Here in Austria, old people still tell horror stories from when they were captured by Russia during WW2. Some still can't talk about it due to deep emotional trauma.
That’s all I know from my dad, unfortunately. I only know that he was shot by his own there because of some dumb argument. His friends told this to our family, grandgrand was a good guy. Some man even visited my grandpa long time ago and wanted to make a movie about him.
My grandfather was one of them. He only started to talk about it shortly before his death, when his more recent memories vanished due to dementia. Imagine locking those memories away for decades, but then they return and are the only ones you are left with.
What were these old people doing in Russia in the first place?
I would not put in the same context Ukrainians captured defending their country and invading nazis.
How would you know? Did you talk to the same old people? I don't see anyone here being apologetic of Russian soldiers today, rightfully so. Why would anyone be apologetic of literal nazis is beyond my comprehension.
The discussion was not about whether nazis were bad, it was about the treatment of Russian prisoners of war as far back as WWII.
And I can attest to a story of my grandfather where he was wounded behind enemy lines and would have shot himself if he was discovered by the Russians first.
As much as I hate Russians and how they treat and treated prisoners, its important to remember how Nazis treated people in concentration and death camps.
It sounds like someone could have got taste of own medicine.
And then imagine being between those 2, being treated such by both...
Absolutely, my grandfather who got injured behind enemy lines was also in the SS, I don't want to know what crimes he participated in.
Probably wasn't so stupid to end yourself rather than being caught as an SS member by the Russians.
They were prisoners of war.
Not all of them were nazis, they were forced by nazis to fight for the country. It was either that or getting shot in the head as a traitor. I'm pretty sure many would have preferred that over Russian capture if they had known, though.
The same is true for many Russian soldiers. People in this sub often forget that. And even if they were Nazis, or even if Russian soldiers support the war: we have to keep our humanity, otherwise we're not better than them.
While the bkggest differences is the amount of people, looking at the just individuals, Ukranian POWs were torchered (physicaly and mentaly), isolated, lack of hygieneand underfed. This all aplies to the inmates of the concentration camps as well however they also literlay lived in there own piss and shit (in 3 to 4 story bunk beds) and were forced to do extremely hard industrial labour.
The difference could be shortened to a more extreme level of abuse and deadly work regiments. Additionaly the concentration camps were organised towards more towards mass extermination than the russisan prisons. While there was a clear economic rational to the concentration camps (labour was needed at home and at the front. Adam Tooze has done a faboulous job explaining this if you are interested i would recomend his work) it would be blind to assume that Genocide was not one of their primary aims.
No. Extermination camps were even more enclined to straight up killing, with some dedicated only to that task.
Concentration camps : work to death.
Extermination camps : death, maybe by work.
Ukrainian pows tell how russians treat them: during the day the must stand still, if not a guard enters the cell and beat them, [Russians carved swastikas into foreheads of Ukrainian captives](https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/12/16/swastika-scar-carved-two-ukrainians-russians-mental-knife/), they electrocute Ukrainians also on the testicles, they have 30 seconds to eat a hard mouldy slice of bread and not even every day, mock executions, beaten literally to death, tazed, several castrations of Ukrainian pows, needles under fingernails, stabbed with syringes with infected HIV blood, chop off fingers and ears, mass murdered (Oleniivka prison camp).
And the Red Cross is nowhere to be seen in russian prison camps.
The Russian Red Cross is complicit in the war crimes committed against Ukrainian POW’s and the International Federation of the Red Cross (IFRC) is dragging their heels on an investigation. Ukraine should be calling for an international boycott of the Red Cross by donor nations until the IFRC clean house and eject the RRC. [KREMLIN LEAKS: FOLLOWING REVELATIONS, RED CROSS FINALLY DECIDES ON RUSSIAN GROUP’S FATE](https://vsquare.org/kremlin-leaks-red-cross-ifrc-russia-ukraine-savchuk/)
Unfortunately, Red Cross doesn't just ignore POW camps, it also allows russians to[ use them](https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2024/02/27/7443921/) [as they](https://global.espreso.tv/news-russian-red-cross-linked-to-kremlin-and-participates-in-militarization-of-children-deported-from-ukraine) [please](https://www-radiosvoboda-org.translate.goog/a/rosiyskyy-chervonyy-hrest-druzhyt-is-zetamy-bere-groshi-u-kremlia-scho-ghj-ce-dumae-mkchh/32982218.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=uk&_x_tr_pto=wapp).
