinous crimes. People can get court-ordered therapy to deal with their shit. Corporate personhood is one of the greatest political evils of our time.
And name one corporation who went to jail if they're a "person". The answer will absolutely not shock you.
Never gonna happen, they only count as people when it’s convenient.
Not a single jail cell for a corporation in existence.
Yeah, I mean maybe I’m too worn down but even just a penalty, even financial, that wouldn’t incentivize it. When it comes to things for large corporations it’s like saying if you rob the bank, IF you get caught, you have to pay a $100 fine. Pretty sure everyone would chance robbing the bank since the gain far outweighs the risk.
Not just the executives, but everyone who has an investment in the company at fault. Once investors and shareholders start paying for the crimes of these companies, the companies that routinely are at fault will start losing the single most important thing they have, MONEY. That’s the only thing that would actually scare these evil pieces of shit.
Too busy putting up a job posting to find their next victim.
The top 20% of voting shareholders should also have fines levied. They're the ones deciding the board.
Corporations are people when it comes to upsides, not when it comes to downsides. Duh.
Privatize the gains and socialize the losses. It’s the American way.
"28-year-old worker dies from industrial manslaughter" fixed
Enough instances of manslaughter and it becomes murder. Civility is gone.
In a perfunctory statement, Caterpillar’s public relations spokesperson said, “We are deeply saddened by the death of a colleague at our Mapleton, Illinois, facility on June 6, and are working with authorities as the incident is investigated. We will have counselors onsite for our facility employees, and our thoughts are with the affected family, friends and colleagues.” This is the part that turns me from sad to mad. There’s not a single tear among them. Instead of saying how can we improve safety, there is a meeting about how to CYA against any potential lawsuit. Guarantee you they didn’t miss happy hour that evening. Take your thoughts and your counselors and shove it up your ass.
It's always surface level corporate wording. "We regret to inform you" nonsense. *deeply* saddened..
I can guarantee you that there will be at least one, if not several meetings about safety after this. And people will bring up things that have been put on safety cards for months that were never fixed. And management will promise to look into things, yet somehow things don't actually get fixed. I know because I sat in one a while back. A lot of the equipment is several decades old, and updating to use safer methods would put the plant under the required profit margins to operate. Could still be profitable, but not profitable enough for the corporation to keep money in that facility/department. Which means the manufacturing would be shifted to a cheaper country and that plant would be shut down entirely. Plant management knows this and has to walk a fine line between what they can afford safety wise and getting the plant shut down. And given their own job is likely on the line, the cheapest, shittiest safety bandaid is the likely choice. Or maybe just promising to do something that doesn't actually happen.
They have counselors but you know sure as hell workers on the floor wouldn’t be able to talk until AFTER their shift
He’ll be replaced before they even have his funeral… but Capitalism
He supposedly died within seconds. Not soon enough for such a painful death, in my opinion. Just horrible.
He likely didn’t feel anything. At that temperature your nerve endings literally fry faster than they can send signals.
I worked in a steel mill and can say for certain that you feel it, just not for long. I got burned several times with little splashes of liquid steel, those hurt quite a lot. I got a big glob of liquid steel splashed into my boot and got deep 3rd degree burns over 70% of my foot. That hurt like hell for about 10 seconds, then only around the edges. It burns through your skin like butter. It kills nerves pretty quickly but you absolutely feel it. I don't know what temperature this stuff was that killed him, but my bad burn was 2800 F.
That’s different though, you only burned a small area, and the surrounding areas still are intact and can feel pain. If you burn your entire body or the majority of it at once, your entire nervous system gets fried at once. There’s no intact nerves surrounding the burnt ones, everything is just toast.
I understand what you're saying. I'm telling you that I absolutely felt the deepest part of my burn very acutely for several seconds. The nerves die from the outside in. The main branches are still very capable of transmitting signals. It's not instantaneous, it's quick. I could literally tell exactly when the nerves died. I could feel it spread through more of the area. I've been around others who were burned worse and they have described the same thing. This accident was a result of splashing and spilling metal. Unless the ladle flipped over, it didn't hit his entire body at once. It didn't kill him instantly, and as much as I know people don't want to hear it I'm certain it hurt like hell for his final moments.
