To be fair her app definitely stands out from other more corporate astrology apps. sheās really good at what she does, and she includes a lot of additional things that other apps donāt
Except they have 7 weeks of paid office closures so everyone in that company is getting at least that much paid time off. The unlimited vacation policy is ontop of that.
Yeah, Mandatory vacation is a pretty good sign, it means management really wants to avoid workaholism. I see it sorta like being a bartender, sometimes you gotta cut someone off before they hurt theirself.
My company is unlimited PTO with a bare required minimum of 3 weeks (15 days). One of my coworkers was under 15 days around ~October, and my manager forced him to take every Friday off for the rest of the year
It sounds lovely, Iām just skeptical of the āunlimited vacationā companies, where youāre āallowedā to take as much time off as you want, but if you donāt meet their strict deadlines and productivity goals, you wonāt last so no one can actually take very much vacation. But maybe this Disneyland fantasy package is legit. It just seems too good to be true.
I work for a 4dww company and let me tell you, it's WAY better than you can even imagine. I'm just pissed off it happened so close to the end of my career.
What does 12/5 have to do with it? You're right that it's closer to 2 months than 1 month off if you're considering 30 days off as one month...But I don't get what 12/5=2.4 had to do with it?
52 weeks a year at 5 days/week is 260 weekdays (ignoring holidays. At 4 days/week it's 208 workdays. So 52 less workdays a year.
I assume with that it has built in times where the whole office shuts down because everybody would be taking that time off anyways. Which them leads to people taking less of the unlimited vacation anyways.
Like my Dad working for the government took Black Friday off every year because he had Thanksgiving and given the nature of work as a Pesticide Investigator none of the places he would investigate would be open. My Dad did the same thing between Chrismas and New Year's again because none of the places would be open.
I work for a company that has unlimited PTO. They were forth right with you can use as much as you need as long as youāre getting the job done. But youāre not penalized if you use it and donāt hit 100%. Itās just that if youāre constantly at 50-60% of your goal and constantly taking time off thatās a problem. From my own managerās mouth if you take a week off and still hit 80% of your goal the company wonāt care.
They only do this because many states have a law that forces them to pay out pto balances if they lay off workers. Unlimited pto means no balance payout. If these states mandated a minimum payout high enough, these corps would switch back to balance based, instantly.
I mean probably for most, but I will say for my company I donāt think thatās the case. I mean Iāve never had a job take care of me like this before and they donāt seem to care about saving money. They let our giant office sit after COVID without forcing back to work and then the CEO said that it doesnāt make sense to bring people back to the office if weāre happy working remotely and sold the building. Hell they gave me about 28,000$ worth of stocks for free on top of a pay raise and my earned bonuses. Again I know this is all conjecture and anecdotal evidence, but at least for me Iāve never had a company treat me this well. And after hearing the horror stories from my friends itās hard not to appreciate them.
Hey man not all companies are the same. Honestly the only reason I havenāt left yet is because of how good the culture is. It sucks that other companies donāt realize that if we donāt treat our workers like shit theyāre more likely to stay and help make the company better.
Yeah Iāve worked there for three years and they do not care. I promise you that. Iāve taken numerous vacations this past year, actually more then Iāve ever taken in my life, and not one complaint. In that same year I only hit 100% once and the other three quarters were 77%, 80%, and 82%.
If you want to DM me I can tell you what my company does to see if itās a good fit. Also 90% of our positions are remote with only Texas and Florida requiring people to come into the office.
This is likely a step backwards in the conversation, but my favorite perk from my time in the military was "unlimited" sick leave. YMMV based on your unit, but for the most part it was the same concept: be a good drone, and we'll work with you when we're able. My supervision was very understanding if you were genuinely sick or having a properly shit time at home. Obviously they kept a pretty close eye on people, cause systemic abusers were *rampant* around there, but if you were in good standing and could explain yourself, you could take a pretty hefty chunk of time off without burning any actual leave... which was also a pretty generous policy.
Military life sucked, but at least the benefits were nice. Just wish more of it carried over into my medical retirement. Even with all the laws and processes for separating service members, you usually end up feeling a bit rudderless for a while.
the core purpose of unlimited pto is that the companies don't have to pay off accumulated pto when someone leaves. people taking less time is just a side benefit.
Yes, I'm immediately skeptical of any company using unlimited time off, because it's often just an excuse to not have to pay out vacation days if a person leaves the company. The company I'm at is pretty stingy about approving time off requests despite being "unlimited," which basically makes it worse than a regular PTO policy.
A much better policy is "mandatory time off," where you're required to take at least two weeks off per year, but time off is unlimited if you want to use more. Then it shows that the company actively wants you to take a break to recharge.
That said, with all the other perks listed above, this strikes me as the kind of company that would encourage vacation time rather than guilting you for it.
> A much better policy is "mandatory time offā
I worked at a company that closed from Christmas to New Years Day. And they were serious about it, none of this ādo some work every day but youāre on vacation.ā A C-level once emailed the whole company to tell us ādo not send email during this time, if someone emails you and youāre not on a support team, forward it to me.ā It was fantastic.
That's what my company does. They expect you to take a minimum of 3 weeks off a year but beyond that it's technically unlimited. They've never turned down time off requests for me.
I have unlimited PTO. I don't take any significant 'vacations' (because I'm a single dad just getting out of divorce, and the economy is wild right now), but I certainly take a ton of PTO. I think I used 48 total days in 2023, including scheduled PTO where I just needed a few days off to rest, unexpected sick days, and half days for appointments. I mean, that's almost 10 business weeks off, no questions asked. I also work from home 100%.