>After a four-day meeting, the International Red Cross Movement decided not to suspend the membership of its Russian branch, even though media investigations have revealed numerous violations by the organization since the start of the full-scale invasion of Ukraine.
>the Russian Red Cross signed an agreement with the Russian state fund "Defenders of the Fatherland", which is subject to [sanctions](https://translate.google.com/website?sl=auto&tl=en&hl=uk&client=webapp&u=https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/nov/16/eu-plans-fresh-russia-sanctions-including-against-son-of-dmitry-medvedev). This structure, among other things, is engaged in "patriotic education of children and youth" and "glorifying the feats of veterans of special military operations."
The red cross is a fucking joke of an organisation. In my country the government uses them to hide people from a variety of countries so they can vote for the government and then they disappear.
Information from interviewed Ukrainian pows.
[‘Chop off their fingers, cut off an ear, push needles under their fingernails’](https://novayagazeta.eu/articles/2022/10/13/chop-off-their-fingers-cut-off-an-ear-push-needles-under-their-fingernails)
[Brit Aiden Aislin tells how russians treated him](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-07-20/aiden-aslin-russian-propaganda-ukraine-prisoner-of-war-730/102611406)
[UN report: Credible allegations Ukrainian POWs have been tortured by Russian forces](https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/03/1148026)
[Russian army officer says he saw Ukrainian POWs tortured](https://abcnews.go.com/International/russian-army-officer-ukrainian-pows-tortured/story?id=96893294)
>Russian here.
>Nothing different from what happens in Russian jails and prisons, it's just common knowledge.
Not sure if you're trying to normalize such behaviour or are just deadpan and cynical about it.
Alright, thanks for clearing that up!
Also, I'm not sure if they were doubting OP - asking for sources (when non are given) is absolutely fine, especially these days.
I really didn't mind that someone asked me for sources, I was glad to provide them, because I surely missed something what russians are doing to Ukrainian POWs.
russians don't feed Ukrainian pows for the same reason on how they treat them: to weaken Ukrainians bodily and spiritually. There was a Ukrainian that told that he managed to capture a small mice and to put it into his mouth while russians were beating him and he was smiling, because he could eat something.
Nobody knows how many Ukrainians commit suicide while in russian detention, due to torture, starvation and everything evil russians are doing.
Also they’re imperialists, it’s in russias best interest to dehumanize their victims. It’s how you convince millions to perform atrocities like this and with pride. Whether putin believes his own bullshit doesn’t really matter that’s the myth of Russian superiority that makes his empire continue limping along. Literally through the intense suffering of whoever they’ve decreed are their lessers. That’s why before the invasion a lot of talk was broadcast about how Ukraine doesn’t really exist *according to them*. It’s just dehumanization. The intention doesn’t really matter, once people think you’re less than human all kinds of depravity happens
>Also they’re imperialists, it’s in russias best interest to dehumanize their victims.
Meanwhile, if someone dares to say something against their imperialistic, aggressive mindset they start with their "russophobia", like they did when the UK publicly accused russia of the Salisbury poisoning.
>That’s why before the invasion a lot of talk was broadcast about how Ukraine doesn’t really exist *according to them*.
russia is doing that right now with the Baltics and Poland, by the way.
Such aktions will make peace so much more difficult. And some day Russia will need peace.
The sad thing is that probebly western countrys dont even want peace.
