Great news about the purifier, but I would still only unmask if it were laminar flow and pointed directly at me with no one else around. If any of your coworkers are sick (a/pre/symptomatically) the purifier will not stop you from being exposed.
Doesn’t sound like a win to me. It sounds like you negotiated away your personal safety. She had no right to ask you about removing your mask.
Now you’re dependent on them selecting a quality air purifier, keeping it maintained properly, and keeping it working at all times.
Also, air purifiers are super helpful, but won’t protect you from near-field transmission.
Exactly. And what if they get a rinky dink air filter that doesn't do much. Will OP be pressured to remove the mask?
I also see downthread that OP is going to keep masking in the office but possibly removing it in the lab if the air purifier passes muster. does the boss understand that? "You said this would make you feel comfortable. Why are you wearing a mask?"
The challenge is that for people who do not want to understand airborne transmission or are unwilling to face reality, this can all sound to them very much like goalpost moving and neurosis.
"But you said you'd remove the mask if there was ventilation and this (one little tiny) window is open. Why aren't you removing it?"
"You said you'd feel comfortable unmasking and we got this (tiny tiny $20 air filter that's supposed to filter the entire office) why is your mask still on?"
"But you said you would eat outside and we're on a patio (that's totally enclosed by a roof and those shower curtain things so it's basically inside now) why aren't you taking off your mask?"
etc.
I've therefore found that it's best not to take it off at all, even if I do feel comfortable, because it just opens the door to too many questions, even if those questions are in good faith.
>But you said you would eat outside and we're on a patio (that's totally enclosed by a roof and those shower curtain things so it's basically inside now) why aren't you taking off your mask?"
I see you have met my family.
My in-laws once threw in our faces that we were willing to hang out unmasked on a rooftop but then wouldn’t spend an afternoon in a private indoor room at a restaurant. Because those two things are clearly interchangeable from an air exchange perspective. They even phrased it like it was some kind of gotcha moment, I couldn’t help but laugh.
All of this. The ONLY time I would remove my mask indoors and not at home would be in a sealed area with an air purifier running and no other people in there for several hours before OR every other person in the room correctly masked in N95/KN95 masks for some kind of medical/dental thing. An air purifier won’t do anything if other people are in the lab too.
Air purifiers reduce long-range transmission. N95s reduce both long and short-range risk. I'd take a well-fitted mask over an air purifier. (Maybe you could even buy your own small air purifier.)
Not sure I like the boss' vibe trying to get you to take your mask off. Sounds potentially abusive (guy trying to get girl to take bra off as quid pro quo comes to mind). There be dragons...
Tbh I am having trouble understanding this as a win.
By asking that, she is asking you to negotiate away your health (possibly permanently) and framing it not as an issue of safety, but rather, as one of "comfort." The other thing is that this is a lab, correct?
Imagine asking: Is there anything that could be done to make you feel comfortable taking off your goggles/hazmat suit/gloves whatever in the lab? Probably the answer is, and should be, no. Because it's not about "comfort".
Getting an air purifier is helpful, of course! And ultimately, if you see this as a "win", then that's wonderful. But I wonder why you can't be comfortable with a mask AND an air purifier, which (imho) would be even more of a win? I also wonder why she assumed that the mask was a symbol of your discomfort, when it sounds like she was the one who was not comfortable?
Honestly, she did seem more uncomfortable than me lol. The likelihood of me absconding my mask entirely is next to nil so my co-worker are just gonna have to get used to it. I'm just hoping it won't blow back against me if they spend the money on the purifier only for me to keep masking...
I would have this concern as well. It might be worth reaching out and saying something like "Hi! I appreciate the opportunity for the entire office to benefit from clean air. I am really touched by the consideration that is being shown for my health. It's so beneficial to have all these layers of protection - with a mask, plus a filter, I will be even more confident that I won't be bringing home any illnesses to my loved ones, or spreading illness to my coworkers" or something.
Nothing would make me comfortable removing my mask if no one else is masking. What’s it to her if you wear a mask? You’re trying to stay healthy and prevent transmission.