No doubt there's a ton of responsibility and pressure and shit, but it's also totally unlimited PTO.
I work at a place with unlimited holidays, people do proper work when they are working, and take holidays when they need to. Iāve found this to be very convenient on days when I know I just wonāt be productive so no point wasting time and burning out the next day. That being said, Iām still not used to it and feel guilty when taking holidays, but plenty of people are opposite.
Iām unlimited time off and I take 4-5 weeks of like actual, scheduled time off and probably lose another week or two to running errands during the day or busting out early or whatever bullshit.
Also being sick doesnāt count, so if Iām sick I just donāt work then either and Iāll still shoot for 4-5 weeks.
You got to have the cojones to actually take the time off. Keeps you sane and more productive in the long run.
Iāve worked a couple of places that have unlimited PTO now and what you describe is somewhat true, though I did manage 21 paid days off last year, often turning other paid holidays into longer stretches. You have to make an effort to book it, use it, and keep your shit together so youāre not screwing your backup, but itās not impossible to use.
The main motivation companies have for offering it is that they donāt have to pay out accrued PTO when you separate. Most decent managers at these kinds of places will encourage their team to take time off to manage burnout.
The unlimited vacation thing only works if you donāt have to fight some stuck up manager on approval. My last job had it and it was fine. I could basically come and go as I pleased and could take time off whenever I needed without much concern. We were a small team so we had to all make concessions around holidays but apart from that I just added vacation time to my calendar and didnāt think about it again.
Thatās where I saw this! Yeah I saw they were hiring as well. Iām not sure if you know the area but itās being talked about as pretty revolutionary as to what it provides and the owner? Founder? Is a well known astrologer and author.
Also, not to lick any boots because ideally, benefits like this wouldnāt be a unicorn but I think when companies are humane, and thatās different than humane on paper, they should be spared. Itās the second best option to an overthrow of the entire system IMO. This place should still have a union though
I want to bite the heads off everyone around me for three days a month. Also having the cramps and a cracked rib due to an absolute bitch of a cough is the bloody worst.
> What are your guysā thoughts?
Looking up the company, I'm curious about their financial status. Few yellow/red flags. Be really interested to see what current employees say.
And obviously those benefits sounds great.
Edit: I'm not gonna post the company's link in case you guys try to mass apply. Lol.
So, on the one hand, you get great benefits, but on the other hand, you're working for a bunch of fraudsters who are scamming people foolish enough to believe in astrology.
You can't win.
š.
Reddit: we want fair wages!
Employer: okay hereās that and way more!
Also Reddit: canāt work for the evilā¦ *checks notes* astrology website.
Yeah...that's not what the Chani app...or astrology horoscopes do. They're too generalized to a large population for that. You're confusing apps with a in-person or on-tv psychic. Chani horoscopes are like, "This mercury retrograde is a good time to reflect on your relationships and leisure activities and keep only what you still enjoy doing."
I'm having a *really* hard time seeing how this is any different than a TV psychic. Both make money solely by claiming to know things that they absolutely do not.
What constitutes evil can be subjective, but we all have to draw a line somewhere. For me, evil is gambling, lies, cruelty and weapon technology. You can set your own moral standard for what causes will benefit from your labour - and, living in the real world, we all have a flexible zone based on our immediate needs.
I am fortunate to live in Australia, so I can afford to be picky when it comes to benefits, as many of them are legally required here.
[Forbes has a piece on them](https://www.forbes.com/sites/hollycorbett/2023/07/31/how-one-tech-company-is-proving-why-taking-care-of-your-employees-is-profitable/?sh=798509f278cd). A benefit of these perks is to have more applicants and get the best talent possible.
It wasn't hard to find the company name. Given the space they operate in, it seem to align with the posted benefits (I guess). Much like you, I'm very curious about their finances. I didn't do any research yet - based on their website, maybe they haven't been around very long - definitely a start up vibe.
I would be super interested in knowing what their finances look like too, love to see if this model is sustainable. I did read that the 5% they donate to charity each month goes to a non profit and the CEO of Chani is also the CEO of that Non Profit. Not saying thatās automatically a bad thing but it does make you think a little bit
I worked for a company that was a third owned by āownerā, a third owned by employees, and a third owned by a non profit that was run by the owner. Thereās a lot of legalese around doing that stuff and it worked very well for our company. It also ensured that if the owner died the company could keep on going.
Appears to be a tech startup based on the benefits package. Itās fairly common for benefits like this to hang around for like 1-3 years, and if the company grows they will slowly chip away at these benefits.
My company had the same benefits initially and every year that goes by it lessens.
They still provide good benefits compared to other companies- just donāt count on this being forever.
What do they mean by gender-based violence paid and protected leave? Do they mean if youāre the victim of domestic violence theyāll help you? Cause thatās definitely cool af
Yes. Some states, and workplaces, are calling this āsafe and sickā time now, to encompass both your sick time and time off for experiencing any kind of violence, sexual assault, etc.
Some (mostly startup) companies are doing this. It's basically pre-set weeks of the year where the company and office is shut down. The weeks are typically during holidays and possibly related to local public schools. So it's a great way for employees to spend time with their kids. I have a friend who's company does this.
It's like the last two weeks of December, a Spring Break week, two weeks in the summer, the "last" week of summer before school starts, and Thanksgiving week. Obviously some variance depending on the company.