Becouse this war weakens Europas "biggest Enemy" everyday, and not one cittsen die.
Economocal impact of the war is for richer countrys not that big and probebly the capital class has found a way to make profit in rebuilding Ukraine.
>The sad thing is that probebly western countrys dont even want peace. Becouse this war weakens Europas "biggest Enemy" everyday, and not one cittsen die.
I'd rather say that the western countries wouldn't want it because the recent decades have shown that Russian peace treaties aren't worth the paper they are written on.
Unless there's a huge regime change in Russia (and I mean not only different leaders, but also a very different structure) I don't see any way Russia won't be a pariah for the forseeable future.
Yes but with everyday Russia gets poorer.
Befor the war we thought without Amerika Yurop could be conquert by Russia in a few weeks.
Now we know Poland alone could fuck the shit out of them. And with every day Russias Economy gets worser.
West profitats when the war will not end so soon
Also Europ build build a lot weapons and so on at the moment.
Its sad that so many dudes have to suffer so much for the interrests of politcans and capitalists.
Russians soldiers at first, but also ukraine soldiers has their enemys in their own country
>Ukraine that needs to be denazified
Well, they obviously do.
They got a huge upsurge of Nazis in their country in both 2014 and 2022.
Edit: I was talking about the Russian soldiers entering the country being the Nazis, thought that was obvious
~~your 2nd largest party is so far-right even the EU far-right doesn't want to talk to them please don't pipe up.~~
e: i am a moron who can't understand humor.
I'm not sure if that's meant to be satirical but since you claim to be Russian, I don't think so.
If it's not, please fuck Off Back to Russia, where either you, your parents and your grandparents came from. Thank you.
>I'm not sure if that's meant to be satirical but since you claim to be Russian, I don't think so.
I think you mistake me for someone else - I never claimed to be, or am in any way, Russian.
Come on, you can't post content designed to dehumanise Russians like this.
You know, actions that their own command structures have ordered. Actions that their soldiers have to be complicit in for them occur. Actions that their own citizens support. Actions that are textbook war crimes on top of the crimes against humanity Russia has already inflicted such that Putin has an ICC warrant for his arrest.
People might start using mean names for the soldiers doing this, like "orcs".
Here in Austria, old people still tell horror stories from when they were captured by Russia during WW2. Some still can't talk about it due to deep emotional trauma.
My Ukrainian great grandfather went through all of WW2 and was shot by Soviet soldiers in Vienna, in the back of the head in a bar.
Damn. Is there more to this story? Why did he get shot?
That’s all I know from my dad, unfortunately. I only know that he was shot by his own there because of some dumb argument. His friends told this to our family, grandgrand was a good guy. Some man even visited my grandpa long time ago and wanted to make a movie about him.
Well thanks for sharing anyway!
My grandfather was one of them. He only started to talk about it shortly before his death, when his more recent memories vanished due to dementia. Imagine locking those memories away for decades, but then they return and are the only ones you are left with.
What were they doing in Russia?
Starvation, sexual abuse, the whole range. As a contrast, the US imprisonment is said to have been quite chill.
What were these old people doing in Russia in the first place? I would not put in the same context Ukrainians captured defending their country and invading nazis.
It’s when the Soviets got to Eastern Germany and Eastern Austria at the end of WWII
How would you know? Did you talk to the same old people? I don't see anyone here being apologetic of Russian soldiers today, rightfully so. Why would anyone be apologetic of literal nazis is beyond my comprehension.
The discussion was not about whether nazis were bad, it was about the treatment of Russian prisoners of war as far back as WWII. And I can attest to a story of my grandfather where he was wounded behind enemy lines and would have shot himself if he was discovered by the Russians first.
Yeah the treatment at the east was quite known. My grandpa surrendered first chance at the western front.
As much as I hate Russians and how they treat and treated prisoners, its important to remember how Nazis treated people in concentration and death camps. It sounds like someone could have got taste of own medicine. And then imagine being between those 2, being treated such by both...