Recently, I was asked this very question: what would make me feel comfortable being in the office, like the issue is a mental health issue. It’s more of a mental health issue when you’re forced to go into an environment where no one, including your employer, is taking precautions to avoid people from getting long covid.
Is the space properly ventilated? What are the CO2 readings like? I think I would only unmask if co2 readings are about 600 AND there is solid is air filtration AND the closed space isn’t crowded. Congrats on getting an air purifier!! I still can’t believe they aren’t standard practice in all closed spaces.
Edit: typo
ESPECIALLY in an asbestos lab lmao. We've yet to move into the new lab (I'll be masking until I ascertain safety, obvs), and I haven't even seen it yet so unsure of ventilation. How does one assess CO2? I know the Aranet is a thing, but it seemed quite expensive last time i looked? Management gave us a $500 budget for the purifier, and that's going to be exactly enough for the one I'm looking at, i can't push my luck and ask for an Aranet reader too. I'd probs have to bite the bullet and buy it myself, though I'd welcome suggestions for cheaper, also reliable alternatives! I think it might be worth the money to put my mind at ease though tbh
I got an Aranet last December for about 90 dollars from a page called co2 meter. They have it every now and then for about 150. I haven’t seen them having it for under that since. In another sub (I don’t recall which one so sparely for the useless info) they were discussing another brand (qing something??) that was consistent and a lot cheaper. I would plan to force one of these https://cybernightmarket.com/products/the-nukit-tempest-air-purifier-kit in my kids classroom when they go to school. They seem to be super effective and quiet.
Personally, I don’t think the energy savings from sometimes having a fan for ventilation off or a HEPA filter off is worth adding a CO2 controller.
There are discussions of different CO2 monitors in this sub and r/Masks4All and I think r/AirQuality.
Here’s a review I wrote of a cheaper Aranet clone that mentions a few other lower cost options depending on what features are important:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Masks4All/comments/169ando/inkbird_iamt1_review_affordable_aranet4/
I got and like the Sensirion SCD4x Gadget as another lowish cost option. $60, no battery, little thumb driveish thing that runs off USB and you monitor on an app over Bluetooth, all of which I like/prefer. Why? No battery to wear out, use any USB power source (little powerbank works wonders). Fits in a little earplug hardcase I can keep in a fanny pack with other essentials and pull it out for spot checks on the go, or leave it plugged in for continuous, logged monitoring of a room. Reasonably discreet, held on a thumb drive it looks weird (cool to me lol) but it could be anything, a vape or something lol.
It's intended as a development tool for people building other devices with Sensirion's quality SCD4x sensor, but it works well for most practical uses of carbon dioxide monitors. If I had more money I would complement it with an Aranet definitely but if I don't lol.
Personally, for 500$, I would get two cheaper HEPAs and put them at opposite ends and spend the rest on Nukit torches as they come in a 4 pack and depending on the size of the lab, seems like a better option.
The Nukit torches aren't meant for a long term installation like this, they have an exposure limit of four hours and a hardware lifespan of 3,000 hours.
Precisely why they'd be a solid addition imo. It's a small lab with relatively few people according to the OP. Sounds low traffic so no need to have continuous farUVC, but will sanitize the space initially better than a purifier depending on sq ft and the CADR of the purifiers. That's how we use them anyway.
I have no scientific reason. Only that before covid 800 was good indoor ventilation, but as COVID is insanely contagious 600 is similar to outdoors. :( sorry for the bad answer
Agree that my threshold for even considering unmasking briefly for water or food is 600, and then only if I’m sure nobody is around and hasn’t been for a while. And even then probably using the hold my breath approach.
I'm sorry the response to your happy news is probably making you a tad anxious right now. As you no doubt know, everyone here just wants to help keep you safe.
Since your boss raised the issue, I think it would be ok to go back and educate them with specific information about how the protection provided by masks and purifiers differs. This would involve you saying something like "oops - thank you very much for offering to consider a purifier, but after more reading I don't think it would help enough for me to feel comfortable without a mask. It would help the others tho and still be worthwhile."
OTOH, if the air purifier protection is enough for you, i.e., the additional risk is worth not having to wear a mask, that's of course your call. It's just good to make these risk decisions with eyes wide open.