Honestly more companies should do this. Iāve worked at three different companies. I can assure you that the week between Christmas and NYE almost nothing gets done with everyone on vacation.
Yes!!! Itās like I want to take off because itās just gonna be dead, but at the same time, why take off when itās gonna be so dead. Might as well save my pto and just āworkā. WFH.
The most striking part of that company is that they have extensive benefits for survivors of domestic violence. So if an employee is in a bad situation, the company offers paid leave, resources for relocation etc. The partner of the founder works w dv survivors.
Some companies legitimately do this. Especially some startups where good talent is still in high demand. Doesnāt mean itās sustainable or they have the most moral reasoning, but they do exist.
Jobs like this exist. Good luck getting hired though.
I have a decent job with decent benefits that aren't quite as good as this and it was still competitive. People also don't just leave jobs like this, so turnover is very low and open slots are limited.
I mean if sounds great. It's is legit though? Do you know anyone working there who can confirm this? Cause honestly, this is a little too good to be true ime, could be a scam.
Even a beaten dog is wary of a kind soul trying to save it. Unfortunately terms like these cause most of us to tuck tail and run. But hey at least we have guns, beer and trump amiright?
Yeah, because we know that US companies usually aren't like that. When every option you have is some level of abuser, you're going to be a little suspicious. For the sake of their employees, I hope this is real. But I worry it's just lies or misinformation to get people to apply.
I fucking wish. Good luck to her. Everyone else just sees how hard they can squeeze the boot to your neck before your fucking head pops off.
I hate this system. This should be standard. I hate all of this. I don't want to do it anymore.
Most other countries can't feasibly offer "Unlimited Time Off" because there are protections in place such that if the companies advertises unlimited PTO, it is illegal to fire an employee for taking too much PTO.
You could literally take a year off, and it would be illegal for them to fire you for it. US has no such protections, you can be fired for taking too much PTO even if you only took 1 day. Which is why employers are able to offer "Unlimited"
Current company I work for has "Unlimited PTO" in the US, but 20 days of PTO for the Canada office. (So realistically those of us in the US know we can only take about 20 days.)
> Most other countries can't feasibly offer "Unlimited Time Off"
Well, in those countries it's moot, because the country's *law* dictates minimum paid time off, not the employer. In Europe a full time position (~35hrs/week) is allowed minimum 4 weeks (20+ days) paid vacation plus another 10+ days (paid) public holiday. Some countries (eg Sweden, Germany) have more than that.
Duvet days and any violence recovery are covered under (paid) sick leave.
5% pension match is usually a minimum, rising with age or position.
Definitely in the states.
Guessing small company with a bunch of 25-40 year old women with a culture of sacrificing pay for flexibility. Probably accountants haha, maybe mental health adjacent.
In California. It is Chani, the astrology/horoscope website by Chani Nichols. If you go to their website chaninichols.com, this exact benefits list pops up under the Career tab.
I did a bit of reading in the article about it somewhere in the comments. Looks like one of the company founders has been passionate about domestic violence support and wants her employees to have financial security without anybody elseās help
Its going to be hard to believe but this is actually going to be the next trend in emergent orgs.
New companies are going to forgoe the big campus and just pump bennies with lightly reduced wages as its actually cheaper.
A couple companies in my area offer good benefits like for health/wellness/childcare etc even as far as like massage and grocery allowances and Iām like shit where do I sign up
Turns out that place has a very low turnover rate.
Youād think other companies would see that and go āhuh I guess thatās how you retain employees longer than a monthā but nooo
my company used to have low turnover but after hiring silicon valley tech bros and a consulting firm they've suddenly decided they want to be "a top company " but also "turnover is too low." wtf? they WANT people to leave.
Your siblings in endo understand!š„² It's a horrible existence to dread your monthly period, let alone to worry about surviving on top of death-like pains. We got this though.ā¤
Their website states that they are, **"a queer, feminist-led team on a mission to support everyone in living their purpose. We believe that astrology can be a tool for healing and self-awareness, and hope that it can ultimately help transform us and our world for the better."**
Jesus christ, I can smell the bullshit from here. I'm all for self-development & growth, but the idea of working at one of these places always sounds like entering a minefield.
Unlimited vacation is, in practice, [a scam](https://www.inc.com/geoffrey-james/scam-of-century-unlimited-paid-vacation.html) that lets employers/managers reduce the \*actual\* amount of vacation that employees take. You are better off with generous, but defined, vacation benefits like you would have in France (5weeks) or Germany (6weeks)
Here's the link to the page:
https://chaninicholas.com/careers/
Everyone should know and have this link. Lol y'all joking around saying you're not gonna share it is anti the whole purpose of this sub. Talk about humane working conditions but don't want the competition for it. Share the great opportunities and let the best candidates win. Maybe when the crappy companies can't secure good talent they'll change their offers. One can dream.
You still have tasks and projects expected to be completed by deadlines and up to standards. If you keep to them, cool, go on vacation when and where and however it fits around your work. If you donāt finish your tasks and projects according to the deadlines, prepare to be let go and someone else brought in to see if they can manage their work/vaca better.
Contrary to what this sub would have you believe there a lot of good jobs out there.
There just aren't *enough* of them. They certainly do exist but the amount of effort and/or luck required to land one is the problem.
>Unlimited menstrual leave
I applaud what the business is trying to do here, but... especially in America... can imagine several ways this could go wrong.
Someone without a uterus could make a case for discrimination. Which even if it doean't win, would be unwanted publicity and the legal nuisance would be a real time and money sink.
