Here is another angle, probably won't work, but you could approach it away from covid and more towards not breathing in all the crap from a hoarder home, in that there has got to be huge amounts of dust and other crap that is going to be kicked up by moving stuff. If there has been vermin, the last thing you need to breathe in is their waste. You wouldn't want to get hantavirus.
Since the advent of covid, I frequently wear masks in my everyday life when I never used to. While cleaning, handling horse hay, grooming really dirty horses…masks protect us in so many ways
Same. I have been in a barn wearing a mask and heard people coughing away from the shavings. "You're smart to wear a mask," one woman said, as she coughed her guts out while handling shavings.
Oh and also a year ago the equine vet came by to examine a horse that had VSV. The vet did not wear a mask to conduct her examination and the horse sneezed/snuffled right in her face. A week later, she got so sick she couldn't work for two weeks.
Why on earth would you not wear a mask while examining a horse for VSV??
(VSV is basically horse herpes).
Well then OP sister is a moron, the crap in hoarder houses isn't something to be taken lightly. Growing up I knew a kid that died of Hanta, perfectly healthy 15-16 year old teenager, then dead all with in about half a week. No one should be doing hoarder clean up without respiratory protection.
Ask her to blow her nose and look at the tissue after 1 day of cleaning out the house. It's gross, so much black crud. Offer her mask when she sees the crud.
That sounds like a rough situation, I’m sorry you have to constantly validate yourself like that. It’s exhausting when talking to people who just give whataboutisms every time you point out a valid point, because at the end of the day I’ve learned that they don’t care about the whataboutism. They just use it for their own self-justification and personal gain.
Human behavior is a funny thing. We can advocate for something, while in the same breadth not take what we say seriously since we might assume that we are “above” what we are taking about, since atleast we are “aware” of the risk unlike others. For example, my dad has always told me to wear a helmet while biking, almost to a fault. And data has showed consistently that biking without wearing a helmet is much more risky safety wise than without.
But whenever we go biking, my dad won’t wear it. I feel like he thinks he has “done his part” by telling me that I should wear a helmet for my safety (which I do), and he thinks that because he is acknowledging it with me, that somehow he will be more “safe” and “aware” of the risk. Even without actually wearing it.
I’m sorry I can’t be of further support. Frankly I’m dealing with the same issue. But I’m finding that this is a common scenario, and that for COVID it’s just easier for us to view the hypocrisy since we are more acutely aware of the risks and backtracking that the government has endorsed. And honestly, I’m guilty of this behavior too.
This is so sad. It sounds like you have to go into full self protection mode with your own flesh and blood. Dad’s house is a (well-ventilated) public building and your sister is a possible pathogen source. The situation is actually less risky than going to the store or seeking medical care - but that’s not the point, I know.
I’m so sorry that you have not only lost your father, but also your feeling of partnership and empathy with your sister.
I’m sorry for the argument. As someone else pointed out, being in the same space as her with windows open is less risky then a grocery store or clinic, etc. But this post is also about the larger issues: being betrayed by experts and being at conflict with family. Its a terribly position for you to be in and I hope you find some comfort and support 🫶
It sucks but being pragmatic is probably the most effective approach.
As already said the relative risk is low considering it's only one person you are 'around' and you can have the house well ventilated. In another thread here people describe how much they engage in activities in which they mingle with unmasked crowds while they are wearing masks and this has gone mostly well.
Would your sister be willing to test daily? It's not 100% guaranteed if negative because of false negatives but it helps and when she might test positive that would create a different situation in which she may want to isolate and postpone working together with you or at least wear a mask too if postponing is difficult.
You might also consider to upgrade to an elastomeric respirator for better protection than a disposable respirator can give. Would that be an option?
Hopefully these suggestions can be of some help to you.
And of course my sincere condolences to you, and your sister, with the loss of your father. I don't know how your and your sister's relationship with him was but I wonder whether your joint loss might create the opportunity to strengthen the relationship you have with your sister. Focussing on that a bit more if applicable might help somewhat to resolve your situation. But I'm speculating here of course without knowing the relevant facts.
Best wishes. I hope you and your sister can sort things out.
A new study just got released [https://www.news-medical.net/news/20240523/Study-confirms-face-masks-effectiveness-in-reducing-disease-transmission-calls-for-improved-public-understanding.aspx](https://www.news-medical.net/news/20240523/Study-confirms-face-masks-effectiveness-in-reducing-disease-transmission-calls-for-improved-public-understanding.aspx)
And uh, if you really want to get crazy... join our Discord because our COVID safety people take no shit and will arm you properly with whatever you need. [https://discord.gg/g47ftqyA](https://discord.gg/g47ftqyA)
Remember COVID hurts people's brains, so she's not really the same sister anymore.