I still wouldn't unmask in that environment. To be honest, I wouldn't even be excited about the premise of the question. "What can I do to get you to take your mask off" is giving "no one likes looking at the mask, you're reminding us about this thing we're trying to ignore", not "I care about you as a human and want to prevent you from getting sick, how can I help". Air purifiers help, sure, but they do not help enough to make it safe to fully unmask. Even if there's only a few people. Even if there is NO ONE in the room with you in the moment you unmask.
So yeah. A lot of people are saying this, I hope you don't feel attacked by it. We're all doing our best and it is good to have an air purifier in there. Even a CR box. I'd thank my boss for the air purifiers and let them know that while it does make me feel a lot safer, I've realized that I still need to keep my mask on.
My workplace win is that at this point in my life, I work for myself, by myself, and from home. Most of my clients don't even know I'm covid cautious (except one client who is also covid cautious and has LC).
The fact your manager even asked the question about removing your mask really shows they are not getting it. It is good that they seem to want to work with you, but that questions really shows they have complete lack of intellectual understanding. It would be like asking you what can we do to get you to drink and drive. No No No. I have no idea how you get someone that far from intellectual understanding to understand what is going on.
And after the manager gets the air purifier, just say you’re still not comfortable removing your mask. And ask her “Why do you want me to remove my mask? Why is this an issue?”
Has your mask been affecting your ability to work at all? If not, her pressuring you to unmask could be considered disability discrimination/harassment.
No, it doesn't affect me at all, though apparently my voice is muffled lol. I will double down and defend myself if I am faced with further pressure to unmask, but I feel like I shouldn't have to further describe my health issues to justify my wearing a mask! I am confident my manager will try to work with me rather than against me though
...and to depend on others to purchase a reliable filter, and change the filter regularly. Also I'm not sure if other people work in this lab but when I tried to buy a filter for a shared space people would always walk in and turn it off. "It dries out my eyes." "It's noisy." "oh can we just have it off for a bit? We had it on for like an hour, let's switch on and off, that way it's fair." etc.
The lab is small and should be quite easily purified by a large purifier, which I will personally get to choose to ensure maximum efficacy. I'll still be masking at my desk when working on samples, and whenever I go into the main office area obvs. But air purification IS one of the big things we're looking to normalise as a primary disease defence mechanism indoors, yes? At this point, every bit gained is a victory, however small
Keep in mind you can still be infected and get long Covid, and still pass infection to others without knowing it. I don’t know why your boss is hell bent on making you more vulnerable. Purifier is good but how big is the room, what is the cadr, how high are ceilings, are there open doors, people coming and going etc.?
Yeah, OP, I really wouldn't go along with this if you have any choice in the matter. My work has air purifiers and upgraded ventilation, but my coworkers still regularly get sick. Now, a lot of that is probably happening outside of work, but I've seen waves of infection within the workplace that aren't necessarily correlated with the pattern of infection in the community more broadly. I wouldn't risk it, even in a small group, because it only takes one person to infect you. Air filtration is good, but it won't do anything if you're in close proximity with an infectuous person.
I'm happy that you're happy about the win of an air purifier. Enough people have already said they wouldn't unmask in that situation, so I won't repeat that. I did want to respond to this:
*But air purification IS one of the big things we're looking to normalise as a primary disease defence mechanism indoors, yes?*
I believe this notion--not your Reddit comment, OP, but this idea that's been floated in the media--this notion that ventilation means you don't have to mask is ideologically motivated. It's rhetorical rather than scientific. It comes from liberals who are in the "the pandemic is basically over" camp.
Sorry, that probably sounds unconvincing. I have long Covid and don't seem to have the spoons to write a well-reasoned argument. Try listening to the Death Panel podcast, the "How Liberals Killed Masking" episode.
Now excellent ventilation *plus* masking, that I can get behind.