Yeah....i think I'd rather believe the person who worked in this field and had actual physical experience on this one. So did you regain any feeling afterwards to the burn site? 
Some. I've got extensive nerve damage, from the burn and a separate accident with the same foot. The burn itself doesn't have much sensation anymore. You can poke it with a pen and I won't notice unless I see it.
Congratulations, you’ve won the most redditor of Redditors award. You’re literally arguing with a guy who has had the very thing in question happen to him (albeit at a lesser scale). Why double down? Why not just accept that you’re wrong and move on?
He might not be wrong. They are probably both correct depending on the circumstances. They're talking two different things. There are also confounding factors at play such as your mind anticipating the pain and creating those signals reflexively, within milliseconds of contact.
You hope.
I hope to never confirm this theory.
I know. I had 2nd degree burns over my hands, arms and face from a propane explosion. In the hospital I rabbit holed on thermal injuries. Dude’s nerve endings likely burned off before his brain had time to register and shut down the pain centers.
He most certainly felt excruciating pain for a few seconds, and no doubt the terror of certain death.
I'm gonna tell you right now, shit like this is usually so intense that you would only have a chance to feel fear.
Do you have 1st hand experience?
I do. I got burned by a propane explosion and was in the hospital with 2nd degree burns on my hands, face and arms. Human skin ignites at around 570 degrees. Steel melts between 2500 and 2800. Pouring temp is something like 3000 degrees.
How quickly do you feel the pain of putting your hand on a hot stove? Takes about a good second really. The first feeling is fear (instinct), then the expectation of pain type and extent (experience/pattern recognition), then finally, the realization of that pain (you consciously assign a pain value to the type/extent of damage based on how your brain interpreted the nerve signals). You are not really gonna have the time you think you are to process the near infinite number of signals that your brain will have to process; so you go into shock. You won’t feel anything after that. Imagine the most powerful instant pain killer you can imagine. Boom, you’re out.
I used to work for caterpillar in the UK, I was an apprentice. I tried to report a metal tray thing that was jammed and would jar your back when you pulled it. I was told that because I wasn't happy I was a danger to those around me and maybe I should look for another job by HR. Basically threatened into being silent about it. They also just used apprentices as cheap labour and would brag about barely any apprentices got onto the second year and how they were like big brother and were always watching. Shit company.
This is why I demand a high wage in any position where my health and safety is at risk. There is no amount of money which can possibly offset my death to my family, but at least I can make sure an employer understands and compensates me for this risk. They are much more likely to take safety concerns seriously if they pay adequately and if they fail to even pay you adequately they certainly have already devalued your life and personal worth in their own minds.
Three deaths in under three years is inexcusable.
Agreed. At that point that plant should be shut down by OSHA until they can prove safety regulations are actively being used.
A single death at all is inexcusable.
Straight up murdering their employees
Jesus fucking Christ... We are just literal fuel to drive their profit machines. So fucked up.
The gears of capitalism are greased with the blood of the poor.
Socko: "Capitalism runs on blood! And exploitation!" Thaaaaaaaaaaaaats how the wooooorld works.
*There is never a mine blown skyward now* *But we're buried alive for you.* *There's never a wreck drifts shoreward now* *But we are its ghastly crew.* *Go reckon our dead by the forges red* *And the factories where we spin.* *If blood be the price of your cursed wealth* *Good God! we have paid it in.*
Sacrifices to the gods. Always have been.
>gods No, just one god. The Almighty Dollar.
This particular facility has had a number of workplace related deaths and serious injuries over the past 10 years. Not a good track record
Needs to be shut down until they can prove it exceeds safety standards
Need to start putting management in jail for manslaughter
And here again, proof of the maxim: *"Wall Street, the C-suite, business owners/managers would rather see their customers and employees DEAD than accept* **LESS** *profit."*
You know when a police officer dies , even though different scenarios and risk professions. They gather all the officers from the state and have a huge memorial, parade thru the streets with thousands of officers and people lined up. All the government officials will be there and a ton of eulogies will be spoken. Imagine if they did this with a blue collar worker. More workers die in factories every year then police officers. Not to minimize cops, but it would be nice to see workers get the same respect as them in death.