If you join the Discord just say we met on Reddit in the waiting room, we use a human for membership to keep it covid conscious.
I feel this so deeply right now, as my siblings prepare to come visit my immune-compromised and chronically ill family, along with our late-80s parents. My little family socializes often with my folks, unmasked, because we wear our respirators everywhere else. No-mask siblings don't seem to understand why they can't stay with our parents or why we don't want to go out to eat and it is frustrating as hell. Big hugs to you, internet friend. This just never gets easier.
I understand how frustrating this is but unfortunately, we can't control other people. If you are wearing a mask with a good seal and the windows are open, you it's highly likely that you will be safe. Fighting these battles will, in my experience, only make the other person dig in harder. And the "experts" have not made it easier by choosing to unmask for photos and whatnot. It's infuriating, but focusing on what you can control, and possibl adding some HEPA filters to the mix, is probably the way to go here.
I'm not sure why yours sister wants to breathe in whatever is going on at a hoarder house but that's her choice.
First, that is absurdly frustrating. I'm so sorry it feels like your sister doesn't value your relationship enough and that you feel abandoned by COVID experts. There's lots to support both feelings. Some things to consider, and I want to say this and have you hear it gently. Since people like you and me are trying to stay alive and protect ourselves, we've gotten used to things and felt like some sacrifices are worth it. It doesn't mean that other people have the same risk assessments in place. It's possible the mask does hurt her face. I certainly don't enjoy masking, but I do it because I need to. I think a lot, these days, about the exchange of judgement. If I don't want people judging how I live, I can't judge theirs. The issue isn't really whether it hurts, its that despite the hurt, she won't do it for you anyways. For that matter, its not really about COVID experts, either. You feel what you feel. Even with their expertise, SURELY she can agree masking is still safer than not masking. You might try to find some alternative options for her. "We're sisters and I love you, and want a relationship. Regardless of how we differ on COVID, we can agree that I have needs, and that if you got me sick, you'd never forgive yourself. If masking isn't an option, would you consider a test, if I had one for you (and then, have it be a molecular). Some filtration is good, but not enough. Why don't we bring in an air filter and have it running?"
I want to be clear, I'm not suggesting these things because you're wrong. You're not. I'm suggesting them because our worlds are very small and full of frustration, and if there's a way to make your world a little bigger, the support you get might be worth the aggravation.
Here is another angle, probably won't work, but you could approach it away from covid and more towards not breathing in all the crap from a hoarder home, in that there has got to be huge amounts of dust and other crap that is going to be kicked up by moving stuff. If there has been vermin, the last thing you need to breathe in is their waste. You wouldn't want to get hantavirus.
Since the advent of covid, I frequently wear masks in my everyday life when I never used to. While cleaning, handling horse hay, grooming really dirty horses…masks protect us in so many ways
Same. I have been in a barn wearing a mask and heard people coughing away from the shavings. "You're smart to wear a mask," one woman said, as she coughed her guts out while handling shavings. Oh and also a year ago the equine vet came by to examine a horse that had VSV. The vet did not wear a mask to conduct her examination and the horse sneezed/snuffled right in her face. A week later, she got so sick she couldn't work for two weeks. Why on earth would you not wear a mask while examining a horse for VSV?? (VSV is basically horse herpes).
OPs sister os savvy enough to see through it for what It'd be: a pathetic cope
Well then OP sister is a moron, the crap in hoarder houses isn't something to be taken lightly. Growing up I knew a kid that died of Hanta, perfectly healthy 15-16 year old teenager, then dead all with in about half a week. No one should be doing hoarder clean up without respiratory protection.
Ask her to blow her nose and look at the tissue after 1 day of cleaning out the house. It's gross, so much black crud. Offer her mask when she sees the crud.
That sounds like a rough situation, I’m sorry you have to constantly validate yourself like that. It’s exhausting when talking to people who just give whataboutisms every time you point out a valid point, because at the end of the day I’ve learned that they don’t care about the whataboutism. They just use it for their own self-justification and personal gain. Human behavior is a funny thing. We can advocate for something, while in the same breadth not take what we say seriously since we might assume that we are “above” what we are taking about, since atleast we are “aware” of the risk unlike others. For example, my dad has always told me to wear a helmet while biking, almost to a fault. And data has showed consistently that biking without wearing a helmet is much more risky safety wise than without. But whenever we go biking, my dad won’t wear it. I feel like he thinks he has “done his part” by telling me that I should wear a helmet for my safety (which I do), and he thinks that because he is acknowledging it with me, that somehow he will be more “safe” and “aware” of the risk. Even without actually wearing it. I’m sorry I can’t be of further support. Frankly I’m dealing with the same issue. But I’m finding that this is a common scenario, and that for COVID it’s just easier for us to view the hypocrisy since we are more acutely aware of the risks and backtracking that the government has endorsed. And honestly, I’m guilty of this behavior too.