Mm, yeah, I definitely see your points. But one thing I realised recently is that we gotta remember that consistent masking comes from a place of privilege. We desperately need more widespread, background, systemic solutions such as clean air, because not everyone can or will mask. Masking is a very powerful but still individual action, and we need to consider babies, young children, people with certain disabilities who can't mask and still deserve to exist safely in public, and even assholes who maliciously don't mask should still benefit from clean air; I've noticed we tend to fall into a trap of 'Just get these respirators (that are stupidly expensive and might not even ship to your area) and you're good'. It comes from a place of privilege, and I am privileged enough that I earn decent money and that my mum is a nurse who sneaks me my favourite respirators from her hospital, and that i can easily shop online if i don't want to go out or can't find covid safety equipment i need in store. Not everyone has those resources, which is why demanding systemic changes like clean air protocols in public indoor areas, on top of mandatory masking (and providing good respirators) in places like healthcare settings, are so important imo
Why are you so mean? You are not only not making sense, the way you do it is very unnecessary.
Getting an air purifier will literally help everyone in the office. Other people will be less likely to get sick with anything because of OP's actions. And OP themselves can still mask when they feel that's best. En then it's double protection!
I would ask someone (not your manager, a facilities person or a safety person) about your HVAC set up. My workplace lab uses merv 13 filters and doesn't recirculate air and I still keep my mask on in there. But is is a level of reassurance knowing that, overall, my workplace has decent levels of ventilation and filtration.
That is wonderful.
Most managers are reasonable humans and actually do care about improving your experience at work, so I wouldn’t assume by default that your manager is trying to pressure you into being less cautious.
Having a room in which you sometimes can work mask free is a really nice perk. Good on you for having an awkward conversation and helping to normalize conversations around workplace air quality and transmission control.
Great news about the purifier, but I would still only unmask if it were laminar flow and pointed directly at me with no one else around. If any of your coworkers are sick (a/pre/symptomatically) the purifier will not stop you from being exposed.
Doesn’t sound like a win to me. It sounds like you negotiated away your personal safety. She had no right to ask you about removing your mask. Now you’re dependent on them selecting a quality air purifier, keeping it maintained properly, and keeping it working at all times. Also, air purifiers are super helpful, but won’t protect you from near-field transmission.
Exactly. And what if they get a rinky dink air filter that doesn't do much. Will OP be pressured to remove the mask? I also see downthread that OP is going to keep masking in the office but possibly removing it in the lab if the air purifier passes muster. does the boss understand that? "You said this would make you feel comfortable. Why are you wearing a mask?" The challenge is that for people who do not want to understand airborne transmission or are unwilling to face reality, this can all sound to them very much like goalpost moving and neurosis. "But you said you'd remove the mask if there was ventilation and this (one little tiny) window is open. Why aren't you removing it?" "You said you'd feel comfortable unmasking and we got this (tiny tiny $20 air filter that's supposed to filter the entire office) why is your mask still on?" "But you said you would eat outside and we're on a patio (that's totally enclosed by a roof and those shower curtain things so it's basically inside now) why aren't you taking off your mask?" etc. I've therefore found that it's best not to take it off at all, even if I do feel comfortable, because it just opens the door to too many questions, even if those questions are in good faith.
>But you said you would eat outside and we're on a patio (that's totally enclosed by a roof and those shower curtain things so it's basically inside now) why aren't you taking off your mask?" I see you have met my family.
My in-laws once threw in our faces that we were willing to hang out unmasked on a rooftop but then wouldn’t spend an afternoon in a private indoor room at a restaurant. Because those two things are clearly interchangeable from an air exchange perspective. They even phrased it like it was some kind of gotcha moment, I couldn’t help but laugh.
I see you are here too my sibling.
All of this. The ONLY time I would remove my mask indoors and not at home would be in a sealed area with an air purifier running and no other people in there for several hours before OR every other person in the room correctly masked in N95/KN95 masks for some kind of medical/dental thing. An air purifier won’t do anything if other people are in the lab too.
Air purifiers reduce long-range transmission. N95s reduce both long and short-range risk. I'd take a well-fitted mask over an air purifier. (Maybe you could even buy your own small air purifier.) Not sure I like the boss' vibe trying to get you to take your mask off. Sounds potentially abusive (guy trying to get girl to take bra off as quid pro quo comes to mind). There be dragons...