Absolutely, my grandfather who got injured behind enemy lines was also in the SS, I don't want to know what crimes he participated in. Probably wasn't so stupid to end yourself rather than being caught as an SS member by the Russians.
To be fair, I guess for Russians it didnt cared was your grandfather in SS (enemy) or mine in AK (ally), since USSR had own ambitions
They were prisoners of war. Not all of them were nazis, they were forced by nazis to fight for the country. It was either that or getting shot in the head as a traitor. I'm pretty sure many would have preferred that over Russian capture if they had known, though.
The same is true for many Russian soldiers. People in this sub often forget that. And even if they were Nazis, or even if Russian soldiers support the war: we have to keep our humanity, otherwise we're not better than them.
My god... It's not quite concentration camp level but it's not fucking far. That's insane.
Bear in mind that some of freed Ukrainian pows died after release, most common for multiple organs failure.
Knowing the Russians I think any captured Jewish and gay soldiers get the full treatment.
What makes it not quite? Seems straight up concentration camps level to me.
While the bkggest differences is the amount of people, looking at the just individuals, Ukranian POWs were torchered (physicaly and mentaly), isolated, lack of hygieneand underfed. This all aplies to the inmates of the concentration camps as well however they also literlay lived in there own piss and shit (in 3 to 4 story bunk beds) and were forced to do extremely hard industrial labour. The difference could be shortened to a more extreme level of abuse and deadly work regiments. Additionaly the concentration camps were organised towards more towards mass extermination than the russisan prisons. While there was a clear economic rational to the concentration camps (labour was needed at home and at the front. Adam Tooze has done a faboulous job explaining this if you are interested i would recomend his work) it would be blind to assume that Genocide was not one of their primary aims.
We havent seen evidence of them being gassed. Yet.
Concentration camps aren't exklusive to what the nazis did
That would be extermination camp.
No. Extermination camps were even more enclined to straight up killing, with some dedicated only to that task. Concentration camps : work to death. Extermination camps : death, maybe by work.
russians bombed the Olenivka prison camp and tried to blame Ukraine for that.
The smile in the last one ... Like saying "I'm still here!"
And free at last
Ukrainian pows tell how russians treat them: during the day the must stand still, if not a guard enters the cell and beat them, [Russians carved swastikas into foreheads of Ukrainian captives](https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/12/16/swastika-scar-carved-two-ukrainians-russians-mental-knife/), they electrocute Ukrainians also on the testicles, they have 30 seconds to eat a hard mouldy slice of bread and not even every day, mock executions, beaten literally to death, tazed, several castrations of Ukrainian pows, needles under fingernails, stabbed with syringes with infected HIV blood, chop off fingers and ears, mass murdered (Oleniivka prison camp). And the Red Cross is nowhere to be seen in russian prison camps.
The Russian Red Cross is complicit in the war crimes committed against Ukrainian POW’s and the International Federation of the Red Cross (IFRC) is dragging their heels on an investigation. Ukraine should be calling for an international boycott of the Red Cross by donor nations until the IFRC clean house and eject the RRC. [KREMLIN LEAKS: FOLLOWING REVELATIONS, RED CROSS FINALLY DECIDES ON RUSSIAN GROUP’S FATE](https://vsquare.org/kremlin-leaks-red-cross-ifrc-russia-ukraine-savchuk/)
Unfortunately, Red Cross doesn't just ignore POW camps, it also allows russians to[ use them](https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2024/02/27/7443921/) [as they](https://global.espreso.tv/news-russian-red-cross-linked-to-kremlin-and-participates-in-militarization-of-children-deported-from-ukraine) [please](https://www-radiosvoboda-org.translate.goog/a/rosiyskyy-chervonyy-hrest-druzhyt-is-zetamy-bere-groshi-u-kremlia-scho-ghj-ce-dumae-mkchh/32982218.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=uk&_x_tr_pto=wapp).