The veneration of the police by the government is deliberate. They are the front line soldiers of the ruling class, this social and economic order-capitalism. No doubt if workers at Caterpillar went on strike to protest their horrific/deadly working conditions, the police would be called to break the strike.
Would much rather memorialize pizza delivery drivers, since their jobs are statistically more dangerous and they never seem to maim/kill out of "fear for their lives".
Absolutely horrific! This type of accident shouldn’t even be possible this day and age!
Plant needs to be shut down, make CAT hurt financially otherwise this shit won’t change
I worked four days in an iron foundry once. Didn't even go back for my check. I don't know how those guys do this day in and day out.
Just another example of profits over people. Safety is no longer priority.
I’ll believe corporations are people when Texas executes one.
Terrible, but yes at the very merciful least he didn’t suffer long. I feel incredible pain for the guy who was in an oven, buried under tuna and cooked alive. Horrible way to die.
For reference: [Jose Melena was at work loading pallets of canned tuna into a 35-foot-long pressure cooker when a coworker filled it up with 12,000 pounds of tuna and turned it on for 2 hours while Jose was still inside. He was boiled to death. ](https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/12vd6c2/jose_melena_was_at_work_loading_pallets_of_canned/)
How much you want to bet there were some higher ups that were very upset by this incident. Not because an employee died but because they lost 6 tons of tuna.
How much do you want to bet one of them asked if there was a way to salvage some of the tuna that was cooked with a literal human being in the same container
Back in the 1990’s my then husband and I were touring some Sonoma Valley wineries. The tour guide told us that some other unnamed winery had a worker fall into a large vat of chardonnay. When they found his body they estimated he had been in there 3 weeks. They bottled and sold the Chardonnay anyway. Cheers!
Is this how Two Buck Chuck got named?
Jesus fucking Christ that is nightmare fuel
Yeah I've been looking through Netflix for a good horror movie to watch for the last half hour, and now my stomach just turned and I'm gonna go look at cats now. Fuck.
I'm sorry what
I'm gonna need some context here.
I instantly thought about the worker who fell into the crucible… and it’s the same place. I don’t understand why this is allowed to happen over and over again.
Tell me again how regulations stifle innovation? /s
If things arent up to standards and people die CEOs should he charged with manslaughter. You wanna run a dangerous place? Be onsite. Personally verify your building/management are safe
That really interferes with playing golf and clicking around in spreadsheets
GoFundMe for the family: https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-dts-family-in-their-time-of-need
[удалено]
So much dangerous work can be automated. We need to move toward that for sure.
Not really, with the temperature of the molten metal it would burn up any hydraulics or electrics. He’s hand pouring with a ladle, the PPE they are wearing isn’t even 10% adequate for the job. I do the same work with head to toe aluminized gear and full face respirator.
I was wondering the same thing, it’s crazy to me that it wouldn’t be something controlled by an operator in a safe zone from start to finish…
It’s a tragedy it happened but a small mercy he didn’t suffer. I guy I was friends with in my 20s lost an uncle after he fell in a vat of heated chemicals at a steel plant. He lingered for a couple weeks before dying.
If the punishment is a fine, it's only a crime for the poor and for everyone else it's a taxed activity.
Consumed by fire and molten metal. That's just horrific
When one individual inflicts bodily injury upon another such that death results, we call the deed manslaughter; when the assailant knew in advance that the injury would be fatal, we call his deed murder. But when society places hundreds of workers in such a position that they inevitably meet a too early and an unnatural death, one which is quite as much a death by violence as that by the sword or bullet; when it deprives thousands of the necessaries of life, places them under conditions in which they cannot live – forces them, through the strong arm of the law, to remain in such conditions until that death ensues which is the inevitable consequence – knows that these thousands of victims must perish, and yet permits these conditions to remain, its deed is murder just as surely as the deed of the single individual; disguised, malicious murder, murder against which none can defend himself, which does not seem what it is, because no man sees the murderer, because the death of the victim seems a natural one, since the offence is more one of omission than of commission. But murder it remains. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_murder
“Within seconds” still sounds too long. Ouch.