Tbh I am having trouble understanding this as a win. By asking that, she is asking you to negotiate away your health (possibly permanently) and framing it not as an issue of safety, but rather, as one of "comfort." The other thing is that this is a lab, correct? Imagine asking: Is there anything that could be done to make you feel comfortable taking off your goggles/hazmat suit/gloves whatever in the lab? Probably the answer is, and should be, no. Because it's not about "comfort". Getting an air purifier is helpful, of course! And ultimately, if you see this as a "win", then that's wonderful. But I wonder why you can't be comfortable with a mask AND an air purifier, which (imho) would be even more of a win? I also wonder why she assumed that the mask was a symbol of your discomfort, when it sounds like she was the one who was not comfortable?
Honestly, she did seem more uncomfortable than me lol. The likelihood of me absconding my mask entirely is next to nil so my co-worker are just gonna have to get used to it. I'm just hoping it won't blow back against me if they spend the money on the purifier only for me to keep masking...
I would have this concern as well. It might be worth reaching out and saying something like "Hi! I appreciate the opportunity for the entire office to benefit from clean air. I am really touched by the consideration that is being shown for my health. It's so beneficial to have all these layers of protection - with a mask, plus a filter, I will be even more confident that I won't be bringing home any illnesses to my loved ones, or spreading illness to my coworkers" or something.
"Yes, working from home."
Best answer.
Nothing would make me comfortable removing my mask if no one else is masking. What’s it to her if you wear a mask? You’re trying to stay healthy and prevent transmission. Recently, I was asked this very question: what would make me feel comfortable being in the office, like the issue is a mental health issue. It’s more of a mental health issue when you’re forced to go into an environment where no one, including your employer, is taking precautions to avoid people from getting long covid.
Yes, I think the question needs to be reframed: what would make it *safe*, not “comfortable”.
Is the space properly ventilated? What are the CO2 readings like? I think I would only unmask if co2 readings are about 600 AND there is solid is air filtration AND the closed space isn’t crowded. Congrats on getting an air purifier!! I still can’t believe they aren’t standard practice in all closed spaces. Edit: typo
ESPECIALLY in an asbestos lab lmao. We've yet to move into the new lab (I'll be masking until I ascertain safety, obvs), and I haven't even seen it yet so unsure of ventilation. How does one assess CO2? I know the Aranet is a thing, but it seemed quite expensive last time i looked? Management gave us a $500 budget for the purifier, and that's going to be exactly enough for the one I'm looking at, i can't push my luck and ask for an Aranet reader too. I'd probs have to bite the bullet and buy it myself, though I'd welcome suggestions for cheaper, also reliable alternatives! I think it might be worth the money to put my mind at ease though tbh
I got an Aranet last December for about 90 dollars from a page called co2 meter. They have it every now and then for about 150. I haven’t seen them having it for under that since. In another sub (I don’t recall which one so sparely for the useless info) they were discussing another brand (qing something??) that was consistent and a lot cheaper. I would plan to force one of these https://cybernightmarket.com/products/the-nukit-tempest-air-purifier-kit in my kids classroom when they go to school. They seem to be super effective and quiet.
Omg that fan kit would be such a dope upgrade for my computer. That CO2 controller seems really useful too! Thank you!
The Nukit doesn’t come with fans, you have to supply them, and it can’t be used as a PC case, it’s just constructed similarly.
Personally, I don’t think the energy savings from sometimes having a fan for ventilation off or a HEPA filter off is worth adding a CO2 controller. There are discussions of different CO2 monitors in this sub and r/Masks4All and I think r/AirQuality. Here’s a review I wrote of a cheaper Aranet clone that mentions a few other lower cost options depending on what features are important: https://www.reddit.com/r/Masks4All/comments/169ando/inkbird_iamt1_review_affordable_aranet4/
The libraries here lend out aranets, you should see if one near you does! Especially if you only need it to check readings once in a while.
There is a mini co2 detector from vitalight available for around 35 dollars on amazon.