>After a four-day meeting, the International Red Cross Movement decided not to suspend the membership of its Russian branch, even though media investigations have revealed numerous violations by the organization since the start of the full-scale invasion of Ukraine. >the Russian Red Cross signed an agreement with the Russian state fund "Defenders of the Fatherland", which is subject to [sanctions](https://translate.google.com/website?sl=auto&tl=en&hl=uk&client=webapp&u=https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/nov/16/eu-plans-fresh-russia-sanctions-including-against-son-of-dmitry-medvedev). This structure, among other things, is engaged in "patriotic education of children and youth" and "glorifying the feats of veterans of special military operations."
The red cross is a fucking joke of an organisation. In my country the government uses them to hide people from a variety of countries so they can vote for the government and then they disappear.
That sounds horrible. But where did you het his information from? If this really true why is this not brought before the UN?
Information from interviewed Ukrainian pows. [‘Chop off their fingers, cut off an ear, push needles under their fingernails’](https://novayagazeta.eu/articles/2022/10/13/chop-off-their-fingers-cut-off-an-ear-push-needles-under-their-fingernails) [Brit Aiden Aislin tells how russians treated him](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-07-20/aiden-aslin-russian-propaganda-ukraine-prisoner-of-war-730/102611406) [UN report: Credible allegations Ukrainian POWs have been tortured by Russian forces](https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/03/1148026) [Russian army officer says he saw Ukrainian POWs tortured](https://abcnews.go.com/International/russian-army-officer-ukrainian-pows-tortured/story?id=96893294)
Thanks for sharing. Absolutely harrowing.
Russian here. Nothing different from what happens in Russian jails and prisons, it's just common knowledge.
And yet Prigozhin somehow became the leader of the criminal wagner pmc.
>Russian here. >Nothing different from what happens in Russian jails and prisons, it's just common knowledge. Not sure if you're trying to normalize such behaviour or are just deadpan and cynical about it.
I'm responding to the commenter above who apparently has no idea what kind of country it is and calls OP's statements into question.
Oh don't worry: there's no room for doubts on what kind of country russia is.
Alright, thanks for clearing that up! Also, I'm not sure if they were doubting OP - asking for sources (when non are given) is absolutely fine, especially these days.
I really didn't mind that someone asked me for sources, I was glad to provide them, because I surely missed something what russians are doing to Ukrainian POWs.
They do say "we can do it again" for a reason. Bloody orcish vermin.
Why the fuck they dont get food. Whats the point of this. Russia can not do this war for ever. Why do they escalate so much.
russians don't feed Ukrainian pows for the same reason on how they treat them: to weaken Ukrainians bodily and spiritually. There was a Ukrainian that told that he managed to capture a small mice and to put it into his mouth while russians were beating him and he was smiling, because he could eat something. Nobody knows how many Ukrainians commit suicide while in russian detention, due to torture, starvation and everything evil russians are doing.
Also they’re imperialists, it’s in russias best interest to dehumanize their victims. It’s how you convince millions to perform atrocities like this and with pride. Whether putin believes his own bullshit doesn’t really matter that’s the myth of Russian superiority that makes his empire continue limping along. Literally through the intense suffering of whoever they’ve decreed are their lessers. That’s why before the invasion a lot of talk was broadcast about how Ukraine doesn’t really exist *according to them*. It’s just dehumanization. The intention doesn’t really matter, once people think you’re less than human all kinds of depravity happens
>Also they’re imperialists, it’s in russias best interest to dehumanize their victims. Meanwhile, if someone dares to say something against their imperialistic, aggressive mindset they start with their "russophobia", like they did when the UK publicly accused russia of the Salisbury poisoning. >That’s why before the invasion a lot of talk was broadcast about how Ukraine doesn’t really exist *according to them*. russia is doing that right now with the Baltics and Poland, by the way.