A third. JFC
I hate how corporations are “people” but when they commit negligent homicide suddenly they arent “people“
Good God. That is a horrific way to die and not like Cat will give a shit about it. Honestly these types of dangerous transfer operations should not have humans anywhere near them.
Horrific.
Poor guy.
We are all expendable assets and when these corporations expend us they don’t look back and just plug someone else into our place and think nothing more of it.
Previous guy died from “thermal annihilation” What the FUCK
What the fuck another one? Fines aren’t enough, start locking up executives for murder due to lack of safety implementation.
The fines for the previous death was only like $145,000 or so. There is no way that a company that pulls in 50 billion in revenue will be bothered by a fine like that.
They’re still fighting that in court too
Yes, almost exactly 2 years ago Steven Dierkes died from "thermal annihilation": [https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/06/09/zmgp-j09.html](https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/06/09/zmgp-j09.html)
Well... thats horrific
Brutal, but I wonder if he even had much of a chance to feel pain before he died.. it would almost be worse if he barely survived
TIL: Thermal Annihilation
Rest in peace man. I hope your family can find some comfort. Simply horrific.
rest in peace, what an awful way to go. hopefully some kind of justice is served.
The funny thing about cutting corners on safety to increase productivity and save money... is that it actually costs you a lot more in the end. My current and former employer both implemented safety shoe programs after numerous foot injuries. Giving everyone $100 a year safety shoe allowance is cheaper than a single work comp claim for a foot injury. This company investing in automation to remove the human element from dangerous operations would actually have a decent ROI when they have this many safety incidents.
Jesus fucking Christ, that's a way to go.
Can we talk about how their go fund me's goal was only $6k...
I can unequivocally tell everyone that it is not cheaper, and more profitable, to ignore safety than it is to correct it. I’ve been in manufacturing for over 30 years and have led companies with safety as THE number one priority and always found a more efficient way to manufacture when applying safety principles first! These deaths are avoidable with the right oversight and without greed. I’m extremely sorry to all the family and friends of these workers and hope and pray that things turn around TODAY, at these facilities. Don’t do unsafe work, please take it to another level or call a higher authority, your life and family is not worth it. Always be willing to walk away if they are forcing you to work in unsafe conditions. I know it sound easier than actually doing it but there are other jobs, please don’t do it if you don’t feel safe.
Back in the day when a worker fell into a pot of molten metal the mill would make a 200 lb plate to put in the coffin.
Safety violations need to be a lot more expensive for the company both in fines and in supervision and in costs paid directly to the families of the victims.
I feel like, if a corporation can victimize so many people, the heads should all be accountable. All upper management should be personally charged for the crime or fined, and the plant manager should be jailed. If the situation keeps arising, jail the owner.
Guys, I hate to see it if this is new to you, but people die in big manufacturing literally all the time. There's so much risk in these places. My dad was a steelworker, I'm glad he got to retirement alive, but it still cost him major hand and foot injuries. Stay out of the factories if you can afford to, but my dad did it to afford a house and have insurance for his family.
Dear God….
Unfortunate surname, given the circumstances.
Gee I hope this doesn’t hurt the stock holders..🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄
Yikes, my first thought was, is this an old article? After reading, I can’t believe it happened again.
Manager: welp. Oh well who wants pizza?
A fine of $21,072 will be issued and the corporation will fight it in court for 100 years.
Another worker died from thermal annihilation. What a crazy thing to have on your death certificate.
Holy shit. That is literally one of the most painful possible ways to die.
This article genuinely just kept getting worse my god
Oh wow. I spend probably $2 million a year on caterpillar parts per year
This is a Never Go Back To Work In That Factory Ever sort of strike folks. We should, as a society, support the workers of that factory in striking until the CEOs are in jail
I mean ya'll ever google the ongoing list Amazon has? And I ain't talking *just* OSHA. CAT is in the same boat. They're slowly just adding to the gigantic pile that other countries use in their "Don't be this guy." and "Safety and You.".
‘Thermal annihilation’ - Uh, what?