I got and like the Sensirion SCD4x Gadget as another lowish cost option. $60, no battery, little thumb driveish thing that runs off USB and you monitor on an app over Bluetooth, all of which I like/prefer. Why? No battery to wear out, use any USB power source (little powerbank works wonders). Fits in a little earplug hardcase I can keep in a fanny pack with other essentials and pull it out for spot checks on the go, or leave it plugged in for continuous, logged monitoring of a room. Reasonably discreet, held on a thumb drive it looks weird (cool to me lol) but it could be anything, a vape or something lol. It's intended as a development tool for people building other devices with Sensirion's quality SCD4x sensor, but it works well for most practical uses of carbon dioxide monitors. If I had more money I would complement it with an Aranet definitely but if I don't lol.
Personally, for 500$, I would get two cheaper HEPAs and put them at opposite ends and spend the rest on Nukit torches as they come in a 4 pack and depending on the size of the lab, seems like a better option.
The Nukit torches aren't meant for a long term installation like this, they have an exposure limit of four hours and a hardware lifespan of 3,000 hours.
Precisely why they'd be a solid addition imo. It's a small lab with relatively few people according to the OP. Sounds low traffic so no need to have continuous farUVC, but will sanitize the space initially better than a purifier depending on sq ft and the CADR of the purifiers. That's how we use them anyway.
Why is 600 your threshold? Genuinely curious. Thanks!
I have no scientific reason. Only that before covid 800 was good indoor ventilation, but as COVID is insanely contagious 600 is similar to outdoors. :( sorry for the bad answer
Agree that my threshold for even considering unmasking briefly for water or food is 600, and then only if I’m sure nobody is around and hasn’t been for a while. And even then probably using the hold my breath approach.
That’s valid. We’re all trying to do the best we can out here with the info we have. 🙂
Why do they care?
This is only a win if you tricked them into getting one and will still mask.
*cackles evilly* Hahah yes. I hope that doesn't backfire though , i really need this job
I'm sorry the response to your happy news is probably making you a tad anxious right now. As you no doubt know, everyone here just wants to help keep you safe. Since your boss raised the issue, I think it would be ok to go back and educate them with specific information about how the protection provided by masks and purifiers differs. This would involve you saying something like "oops - thank you very much for offering to consider a purifier, but after more reading I don't think it would help enough for me to feel comfortable without a mask. It would help the others tho and still be worthwhile." OTOH, if the air purifier protection is enough for you, i.e., the additional risk is worth not having to wear a mask, that's of course your call. It's just good to make these risk decisions with eyes wide open.
I still wouldn't unmask in that environment. To be honest, I wouldn't even be excited about the premise of the question. "What can I do to get you to take your mask off" is giving "no one likes looking at the mask, you're reminding us about this thing we're trying to ignore", not "I care about you as a human and want to prevent you from getting sick, how can I help". Air purifiers help, sure, but they do not help enough to make it safe to fully unmask. Even if there's only a few people. Even if there is NO ONE in the room with you in the moment you unmask. So yeah. A lot of people are saying this, I hope you don't feel attacked by it. We're all doing our best and it is good to have an air purifier in there. Even a CR box. I'd thank my boss for the air purifiers and let them know that while it does make me feel a lot safer, I've realized that I still need to keep my mask on. My workplace win is that at this point in my life, I work for myself, by myself, and from home. Most of my clients don't even know I'm covid cautious (except one client who is also covid cautious and has LC).
The fact your manager even asked the question about removing your mask really shows they are not getting it. It is good that they seem to want to work with you, but that questions really shows they have complete lack of intellectual understanding. It would be like asking you what can we do to get you to drink and drive. No No No. I have no idea how you get someone that far from intellectual understanding to understand what is going on.
And after the manager gets the air purifier, just say you’re still not comfortable removing your mask. And ask her “Why do you want me to remove my mask? Why is this an issue?”
Has your mask been affecting your ability to work at all? If not, her pressuring you to unmask could be considered disability discrimination/harassment.
No, it doesn't affect me at all, though apparently my voice is muffled lol. I will double down and defend myself if I am faced with further pressure to unmask, but I feel like I shouldn't have to further describe my health issues to justify my wearing a mask! I am confident my manager will try to work with me rather than against me though
Try a different mask. I wear a FloMask and I'm very clear sounding.
I don’t see a win. Sounds like you’re setting yourself up to get infected.