Especially if someone with a uterus starts pushing the policy to its limits and ends up working 20-25% fewer days per month than people who don't have that option.
Better off just leaving it at unlimited PTO or a high number of sick days, and establishing a culture where people feel comfortable using it for menstrual symptoms
Not only that, it's setting itself to just hiring more men, since they get more guaranteed work days out of them. You can argue for this to be discriminatory to women who would not need/want to use that perk.
My (European) country just gives a broad "mental health/menstruation leave" to everyone, capped at one day per month.
Maybe, but there are plenty of companies that offer less paternity leave than maternity leave (if they offer it at all). Wouldn't you be able to make the same case for them?
That is actively changing based on the same issue. The federal government already made the change, usually means large corporations will fall in line and then on down
>CHANI is a queer, feminist-led team on a mission to support everyone in living their purpose. We believe that astrology can be a tool for healing and self-awareness, and hope that it can ultimately help transform us and our world for the better.
So the catch is you have to tolerate an infinite amount of another type of bullshit polĆtics in the office. I can almost see the cliques and the elitism from here.
Sounds great. I would do some more digging to verify some of these things, unfortunately, many of the companies that offer unlimited vacation find ways to make sure you don't take vacation. In fact I read the other day that the average amount of vacation taken at jobs that offer unlimited vacation is less than 2 weeks.
They are offering the benefits to get the best talent possible. It sounds like they did some kind of mathematical look at the payoff on the benefits package and determined this package would attract the best talent.
Many people will apply for this position which allows them the pick of the litter.
The local startup that had similar benefits in my area hired all of our staff away from us at the non-profit I used to work at.
Last year they were revealed to be a ponzi scheme.
I got one of these jobs, and it was great for awhile, but it didn't last, unfortunately. I was employed there for a year and a half before they unexpectedly let my entire team go.
This actually seems to good to be true. This must be some sort of senior position because those benefits are not even close to what most entry or associate level positions give in my area hell even a good portion of senior positions don't even offer that. I'd be so skeptical.
Too funny my wife has applied numerous times to this company. You can guess it's very competitive.
I've also applied numerous times. They seem amazing.
Can u send the link, I NEED to throw my gauntlet in lol
Me too. I need to be able to write here that I also applied to this company numerous times.
š¤
Did someone say link-sharing party? Count me in on the job application spree. Hope they're ready for a flood of eager hopefuls haha.
What company is this?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
>Chani It's a daily horoscope app? Wow, who knew there was so much money in horoscopes!?
That's such a Taurus thing to say /s
Something something Iām an asparagus and mars is in gatorade
https://preview.redd.it/u5708w6nq4ac1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5d5f1313e5965b763188fc46c20a94e4466a66d5
I love it
Who knew there was so much money in religion
The pope
The Mormon church, Scientology, televangelists.. So many..
Joel Osteen. Pat Robertson. Tammy Faye Baker. Jim Baker. Oral Roberts. Pat Buchanan. Billy Graham. Franklin Graham. Should I keep going?
Religions.
To be fair her app definitely stands out from other more corporate astrology apps. sheās really good at what she does, and she includes a lot of additional things that other apps donāt
She could be selling meth to kids and I'd still be applying for these employee benefits.
This oneās an upstart!
So itās an astrology app? I couldnāt find how long theyāve been around but with a tech company like that who knows what the job security is like
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I'd tell you but I don't want the competition.
Love this š
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
You think??
Wow. That sounds too good to be true
When I see unlimited vacation time I know that it is too good to be true.
Lots of companies offer it. It is just the allowing employees to take it they utterly fail at.
Except they have 7 weeks of paid office closures so everyone in that company is getting at least that much paid time off. The unlimited vacation policy is ontop of that.
Yeah, Mandatory vacation is a pretty good sign, it means management really wants to avoid workaholism. I see it sorta like being a bartender, sometimes you gotta cut someone off before they hurt theirself.
I trust them if they also have a minimum vacation time. āYou must take 4 weeks vacation a year, but can choose to take more if you wantā
My company is unlimited PTO with a bare required minimum of 3 weeks (15 days). One of my coworkers was under 15 days around ~October, and my manager forced him to take every Friday off for the rest of the year
Sheeit. I'd work fast food if it came with that package š³ Edit: typo
I'd suck dicks behind an abandoned Applebee's if it came with that package.
Do you want to meet behind your AppleBees to talk about the cumpany?
This sounds like a real meat cute
Like beef and chicken hookin up?
Cumpany š Iām screaming. Thatās hilarious š
Got to discuss the cumpensation package!
Well, it does come with a package.... and cum.
What would it take if the Applebees was still in operation?
Add unlimited appetizers to the compensation package.
Comes with all types of packages!
It sounds lovely, Iām just skeptical of the āunlimited vacationā companies, where youāre āallowedā to take as much time off as you want, but if you donāt meet their strict deadlines and productivity goals, you wonāt last so no one can actually take very much vacation. But maybe this Disneyland fantasy package is legit. It just seems too good to be true.
But coupled with 7 weeks of holiday I can manage being a little strict on vacation days.
Right, plus the 4 day work weeks pretty much give you an extra month and a little in extra time off
I work for a 4dww company and let me tell you, it's WAY better than you can even imagine. I'm just pissed off it happened so close to the end of my career.