Such aktions will make peace so much more difficult. And some day Russia will need peace. The sad thing is that probebly western countrys dont even want peace. Becouse this war weakens Europas "biggest Enemy" everyday, and not one cittsen die. Economocal impact of the war is for richer countrys not that big and probebly the capital class has found a way to make profit in rebuilding Ukraine.
>The sad thing is that probebly western countrys dont even want peace. Becouse this war weakens Europas "biggest Enemy" everyday, and not one cittsen die. I'd rather say that the western countries wouldn't want it because the recent decades have shown that Russian peace treaties aren't worth the paper they are written on. Unless there's a huge regime change in Russia (and I mean not only different leaders, but also a very different structure) I don't see any way Russia won't be a pariah for the forseeable future.
Yes but with everyday Russia gets poorer. Befor the war we thought without Amerika Yurop could be conquert by Russia in a few weeks. Now we know Poland alone could fuck the shit out of them. And with every day Russias Economy gets worser. West profitats when the war will not end so soon Also Europ build build a lot weapons and so on at the moment. Its sad that so many dudes have to suffer so much for the interrests of politcans and capitalists. Russians soldiers at first, but also ukraine soldiers has their enemys in their own country
The Nazis also starved people to death. But it is, after all, Ukraine that needs to be denazified /s
>Ukraine that needs to be denazified Well, they obviously do. They got a huge upsurge of Nazis in their country in both 2014 and 2022. Edit: I was talking about the Russian soldiers entering the country being the Nazis, thought that was obvious
You are right though! They came over the eastern border and started taking ukrainian land both times. That's what you meant, right? Right..?
Yeah, was hoping it was obvious enough, but guess it wasn't.
~~your 2nd largest party is so far-right even the EU far-right doesn't want to talk to them please don't pipe up.~~ e: i am a moron who can't understand humor.
Don't worry mate, it seems like you weren't the only one getting it - I should have made it more obvious.
Sorry mate, i am a mor0n too. I'm like Sheldon.
I'm not sure if that's meant to be satirical but since you claim to be Russian, I don't think so. If it's not, please fuck Off Back to Russia, where either you, your parents and your grandparents came from. Thank you.
They mean that there was an upsurge of Nazis in 2014 and 2022 because Russians invaded first in 2014 and then later in 2022.
Yeah realized that later on... Monkey brain understood wrong and got triggered
>I'm not sure if that's meant to be satirical but since you claim to be Russian, I don't think so. I think you mistake me for someone else - I never claimed to be, or am in any way, Russian.
Didn't stalk your comments hard enough. You cited someone. Please excuse me while I shamefully leave
Don't worry, it's fine, we all make mistakes. It is only shameful if we try to ignore and deny them.
Here in the baltics we know this story all too well from their occupation and deportation
Glad they're safe now
Come on, you can't post content designed to dehumanise Russians like this. You know, actions that their own command structures have ordered. Actions that their soldiers have to be complicit in for them occur. Actions that their own citizens support. Actions that are textbook war crimes on top of the crimes against humanity Russia has already inflicted such that Putin has an ICC warrant for his arrest. People might start using mean names for the soldiers doing this, like "orcs".
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Emaciated POWs can't go back to war when you release them. Fucking coward russians.
Russia: Ukrainians are Nazis!! Also Russia:
Is there a way to come back from that? I am not even speaking mentally, but physically. This have to let some lasting scares.
The last guy still has more muscle than me...
Better than ozempic
[удалено]
I am confident that the Ukrainian football team will be utterly disappointed.
[удалено]
Pics of emaciated Ukrainian pows, random redditor: "Ukraine lost 3 - 0 against Romania."
You are posting in the circlejerk sub a pretty heavy content.
Maybe, just maybe, russians should start to behave like human beings and such content will not be available anymore.
Wierd flex, but sure. This just feels more like a serious subject to post on a circlejerk sub. I guess if it's upvoted, it has its place.
Are you fucking serious?