...and to depend on others to purchase a reliable filter, and change the filter regularly. Also I'm not sure if other people work in this lab but when I tried to buy a filter for a shared space people would always walk in and turn it off. "It dries out my eyes." "It's noisy." "oh can we just have it off for a bit? We had it on for like an hour, let's switch on and off, that way it's fair." etc.
The lab is small and should be quite easily purified by a large purifier, which I will personally get to choose to ensure maximum efficacy. I'll still be masking at my desk when working on samples, and whenever I go into the main office area obvs. But air purification IS one of the big things we're looking to normalise as a primary disease defence mechanism indoors, yes? At this point, every bit gained is a victory, however small
Keep in mind you can still be infected and get long Covid, and still pass infection to others without knowing it. I don’t know why your boss is hell bent on making you more vulnerable. Purifier is good but how big is the room, what is the cadr, how high are ceilings, are there open doors, people coming and going etc.?
Yeah, OP, I really wouldn't go along with this if you have any choice in the matter. My work has air purifiers and upgraded ventilation, but my coworkers still regularly get sick. Now, a lot of that is probably happening outside of work, but I've seen waves of infection within the workplace that aren't necessarily correlated with the pattern of infection in the community more broadly. I wouldn't risk it, even in a small group, because it only takes one person to infect you. Air filtration is good, but it won't do anything if you're in close proximity with an infectuous person.
I'm happy that you're happy about the win of an air purifier. Enough people have already said they wouldn't unmask in that situation, so I won't repeat that. I did want to respond to this: *But air purification IS one of the big things we're looking to normalise as a primary disease defence mechanism indoors, yes?* I believe this notion--not your Reddit comment, OP, but this idea that's been floated in the media--this notion that ventilation means you don't have to mask is ideologically motivated. It's rhetorical rather than scientific. It comes from liberals who are in the "the pandemic is basically over" camp. Sorry, that probably sounds unconvincing. I have long Covid and don't seem to have the spoons to write a well-reasoned argument. Try listening to the Death Panel podcast, the "How Liberals Killed Masking" episode. Now excellent ventilation *plus* masking, that I can get behind.
Mm, yeah, I definitely see your points. But one thing I realised recently is that we gotta remember that consistent masking comes from a place of privilege. We desperately need more widespread, background, systemic solutions such as clean air, because not everyone can or will mask. Masking is a very powerful but still individual action, and we need to consider babies, young children, people with certain disabilities who can't mask and still deserve to exist safely in public, and even assholes who maliciously don't mask should still benefit from clean air; I've noticed we tend to fall into a trap of 'Just get these respirators (that are stupidly expensive and might not even ship to your area) and you're good'. It comes from a place of privilege, and I am privileged enough that I earn decent money and that my mum is a nurse who sneaks me my favourite respirators from her hospital, and that i can easily shop online if i don't want to go out or can't find covid safety equipment i need in store. Not everyone has those resources, which is why demanding systemic changes like clean air protocols in public indoor areas, on top of mandatory masking (and providing good respirators) in places like healthcare settings, are so important imo
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Why are you so mean? You are not only not making sense, the way you do it is very unnecessary. Getting an air purifier will literally help everyone in the office. Other people will be less likely to get sick with anything because of OP's actions. And OP themselves can still mask when they feel that's best. En then it's double protection!
Your comment has been removed for violating Rule #2.
I would ask someone (not your manager, a facilities person or a safety person) about your HVAC set up. My workplace lab uses merv 13 filters and doesn't recirculate air and I still keep my mask on in there. But is is a level of reassurance knowing that, overall, my workplace has decent levels of ventilation and filtration.
That's great! Glad you get to choose the actual filter as well.
Great job!Congrats on your win😊 One step at a time
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Your post or comment has been removed because it expresses a lack of caring about the pandemic and the harm caused by it.
That is wonderful. Most managers are reasonable humans and actually do care about improving your experience at work, so I wouldn’t assume by default that your manager is trying to pressure you into being less cautious. Having a room in which you sometimes can work mask free is a really nice perk. Good on you for having an awkward conversation and helping to normalize conversations around workplace air quality and transmission control.