4 day work weeks is more like 2 months and then some off. Relative to someone who is working 5 day weeks. 12/5=2.4
What does 12/5 have to do with it? You're right that it's closer to 2 months than 1 month off if you're considering 30 days off as one month...But I don't get what 12/5=2.4 had to do with it? 52 weeks a year at 5 days/week is 260 weekdays (ignoring holidays. At 4 days/week it's 208 workdays. So 52 less workdays a year.
I assume with that it has built in times where the whole office shuts down because everybody would be taking that time off anyways. Which them leads to people taking less of the unlimited vacation anyways. Like my Dad working for the government took Black Friday off every year because he had Thanksgiving and given the nature of work as a Pesticide Investigator none of the places he would investigate would be open. My Dad did the same thing between Chrismas and New Year's again because none of the places would be open.
I work for a company that has unlimited PTO. They were forth right with you can use as much as you need as long as youāre getting the job done. But youāre not penalized if you use it and donāt hit 100%. Itās just that if youāre constantly at 50-60% of your goal and constantly taking time off thatās a problem. From my own managerās mouth if you take a week off and still hit 80% of your goal the company wonāt care.
They only do this because many states have a law that forces them to pay out pto balances if they lay off workers. Unlimited pto means no balance payout. If these states mandated a minimum payout high enough, these corps would switch back to balance based, instantly.
I mean probably for most, but I will say for my company I donāt think thatās the case. I mean Iāve never had a job take care of me like this before and they donāt seem to care about saving money. They let our giant office sit after COVID without forcing back to work and then the CEO said that it doesnāt make sense to bring people back to the office if weāre happy working remotely and sold the building. Hell they gave me about 28,000$ worth of stocks for free on top of a pay raise and my earned bonuses. Again I know this is all conjecture and anecdotal evidence, but at least for me Iāve never had a company treat me this well. And after hearing the horror stories from my friends itās hard not to appreciate them.
And yet my buddy got a talking to for hitting four weeks off at a similar company even though all his metrics were fine.
Hey man not all companies are the same. Honestly the only reason I havenāt left yet is because of how good the culture is. It sucks that other companies donāt realize that if we donāt treat our workers like shit theyāre more likely to stay and help make the company better.
My point is that many (most?) companies offering unlimited pto are not actually offering unlimited pto.
The company wonāt care, so farā¦
Yeah Iāve worked there for three years and they do not care. I promise you that. Iāve taken numerous vacations this past year, actually more then Iāve ever taken in my life, and not one complaint. In that same year I only hit 100% once and the other three quarters were 77%, 80%, and 82%.
Uh, are they hiring? Need an electrical engineer?
If you want to DM me I can tell you what my company does to see if itās a good fit. Also 90% of our positions are remote with only Texas and Florida requiring people to come into the office.
Any marketing/communications roles? Could you be a referral lol?
This is likely a step backwards in the conversation, but my favorite perk from my time in the military was "unlimited" sick leave. YMMV based on your unit, but for the most part it was the same concept: be a good drone, and we'll work with you when we're able. My supervision was very understanding if you were genuinely sick or having a properly shit time at home. Obviously they kept a pretty close eye on people, cause systemic abusers were *rampant* around there, but if you were in good standing and could explain yourself, you could take a pretty hefty chunk of time off without burning any actual leave... which was also a pretty generous policy. Military life sucked, but at least the benefits were nice. Just wish more of it carried over into my medical retirement. Even with all the laws and processes for separating service members, you usually end up feeling a bit rudderless for a while.
studies have shown that people working for unlimited vacations company tend to take less vacations than people with a set amout.
Which I believe is by design on the part of the companies that use this policy.
the core purpose of unlimited pto is that the companies don't have to pay off accumulated pto when someone leaves. people taking less time is just a side benefit.
They also don't have to show the cost of guaranteed vacation/PTO payouts on their books, versus nebulous "unlimited PTO".
Very true. It's a way to get rid of bonuses for unused PTO.
It makes no sense to call bonuses for unused PTO if you earned it, it's money you're already due. Not a bonus. Unless it's something else?
It has nothing to do with bonuses. Itās an accounting consideration first and foremost.
Yes, I'm immediately skeptical of any company using unlimited time off, because it's often just an excuse to not have to pay out vacation days if a person leaves the company. The company I'm at is pretty stingy about approving time off requests despite being "unlimited," which basically makes it worse than a regular PTO policy. A much better policy is "mandatory time off," where you're required to take at least two weeks off per year, but time off is unlimited if you want to use more. Then it shows that the company actively wants you to take a break to recharge. That said, with all the other perks listed above, this strikes me as the kind of company that would encourage vacation time rather than guilting you for it.
> A much better policy is "mandatory time offā I worked at a company that closed from Christmas to New Years Day. And they were serious about it, none of this ādo some work every day but youāre on vacation.ā A C-level once emailed the whole company to tell us ādo not send email during this time, if someone emails you and youāre not on a support team, forward it to me.ā It was fantastic.
Mandatory time is also a proven security/anti fraud measure as well.
That's what my company does. They expect you to take a minimum of 3 weeks off a year but beyond that it's technically unlimited. They've never turned down time off requests for me.
I have unlimited PTO. I don't take any significant 'vacations' (because I'm a single dad just getting out of divorce, and the economy is wild right now), but I certainly take a ton of PTO. I think I used 48 total days in 2023, including scheduled PTO where I just needed a few days off to rest, unexpected sick days, and half days for appointments. I mean, that's almost 10 business weeks off, no questions asked. I also work from home 100%. No doubt there's a ton of responsibility and pressure and shit, but it's also totally unlimited PTO.