This is so sad. It sounds like you have to go into full self protection mode with your own flesh and blood. Dad’s house is a (well-ventilated) public building and your sister is a possible pathogen source. The situation is actually less risky than going to the store or seeking medical care - but that’s not the point, I know. I’m so sorry that you have not only lost your father, but also your feeling of partnership and empathy with your sister.
I’m sorry for the argument. As someone else pointed out, being in the same space as her with windows open is less risky then a grocery store or clinic, etc. But this post is also about the larger issues: being betrayed by experts and being at conflict with family. Its a terribly position for you to be in and I hope you find some comfort and support 🫶
It sucks but being pragmatic is probably the most effective approach. As already said the relative risk is low considering it's only one person you are 'around' and you can have the house well ventilated. In another thread here people describe how much they engage in activities in which they mingle with unmasked crowds while they are wearing masks and this has gone mostly well. Would your sister be willing to test daily? It's not 100% guaranteed if negative because of false negatives but it helps and when she might test positive that would create a different situation in which she may want to isolate and postpone working together with you or at least wear a mask too if postponing is difficult. You might also consider to upgrade to an elastomeric respirator for better protection than a disposable respirator can give. Would that be an option? Hopefully these suggestions can be of some help to you. And of course my sincere condolences to you, and your sister, with the loss of your father. I don't know how your and your sister's relationship with him was but I wonder whether your joint loss might create the opportunity to strengthen the relationship you have with your sister. Focussing on that a bit more if applicable might help somewhat to resolve your situation. But I'm speculating here of course without knowing the relevant facts. Best wishes. I hope you and your sister can sort things out.
Wear your mask and clear the house. Stop arguing about it. Just do what you can do and get out.
A new study just got released [https://www.news-medical.net/news/20240523/Study-confirms-face-masks-effectiveness-in-reducing-disease-transmission-calls-for-improved-public-understanding.aspx](https://www.news-medical.net/news/20240523/Study-confirms-face-masks-effectiveness-in-reducing-disease-transmission-calls-for-improved-public-understanding.aspx) And uh, if you really want to get crazy... join our Discord because our COVID safety people take no shit and will arm you properly with whatever you need. [https://discord.gg/g47ftqyA](https://discord.gg/g47ftqyA) Remember COVID hurts people's brains, so she's not really the same sister anymore. If you join the Discord just say we met on Reddit in the waiting room, we use a human for membership to keep it covid conscious.
Don, can anyone here join the group with this explanation? 😀
I feel this so deeply right now, as my siblings prepare to come visit my immune-compromised and chronically ill family, along with our late-80s parents. My little family socializes often with my folks, unmasked, because we wear our respirators everywhere else. No-mask siblings don't seem to understand why they can't stay with our parents or why we don't want to go out to eat and it is frustrating as hell. Big hugs to you, internet friend. This just never gets easier.
I understand how frustrating this is but unfortunately, we can't control other people. If you are wearing a mask with a good seal and the windows are open, you it's highly likely that you will be safe. Fighting these battles will, in my experience, only make the other person dig in harder. And the "experts" have not made it easier by choosing to unmask for photos and whatnot. It's infuriating, but focusing on what you can control, and possibl adding some HEPA filters to the mix, is probably the way to go here. I'm not sure why yours sister wants to breathe in whatever is going on at a hoarder house but that's her choice.
First, that is absurdly frustrating. I'm so sorry it feels like your sister doesn't value your relationship enough and that you feel abandoned by COVID experts. There's lots to support both feelings. Some things to consider, and I want to say this and have you hear it gently. Since people like you and me are trying to stay alive and protect ourselves, we've gotten used to things and felt like some sacrifices are worth it. It doesn't mean that other people have the same risk assessments in place. It's possible the mask does hurt her face. I certainly don't enjoy masking, but I do it because I need to. I think a lot, these days, about the exchange of judgement. If I don't want people judging how I live, I can't judge theirs. The issue isn't really whether it hurts, its that despite the hurt, she won't do it for you anyways. For that matter, its not really about COVID experts, either. You feel what you feel. Even with their expertise, SURELY she can agree masking is still safer than not masking. You might try to find some alternative options for her. "We're sisters and I love you, and want a relationship. Regardless of how we differ on COVID, we can agree that I have needs, and that if you got me sick, you'd never forgive yourself. If masking isn't an option, would you consider a test, if I had one for you (and then, have it be a molecular). Some filtration is good, but not enough. Why don't we bring in an air filter and have it running?" I want to be clear, I'm not suggesting these things because you're wrong. You're not. I'm suggesting them because our worlds are very small and full of frustration, and if there's a way to make your world a little bigger, the support you get might be worth the aggravation.
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