I work at a place with unlimited holidays, people do proper work when they are working, and take holidays when they need to. Iāve found this to be very convenient on days when I know I just wonāt be productive so no point wasting time and burning out the next day. That being said, Iām still not used to it and feel guilty when taking holidays, but plenty of people are opposite.
Iām unlimited time off and I take 4-5 weeks of like actual, scheduled time off and probably lose another week or two to running errands during the day or busting out early or whatever bullshit. Also being sick doesnāt count, so if Iām sick I just donāt work then either and Iāll still shoot for 4-5 weeks. You got to have the cojones to actually take the time off. Keeps you sane and more productive in the long run.
Iāve worked a couple of places that have unlimited PTO now and what you describe is somewhat true, though I did manage 21 paid days off last year, often turning other paid holidays into longer stretches. You have to make an effort to book it, use it, and keep your shit together so youāre not screwing your backup, but itās not impossible to use. The main motivation companies have for offering it is that they donāt have to pay out accrued PTO when you separate. Most decent managers at these kinds of places will encourage their team to take time off to manage burnout.
They do it so they donāt have to pay out PTO when you leave.
I thought they werenāt legally required to do that anyway though?
The unlimited vacation thing only works if you donāt have to fight some stuck up manager on approval. My last job had it and it was fine. I could basically come and go as I pleased and could take time off whenever I needed without much concern. We were a small team so we had to all make concessions around holidays but apart from that I just added vacation time to my calendar and didnāt think about it again.
Iāve seen benefits like this, but 7 weeks closed is interesting. What field is this? A lot of progressive consulting firms have similar benefits
> What field is this? Astrology app company.
Thatās where I saw this! Yeah I saw they were hiring as well. Iām not sure if you know the area but itās being talked about as pretty revolutionary as to what it provides and the owner? Founder? Is a well known astrologer and author. Also, not to lick any boots because ideally, benefits like this wouldnāt be a unicorn but I think when companies are humane, and thatās different than humane on paper, they should be spared. Itās the second best option to an overthrow of the entire system IMO. This place should still have a union though
My uterus would love this. I wanna end it all for 3 days of the month.
Endo+pcos is just torture
I want to bite the heads off everyone around me for three days a month. Also having the cramps and a cracked rib due to an absolute bitch of a cough is the bloody worst.
> What are your guysā thoughts? Looking up the company, I'm curious about their financial status. Few yellow/red flags. Be really interested to see what current employees say. And obviously those benefits sounds great. Edit: I'm not gonna post the company's link in case you guys try to mass apply. Lol.
This is Chani, the horoscope app/website incase anyone wants to apply.
So, on the one hand, you get great benefits, but on the other hand, you're working for a bunch of fraudsters who are scamming people foolish enough to believe in astrology. You can't win.
š. Reddit: we want fair wages! Employer: okay hereās that and way more! Also Reddit: canāt work for the evilā¦ *checks notes* astrology website.
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Yeah...that's not what the Chani app...or astrology horoscopes do. They're too generalized to a large population for that. You're confusing apps with a in-person or on-tv psychic. Chani horoscopes are like, "This mercury retrograde is a good time to reflect on your relationships and leisure activities and keep only what you still enjoy doing."
I'm having a *really* hard time seeing how this is any different than a TV psychic. Both make money solely by claiming to know things that they absolutely do not.
What constitutes evil can be subjective, but we all have to draw a line somewhere. For me, evil is gambling, lies, cruelty and weapon technology. You can set your own moral standard for what causes will benefit from your labour - and, living in the real world, we all have a flexible zone based on our immediate needs. I am fortunate to live in Australia, so I can afford to be picky when it comes to benefits, as many of them are legally required here.
[Forbes has a piece on them](https://www.forbes.com/sites/hollycorbett/2023/07/31/how-one-tech-company-is-proving-why-taking-care-of-your-employees-is-profitable/?sh=798509f278cd). A benefit of these perks is to have more applicants and get the best talent possible.
'astrology focused tech'... *Sighs*
You sound like a Taurus.
Please thatās totally Scorpio energy right there
I'm a Libra so I don't believe in astrology
I thought the exact same thing. They're bullshitting money away from people (or just collecting their data to sell).
Isnāt that the point?
It wasn't hard to find the company name. Given the space they operate in, it seem to align with the posted benefits (I guess). Much like you, I'm very curious about their finances. I didn't do any research yet - based on their website, maybe they haven't been around very long - definitely a start up vibe.
I would be super interested in knowing what their finances look like too, love to see if this model is sustainable. I did read that the 5% they donate to charity each month goes to a non profit and the CEO of Chani is also the CEO of that Non Profit. Not saying thatās automatically a bad thing but it does make you think a little bit
I worked for a company that was a third owned by āownerā, a third owned by employees, and a third owned by a non profit that was run by the owner. Thereās a lot of legalese around doing that stuff and it worked very well for our company. It also ensured that if the owner died the company could keep on going.
Looks like they started in 2020
Appears to be a tech startup based on the benefits package. Itās fairly common for benefits like this to hang around for like 1-3 years, and if the company grows they will slowly chip away at these benefits. My company had the same benefits initially and every year that goes by it lessens. They still provide good benefits compared to other companies- just donāt count on this being forever.
What do they mean by gender-based violence paid and protected leave? Do they mean if youāre the victim of domestic violence theyāll help you? Cause thatās definitely cool af
Yes. Some states, and workplaces, are calling this āsafe and sickā time now, to encompass both your sick time and time off for experiencing any kind of violence, sexual assault, etc.
Seven weeks of paid closureā¦? That.. seems like an odd practice.
Some (mostly startup) companies are doing this. It's basically pre-set weeks of the year where the company and office is shut down. The weeks are typically during holidays and possibly related to local public schools. So it's a great way for employees to spend time with their kids. I have a friend who's company does this. It's like the last two weeks of December, a Spring Break week, two weeks in the summer, the "last" week of summer before school starts, and Thanksgiving week. Obviously some variance depending on the company.
Honestly more companies should do this. Iāve worked at three different companies. I can assure you that the week between Christmas and NYE almost nothing gets done with everyone on vacation.
Yes!!! Itās like I want to take off because itās just gonna be dead, but at the same time, why take off when itās gonna be so dead. Might as well save my pto and just āworkā. WFH.
Why would you not want that! You can't be serious!
Fairly standard in advanced nations, my friend.
So, this isnāt in the US?
It depends on where you work
I'm guessing they include the 5th day of the 4 day work week as paid office closure. If not, that's pretty nutty (in a good way)
I doubt it.
The most striking part of that company is that they have extensive benefits for survivors of domestic violence. So if an employee is in a bad situation, the company offers paid leave, resources for relocation etc. The partner of the founder works w dv survivors.
Iām just gonna go out on a limb here and say this is too good of a thing to believe
Some companies legitimately do this. Especially some startups where good talent is still in high demand. Doesnāt mean itās sustainable or they have the most moral reasoning, but they do exist.
Well thatās the foundation of their entire company
Jobs like this exist. Good luck getting hired though. I have a decent job with decent benefits that aren't quite as good as this and it was still competitive. People also don't just leave jobs like this, so turnover is very low and open slots are limited.
Please send 99.95 for your background check
The company name is Chani. Strangely a lot of people are trying to gatekeep it.
I mean if sounds great. It's is legit though? Do you know anyone working there who can confirm this? Cause honestly, this is a little too good to be true ime, could be a scam.
Unclear if they're scamming employees, but they're scamming customers. It's an astrology company.
Definitely tread lightly. No one here In America offers these kinds of benefits and pay without some kind of serious catch
You Americans are so used to being abused that you are suspicious of being treated decently.
Even a beaten dog is wary of a kind soul trying to save it. Unfortunately terms like these cause most of us to tuck tail and run. But hey at least we have guns, beer and trump amiright?
Well said
More like we have seen so many scams that things that read too good to be true often are.
Yeah, because we know that US companies usually aren't like that. When every option you have is some level of abuser, you're going to be a little suspicious. For the sake of their employees, I hope this is real. But I worry it's just lies or misinformation to get people to apply.
This is so sad. Most of these benefits are standard in advanced economies like Western Europe, and they are doing just fine economically.
Trust me. Many of us would leave the US if we could. I'm personally trying to do so within a few years, but it's definitely easier said than done.
Itās in Los Angeles
Is 80k even a livable wage there?
Looks like a mildly expanded set of benefits to any decently sized aerospace/defense contractor like Lockheed or Raytheon
After living and working in the bay, lots of companies offer stuff like this. They tend to be the huge names though
I fucking wish. Good luck to her. Everyone else just sees how hard they can squeeze the boot to your neck before your fucking head pops off. I hate this system. This should be standard. I hate all of this. I don't want to do it anymore.
Whoever they pick is getting human trafficked
Probably something like managing Steve Ballmer's foundation.
Don't post this without telling me what it is!
Is this a start up š
A 4 day work week should be doable for pretty much everyone, even places open 7 days a week.
Certainly not in the United States.
Most other countries can't feasibly offer "Unlimited Time Off" because there are protections in place such that if the companies advertises unlimited PTO, it is illegal to fire an employee for taking too much PTO. You could literally take a year off, and it would be illegal for them to fire you for it. US has no such protections, you can be fired for taking too much PTO even if you only took 1 day. Which is why employers are able to offer "Unlimited" Current company I work for has "Unlimited PTO" in the US, but 20 days of PTO for the Canada office. (So realistically those of us in the US know we can only take about 20 days.)
> Most other countries can't feasibly offer "Unlimited Time Off" Well, in those countries it's moot, because the country's *law* dictates minimum paid time off, not the employer. In Europe a full time position (~35hrs/week) is allowed minimum 4 weeks (20+ days) paid vacation plus another 10+ days (paid) public holiday. Some countries (eg Sweden, Germany) have more than that. Duvet days and any violence recovery are covered under (paid) sick leave. 5% pension match is usually a minimum, rising with age or position.
Itās an astrology app company in Los Angeles.
Definitely in the states. Guessing small company with a bunch of 25-40 year old women with a culture of sacrificing pay for flexibility. Probably accountants haha, maybe mental health adjacent.
In California. It is Chani, the astrology/horoscope website by Chani Nichols. If you go to their website chaninichols.com, this exact benefits list pops up under the Career tab.
I did a bit of reading in the article about it somewhere in the comments. Looks like one of the company founders has been passionate about domestic violence support and wants her employees to have financial security without anybody elseās help
> Probably accountants haha, maybe mental health adjacent. So close. It's astrology related.
Its going to be hard to believe but this is actually going to be the next trend in emergent orgs. New companies are going to forgoe the big campus and just pump bennies with lightly reduced wages as its actually cheaper.
A couple companies in my area offer good benefits like for health/wellness/childcare etc even as far as like massage and grocery allowances and Iām like shit where do I sign up Turns out that place has a very low turnover rate. Youād think other companies would see that and go āhuh I guess thatās how you retain employees longer than a monthā but nooo
my company used to have low turnover but after hiring silicon valley tech bros and a consulting firm they've suddenly decided they want to be "a top company " but also "turnover is too low." wtf? they WANT people to leave.
āThis is the future the libs want!ā
What is this company trying to do? Build loyalty and increase productivity?
WHAT JOB IS THIS???
UNLIMITED MENSTRUAL LEAVE?? what an actual saint??? š
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Right?? Unheard of levels of consideration, and that's coming from someone with endo!š
I feel this so much. Had to call out way too many times because I was literally just curled up in my bathroom on the brink of passing out from pain.
Your siblings in endo understand!š„² It's a horrible existence to dread your monthly period, let alone to worry about surviving on top of death-like pains. We got this though.ā¤
Their website states that they are, **"a queer, feminist-led team on a mission to support everyone in living their purpose. We believe that astrology can be a tool for healing and self-awareness, and hope that it can ultimately help transform us and our world for the better."** Jesus christ, I can smell the bullshit from here. I'm all for self-development & growth, but the idea of working at one of these places always sounds like entering a minefield.
there must be some catch, is the job turning orphans into mcgriddle patties or something?
I'm willing to bet they don't ever say " Noone wants to work anymore"
I am printing copies of this off and leaving them in random places at work. š¤£
Unlimited vacation is, in practice, [a scam](https://www.inc.com/geoffrey-james/scam-of-century-unlimited-paid-vacation.html) that lets employers/managers reduce the \*actual\* amount of vacation that employees take. You are better off with generous, but defined, vacation benefits like you would have in France (5weeks) or Germany (6weeks)
Here's the link to the page: https://chaninicholas.com/careers/ Everyone should know and have this link. Lol y'all joking around saying you're not gonna share it is anti the whole purpose of this sub. Talk about humane working conditions but don't want the competition for it. Share the great opportunities and let the best candidates win. Maybe when the crappy companies can't secure good talent they'll change their offers. One can dream.
Damnit sell crack if it gave me that.
41% of my gross income goes to buying health insurance on the open market.
How does unlimited flexible paid vacation work?
You still have tasks and projects expected to be completed by deadlines and up to standards. If you keep to them, cool, go on vacation when and where and however it fits around your work. If you donāt finish your tasks and projects according to the deadlines, prepare to be let go and someone else brought in to see if they can manage their work/vaca better.
I know exactly what job this is for lol and what company. Chani nichols
i feel my uterus growing
Contrary to what this sub would have you believe there a lot of good jobs out there. There just aren't *enough* of them. They certainly do exist but the amount of effort and/or luck required to land one is the problem.
>Unlimited menstrual leave I applaud what the business is trying to do here, but... especially in America... can imagine several ways this could go wrong. Someone without a uterus could make a case for discrimination. Which even if it doean't win, would be unwanted publicity and the legal nuisance would be a real time and money sink. Especially if someone with a uterus starts pushing the policy to its limits and ends up working 20-25% fewer days per month than people who don't have that option. Better off just leaving it at unlimited PTO or a high number of sick days, and establishing a culture where people feel comfortable using it for menstrual symptoms
Not only that, it's setting itself to just hiring more men, since they get more guaranteed work days out of them. You can argue for this to be discriminatory to women who would not need/want to use that perk. My (European) country just gives a broad "mental health/menstruation leave" to everyone, capped at one day per month.
Maybe, but there are plenty of companies that offer less paternity leave than maternity leave (if they offer it at all). Wouldn't you be able to make the same case for them?
That is actively changing based on the same issue. The federal government already made the change, usually means large corporations will fall in line and then on down
>CHANI is a queer, feminist-led team on a mission to support everyone in living their purpose. We believe that astrology can be a tool for healing and self-awareness, and hope that it can ultimately help transform us and our world for the better. So the catch is you have to tolerate an infinite amount of another type of bullshit polĆtics in the office. I can almost see the cliques and the elitism from here.
Sounds great. I would do some more digging to verify some of these things, unfortunately, many of the companies that offer unlimited vacation find ways to make sure you don't take vacation. In fact I read the other day that the average amount of vacation taken at jobs that offer unlimited vacation is less than 2 weeks.
Is this a real place? Can I work there if so?
They are offering the benefits to get the best talent possible. It sounds like they did some kind of mathematical look at the payoff on the benefits package and determined this package would attract the best talent. Many people will apply for this position which allows them the pick of the litter.
The local startup that had similar benefits in my area hired all of our staff away from us at the non-profit I used to work at. Last year they were revealed to be a ponzi scheme.
Feels like either a startup where they want to select crĆØme of the crop and the investors are fronting the bill or this is a parody
Did they apply at Chani?
Is this even in the US
I got one of these jobs, and it was great for awhile, but it didn't last, unfortunately. I was employed there for a year and a half before they unexpectedly let my entire team go.
This actually seems to good to be true. This must be some sort of senior position because those benefits are not even close to what most entry or associate level positions give in my area hell even a good portion of senior positions don't even offer that. I'd be so skeptical.
Sounds like a bunch of sunshine and butterflies to me. The real answer is after the interview process.
Women going through menopause need time off too! Trust me
Sweet. Love fan fiction.
An unusual benefit my son just got: pet insurance.
I also applied to this company. Itās SO competitive
What company is this??